S03.E06: The Ballad of Donkey Doug

[ChiCricket]

3 hours ago, BoogieBurns said:

Well, Simone is played by a black woman. Black people don't scar the same way as other races, we have raised scars called keloids. Assuming she didn't request to have them covered, they are just a product of the actress being a person who may have fallen at some point in her life. But as always, I never underestimate Mike Schur and still think (regardless of her scar location) that Kirby's character is supernatural. 

I thought of keloids. But it looks so symmetrical. 

[DeLurker]

1 hour ago, ClareWalks said:

That was so flawless. Sometimes I see something on TV that is so hysterical that I cannot believe the actors didn't break, and that was one of those scenes.

I want to see outtakes of that scene.

[albinerhawk]

With all this discussion about whether the Soul Squad's efforts will be fruitful or not, I started to think about the end game.

In Christianity, the standard to get into heaven is perfection. A literal translation of the word "sin" mean to miss the mark or target. Since obviously no one would get in according to this standard, the theological solution is the belief that Jesus took upon the sins of the entire world. Through belief, his followers are given this gift of grace and are saved. 

Even though I'm a Christian, I keep my beliefs on Christianity separate from the realm of The Good Place. However, the point system sounds similarly difficult. While we've heard plenty about the people who didn't go, we have yet to hear about anyone who has made it into the Good Place. As a PP pointed out, even Florence Nightingale didn't make it. 

So what is the end game here? All signs seem to be pointing to an overhaul of the system as it is currently in place. So I wonder if we're going to see a Christianesque solution and have the merit system completely disregarded in favor of system based on grace? Since the basis of the entire plot of The Good Place is rooted in the philosophers, I wonder if we'll find the key there. Many of the great philosophers were Christians, but many weren't. I've only taken a survey course in philosophy, so I don't know if there any clues there or not.

[Enginerd]

It's a little odd to me that they're so concerned about keeping the secret of the afterlife due to worry about corrupting people's motives and condemning them to The Bad Place. I think they could go around telling everyone and no one's motives would be corrupted, because no one would believe them. The biggest risk is that people would think they were nutty and had fallen down some conspiracy theory wormhole or joined some fringe religion. Without seeing some sort of proof like the core gang saw, people would take this as seriously as most of us take things like Scientology and kids playing at being wizards.

I liked this episode, but it would have been nice for the whole group to be part of the simulations, and also for Chidi and Eleanor to experience the wild world of Jason's past.

I thought Tahani's parents died before she did. Didn't we see a flashback where a lawyer was informing her of the inheritance, which heavily favored Kamila? Or was that some sort of simulation? Maybe she'll only get a chance to try to mend fences with Kamila, and not with them. I still don't think she should have lost so many points for her charitable works being corrupt because she was trying to gain love. Is it really bad to want your parents to love you? Sometimes people should let go of that for their own peace of mind because love is just not something some people are willing to offer them, but don't think they're less "good" if they haven't managed to detach from their emotionally abusive parents. Wanting your parents to love you is a natural and healthy thing.

On the other hand, Tahani definitely does other point-loss-worthy things, such as completely forgetting about her fiance or telling her study group to "come as you are" to a dressy engagement party. Tahani of all people should have known it isn't good to encourage people to feel out of place for not dressing for the event!

[iMonrey]

Quote

Even if Pillboi is able to spend his days helping the elderly and away from crime, so what. Florence Nightingale didn't make the cut; with the system as it is, being sent into the Good Place is almost impossible. However, I think their selfless actions are helping them. Not enough. though. I mean, it's the points system what must be changed. That should be their goal.

Also, if the people in the Good Place are really good people, how can they live with themselves knowing that the 99'99% of the world population is being endlessly tortured? I know I couldn't and I'm not good enough to get into the Good Place.

I think what this is leading up to is that Eleanor, Chidi, Tahani and Jason might make themselves eligible for the good place simply because they have chosen to help try save people despite knowing it won't do themselves any good, WRT earning "points." Wouldn't that be the ultimate selfless act?

I'm not sure we can trust that 99.99 percent of the world's population actually winds up in the bad place, because that's something Michael told them (I think) when he was still fooling them into believing they were in the good place. 

[Loandbehold]

Janet *ding* sure was able to build the VR simulator quickly. She might have retained all knowledge of the universe up to the time that she and Michael stepped through the Magic Door, but she still had to build the device with her own two clumsy hands. The break-up scenes were fantastic, and the actress playing Simone did great Eleanor and Janet impersonations. Chidi doing the Michael *snap* to end the simulations and giving Simone a puppy. Awww. Followed by Eleanor not wanting to leave the simulation b/c she flirting w/ Simone. Finally, another Nemo sighting as that was in the name of the shop where the break-up took place.

Donkey Doug being Jason's father makes all kinds of sense. I loved the Randy Macho Man [Non-]International Airport, the huge taxi, and then the scene at the pool outside of Donkey Doug's apartment. The AV Club does some annotations of the episodes and said that the scene progresses as the show goes on, using the same three characters - man, woman, and alligator. I'll have to watch the episode again to pick that up. I also love that Pill Boi knows all the right and wrong combinations of the drugs he gives to the people in the home. Of course he does.

[Traveller519]

One of the little things I loved was that the coffee shop where Chidi met Someone was call French Pressing Nemo, Eleanor's bar last week was Drinking Nemo.

I'm sad they're leaving Australia

Edited October 28, 2018 by Traveller519

[Lemur]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong ... but aren't Tahani's parents dead?  Wasn't there a scene where they'd misspelled her name in their will and left their property to "Tahini Al-Jamil"?  Or did I misconstrue the next mission and they're going to see Khamilla?

[jmonique]

11 minutes ago, Lemur said:

Someone correct me if I'm wrong ... but aren't Tahani's parents dead?  Wasn't there a scene where they'd misspelled her name in their will and left their property to "Tahini Al-Jamil"?  Or did I misconstrue the next mission and they're going to see Khamilla?

You're correct: They're going to see Khamilla's exhibition. The Al-Jamil parents are both dead.

[Helena Dax]

39 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

I think what this is leading up to is that Eleanor, Chidi, Tahani and Jason might make themselves eligible for the good place simply because they have chosen to help try save people despite knowing it won't do themselves any good, WRT earning "points." Wouldn't that be the ultimate selfless act?

I'm not sure we can trust that 99.99 percent of the world's population actually winds up in the bad place, because that's something Michael told them (I think) when he was still fooling them into believing they were in the good place. 

To me, the fact that Chidi or Tahani didn't make it is proof that, indeed, almost no one goes to the Good Place. I mean, Chidi tried so hard to be good, he never lied, he was helpful, he never hurt anyone on purpose. And Tahani did a lot of good, helped a lot of people. Was she vain? Yes, and she also didn't do it for the better reasons. But the point is they weren't bad people and they didn't deserve an eternity of pain, yet that's what they got. The system seems to be legitimately unfair, unless there's another twist hiding somewhere.

Bip!

[Blakeston]

Is there anyone Kristen Bell doesn't have crazy chemistry with?

[ChiCricket]

Is anyone surprised the mail bomber suspect is from Florida? I immediately thought of this show!

[Notwisconsin]

6 hours ago, Helena Dax said:

Florence Nightingale didn't make the cut;

Florence Nigthtingale was a total bitch, which may have been necessary at the time.

[ChiCricket]

38 minutes ago, Notwisconsin said:

Florence Nigthtingale was a total bitch, which may have been necessary at the time.

I've read many stories about her, where did you hear this? I imagine she had to be a tough cookie, though.

[cpcathy]

I now really, really need to know why Florence Nightingale was a bitch!

[ChiCricket]

26 minutes ago, cpcathy said:

I now really, really need to know why Florence Nightingale was a bitch!

IKR? So random. ?

[Lugal]

So much awesome, I can't tell what my favorite part is: the Randy "Macho Man" Savage Non-International Airport, complete with monster cabs or Janet having to do her own bings or Tahani wondering why she was ever friends with Elon Musk, or the breakup simulator.

The philosophy was deep in this one too.  I see it as the Soul Squad doesn't think they'll actually save anyone, but just try to put people on a better path.  Pillboi is the prime example.  He genuinely seems to care about the old people he works with, helping the old people of his own volition, and the Spies from NASA just made sure he stays there.  It's funny with Chidi talking about Nihilism last week because there are two types: the "We're all going to die, nothing means anything, we might as well kill each other now" type, and the "We're all going to die, nothing means anything, we might as well help each other as much as we can" type, which is kinda close to Buddhism, and seems to be the strategy that the Soul Squad has gone for.

Like other posters, I also don't trust that 99.99% of people end up in the Bad Place, because I think that is what Micahel Michael told them at the beginning (clearly things seem weighted toward the Bad Place, however) and even he admits the system is flawed, which ties into  how on this show the characters are human.  Chidi did try to be the best person he could be, but he was selfish about it, debating the ethical ramifications of who to pick for his soccer team that it essentially cost all the other kids a recess, or keeping his girlfriend awake while ruminating on how he hates his friend's boots.  Jason does bad things, but he's not malicious, but more on a philosophy of it seemed like a good idea [to him] at the time.  Eleanor is as she said, a medium person.  Tahani does good things but for her own vanity, rather than altruistic motives.

[ClareWalks]

Two Eleanor moments that had me totally gagged (in a good way): 

1) asking Chidi "why aren't more guys bi? It's 2018! Get over yourselves!" It reminded me of Kristen's marriage to Dax and whenever Dax goes on Conan's show and totally hits on him, or talks about how they should swing. Awesome stuff.

2) in the simulation when she was vibing with Simone and said "what...is...happening?" with that growing smile on her face. Just an amazing delivery of that line. Brava, Kristen Bell!

[Notwisconsin]

1 hour ago, cpcathy said:

I now really, really need to know why Florence Nightingale was a bitch!

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4188688/

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/09612025.2010.509934?src=recsys&journalCode=rwhr20

Remember, I only mentioned this because , Helena Dax did.

[ChiCricket]

40 minutes ago, Notwisconsin said:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4188688/

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/09612025.2010.509934?src=recsys&journalCode=rwhr20

Remember, I only mentioned this because , Helena Dax did.

^^ these links want you to pay $42.50 to read anything else.(odd amount)

But I did find this on Wiki:

Although much of Nightingale's work improved the lot of women everywhere, Nightingale was of the opinion that women craved sympathy and were not as capable as men.

and

She preferred the friendship of powerful men, insisting they had done more than women to help her attain her goals, writing: "I have never found one woman who has altered her life by one iota for me or my opinions."

and

She often referred to herself in the masculine, as for example "a man of action" and "a man of business".

Still don't see why she was a bitch. YMMV

[SoMuchTV]

12 hours ago, bethy said:

22 hours ago, phalange said:

I love Jason going, "I hope not, but thanks" after his dad says one day he'll distract the cops for his own son.

I did, too. It seemed like a significant moment for Jason, to me. That he realized he didn't want to be his dad moving forward. 

O h... I just thought he meant he didn't expect to be a dad. Maybe I'm not giving him enough credit!

And I'm not sure if anyone has said this yet but interesting that Pillboi actually was pill boy.

[ChiCricket]

5 minutes ago, Ivydoom said:

Yes they can. Called dermals (in NL at least). There's actually a tiny plate inserted inside the skin and the piercings go on that. A friend of mine has 4 in his neck actually.

Thanks for the answer?....oh my?

[secnarf]

10 minutes ago, SoMuchTV said:

And I'm not sure if anyone has said this yet but interesting that Pillboi actually was pill boy.

I burst out laughing when I realized this (when he went back to the medicine cart for more pills and I said 'oh boy!)

[Desperately Random]

43 minutes ago, SoMuchTV said:

And I'm not sure if anyone has said this yet but interesting that Pillboi actually was pill boy.

And I never even caught that. I guess I need some pills that make you smarter. ?? I'm glad that they had his nickname turn out to be based on his job of passing out pills to the old people and not because he was a drug dealer.

[Lugal]

9 hours ago, Amarsir said:

That's one of the two things that bugged me since season one. Why would good people not be constantly horrified by the existence of a place full of torture and working to change it? Of course then the twist did pretty much explain it at least for that neighborhood.

There's a lot of things on Earth that are built on some pretty horrific foundations and people here (man of whom consider themselves good people) ignore just to get through life.  One thing we humans are good at, if we see a huge problem with no solution, we learn to live with it.

[BeckyThatcher]

Misreaded Florence Nightingale as Florence Henderson. Spent random moments of my day wondering why FH was a bitch. I blame The Brainy Bunch episode. 

Janet’s beeps were the best!

[Kromm]

Randy "Macho Man" International Airport is one of the best background visual gags this show has EVER had. And it's had some great ones.

Oh, excuse me... "NON-International Airport".

[possibilities]

Maybe Simone will die and they'll meet her in wherever they wind up next. Maybe they'll all be in the Bad Place again, and try to reform that from inside, by trying to get the residents to do good things while there.

I liked that Simone seemed to be reciprocating the attraction in the simulation with Eleanor.

I can't stop laughing about the Nemo cafe name gags.

I also enjoy that Eleanor is still Eleanor. Being a better person doesn't stop her from wanting to kill her mother for faking death. She's still snarky with Chidi, she still does pranks, she's still wrathful and sometimes selfish.

[arc]

I rewatched a bit of the season opener to see Donkey Doug’s first appearance, and when he quit the dance crew, he and Jason had a handshake that was about the first third of the handshake between Jason and Pillboi.

[CofCinci]

3 hours ago, arc said:

I rewatched a bit of the season opener to see Donkey Doug’s first appearance, and when he quit the dance crew, he and Jason had a handshake that was about the first third of the handshake between Jason and Pillboi.

I hope someone creates a supercut of all the times Donkey Doug was mentioned on the series. I’d love to rewatch with the context that DD is actually Jason’s father. 

[cpcathy]

9 hours ago, BeckyThatcher said:

Misreaded Florence Nightingale as Florence Henderson. Spent random moments of my day wondering why FH was a bitch. I blame The Brainy Bunch episode. 

Janet’s beeps were the best!

Hey, don't even get me started on Florence Henderson!

[DeLurker]

18 hours ago, Blakeston said:

Is there anyone Kristen Bell doesn't have crazy chemistry with?

I find she has little chemistry on screen with her actual husband, but otherwise, she's gold.

[Amarsir]

14 hours ago, Ivydoom said:

The same way people burnt witches or flew planes in towers. They want to get rid of what they don't understand and believe is bad, and protect what they love and believe is good. Funny thing I heard a scientist say in a tv-program (Dutch scientist professor Vincent Icke, Dutch talkshow De wereld draait door, they talked about Stephen Hawking's latest book) Icke said: 'People used to be scared of an eclipse because they did not understand what it was. Now we know what it is and we are no longer afraid of it' Maybe he was paraphrasing Hawking himself, I don't remember to be honest.

 

13 hours ago, Lugal said:

There's a lot of things on Earth that are built on some pretty horrific foundations and people here (man of whom consider themselves good people) ignore just to get through life.  One thing we humans are good at, if we see a huge problem with no solution, we learn to live with it.

Sure, but those aren't examples of people I'd expect to have made it to The Good Place. Everyone considers themself a good person. But someone who was externally validated to have lived selflessly just doesn't seem likely to accept being privileged. I mean consider Fake Eleanor. We know now she was a character, but would someone like that ever rationalize that 95% of humanity deserves torture?

One weird theory I haven't vetted is that there is no Good Place. We haven't seen it or met anyone from it. We did see a representative in the Mindy St. Clair explanation (and Mindy herself makes less sense) but that could all be part of an elaborate ruse. The biggest evidence is that Janet exists. And presumably if Michael knew where to get Janet then he must have met good place "angels". But if Janet can be explained then I could imagine it all being a trick that even the demons aren't in on.

[Mabinogia]

14 minutes ago, Amarsir said:

Sure, but those aren't examples of people I'd expect to have made it to The Good Place.

Well, based on the standard, maybe no one has ever actually gotten into the good place. lol Maybe it's just this big empty space full of dogs and other animals that frolic around big fields all day. 

[Loandbehold]

9 hours ago, possibilities said:

I can't stop laughing about the Nemo cafe name gags.

They've been great, but I also love so many of the other sight gags. My problem is that my TV doesn't have a large enough screen and they go by too fast for me to catch many of them. It's not until they're mentioned here, or I read about them on some other site, that I learn about them. For instance, the cafe is located at the corner of "That's Not a" Street and "This is a" Street.

[Anela]

My DVR has been messing up on the recordings. It doesn't record some shows at all, and with this one, it starts five minutes late, or cuts off the last fifteen minutes (??). I had to catch up with the app on my phone, yesterday. 

I liked Jason pointing out that giving his dad money, wouldn't do him any good, because he'd just blow it all. He's rarely shown to be that smart. Simone was great, I knew she would just break up with Chidi. 

[companionenvy]

I think we have had one person "confirmed" to be in the Good Place, no? IIRC, Michael says that "All of the presidents except for Lincoln" are in the Bad Place. So, Lincoln apparently got in.

[The Companion]

On 10/25/2018 at 8:22 PM, Linny said:

 

Simone stayed awesome to the end. The actress just killed it in the simulations when imitating Eleanor and Janet. I appreciated that after her initial sting of rejection, Simone accepted that Chidi was sure of what he wanted and made peace with it. It was also helpful of Eleanor to point out that Simone has a full life that Chidi has been an important figure in, but he was never the defining piece.

 

I loved Simone and I actually thought Chidi's reason for breaking up with her (to avoid letting the truth slip and damning her) was kind of sweet. The actress did an incredible job, and totally nailed her Janet and Eleanor impressions. I am ok if that is it for Simone but I would also love to see her again.

 

On 10/25/2018 at 9:43 PM, festivus said:

I love that Donkey Doug turned out to be Jason's dad. Wasn't he the first one to leave the 40 person dance crew in the first episode? That makes it even funnier. That being said, I don't really need to see him again. Dumb characters are not my thing. Jason only gets away with it because he's so sweet under the dumbness.

I agree. Jason's sweetness makes him watchable. I did love getting to see his background. His interactions with Donkey Doug were killing me.

On 10/25/2018 at 9:58 PM, jmonique said:

This episode further illustrated why I've always been more onboard with Jason/Tahani than Jason/Janet. 
Jason and Janet just happened: "You know what? I think I love you, girl." There wasn't much build-up beyond the two of them being nice to one another, and largely since the end of the first season, it's just been Janet crushing and now creepily obsessing over Jason.

 

I mean, it isn't like she has had a bunch of break ups before to help her figure out how to act. I think she is taking it pretty okay.

On 10/26/2018 at 12:26 AM, CatWarmer said:

The way Michael's face lit up when he saw the monster truck - fantastic.

I love when he is delighted by something.

On 10/26/2018 at 5:45 AM, PityFree said:

I am not saying that Donkey Doug’s sacrifice would get him into the good place under the current system.  Under the current system almost no one gets in a good place for anything they do.  I am saying that in the future on the show, the sacrifice will come up as a point in his favor. I think the Soul Squad will challenge the current point system and that when they do, things like Donkey Doug’s sacrifice will matter.

 

I do think part of what we are seeing is the inherent unfairness of the system. Jason actually turned out pretty awesome, and he does the wrong things but for the right reasons sometimes. We have seen how the backgrounds of three of the characters set them up for failure, and I don't think that is an accident. 

 

I really liked this episode. I loved the relationship simulator. It is basically how I live my life (ok, let me practice this phone call in my head one more time before I call). I loved Kristen Bell's delivery in the scene with Simone. She has made references to her attraction to Tahani in the past, and I like that they continue to matter of factly show her attraction to men and women (I believe the show previously confirmed she is bisexual and while it sometimes is the subject of jokes, I don't feel it is ever directed at the fact that she is attracted to women generally, which I appreciate). Chidi's many break up attempts were hilarious. Honestly, he should have paid more attention to Eleanor's fake breakup speech through Simone, which was pretty good. Loved the constant interruption in the real deal and the satisfactory resolution between the characters at the end. 

Jason's trip home was hilarious. I was glad we didn't have smellovision for the axe energy spray. I think most of the amazing parts have been covered (that handshake!).

Edited October 27, 2018 by The Companion
Autocorrect fail

[DrSpaceman73]

21 hours ago, ChiCricket said:

Is anyone surprised the mail bomber suspect is from Florida? I immediately thought of this show!

Yes I thought the same thing. 

I am sure he is a big Jaguars fan. 

[jmonique]

1 hour ago, The Companion said:

I mean, it isn't like she has had a bunch of break ups before to help her figure out how to act. I think she is taking it pretty okay.

My problem is more with the writing and setup of Jason/Tahani vs. Jason/Janet, as well as the whiplash pace of the two relationships in seasons 1 and 2.

J/J S1 was basically predicated around how Janet was the only one who was nice to Jason, and how he was nice to her after she was rebooted. That’s it, she even says as much: “And Jason is a person who was near me.”

J/T S2 are actually shown working on their relationship, via couples therapy. J/J S2 in the Judge’s chamber is largely a device to get Chidi to kiss Eleanor (which better be circled back on this season, IMO).

Basically, the shipper aspects of the show are the weakest points for me, however, I still find myself much more invested in Jason and Tahani, as they had an actual relationship, and largely we’ve just seen Janet pine for Jason - and it’s starting to get marginally creepy, with the strongman onesie and all.

[Blakeston]

1 hour ago, Amarsir said:

One weird theory I haven't vetted is that there is no Good Place. We haven't seen it or met anyone from it. We did see a representative in the Mindy St. Clair explanation (and Mindy herself makes less sense) but that could all be part of an elaborate ruse. The biggest evidence is that Janet exists. And presumably if Michael knew where to get Janet then he must have met good place "angels". But if Janet can be explained then I could imagine it all being a trick that even the demons aren't in on.

Gen herself seemed to acknowledge that The Good Place was real, and that the humans could get there if they got enough points. I guess even she can't be taken entirely at face value, though.

[CherithCutestory]

On 10/26/2018 at 9:23 AM, Helena Dax said:

I was thinking the same thing. Even if Pillboi is able to spend his days helping the elderly and away from crime, so what. Florence Nightingale didn't make the cut; with the system as it is, being sent into the Good Place is almost impossible. However, I think their selfless actions are helping them. Not enough. though. I mean, it's the points system what must be changed. That should be their goal.

 

I completely agree that the system needs to be changed. And, previously, that always seemed to be the point of the show. In season 1 the underlying idea was Eleanor wasn't a good person but she didn't belong in Hell. Even Chidi agreed and he has more exacting moral standards than anyone. I still think the show doesn't endorse the system it has set-up. And will one day change it.

But I think the focus on Florence Nightingale is a mistake. Anyone who ended up being very famous for their deeds, as she was in her lifetime, is likely to have their morals corrupted in some way according the far too stringent standards of the Good Place. (That's not my personal belief but works under the show's intentionally unfair moral framework.) Power corrupts and all that. At some point, those people, unless they are exceptionally saintly, are likely to err on the Tahani side and start doing things for the acclaim rather than to help people. 

If anyone makes it into the Good Place it's probably randoms like Pillboi  or even Simone if she's human. People who are good and kind every single day but don't get much in the way of earthly rewards for it. So, it wouldn't be people we've all heard of like Florence Nightingale. I don't think we can say that if she (or any other famous person)  didn't get in no one stands a chance. Because the reason may be that their very fame ended up corrupting their motivation. 

As I said, I agree the system is unfair. So, I'm not endorsing the idea that every good thing you do is invalid if you also happen to get and LIKE the attention you receive for it. But that's sort of how the system works now. But there are lots of good people who don't get that. 

Quote

 

Basically, the shipper aspects of the show are the weakest points for me, however, I still find myself much more invested in Jason and Tahani, as they had an actual relationship, and largely we’ve just seen Janet pine for Jason - and it’s starting to get marginally creepy, with the strongman onesie and all.

 

 

 

I agree with your post. I hate the shipping stuff for this particular show. And I thought they claimed they weren't into triangles? I don't like Jason and Tahani much but they are actual human beings who try. Janet is built to please humans and would never challenge Jason. It's inherently unhealthy. 

I was really happy this whole thing was resolved last season. And it's just one more unhappy revisiting brought by the bad choice to reboot everyone again at the end of the season. 

Edited October 27, 2018 by CherithCutestory

[Chaos Theory]

On 10/26/2018 at 2:42 PM, Helena Dax said:

To me, the fact that Chidi or Tahani didn't make it is proof that, indeed, almost no one goes to the Good Place. I mean, Chidi tried so hard to be good, he never lied, he was helpful, he never hurt anyone on purpose. And Tahani did a lot of good, helped a lot of people. Was she vain? Yes, and she also didn't do it for the better reasons. 

They were both also incredibly selfish.  Chidi not lying was often the cause of a lot of his grief.  He went nuts because he couldn’t tell a guy he like his ugly boots.  Tahani always had ulterior motives for her charity even if it was just to snog Ryan Gosling.   

[bethy]

Which she did. Twice.

[Kromm]

3 hours ago, The Companion said:

I really liked this episode. I loved the relationship simulator. It is basically how I live my life (ok, let me practice this phone call in my head one more time before I call). I loved Kristen Bell's delivery in the scene with Simone. She has made references to her attraction to Tahani in the past, and I like that they continue to matter of factly show her attraction to men and women (I believe the show previously confirmed she is bisexual and while it sometimes is the subject of jokes, I don't feel it is ever directed at the fact that she is attracted to women generally, which I appreciate)

 

I don't really think they write or Kristen acts Eleanor as bisexual per-se as much as they pose her as kind of on the sexuality spectrum in a place where she's into people who are hot, regardless of gender, but her usual leanings are towards men.  She wouldn't self identify as queer, I'd think, but wouldn't be overly bothered if someone thought she was. 

 

I do think it takes a little alcohol usually, and knowing Eleanor some level of boredom/thrill seeking for her to hook up with a girl. She's likely had more than her fair share of inebriated hookups with girls she picked up in bars. 

Edited October 27, 2018 by Kromm

[CherithCutestory]

2 hours ago, Kromm said:

I don't really think they write or Kristen acts Eleanor as bisexual per-se as much as they pose her as kind of on the sexuality spectrum in a place where she's into people who are hot, regardless of gender, but her usual leanings are towards men.  She wouldn't self identify as queer, I'd think, but wouldn't be overly bothered if someone thought she was. 

 

I think the fact that she was pretty much offended that more men don't openly identify as bisexual means that she identifies as bi herself. If she wasn't into labels why would she think more men should have the label? 

Quote

 

 Chidi not lying was often the cause of a lot of his grief.

 

 

 

Exactly. Chidi's personal moral code actively hurt the  people he was closest to. And he knew it (this is why everyone hates moral philosophy professors) and that wasn't a problem for him. His moral code wasn't helping anyone. It was only for himself. Just as Tahani ultimately wasn't doing it for anyone else. She was doing it for her own self-worth. 

Edited October 27, 2018 by CherithCutestory

[Lugal]

25 minutes ago, Kromm said:

I do think it takes a little alcohol usually, and knowing Eleanor some level of boredom/thrill seeking for her to hook up with a girl. She's likely had more than her fair share of inebriated hookups with girls she picked up in bars.

I would agree she's into hotness regardless of gender, and this is probably a minor point, but I don't see Eleanor to be the type to pick up women in bars, so much as the one to be picked up.  She's vain enough to think everyone's into her, regardless of gender, and if they aren't she shakes it off and it if they are she goes with it, like in the simulation, Simone made the first move and Eleanor was into it.  Or in the first season when Vicky/Real Eleanor said something, and Eleanor took it that way and said something like "Doing it with someone with the same name?  That's a little narcissistic, OK fine, let's do it."

[cpcathy]

What is  hot Eleanor supposed to do, just stand there and go, "Derp, derp, derp?"

[Amarsir]

6 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

Well, based on the standard, maybe no one has ever actually gotten into the good place. lol Maybe it's just this big empty space full of dogs and other animals that frolic around big fields all day. 

Oh I like that idea. It takes what was hinting at "doesn't exist" to me and makes it more sensible. Then there are complications like @companionenvy points out with Lincoln. But if the actual words were "not in the Bad Place" that's different from "in the Good Place".

[Zuleikha]

I don't remember if Michael said it or Janet did. If Michael said it, it doesn't cleanly establish anything because Michael eagerly lies. If Janet said it, it has to be canon because Janet can't lie (or couldn't until her reboots evolved her).