The Marvel Cinematic Universe: The Avengers, etc.

[Wynterwolf]

 

Edited July 20, 2018 by Wynterwolf

[Dee]

An 'Ironheart' Film May Be In Development

Quote

While it’s not unusual for the Black List to be associated with Marvel Studios properties – Black List writers Matthew and Ryan Firpo are penning the Eternals script – it is unusual for a script about a superhero owned by a billion-dollar corporation to appear on a list that helps sell scripts to interesting film studios. Our friends at That Hashtag Show were told that Ironheart writer Jada Rodriguez had to either own the IP or had have been commissioned to write it up. For obvious reasons, we’re inclined to believe the latter.

[JessePinkman]

31 minutes ago, Wynterwolf said:

 

 

Those tweets were really fucking something else. There's dark humor and then there's whatever the fuck he thought he was doing there.

If they use his script, it's likely they'll use elements at least because he just turned it in and the movie was set to start filming in a few months, then he'll still make money off the franchise. This just basically means he won't be helming any big movies anytime soon.

Edited July 20, 2018 by JessePinkman

[thuganomics85]

Damn, Gunn!  For now, I truly believe they were jokes and he really doesn't believe any of it, and I certainly not against dark humor at times, but those were pretty messed up. And this was certainly the absolute wrong time to resurface.

Curious to see what they'll do with the Guardians going forward.  I know some are already throwing the Russo Bros and Taika Waititi's name in the hat, but I wonder if Disney/Marvel will bring in a fresh face instead.  Or, hey, maybe they can make another attempt with Edgar Wright!

[anna0852]

39 minutes ago, thuganomics85 said:

Damn, Gunn!  For now, I truly believe they were jokes and he really doesn't believe any of it, and I certainly not against dark humor at times, but those were pretty messed up. And this was certainly the absolute wrong time to resurface.

Curious to see what they'll do with the Guardians going forward.  I know some are already throwing the Russo Bros and Taika Waititi's name in the hat, but I wonder if Disney/Marvel will bring in a fresh face instead.  Or, hey, maybe they can make another attempt with Edgar Wright!

Either Taika Waititi or Peyton Reed would be their best bet. I think either of them would be good for matching the established tone.

Edited July 20, 2018 by anna0852

[Matt K]

I do appreciate that Gunn straight up apologized for them, he didn't really try to defend what he said and took responsibility for them.

 

That said, getting Waititi for vol 3 would be amazing.  I'm not sure we're getting any more Thor, so I really want him to get more Marvel work (Reed at least will probably be getting another Antman/Wasp movie).  I think Waititi would be a good choice for Fantastic Four as well.

[VCRTracking]

I remember the controversy over these tweets when he was making the first film and Gunn apologized and that was it. The fact that Mike "Pizzagate is real" Cernovich was the one who brought this back up bothers me.

[Spartan Girl]

4 minutes ago, VCRTracking said:

I remember the controversy over these tweets when he was making the first film and Gunn apologized and that was it. The fact that Mike "Pizzagate is real" Cernovich was the one who brought this back up bothers me.

And he's made TONS of horrendous tweets about rape too. 

Once again, we can't have nice things.

[Wynterwolf]

It definitely appears targeted, but the tweets are absolutely still his.  I am a little hopeful, though, that maybe Disney's swift action here means we're finally moving away from excusing and ignoring things like this and instead we're seeing real consequences for behavior that is this abhorrent, even if it was 8 years ago.  And who knows, maybe someone new will be funnier.  I feel really bad for GotG fans though, I've seen a lot that have been really hurt by this.  

[festivus]

What the shit? I don't know anything about these tweets, I don't do Twitter and looking around is not really giving me much info.

[HunterHunted]

1 minute ago, VCRTracking said:

I remember the controversy over these tweets when he was making the first film and Gunn apologized and that was it. The fact that Mike "Pizzagate is real" Cernovich was the one who brought this back up bothers me.

That bothers me too. I hate that Disney ended up set up by someone who legitimately has no problems with rape.

1 hour ago, JessePinkman said:

Those tweets were really fucking something else. There's dark humor and then there's whatever the fuck he thought he was doing there.

I can tell that they were intended to be jokes, but they're not actually funny. They are aggressively unfunny and I've made some really really dark jokes. Gunn has been in trouble in the past for things he thought were humorous, but didn't play all that well. As funny and enjoyable as I've found the Guardians films to be, they've succeeded more because of their heart than their humor. I think, perhaps, as he's aged, he's learned that he's not nearly as funny as he thinks he is and to temper his jokes with sentiment.

[Wynterwolf]

1 minute ago, festivus said:

What the shit? I don't know anything about these tweets, I don't do Twitter and looking around is not really giving me much info.

If you google "james gunn tweets" and look at the images, you'll see examples.

[HunterHunted]

3 minutes ago, festivus said:

What the shit? I don't know anything about these tweets, I don't do Twitter and looking around is not really giving me much info.

1 minute ago, Wynterwolf said:

If you google "james gunn tweets" and look at the images, you'll see examples.

 

[VCRTracking]

11 minutes ago, HunterHunted said:

 As funny and enjoyable as I've found the Guardians films to be, they've succeeded more because of their heart than their humor.

And it's from the same person.  I think whoever they get to replace Gunn needs to remember the heart part as well as the jokes.

I thought those tweets were gross and unfunny in 2014 and I don't now but I do think people can learn and change.

Edited July 20, 2018 by VCRTracking

[SnoGirl]

Wow. That bums me out. I dont remember those tweets the first time around. Kinda ruins the first two movies a little bit-those tweets are not okay.

 

Wouldn’t mind Waititi directing, but I’d love a FEMALE director too. Spread the wealth Marvel, get a lady up in there.

[Wynterwolf]

3 minutes ago, VCRTracking said:

but I do think people can learn and change.

I do too, and I hope he has.  What will be really telling is how he handles his life and his work going forward from here.  

I never really followed the GotG stuff, they are at the bottom of my Marvel list with Dr. Strange, but I've been seeing that the first film was mostly written by Nicole Perlman?  And it seems she still has listed writing credit, so maybe they can get her involved again?  

[JessePinkman]

25 minutes ago, HunterHunted said:

That bothers me too. I hate that Disney ended up set up by someone who legitimately has no problems with rape.

I too hate the source but I'm glad this came to light.

What I don't understand is why he didn't delete all of those tweets 4 years ago when they first apparently gained traction? He made so many, no way did he just forget them. They are WAY too bizarre. Who makes one joke about child rape for the world to see much less dozens?

Edited July 20, 2018 by JessePinkman

[festivus]

Okay, thanks to all, I just had to get deep in the reddit thread where someone linked them. Man that is a lot of pedo jokes. Ugh, I had no idea about this.

[raven]

20 minutes ago, JessePinkman said:

They are WAY too bizarre. Who makes one joke about child rape for the world to see much less dozens?

The theme really bugs me.  I was shocked reading about this, I didn't know they came to light earlier.  I've seen him in interviews and he seemed kind of geeky and funny (I knew it was probably an affected persona to some degree).    I know these tweets were years ago and I'm glad he took responsibility for them BUT I don't know, it's an awful, gross thing to joke about when you're trying to be "provocative" as he says.   Just, ugh.

As you all say, it will give someone else a chance to step up. 

[festivus]

53 minutes ago, Wynterwolf said:

I never really followed the GotG stuff, they are at the bottom of my Marvel list with Dr. Strange, but I've been seeing that the first film was mostly written by Nicole Perlman?  And it seems she still has listed writing credit, so maybe they can get her involved again?  

Guardians 1 is my favorite Marvel movie along with Winter Soldier. I hope they do get Nicole Perlman involved again.  I was just reading that she's involved in Captain Marvel so she's still around the MCU.

I also hope this doesn't affect Sean Gunn/ Kraglin because I really love that character. Please don't let him turn out to be an asshole too. 

[HunterHunted]

1 hour ago, JessePinkman said:

He made so many, no way did he just forget them. They are WAY too bizarre. Who makes one joke about child rape for the world to see much less dozens?

53 minutes ago, raven said:

BUT I don't know, it's an awful, gross thing to joke about when you're trying to be "provocative" as he says.   Just, ugh.

 

 

1 hour ago, festivus said:

Man that is a lot of pedo jokes. Ugh, I had no idea about this.

The "trick" to even remotely pulling off jokes about provocative subjects is that the punchline is ALWAYS the perpetrator and NEVER the victim. Gunn's jokes, such as they are, have punchlines all over the place--some of them are on the victims, the victimizers, and some on the offensive act. Nor does it seem like he was doing his own weird dumb riff on The Aristocrats. It just seems like this was just offensive taboo jokes for provocative purposes.

[Wynterwolf]

Those weren't jokes... they were someone trying to be offensive for attention, he used rape and pedophilia as his subject, others use homophobia, or racism, or misogyny as their target.  Then the usual tactic if someone objects or gets upset is to say, "Hey, I was only joking!  You just can't take a joke!"  I just hope he genuinely has grown beyond that, instead of just figuring out how to hid it better.  

[tennisgurl]

I had heard that James Gunn had said some pretty questionable stuff in the past, but god dang, that is a weird obsession with child rape right there. I can appreciate dark humor, but those arent even jokes, its that kind of anti comedy "provocateur" humor that I find so pathetic. I love the Guardians movies, but maybe a new director would be a good move. I just wish the tweets weren't dug up by some wacked out right wing conspiracy nut clearly targeting Gunn for his politics and not his awful old tweets. 

I just have no idea why he didnt delete those tweets years ago. Come on dude.  

[mattie0808]

3 hours ago, JessePinkman said:

What I don't understand is why he didn't delete all of those tweets 4 years ago when they first apparently gained traction? He made so many, no way did he just forget them. They are WAY too bizarre. Who makes one joke about child rape for the world to see much less dozens?

 

14 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

I just have no idea why he didnt delete those tweets years ago. Come on dude.  

I can’t wrap my mind around this...ESPECIALLY since it sounds like these tweets were at least raised when he was first hired (I don’t remember hearing anything about it then). The NANOSECOND after you sign the GotG contract with Disney, you don’t go back and delete it all? Hell, just nuke the account entirely and start a new official one for yourself? WTF?!

I was skeptical when this first broke but day-um that is a whole lot of weird to disturbing “jokes” told over YEARS. Ugh.

And yes please to Taika.

[blueray]

13 hours ago, festivus said:

Guardians 1 is my favorite Marvel movie along with Winter Soldier. I hope they do get Nicole Perlman involved again.  I was just reading that she's involved in Captain Marvel so she's still around the MCU.

I also hope this doesn't affect Sean Gunn/ Kraglin because I really love that character. Please don't let him turn out to be an asshole too. 

I hope he's not like that.  Because to me he is still Kirk from Gilmore Girls :).  I wonder if he would get to still act in the movie, he wasn't a main character and I suppose his "captain?" was killed in the second one. So he would have no need to return as he isn't part of the guardian crew. I can see this going either way. But if they were planning on having him, they still should as so far he had nothing to do with it.

[Kel Varnsen]

It is certainly a fucked up situation and i am not sure how I feel about Gunn getting fired, especially since it appears to have been a politically motivated hit job based on Gunn sharing his opinions.

Don't get me wrong those tweets are terrible. But at the same time, as far as i understand it, they have been out there since before he was even hired for the first GOTG and he also apologized and recognized they were terrible. 

Also wondering if this is a career ending never work again kind of scandal. If it is that kind of sucks.

[Wynterwolf]

3 minutes ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Also wondering if this is a career ending never work again kind of scandal. If it is that kind of sucks.

There are too many high profile people (mostly other white men) voicing support for him, I would be very surprised if this doesn't work to his career benefit eventually.  

5 minutes ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Don't get me wrong those tweets are terrible. But at the same time, as far as i understand it, they have been out there since before he was even hired for the first GOTG and he also apologized and recognized they were terrible.

This was the first I had heard about it.  And the thing for me is that even in his most recent statement, he still classifies what he said as "provocative" and I suspect that might be why he didn't delete the tweets... he really doesn't understand how abhorrent they are.  And because of the nature of those tweets, I really don't see where Disney could have done anything other than what they did, even given where the attack came from (and honestly, that shouldn't matter at all unless there were any lies told, and it doesn't seem like there were).  

I don't know what his initial statement about this was when they first came to light, but I'm assuming they were similar to these statements.  So if, when they first came up, or at anytime in the intervening years, he had come out with a statement that was more self-aware of the harmfulness of his actions, and if he had openly acknowledged it (without being forced to because someone else forced the issue), then I think Disney maybe could have used that and taken a different tact.  But to my knowledge he didn't, and as I said, it feels from his current statement that while he gets that it was bad, he still really doesn't understand why, because he was 'only joking'.  That excuse just doesn't fly as a get-out-of-jail-free card for certain people the way it used to.  

[Maelstrom]

17 hours ago, mattie0808 said:

I can’t wrap my mind around this...ESPECIALLY since it sounds like these tweets were at least raised when he was first hired (I don’t remember hearing anything about it then). The NANOSECOND after you sign the GotG contract with Disney, you don’t go back and delete it all? Hell, just nuke the account entirely and start a new official one for yourself? WTF?!

I feel safe in assuming that an entity as massive as Disney knew about those tweets long before Gunn was even officially under contract to them. If Disney truly had a problem with the tweets, they wouldn't have hired him in the first place. So I'm not sure what BTS machinations are going on, but it all seems dodgy.

And I want to be clear, they are all horrible tweets and I am in no way condoning or excusing them one bit. They are vile and beyond unfunny. WTF was Gunn even thinking, sending them out into the internets in the first place?! Right now I'm inclined to agree with other posters that he didn't really believe any of it and was just trying to stir shit for the sake of stirring shit. Which, honestly, is a fucking terrible reason to make such offensive comments. And so many of them to boot.

The Guardians movies are my favorite subfranchise along with Captain America, so I really hope that whoever they get to direct Vol. 3 can capture what made the first two so great. And I realize I am in the minority on this, being the only person on the internet who didn't like Thor: Ragnorak, but I really, really hope they don't get Taika Waititi. Maybe some new blood would be a good choice.

20 hours ago, VCRTracking said:

I think whoever they get to replace Gunn needs to remember the heart part as well as the jokes.

My thoughts exactly.

[VCRTracking]

Taika could probably take over directing GOTG 3 but this tweet also brought up something:

[Wynterwolf]

2 minutes ago, VCRTracking said:

Taika could probably take over directing GOTG 3 but this tweet also brought up something:

Which isn't necessarily a bad thing... 

6 minutes ago, Maelstrom said:

If Disney truly had a problem with the tweets, they wouldn't have hired him in the first place.

Disney isn't a monolith... it's made up of literally thousands of individual people.  Maybe the people in charge of making the determination of who works for them now is different than it was then, and it's certainly a different climate now.  

[Perfect Xero]

I believe  that one of the people Gunn was sharing pedo jokes back and forth with was fairly recently caught with child porn on his computer and plead guilty, I don't know if that factored in to Disney firing him now when he'd skated by before, or if it's just the general shift in climate, but its a possible difference between now and the last time it came up.

I do have to say that one of the baffling things is people saying that Gunn's tweets are indefensible but then saying that Disney make a mistake for giving in to the Pizzagate guy.

Like, I get that he's doing this out of spite and the guy has said some deeply problematic things himself, but this take is sort of like getting upset at the police because they arrested a criminal after another criminal snitched on him.

What Gunn did was either worthy of being fired over or not, the source shouldn't factor in to it.

[VCRTracking]

Edited July 22, 2018 by VCRTracking

[Racj82]

9 hours ago, Perfect Xero said:

I believe  that one of the people Gunn was sharing pedo jokes back and forth with was fairly recently caught with child porn on his computer and plead guilty, I don't know if that factored in to Disney firing him now when he'd skated by before, or if it's just the general shift in climate, but its a possible difference between now and the last time it came up.

I do have to say that one of the baffling things is people saying that Gunn's tweets are indefensible but then saying that Disney make a mistake for giving in to the Pizzagate guy.

Like, I get that he's doing this out of spite and the guy has said some deeply problematic things himself, but this take is sort of like getting upset at the police because they arrested a criminal after another criminal snitched on him.

What Gunn did was either worthy of being fired over or not, the source shouldn't factor in to it.

No it's not like the example you said.

These are people targeting Gunn to make a point.

Whether or not his tweets were reprehensible isn't the point. They obviously are joke or not.

These tweets already came to light. It was addressed when he first came to Disney by all parties. It was not buried. This isn't new information. He apologized for his actions and took responsibility for them.

Now people who want to lash back after things like the Roseanne incident to make a point.

And this shouldn't be a treated like Roseanne incident. This isn't someone actively saying bad things. This is a guy who said bad things in jest at one point in his life, apologized and seemed to learn from it.

If people aren't allowed to learn and change anymore, we have a huge problem.

Screen junkies covered a lot of my thoughts as well.

[JessePinkman]

I feel like I’m living in the twilight zone. Who cares if he apologized before? Who cares if he apologized at all? Who cares if Disney knew about it in 2011 or 14 or whatever? They also knew Roseanne was making racist tweets before they revived her show. What matters is their actions right now.

Actions have consequences, whether those consequences came 6, 7, 8 years ago (people seem really stuck on the amount of time here and it baffles me, this was a 41 year old man who thought the height of comedy was to talk about peeing on and having sex with children, it’s fucking unsettling and the dismissive reaction to it due to the source or because you don’t like the optics of it or agree with Gunn’s politics is making me sick) or now.

[Wynterwolf]

3 minutes ago, JessePinkman said:

Actions have consequences

And the only consequence to him is that he has lost a high profile job.  People like his work, he'll get another job.  

[Kel Varnsen]

4 hours ago, Racj82 said:

If people aren't allowed to learn and change anymore, we have a huge problem.

That is what I am having trouble with. Are we supposed to write people off for the rest of their lives for statments like this? Even if they recognized that the statments were terrible and tried to improve themselves?  If James Gunn did 8 years in prison wouldn’t people want him to try and integrate back into society? So in this case what should be a reasonable sentence?

 

Quote

 

And this shouldn't be a treated like Roseanne incident. This isn't someone actively saying bad things. This is a guy who said bad things in jest at one point in his life, apologized and seemed to learn from it.

 

Roseanne was also a case of her targeting and attacking a specific person, which makes it different for me.

[Wynterwolf]

3 minutes ago, Kel Varnsen said:

So in this case what should be a reasonable sentence?

That's the thing though... he lost a job, he's not being arrested (and since he's being painted as the innocent victim of a right-wing attack, he's got a lot of support).  A lot of things influence someone getting/keeping a job, particularly an extremely high profile one like his... some fair and some not fair.  Particularly in the age of social media, mis-steps, even old one, have an impact.  I can understand Disney not wanting to fight a media battle trying to defend someone who indulged in extensive public statements about rape and pedophilia, however much he is purported to have changed and grown.  

What I find hilarious though, are the people who are condemning Disney's actions by saying that Walt was a racist... like, the lack of critical thinking in that argument isn't even worth addressing.  

[blueray]

The major difference between Roseanne and James Gunn is that her comments were recent. His were from 6 years ago. While what he said is very wrong, it was a long time ago. He hadn't said anything like that since as far as I know.  This stuff apparently was discussed when he first got the job to direct GoTG and clearly it was dismissed then. Clearly he was targeted as this had no reason to resurface. There is a bigger issue going on which is can some one evolve and get better. From what I read he was great to work with and most of the cast liked working with him.  I recently watched watched screen Junkie's cover of it. They bring up good points and discuss the situation.

Edit: Someone already posted it.

Edited July 22, 2018 by blueray

[Wynterwolf]

29 minutes ago, blueray said:

Clearly he was targeted as this had no reason to resurface.

He was, there's no disputing that.  But the reason is because of how much his public profile has been raised in the past couple of years.  For a lot of people, particularly young fans, this is new information and as it's a legitimate part of his history, it matters and each person has to decide for themselves how it matters.    

[Wynterwolf]

47 minutes ago, blueray said:

There is a bigger issue going on which is can some one evolve and get better.

I keep seeing this... this really isn't the issue related to his firing, his firing was primarily a business decision based on a ton of factors, most of which we, as fans, have no idea about.  Can people change and grow?  Of course they can!  And if he has, he'll grieve the loss of this job, pick himself up (likely with the help of a lot of friends he's made) and move to something else.  People do this every day.  The biggest difference is that he's doing it very publicly.  

[Racj82]

26 minutes ago, Wynterwolf said:

I keep seeing this... this really isn't the issue related to his firing, his firing was primarily a business decision based on a ton of factors, most of which we, as fans, have no idea about.  Can people change and grow?  Of course they can!  And if he has, he'll grieve the loss of this job, pick himself up (likely with the help of a lot of friends he's made) and move to something else.  People do this every day.  The biggest difference is that he's doing it very publicly.  

It's really easy to just dismiss it like this but it's not just a job. It's his dream job he's losing. He spent his career trying to get to this point. And when something like this happens to you, it's not as simple to just bounce back. A lot of people won't want to hire him not even because of what he joked about, the backlash they will receive. All for something that was public years ago, addressed by the studio years ago and hasn't happened since.

Yes people have to be held accountable for their own actions and repercussions will happen for your prior mistake in certain circumstances. But, he didn't lie to anyone. He was always out there with this news. A bunch of people didn't know about it? Okay, it still wasn't hidden.

And his firing is systematic of a bigger issue. Treating every bad deed the same way regardless of context or facts. Just fire them. Move on is going to keep setting a dangerous situation. And allowing someone who clearly doesn't care about this situation and is beating you will only get worse until people and studios take a stand and work people who have said something wrong or maybe done something wrong in the past. 

Mark Walberg committed a vicious hate crime in his youth that nearly killed a man. It's open information but many people still dont know about it. He has never done anything like that since then and has apologized for his misdeeds. Should he be fired from movies years later because someone basically did a smear campaign about him years later? Yes, a business can do this. They have the right. But, should people keep getting written off for these bad deeds? At a certain point, the answer has to be no or at least no given that every situation is different.

Sorry for ranting but this isn't some issue that should just be casually dismissed. There is no nuance or thought behind the way a lot of people are judged today and I just don't like. 

[Wynterwolf]

I apologize for coming off as being dismissive of the magnitude of what happened to him.  It is a huge deal.  Also, losing his creative influence going forward is a huge blow for his fans.  

5 minutes ago, Racj82 said:

At a certain point, the answer has to be no or at least no given that every situation is different.

If we were having a lot of people being fired in the entertainment industry for marginal infractions, I would find this argument a lot more compelling.  But the norm is for even major things to be dismissed and ignored.  I do think each case should be determined on it's merits, and in this case, I think Disney decided it would be easier to take the hit for letting JG go, rather than having to deal with an ongoing issue of having someone who - yes, in the past - can be directly linked to public statements in support of pedophilia, in a position of significant power over entertainment aimed at children.  Disney was going to take a hit either way, the choice they made seems to be the more easily managed in the long term.  

That fact that more people seem to be focusing what's happening to JG, rather than how harmful his statements were, I think is a function of how desensitized we've become to what constitutes something that deserves action.  I mean, the WB literally had Johnny Depp on stage at SDCC right before Amber Heard was to appear for Aquaman.  

[Racj82]

8 minutes ago, Wynterwolf said:

I apologize for coming off as being dismissive of the magnitude of what happened to him.  It is a huge deal.  Also, losing his creative influence going forward is a huge blow for his fans.  

If we were having a lot of people being fired in the entertainment industry for marginal infractions, I would find this argument a lot more compelling.  But the norm is for even major things to be dismissed and ignored.  I do think each case should be determined on it's merits, and in this case, I think Disney decided it would be easier to take the hit for letting JG go, rather than having to deal with an ongoing issue of having someone who - yes, in the past - can be directly linked to public statements in support of pedophilia, in a position of significant power over entertainment aimed at children.  Disney was going to take a hit either way, the choice they made seems to be the more easily managed in the long term.  

That fact that more people seem to be focusing what's happening to JG, rather than how harmful his statements were, I think is a function of how desensitized we've become to what constitutes something that deserves action.  I mean, the WB literally had Johnny Depp on stage at SDCC right before Amber Heard was to appear for Aquaman.  

I didn't say every person is being fired for minor issues. The issue I have and other people are having is that this whole issue is creating a dangerous precedent for the future if studios are going to keep letting these mobs of people trying to prove a point dictate what they do with their talent. It's not about just right now. It's about the future. It's not just about the entertainment industry. It's already hard for felons both violent and non violent to get hired or rehabilitate. More set ups to write people off isn't a good thing. Not with people who have changed and learned. People need to be able to change and grow. The world we are living in right now is making that something people don't care about.

[Wynterwolf]

2 minutes ago, Racj82 said:

People need to be able to change and grow.

I absolutely agree, and I agree that people who have made mistakes in the past need to have a path forward and they need to be actively supported in that.  I just don't see this specific situation as a harbinger for what you're suggesting.   I do, however, see a lot of people in pain over the situation, dealing with it the best way they can.  

[WritinMan]

Here's the problem I have with him saying that he's grown and that he's a changed person:

Why didn't you delete those tweets years ago? Especially if this already came up before directing GotG? (Which I don't remember, but I've read several times now.)

[starri]

I wonder if Marvel is regretting not putting on a big Hall H panel.  Because they intentionally kept their presence at SDCC minimal this year--not quite ready to push Captain Marvel and not wanting to spoil Avengers: Based on the Novel Push, by Sapphire--and so this is all anyone has to talk about.

[Racj82]

20 minutes ago, starri said:

I wonder if Marvel is regretting not putting on a big Hall H panel.  Because they intentionally kept their presence at SDCC minimal this year--not quite ready to push Captain Marvel and not wanting to spoil Avengers: Based on the Novel Push, by Sapphire--and so this is all anyone has to talk about.

They don't need comic con. They aren't regretting anything. They have D23. 

 

52 minutes ago, Wynterwolf said:

I absolutely agree, and I agree that people who have made mistakes in the past need to have a path forward and they need to be actively supported in that.  I just don't see this specific situation as a harbinger for what you're suggesting.   I do, however, see a lot of people in pain over the situation, dealing with it the best way they can.  

I've said my peace. I will just say one thing I read today that hit me. Basically, it's about people weaponizing shame. This is where we are. Using any dirt you can use to browbeat youropposition. Facts or logic be damned. It's not new. Politics are fueled by it. But, now we have people that are upset about attacks on people on their side or party and are trying to force actions on others through shame. It's just not a good look into out future. Not trying to be overdramatic but you have a guy who 100 percent does not give a shot about these tweets and has said horrible things too. But, he used these tweets to fire back at a group of people he doesn't agree with. It's just games being played instead of actual feeling of hurt and outrage.

35 minutes ago, WritinMan said:

Here's the problem I have with him saying that he's grown and that he's a changed person:

Why didn't you delete those tweets years ago? Especially if this already came up before directing GotG? (Which I don't remember, but I've read several times now.)

Why bother? They were already out there meaning someone was always going to drag them back up. It wouldn't delete them from the world. And people often delete to hide from what they did or said. He never did. Not to make him out to be a saint but him not deleting the tweets doesn't mean he didn't care or didn't learn in itself. Why Disney let them stay up is a bigger question i have.

[Morrigan2575]

Just a few thoughts. I get that this was a right wing attack. I hate that Pizzagate guy managed to get Gunn fired and, that's annoying in and of itself. I also get that Gunn made these tweets years ago and like the recent attack on Joy Reid people dug something up from years ago and this is not who Joy/Gunn is now.  At the very least, I hope Gunn is NOT like this. I really hope that he was simply being provocative to get attention and, not something he really believes deep down.

At the same time this IS Disney. Their entire brand is about Kids/Family, even their sub-companies (Lucas Film, Marvel, etc) are subject to Disney's over all brand.  Any other company and and Gunn's apology may have been granted a stay of Execution but, not Disney.

While, this is unfortunate and, I do feel bad for Gunn and worry about GoTG3 I don't blame Disney for the firing, they had to do this. 

Edited July 22, 2018 by Morrigan2575

[WritinMan]

11 minutes ago, Racj82 said:

Why bother? They were already out there meaning someone was always going to drag them back up. It wouldn't delete them from the world. And people often delete to hide from what they did or said. He never did. Not to make him out to be a saint but him not deleting the tweets doesn't mean he didn't care or didn't learn in itself. Why Disney let them stay up is a bigger question i have.

To me, not deleting them does show he didn't care enough--or just didn't take this seriously.

It would've shown that he was truly serious about this. "Yes, these are stupid tweets and I'm I don't want them on my Twitter account anymore." It's possible he could have avoided this screwing up his work with Disney/Marvel if he had made a show of good faith regarding this. He could have apologized AND done something to deal with it.

But instead, he just left them.

Edited July 22, 2018 by WritinMan

[Wynterwolf]

O_O