S02 Ep 05 Carrots

[chitowngirl]

When a patient suffering from anorexia can't gain the weight needed to survive heart surgery, Claire suggests they perform an experimental surgery which Melendez strongly opposes. Shaun worries Glassman's refusal to walk the hospital floor will keep him from being discharged and tries to persuade him to ambulate.

[SnarkEnthusiast]

Unpopular opinion, but Glassman's scenes are boring. He's curmudgeonly about recovery because he's used to swinging his dick around as Big Boss. He's condescending to Shaun and pushes away his earnest attempts to help. Shaun realizes it's a front to cover up fear/vulnerability and still helps him for some reason despite him being a gigantic asshole and continuing to behave the exact same way at every stage. Lather, rinse, repeat. Don't care about his relationship with Cafe Lady bit hope it will make him...have other personality traits. 

Well, Lea continues to find new ways to be an insufferable dick. "Do you think about dating me? I know you do. Well even though I've spent the past two weeks throwing a tantrum that you're not obsessed with me, I just want to take this opportunity to reiterate that I don't have feelings for you and never, ever will. Also, you will have to get used to me having sex right in front of you. Because I'll never see you as a viable option. You get it, right? BUT your attention fills the black hole that is my ego so let's end the conversation by talking about how much your friendship means to me in a way that's just sentimentally ambiguous enough for you to misinterpret romantically and keep your hopes up. :)" How many times did they go back and forth about renting the apartment? And for Lea to be fighting it tooth and nail the whole episode and then at the last minute change her mind is just a mess of mixed signals. Look, no one is entitled to date anyone. Able people shouldn't feel bad or guilty for not being attracted to disabled people, as long as the disability isn't the only reason. But you have to stop acting flabbergasted we have feelings when you go out of your way to actively cultivate them AND constantly insinuate those feelings might be reciprocated. Do the writers think we've just forgotten last season when she drove him into the middle of the woods to amuse herself getting him drunk for the first time and then experiment with kissing him? If anything, the fact that she's acting as if Shaun's idea that she has romantic interest in him is some sort of childish delusion of his own invention makes that original dalliance a lot creepier because she just pretending it never happened. It's not outrageous for someone with zero social life or grasp of social cues to hope that you might be interested in them after your flirt with them and kiss them. Lea knows this but doesn't care and it's super condescending. 

The cases had pretty dark endings for a week where nobody died – Vain Gay Husband is going to threaten divorce the second the guy puts on weight (which imo was a huge missed opportunity to talk about body image obsession in the gay community beyond just "this one dude is shallow") and Anorexia Mom can now eat, but has apparently logically resigned herself to never being able to feel love towards her son again? Ouch. 

So I'm assuming that whole brain treatment kerfuffle was a pretext for Melendez to remove Claire from his professional supervision so they can (more) ethically bang in a few episodes, right?

I still really miss Jared.

[preeya]

22 minutes ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:

So I'm assuming that whole brain treatment kerfuffle was a pretext for Melendez to remove Claire from his professional supervision so they can (more) ethically bang in a few episodes, right?

Melendez really is a scumbag, and yes banging is coming.

[Annber03]

33 minutes ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:

Do the writers think we've just forgotten last season when she drove him into the middle of the woods to amuse herself getting him drunk for the first time and then experiment with kissing him? If anything, the fact that she's acting as if Shaun's idea that she has romantic interest in him is some sort of childish delusion of his own invention makes that original dalliance a lot creepier because she just pretending it never happened. It's not outrageous for someone with zero social life or grasp of social cues to hope that you might be interested in them after your flirt with them and kiss them. Lea knows this but doesn't care and it's super condescending. 

Yeah,  that whole part of things confused me, too. They did have something at one point, and I thought that was the whole point of their issues when she returned. We know Shaun was upset to see her go, because of how much he cared about her (as well as the fact that he struggles with people leaving him in general), and he told her as much when they fought a few episodes back. So I figured Lea's reaction was tied to that as well. 

But now she's suddenly just talking about them being friends. I could understand that angle if she was thinking about it in terms of, "We've just reunited, things are kinda shaky, let's take it slow and see where it goes", but that doesn't seem to be her thought process right now. She's pretty much put the idea of them getting back together at all off the table. So yeah. I'm not sure what the deal is there. 

Course, that's precisely why I think Lea's initial suggestion they not move in together was a wise one. Not because of the reasons she gave so much, but because of the fact there's still some tension between them and Lea still seems to be affected by whatever happened in Hershey. I don't know that moving in together will fix those issues for them. But since they've decided to go forward with it, I guess we'll see how it plays out. 

Quote

So I'm assuming that whole brain treatment kerfuffle was a pretext for Melendez to remove Claire from his professional supervision so they can (more) ethically bang in a few episodes, right?

I hadn't even considered that angle, but I can totally see that being the case. If so, though, considering how genuinely frustrated Melendez seemed with Claire, they may have some work to do to get them to that place. 

Again, though, I sympathize with Claire's confusion. Seems the advice to be more assertive isn't working out for her thus far. I can understand the concern over telling a patient about a procedure that's experimental and risky, but still. 

Regarding that case with the woman, given Morgan's reactions to some of what was happening with her, for a time there I thought we might learn that she had some kind of personal experience with an eating disorder in the past or something. 

As for Glassman, I do agree that it'd be nice to see him try to move forward and be less stubborn about his recovery, so I'm hoping bringing Debbi in at the end (good to see her back, by the way) is the start of that part of the storyline. I'd like to see Glassman channel that stubborn attitude of his into refusing to let this cancer/surgery get him down, and see him work on smoothing out his relationship with Shaun more. I liked the whole thing of Shaun trying to find a "carrot" to help Glassman throughout :) (also, his scenes with Edelstein's character were really good). 

And finally, "Marriage is confusing, no wonder you both failed at it." Dang, Shaun coming in with the zingers, LOL :D. I'm assuming we'll learn more about the story behind that phone call Park made at the end at some point? 

[SnarkEnthusiast]

13 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

Yeah,  that whole part of things confused me, too. They did have something at one point, and I thought that was the whole point of their issues when she returned. We know Shaun was upset to see her go, because of how much he cared about her (as well as the fact that he struggles with people leaving him in general), and he told her as much when they fought a few episodes back. So I figured Lea's reaction was tied to that as well. 

But now she's suddenly just talking about them being friends. I could understand that angle if she was thinking about it in terms of, "We've just reunited, things are kinda shaky, let's take it slow and see where it goes", but that doesn't seem to be her thought process right now. She's pretty much put the idea of them getting back together at all off the table. So yeah. I'm not sure what the deal is there. 

Course, that's precisely why I think Lea's initial suggestion they not move in together was a wise one. Not because of the reasons she gave so much, but because of the fact there's still some tension between them and Lea still seems to be affected by whatever happened in Hershey. I don't know that moving in together will fix those issues for them. But since they've decided to go forward with it, I guess we'll see how it plays out. 

I swear, if they try to pull some sort of narrative Hail Mary and have Lea start crying about how she ran away to Hershey because of her feelings for Shaun or (even richer) came back to San Jose because of her feelings for Shaun, I will shit a brick. You know as soon as she gets bored or needs him to do something, she will pretend as though she's been interested in him the whole time, but was "hiding it" because she's AFRAID to be VULNERABLE! (which seem to be get out of jail buzzwords and carte blanche for shitty behavior by anyone on this show). The writers do realize we root for Shaun, right? Because there is an uncomfortable subtext of "this poor hot girl was just trying to be nice to her disabled neighbor and now she's saddled with a nice but creepy autistic man and his creepy feelings." The show wants us to think that Shaun's expectation of dating Lea is simultaneously endearing and pathetic, when it's actually reasonable and logical given their relationship and the context of everything that's happened.

[SnarkEnthusiast]

33 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

And finally, "Marriage is confusing, no wonder you both failed at it." Dang, Shaun coming in with the zingers, LOL :D. I'm assuming we'll learn more about the story behind that phone call Park made at the end at some point? 

I think the man's willingness to throw his husband away for such a superficial reason made Park reconsider the dissolution of his own marriage. From the phone call, he caught his ex-wife in bed with a man who she dated for a while after the divorce, but is no longer with. He said something like "what would've happened if I hadn't caught you together?" which implies that he still has feelings for his ex-wife and only wanted a divorce because of the shock of the infidelity. Now, that's something many people aren't willing to forgive, but maybe it was a long time ago or the rest of their marriage was fantastic. He appears to regret making a snap judgement and not trying to work through it. That's a testament to his growth as a person I suppose, but in my opinion, there's a huge difference between leaving your spouse or considering doing so because you're disgusted by the mere possibility of them being fat and catching them in an affair. Whatever, it was the catalyst he needed for his personal epiphany, so that's fine.

[izabella]

1 hour ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:

Anorexia Mom can now eat, but has apparently logically resigned herself to never being able to feel love towards her son again? Ouch. 

Did the surgery also take away her ability to feel love for her husband?  This is going to be one miserable household.

[Kdawg82]

Haven't yet got through the episode but loved Shaun "I used to hate hugs but now sometimes I don't." 

[Lady Calypso]

35 minutes ago, izabella said:

Did the surgery also take away her ability to feel love for her husband?  This is going to be one miserable household.

According to Melendez, it would have only taken away the maternal part of her, so it would really just be her son.

I do like Claire but I also can see why Melendez may be upset with her. I know people have told Claire to be more assertive, Melendez included, which is why I assume he would have been fine if Claire hadn't have involved the patient...or maybe not. He makes it clear that he would have rather Claire accept his decision than her go around him to find another way, which...does make it seem like they're heading straight for a Melendez/Claire hook-up.

I really can't stand Lea, which is odd because I did like her in season 1...so either the character has or I have. Either way, I'm ready for Lea to get the hell off my screen at any time. I really think that she's a despicable friend and a clear love interest for Shaun. If Shaun was a real person, I'd be telling him to run far, far away from her. The writing certainly doesn't do Lea any justice, especially when it's clear Lea and Shaun will be some sort of couple. It's her overall attitude and not taking responsibility for her own actions which makes me dislike her.

At this point, I don't give a shit about what happened to her in Hershey, even though I guess I should. They need to do something to make me like her again.

Glassman's stubbornness IS starting to wear thin on me. At least Debbi showed back up to help, and I hope this is the last of angry cranky Glassman. I understand why he's acting like this, and it could be a symptom of his brain surgery, but I'm really ready for Glassman to do anything else other than lay down and be pouty. Last episode made sense. This episode did not.

[SnarkEnthusiast]

53 minutes ago, izabella said:

Did the surgery also take away her ability to feel love for her husband?  This is going to be one miserable household.

No, it was only the kid specifically for the narrative - a kind of cruel karma for the irony that despite years of her husband fretting over her, it was her pregnancy that finally convinced her to start eating regularly again and apparently started her recovery until she relapsed a year ago. In a last act of supposed altruism, she said that it was worth it to lose her ability to love her son as long as he wouldn't have to watch her kill herself by starvation. So she can still love her husband, whose love wasn't enough to convince her to stop starving herself, but can't love her son, who has always been her primary motivation to recover and ultimately the reason that she's now cured. But what I don't understand is, if you know that's a side effect of the surgery, can't you just… consciously recognize that the lack of emotion is because of the surgery instead of a fundamental change in your feelings toward your family? Why can't you just love your kid anyway or remember the old feeling? The melodrama of the plot was kind of lost on me admittedly. It's not like she wouldn't be able to remember that he was her son. Also, if she had been continuously battling anorexia since age 14, there's no way that her BMI would be high enough for regular menstruation (or menstruation at all), let alone supporting a healthy pregnancy full-term.

[catrice2]

Thanks for the explanation about Park. I didn't watch all the time last year and I just forwarded you some of that episode last night so I didn't understand what his phone call was about. In fact I don't know much about his backstory at all except that used to be a police officer. I can't believe that they were discussing his violation of HIPAA laws in front of another patient. I don't know if they were trying to indicate that the patient was in a vegetative state, but it doesn't matter. It was inappropriate for them to discuss that patient's situation in front of another patient inside of their room even if they didn't use names

Yes having  Leah back was a bad idea and yes I agree that they are setting Claire and  Meliendez  up for some type of tryst. I've never liked Glassman so there's that and I don't know how they plan to use that woman that I know nothing about is just as she used to be on house.

I totally called that they were going to bring Glassman's romantic flirtation back, and the best part of the episode was there was very little of the other female doctor whose name I can't remember but is annoying..

Oh how I miss Jared. I really like Marsha Thomson so I hope she comes back.

Did they ever indicate anyway what happened to Sean's pitiful happen to Sean's pitiful neighbor?

[TimetoShine]

I’m fast forwarding Lea’s scenes. She was ok last season, I actually enjoyed her scenes with Shaun. This season she sucks. 

I’m also having issues with Dr Glassman. 

 

The cases of the week were pretty good but I’m starting to think Claire needs a specialty other than surgery. 

[Annber03]

18 minutes ago, catrice2 said:

Did they ever indicate anyway what happened to Sean's pitiful happen to Sean's pitiful neighbor?

Yeah, they said a couple episodes back that he got arrested. 

[rhys]

Shouldn't Leah be working by now or at least looking for work? Also I hope Glassman is gone by the next episode. This is a really long hospital stay. BM or no BM.

[Fable]

Shaun was a little annoying this episode.  I am not a Lea fan, but she did put her cards on the table about not living with Shaun and why.  He would not accept her decision, and I don’t like using his autism as an excuse.  He also has to learn to respect boundaries.  Same thing with Glassman.  I know Shaun cares about him and I appreciate that because I am sure Dr. Glassman has done much for him, but again, it’s about boundaries.  

I’m not looking forward to Shaun and Lea as roommates.  This is not just annoying, it is becoming silly…dancing around about being roommates?  This arc is the least interesting part of the show, and it doesn’t really seem to fit into the narrative. 

[thuganomics85]

Good thing this is a hospital and should have plenty of burn cream, because Shaun just left Park and Lim on fire with his "No wonder you both failed at it" line about marriage being confusing.  And, of course, he didn't even mean to be insulting about it.  Classic Shaun!

Both of the cases were pretty good and I enjoyed seeing Reiko Aylesworth as the mother.  But I knew Claire was going to end up taking a hit, because that's her lot in life.  On one hand, I have to imagine that is is frustrating for her that she was told to be more assertive, but any time she takes that advice, she gets push back and arguably ignored.  On the other hand, going over your boss' head is always a dicey situation, so she really should have been prepared that Melendez might not take it well, even if she might have been right (not sure if the mom seemed to no longer love the son or not.)  Not sure if this is a set-up for more conflicts or if they're going down some kind of romantic path.

Glad we finally got more Park backstory.  Judging from that phone call, it sounded like his ex cheated on him, which was why he was so headstrong about his patient being honest with his husband.  But now it seems like he might be willing to forgive her, so I wonder what the fully story is going to end up being?

While I'm still enjoying this season, I do think the cases and interactions between the doctors are stronger then the personal arcs.  Already getting tired of Glassman being a crusty grump, and I'm totally over the Lea drama.  Shaun and her being roommates is not going to end well.

Edited October 31, 2018 by thuganomics85

[doctor destiny]

14 hours ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:

Well, Lea continues to find new ways to be an insufferable dick. "Do you think about dating me? I know you do. Well even though I've spent the past two weeks throwing a tantrum that you're not obsessed with me, I just want to take this opportunity to reiterate that I don't have feelings for you and never, ever will. Also, you will have to get used to me having sex right in front of you. Because I'll never see you as a viable option. You get it, right? BUT your attention fills the black hole that is my ego so let's end the conversation by talking about how much your friendship means to me in a way that's just sentimentally ambiguous enough for you to misinterpret romantically and keep your hopes up. :)" How many times did they go back and forth about renting the apartment? And for Lea to be fighting it tooth and nail the whole episode and then at the last minute change her mind is just a mess of mixed signals. Look, no one is entitled to date anyone. Able people shouldn't feel bad or guilty for not being attracted to disabled people, as long as the disability isn't the only reason. But you have to stop acting flabbergasted we have feelings when you go out of your way to actively cultivate them AND constantly insinuate those feelings might be reciprocated.

 

You hit the nail on the head for me.  Beautifully written criticism I have to say.  I kept wondering all episode where are they going with this?  I have to think that with at least one autistic writer on board in the writers' room this is all completely deliberate.  I mean Resnick mentioned the autistic man as pet theory the other week and now, well, here we are.  I felt that I was punched in the gut wondering if this was going to happen to my wonderful autistic kids too.  It was almost viscerally painful.  Why did she kiss him while drunk (yeah that happens), then say when sober she'd kiss him again if she hadn't brushed her teeth, then kiss him prior to leaving and then turn up again.  What happened in Hershey????  No, I can't believe it's a ham-fisted slow burn.  Shore doesn't go linear surely?  Yeah I get she isn't leading him on and rightfully doesn't want to give him false hope - but then why did she give false hope before?  As she would say, "not cool".

[doctor destiny]

6 hours ago, Fable said:

Shaun was a little annoying this episode.  I am not a Lea fan, but she did put her cards on the table about not living with Shaun and why.  He would not accept her decision, and I don’t like using his autism as an excuse.  He also has to learn to respect boundaries.  Same thing with Glassman.  I know Shaun cares about him and I appreciate that because I am sure Dr. Glassman has done much for him, but again, it’s about boundaries.  

I’m not looking forward to Shaun and Lea as roommates.  This is not just annoying, it is becoming silly…dancing around about being roommates?  This arc is the least interesting part of the show, and it doesn’t really seem to fit into the narrative. 

I think one of the main points of this episode is to showcase those traits of Shaun that are annoying.  Tactless burns, starting a conversation without introducing himself, all the annoyances that Dr Glassman told Shaun off for, nagging persistently, obsessional behavior...They are taking their time to flesh out all the characters in the second series.

[doctor destiny]

13 hours ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:

Because there is an uncomfortable subtext of "this poor hot girl was just trying to be nice to her disabled neighbor and now she's saddled with a nice but creepy autistic man and his creepy feelings." The show wants us to think that Shaun's expectation of dating Lea is simultaneously endearing and pathetic, when it's actually reasonable and logical given their relationship and the context of everything that's happened.

People say they cry each episode but I've only really cried once watching TGD and it was contemplating exactly this.  It was so personally painful.  I cannot or rather I will not believe that this is all set up by accident by a tone deaf writers' room.  I know that Freddie Highmore has read Neurotribes.  Mark Rozeman is autistic and there are likely other auties in the room.  This was the writers' room that gave us the pitch perfect god-awful autism martyr parents in 22 Steps.  There is a reason why "Heartfelt" had the worst ratings in Season 1.  It showed Shaun to be incredibly brave in a social setting but also a bit pathetic and the pain of seeing his pain and his being bullied by Resnick made me very uncomfortable.  I wonder how "Carrots" will do.  Shaun is a man and deserves the dignity as such.  I wanted to shout at him "don't do this, you'll get hurt!".  But I also think it's very deliberate.

[ForReal]

6 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Good thing this is a hospital and should have plenty of burn cream, because Shaun just left Park and Lim on fire with his "No wonder you both failed at it" line about marriage being confusing.  And, of course, he didn't even mean to be insulting about it.  Classic Shaun!

My husband and I both burst out laughing at this, especially the two doctors standing there speechless. He nailed it.

Is it even possible for brain surgery to impact only the area responsible for maternal feelings? I felt like this was lazy writing. I recall times on House when they stuck a probe in someone's brain and asked questions to determine what areas were being affected, but nothing so specific. Could they zap someone's brain and removed the area responsible for racism?

Also, I thought it was unrealistic that the woman woke up from brain surgery, promptly and with no grogginess said she was hungry, her family bailed immediately, and she then indicated that her feelings about her son had changed. I realize they had to wrap up the story, but really?

[DearEvette]

I have to agree with those who are not as engaged in the Glassman storyline.  I am finding myself impatient to get to  other stuff when it is on,

I didn't think I could dislike Lea more than I did in S1, but S2 is proving me wrong.  She is just a bad idea for a regular character.  Instead of adding a much needed dimension to Sean's life, she just seems to be taking up space.  I am not finding anything worthwhile in her scenes because she is written so badly.

So, we have a procedure that can affect the different types of love a person feels?  It can distinguish maternal love out of all other types?  Doesn't affect any other connection....sibling love, love for a child to a parent?  Even romantic love for a spouse isn't all one thing.  It has different facets.  Also if the mom still has any ability to feel affection for anyone isn't the possibility there that it can be relearned?  Such an odd case.  Also, since when have they not gone to the patient to give them options for risky procedures?  It feels like the goalposts keep moving for poor Claire WRT to Melendez.  This is obviously not the end for them, I also predict boning in the future.

[MoreCoffeePlease]

Quote

Also, I thought it was unrealistic that the woman woke up from brain surgery, promptly and with no grogginess said she was hungry, her family bailed immediately, and she then indicated that her feelings about her son had changed. I realize they had to wrap up the story, but really?

As Seth Meyers and Amy Poehler would say, "Really!?!?!  Really!?!?!"  The patient's responses seemed totally sketchy to me.  Prior to the surgery, removing the feeding tube by herself.  Auggh!!!  My eyes!!!

Poor Claire. Cannot catch a break with the assertiveness stuff, but I do get where Menendez is coming from to a degree.  She could have said, "Dr. President guy told me to be more assertive, but every time I am, I get punished for it."

I didn't watch House, but I read an article about Lisa Edelstein and how her skirts always got tighter and tighter on that show. Apparently they like to highlight her figure on The Good Doctor too ... her pants/leggings in one of her last scenes were very form-fitting.

Shaun likes some hugs now!  Love him so much.

[possibilities]

In my view, in their "friendship," it's Lea who's behaving badly, not Shaun. She disappears, reappears, stalks him at work, never explains herself, admits she's flaky and unreliable and has no plans to do anything about it, doesn't expect to be held accountable for anything, is needy and controlling and offers nothing in return. Her plan last season to make him skip work and get drunk and be kissed and dumped was really not good for him. He almost lost his job over it, AND anyone would be pissed by kiss-and-dump the way she played it.

From the day they met, she was "borrowing" his batteries, which is kind of outside the norm, she's taken advantage of his generosity and treated him like a disposable toy. I really hope this show isn't trying to show us how hard it is for neurotypicals to deal with autistic people, because right now I think what they are showing us demonstrates the exact opposite.

Even with Glassman, Shaun's trying really hard and Glassman's being a turd all episode. I loved it when Shaun pawned him off on someone else. No need to be a martyr, Shaun! I thought walking to the muffin was a clever approach, not a particularly autistic choice even, and even the oncologist was shrugging off Glassman's behavior, so it's not like Shaun was failing where a non-autistic person would find it easy.

Incidentally, I think "all he needed was the love of a good woman" is a nauseating trope, so I hated that nonsense with Glassman, who now is not only an ego-maniac but also an manbaby who enjoys being infantilized by his love interest. I'm having dry heaves over here.

I guess I hated this episode. I don't trust them to resolve any of these storylines in a way I'll like. I really hope I'm wrong about that.

I do kind of respect how they are showing that Claire being more assertive is backfiring on her with her bosses. It's unpleasant, but realistic. I really hope they aren't going to let this lead to her and Melendez in a romantic dynamic, though. I will really hate that. I don't know where I do want them to go after this development, but if romance grows out of him giving her a career setback, all I can say to that is NO.

Are gay men really more shallow than straight men? I have a hard time believing that gay men, who saw each other through the early days of AIDS (which, for those who wreen't around in the 1980s and missed it, was a gruesome horror not for anyone who was the least bit squeamish or looking for a superficially good time) are more likely to ditch their partners over superficial things than straight men are to ditch theirs.

I don't know much about treating anorexia, but I wondered if something like anti-anxiety meds or appetite stimulants had ever been tried. Does anyone know?

[topanga]

20 hours ago, Annber03 said:

Regarding that case with the woman, given Morgan's reactions to some of what was happening with her, for a time there I thought we might learn that she had some kind of personal experience with an eating disorder in the past or something. 

Yeah, me too. I see this as a missed opportunity. Reznick was so unnaturally quiet throughout the episode that I thought for sure she's struggled with an eating disorder during her life. It's something she could've shared with the patient that could've helped. And it would have given her a layer of vulnerability we haven't seen with her. And maybe the patient wouldn't have had to have the surgery that exclusively made her unable to love her son.

 

8 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Good thing this is a hospital and should have plenty of burn cream, because Shaun just left Park and Lim on fire with his "No wonder you both failed at it" line about marriage being confusing.  And, of course, he didn't even mean to be insulting about it.

What kind of residency program is this? Residents are allowed to enter random patient's rooms and examine them then provide possible diagnoses? Where were the patient's original attendings and residents?  Lim said Shaun and Park 'stole' the patient. From whom? And I'm confused about the logistics of their work day. If they were working in the ED to help with surgical cases, they wouldn't be able to spend the entire day with one surgical patient. They would continue to work in the ED, dealing with all of the potential surgical cases that came through the door. 

And residents would never be able to behave the way this group does. Again, what kind of residency program is this? Claire goes behind Melendez’s back to talk to a patient about a potential surgery he said no to? Park defies Lim and violates a patient's HIPAA confidentiality, thereby disobeying an attending's specific instructions and exposing Lim and the hospital to a potential lawsuit? Shaun tells Lim 'that's why you failed at marriage.' Autism or no autism, that is rude and disrespectful. At least Glassman would have told Shawn that his words were inappropriate. Lim did not.

In any other world, these residents would be reprimanded and potentially kicked out of the program and sent to join Jared in Denver. I can't even remember what he did that was so bad he was asked to leave. 

 

1 hour ago, DearEvette said:

It feels like the goalposts keep moving for poor Claire WRT to Melendez.  This is obviously not the end for them, I also predict boning in the future.

Heh. That, I wouldn't mind. I really like this show, but I would enjoy it more if there some amount of romantic tension or relationship drama. Lea and Shaun are not providing that for me. Call me shallow, if you must. I'm not asking for Grey's Anatomy level porn, where everyone in the hospital sleeps with everyone else. But NO ONE is in a happy relationship this season. Or even a hot, steamy one. Lim had the one hook up with the attorney, but I haven't seen him since. 

[martha21]

20 hours ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:

I think the man's willingness to throw his husband away for such a superficial reason made Park reconsider the dissolution of his own marriage. From the phone call, he caught his ex-wife in bed with a man who she dated for a while after the divorce, but is no longer with. He said something like "what would've happened if I hadn't caught you together?" which implies that he still has feelings for his ex-wife and only wanted a divorce because of the shock of the infidelity. Now, that's something many people aren't willing to forgive, but maybe it was a long time ago or the rest of their marriage was fantastic. He appears to regret making a snap judgement and not trying to work through it. That's a testament to his growth as a person I suppose, but in my opinion, there's a huge difference between leaving your spouse or considering doing so because you're disgusted by the mere possibility of them being fat and catching them in an affair. Whatever, it was the catalyst he needed for his personal epiphany, so that's fine.

 

8 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Glad we finally got more Park backstory.  Judging from that phone call, it sounded like his ex cheated on him, which was why he was so headstrong about his patient being honest with his husband.  But now it seems like he might be willing to forgive her, so I wonder what the fully story is going to end up being?

I had a different take on the Park story. To me the question was not about forgiveness, but rather about whether it's better to lie or be truthful about everything in a marriage. At first, Park's opinion was that it's better to always be truthful. That's why he let it slip to the husband about the actual procedure being performed. But when the husband did find out everything he said he wished he didn't know. So that made Park wonder what would have happened if Park himself never knew about his wife cheating. Maybe they'd still be happily married, and maybe it is better to lie and keep secrets sometimes. That was the question as I saw it.

13 hours ago, Fable said:

I’m not looking forward to Shaun and Lea as roommates.  This is not just annoying, it is becoming silly…dancing around about being roommates?  This arc is the least interesting part of the show, and it doesn’t really seem to fit into the narrative. 

Unpopular opinion here, but I'm enjoying this story (and Glassman's too, go figure). To me this is about people connecting with each other whether romantically or not. Relationships are complicated and can be confusing, but human connections are important for a fulfilling life. These two lonely people will now have someone to come home to. They enjoy each other's company and want to spend time together. I don't see it as a bad thing. Totally agree that neither of them is perfect but then who is? If they can live in this nice apartment together and help each other that way and with regards to emotional support, why not try it. Mileage varies, of course. but that's how I see it.

[Xantar]

2 hours ago, MoreCoffeePlease said:

I didn't watch House, but I read an article about Lisa Edelstein and how her skirts always got tighter and tighter on that show. Apparently they like to highlight her figure on The Good Doctor too ... her pants/leggings in one of her last scenes were very form-fitting.

Still nothing nearly as inappropriate as what she was wearing on House which included at one point a skirt with slits on both sides going up to mid-thigh. And at least in this case she isn't playing a character in a position of authority.

[rubyred]

I'm a little bemused by FH's performances so far this season. I binge-watched the earlier season in prep for this and his portrayal was so nuanced without crossing the line into caricature, but this season I don't know if he feels more relaxed in the role or what but some of his reactions, while still mostly "Shaun-like" sometimes verge on...childishness. That last scene with him jumping up and down about living with Lea...I don't know, that did not work for me. Not that Shaun wouldn't be excited, but that he would show it in such a toddler-like fashion. His physicality has always been extremely closed-in and I found that a really effective way to demonstrate how living in the world affects him. But this living with Lea thing... I had high hopes until she said she'd bring the keys back - then I knew we were doomed for "Roomies!" the karaoke musical.

There does seem to be something missing; it's weird to think it might be Jared because while I thought he was adequate I never thought he was the emotional lynchpin of the show. Probably Melendez and Claire are going to hook up, it seems inevitable. Well, at least they have some chemistry. I do appreciate that they made something of an effort to separate the mentor/mentee aspect of their relationship to make it less squicky, but at what cost? Has Claire basically lost her surgical residency? How can she keep it if Melendez won't let her do surgery? Because if she has, that SUCKS and does not make me root for a personal relationship if it's at the cost of a professional one. 

[Texasmom1970]

He mentioned neither he nor Lea could afford the apartment alone. Does anyone remember what Lea does? Does she even have a job?

[possibilities]

13 hours ago, topanga said:

In any other world, these residents would be reprimanded and potentially kicked out of the program and sent to join Jared in Denver. I can't even remember what he did that was so bad he was asked to leave. 

He assaulted an attending. It was pretty bad, honestly.

[Trini]

Well, they got me. I really thought Lea was moving out, but no, she and Shaun are going to be roomies now. UGH NO. It's just a bad idea on several levels, and does she even have a job??

Glad we learned a little more about Park! And Blonde was not as grating this episode; but I'm sure that won't last.

I wasn't sure we'd ever see the hospital board again; I've missed Aoki, but I guess they're choosing to focus on others characters this season.

Sucks that Claire being more assertive is backfiring; although I knew there'd be some fallout with Melendez when she went behind his back. I'll be the contrarian and say that I don't think Melendez kicking Claire off his team will lead to them hooking up. If they get together at all, I don't think it will be anytime soon - not this season. I'm not opposed to them as a couple though; the man is fine.

I've been pretty meh about Glassman this season, but I still like the scenes with him and Shaun.

Besides Shaun's sick marriage burn, I also laughed out loud at "the orderly is eating it."

Edited November 2, 2018 by Trini

[mojito]

Quote

sibling love, love for a child to a parent?  Even romantic love for a spouse isn't all one thing. 

I noticed that this patient told her child that she loved him when she was rolled into surgery, but didn't say the same to her husband. Could be the child was all that was keeping them together.

Quote

Are gay men really more shallow than straight men? I have a hard time believing that gay men, who saw each other through the early days of AIDS (which, for those who wreen't around in the 1980s and missed it, was a gruesome horror not for anyone who was the least bit squeamish or looking for a superficially good time) are more likely to ditch their partners over superficial things than straight men are to ditch theirs.

Plenty of HIV positive men were dumped back then. Shallowness is a universal thing.

Quote

I really like this show, but I would enjoy it more if there some amount of romantic tension or relationship drama.

Oh, please no. That's so overdone.

[Ragingviolet]

On Wednesday, October 31, 2018 at 12:17 PM, Xantar said:

Still nothing nearly as inappropriate as what she was wearing on House which included at one point a skirt with slits on both sides going up to mid-thigh. And at least in this case she isn't playing a character in a position of authority.

I don't get what difference it makes. 

[rmontro]

I've found Glassman to be unsufferably annoying ever since he was so insistent that Shaun see a therapist when he didn't want to.

As a physician, he should know the importance of getting up and walking after surgery.  There's a reason they say doctors (and nurses) make the worst patients though.

[whydoiwatchtv]

I recall Lea saying she was leaving a high paying tech job, (or going to one) like 90,000 a year but my memory for tv shows really stinks. Now she’s sleeping in a sleeping bag on the floor and can’t afford an apartment. 

[shksabelle]

I hate Leah. 

That’s all 

[tennisgurl]

Yeah, I feel bad for Glassman being sick and all, but not only is he being a dick to poor Shaun, who is just trying to help, but he is being an idiot. The guy is a doctor, shouldn't he know that Shaun is trying to get him to help himself? And now Shaun thinks that he is a bad friend, its really just sad. 

[vavera4ka]

Yeah, when Melendez "fired" Claire, immediately went to "paving the road to romance"

I don't mind. Last season they had some tension and chemistry. And shallowly I have been objectifying Melendez from day one. So whatever gets him on my screen shirtless - I'm game. lol

Edited November 5, 2018 by vavera4ka

[catrice2]

2 hours ago, vavera4ka said:

Yeah, when Melendez "fired" Claire, immediately went to "paving the road to romance"

I don't mind. Last season they had some tension and chemistry. And shallowly I have been objectifying Melendez from day one. So whatever gets him on my screen shirtless - I'm game. lol

 

He is in such great shape, and I think he is attractive when in character no matter what show he is on regardless of how short he is. .  Oddly when I seem him in real life, like on the 100,000 Pyramid, he is not attractive to me at all!  It seems like every show I've ever caught him in except this one he has had a reason to be shirtless!  His family is pretty impressive with two real doctors.

Edited November 5, 2018 by catrice2

[ForReal]

On 11/5/2018 at 12:49 PM, catrice2 said:

He is in such great shape, and I think he is attractive when in character no matter what show he is on regardless of how short he is. .  Oddly when I seem him in real life, like on the 100,000 Pyramid, he is not attractive to me at all!  It seems like every show I've ever caught him in except this one he has had a reason to be shirtless!  His family is pretty impressive with two real doctors.

He's pretty impressive himself -- I just read up on him.

[catrice2]

Yep! He is actually the reason that I started watching this show. The actor that plays Jared was a nice bonus.  Alas one half of my eye candy is gone. Then I read that Regina King used to date him and now I can't help but thinking she's crazy!

[Kdawg82]

On 10/31/2018 at 1:33 PM, rubyred said:

That last scene with him jumping up and down about living with Lea...I don't know, that did not work for me. Not that Shaun wouldn't be excited, but that he would show it in such a toddler-like fashion. His physicality has always been extremely closed-in and I found that a really effective way to demonstrate how living in the world affects him. But this living with Lea thing... I had high hopes until she said she'd bring the keys back - then I knew we were doomed for "Roomies!" the karaoke musical.

THIS! I hate when writers get us to invest in a character and their mannerisms, personality, nuances, then flip the script for absolutely no friggin reason at all. Why would this man be so eager to move in with Leah?! And I can't stand her either. How many times does she say "I don't want anything to get in between our friendship..." Umm that's called just getting together and being a couple and then you can be with your best friend until the end of times! What else does she have going for her? Is she just unattracted to Shaun or is he annoying to her? Then why move in together.  None of it makes sense. She needs to clarify his purpose in her life besides her leaching off of him emotionally and other ways. She's just a user. 

[jhlipton]

On 10/31/2018 at 7:50 AM, possibilities said:

I don't know much about treating anorexia, but I wondered if something like anti-anxiety meds or appetite stimulants had ever been tried. Does anyone know?

The wife said that she had tried EVERYTHING, which I think included meds.  

[Bridget]

On 10/30/2018 at 12:16 PM, Kdawg82 said:

Haven't yet got through the episode but loved Shaun "I used to hate hugs but now sometimes I don't." 

Also, "...I don't want to have to beat Dr. Glassman with a stick." when Shaun was explaining the need to find a "carrot" substitute was hilarious!

[Chas411]

The ending to me was unclear (or maybe just too depressing for me to acknowledge) but did the mother lose her maternal instinct or whatever it was or was her reaction to hugging her son more out of fear it was different. 

Claire and Melendez are so going to bone. I don't see the point of him kicking her off the case otherwise. Especially when he voted for the treatment. 

Edited November 13, 2018 by Chas411

[sinkwriter]

It's too late at night to go into more detail, but... Claire is pissing me off. First with the previous episode when she felt like her way was the best way, even though that thrill seeker / climber had every right to not go through with a surgery that would leave her with potential limited neck mobility, and now with this episode where she went behind her boss's back to present a treatment that has very little paperwork to back it up. I can understand the anorexic mom wanting to take a chance, given that she's tried everything else, but for Claire to decide for that 18-year-old who was perfectly competent to make her own choice just infuriated me. And her going behind Melendez's back? If it's simply a ploy to get those two to hook up eventually... ugh. He had every right to bench her for that.