S07.E20: Fake Out

[iheartla]

In the kitchen scene with the blow up doll, Aubree is wearing the exact outfit she had on for the first day of school episode. My thought is MTV filmed the blow up doll scene in the evening, after Aubree had been picked up from her first day. I'm going to throw her a teeny bit of shade for dropping Aubree off with her mom for her bachelorette party on Aubree's very first day of school. Girlfriend redeems herself because she takes care of Aubree the other 99% of the time.

While I'm on it, I don't think Chelsea is some ultra thrifty lady. She's not spending beyond her means, and it's clear she's not blowing through her money on crap, but she's not Miss. Thrifty either. I've counted 2 different Louis Vuitton bags this season, she drives a LR4, she takes vacations too (albeit infrequent ones or she'll take Aubree with her). I agree with the post above, I think she's scared of the lifestyle change, which is perfectly valid. You get used to a certain way of living and it takes some time to adjust and prioritize what extras you want to omit to afford the extras you don't want to go without. She'll do fine, but I'm sure it's scary to think about. It's easier to stay on the show and continue rolling in the easy money while you can.

[HeySandyStrange]

1 hour ago, iheartla said:

I agree with the post above, I think she's scared of the lifestyle change, which is perfectly valid. You get used to a certain way of living and it takes some time to adjust and prioritize what extras you want to omit to afford the extras you don't want to go without. She'll do fine, but I'm sure it's scary to think about. It's easier to stay on the show and continue rolling in the easy money while you can.

I agree. I think Chelsea, dim though she can be, has enough sense to know how much she lucked out. She was able to go from being taken care of by her high earning father to making her own six figure salary, all while being a SAHM and doing some side job for fun. She probably sees a lot of her friends, most of whom were teen moms, struggling while she's had it fairly easy and it makes sticking it out with the show much more attractive. I think Cole and Chelsea will be fine as long as they learn to be a tiny bit more thrifty with their money, stick with the same house, and don't have a boatload of kids. I will assume they have a generous nest egg but aren't millionaires, so they can be comfortable for a long while after the show ends as long as they downsize their lives a little bit more.

[GreatKazu]

1 hour ago, iheartla said:

In the kitchen scene with the blow up doll, Aubree is wearing the exact outfit she had on for the first day of school episode. My thought is MTV filmed the blow up doll scene in the evening, after Aubree had been picked up from her first day. I'm going to throw her a teeny bit of shade for dropping Aubree off with her mom for her bachelorette party on Aubree's very first day of school. Girlfriend redeems herself because she takes care of Aubree the other 99% of the time.

While I'm on it, I don't think Chelsea is some ultra thrifty lady. She's not spending beyond her means, and it's clear she's not blowing through her money on crap, but she's not Miss. Thrifty either. I've counted 2 different Louis Vuitton bags this season, she drives a LR4, she takes vacations too (albeit infrequent ones or she'll take Aubree with her). I agree with the post above, I think she's scared of the lifestyle change, which is perfectly valid. You get used to a certain way of living and it takes some time to adjust and prioritize what extras you want to omit to afford the extras you don't want to go without. She'll do fine, but I'm sure it's scary to think about. It's easier to stay on the show and continue rolling in the easy money while you can.

Only two LV bags? Considering the money she has pulled in, that is tame. :-) I know women who earn way less than Chelsea and own three LV purses each. Not me. Not my thing. lol. 

Leah has been seen with countless expensive bags, several cars, a drug habit that doesn't come cheap. Some sources put her drug habit at $1000 a week just three years ago. She stole from her girlses trust fund. The constant moving from one house to another. Who can forget the Mary Kay fiasco and her space shuttle washer and dryer combo. I know I am forgetting a lot of crap. 

[Blissfool]

To me it seemed that Chelsea put on a charade about how she wants to respect the fact that this is Cole's first baby and she doesn't want to reveal too much. Then while talking to her friends she mentions how cute the baby will look wearing those thingies <gestures at suspenders>. When her friends shout "suspenders", she acts all "STFU, guuuuuys.....mtv is listening!" I think she was bursting at the seams to reveal the gender to mtv. Especially after she continued driving with a smug smile on her face.

[evilmindatwork]

19 hours ago, ghoulina said:

I don't necessarily think Chelsea is being given any leeway. I just think the others don't care as much about having all their drama out there. They like the attention, good or bad. But if she IS being given any leeway, it might be because of how she treats people. 

Yes, being likable goes a long way. If you have friends, they'll pull strings for you. If you go out of your way to treat people like crap, if they have to deal with you because of their jobs they will, but don't be surprised if they ridicule you and make you look like an asshole. 

[Phoebe70]

UBT scares me.  I mean, REALLY scares me.  When he was driving the car with just Kaiser and his daughter, he was trying to act like Father Of The Year.  It's strange how differently he treats Kaiser than Jace.  And when he called Nathan a "b*tch" in the car his tone of voice was scary-mean.  It will just be a matter of time before he gets arrested again for DV.

[GreatKazu]

4 hours ago, Blissfool said:

To me it seemed that Chelsea put on a charade about how she wants to respect the fact that this is Cole's first baby and she doesn't want to reveal too much. Then while talking to her friends she mentions how cute the baby will look wearing those thingies <gestures at suspenders>. When her friends shout "suspenders", she acts all "STFU, guuuuuys.....mtv is listening!" I think she was bursting at the seams to reveal the gender to mtv. Especially after she continued driving with a smug smile on her face.

Possibly, considering Chelsea likely knew by the time this scene aired she would give birth and it wouldn't matter what was said on camera.

[Inga]

On 2/9/2017 at 7:34 PM, GreatKazu said:

Jo is enjoying the fact he can have Isaac at will, as he told Vee. Jo is holding the cards.  Kail is obviously being agreeable because she knows she needs Jo and Vee more than ever. I know that Vee is seeing right through Kail, including most of us. We know that history can repeat itself and rear its ugly head. He also knows she is going through a divorce. Things are too sensitive right now to bring the topic up and Kail is all over the place with her emotions. He may want to wait and see what Javi and Lincoln's custody schedule will be. Jo is adamant about keeping Javi and Lincoln in the picture. It may help him to know what will be the best as far as the kids' visitation schedules is concerned. Kail is also still in college. That is a temporary situation. Jo is likely wanting to wait until she graduates before springing the idea of changing the custody schedule. Who knows what her life will be like after college, what job she may get, what her work schedule will be like, etc.

They replayed Karl's 16 & pregnant the other day and back then , she was going to school to become a dental hygienist and I thought that was a brilliant idea. Dental hygienists make great money, what happened to that? This "hosting" thing? Not so great 

[GreatKazu]

3 minutes ago, Inga said:

They replayed Karl's 16 & pregnant the other day and back then , she was going to school to become a dental hygienist and I thought that was a brilliant idea. Dental hygienists make great money, what happened to that? This "hosting" thing? Not so great 

I think it was one of those on-the-whim moments which Kail is known for. She doesn't stick with anything for long. It is just a spur of the moment much like her relationships.

[Inga]

On 2/13/2017 at 9:09 PM, Brooklynista said:

Seems Leah has been watching Supernanny.  

The song and dance Janelle is doing to make sure UBT knows that she's texting Nathan strictly about Kaiser is unnerving.  Does David expect for these parents to never speak to each other? Is he that scared of losing his meal ticket?

Supernanny-yes, this is exactly what I thinking as well.  She needs to watch it more though, her major mistake was that you never talk to a child when they are in time out, you have to completely ignore them, otherwise they are still getting attention which is exactly what they want. 

[Birdee]

Being a dental hygienist is below the new Kail. The new Kail needs to be the biggest star in her universe. The older, poorer and smarter Kail wanted a steady paycheck and a solid job. 

[lezlers]

7 minutes ago, Birdee said:

Being a dental hygienist is below the new Kail. The new Kail needs to be the biggest star in her universe. The older, poorer and smarter Kail wanted a steady paycheck and a solid job. 

Yes, now that she's a "celebrity" a simple dental hygienist is waaaaaaay too far beneath her.

[ghoulina]

I wouldn't want Kail as my hygienist anyway. She is not nearly pleasant enough. All the girls at both my dentist, and the pediatric one I take my kids to, are super friendly and reassuring. I cannot see Kail being that way with patients at all. 

[HeySandyStrange]

On one hand, I think dental hygiene would have been the much better career field for Kail to go into. It would require some hard work and dedication, which were Kail's strengths at one point, without demanding too much intellectually. It wouldn't require good looks, charisma, or talent, unlike hosting tv shows tend to. Someone once pointed out that Kail would've even been able to have a mentor in Randilicious, which would've been excellent for her if she'd gone in that direction.

On the other hand, I agree that Kail's attitude and personality as of now are not a good fit for being a hygienist. She's never been the most pleasant or friendly person but now? The fame has completely gone to her had and I think in her mind, even being a neurosurgeon would somehow be beneath her lofty tv hostess ambitions.  In the beginning, when she was a little more humble and practical it might've worked but now she would never lower herself to it. I think Kail is going to end up kicking herself in a few years when her dreams of becoming the next Nessa or whatever don't pan out.

[guilfoyleatpp]

To revisit the Chelsea situation, I think she gets more "leeway" because she doesn't piss off the producers with petty ass bullshit (that makes a difference, these people don't have to sign an oath to be fair and balanced in their representation of the cast members) and she's probably actually just not an asshole in front of the camera. 

We all definitely have our asshole moments, but Chelsea has mentioned before that she's hidden things from the producers.  She's observant enough to know how she can (it seems that all the girls are, to some extent). So she sleeps with Adam and the producers don't know about it until she mentions it to one of her friends on camera. Adam sends her asshole text messages and she doesn't immediately call him to yell at him and give him the opportunity to bring up embarrassing shit from the past.  

I don't think she's a genius, but she's canny. Like most of us in the real life world, she tolerates people she dislikes but still has to work with and keeps her mouth shut because she knows she has to preserve relationships in order to get shit done. She doesn't talk shit about her realtor or her wedding planner. Maybe seeing her mom blurt out every stupid thing that pops into her head taught Chelsea the value of not speaking before you think.

Anyway, that's why I think she gets a decent edit. She might be a jerk, but she's not gonna let her jerk flag fly around the producers.

[CofCinci]

If Teen Mom 2 didn't become a series, I think Kail would have continued with the dental hygienist program. Honestly, I think she'd be much happier in life if the series didn't happen. 

[teapot]

13 minutes ago, CofCinci said:

If Teen Mom 2 didn't become a series, I think Kail would have continued with the dental hygienist program. Honestly, I think she'd be much happier in life if the series didn't happen. 

I think we can safely say that about almost all of them...maybe not Chelsea or Maci, (who kind of just seem to be living a higher-end version of the life they'd probably be living anyways), but the rest of them

[heatherchandler]

Thinking about the comments made by Nathan, more or less hinting that he and Jenelle could have made it work in the end, I get the feeling that Jenelle is kicing herself for hitching her wagon to UBT.  Nathan is not a prize, but he's good looking (when less greasy and roided-up) and he used to make Jenelle light up.  She even said to Barb at one point that she was thrilled that someone like him went for her.  UBT is hideous looking, and Jenelle doesn't look thrilled to be with him, ever.

I am sure she is wishing she waited for him to come back to her, she is probably picturing her life right now and wishing it was with Nathan.  I wonder if she will act on it.

I also get the feeling that UBT knows this and wants to be sure that will never happen.  

[SPLAIN]

1 hour ago, heatherchandler said:

Thinking about the comments made by Nathan, more or less hinting that he and Jenelle could have made it work in the end, I get the feeling that Jenelle is kicing herself for hitching her wagon to UBT.  Nathan is not a prize, but he's good looking (when less greasy and roided-up) and he used to make Jenelle light up.  She even said to Barb at one point that she was thrilled that someone like him went for her.  UBT is hideous looking, and Jenelle doesn't look thrilled to be with him, ever.

I am sure she is wishing she waited for him to come back to her, she is probably picturing her life right now and wishing it was with Nathan.  I wonder if she will act on it.

I also get the feeling that UBT knows this and wants to be sure that will never happen.  

Indeed. Nathan seemed to imply all of that when he said words to the effect of "Jenelle went and got pregnant" as if to say the pregnancy ruined whatever chance they had to get back together. Jenelle has a history of returning to the guy even after the worst fall-out. Domestic violence or any violence has not stopped her from going back to Keefuh and the other guys. It was only when she was without a guy did she resort to that behavior. I can't forget Jenelle crying her eyes out when she told Nathan how he had moved on so quickly. It sounded like Jenelle was hoping for a reconciliation. We know they were hooking up as they both mentioned it.

I am with those who think Kail would see the dental hygiene career as being beneath her. As her butt has gotten bigger, so has her ego. Not sure which is bigger at this point.

Kail had no qualms making a snooty face when she got in Javi's truck as if she wouldn't dare be seen in such a vehicle. Then, she has to let Javi know what a POS vehicle it is in her eyes. She is lucky it was Javi. I can't wait for the guy who will kick her gigantic butt out of his vehicle once he is done with her.

Edited February 17, 2017 by SPLAIN

[Grandma Saracen]

Not only do you not talk to a child during their time out, for a young child like Addie, for an infraction like the one in question, you don't wait until you leave the park and drive home before you give a consequence. For a younger child, the consequence loses all meaning when it's that far from the event. I like Supernanny and what she stands for a lot, and I come from a child development background, as well. I do give Leah props for trying out the method, but it needs some work. 

Edited February 17, 2017 by Grandma Saracen
Grammar, ugh.

[SheTalksShit]

On 2/16/2017 at 6:16 AM, Vandy10 said:

He said "had to be escort by security" instead of "escorted," but other than that, I agree with you. Surprisingly well written.

I go back and forth on Nathan. We see him with Kaiser on the show or instagram, and it looks like he's such a better parent than Jailnelle. But then those reports of domestic violence come out (over and over again), and I think he's dangerous. And then I think about what I've read about PTSD and TBI and how much they can change a formerly good, stable person into a violent mess, and then I feel really bad for him.

Basically, it's complicated. LOL

it's pretty easy to look like and be a "good parent" when you only see your kid like, once a week, for a few hours. just sayin. All you have to do is play with him and act all attentive for a few hours. anyone can do that. 

[shelley1234]

Adam would beg to differ on that.  

[CerealKiller813]

On February 16, 2017 at 11:05 AM, MissMel said:

I think Nathan might have a hard time with words.  I do, now.  And it's particularly rough when speaking.  (I post here and on Facebook to train my brain back to normal.)  The worst feeling is knowing what word you want but not being able to find it's way out of your mouth.  And people recognize that but patronize you with an "it's ok".  It's not ok.  Pass me some paper and a pen, or a phone, and I can get the right words out eventually.  

Nathan's post reminds me of that.  I also make fun of his dramastical errors with words, but usually just when they happen in a regular setting.(<--see that? Can't find the word I want to use.)  Anyway, this post looks like he took time to think about it and it meant something to him.  I can't fault him for any of it.  

I totally get what you are saying. I also have trouble finding the right words (stroke a few yrs back left me with some language difficulties) and the frustration I feel when I know the word and it can't pass out my mouth, or even when I lose my train of thought in the freaking middle of my thought, is enough to want to kick something. 

Nathan isn't perfect but I understand (other than the AIDS comment) what he was trying to say and he clearly has the evidence to back it up. 

More power to the pen and paper! 

[Inga]

On 2/14/2017 at 8:10 AM, luvbadtv said:

Same with Kaiser.  At the drop off, he was carrying a giant bag of gummies.  Then gets in he car and is drinking a bottle of sugar crap.

Totally agree, how old is he? Like 1? I'm sorry but he should not be eating sour patch worms or whatever they were. And those sugar filled bottles that the twinses were eating, ugh, pure sugar and lots of it. This all has to do with where Leah is from, that's how that all eat, and that's how she grew up. I cringe whenever I see people buying those little barrels of blue juice at the grocery store-I mean that is 100% corn syrup and food coloring. I'm pretty sure Leah buys those for the girls.

On another note, how adorable and cute and funny is Kaiser?? He's always happy and does and says whatever anyone tells him. How is he like this with these 2 as parents??

[lezlers]

16 hours ago, SheTalksShit said:

it's pretty easy to look like and be a "good parent" when you only see your kid like, once a week, for a few hours. just sayin. All you have to do is play with him and act all attentive for a few hours. anyone can do that. 

He actually has 3 out of 4 weekends every month with Kaiser.  I was surprised he got so much visitation, frankly.  Usually the non custodial parent gets every other weekend.  Seeing how Jenelle pawns off her kids about 75% of the time, I'd wager that Nathan might actually spend more time with Kaiser than Jenelle and UBT.

[BitterApple]

Kaiser appears to genuinely adore Nathan, so I don't buy Jenelle's claims that Nathan dumps the kid off on his parents for the entire weekend. Nathan's mom might watch him for an evening or do outings like the playground and church, but Nathan has to be doing some level of caretaking otherwise Kaiser wouldn't be so happy and comfortable in his presence.

[jacksgirl]

Whew,  late to the party, and just read all 5 pages of snark. As much as I like the new, more mature Jo, he made me so angry when he said that first grade is "real school." I get the sentiment, first grade is when most students learn to read,  but as a long time pre-Kindergarten and kindergarten teacher, what I teach is "real school." Want your child to be successful in first grade? Improve their chances with good early childhood programs.  Rant over, I still think you're a good dad Jo.

ETA- these people sure spent a lot of time in the car this week. Think Maryssa gets tired of all the traipsing about? 

Edited February 18, 2017 by jacksgirl
New thought

[ghoulina]

I still want to know Maryssa's arrangement. She seems to be with them every time they film. Dave can't possibly have full custody of her, can he? Maybe her mom allows him to take her every time MTV is there, so he can look like a good dad.

[lezlers]

1 hour ago, ghoulina said:

I still want to know Maryssa's arrangement. She seems to be with them every time they film. Dave can't possibly have full custody of her, can he? Maybe her mom allows him to take her every time MTV is there, so he can look like a good dad.

I was wondering about that too.  They seem to have her every time Jenelle has Jace which, I believe someone had mentioned, is only when they're filming. They probably arrange it that way so Jace and Maryssa can entertain themselves (and take care of Kaiser) while Jenelle and UBT do god only knows what.

[CofCinci]

Marissa probably helps with Kaiser too. 

[Brooklynista]

13 minutes ago, CofCinci said:

Marissa probably helps with Kaiser too. 

According to the Duggars guide she's definitely old enough to start raising him.

[GreatKazu]

5 hours ago, ghoulina said:

I still want to know Maryssa's arrangement. She seems to be with them every time they film. Dave can't possibly have full custody of her, can he? Maybe her mom allows him to take her every time MTV is there, so he can look like a good dad.

Maryssa is there because she gets PAID. Ching ching $$

[Miss Chevious]

1 hour ago, GreatKazu said:

Maryssa is there because she gets PAID. Ching ching $$

That's what I was wondering. I mentioned this upthread a few pages back, but no one commented at the time. I was speculating that UBT made sure his time with Maryssa coincided with MTV's filming schedule because he must get paid more for having her on the show. That poor kid doesn't look thrilled to be there in most of her scenes. As she gets older, I predict she'll be very resentful for having to be the "built-in babysitter" for a bunch of her father's step-kids.

[woodscommaelle]

I really wish Jo and Kail would have acknowledged Isaac's answer to  "what are you excited for at school?"  And Isaac said 'making new friends.'  What a sweet answer but neither one really cared.

Chelsea's tall and thin friend was creeping me out in the Fun House.  Her long legs leading her forward?  super freaky looking!

[CofCinci]

I'd wish Wikileaks would release information about how folks on this show are paid. 

[GreatKazu]

17 hours ago, Miss Chevious said:

That's what I was wondering. I mentioned this upthread a few pages back, but no one commented at the time. I was speculating that UBT made sure his time with Maryssa coincided with MTV's filming schedule because he must get paid more for having her on the show. That poor kid doesn't look thrilled to be there in most of her scenes. As she gets older, I predict she'll be very resentful for having to be the "built-in babysitter" for a bunch of her father's step-kids.

I agree. Poor Maryssa looks as if she'd rather be anywhere else.

Going by what Gary said on the weekend special with the guys, he wondered why Cory wouldn't allow Remi to be filmed since the kids get paid. Gary went on to say how that money could be used for college. Cory mentioned he makes enough and doesn't need the extra money for his child. Every time I see UBT's daughter on screen, I keep hoping MTV would insert a "ching-ching" audio. lol

[ghoulina]

Ahhh, good point. I forgot about Gary saying the kids earn money as well. Makes sense. I do wish, that being the case, MTV would automatically put into a savings account that can only be opened when the child is 18.Lord knows what some of these women do with their children's money. 

[Christina]

My understanding is that the money paid to the kids from MTV, which was $5000 for 16 and Pregnant but no telling how much for Teen Mom in the later years, goes directly into a college fund for the kids. We did learn that Leah was accused of emptying a fund for her kids, but it sounded like it was some type of donation fund created for her and funded by viewers, not the MTV money. 

The original amount was disclosed in that book that someone from production(?) wrote, along with comments from that camera man on Reddit. Then Gary specifically said, "Money for college" so I think it is still the same, with MTV paying into a college fund. College funds are controlled by law, and it is unlikely anyone such as Leah would have been able to cash it out. There are pretty specific regulations for the payout of college funds, at least the one my son has, with what they will pay for, when you can cash it out, etc.

[GreatKazu]

Randy just gave out information about the college funds. Mind you, that doesn't mean this was the norm all of these seasons. Perhaps MTV started these college funds after reading various comments on their website about people inquiring about such a fund:

http://www.inquisitr.com/3963702/chelsea-deboers-father-reveals-mtv-has-college-funds-for-teen-mom-2-kids/

I remember when Amber went to court for her actions, it was revealed she didn't have any sort of fund set up for Leah. She was then ordered to put $10k into a trust account for her child. That indicates to me that MTV was not setting up any sort of funds for the kids.

The participants are not employees of MTV. They are independent contractors. They don't fall under the SAG requirements. The same holds for the kids. MTV is not required to pay the kids, but I am sure they did in order to secure the parents to the show.

If a parent is a trustee of an account, they can access it. My father was a trustee of both of my accounts when I was growing up. When I turned 18, I was then given access to my accounts.

As for Leah, the money she was accused of taking came from a trust fund. It might have been monies received from donations as well as any money Leah and Cory had put in from their earnings. This one article mentions Leah's expensive spending habits for gadgets and such:

http://www.intouchweekly.com/posts/leah-messer-emptied-twins-trust-fund-court-date-76958

Edited February 20, 2017 by GreatKazu

[Mkay]

New Ashley article. 

 

http://www.theashleysrealityroundup.com/2017/02/20/teen-mom-2-season-7b-episode-8-recap-bachelorette-party-battling-ex-boyfriends/

[BitterApple]

It makes me nervous to think of these girls having access to their kids' money. I know Chelsea would never screw Aubree over, but Leah and Jenelle? Might as well go ahead and put the money in their personal checking accounts now.

[ChristmasJones]

On 2/14/2017 at 0:17 PM, ghoulina said:

Has anyone ever noticed that the MAIN way Jenelle and her current boyfriend bond is over hating on the old boyfriend? They don't bond over books or movies or hobbies or political beliefs. Their conversations solely revolve around this other dude. If Nathan died tomorrow, Jenelle and David's relationship would implode, because they'd have no common ground. Putting down Nathan makes David feel like the superior boyfriend/father. And getting David riled about Nathan makes Jenelle feel important desired. There's literally nothing else there.

Finally got around to watching this episode, and reading this thread.

This quote by Ghoulina made me think of the Karpman Drama Triangle- a concept used in family therapy (and individual therapy) - it describes three roles in a conflictual relationship - the victim, the persecutor, and the rescuer  (and those are not necessarily literal, it can just as well mean someone who FEELS like they are the victim, or the rescuer, etc).

Janelle does tend to re-create this pattern in her relationships - currently, she views herself as the victim,  Uncle ID Channel is her Rescuer, and Nathan is the Persecutor.   But the roles can also change easily, its not a fixed thing.

Here is a bit from the wiki:

Initially, a drama triangle arises when a person takes on the role of a victim or persecutor. This person then feels the need to enlist other players into the conflict. As often happens, a rescuer is encouraged to enter the situation.[5] These enlisted players take on roles of their own that are not static, and therefore various scenarios can occur. For example, the victim might turn on the rescuer, the rescuer then switches to persecuting.

The motivations for each participant and the reason the situation endures is that each gets their unspoken (and frequently unconscious) psychological wishes/needs met in a manner they feel justified, without having to acknowledge the broader dysfunction or harm done in the situation as a whole. As such, each participant is acting upon their own selfish needs, rather than acting in a genuinely responsible or altruistic manner.[citation needed] Thus any character from all of three in this triangle might "ordinarily come on like a plaintive victim; it is now clear that the one can switch into the role of Persecutor providing it is 'accidental' and the one apologizes for it".[5]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karpman_drama_triangle

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

On February 19, 2017 at 6:39 AM, CofCinci said:

I'd wish Wikileaks would release information about how folks on this show are paid. 

Dear Julian Asange, 

Please make this happen! 

[SPLAIN]

28 minutes ago, ChristmasJones said:

Finally got around to watching this episode, and reading this thread.

This quote by Ghoulina made me think of the Karpman Drama Triangle- a concept used in family therapy (and individual therapy) - it describes three roles in a conflictual relationship - the victim, the persecutor, and the rescuer  (and those are not necessarily literal, it can just as well mean someone who FEELS like they are the victim, or the rescuer, etc).

Janelle does tend to re-create this pattern in her relationships - currently, she views herself as the victim,  Uncle ID Channel is her Rescuer, and Nathan is the Persecutor.   But the roles can also change easily, its not a fixed thing.

Here is a bit from the wiki:

Initially, a drama triangle arises when a person takes on the role of a victim or persecutor. This person then feels the need to enlist other players into the conflict. As often happens, a rescuer is encouraged to enter the situation.[5] These enlisted players take on roles of their own that are not static, and therefore various scenarios can occur. For example, the victim might turn on the rescuer, the rescuer then switches to persecuting.

The motivations for each participant and the reason the situation endures is that each gets their unspoken (and frequently unconscious) psychological wishes/needs met in a manner they feel justified, without having to acknowledge the broader dysfunction or harm done in the situation as a whole. As such, each participant is acting upon their own selfish needs, rather than acting in a genuinely responsible or altruistic manner.[citation needed] Thus any character from all of three in this triangle might "ordinarily come on like a plaintive victim; it is now clear that the one can switch into the role of Persecutor providing it is 'accidental' and the one apologizes for it".[5]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karpman_drama_triangle

This fits Leah, Kail, and Jenelle's lives. They shit on the previous guy while making the new guy sound like their hero. They constantly behave like victims. They expect a guy to rescue them from their misery.

[ChristmasJones]

Yes, and we have watched Jo and Corey move on from those types of dysfunctional roles, and now act like mature adults.

It will be interesting to see what Javi does now that he isn't with Karl anymore. He was very much brought in as Rescuer to Karl's Victim, and he took on that role completely. 

[SPLAIN]

9 minutes ago, ChristmasJones said:

Yes, and we have watched Jo and Corey move on from those types of dysfunctional roles, and now act like mature adults.

 

Yes. I will add Gary to that as well. The guys put the needs of their children first and foremost when choosing their current partners. As for Jenelle, Leah, and Kail, they are always putting their own needs first which seems to be a big part of the reason why their relationships fail. They are choosing rescuers as partners. They need a rescuer who will see them as victims and side with them. Part of the problem is the girls enter relationships without fully exploring life as independent individuals. A partner should not be sought until you fix yourself and whatever problems you are going through.

[Christina]

If they are college funds, it doesn't matter who the trustee is, the parent cannot cash them out for non-school purposes. If one of the kids was to pass away, or become disabled to the point there would not be college in their future, there can be payouts at a much reduced and heavily taxed rate. 

If it is just a trust fund, the Trustees would be able to cash them out or spend the money in them, but it was disclosed that the kids had "college funds" for the parents appearing on 16 and Pregnant. Amber was ordered to start a trust account for Leah when she was arrested for the domestic violence or one of the drug charges by the criminal court judge and Cory alleged that Leah had taken money from the twin's trusts, which she claimed she moved to another account, probably one owned by her drug dealer.

There was a lot of talk back when Amber was ordered to start a fund for Leah, with legal experts weighing in on whether or not that judge could order that specifically when Amber's charges were not financial crimes, and it seems like it was a mixture of yeses and nos depending on which legal expert was talking. I tried to google it, but the first three pages are all about whether or not Amber and Matt were getting married, had nothing to do with my search, and I decided I didn't care enough to scroll through anymore. 

I think MTV is paying into a college fund so the kids will have something for school in the future, Hopefully, they will all go and even more hopefully, they will become financially secure and cut their parents off and one of them will write a book.

[Christina]

24 minutes ago, SPLAIN said:

As for Jenelle, Leah, and Kail, they are always putting their own needs first which seems to be a big part of the reason why their relationships fail. They are choosing rescuers as partners. They need a rescuer who will see them as victims and side with them. Part of the problem is the girls enter relationships without fully exploring life as independent individuals. A partner should not be sought until you fix yourself and whatever problems you are going through.

That surprises me with Kail, although I agree she fits the mold, because she seems so dead set on being seen as an independent woman. She can't be alone for a moment.

[GreatKazu]

33 minutes ago, Christina said:

That surprises me with Kail, although I agree she fits the mold, because she seems so dead set on being seen as an independent woman. She can't be alone for a moment.

Kail loves to tout the independent woman angle, but in reality, everything she has and all that she has accomplished has been due to her being on this tv show and what she could get from someone else's hard work. I wish I could look into a crystal ball and see where she would be in life without this show and without all the people that supported her throughout her life with their money, their benefits, their families, and their homes.

@Christina Amber was ordered by Judge David Happe to set up a trust fund when she chose a plea deal (instead of going to prison) with the Madison County Drug Court program for her drug charges. This is the plea deal she ended up failing and asked to go to prison for five years. Part of the terms of her probation was she could not work for MTV. MTV could not sue her for breach of contract per the adjudicator's order, she was ordered to do daily drug testing and she was required to get a real 9-5 job while staying at a half-way house.  http://starcasm.net/archives/142616

Amber explaining the trust fund option because according to her MTV does not do it for them or the kids:  http://www.wetpaint.com/teen-mom-finances-amber-portwood-kailyn-lowry-835628/

That just reaffirms what I posted above about MTV doesn't have a hand in the trust fund issue.

Edited February 21, 2017 by GreatKazu

[poopchute]

I think it's sweet that someone at MTV thinks Jenelle or Leah's children will go to college but they have complete morons for parents who I am sure do not emphasize the importance of higher education.  I know it's possible to value an education even if you have parents with limited intellectual abilities or parents who don't model good behaviors or parents who don't teach the importance of school from an early age but I just don't see it with these folks.