Carole Radziwill: She's a Real Princess!

[Maximona]

3 minutes ago, ryebread said:

And then there are people who, like you, think it takes a certain kind of special to join these forums to snark these shows. We're all here, so guilty as charged, your 'onna!

Ha, ha, ha!  SO TRUE!!!!  :-)

[Jel]

7 hours ago, breezy424 said:

My point is that some think that Carole is the one starting stuff.  Maybe not.  Beth brought up Adam and Houston.  Heck, I don't like Adam either but that not the point or what this is about in the comments made.  It was about Carole instigating stuff when, in fact, Beth was.

I think technically Bethenny did start it (by saying Adam is an operator), but she did that unintentionally. From Beth's perspective, her friend has broken up with a guy who's now seeing other women, and she feels it's fine to go into "screw him!" mode. That's what I think she was doing there, saying what she really thought of the guy, now that he and her friend are over. Carole, I think, took that in a way Bethenny didn't intend it, as though Beth was insulting Carole by saying Adam never liked/loved her, and he was just using her for money, for fame, for opportunities, for connections.

That's the only way I (someone who likes both Beth and Carole) can make sense of Carole's OTT reactions -- cold, near contemptuous, dismissive and taking shots at Bethenny in her blogs week after week.  Maybe "Adam is using you"  was a secret fear of Carole's and the operator comment hit a nerve?  We know Carole has (or had) "opinions" about women in their 50s dating younger men because she's made a couple of jokes at someone else's expense on the subject. She thought it was jab worthy then. Most people assume other people think like they do .... Yes! I have convinced myself! ;)

For viewers who don't like Beth, I can see Carole's reaction as coming across as "finally! she sees the light!", but I, personally, don't think that's the case here. Bethenny was like that from day one -- in fact she was worse back then when Carole became friends with her, right? weren't those her "You're  whore!..: freak out days? -- so for Carole to now say, "Now I see who Bethenny really is" seems disingenuous.  She saw her at her worst and she signed on to a friendship when Bethenny was at her worst. I contrast that acceptance with the people who don't like Beth and I recall they really didn't like the way she was behaving that season (when Carole and Beth started their friendship). The Beth non-fans saw that and didn't like it, heck even the Beth fans weren't very happy with her that year.

In the early days of feuding, Carole said she was shocked to find out some of the things her supposed friend had said about her. As a viewer, I was like, "What things?" What other than the typical Bethenny remarks has she said?  The truth is, Beth didn't really say much about Carole, what happened was Carole heard Bethenny say something that she didn't really say -- Carole "heard" Beth say "You are old, Carole, Adam never loved you, he was just using you. Ha, ha, ha!"

That's my analysis and I'm sticking to it!

[hoodooznoodooz]

7 hours ago, ShawnaLanne said:

Since this is a thread about Carole and not Bethany, I don't really care how Bethany felt about Jill. I'm here to talk about Carole. I will say it again, it's interesting that Carole is so boring that even in a thread about her, Bethany dominates. Lol 

It’s possible that many like Carole enough to want to defend her in the Carole vs. Beth discussion. 

[hoodooznoodooz]

13 hours ago, Mondrianyone said:

Hardly ever to their faces anyway.

I really can’t think of one example of Carole saying something about another HW in a TH or behind her back or in a blog, that was more malicious than some of the things Beth has said to someone.  

(She apologized to Sonja about the illegal sex act joke.)

[SuprSuprElevated]

8 hours ago, jaync said:

Muthafucka prays for diarrhea. You can't get much sadder than that.

As a one-year member of the 3F club, I would suggest to B that she have her gall bladder removed.  That oughta fix what ails her, and quickly.

[Alonzo Mosely FBI]

14 hours ago, film noire said:

Carole hangs with the kind of A list crowd Bethenny covets but cannot break into  (many of whom are longstanding friends)  Carole's close to her family, she has a beautiful home, enough financial freedom to walk away from half a million a year, and doesn't have to behave like a rabid howler monkey for $$$  -- sounds like greener pastures  to me :)

Agreed -- I don't much like Radziwill, but I like the way she handled Frankel.

199% whoops I meant to type 100% but I am going to stick with the 199% also. 

9 hours ago, Rap541 said:

 

To be totally fucking blunt, I don't much like Adam after his "I have a disability which requires a *service dog* and Baby the dog I don't even own is my service dog and therefore Delta should be boycotted because MY SERVICE DOG (that doesn't belong to me and isn't actually my dog) wasn't allowed to fly for free" silliness, and quite frankly I would like to know Carole's opinion on this issue as she is an actual owner of the dog her sorta boyfriend/coffee fuck was using for attention. 

 

Yuck. I hate ANYONE who pulls that shit re: service animals. The last fake I saw in the grocery store was growling at children walking by and lunching while the owner in her jazzy scooter ignored the behaviour. Service dog my ass. A long winded paper trail to have your pet with you at all times. Looking at you Adam and it's not even your own pet. I HATE THAT. 

[Otherkate]

1 hour ago, Jel said:

That's the only way I (someone who likes both Beth and Carole) can make sense of Carole's OTT reactions -- cold, near contemptuous, dismissive and taking shots at Bethenny in her blogs week after week.  Maybe "Adam is using you"  was a secret fear of Carole's and the operator comment hit a nerve?]

 

Yes, I am with you on this.

Edited August 6, 2018 by Otherkate

[hoodooznoodooz]

11 hours ago, breezy424 said:

Gosh, I feel like I was watching a different show.  Carole was the evil one who was mean all season?  Huh?  Yeah.  No.  Beth was no innocent.  Let's start with Beth telling Doris about Adam and the confusing story about Houston....

Honestly! I am wondering if the viewers who defend Carole 

1. Identify with Carole because we share many of the same personality traits or characteristics as Carole

2. Had a “Bethenny” in our lives who exhausted us 

The viewers who defend Beth

1. Identity with Beth because they share many of the same personality traits or characteristics as Beth 

2. Had a “Carole” in their lives who was too stoic

 

Like Breezy424, I did not see an evil Carole. I did not see mean. I saw someone who was confused and hurt. I saw someone who was surprised that her friend said, “You don’t have to like it.” That she hollered, “I know you want to be 45, but don’t act like you’re seven!!!” [not 100% sure of the ages here]

Beth spoke negatively about Adam. I didn’t see Carole upset because she desperately wanted to eventually reconnect with Adam. I saw someone who would get upset if her friend maligned anyone she cared about: Heather, her mother, Carolyn Bessette. She’s loyal.  If someone spoke ill of Beth last year, Carole would have gotten upset about that, too. 

[Rap541]

Quote

Beth spoke negatively about Adam. I didn’t see Carole upset because she desperately wanted to eventually reconnect with Adam. I saw someone who would get upset if her friend maligned anyone she cared about: Heather, her mother, Carolyn Bessette. She’s loyal.  If someone spoke ill of Beth last year, Carole would have gotten upset about that, too. 

Ah but here's the thing. And this is probably getting nitty gritty into why I think Bethenny probably gets more sympathy in this break up.

Beth spoke negatively about Adam during a time where Carole and Adam were effectively no longer dating. Lets all be honest with ourselves - if you break up with a guy, even one that maybe you still love deep down, do you get mad when your other friends start to point out your ex's flaws to where you decide to not be friends with them? Because you're so loyal to your ex, you can't bear a negative word to be said? I mean ride or die is nice and all, but we're talking about Adam the ex coffee fuck who calls Carole to let her know he's fucking someone else... not Heather or her mother or Carolyn Bessette.

And this is pretty much it. This is what Carole is mad about, that's what ended the friendship. Carole broke up with her coffee fuck that she told the world she was just shacking up with and then got offended when her bestie was honest about how she really felt about the now ex. The question then becomes "was Adam worth it?" 

I suppose Carole will find out. 

[AnnA]

If Carole was truly stoic, she wouldn't be whining about her situation with Bethenny to the other HWs every chance she got.   It's non-stop!

[Mozelle]

1 hour ago, Rap541 said:

Ah but here's the thing. And this is probably getting nitty gritty into why I think Bethenny probably gets more sympathy in this break up.

Beth spoke negatively about Adam during a time where Carole and Adam were effectively no longer dating. Lets all be honest with ourselves - if you break up with a guy, even one that maybe you still love deep down, do you get mad when your other friends start to point out your ex's flaws to where you decide to not be friends with them? Because you're so loyal to your ex, you can't bear a negative word to be said? I mean ride or die is nice and all, but we're talking about Adam the ex coffee fuck who calls Carole to let her know he's fucking someone else... not Heather or her mother or Carolyn Bessette.

And this is pretty much it. This is what Carole is mad about, that's what ended the friendship. Carole broke up with her coffee fuck that she told the world she was just shacking up with and then got offended when her bestie was honest about how she really felt about the now ex. The question then becomes "was Adam worth it?" 

I suppose Carole will find out. 

...depending on whose side you fall lol.

Because from my vantage point, Carole and Adam weren't a "coffee fuck" apparently until after they broke up. It's probably really easy to forget that they were an exclusive item for three years because it's more salacious and Carole knock-y to suggest that she was nothing but an easy lay or something. What happened between Carole and Adam after their break up doesn't magically erase their three years together. 

I also don't know very many people who are truly OK with a friend trashing their recent ex, even if they themselves are smarting over the break up. Like, "Yeah, I'm pissed/angry/hurt about this break up, but no you don't get say anything of the sort about the ex" because, in the end, and to quote Dorinda, "You have no skin in this game."

2 hours ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

Honestly! I am wondering if the viewers who defend Carole 

1. Identify with Carole because we share many of the same personality traits or characteristics as Carole

2. Had a “Bethenny” in our lives who exhausted us 

The viewers who defend Beth

1. Identity with Beth because they share many of the same personality traits or characteristics as Beth 

2. Had a “Carole” in their lives who was too stoic

 

Like Breezy424, I did not see an evil Carole. I did not see mean. I saw someone who was confused and hurt. I saw someone who was surprised that her friend said, “You don’t have to like it.” That she hollered, “I know you want to be 45, but don’t act like you’re seven!!!” [not 100% sure of the ages here]

Beth spoke negatively about Adam. I didn’t see Carole upset because she desperately wanted to eventually reconnect with Adam. I saw someone who would get upset if her friend maligned anyone she cared about: Heather, her mother, Carolyn Bessette. She’s loyal.  If someone spoke ill of Beth last year, Carole would have gotten upset about that, too. 

You know what I find infinitely interesting about the need to knock Carole for wanting to be young of spirit is that I wonder how many of us know people--have become friends with or acquaintances with people--who are older or younger than us. It's not a bad thing. Carole, seeing how she is with Cassandra Grey's son, and seeing how she hosted that baby shower, strikes me as what one would call "the cool aunt." Apparently, now though, being the cool aunt is all uncool.

Edited August 6, 2018 by Mozelle

[Rap541]

Sure. Lets say Carole and Adam were exclusive and it was a deep relationship despite Carole's constant noting that she was "just shacking up" and didn't want him to move in, etc etc etc. I allow it. Let's say they were in a deep relationship. They still were broken up and no longer in a relationship when this all went down.

And what went down? Did Bethenny call him a rapist, an asshole, a piece of shit that Carole was dumb to make a part of her life? Because I didn't see that. She called him "an operator" and thats... not exactly trashing him.  

And thats why Carole is coming off as unreasonable. After Carole broke up with Adam and was no longer in a relationship with him, she took such offense to "Adam's an operator" that she decided to end a three year friendship over it. Because she was so angry over someone saying something uncomplimentary about the man she couldn't bring herself to publically acknowledge beyond being her coffee fuck she shacked up with. 

[Jel]

17 minutes ago, Mozelle said:

...depending on whose side you fall lol.

Because from my vantage point, Carole and Adam weren't a "coffee fuck" apparently until after they broke up. It's probably really easy to forget that they were an exclusive item for three years because it's more salacious and Carole knock-y to suggest that she was nothing but an easy lay or something. What happened between Carole and Adam after their break up doesn't magically erase their three years together. 

I also don't know very many people who are truly OK with a friend trashing their recent ex, even if they themselves are smarting over the break up. Like, "Yeah, I'm pissed/angry/hurt about this break up, but no you don't get say anything of the sort about the ex" because, in the end, and to quote Dorinda, "You have no skin in this game."

I completely get this, but man, it's an individual differences thing. For me, the long list of negative things that jerk did and said! (and at the break up point, the longer the better!) is the real start of the getting over it phase.

It's like validation or something. Or petty candy -- sour grapes flavour? ;)

Edited August 6, 2018 by Jel
Had to add words because I was obviously accessing the unceremoniously dumped section of memory and got flummoxed.

[Rap541]

And for the record, I don't really have a side in the Carole/Bethenny thing. They're both awful people and if this friendship mattered to either, they both could have made an effort to save it. Instead, Bethenny made it all about Bethenny and Carole slashed and burned her way out. Neither deserves a prize when I think they could have easily resolved this by talking and maybe being willing to forgive a little. 

[Jel]

I don't have a side really either except underneath it all -- the egos, butt-hurtedness, emotional immaturity and unresolved childhood damage (so way, way underneath) I think they're both good, kind people.

Pollyanna signing off.

[AnnA]

This show is pure entertainment for me so it's natural that I'm always going to be on the side of whoever provides the most.  In this case, that's Bethenny.    There's nothing even remotely entertaining or enjoyable about Carole.   She's boring, unattractive and mean. 

 

I've been team Bethenny since day one.   She's a smart ass with a quick wit and she makes me laugh.  Carole never even makes me smile.

Edited August 6, 2018 by AnnA

[BodhiGurl]

Rewatching the episode where Carole gives Sonja the earrings - this after earlier in the day talking to Sonja about how toxic BF is, she later goes to dog BF some more in front of Sonja... I find that gross. It's clear Sonja is cool with BF this season - wrong person for Carole to go after, I felt it was more than an attempt to get intel, it was trying to get Sonja to her side of "everybody having a terrible trip because of BF"... Just gross. Glad Sonja didn't fall for it and was on to Carole. Also - Carole says she's focusing on "family" and "other things". Where were the scenes with "family" and "other things" throughout the season? Such a shame - guess she hung her hat on the friction with BF for max screen time. During this Columbia trip seriously none of the women seemed to be having issues with BF other than Carole... Even Dorinda was being civil. Hey - I get it, in many of the others talking heads they were anti-BF at times, but overall they seem to behave kindly during group trips. I also understand none of them had the friendship level relationship with BF like Carole did. It's just too bad this became such a central storyline. It's also interesting in this episode that finally Carole says it's time to address the elephant in the room - after an entire season of talking about BF behind her back... Anywho - I look forward to what next season brings when the dynamic changes. NYC is still my fave out of all the RH shows... I think Carole's departure was long overdue - she probably should have exited when Heather did... however she made the wise choice to befriend the BF, thus insuring a few more seasons... 

Edited August 6, 2018 by BodhiGurl
wrong word/clarity

[lamujerdecente]

13 hours ago, breezy424 said:

My point is that some think that Carole is the one starting stuff.  Maybe not.  Beth brought up Adam and Houston.  Heck, I don't like Adam either but that not the point or what this is about in the comments made.  It was about Carole instigating stuff when, in fact, Beth was.

They were both instigating stuff. These are two sides of the same kind of mean girl. Is Carole slightly redeemable than ever present screeching ungrateful Bethany. Maybe. Depends on who you ask. I never liked Bethany. I always saw this asshole side. As I have gotten older, my empathy chip is kicking in and I am seeing why people are the way they are. That doesn't excuse them and I stay away from those toxic types. I don't slide over to them and tell them I have sex dreams with them and mock anorexic chicks clearly having a relapse with them. I mean I would expect a world traveling war journalist to have acquired a bit of common sense in her travels. She sure has horned her smug, entitled, conceited side. That might answered my question on how she was led astray. Smug. Entitled. Conceited. Thats Carole.

And her little man child is the model boy for Smug and entitled. 

[Mozelle]

51 minutes ago, Rap541 said:

Sure. Lets say Carole and Adam were exclusive and it was a deep relationship despite Carole's constant noting that she was "just shacking up" and didn't want him to move in, etc etc etc. I allow it. Let's say they were in a deep relationship. They still were broken up and no longer in a relationship when this all went down.

And what went down? Did Bethenny call him a rapist, an asshole, a piece of shit that Carole was dumb to make a part of her life? Because I didn't see that. She called him "an operator" and thats... not exactly trashing him.  

And thats why Carole is coming off as unreasonable. After Carole broke up with Adam and was no longer in a relationship with him, she took such offense to "Adam's an operator" that she decided to end a three year friendship over it. Because she was so angry over someone saying something uncomplimentary about the man she couldn't bring herself to publically acknowledge beyond being her coffee fuck she shacked up with. 

We can say that they were in such a relationship because they were, no supposition needed. Carole noted that they were "shacking up" because Adam was looking for a new apartment after moving out of his old apartment. Carole not wanting to live permanently with Adam didn't mean that they weren't in a relationship. The former didn't cancel out the latter.

And I'll remind that just because Carole and Adam were at a pause or a break up or a moment away from each other still didn't mean that Bethenny had reason to share whatever views of Adam she had.

I guess I'm a different kind of friend. One of my best friends is married to a man who I don't care much for. Even though I don't like him (e.g., a particular thing that my friend was quite fine with three and half years ago before she met him is now something she's done a 180 on because of his views on the matter), if anything were to happen between them, I'd still keep my opinion about him to myself because chances are high she'd still have feelings for him, even if in one breath or another she was pissed off about him and/or their break up. (And just for comparison sake, they've been together three years, not quite married two, so about the length of time that Carole and Adam were together.) 

Basically, you go all in joining your friend as she vents about the ex...then your friend and the ex get back together. Awkward af.

[jaync]

Quote

Beth spoke negatively about Adam during a time where Carole and Adam were effectively no longer dating.

If Beth thought negatively about Adam, and saw him as an operator, then why did she even ask him - when he was no longer with Carole - to accompany her to Puerto Rico in the first place?

Quote

Lets all be honest with ourselves - if you break up with a guy, even one that maybe you still love deep down, do you get mad when your other friends start to point out your ex's flaws to where you decide to not be friends with them?

We don't know that Carole did that.

[AnnA]

[ryebread]

46 minutes ago, AnnA said:

I've been team Bethenny since day one.   She's a smart ass with a quick wit and she makes me laugh.  Carole never even makes me smile.

Bethenny is funny, Carole is not.

Carole is calm, Bethenny is not.

Bethenny is a hard worker, Carol is not.

Carole seems to be able to maintain friendships, Bethenny cannot.

The only things these two have in common is they are mean. And even in that, they have their differences.

Carol tries to hide her meanness, Bethenny does not.

[Reality police]

25 minutes ago, Mozelle said:

We can say that they were in such a relationship because they were, no supposition needed. Carole noted that they were "shacking up" because Adam was looking for a new apartment after moving out of his old apartment. Carole not wanting to live permanently with Adam didn't mean that they weren't in a relationship. The former didn't cancel out the latter.

And I'll remind that just because Carole and Adam were at a pause or a break up or a moment away from each other still didn't mean that Bethenny had reason to share whatever views of Adam she had.

I guess I'm a different kind of friend. One of my best friends is married to a man who I don't care much for. Even though I don't like him (e.g., a particular thing that my friend was quite fine with three and half years ago before she met him is now something she's done a 180 on because of his views on the matter), if anything were to happen between them, I'd still keep my opinion about him to myself because chances are high she'd still have feelings for him, even if in one breath or another she was pissed off about him and/or their break up. (And just for comparison sake, they've been together three years, not quite married two, so about the length of time that Carole and Adam were together.) 

Basically, you go all in joining your friend as she vents about the ex...then your friend and the ex get back together. Awkward af.

It's called respect. You care for your friend and respect her decisions even if you feel they are wrong. That's the kind of friend I have and i feel that's the kind of friend you are.

[Rap541]

Is calling Adam an operator "going all in"?  I think that's my disconnect. Calling Adam an operator  who maybe was into Carol for the perks and not so much for Carol? Is it the same as "I never liked that fucking prick and I'm glad you finally came to your senses, he was a complete shit to you"?

Because THATS trashing the ex in my book. My friends do hear from me if I think their boyfriends are users or are bad people. I try not to be an ass about it, and I do drop it once I've made my views known. Because I can't stop people from making mistakes and because I can admit to sometimes making them myself. If that makes me a bad friend so be it. 

That said, we're still back to the idea that Bethenny calling Adam an operater was Bethenny going all in trash talking Adam and I am not seeing it that way... and judging by reactions to Carole I doubt I am alone in that. 

Quote

If Beth thought negatively about Adam, and saw him as an operator, then why did she even ask him - when he was no longer with Carole - to accompany her to Puerto Rico in the first place?

First, I think the refusal of Adam to do the Puerto Rico trip is where Bethenny formalized her view that he was an operator. :)

Second, yup, she may not especially like him, but I never got the sense she disliked him either - maybe she asked because he was still a friend of her friend and she wanted to help him get a resume point as a photographer, and also maybe she thought he owed her a favor or two after taking him on some free trips?

I know I've done favors or helped people out who weren't especially close to me because I knew they were close to my better friends. It happens.

[jaync]

Quote

 Carole never even makes me smile.

Oh, come on now...those memes don't make you grin, just a little?

[Rap541]

I admit to cheerful laughter at the dunkin donuts thing.

And the line about Ramona and Sonja's eyes lighting up at the idea of a wine tap of their very own was a genuine belly laugh moment for me. 

[ryebread]

6 minutes ago, Rap541 said:

Is calling Adam an operator "going all in"?  I think that's my disconnect. Calling Adam an operator  who maybe was into Carol for the perks and not so much for Carol? Is it the same as "I never liked that fucking prick and I'm glad you finally came to your senses, he was a complete shit to you"?

I agree with you, rap. I don't think calling Adam an operator was all that. I think Carole has a whole lot of other baggage stored between those be-feathered ears of hers, that got stuck in her craw.

But I learned long ago, it's better to just keep your pie hole shut when it comes to the demise of anyone's relationship. Especially on TV. No bueno.

Of course there's a caveat to that:  If your friend gives you permission to trash your ex on TV,  like Bethenny gave to Carole re: Jason. Then apparently, the rules change. Funny how that works.

[jaync]

Quote

I know I've done favors or helped people out who weren't especially close to me because I knew they were close to my better friends. It happens.

So, Beth asked Adam a favor because he was still close to Carole, but at the very same time, Beth dissed Adam because he and Carole were no longer close? I don't know...that seems to be quite a bit of pretzel logic in order to explain/excuse away Beth's behavior.

Edited August 6, 2018 by jaync

[SweetieDarling]

5 minutes ago, ryebread said:

I agree with you, rap. I don't think calling Adam an operator was all that. I think Carole has a whole lot of other baggage stored between those be-feathered ears of hers, that got stuck in her craw.

But I learned long ago, it's better to just keep your pie hole shut when it comes to the demise of anyone's relationship. Especially on TV. No bueno.

Of course there's a caveat to that:  If your friend gives you permission to trash your ex on TV,  like Bethenny gave to Carole re: Jason. Then apparently, the rules change. Funny how that works.

I agree with everything you said, especially the bolded. I don't think any ONE thing caused the demise of their friendship. I think it may have been several things or an accumulation of things. 

[Mozelle]

1 hour ago, Rap541 said:

Is calling Adam an operator "going all in"?  I think that's my disconnect. Calling Adam an operator  who maybe was into Carol for the perks and not so much for Carol? Is it the same as "I never liked that fucking prick and I'm glad you finally came to your senses, he was a complete shit to you"?

Because THATS trashing the ex in my book. My friends do hear from me if I think their boyfriends are users or are bad people. I try not to be an ass about it, and I do drop it once I've made my views known. Because I can't stop people from making mistakes and because I can admit to sometimes making them myself. If that makes me a bad friend so be it. 

That said, we're still back to the idea that Bethenny calling Adam an operater was Bethenny going all in trash talking Adam and I am not seeing it that way... and judging by reactions to Carole I doubt I am alone in that. 

First, I think the refusal of Adam to do the Puerto Rico trip is where Bethenny formalized her view that he was an operator. :)

Second, yup, she may not especially like him, but I never got the sense she disliked him either - maybe she asked because he was still a friend of her friend and she wanted to help him get a resume point as a photographer, and also maybe she thought he owed her a favor or two after taking him on some free trips?

I know I've done favors or helped people out who weren't especially close to me because I knew they were close to my better friends. It happens.

I mean, as we all know by now, Bethenny likes to substitute words. When the "operator" comment came out lo those many episodes ago, people immediately understood it to mean that she was calling Adam a user. There's more than one way to skin a cat, and there's certainly more than one way to trash someone without using all the expletives possible lol. 

I think it's as others have said--it was likely a culmination of things: the "operator" comment; Bethenny feeling as though she should be Carole's only RHONY friend; Carole feeling that the friendship was too heavy and one-sided (per Sonja--I know I know!--Carole saying that Bethenny is a taker, which Bethenny immediately took to mean materially rather than emotionally, which is how I think Carole meant it. That Bethenny is draining and doesn't take that same energy to listen). 

[SweetieDarling]

I still can't get over Bethenny's "Can we be done with Adam yet?" comment. It's just so dismissive and doesn't take Carole's feelings or emotions into consideration at all. 

[Rap541]

Quote

So, Beth asked Adam a favor because he was still close to Carole, but at the very same time, Beth dissed Adam because he and Carole were no longer close? I don't know...that seems to be quite a bit of pretzel logic in order to explain/excuse away Beth's behavior.

Did she diss him at the same time she was asking him the favor? I thought the chain of events Bethenny asked him to help her, he said no, she later told Dorinda she thought he was a bit of an operator. Not Bethenny badmouthed Adam to Dorinda BEFORE she asked him to help with Houston/Puerto Rico.

I mean, here's my "pretzel logic".

1. Sometime in the summer of 2017, Carole and Adam broke up amicably.

2. The hurricanes happen. Knowing that Carole and Adam broke up amicably, Bethenny still felt she was on reasonably good terms with Adam and approached him with the charity job. He said no. 

3. A few months later, with Carole and Adam still broken up, Bethenny calls Adam an operator and the drama ensues. 

This is what the show presented as the start of the fight. To me, this makes Carole look petty and like she's badly overreacting and making a molehill into a mountain. And look where it got her. 

Now, the only way this is defending Bethenny is pointing out that Bethenny's actions weren't horrible. They weren't great, but honestly? As presented? If this happened to me, with me in the Carole role? I'd talk with my friend but I'd also try to see what motivated it. I like my friends. I try not to lose them over petty stuff. Sometimes we say and do things we don't mean or regret.

Quote

I mean, as we all know by now, Bethenny likes to substitute words. When the "operator" comment came out lo those many episodes ago, people immediately understood it to mean that she was calling Adam a user. There's more than one way to skin a cat, and there's certainly more than one way to trash someone without using all the expletives possible lol. 

No need to explain. I understood what Bethenny meant, as did everyone else. I still don't see it as a friendship ending remark, not over a guy that was already out the door. (and frankly, I was more on Adam's side at first since I thought it was probably legit that he really just couldn't afford it. Now that he's a piece of shit lying about service dogs to avoid pet charges, my opinion of him has dropped)

Quote

I still can't get over Bethenny's "Can we be done with Adam yet?" comment. It's just so dismissive and doesn't take Carole's feelings or emotions into consideration at all. 

Yeah. This is the one I thought was pretty fucking cold on Bethenny's part. I wish Carole had picked this and not the "he's an operator" remark as her hillside to die on. 

[film noire]

7 hours ago, Alonzo Mosely FBI said:

199% whoops I meant to type 100% but I am going to stick with the 199% also. 

Given the subject, the hyperbole seems apt, Alonzo! (+ !!!!!!! :)

2 hours ago, Mozelle said:

And I'll remind that just because Carole and Adam were at a pause or a break up or a moment away from each other still didn't mean that Bethenny had reason to share whatever views of Adam she had.

And just imagine the reverse: Carole daring to criticize Dennis -- during one of their endless Deathenny breakups -- in *any* capacity, never mind implying he's an untrustworthy user (or just straight up reporting the facts; Frankel fucks a guy who fucks over people in deep crisis).  She would adopt a baboon-like stance and charge until Radziwill was dead and bleeding on the floor.

2 hours ago, jaync said:

Beth asked Adam a favor because he was still close to Carole, but at the very same time, Beth dissed Adam because he and Carole were no longer close? 

I don't know...that seems to be quite a bit of pretzel logic in order to explain/excuse away Beth's behavior.

As twisty as Frankel's colon ; )

Edited August 6, 2018 by film noire

[Midnight Cheese]

I don't know what to think about the implosion of Frankelwill.   Bethcarole.    Carenny doesn't work; they are both solipsistic AF.   Anyway.   They were friends 'till the end until they weren't.   I do call b.s. (ugh, and now I need to apologize to Emma Gonzalez) on the idea that Carole somehow got a surprise burn from Beth:  Carole was right there for the truly repulsive attitudes they had towards Jules, and I'm glad Jules is over it with Carole, but I'm not and won't ever be.    That small little moment when Carole had to decline giving blood due to her being underweight due to the marathon training reminded me instantly of the Jules storyline (I'll admit this is random) and I felt all that old revulsion, and my own certainty that gruesome twosome B&C were both unmoored at no longer being the undisputed underweight champ of RHONY.   At least Beth's issues are out there on this tip.

For me, this breakup is not really like Jill v Beth, with Beth in the red-haired loudmouth role.   Jill was the insecure mother hen, like Carmela to Meadow in the middle of The Sopranos, when Tony (Bobby?  Nah) was genuinely befuddled as to why Carm wasn't joyous when Meadow finally got her groove at Columbia.   Beth thought of Carole as her peer - her only peer.   More lustrous social and professional ties than Holla.  Skinny.   Fashion-obsessed.   Some money.  Notable and occasionally controversial romantic life.   Wit.   So I really believe that this fracture really hurt Bethenny even though much of it is her frigging fault!   And consequently I also believe Carole's social game-playing and I'm Hurting Too!  (<--- Carole is a cowardly liar, please see exhibits 1-99, her TH's and tweets and blogs) total gas lighting ratfucking nonsense truly hurt Beth.   Carole can walk away of course.   Friendship contracts have been broken often, as Cynthia Bailey knows too well.   But I certainly can't see where Carole acted with any valor for lack of a better word.  She was like a chickenshit girl version of Andy Cohen.

Certainly Carole seems to have stronger social ties.  But....eh.   I don't know.   Her crowd seems like a nasty, user crowd.  Adam and his bullshit with respect to Baby, Michaela, coffee.   Cassandra Grey and her like, wow, Gertrude, twu wuv with Samantha Ronson, and her Goopier than Goop beauty site for the spoiled and clueless.   I just...I don't see her having genuinely complex mutual friendships with people.    She and Andy - and their friendship makes much more sense to me now - can cruel-snark their way into the sunset, making comments about people being fat or somesuch.   

[SuprSuprElevated]

1 minute ago, Midnight Cheese said:

I don't know what to think about the implosion of Frankelwill.   Bethcarole.

I'm of a mind that I and the participants in this forum have collectively spent more energy, brainpower, and bandwidth on the Frankel/Radziwill relationship, then have the two of them.  I anxiously await a new obsession.

[hoodooznoodooz]

17 minutes ago, Mozelle said:

I mean, as we all know by now, Bethenny likes to substitute words. When the "operator" comment came out lo those many episodes ago, people immediately understood it to mean that she was calling Adam a user. There's more than one way to skin a cat, and there's certainly more than one way to trash someone without using all the expletives possible lol. 

I think it's as others have said--it was likely a culmination of things: the "operator" comment; Bethenny feeling as though she should be Carole's only RHONY friend; Carole feeling that the friendship was too heavy and one-sided (per Sonja--I know I know!--Carole saying that Bethenny is a taker, which Bethenny immediately took to mean materially rather than emotionally, which is how I think Carole meant it. That Bethenny is draining and doesn't take that same energy to listen). 

I think you’re absolutely correct about this. I also think that Carole can be unconditionally supportive of her friends. And would have continued to be unconditionally supportive of Beth. But Carole started to notice that Beth does not reciprocate. 

[AnnA]

Has there been a mention of Adam and the service dog incident?

I'm asking because look what PTV put on the bottom of my screen.

 

[KungFuBunny]

Carole in her latest fashion forward ensemble

To prove that she left, Carole poses in front of an EXIT sign

Edited August 6, 2018 by KungFuBunny

[Rap541]

Thats just disturbing, Kungfu! :D

[Jel]

8 minutes ago, Rap541 said:

Did she diss him at the same time she was asking him the favor? I thought the chain of events Bethenny asked him to help her, he said no, she later told Dorinda she thought he was a bit of an operator. Not Bethenny badmouthed Adam to Dorinda BEFORE she asked him to help with Houston/Puerto Rico.

I mean, here's my "pretzel logic".

1. Sometime in the summer of 2017, Carole and Adam broke up amicably.

2. The hurricanes happen. Knowing that Carole and Adam broke up amicably, Bethenny still felt she was on reasonably good terms with Adam and approached him with the charity job. He said no. 

3. A few months later, with Carole and Adam still broken up, Bethenny calls Adam an operator and the drama ensues. 

This is what the show presented as the start of the fight. To me, this makes Carole look petty and like she's badly overreacting and making a molehill into a mountain. And look where it got her. 

Now, the only way this is defending Bethenny is pointing out that Bethenny's actions weren't horrible. They weren't great, but honestly? As presented? If this happened to me, with me in the Carole role? I'd talk with my friend but I'd also try to see what motivated it. I like my friends. I try not to lose them over petty stuff. Sometimes we say and do things we don't mean or regret.

No need to explain. I understood what Bethenny meant, as did everyone else. I still don't see it as a friendship ending remark, not over a guy that was already out the door. (and frankly, I was more on Adam's side at first since I thought it was probably legit that he really just couldn't afford it. Now that he's a piece of shit lying about service dogs to avoid pet charges, my opinion of him has dropped)

Yeah. This is the one I thought was pretty fucking cold on Bethenny's part. I wish Carole had picked this and not the "he's an operator" remark as her hillside to die on. 

Ironically, with this service dog chicanery, Adam has show himself to be an operator -- Bethenny didn't even need to say a word. Life is funny.  Interestingly, Bethenny didn't say anything about that -- gun was loaded, all she had to do was pull the tweet trigger.  She showed some restraint there.  And unsurprisingly Carole didn't say anything about it either.

I also think that maybe Bethenny was thinking hmm, I need a photographer for this trip, maybe I can ask the dude for whom I've "comped" several vacations  (allegedly!), surely since I've helped him out, I can ask for this in return.  (But gadzooks she did that without checking with his ex-girlfriend Carole first. NEVER FORGET!)  So when he comes back with "What's the comp?" as his reply (also allegedly!), I can see how that would put her off a little. I get that.

[KungFuBunny]

KFB Exclusive

Just after Carole was escorted from the building left Bravo headquarters, I caught Carole In an authentic moment.

See how Carole is celebrating her new found status as a non mother fucking factor

[Rap541]

<dies><iz ded>

[Jel]

6 minutes ago, KungFuBunny said:

KFB Exclusive

Just after Carole was escorted from the building left Bravo headquarters, I caught Carole In an authentic moment.

See how Carole is celebrating her new found status as a non mother fucking factor

Can't stop laughing...trying to...can't.

I wish the dude in the background was wearing a Tinsley wig.

[Happy Camper]

43 minutes ago, SweetieDarling said:

I still can't get over Bethenny's "Can we be done with Adam yet?" comment. It's just so dismissive and doesn't take Carole's feelings or emotions into consideration at all. 

I would have liked Bethenny's response to Carole's "Can we be done with Jason yet?"

That should have happened. Seriously.

[KungFuBunny]

Since leaving  being fired, Carole has gained some weight, giving her a healthier appearance, she also changed her hairstyle as she is always looking for ways to update her look.

However, we just can't seem to get her away from those feathers

[AnnA]

Dear Carole,

 

[KungFuBunny]

11 minutes ago, Rap541 said:

<dies><iz ded>

 

8 minutes ago, Jel said:

Can't stop laughing...trying to...can't.

I wish the dude in the background was wearing a Tinsley wig.

Tisley is there but out of shot. Scott just walked in and Tinsley is on the floor mewling.

I forgot to add. Dorinda remains good friends with Carole as the photo shows Drunk Dorinda is the one who applied Carole's lipstick

[ShawnaLanne]

5 minutes ago, KungFuBunny said:

Since leaving  being fired, Carole has gained some weight, giving her a healthier appearance, she also changed her hairstyle as she is always looking for ways to update her look.

However, we just can't seem to get her away from those feathers

It really is amazing how alike they look, along with Caitlyn Jenner. On a side note, I met Steven Tyler at San Jose International Airport in the late 80s/ early 90s and he was super gracious.

[Jel]

Is the operator standing to the side, pausing, looking pensive and then asking "Are you going to eat the rest of that burger?"

[KungFuBunny]

9 minutes ago, ShawnaLanne said:

It really is amazing how alike they look, along with Caitlyn Jenner. On a side note, I met Steven Tyler at San Jose International Airport in the late 80s/ early 90s and he was super gracious.

I think Steven Tyler is the beautiful twin. He has a smoother complexion and wears hats and feathers better

Carole can't pull off this look

Edited August 6, 2018 by KungFuBunny