S02.E03: Déjà Vu

[Lady Calypso]

What I actually liked about Sylvester's role in this episode is that he was treated more than just a special guest cameo. They actually gave him material to work with and have it interwoven with Kevin and Kate. It didn't feel like some big star playing himself and just showing up as a favour. They gave him excellent scenes to work with, so he felt like a character, even if he was just playing himself.

And, I'll be honest. My first thought was "Hey, this Special Guest can act and isn't just hamming it up!" Like, I know Sylvester's a good actor, but I wasn't cringing at his scenes like, for example, Seth Meyer's cameo last season, where it felt shoehorned in.

[NeverLate]

12 minutes ago, SongbirdHollow said:

Yeah, I'm bothered that to Randall getting a foster kid is more about what it means to him than, you know, the kid. She is a person, not your redemption, dude. 

I think he's just paying it forward, wanting his good fortune to happen to anther human, male or female 

[ShadowFacts]

21 minutes ago, OtterMommy said:

As for Randall's foster story line...is it bad that the one concern I had was the bedroom situation at the Pearson's.  After all, we know they ONLY HAVE 3 BEDROOMS!  But it sounded like Tess and Annie (who are so frickin' adorable!) were sharing a room because they were nervous about Deja, so whoever gave up their room for William must have moved back in.  So, now the house has 4 bedrooms?  I guess that Beth could have given up her office for good, but--yeah, that's where my mind went.

Yeah, I wondered about that, too.  Maybe she moved her office to the basement, because she's so all in on the fostering/adoption.

32 minutes ago, Katy M said:

It was the second day.  She had woken the girls up the night before.

Whether it was the first night or the next day, my concern is that Randall's putting something out there for Deja that is not relevant.  How does it help her?  He meant well, certainly, but stating his history of feeling split because he never knew his bio parents is not her situation at all.  She knows her mother and expects to be reunited with her sooner than later.  I know it was meant to parallel the scene with Annie telling William about her sleepover, but that was more about William making a connection with his granddaughter that kept him there than believing what she was actually saying about how things would turn out well.  To me, at least.  The mirroring was not perfect and I was putting myself in Deja's shoes, wondering how I would take that whole spiel.  I would still be thinking about how soon I could get back with my mother, not how great it was that this stranger ended up with a wonderful life. 

[Blakeston]

1 hour ago, DoubleUTeeEff said:

I really liked that Randall just gave it to her straight. She should know what's happening when it is something directly related to her and how her life will be affected by it. She's 12 years old so she's old enough to understand what's going on. She mentioned that she was waiting for her mother to show up and take her back, she should know that is not what is happening this time. I'm sure it was hard to hear but she needed to know.

It's one thing to give it to her straight, but there's a time and a place. This was basically, "Welcome to our home, I'll tell you all about the wonderful family I grew up with while my wife goes through your things behind your back, and the second you feel comfortable, let me be the first to tell you that your mother is going to prison for a long, long time."

[Lady Calypso]

4 minutes ago, ShadowFacts said:

Whether it was the first night or the next day, my concern is that Randall's putting something out there for Deja that is not relevant.  How does it help her?  He meant well, certainly, but stating his history of feeling split because he never knew his bio parents is not her situation at all.  She knows her mother and expects to be reunited with her sooner than later.  I know it was meant to parallel the scene with Annie telling William about her sleepover, but that was more about William making a connection with his granddaughter that kept him there than believing what she was actually saying about how things would turn out well.  To me, at least.  The mirroring was not perfect and I was putting myself in Deja's shoes, wondering how I would take that whole spiel.  I would still be thinking about how soon I could get back with my mother, not how great it was that this stranger ended up with a wonderful life. 

I agree that it wasn't perfect and Randall might have gone about the conversation the wrong way, which is why Deja stormed out and threw the picture on the ground by the end, showcasing that she didn't just buy into what he was telling her. What Randall was trying to do was soften the bad news about her mom going to jail. We don't know the details, but I assume it's a lot longer this time around where she might be stuck in foster care for a while. What Deja was saying to Randall and Beth was that she had been through these situations where she goes into foster care for a bit (maybe just a day, maybe a week, maybe a few weeks) but her mom always comes back to take her home. So Randall giving her vague information on her mom certainly didn't help, and his message was lost because Deja was under the assumption, up to that point, that her mom would come back for her and she'd be out of that house sooner rather than later. 

So, I can see why Randall was saying what he was saying; he just wanted her to have that information sink in, to get her to believe that she would be ok, even though he was also breaking the news about her mom going to jail for a while. Randall has never had to handle a situation like this before, so I'm fine with him thinking that what he was saying would help. Which is why Randall let her go when she got pissed and stormed out. Him and Beth had realizations that the situation they're in is fragile, and that they can't get mad at Deja or try to push her to do something. So, Randall was trying to find a way to connect with Deja, knowing that she'd be around a lot longer than either of them probably expected, and I'm fine with that. 

[NeverLate]

18 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

I agree that it wasn't perfect and Randall might have gone about the conversation the wrong way, which is why Deja stormed out and threw the picture on the ground by the end, showcasing that she didn't just buy into what he was telling her. What Randall was trying to do was soften the bad news about her mom going to jail. We don't know the details, but I assume it's a lot longer this time around where she might be stuck in foster care for a while. What Deja was saying to Randall and Beth was that she had been through these situations where she goes into foster care for a bit (maybe just a day, maybe a week, maybe a few weeks) but her mom always comes back to take her home. So Randall giving her vague information on her mom certainly didn't help, and his message was lost because Deja was under the assumption, up to that point, that her mom would come back for her and she'd be out of that house sooner rather than later. 

So, I can see why Randall was saying what he was saying; he just wanted her to have that information sink in, to get her to believe that she would be ok, even though he was also breaking the news about her mom going to jail for a while. Randall has never had to handle a situation like this before, so I'm fine with him thinking that what he was saying would help. Which is why Randall let her go when she got pissed and stormed out. Him and Beth had realizations that the situation they're in is fragile, and that they can't get mad at Deja or try to push her to do something. So, Randall was trying to find a way to connect with Deja, knowing that she'd be around a lot longer than either of them probably expected, and I'm fine with that. 

I guess there is no right or wrong way We all see it differently, because of our own backgrounds. Nothing 

regarding emotions comes with a manual .

[ShadowFacts]

19 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

So, I can see why Randall was saying what he was saying; he just wanted her to have that information sink in, to get her to believe that she would be ok, even though he was also breaking the news about her mom going to jail for a while. Randall has never had to handle a situation like this before, so I'm fine with him thinking that what he was saying would help. Which is why Randall let her go when she got pissed and stormed out. Him and Beth had realizations that the situation they're in is fragile, and that they can't get mad at Deja or try to push her to do something. So, Randall was trying to find a way to connect with Deja, knowing that she'd be around a lot longer than either of them probably expected, and I'm fine with that. 

Like I said, I know he meant well.  I just think connections in real life are forged a little more slowly and organically than spilling your history in one soliloquy, but this is TV land and we see big dramatic shortcuts all the time.  I just wonder what the poor kid is going to make of the Thanksgiving Pilgrim Rick reenactment ritual.  She might become a runaway.  

[Katy M]

58 minutes ago, ShadowFacts said:

Whether it was the first night or the next day, my concern is that Randall's putting something out there for Deja that is not relevant.  How does it help her? 

I was just answering someone else's question.

[izabella]

1 hour ago, OtterMommy said:

Re the possible addiction plot:  I'm also in the "shit, I don't want to see that" camp.  It's not that I don't think this is the right show for it or that it doesn't fit with the character (sort of), but it is feeling like Sophie 2.0 to me.  We haven't had any indication up to this point that Kevin had any sort of addiction issue and then, boom, there it is.  I sort of feel like, with Kevin, the Fogelman et. al. don't really know what to do with him so they just keep throwing stuff to see what sticks.  As a viewer, it is frustrating because we don't really get a good grasp on his character or where he's going.

It makes sense that Jack's biological children would have addiction issues, and we know that Kate has a food addiction.  So, it isn't out of character for Kevin to have his own addiction, but the way they are trying to give it to us just doesn't seem organic.

I don't want to see a Kevin addiction story line, either.  I dreaded the foster kid story line, though, and that's turned out ok so far, so maybe the addition one won't irritate or bore me if I give it a chance.  But, still, I really, really just don't want to see it. 

Randall has two parents who were addicted to drugs, so he has just as much reason as Kate and Kevin to have addition issues, too.  Maybe that contributes to my loathing of adding yet another addiction story line.  It seems everyone in this family is addicted to something other than Randall and Rebecca.

[Katy M]

1 minute ago, izabella said:

It seems everyone in this family is addicted to something other than Randall and Rebecca.

Not chemically. But Randall's addicted to perfection.

[Kira53]

1 hour ago, bettername2come said:

Chrissy Metz looked so good in the scenes on the movie set. The makeup and black wardrobe looked great. I thought she looked like she'd lost weight, but judging by her final scene it may have just been the wardrobe.

Kevin said Kate was doing good with her weight loss so you got the right impression.  She does seem to have to lost weight.  Good for her. 

[Cardie]

7 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I loved that Deja knew to go to Tess and Annie for the real scoop on Randall and Beth.

The girls' savvy understanding of the power dynamics in the household was impressive--and hilarious.

[MelGoLightly]

15 hours ago, bettername2come said:

 

Enjoyed the flashback to Jack giving Kevin the necklace at the hospital and Kate showing up at the car window to tell him about Jack. Were they in the same station wagon we see Rebecca driving or do I just think all station wagons look alike? "He's just like you." *downs drugs* Shit. I don't want an addiction storyline for Kevin. I don't think it quite fits him and I don't want him to go through that.

 

This occurred to me just this morning and not while viewing last night.  I'm glad someone else noticed it. If it is the same station wagon (and we've only seen them with one car, so unless it's Sophie's it's safe to assume that it's the Pearsons') what does that mean for the fire & Jack's death as it pertains to the kids at Miguel's house scene? In that scene, the timing makes it appear that Randall & Kate are at Miguel's discussing how she needs to tell Kevin. Cut to Rebecca in the wagon in front of the burnt down house with Jack's belongings. But last night we see Kate finding Kevin in the wagon to tell him whatever she knows and Rebecca is apparently not around. Maybe the house burns down while Kevin is out with Sophie in the car and the kids go to Miguel's while Rebecca goes to the hospital (in the ambulance?) and Kate goes to find Kevin, they go back to Miguel's where Rebecca eventually returns then takes the car to the fire scene?  It's hurting my brain to figure out how that could work with the timeline we have seen. 

Help. 

[Natalie Wilson]

Anyone else notice the Fleet Foxes song "If You Need To, Keep Time On Me” playing during the last two minutes of the episode last night? The song is so good! 
https://open.spotify.com/track/7d0XkI4iJ32nxeFAHFXbLQ

[Lady Calypso]

7 minutes ago, MelGoLightly said:

This occurred to me just this morning and not while viewing last night.  I'm glad someone else noticed it. If it is the same station wagon (and we've only seen them with one car, so unless it's Sophie's it's safe to assume that it's the Pearsons') what does that mean for the fire & Jack's death as it pertains to the kids at Miguel's house scene? In that scene, the timing makes it appear that Randall & Kate are at Miguel's discussing how she needs to tell Kevin. Cut to Rebecca in the wagon in front of the burnt down house with Jack's belongings. But last night we see Kate finding Kevin in the wagon to tell him whatever she knows and Rebecca is apparently not around. Maybe the house burns down while Kevin is out with Sophie in the car and the kids go to Miguel's while Rebecca goes to the hospital (in the ambulance?) and Kate goes to find Kevin, they go back to Miguel's where Rebecca eventually returns then takes the car to the fire scene?  It's hurting my brain to figure out how that could work with the timeline we have seen. 

Help. 

So, I analyzed both flashback sequences (the one from 2x01 and then the quick flashback to Kevin and Kate). They are two different station wagons. Kevin wouldn't be able to drive anyway with his broken leg. His left leg, his driving leg, would be broken so even if we know that he has his license, he wouldn't be able to drive the family car, let alone Sophie's car, or her family's car. 

Also, if anyone can confirm because I was only glancing through briefly, but I think Kate is wearing the exact same outfit in both scenes (at least, the same shirt). Obviously, she's wearing a jacket and a hat in this episode's quick flashback, but I do think we're supposed to deduce that the 2x01 flashback with her and Randall crying at Miguel's, and tonight's quick flashback of Kate finding Kevin, is the same event, and I think they're trying to concur that it's the night of Jack's death. They could pull a fast one and drag the death out even longer, but I think, for now, I'm going to believe it's the night of his death. 

[Cardie]

8 minutes ago, MelGoLightly said:

 It's hurting my brain to figure out how that could work with the timeline we have seen. 

I think you must have it right. The whole family is at home, then Kevin takes the car for his date. Fire. Jack mortally injured. Rebecca to hospital in ambulance. Miguel called, takes kids to his house. (Or hospital, then his house after Jack dies.) Kate is driven/walks to their house to greet Kevin, then they go get Rebecca, who drops them back at Miguel's because she wants to go view the ruins of her house on her own.

I wonder how it was decided that Kate would get Jack's ashes. Ordinarily, I would think it would be Rebecca.

[AttackTurtle]

Randall is my favorite character; however I have always really liked Kevin.  I lost my father when I was seven and decades later, my cage still gets rattled every time someone mentions him to me.  The scene between Kevin and "Sly" completely captured that feeling for me....and honestly "Sly's" comment about time and being able to reach back and grab it was just heartbreaking.  So well done show....you finally got a sniffle from me.

[Katy M]

10 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

His left leg, his driving leg, would be broken so even if we know that he has his license, he wouldn't be able to drive the family car, let alone Sophie's car, or her family's car. 

Isn't your right leg your driving leg?  And, either way, can't you use the other in a pinch because one is broken? 

[Biggie B]

Quote

Isn't your right leg your driving leg?  And, either way, can't you use the other in a pinch because one is broken? 

Yes, if you drive an automatic car, you use only your right leg for both the brake and the gas. The left leg does nothing. However, unless you are incredibly limber, if your right leg was broken and in a cast, it would be just about impossible to use your left leg to drive. You'd have to snake it under your broken right leg, which, if in a cast, would pretty much be impossible, not to mention incredibly painful for both legs. Depending on how the cast is set on the broken right leg, you might not even be able to get in behind the wheel. It's painful even just thinking about it!

[WhosThatGirl]

I don’t know- I feel meh about this season so far. Last year I was so excited about every episode and now I’m just not. 

[wonderwoman]

2 hours ago, crocodile said:

 

I didn't like this episode

 

I was beginning to think that it was me...  

Other than the scene with William, which resonated (as they always do), I found this episode oddly disjointed. Part of it is having the siblings on opposite coasts. But it feels to me that such blatant efforts to connect the elements -- Jack's drinking, foreshadowing Kevin and pills -- actually lessen the emotional impact. As someone said upthread, there's a preachy aspect going on here, a need to over explain everything.

[tennisgurl]

I love that Sylvester Stallone is just popping up all over the place in the most seemingly random places. First as a space pirate, and now here! You know, I assumed that he was just going to show up for a Guest Cameo kind of deal, but he actually got some good material, and was actually here to act and not just make Rocky jokes. Really great use of a guest star. Sly seemed like a really good guy, and he played his scenes (especially with Kate) really well. 

Loved this episode, it got so many things right. I loved the flashbacks to Jake and Rebecca, and the issues they had reconnecting while dealing with Jacks drinking. Rebecca tried to do the Jack thing and be the perfect supportive one, and while it got off to a rocky (heh) start, it all worked out well. You cant force romance, you have to just let it happen. 

Poor Deja. You can tell she had had a really hard time, I hope things work out for her with Randall, Beth, and the adorable girls. They are seriously so cute, I love their scenes so much. I think Randall and Beth should have talked to the girls more about having a foster kid, but seeing the flashbacks to William, its clear the kids can adjust quickly. I dont think Beth was in the wrong looking through Dejas stuff, she needs to know whats in her house after all. It was also nice to connect it with the flashbacks of Randall trying to find his birth parents, and how Kate and Kevin came with him and went to check on him after it went badly. It was nice to see Keven and Randall getting along as teens. They certainly had issues, but I always thought they must have gotten along at some points. 

Kevin had a really great episode, even if I fear it is going to lead to even more drama in his story. Sadly, I totally think drug addiction would be in character for Kevin. He has low self esteem, easy access to drugs (being in the entertainment industry), and clearly has a family history of addiction. I didn't pick up on it, but after some other posters did, I also wondered if Kate's freaked out reaction to Kevin getting hurt was more about the pain pills he would take and the possibility of a relapse of previous problems. In that case, does only Kate now? 

[Biggie B]

Quote

I don’t know- I feel meh about this season so far. Last year I was so excited about every episode and now I’m just not. 

Some of the bloom is off the rose. Last season, it was all so new and novel. Every flashback revealed some new nugget of information about how this family was formed. We were shown the current-day characters very fully-formed but only given small, incremental glimpses to their past, and we anxiously awaited those scenes from the past, hoping they'd flesh out and answer questions about the present-day characters. Well...that gimmick has faded for me. I don't even care how or when Jack dies, because I already know he's going to die, and I already know that his death was utterly traumatic and has reverberated through the decades into almost every aspect of each character's life. I think I am still watching because I appreciate the actors themselves (well, some more than others). I vastly prefer the current parts of the show and my interest in the flashbacks has receded greatly. In this episode, I actually fast-forwarded through Jack and Rebecca's scenes during their date. Because truly, what did it matter? He still dies - no amount of re-connection between Jack and Rebecca is going to change that. I realize that each character's past has influenced how he or she is as an adult - I get that - but it's sort of wearing thin. The show is called "This Is Us," not "This Was Us." How many different times can we be shown or told that Rebecca and Jacks' marriage wasn't perfect, that Kate had weight/insecurity issues, that Kevin was sort of the odd child out, that Randall was a driven perfectionist seeking to be made whole? I'm more curious about what is happening now and what's going to happen. I want to see if Kate and Toby actually get married. I want to see what happens with Kevin's career and with Sophie. Certainly I want to see what happens with Randall and Beth and their family. As for Rebecca - she's the least compelling character to me. I wouldn't mind knowing how she and Miguel got together, but honestly...I'm not that interested and rarely think about it. This is just my subjective view of the show right now - it could change. I found this one episode to be moderately uninteresting and nowhere near as compelling as others have been for me. 

Edited October 11, 2017 by Biggie B

[Baltimore Betty]

I thought I was alone in thinking this season is starting off lack luster.  I feel like Randall and Beth fostering a child is a little bit like when the Brady Bunch adopted Cousin Oliver, fish out of water story line, meh.

[OtterMommy]

2 hours ago, Blakeston said:

It's one thing to give it to her straight, but there's a time and a place. This was basically, "Welcome to our home, I'll tell you all about the wonderful family I grew up with while my wife goes through your things behind your back, and the second you feel comfortable, let me be the first to tell you that your mother is going to prison for a long, long time."

I think what the writers were trying to do was set it up so that Randall could cushion the blow of her finding out her mother wasn't coming back for a long time, if at all.  However, if that was their attempt, it wasn't successful.

[camom]

I don't think Randall should have told her about her mother at all.  He wants to have a positive relationship with her, and that isn't going to help.  News like that should have come from the social worker, but later.  It was too soon to know what would happen.

Quote

 unless you are incredibly limber, if your right leg was broken and in a cast, it would be just about impossible to use your left leg to drive.

I remember when my dad broke his right leg.  It was in the 1960s and the front seat of the car was a bench seat.  He put his right leg over the hump in the middle and used his left foot on the pedals.  It would be more difficult in today's cars, but I think it could have been done in the Pearson's station wagon.

[crocodile]

55 minutes ago, Biggie B said:

Some of the bloom is off the rose. Last season, it was all so new and novel. Every flashback revealed some new nugget of information about how this family was formed. We were shown the current-day characters very fully-formed but only given small, incremental glimpses to their past, and we anxiously awaited those scenes from the past, hoping they'd flesh out and answer questions about the present-day characters. Well...that gimmick has faded for me. I don't even care how or when Jack dies, because I already know he's going to die, and I already know that his death was utterly traumatic and has reverberated through the decades into almost every aspect of each character's life. I think I am still watching because I appreciate the actors themselves (well, some more than others). I vastly prefer the current parts of the show and my interest in the flashbacks has receded greatly. In this episode, I actually fast-forwarded through Jack and Rebecca's scenes during their date. Because truly, what did it matter? He still dies - no amount of re-connection between Jack and Rebecca is going to change that. I realize that each character's past has influenced how he or she is as an adult - I get that - but it's sort of wearing thin. The show is called "This Is Us," not "This Was Us." How many different times can we be shown or told that Rebecca and Jacks' marriage wasn't perfect, that Kate had weight/insecurity issues, that Kevin was sort of the odd child out, that Randall was a driven perfectionist seeking to be made whole? I'm more curious about what is happening now and what's going to happen. I want to see if Kate and Toby actually get married. I want to see what happens with Kevin's career and with Sophie. Certainly I want to see what happens with Randall and Beth and their family. As for Rebecca - she's the least compelling character to me. I wouldn't mind knowing how she and Miguel got together, but honestly...I'm not that interested and rarely think about it. This is just my subjective view of the show right now - it could change. I found this one episode to be moderately uninteresting and nowhere near as compelling as others have been for me. 

There are stories from their pasts that I'm interested in seeing - Kevin's first foray into acting, Kevin & Sophie, Randall having more exposure to a black community at college, Randall choosing to live n an all-white neighborhood, even Rebecca adjusting to all three kids living home at once, or Rebecca falling for Miguel - but those are not the ones that are being shown.

[Katy M]

4 minutes ago, crocodile said:

There are stories from their pasts that I'm interested in seeing - Kevin's first foray into acting, Kevin & Sophie, Randall having more exposure to a black community at college, Randall choosing to live n an all-white neighborhood, even Rebecca adjusting to all three kids living home at once, or Rebecca falling for Miguel - but those are not the ones that are being shown.

I don't think we're going to see anything from the past, or at least not much, post-Jack.  I understand there's a clear 3 year plan that they *say* (we'll see) that they're going to stick to.  And I fear that means that Jack will finally die in the Series (Season 3) finale.  Talk about dragging something out.

[Crs97]

I didn't love this episode.  I don't mind Rebecca and Miguel's ex wife still being friends, and I didn't think her advice was all that terrible.  Maybe not have sex, but get back to focusing on some intimacy before you just become roommates.  Without her suggestion, Rebecca would not have recreated the date that at least got them talking again.  I am also reminded that Melissa Gilbert was friendly with Bruce Boxleitner's ex wife, who encouraged them to date.  

When Stallone showed up, husband just kept asking, "How many face lifts has he had?"  Took me out of the emotional moments.

Kate bugged because she could tell she was upsetting Kevin and he asked her to stop and she just kept talking.  I hate that.  I was looking forward to Kevin being good in the film, and she totally sabotaged his second scene after Sly inadvertently sabotaged the first.  Now he will have a drug problem?  Disappointing.

I haven't decided how I feel about the fostering storyline.  I completely agree with the poster who said the show was folding in on itself by dragging out Jack's death.  They need to cover it and move on.

[Dreamboat Annie]

Quote

I wonder how it was decided that Kate would get Jack's ashes. Ordinarily, I would think it would be Rebecca.

I don't recall, but are we absolutely sure Jack and Rebecca were still married at the time of Jack's death? 

 

I tried to get into the fostering storyline, to no avail.  I just don't care about it.  I wish I did.  It's not like we weren't given enough backstory to lead up to it.  The William/Annie moment was touching.  I just would rather they gave Randall and Beth something else to do this season.  Although I loved the William story last season, I think there should have been at least one season off before another "let's have a complete stranger move into our house".

[JudyObscure]

3 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

So, I can see why Randall was saying what he was saying; he just wanted her to have that information sink in, to get her to believe that she would be ok, even though he was also breaking the news about her mom going to jail for a while. Randall has never had to handle a situation like this before, so I'm fine with him thinking that what he was saying would help. Which is why Randall let her go when she got pissed and stormed out. Him and Beth had realizations that the situation they're in is fragile, and that they can't get mad at Deja or try to push her to do something. So, Randall was trying to find a way to connect with Deja, knowing that she'd be around a lot longer than either of them probably expected, and I'm fine with that

I'm fine with everything they did, too, even to having the baby monitor in Tess and Annie's room.  (Randall must have heard the girls say Beth was the boss. Heh.)  There used to be some ad for the Big Brother/Sister group that reassured people that you didn't have to be perfect to work with a child, just  well meaning and present.  Randall may have been talking a lot about himself and maybe it wasn't the best time for his story, but the important thing is that Deja learned that these people want to understand her, are happy to take the time to sit down and talk with her, and  are not going to get mean or violent toward her.  She was scared of Randall and now she's just a little mad at him.  Big step forward.

I liked the Rebecca and Jack story, too.  So often TV tries to tell us that men are 24/7 sex machines and not real people who aren't always able to perform. Rebecca was as likeable as I've ever seen her with her good humor about being rejected, laughing at her "plan," and opening the door for Jack to talk about how hard it was for him to "do the steps." 

This was one of the best episodes  for me.

[OtterMommy]

1 hour ago, camom said:

I don't think Randall should have told her about her mother at all.  He wants to have a positive relationship with her, and that isn't going to help.  News like that should have come from the social worker, but later.  It was too soon to know what would happen.

Perhaps someone who knows more about the foster system can speak more to this, but I agree that Randall shouldn't have been the one to tell her.  It should have been her caseworker.  Having the foster parent tell a newly placed foster child this sort of information just doesn't seem like something that would happen.

[SunnyBeBe]

3 hours ago, Kira53 said:

Kevin said Kate was doing good with her weight loss so you got the right impression.  She does seem to have to lost weight.  Good for her. 

I didn't see that she has lost any weight.  I could be wrong, but, I suppose that if it's an integral part of the storyline and the actor does not accomplish it, you just have to improvise, cut around it, pretend, etc.  That's one reason I think it would be stressful to play a character like hers.

[dju]

43 minutes ago, Dreamboat Annie said:

I don't recall, but are we absolutely sure Jack and Rebecca were still married at the time of Jack's death? 

 

 

I know it's repeatedly used as an argument, but I think it's pretty valid to say that given she's wearing the necklace in the present day, that they were still married and doing well when he passed away, and that present-day Rebecca carries Jack with her in that respect. Given the state of Jack and Kate's relationship, I buy that she would be the one with got to keep the ashes and that Rebecca would be okay with that.

In the Vanity Fair article someone posted earlier, it says: 'Previous episodes have made reference to Jack’s Rocky fandom'. The only thing I can think of is the boxing and that's stretching it a bit, were there other references?

Edited October 11, 2017 by dju

[SunnyBeBe]

Well, Kate has said that other people MAKE her behave badly.  I don't think she gets a pass though.  She should be responsible for her actions, regardless.  

Can someone explain to me why Jack didn't want to get down with his wife in the car?  I know what he said, but, what does that have to do with getting laid?  I'm a sensitive person, but, after it's been awhile and the wife you adore is ready.....seemed contrived to me. 

And maybe, I'm a big baby, but, I would NEVER in a million years drink alcohol and take pain pills together  I mean......really?  Isn't that how people die?  That was alcohol and pain pills Kevin was taking right? 

Edited October 11, 2017 by SunnyBeBe

[Lady Calypso]

2 hours ago, Katy M said:

Isn't your right leg your driving leg?  And, either way, can't you use the other in a pinch because one is broken? 

Oops, sorry. I don't know why I said left. I did mean the right leg, which would still be difficult to drive with, especially in the cast that they showed him in. So that's why I assume Sophie picked Kevin up in her car. 

6 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Can someone explain to me why Jack didn't want to get down with his wife in the car?  I know what he said, but, what does that have to do with getting laid?  I'm a sensitive person, but, after it's been awhile and the wife yo adore is ready.....seemed contrived to me. 

If I remember correctly, he told Rebecca that he didn't want their first time in a while to be like that; he wanted it to be more special, and I think he mentioned he didn't want to feel the way he was feeling while having sex. 

[mtlchick]

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I thought it was a brilliant addition, I'd be like Kate, non stop talking,  but anxious and overcome happy ,all rolled into one.LOL

Part of me is convinced that she was told to memorize the lines but not rehearse with him so when she did see him to say her lines, it would be a natural "OMG YOU ARE STALLONE!"  and it was done in one take.  It probably wasn't but it sure felt like it!

[Aloeonatable]

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 In this episode, I actually fast-forwarded through Jack and Rebecca's scenes during their date. Because truly, what did it matter? He still dies - no amount of re-connection between Jack and Rebecca is going to change that. I realize that each character's past has influenced how he or she is as an adult - I get that - but it's sort of wearing thin. The show is called "This Is Us," not "This Was Us." How many different times can we be shown or told that Rebecca and Jacks' marriage wasn't perfect, that Kate had weight/insecurity issues, that Kevin was sort of the odd child out, that Randall was a driven perfectionist seeking to be made whole? I'm more curious about what is happening now and what's going to happen. I want to see if Kate and Toby actually get married. I want to see what happens with Kevin's career and with Sophie. Certainly I want to see what happens with Randall and Beth and their family.

We are who we are from the experiences we have and the life we've led for our whole life. I love Jack and Rebecca, their children at all their ages. I love the journey this family is taking me on. 

 

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And I fear that means that Jack will finally die in the Series (Season 3) finale.  Talk about dragging something out.

I think we'll actually see Jack die this season. Maybe even before Christmas. 

 

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Well...that gimmick has faded for me.

Maybe because I don't look at the story structure, how the past colors the present, as a gimmick, I actually love this season as much as the first. 

[NutMeg]

Yeah, add me to the list of those who found this episode so-so.

*Kate* is now recommending therapy to Kevin? Kate? Who should be in therapy? who couldn't talk about how her dad died but has no problem telling Kevin he should get into therapy to deal with the loss? Is the one minute drumming session all the therapy Kate needed? <eyes rolling very far>

Then we have Randall, who of course is being St Randall, and focusing on his story rather than on the person who's in front of him and on her needs, and Beth being all supportive, of him more than of the child she insisted they foster.

I also have a problem with the stories of the three siblings. Sure, we have flashbacks that remind us they are connected (and the actors playing them as teens are doing an AMAZING job), but without those flashbacks, it's like we're watching two different shows, and I'm getting wary of this lack of connectivity - even last episode, when all three were at the same place at the same time, shenanigans happened and they never interacted? No wonder I'm enjoying their teen selves more (and BTW the actress who plays young Kate is amazing!).

I'm all for Kevin to - finally - get his day in the sun, but addiction, really? I know they're prepping us with the Kate line and the previous injury, but it seems very unoriginal.

Now, back to the past, I feel that the Jack AA / Rebecca story is very well done. I know of a couple who went through the same (he in AA, her supporting him), and sadly they never recovered from it and are now apart, so that felt real to me. But still, not enough to get me really invested, which is what is missing for me this season.  

[Dreamboat Annie]

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I know it's repeatedly used as an argument

Oh, I was honestly not aware of that.

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 I think it's pretty valid to say that given she's wearing the necklace in the present day, that they were still married and doing well when he passed away, and that present-day Rebecca carries Jack with her in that respect. Given the state of Jack and Kate's relationship, I buy that she would be the one with got to keep the ashes and that Rebecca would be okay with that.

I hope so.  And about the ashes I would buy it too.  I was just mentioning a possibility to Cardie, who thought that ordinarily it would be Rebecca who would have the ashes.  And ordinarily, I think it probably would.

[debraran]

I can see Kate having the ashes, maybe it wasn't from the beginning but after her Mom got married. Having his urn might have been not necessary, she had his necklace,  his heart, her memories.

I always noticed no matter how many times Kate blamed herself,  no one says, "No you weren't" or "No one blames you" I feel it's to keep the mystery up a bit.  There's no kindness toward her mother if she really caused her husband's death, no guilty platitudes.

I like that Jack didn't just want to have a date with Rebecca. Many alcoholics and other addicts are very depressed and that's the last thing on their mind. I have a friend who says it has been months because her husband is dealing with his addictions and AA and trying to not need medication.  If he was happy and carefree, it wouldn't really be real.

[Haleth]

About Jack's ashes, I think it's understandable that Kate would take them after Rebecca and Miguel married. 

[Conotocarious]

I think the fact that people can binge watch series now is adding to the frustration of how slowly this show peels back layers. People just want to know and they want to know now. Not in a few months. Fortunately for me, I don't binge watch anything and I rarely watch TV shows at all so I'm just happy to be watching something I enjoy.

Edited October 11, 2017 by Conotocarious

[JasminePhyllisia]

I like seeing the big three together as teens, there for each other although even then Randall was a bit of a third wheel.  As adults there seems to be a gap in terms of any sort of relationship between Kate and Randall (and Beth).  I rarely see her interacting with either of them or their kids.  It would be interesting to see if any sort of bond ever develops between her and Deja.  But unlikely.

[Katy M]

1 minute ago, JasminePhyllisia said:

I like seeing the big three together as teens, there for each other although even then Randall was a bit of a third wheel.  As adults there seems to be a gap in terms of any sort of relationship between Kate and Randall (and Beth).  I rarely see her interacting with either of them or their kids.  It would be interesting to see if any sort of bond ever develops between her and Deja.  But unlikely.

And, I think a  lot of that either comes from the geographic divide or the writers just don't know how to put them together.  We know that Kate was the one that apprised Randall of the Manny situation.  And, I think it was implied that for the last few years they were in regular contact and Randall and Kevin not so much.

[Clanstarling]

19 hours ago, Artsda said:

I found the younger Rebecca and Miguel's wife lunch eating scene to seem more modern than 20 years ago. Sipping wine, eating a big salad at an outdoor patio? I remembered it wasn't present time when I saw the car Rebecca was driving to "Jack Pearson" Jack.

It wasn't the dark ages. I was eating big salads at restaurants more than 30 years ago (I didn't do the wine, because I don't drink at lunch - well, except when I got laid off and someone else was driving - which was also 30 or so years ago).

4 hours ago, AttackTurtle said:

Randall is my favorite character; however I have always really liked Kevin.  I lost my father when I was seven and decades later, my cage still gets rattled every time someone mentions him to me.  The scene between Kevin and "Sly" completely captured that feeling for me....and honestly "Sly's" comment about time and being able to reach back and grab it was just heartbreaking.  So well done show....you finally got a sniffle from me.

I wondered how hard it was for him to say those lines, given that he'd lost his son some years ago. It was pretty touching.

2 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I didn't see that she has lost any weight.  I could be wrong, but, I suppose that if it's an integral part of the storyline and the actor does not accomplish it, you just have to improvise, cut around it, pretend, etc.  That's one reason I think it would be stressful to play a character like hers.

When you're large, it takes an incredibly long time for weight loss to be visible (in person, much less on tv) to people who aren't intimate with you (and even for those who are). I wouldn't expect for it to be noticeable for a while if she's losing in a healthful manner and not like the crazy unhealthy ways they do on The Biggest Loser.

I really liked that Kevin's story is getting more involved, even if I'm not keen on a drug problem story line. The actor now has more to do than look handsome and a bit clueless, and he's really stepping up. 

Edited October 11, 2017 by Clanstarling

[Cardie]

All shows that utilize a flashback structure risk diminishing returns. When we know nearly nothing about the present-day characters, compelling revelations can inform every one of the scenes in the past. The more we kn ow, the more they strain to seem relevant. Soon you're at the point of finding out the story behind Jack Shepard's tattoos on Lost. TIU has another problem in that its star is gone for twenty years of the present-day characters' lives but must continue to appear in the past. This diminishes important depictions of the formative years of their twenties, although the show has no choice but to get into these as time goes on. That's one reason they are probably dragging out the depiction of Jack's death and its immediate impact.

If Rebecca thought Jack's ashes should be with the kids after her remarriage, I wonder if there was any competition or if all agreed that Kate had a special relationship with him and should keep them.

[Cementhead]

9 hours ago, Conotocarious said:

I am enjoying this season as much as last year. I see no drop off at all. 

I agree.  In fact, I am enjoying this season even more than last year's.

[dju]

2 hours ago, Dreamboat Annie said:

Oh, I was honestly not aware of that.

I hope so.  And about the ashes I would buy it too.  I was just mentioning a possibility to Cardie, who thought that ordinarily it would be Rebecca who would have the ashes.  And ordinarily, I think it probably would.

Sorry Dreamboat Annie, I hope I wasn't coming off as patronizing. I've seen the 'Rebecca wearing the necklace = positive state of their marriage' argument floating around here and on other forums so didn't want to come across as though I was providing new information but also shouldn't have assumed it's a known argument.

From personal experience, I would understand that Rebecca wouldn't want the ashes because it would be too painful and that the necklace is what keeps her connected to Jack. I think if she did, in fact, want them in her possession, her remarriage wouldn't stand in the way of that. Knowing Kate has them and is keeping them safe and how vitally important they are to her for me is what would matter Rebecca. Kevin has Jack's necklace and after what we learnt from him in this episode, wouldn't want to be anywhere near the ashes. Randall not having them or fighting to have them makes sense for me because I've gotten the impression that he doesn't need something tactile to feel close to his father. There are pictures of his father all over his house and we've seen him openly discuss his father with Rebecca (and with others) which provides another form of connection to him that Kate or Kevin sadly don't have (for the time being). 

[AmandaPanda]

We also don't necessarily know for certain that Kate is the only one with Jack's ashes. Each of the kids and Rebecca could have been given some of his ashes.