S16.E09: A Little Avant Garde

[anniebird]

17 hours ago, MuMuGuy said:

looked like something Mom from Futurama would've worn to a gala.

Isn't that what avant-garde is supposed to look like?

[babs j.]

I'm WAY past the age to have children and I don't know what the young folks are doing these days so I had never heard of Shopkins until last night.  When I was about 10 my aunt gave me a Barbie Doll.  It was so long ago that Barbie was not famous.  It's not the doll that runs into money, it's the accessories.

[Tabbygirl521]

3 hours ago, PrincessSteel said:

Depends on what fabric was used. I give Michael props for caring about the comfort of his model. His concern meant that he had to make an entire second piece during a very tight time frame. 

 

I think that you are reacting to the fact that nearly nekkid images of this model were aired. That isn't on Michael. Of necessity, models are nude or nearly so all the time in the workroom. The decision to film and air the model in a transparent bodysuit (uncensored) was made by the producers, not the designer. 

Oh, I don't blame Michael - I really did have two questions. Why that fabric choice (I STILL doubt it's efficacy), and what the hell, editors? The poor girl's nipples were plainly visible on HDTV. Seemed extra exploitative. 

[Michichick]

4 hours ago, wings707 said:

I wonder if Georgina Chapman will be a judge this season, she often is.  

She was already on this season, for the "models off duty" challenge.

[Tabbygirl521]

33 minutes ago, amazingracefan said:

Yeh the twins face off challenge wasn't really needed, as it was obvious Shawn did the worse one I thought.  That approach backfired anyway as they didn't bother completing it, so the producers could only use it as a pointless cliffhanger. 

I suppose Batani had already been given one chance.  Amy was unlucky they made this a double elimination, normally they do that when they think it's one of the worst performances they have seen, but here they were full of praise for the general effort here.

 

And again we were given a teaser of a different kind of challenge, clothes for children (just like we had with the male models previously).  But they are unlikely to ever challenge designers like that again anymore unfortunately, much to the designers' delight.  It was basically an avant-garde challenge, the child aspect wasn't really that important at all.

The twin-off was BS from The get-go. Shawn had already said on the runway that she herself should be the one to go if their team lost. 

[Wings]

9 minutes ago, Michichick said:

She was already on this season, for the "models off duty" challenge.

Oh, I forgot about that.  

[latetotheparty]

Honestly, the whole twins drama went down pretty much as I expected it would. 

Back when we were speculating how they'd be eliminated, my preferred scenario was exactly what we got:  being the bottom pair of a team challenge and each of them having to defend their right to stay. Then I realized rhat wouldn't give me what I wanted because Shawn would sacrifice herself to her sister. It's been apparent for a while that, appearances notwithstanding, Claire is the leader of their little parade of two. 

Once that all happened I figured Claire would be a shoo-in for the winner of the Dixiecup challenge if she sent anything remotely acceptable down the runway because these producers love the last to first storyline almost as much as they love workroom drama. (See Margarita and Michael just from this year alone.). I've long given up the idea that the iwinners are determined but sincere judging alone. And it would have gone down exactly like that if not for Michael. Good job, Michael. 

I took a several-year hiatus from this show because I just couldn't deal with the bullshit anymore.  Came back this year on a whim. I think I'm done. PR haslost pretty much everything it once was. 

[BlackberryJam]

1 hour ago, phoenix780 said:

I can't get there with you. I don't disagree with what you're saying, but for me it just felt so self-serving that I can't get to a place where I see this specific instance as something to encourage. I guess I think that motive matters, so finally speaking out because you're jealous or you're the victim of the copying, whatever, isn't something I applaud. That may be wrong on my part and I'll have to rethink it. Also, my opinion is admittedly tainted because I have a pet peeve about people speaking a different language to hide a conversation, and I remember Margarita throwing a model under the bus spectacularly a few weeks back, so I'm already not feeling either her or Michael. 

I understand, but if we require all of those to speak out to be pure of intentions, act with only clean hands, receive no benefit from speaking out, and ...be likable, well, that's the culture we have now and it's a problem. I've been guilty of that as well, "Why didn't he say something sooner?" and "I just don't like the way she went about disclosing" and then I minimize the allegation. And that is wrong of me. So very very wrong of me. 

Ultimately, Claire cheated, she broke the rules, and was rightfully removed from the competition for breaking those rules, no matter that the disclosure of her rule-breaking came in a classless manner from dislikable people. 

[Tabbygirl521]

52 minutes ago, babs j. said:

I wonder if Georgina will still have to be introduced as the beautiful (or is it lovely?) Georgina Chapman?

"The Tragic Georgina Chapman."

[Elizabette]

I absolutely LOVED Kentaro’s look. He is fabulously talented and so funny and sweet. He is definitely this seasons much needed palette cleanser in a shit show season thus far. 

[Miss Ruth]

1 hour ago, ichbin said:

They are two attractive, intelligent girls

I guess that's in the eye of the beholder.

[Wings]

51 minutes ago, babs j. said:

I'm WAY past the age to have children and I don't know what the young folks are doing these days so I had never heard of Shopkins until last night.  When I was about 10 my aunt gave me a Barbie Doll.  It was so long ago that Barbie was not famous.  It's not the doll that runs into money, it's the accessories.

I was past the stage of playing with dolls when Barbie came out!  I have 4 grandchildren and they have never mentioned Shopkins. 

They are made by Moose Toys out of Australia.  I think they are trying to make them happen here in time for Christmas thus the product placement.   

4 minutes ago, Elizabette said:

I absolutely LOVED Kentaro’s look. He is fabulously talented and so funny and sweet. He is definitely this seasons much needed palette cleanser in a shit show season thus far. 

I agree, he is adorable and talented. 

The rest of this season is going to be much better without the twins sucking all the energy out of the room.  

[enoughcats]

3 hours ago, wings707 said:

but they have 2 children together. 

I don't know any details of the children's gestation, but others in the Long Island moneyed set depend on surrogacy to keep their figures.

[Wings]

4 minutes ago, enoughcats said:

I don't know any details of the children's gestation, but others in the Long Island moneyed set depend on surrogacy to keep their figures.

Sure but my point was that if the marriage was a business merger they probably would not have had kids either way.  

Edited October 13, 2017 by wings707

[PamelaMaeSnap]

18 hours ago, Beaner said:

He did not incorporate any of the ideas of his young partner. Wasn't that the whole challenge?

That is what really bothered me the most. And I actually like Brandon (not as a designer but he seems like a good guy). But that design, while being pretty much a mishmash of everything he does every week, had ZERO ZERO LESS THAN ZERO to do with ANYTHING his young partner asked for or suggested. He admitted as much on the runway, to his credit. But the judges just acted like he hadn't said a word and gushed about the folds or whatever those upside down nun wimples were. I mean, he didn't even go with something brown! That he wasn't B3 to me is VERY telling ... it would have been easy enough to say, "Well, you know what, Brandon, you absolutely did not address this challenge at all so you're B3 but you're safe" instead of putting him in the T4 where he had no business at all being. But no, heaven forfend they say anything remotely critical of their darling. 

I think I love Kentaro even more than ever after this episode. He just cracks me up and is so adorable. Plus I actually loved his design even though it was very simple ... I suspect we're looking at a Brothers F2 and that's fine with me because none of the others have been SO amazing or consistent that I could enthusiastically argue in favor of them over the long haul, but I really hope Kentaro is the winner because I like that this late in the season he's making a concerted effort two weeks in a row to go out of his box. Brandon meanwhile is crawling further and further into his, or else simply is such a one-trick pony (no matter how much they may like that one trick) that he has nowhere to GO out of his box. 

I knew Amy was toast from the first minute or so in ... until this episode, I kept forgetting she even existed and we knew NOTHING about her. She was a non-entity. A total cipher. Once they showed her emotion about her daughter and we actually got a talking head with her, it was "so long, Amy." And wow, Batani's outfit looked like something I'd whip up when I was four and raided my mom's scarf drawers and tied crap together to be a pirate. Way to make the most of that last-minute absolution. (I had not noticed before how really drop-dead gorgeous Monique is, BTW).

I wonder if the double-elimination was based on the fact that they score the outfits and they literally came out tied on every vote? They were equally dreadful. 

I was actually in the dark as to whether Michael's outfit would be top or bottom ... I am actually glad he won but ... well, it was tacky but fun and exactly what his poppet wanted. And while I am not a fan of Margarita, I thought her dress was gorgeous (would make a great wedding dress and actually reminds me a lot of a gown I saw on Say Yes to the Dress which I only remember because my niece wore it at her wedding ... in the way it flowed ... but I LOVE LOVE LOVED her sparkuly material! Very modern day Cinderella.) And while I can't imagine anyone on this earth ever wearing Ayana's get-up (I got Alice in Wonderland on acid if that's not redundant), I give her HUGE props for going that far out of her zone, really tackling the challenge with gusto, and having the awesome Liris to bring that baby home!

[becauseIsaidso]

Worst thing in this episode by extension, and the last, was having to watch the ever-holier-than-thou-Yolanda-Foster-Hadid-whichever-ex--has-the-most-money demonstrate that she is exactly the money-grubbing fame-whore many of us have always suspected. I pity her daughters, yet even more, I pity her son. Previously I had thought PR had scraped the bottom of the barrel in their selection of judges, now I am absolutely certain.

[HurricaneVal]

All through this episode, all I could think of was that poor twee "Hello Kitty" Taiwanese designer who was first eliminated watching this from home and sobbing "This was MY challenge!"

(Repeating my post from another board:)

I don't understand the lavish tongue baths and praise that Brandon's and Margarita's got on the runway. Brandon's was just more of his same stuff--good stuff, but it didn't really fit the challenge. Margarita's was...well, Margarita's was...well, a bunch of bunched up fabric that was floatier and less colorful than Batani's bunch of bunched up fabric. I don't understand how Amy got that dull mess from "Shopkins" and "Avant Garde" but OK. It is like she vaguely heard something about avant garde design somewhere, and there always seems to be a dramatic high sweeping poufy collar neck thing so she did that.

Ayana's and Michael's were the most faithful to the inspirations. Personally, I felt that Ayana deserved the win--not only was it spectacular and fit the definition of "wearable art" but I could very easily see her piece made out of hot pink injection molded plastic to snap onto a little plastic doll. Ayana really stretched herself with that, and she was justifiably happy with it. I thought Michael's was fine, and did fit the mold of avant garde and his concept of melted disco ball fit the Shopkin doll very well, but it was a completely one-way outfit. All the look was at the front. When the model turned around, the back was just plain, boring, silver sequined jumpsuit with a horribly obvious zipper going up the back. I feel designs should be 360 deg., Ayana's was and Michael's was not.

[becauseIsaidso]

10 hours ago, tessat said:

I was shocked Michael won - when I looked at that I thought someone with elephantitis. It was totally different from the look he first drew and was horrible across her chest. I thought for sure Brandon was going to be in the bottom three. I personally like the guy but it's the same thing from him everytime and I saw nothing Avante Gard. I thought Anya, Kenya and Kentaro were going to be the top three.

I really thought pink bow uside-downcupcake should have been the winner - especially with the interactiveness of that great model! - hang the cost of making the winning design over into  a shopkins-whatever - it WAS the best - IMO, of course. And I don't even like most of the other designer's stuff! I could see the point behind melting disco ball, once it was explained, but it was not as clear as the other. 

I have become jaded enuf to think the win HAD to go to either M or M as a sort of vindication of what they had been saying about Claire - and most likely the twinny. So, of course, production went with the one that would be cheaper to reproduce! 

And what a total WASTE of my time to have those two cheaters taking the place of some two otherwise deserving designers who didn't get the call because of the 'twin' thing. Get a grip, PR - you have fallen TOOOOOOOO much below what you were when you were on Bravo.

AND I can't BELIEVE I have actually help up bravo as being a source of quality programming - goddess help me.

OTOH, another show that really gets my goat about the cheating is TC - more than once I have heard one judge or the other say, at judges table, that they DON"T CARE what goes on in the kitchen. Well, you'd better believe that if I had the talent and skills to be a cheftestant I would be screaming about any shenanigans in the kitchen - tampering with oven temps, ingredients, etc - cuz that crap is JUST NOT what a cooking competition should be about.  Hence my preference for Chopped, Masterchef (goddess help me) and The Great British Baking Show ( crème de la crème, IMNSHO)!

[seacliffsal]

When she was speaking with just the other designers, Claire kept emphasizing that "it was just a tank top."  Then, with Tim she added "and the crotch of a pair of pants."  We may never know the true extent of her cheating.  I busted one of my students this last week for cheating, and he refused to admit it until I started showing him my multiple pieces of evidence (I always find the internet sources and show them directly to the students who cheat-and send the urls to the parents in an email).  However, my student is a high schooler while Claire is close to 30-she should have demonstrated more maturity than that of a high schooler (well, and she should not have resorted to cheating in the first place).  What really irks me though is that Claire was total "ms defiance" when she previously had been in the bottom; she specifically stated that she would not thank the judges for keeping her in the competition and giving her another chance.  Well, after the cheating was exposed it really shows her to be quite immature and ungrateful.  She should have been appreciative AF that she was being allowed to stay in the competition while breaking the rules of the competition.  Her entitlement to be on PR is unbelievable.  She felt she deserved to always be in the top (per her many talking heads) and that her cheating was acceptable as "it was only a tank top."  Yep, special snowflake syndrome to the 100th degree.

Oh, and it was delicious when the editors showed Michael complaining about Brandon asking Kentaro about his design and then the next scene was Michael asking Margurita about his design.

[PamelaMaeSnap]

2 hours ago, amazingracefan said:

Yeh the twins face off challenge wasn't really needed, as it was obvious Shawn did the worse one I thought.  That approach backfired anyway as they didn't bother completing it, so the producers could only use it as a pointless cliffhanger. 

I thought ... and as usual I qualify this by saying my memory is not as reliable as it once was ... that the reason given for the twins' showdown ... because they couldn't say "Ratings! Gold!" was not that they couldn't decide which one that particular challenge was the weaker one and who'd been responsible for it, but that they knew they worked together a lot (which also leads me to believe that they were VERY well aware of all the "working together" they'd been doing unofficially in prior weeks) and as such they wanted a challenge where there was very definitively NO sharing, NO helping, NO working together so they could be sure to send home the weaker link.

[PrincessSteel]

2 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

While I think this is often true - it's no accident that Yolanda managed to squeeze out three children in her short marriage - I've read that Georgina's parents are billionaires.  I believe Georgina that she didn't know Weinstein was assaulting women, but she had to know he was a cheating dog.  Some women are just attracted to powerful men, even when they themselves come from a very affluent world, and said man is a dog to women.  I wonder if Weinstein reminds her of her father.  We often marry our fathers even if our fathers are alcoholics, cheaters, abusive, etc.

People get married for all sorts of reasons. It isn't always a love match. That said, couples can have an understanding: Fool around if you must but don't embarrass me. Ol' Harv couldn't possibly be more of an embarrassment right now. 

 

Back to this ep: I didn't love Kentaro's design this week but I love him. I want him in the finals just because he is a damn delight. If Brandon doesn't make it to the finals (and I think he is on the bubble), I would love seeing him come back to assist his brother during the inevitable Fashion Week surprise challenge. 

[HunterHunted]

5 hours ago, Sarnia said:

Brandon is also growing on me. If we accept that straps are his trademark, I think he's growing from episodes to episodes and he has a personnal vision. I would not be surprised if he won the whole thing (I'm not quite sure who else could, I don't think any one of them is a very talented and original designer, except maybe Kentaro).

Someone on Jezebel said Brandon's clothing looked British designer Craig Green. It really does. Brandon's trademark isn't that original.

https://craig-green.com/collections/aw16-runway

Edited October 13, 2017 by HunterHunted

[Wings]

3 minutes ago, HunterHunted said:

Someone on Jezebel said Brandon's clothing looked British designer Craig Green. It really does. His trademark isn't that original.

https://craig-green.com/collections/aw16-runway

I don't see this designer as the same at all.  There are a lot of designers who make alternative men's clothing.  Just because they are not the more  traditional wear doesn't mean they are all the same.  

[HunterHunted]

4 minutes ago, wings707 said:

I don't see this designer as the same at all.  There are a lot of designers who make alternative men's clothing.  Just because they are not the more  traditional wear doesn't mean they are all the same.  

I don't know if you scrolled all of the way through, but Craig Green also does those asymmetrical button closures and the long ties. It looks clearly inspired by Green to me, just as I thought Michael's was inspired by Comme de Garcon.

[Wings]

19 minutes ago, HunterHunted said:

I don't know if you scrolled all of the way through, but Craig Green also does those asymmetrical button closures and the long ties. It looks clearly inspired by Green to me, just as I thought Michael's was inspired by Comme de Garcon.

Oh, I didn't scroll.  brb  Lol

ETA.  I see that now.  I still like him, Kentaro, too.  As the judges and Tim said, designers inspire each other.  LOL.  How is that for defense for one of my favorites!  

Edited October 14, 2017 by wings707

[BlackberryJam]

Brandon has a definite style, as does Kentaro. I’m sure both are referential. I look at all of Kentaro’s work and think, “ballet practice wear done impeccably.” That doesn’t make what he’s doing any less interesting. 

[jackjill89]

17 hours ago, dwarmed said:

What the hell happened to Tim's comments in the season trailer, "This entire thing disgusts me. It was unprofessional, unseemly, atrocious." Of course, a lot of the crying shots were from other episodes, not to give away too much, but Tim's outfit was the same as what he was wearing during this episode. Were those comments directed at the designers for making a scene on the runway or was it about cheating? I feel totally ripped off that we didn't get the full Tim Gunn righteous tirade in the episode. Lame, PR.

I think M&M's major beef was that the twins were cheating by not actually designing, but making exact copies of existing clothes, either that they owned or the models owned or other designers' work. They were particularly unhappy that this copying was being rewarded on a design show. Unfortunately, the judges didn't give a rat's ass about that. M&M were lucky they had the actual rule-breaking by using a tape measure in the hotel to pull out of their back pocket. However, that was NOT what was bothering them the most.

I trust Amy's interview that the designers were reporting cheating to production before and they weren't doing anything about it. Michael forced the producers' hands by walking off the runway (or maybe the producers staged it that way). Anyway, if that is all true, I can't really fault them for the way they handled it. The edit makes it appear that they kept it to themselves until they were upset by Claire's win, but that may just be a fiction for drama. I can blame M&M being phony as hell, with their 'I didn't mean for this to happen' bullshit. Classic passive-aggressive nonsense.

I was surprised that Claire admitted to cheating so readily, but it was clear that she was arrogant enough to think it was no big deal. She had the annoyance of a bratty teenager being nitpicked about something trivial. Her response of 'they can just take it away' was classic teenager, as if that's what happens when you break the rules of a competition. It was like she was getting caught by a teacher smoking a cigarette in the bathroom. All that was missing was a 'Whatever [eye roll]'.

It's a real shame that the most dramatic things happening are not the clothes on the runway anymore. Ever since the show moved to Lifetime, the highlight of any episode is a Swatch sighting at Mood.

What really bugged me is that the judges were talking about how referential designs are...however...these designs weren't referential and I don't recall complete and blatant rip offs like the twin's work. It is one thing to be influenced by a certain design or designer, it is quite another to copy a design from the week before so obviously. You might have liked the pleating technique or something, but to pretty much recreate it? That would be completely irritating to witness. Everything they made was taken from somewhere else -- either their own clothes or someone else's design. 

I agree about producer interference. They really don't understand what good TV is. They didn't need to draw this out. 

[RedheadZombie]

1 hour ago, HunterHunted said:

Someone on Jezebel said Brandon's clothing looked British designer Craig Green. It really does. Brandon's trademark isn't that original.

https://craig-green.com/collections/aw16-runway

I just don't seem to get it.  I've never once tried on an outfit and thought:  Gee, what this outfit really needs is ten extra belts (including one tied around my eyes, and one tied about my throat), a hood that blinds me, five extra yards of fabric, and a saggy crotch.  

[Talented Tenth]

Since the beginning of the show, it seems that the twins were bashed by the great majority for being annoying, codependent and middle of the road when it came to talent, but being called out for cheating now makes her a sympathetic character?  Michael and Margarita did nothing wrong -- they just wanted the competition to be fair and they probably felt bad she got offed because they don't have black hearts.

[Chippings]

14 hours ago, LennieBriscoe said:

Chippings, Several of us have noted the "ease of replicating" Michael's design for the doll size. 

I'm sorry.  I had read the page immediately above my posting, but not the page before.

But also -- the raised, asymmetrical collar on I think it was Amy's outfit reminded me, but only kind of lamely, of a piece that Chris March and Christian Siriano did in their season when they had gone to the art museum for inspiration, and they did a gi-normous piece, with a collar that rose over the model's head.  It was FABulous.  And because they were asking for something special (which Avant Garde should be), they gave them enough time.  Of all the pieces ever on this show, that one stays in my mind.  Those were designers, folks.  

[njbchlover]

3 hours ago, MinorL said:

I wonder if the judges wouldn't have been so blase about copying work if they hadn't just awarded the win to Claire. They seemed really defensive, as if they were being attacked. Yolanda was particularly defensive on Claire's behalf, and she doesn't' know Claire. It was more like she was defensive on her own behalf. "How dare you criticize the person I just decided was the winner of this challenge?"  It seemed like that's at least one reason why they were so quick to dismiss any of the criticism of Claire. 

Having watched Yolanda all the years she was on Real Housewives - THIS is exactly the way she perceived it!  

[HunterHunted]

Just now, RedheadZombie said:

I just don't seem to get it.  I've never once tried on an outfit and thought:  Gee, what this outfit really needs is ten extra belts (including one tied around my eyes, and one tied about my throat), a hood that blinds me, five extra yards of fabric, and a saggy crotch.  

It's so funny because I once bought a top because it had a bunch of weird panels and straps and I couldn't figure out how you wore it. It was at a sample sale so it was the only one. It's a great top and shockingly tailored, but it looked crazypants on the hanger, like just as over the top Brandon's stuff.

Brandon's stuff is an aesthetic. It's not mine, but there are clearly people who really dig it.

[jackjill89]

8 hours ago, dleighg said:

I think many of us just learned this. One always wonders when a lovely young lady marries an old toad. Several examples come to mind.

...because he was a Hollywood bigwig and could get the stars to wear his wife's designs.  Marchesa became a red carpet staple because of his influence, I'm sure.

IMO, there is nothing that could justify marrying him. Dismissing all the charges against him, he is beyond ugly and looks like he smells. He is ugly even before you consider what a horrible excuse for a human being he is. Also -- the rumors about him being a nasty piece of work have been around for years and years. She had to have heard them.

[gingerormaryann]

5 minutes ago, njbchlover said:

Having watched Yolanda all the years she was on Real Housewives - THIS is exactly the way she perceived it!  

As well she should.  She was one of the judges.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

10 hours ago, Nidratime said:

It occurred to me only today that when Claire said to the other contestants, "you should have just come to me and told me that it was wrong!" that that's exactly what abusers say to their victims.  Like, telling someone they shouldn't cheat makes it all better.

ITA - and in this case, because the producers are the higher authority (like the police in an abuse case), it came off as, "Why didn't you tell me I was doing something wrong (even though I already knew I was doing something wrong) so that I could justify it to you and talk you out of reporting it to the people who could do something about it?" It's not a witness's responsibility to confront an abuser and tell them that what they're doing is wrong. But what makes it really stupid is that Claire KNEW she was breaking the rules and she's acting like the only reason she continued to cheat is that no one reminded her that she was breaking one of the rules. If someone had said, "Hey, Claire, you're not supposed to have a measuring tape at the apartment," are we really supposed to believe that Claire would have just stopped taking measurements and writing them down?

10 hours ago, Tabbygirl521 said:

Sure - but does *sheer* fabric really protect that much? It seems odd to me. 

As someone who has had to wear sequined costumes, yes, anything that you can put between your skin and the sequins helps, even if it's sheer. It's also nice to have something between your skin and the back of the sequined material which can also be uncomfortable. A sheer bodystocking is great because it offers protection from both and because it's smooth, any sequins will slide across the top of the fabric instead of digging into your skin.

1 hour ago, jackjill89 said:

What really bugged me is that the judges were talking about how referential designs are...however...these designs weren't referential and I don't recall complete and blatant rip offs like the twin's work. It is one thing to be influenced by a certain design or designer, it is quite another to copy a design from the week before so obviously. You might have liked the pleating technique or something, but to pretty much recreate it? That would be completely irritating to witness. Everything they made was taken from somewhere else -- either their own clothes or someone else's design.

I agree - referential is different from totally copying. That black zippered sweatshirt was not referential. It was an exact copy. The little cut outs on the top from Shawn's top were not referential. They were the same.

[hoodooznoodooz]

5 hours ago, vibeology said:

I was actually shocked that the judges didn't care more about the twins ripping off other people's looks. It might not be cheating the way having a measuring tape is, but it's wrong and shouldn't be rewarded in a design competition. Claire hasn't just been remaking looks that she's already made; she's copying other designers work. Zac is a designer. He'd care if it was his look. If Claire had been sending down Posen knock-offs week after week you can bet he'd care. I know that in fashion, there aren't really any new ideas anymore but some of the copies have been so blatant and I find it frustrating that it wouldn't have mattered a bit if not for the measuring tape.

I totally agree.

The judges were arguing that all designers inspire one another. But Claire was making almost exact copies of other garments. And if I were Margarita, I would have been really upset that Tim never pointed out how similar Claire's original top was to Margarita's dress. 

In Road to the Runway, Claire explained that they take classic silhouettes and then embellish them to the point that they become statement pieces. 

You could achieve something similar by buying overruns of basic pieces, a hot glue gun and 50 pounds of crap from Joann's Fabrics. (see: Shock & Aww leather jackets)

[Kristimar]

11 hours ago, RedbirdNelly said:

I so agree with this. I didn't like Claire but felt bad for her and hated how M&M handled this. Plus Michael's snarky commentary about Brandon running out of ideas. I'm not a huge fan of Brandon's designs but right now I just want Michael not to win. His behavior was awful. If you see cheating, report it. You don't need to stage a walk off the runway.

And I didn't pay attention during the Shopkin explanation so still don't really get what they ar

Michael's made snarky remarks about Brandon in 2-3 other episodes and Kenya decided to join in with her 'Golden Boy' remark. I  like Brandon's work and love that he stays out of the drama. I think he's there for one reason only and that is to learn everything he can, gain exposure for his brand and get a chance at the golden ring. 

As for Margarita, she strikes me as being the kind of person who lives to create chaos and then sit back and watch with glee when things come unglued.  And then to be so apologetic afterward with that wide-eyed 'I didn't know' garbage? She knew exactly what she was doing.  I also thought it interesting she volunteered to go backstage to find out what was going on with Michael - and they let her, which lends even more credibility to the belief that production shenanigans abound behind the scenes at PR.

[gingerormaryann]

1 hour ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

ITA - and in this case, because the producers are the higher authority (like the police in an abuse case), it came off as, "Why didn't you tell me I was doing something wrong (even though I already knew I was doing something wrong) so that I could justify it to you and talk you out of reporting it to the people who could do something about it?" It's not a witness's responsibility to confront an abuser and tell them that what they're doing is wrong. But what makes it really stupid is that Claire KNEW she was breaking the rules and she's acting like the only reason she continued to cheat is that no one reminded her that she was breaking one of the rules. If someone had said, "Hey, Claire, you're not supposed to have a measuring tape at the apartment," are we really supposed to believe that Claire would have just stopped taking measurements and writing them down?

  

I completely disagree.  The argument she was responding to was originally about copying designs not the measuring tape.  As such, M&M had no problem talking in Spanish right in front of Claire about the situation, yet not discussing it with her, something Ayana observed made things quite difficult.

When people are equating what Claire did to an abuser, you know the show has done its job. 

[lark37]

7 hours ago, wings707 said:

I was past the stage of playing with dolls when Barbie came out!  I have 4 grandchildren and they have never mentioned Shopkins. 

They are made by Moose Toys out of Australia.  I think they are trying to make them happen here in time for Christmas thus the product placement.   

I agree, he is adorable and talented. 

The rest of this season is going to be much better without the twins sucking all the energy out of the room.  

Shopkins are already hugely popular in the US with the under 10 set especially girls. My granddaughters have shopkins toys, games, pillows, backpacks etc. I suspect the new Shopkins Live show was the reason behind the promotional push. 

Edited October 14, 2017 by lark37
Shopkins Live not live Shopkins

[Miss Ruth]

1 hour ago, Kristimar said:

[Margarita]  volunteered to go backstage to find out what was going on with Michael - and they let her,....

I don't think "they" let her.  From where I sat, she just took off.

[dgpolo]

Spoiler

 

I thought no spoilers regardless of age were permitted in another forum? I was not expecting a spoiler for Jeopardy in this forum. Did I read that rule wrong?

Edited October 14, 2017 by dgpolo
spoiler edit just in case

[pinguina]

The runway was fine.  Just some thoughts:

Regarding Claire's blatant rip-offs throughout this season (along with her sister!!!) I have something about that.  In the season of Kelsey, she made a dress - it was really good.  Yet, Kelsey was in the bottom.  The judges told her it was tooo close of a copy of a recent (at the time) show by a famous designer (can't remember name).  She said she'd never seen his work, but the judges still chastised her because they said she should keep current to what others are doing SO that there would be no copying.  Kelsey got scolded for copying without even realizing that she was copying.  And now??? Claire gets, "Well, we get influenced by the people whose work we are seeing." And apparently that is okay now.

Although I really don't care for Brandon's aesthetic (I do think he is a very nice person with a go with the flow vibe) I kind of liked what he did.  However, he did not do what the challenge required and should have been on the bottom.  This happened with the guy who got caught with the pattern books.  In one challenge he clearly made a beautiful dress.  Seriously, a great dress!  Here comes the "But" , but he did not design or include a dog outfit to go with the dress. He made a cloth collar to go around the dog's neck.  So he was in the bottom, he was declared safe due to the great dress he made.  The judges told him that if he had included a dog outfit, he would have won.

I thought that Ayana should have won.  It met the perimeters of the challenge and it looked good (Liris did a great job selling it!!).  I did like Margaria's - as others have said it gave a princess vibe without being princessy.

I loved Kentaro's simplicity and yet it was striking in my opinion.

Bhatana (sp?) made a terrible design!  I really like her but what she made was awful (coming from a person who thinks a shirt with buttons and jeans is dressy enough).  And poor Amy!  I really wanted to like what she made but it was not cheerful nor exciting nor fun which is what Shopkins are (or so I am told by my second graders!) I like her too but yeah, she had to go.

And just one more humble opinion - although, we may not like how Margarita and Michael handled the whole Claire situation, I have to give them a benefit of a doubt.  They did speak up, as did others to producers apparently regarding the twins'  "helping" each other, clearly copying their own clothes as well as others (Addidas, the model's outfit) and were disregarded.  I really think the producers wanted a blow up of some kind, and Michael gave it them.  Margarita and Michael both felt bad about Claire but she did it to herself because she did the cheating not them.  So we might not like or agree as to how they handled the whole thing, the bottom line is that Claire cheated.

.

[hoodooznoodooz]

4 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

Someone on Jezebel said Brandon's clothing looked British designer Craig Green. It really does. Brandon's trademark isn't that original.

https://craig-green.com/collections/aw16-runway

If one of my guy friends showed up in what resembles a gigantic cowhide baseball cover with lacing that exploded, I would laugh and laugh and laugh . . . . (trying to continue with the Seinfeld references)

[hoodooznoodooz]

I think it's kind of odd that they were supposed to design an avant garde look inspired by a Shopkins and superfan's story, and the winner's reward would be a Shopkins inspired by the avant garde look.

[Miss Ruth]

1 hour ago, pinguina said:

In the season of Kelsey,

I don't remember Kelsey.  Did you possibly mean Kenley Collins?

[pinguina]

Just now, Miss Ruth said:

 I don't remember a Kelsey.  Did you possibly mean Kenley Collins?

Yes,  I typed too fast and didn't notice I spelled it wrong :)

[Sarnia]

7 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

Someone on Jezebel said Brandon's clothing looked British designer Craig Green. It really does. Brandon's trademark isn't that original.

https://craig-green.com/collections/aw16-runway

I can see the inspiration. It makes sense that Brandon has references in menswear design if that's what he does. In Project Runway he's transposing that to woman's fashion and I think he's doing a pretty good job of it. I'm not saying I like it (I'm not sure I do, actually) but at least it's interesting and different from what we usually see on Project Runway.

6 hours ago, BlackberryJam said:

Brandon has a definite style, as does Kentaro. I’m sure both are referential. I look at all of Kentaro’s work and think, “ballet practice wear done impeccably.” That doesn’t make what he’s doing any less interesting. 

Exactly this. And both are focused and drama-less, so refreshing. I would be OK with either of them winning. Ayana's evolution is also interesting, if she continues to be more daring as she was this week maybe she could surprise.

[Former Nun]

10 hours ago, babs j. said:

I wonder if Georgina will still have to be introduced as the beautiful (or is it lovely?) Georgina Chapman?

I think it's "the gorgeous™."

[Former Nun]

2 hours ago, pinguina said:

And just one more humble opinion - although, we may not like how Margarita and Michael handled the whole Claire situation, I have to give them a benefit of a doubt.  They did speak up, as did others to producers apparently regarding the twins'  "helping" each other, clearly copying their own clothes as well as others (Addidas, the model's outfit) and were disregarded.  I really think the producers wanted a blow up of some kind, and Michael gave it them.  Margarita and Michael both felt bad about Claire but she did it to herself because she did the cheating not them.  So we might not like or agree as to how they handled the whole thing, the bottom line is that Claire cheated.

And just as the entire storyline has been edited and manipulated by Production, so are we.  We share opinions of supporting or criticizing Margarita and (especially) Michael, but we don't know what really happened, step-by-step, who was involved, how many stepped forward--or when.  I prefer to wholeheartedly support Michael...and Margarita.   You know how it is when you've finally had it!  The fake drama on this show is getting worse as they try to prop/pump up ratings.

[Desert Rat]

7 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

Someone on Jezebel said Brandon's clothing looked British designer Craig Green. It really does. Brandon's trademark isn't that original.

https://craig-green.com/collections/aw16-runway

I think I've seen Craig Green's designs before.  Isn't he a designer for the Taliban?