S08.E06 Return to Murder House

[littlemommy]

I always thought that Moira couldn’t move on because she wanted her bones found and Constance to be found responsible for her murder. Maybe since Constance is dead and that possibility disappeared Moira was open to moving on in a different way. 

I can buy the explanation that Tate did evil things because of the evil house, but it would have been better if that had been explored more and not just presented as a rushed proclamation. By Madison, of all people, the least touchy-feely  person ever.

[ShadowHunter]

7 minutes ago, littlemommy said:

 

I can buy the explanation that Tate did evil things because of the evil house, but it would have been better if that had been explored more and not just presented as a rushed proclamation. By Madison, of all people, the least touchy-feely  person ever.

Yes this episode should have been 10 minutes longer or so. They could waste time showing Stevie sing they could have showed more that Tate was different now. Though I feel Evan played him more calmer or sadder. The manipulation of the first season felt gone to me. 

Granted Evan does not look 17 anymore but he will be 32 in less than 4 months lol so I thought it could have looked way worse. It didn't bother me. 

I dont think Emma is a good actress but this episode was the first time on the show that I was able to deal with her. Her and Billy Poter worked well together. 

[WednesdayAddams]

I'm with those that don't remember much about Murder House. But why was it such a surprise/shock to these people that Michael turned out the way he did? Wasn't it hugely hinted at that this baby was not normal even before being born? With every thing that led to conception-birth-murder house shenanigans, it shouldn't come as a surprise. 

[llewis823]

3 hours ago, WednesdayAddams said:

I feel like there's a lot of questions that may not be answered by the last episode.

That is the thing I don't like about AHS. Every season it seems there will be some big climatic scene at the end where we will understand what we've been shown all season. But nope. Lots just gets forgotten about or explained in a way that we just don't care - like no biggie. They always tell us all the seasons tie together and it will be revealed how in the end. Well I rather doubt that. Personally, I think they don't truly plan ahead but just kind of wing it with general ideas in mind. (I just imagine two teenage guys sitting in their mom's basements saying in a Jeff Spicoli voice, "What do you want to do next season? Oh, a circus? That would be cool - let's do that!") That would explain the lame endings that don't tie up all the loose ends, etc. But yet I continue to watch each season...

Edited October 18, 2018 by llewis823

[KellySunshine]

How long was this episode? My PVR cut out right when Kathy Bates and the other two people arrived at the door of the murder house.  Did I miss a lot?

[Rap541]

39 minutes ago, WednesdayAddams said:

I'm with those that don't remember much about Murder House. But why was it such a surprise/shock to these people that Michael turned out the way he did? Wasn't it hugely hinted at that this baby was not normal even before being born? With every thing that led to conception-birth-murder house shenanigans, it shouldn't come as a surprise. 

You're not crazy. There was a scene where Vivian had a sonogram of the babies and the nurse doing it freaked out and was later seen in a church/chapel praying.

As someone who was never enamored with Murder House, I suspect my opinion will be in the minority but... I was bored. Michael is the AntiChrist and honestly, I don't know that we needed an entire episode of backstory to establish that. Jessica Lange is fun but I would rather have seen Fiona in the crossover. Tate's evil and manipulation is being whitewashed, and honestly I don't buy that Constance would ever have wanted Moira to be freed from her control. Everyone who is dead in the house has a miserable existence. Oh, and guess what? Michael is the son of the Devil. 

Which I think we kinda knew. 

There's four episodes left. Time to move things along.

[Bruinsfan]

4 hours ago, sashayshante said:

the fourth child was actually a gay albino son. There are deleted scenes out there that show him with Tate. They cut the character because  - wait for it- they thought he was too disturbing.

Too disturbing in a season that had the Burned Man and the Infantata?

One thing about this episode underscoring that it was the House/Evil/Satan using Tate to father Michael, that at least makes more sense of how a ghost could be one of the parents of a living child. There wasn't anything in particular about Tate that convinced me he'd be able to achieve such a miracle, but if it was a Rosemary's Baby situation I can buy it.

[tennisgurl]

So, this was basically a sequel episode to Murder House, where the ghosts get closure, and we basically get a bunch of fanservice for one of the most popular season. Honestly, I really do wish the show had just started with the witches trying to stop Michael and his apocalypse, instead of all the stuff with the bunker. I guess that will all come back, but I am actually way more interested in the stuff with the witches and them going from season to season meeting AHS characters, maybe with them teaming up to fight Michael and his anti chist buddies. Like a super campy, murder happy Infinity War. 

The Tate whitewashing is annoying, but some of it makes sense. I always thought it was lame that Tate could apparently pump out the anti christ, and it actually being a Rosemary's Baby situation, with Satan impregnating an unwitting human woman, actually sounds like a better twist than Tate being the leather-man anyway. And I guess you can say that anyone being around the house too much made them kind of evil and crazy, and it just generally attracted evil energy, so I guess I can buy it. And its nice to give the ghosts in the house some closure, and, yes, its just fun to see Murder House and the ghosts again, even the non main ghosts. Murder House, even with its not super awesome ending, was my favorite season, and it was nice to see it again. 

Madison and Behold were a fun paring, and it was actually kind of nice to see Madison actually develop a bit as a character. Of course, Madison has shown bits of humanity before, and it never leads anywhere, so maybe this wont either, who knows? Still, they were funny together. "Your offspring would have the most beautiful skin" *both look at each other looking grossed out* "The tearjerker?" I would watch a whole spin off series that was just the two of them going from season to season, helping the characters while snarking and looking fabulous. 

Its been awhile since I saw Murder House, so am I forgetting who Constance's eyeless daughter is?

[iMonrey]

Well, I for one thought this episode was awesome on a level not seen since Asylum. It just reinforced my opinion that the show has never really lived up to the first season in terms of cast and characters. I was actually quite touched by the happy ending they finally gave Moira.

On the other hand, there were some inconsistencies. The Harmon family was united in death at the end of Season 1, and determined to scare away any potential buyers. Not sure why they were no longer maintaining that unified front by the time this episode took place. Also, after Vivien died, Moira flatly informed her that she was no longer her maid because she doesn't work for ghosts. Yet here she was, working as a maid and being bossed around by Constance. Wasn't she also supposed to be godmother to Vivien and Ben's "good" baby?

I'd also like to know, obviously, why Madison doesn't recognize that Billie looks exactly like Cordelia, or that Constance looks exactly like Fiona, or that Violet looks exactly like Zoe. I guess we're just supposed to hand-wave this but I think it would be more interesting if they acknowledged it somehow.

I about died when Ben said "I have to go look out the window and cry while I masturbate" (and the follow-up nickname "Tear Jerker"). OMG. You know, I'm willing to bet that Dylan McDermott has never quite lived down playing that scene. It was pretty graphic and shocking for a basic cable channel. Nice to know he's got a sense of humor about it.

Quote

Billie Dean did not need to show up.  It felt like she was thrown in because it was Sarah.

Agreed. She was such a minor character back in Season 1, and she's already played two characters this season. Why throw her into the mix? I suspect she gets paid by the episode and her contract stipulates that she appear in all 10. That's the only reason I can think of.  It was enough to see Constance, Ben and Vivien again. Tate and Violet were an added bonus but who the hell really cares if Billie shows up?

[Stallion12]

Can't quote today for some reason,  I guess if they expAndes the whitewashing more I'd have bought it.

[DangerousMinds]

5 hours ago, Chaos Theory said:

I didn’t mind the Tate Whitewashing at all.  If you accept the fact that the house itself is evil and you remove the evil from the house what do you have left?   Ben murdered at least one person.  Constance was the worlds worst mother and used and abused people to get in the house.  Hell she murdered Moira and buried her on the property to keep her from moving on.   The house played on people’s worst instincts and if you remove the worst part of the house which is what made Michael you leave the possibility of what Tate really is.  

Well, Tate was the only one who massacred a bunch of innocent high school students.

[tennisgurl]

2 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I'd also like to know, obviously, why Madison doesn't recognize that Billie looks exactly like Cordelia, or that Constance looks exactly like Fiona, or that Violet looks exactly like Zoe. I guess we're just supposed to hand-wave this but I think it would be more interesting if they acknowledged it somehow.

 

Yeah, I've been wondering how they were going to write around this ever since they decided to establish the AHS Expanded Universe, and I guess they've just chosen to ignore it. I guess I can hand-wave it, but its super weird to have characters interact with people who just so happen to look exactly like other people they not only know, but very recently saw. I guess we can guess that they dont look like that to them, or dont look as much like they do, but its super strange. Yeah, I know thats saying something on this show...

[Cobalt Stargazer]

5 hours ago, littlemommy said:

I always thought that Moira couldn’t move on because she wanted her bones found and Constance to be found responsible for her murder. Maybe since Constance is dead and that possibility disappeared Moira was open to moving on in a different way.

Moira's almost childlike delight when Madison presented her with the bag ("My bones!") was hilarious and heartbreaking and awful all at once. Interesting that Constance's wish was for her to be set free from the house in exchange for giving information about Michael. I'm like, Woman, you're the one who killed her and you're why she can't leave.

[LoneHaranguer]

5 hours ago, ShadowHunter said:

Yes this episode should have been 10 minutes longer or so. They could waste time showing Stevie sing they could have showed more that Tate was different now.

They could have easily condensed the first half to make room. They're no better at planning out an episode than a season.

[DangerousMinds]

maybe 'American Horror Story' shouldn't have given a mass shooter a happy ending 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/mashable.com/article/tate-langdon-american-horror-story-apocalypse-school-shooter.amp

Edited October 19, 2018 by DangerousMinds

[KnoxForPres]

Did  Madison call Dylan McDermott a FILF during tear jerker scene?  Hilarious and co sign if so. As others have stated- turns out she was good in this- as was Behold (great name).

I thought it was pretty solid. The Moira scene felt longer than a Stevie Nicks ballad for me but other than that pretty good. 

It feels like they’re caring a lot more this season and I’m really appreciative of that. 

This is an aside but in the intro kmow when it does that chilling noise (I’m an English major- not music sorry). I always think to myself egotistically Id want my name to hit then. But Emma Roberts I know gets it and Falchuk and Murphy don’t so I guess it’s just me. But the impact- I’ve loved it since first time I watched AHS!

[Primal Slayer]

Sarah Paulson said that she does believe that Madison is related to the other Montgomery's even though they didnt validate it.

[ihartcoffee]

9 hours ago, KellySunshine said:

How long was this episode? My PVR cut out right when Kathy Bates and the other two people arrived at the door of the murder house.  Did I miss a lot?

I had to go watch the on demand version,  there was more.  

[Dobian]

So why wasn't Jamie Brewer in this?  This season has featured the two seasons she was in, Murder House and Cult, but she didn't get to play either character?  That's a real disappointment.

[Token]

So, does this mean that Michael has always been the person in the black latex suit, including the one who appeared in Hotel?

[AgentRXS]

8 hours ago, iMonrey said:

Well, I for one thought this episode was awesome on a level not seen since Asylum. It just reinforced my opinion that the show has never really lived up to the first season in terms of cast and characters. I was actually quite touched by the happy ending they finally gave Moira.

On the other hand, there were some inconsistencies. The Harmon family was united in death at the end of Season 1, and determined to scare away any potential buyers. Not sure why they were no longer maintaining that unified front by the time this episode took place. Also, after Vivien died, Moira flatly informed her that she was no longer her maid because she doesn't work for ghosts. Yet here she was, working as a maid and being bossed around by Re. Wasn't she also supposed to be godmother to Vivien and Ben's "good" baby?

I'd also like to know, obviously, why Madison doesn't recognize that Billie looks exactly like Cordelia, or that Constance looks exactly like Fiona, or that Violet looks exactly like Zoe. I guess we're just supposed to hand-wave this but I think it would be more interesting if they acknowledged it somehow.

I about died when Ben said "I have to go look out the window and cry while I masturbate" (and the follow-up nickname "Tear Jerker"). OMG. You know, I'm willing to bet that Dylan McDermott has never quite lived down playing that scene. It was pretty graphic and shocking for a basic cable channel. Nice to know he's got a sense of humor about it.

Agreed. She was such a minor character back in Season 1, and she's already played two characters this season. Why throw her into the mix? I suspect she gets paid by the episode and her contract stipulates that she appear in all 10. That's the only reason I can think of.  It was enough to see Constance, Ben and Vivien again. Tate and Violet were an added bonus but who the hell really cares if Billie shows up?

Re: The Harmons

It was implied that Viv and Ben had a falling out over Michael. Viv pretty much never wanted anything to do with him, and Ben wanted to treat him as his own at first. I could see how he got the silent treatment over that.

33 minutes ago, Dobian said:

So why wasn't Jamie Brewer in this?  This season has featured the two seasons she was in, Murder House and Cult, but she didn't get to play either character?  That's a real disappointment.

Jaime Brewer's character in Season 1 didn't die on Murder House property. Constance didn't get her body on the land in time. I forgot what happened to her character in Coven.

[SHD]

2 hours ago, KnoxForPres said:

Did  Madison call Dylan McDermott a FILF during tear jerker scene?  Hilarious and co sign if so. 

I thought she said DILF, which I'm guessing is basically the same?

Moira with her mother brought tears. When her mother said she wanted to smother Moira in kisses for pulling the plug...anyone who has had to make a medical decision for a relative  (or for that matter, has had a pet put down)...to be able to learn that you did the right thing...man.

The line that made me laugh the most was "We look like the worst possible version of Heidi Klum and Seal."

[Cobalt Stargazer]

12 hours ago, DangerousMinds said:

maybe 'American Horror Story' shouldn't have given a mass shooter a happy ending 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/mashable.com/article/tate-langdon-american-horror-story-apocalypse-school-shooter.amp

 

I'm just going to say it; it's only a happy ending in the sense that Madison leaves Tate and Violet gazing into each other's eyes, and I could even say that she didn't do it for Tate but out of a rare moment of compassion for Violet, who didn't do anything wrong. Fact is, Tate's still dead, and he's still trapped in the house with Constance, who may or may not have contributed to him becoming a murderer, particularly if she was right in saying she was put on earth to raise monsters. Hell, Constance raised Michael, who tried to strangle her in her own bed because she corrected his grammar too often. Or something.

If anything, all the exposition in this episode about Michael's background and upbringing - "He was a product of rape! He killed bugs and stray animals and at least one babysitter! He's actually the son of the devil even though he cries sometimes because he wants to be good!" - smacks of a setup to make him not a thousand percent awful, even though as the episode ends Madison and Behold don't know if there's anything to be done to stop him. And there's not, since this is a flashback and the end of the world pretty much already happened and all that's left is (I guess) the resurrected witches to try to stand against him now. Okay, school shootings are a thing that happens in real life and the son of Satan destroying the world isn't, but within the context of the show the evil Michael represents is far greater than Tate's. So why bother making any explanations for why he is the way he is unless the explanations are really just excuses?

Edited October 19, 2018 by Cobalt Stargazer

[ShadowHunter]

I have a bad feeling the only way the end of the world can be saved is they go back in time lol. I cant shake the feeling a reset is going to happen. Maybe that is why the characters in Murder House got a happy ending because in the end this season wont really matter. Which also means poor Misty is going back to Hell and Queenie is back to the Hotel Cortez. 

That is probably just wild speculation on my part. I just cant think of how else they are going to stop something that already happened.  Even if they kill Michael which I hope they do again the world did end already. Unless killing him will turn things back to normal?

6 hours ago, LoneHaranguer said:

They could have easily condensed the first half to make room. They're no better at planning out an episode than a season.

Agree honest in some ways this season is falling apart for me. It was great seeing the MH again Mr.March. Misty being free from Hell is good but that has been about it. The opening minutes of this season was really good and then it has been a small let down.  

[BookWoman56]

I'm not overwhelmingly fond of the "son of Satan" story line (not just in AHS but anywhere), but Cody Fern brought his A game to that role in this episode. He showed quite convincingly the regrets and horror Michael experienced at his own actions sometimes, while becoming increasingly isolated psychologically as everyone around him, living or ghost, ultimately rejected him, and then embracing his inner monster. I think part of what made this episode so powerful is that in terms of the acting, almost everybody brought their A game. Even Emma Roberts, who generally hovers around the level of adequate in acting, was surprisingly good. As for why Madison told Violet that the evil in the house itself used Tate for its own purposes, that just seemed to fit in overall with several of the resident ghosts there getting some kind of closure. Ben and Vivienne reconciled, Moira was able to be with her mother, and Constance was able to be the center of attention while describing her botched efforts at motherhood. Why not give Violet some relief from her loneliness and grief? I did find myself wondering if Tate had been in the habit of hanging around that house before he went on his shooting spree, and if so, how much of that act was driven by Tate's own urges and how much was driven by the house. 

ETA: Thanks @JenE4, I had completely forgotten that Tate actually lived in the house although I knew he had died there; I was thinking of Constance living not in that house but in the house she had when Ben and Viv moved into Murder House. So, yeah, I would have to agree that the house itself was the primary force behind most of Tate's actions. That is, I think Tate may have had some typical adolescent urges for violence, but the house effectively removed the brakes on those urges and instead revved up the desire for violence to a breaking point.

Edited October 19, 2018 by BookWoman56

[JakeyJokes]

1 hour ago, AgentRXS said:

Re: The Harmons

It was implied that Viv and Ben had a falling out over Michael. Viv pretty much never wanted anything to do with him, and Ben wanted to treat him as his own at first. I could see how he got the silent treatment over that.

Jaime Brewer's character in Season 1 didn't die on Murder House property. Constance didn't get her body on the land in time. I forgot what happened to her character in Coven.

Marie Laveau and Fiona Goode drowned her as a sacrifice to Papa Legba. Theoretically, she's in heaven so there would be no hell to rescue her from.

[Dobian]

2 hours ago, AgentRXS said:

Jaime Brewer's character in Season 1 didn't die on Murder House property. Constance didn't get her body on the land in time. I forgot what happened to her character in Coven.

Right she got hit by a car.  Nan could have been brought back though, same as Misty, Queenie and Madison.

I don't mind that they gave Tate a happy ending with Violet.  This show is full of murdering psychos and you kind of have to toss your moral barometer out the window when watching it.  In the AHS universe, even serial killers get love.  Even Twisty.

[methodwriter85]

21 minutes ago, Dobian said:

Nan could have been brought back though, same as Misty, Queenie and Madison.

I guess because Nan went to heaven? After season 6 Buffy, we all learned it's bad form to take someone who's happily in heeavvvvvveeeennnn. In the other 3 cases, they were being rescued from hell.

I haven't watched the show since Motel but I don't really feel lost. I guess that's the benefit of an anthology show. I came back purely for Cody Fern.

Edited October 19, 2018 by methodwriter85

[KnoxForPres]

8 hours ago, SHD said:

I thought she said DILF, which I'm guessing is basically the same?

Moira with her mother brought tears. When her mother said she wanted to smother Moira in kisses for pulling the plug...anyone who has had to make a medical decision for a relative  (or for that matter, has had a pet put down)...to be able to learn that you did the right thing...man.

The line that made me laugh the most was "We look like the worst possible version of Heidi Klum and Seal."

I am laughing so much at my mistake- thank you!  Suddenly I’m the mom character in SNL who gets celebrities names wrong.

[Captanne]

I am so old* that I took the "Montgomery" reference to be a cute shout out to Elizabeth Montgomery who starred in "Bewitched" in the 60s.

 

*And by "so old" I mean that I can't remember characters from a current show in 2018 but I can from my childhood in the 1960s.  Yeah.  That old.

 

ETA:  "Tear jerker" made me laugh.

Edited October 19, 2018 by Captanne

[sashayshante]

Dear God, let there be a twist. I get the feeling the next episode is going to be a total backslide. And while the Murder House re-visit was fun, it did nothing to further the plot. What?? Michael is evil?? You don't say. The story needs a shot in the arm, fast. The Coven stuff has reached peaked extra. Papa Legba? Christ, come on. Move it along. Stop going backwards and stop introducing/bringing back characters just for fan service.

Edited October 19, 2018 by sashayshante

[Chaos Theory]

10 hours ago, Dobian said:

So why wasn't Jamie Brewer in this?  This season has featured the two seasons she was in, Murder House and Cult, but she didn't get to play either character?  That's a real disappointment.

Her character died (I think) during the Halloween episode of Murder House off the property so she wasn’t trapped there.  She was able to move on.  

I don’t mind all the fan service and I  don’t mind Tate getting a happy ending because Violet didn’t deserve to spend eternity alone.  And it’s not like Tate is miraculously going to heaven on winged chariots.   He gets forgiven by the girl he likes and spends eternity in an evil house with her.

Edited October 19, 2018 by Chaos Theory

[WednesdayAddams]

3 hours ago, Captanne said:

I am so old* that I took the "Montgomery" reference to be a cute shout out to Elizabeth Montgomery who starred in "Bewitched" in the 60s.

 

*And by "so old" I mean that I can't remember characters from a current show in 2018 but I can from my childhood in the 1960s.  Yeah.  That old.

 

ETA:  "Tear jerker" made me laugh.

I'm 31 and thought the same thing and Elizabeth Montgomery and Madison! 

[LoneHaranguer]

12 hours ago, ShadowHunter said:

That is probably just wild speculation on my part. I just cant think of how else they are going to stop something that already happened.  Even if they kill Michael which I hope they do again the world did end already. Unless killing him will turn things back to normal?

Seems unlikely, but since we were just told that he's not all evil, maybe they can talk him into using his super son-of-Satan powers to do it?

[JenE4]

12 hours ago, BookWoman56 said:

I did find myself wondering if Tate had been in the habit of hanging around that house before he went on his shooting spree, and if so, how much of that act was driven by Tate's own urges and how much was driven by the house. 

Tate and Constance...and Beau, et al...used to live in the house. Tate committed the mass murder while living there. The police came to arrest him and shot him in his room, which is how he became a ghost there in the first place. That’s why I don’t fault Tate for being “evil.” The house—built over the portal to hell, as we learned this episode—made him do that. I assume that’s why he didn’t know that he even committed the mass murder. He was seeing Dr Tearjerker because he was having these evil thoughts—but didn’t know they were actually memories. Michael was portrayed in a similar vein. He didn’t know why he was committing these murders and tried to fight against those urges AT FIRST, but then he went all in embracing being the son of Satan. This doesn’t make Tate Satan. I guess Tate was sort of like Joseph in the Mary and Joseph pairing with Jesus as the son of God. That house basically turned everyone who lived there into a murderer...assuming they walked through the door long enough to live there. I didn’t think Tate was “the” villain in season 1, but just one of the more interesting twist ending “victim villains” of the house, if that makes any sense. Just like the burn victim guy who it turned out the house made him set his own children on fire. He wouldn’t have otherwise done that if he didn’t live there, and I think Tate would have been a “normal” kid if he lived somewhere else, too. So I’m okay with Tate having a “happier” ending—as happy as one can be living over the portal to hell, I guess. 

The other big controversy on this thread seems to be re a 30 year old playing a 15 year old. Well, technically, he was 5 and woke up looking 10 years older overnight, so he’s really a 5 year old who looks 15 who’s played by a 30 year old??? If he ages that quickly, then he should look older than he is, I guess?? But mentally is he still a 5 year old? This episode I feel like he’s “playing young,” likewise that previous scene eating French toast with his Devil Mama seemed like a little kid. But he’s teenagerish at the school and then like Victorian gentleman like only 3 years later at the time of the apocalypse, so who the hell knows. Maybe that’s the point that the devil-spawn would be ageless? He could be 5, he could be a teenager, he could be an adult—it really doesn’t matter because he’s not human and can’t be ascribed to typical human aging guidelines.

Edited October 19, 2018 by JenE4

[AgentRXS]

35 minutes ago, JenE4 said:

I guess Tate was sort of like Joseph in the Mary and Joseph pairing with Jesus as the son of God

Another thing similar to that story was The Black Pope and his 2 other worshippers following a "dark star towards the west" to find Michael, just like the Three Wise Men following the bright star of the East to find Jesus. Makes sense for the Anti-Christ to have the evil version of the story of Christ.

[rubinia]

13 hours ago, ShadowHunter said:

The opening minutes of this season was really good and then it has been a small let down.  

 

That pretty much sums up every season of this show, though the let downs vary in size.

[checkmeboo]

“She’s a sucker for a farmhouse kitchen,” (one of the great lines from this epi) - and so am I ??‍♀️ Wasn’t feeling this season but this episode really sucked me back in - Murder House will always be my fave and great to come back to it! 

[iMonrey]

I would have been interested to know if Behold sees Moira as an older woman or as a young, sexy woman. They established that men saw her as the latter, but would a (presumably) gay man also see her in that form? I'm guessing Alexandra Breckenridge wasn't available, or they simply didn't bother with that aspect of the character.

Quote

So, does this mean that Michael has always been the person in the black latex suit, including the one who appeared in Hotel?

Well he couldn't have always been the one in the latex suit because the latex suit guy appeared long before he was even born. He's the one who killed the previous owners (the gay couple) before the Harmons bought the house and obviously impregnated Vivien with Michael too.

[Captanne]

Well, without getting into a whole theological discussion (or, getting into one!), the Antichrist is a Christian concept.  Christianity is based on a Triune god -- the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost.  As one Being, the Trinity (subject singular) forms what philosophers call a "necessary being" (St. Thomas Aquinas https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/god-necessary-being/) -- one that transcends time, form, space, and all dimensions.  It simply must exist, does exist, and exists outside of any realm of reality.  Therefore, there certainly is precedent in a Christian concept of one being in many forms that exist without (and within) our traditional concepts of reality.  Michael certainly could have been his own father.  (See: God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Ghost.  All three are one being.)

[Nutjob]

AHS has offended the satanists, everyone.

 

https://theblast.com/american-horror-story-apocalypse-church-of-satan/

[JenE4]

10 minutes ago, Nutjob said:

AHS has offended the satanists, everyone.

 

https://theblast.com/american-horror-story-apocalypse-church-of-satan/

 

[Bruinsfan]

3 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I would have been interested to know if Behold sees Moira as an older woman or as a young, sexy woman. They established that men saw her as the latter, but would a (presumably) gay man also see her in that form? I'm guessing Alexandra Breckenridge wasn't available, or they simply didn't bother with that aspect of the character.

I'll take not knowing in exchange for all the character's scenes being performed by Frances Conroy, however.

[Sile]

Emma Roberts' work in this ep just reaffirms my opinion that Billy Porter is one of those actors that makes everybody around him better, seemingly just by virtue of his presence.

[Hazel55]

On 10/17/2018 at 10:21 PM, Cobalt Stargazer said:

"I'm Constance Langdon, and this is my fucking house."

She may as well have said, "I'm Jessica Lange, and this is my fucking show."

(Meanwhile, offscreen, Sarah Paulson swoons and drops into a dead faint, humble by being in the presence of TRUE greatness.) 

[LoneHaranguer]

3 hours ago, Sile said:

Emma Roberts' work in this ep just reaffirms my opinion that Billy Porter is one of those actors that makes everybody around him better, seemingly just by virtue of his presence.

And a good writer can make almost anyone look good. It can be hard to tell who to credit when things go well.

[Token]

7 hours ago, iMonrey said:

Well he couldn't have always been the one in the latex suit because the latex suit guy appeared long before he was even born. He's the one who killed the previous owners (the gay couple) before the Harmons bought the house and obviously impregnated Vivien with Michael too.

That's what I thought.  That's why I was confused at the reveal.  I hate this show sometimes.

[WednesdayAddams]

23 minutes ago, Token said:

That's what I thought.  That's why I was confused at the reveal.  I hate this show sometimes.

I laughed when at the start of the season Evan (I forget the hairdresser's name) thought it was Michael in the latex suit in his room. Latex man was clearly.... Shapely? To put it nicely. No way was that the very skinny son of Satan. He should have known better.

[GoneGirl]

On 10/17/2018 at 11:25 PM, Primal Slayer said:

I think we're supposed to walk away with that Tate was used by Satan to do this.

Yes

[AngelKitty]

On ‎10‎/‎17‎/‎2018 at 11:28 PM, ShadowHunter said:

This episode was a lot of fan service though lol.  Tate and Violet getting back together, Moira being set free.  Finally showing the 4th Langdon child. 

Well, I'm a fan and enjoyed being serviced.

Mr. AngelKitty and I did just watch Murder House, so it was especially fun to return and not having to explain everything to him. Michael's whole plot, from conception to Antichrist was all very Rosemary's Baby reminiscent.