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Joy and Austin: This One Time At Family Camp

frenchtoast

By frenchtoast
in Counting On

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Salacious Kitty

Salacious Kitty

Just now, Zella said:

Yeah I just checked and ours was the 15th. A cursory search of the biggest school districts in Benton and Washington County also show them all going back on the 15th or 16th. 

Personally, I think Joy and Austin would be some of the absolute last of the Duggar offspring to send their own kids to school. I think they're definitely some of the most indoctrinated of the kids. 

And will be the most undereducated. I worry that Joy will struggle with teaching the kids to read.

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ozziemom

ozziemom

1 minute ago, Zella said:

Yeah I just checked and ours was the 15th. A cursory search of the biggest school districts in Benton and Washington County also show them all going back on the 15th or 16th. 

Personally, I think Joy and Austin would be some of the absolute last of the Duggar offspring to send their own kids to school. I think they're definitely some of the most indoctrinated of the kids. 

Austin was homeschooled too IIRC so he may think Joy is capable of teaching the kids. Joy can stick Giddy with a tablet just like Alyssa Bates Webster does.

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StaceyNotStacie

StaceyNotStacie

(edited)
1 hour ago, Tdoc72 said:

I agree that school would probably be good for him but I think school would’ve started already.  Nj is going back next week and the South usually starts earlier.  

I wonder if Joy is still close to Jill and how close Austin and Derrick are. If they see Jill’s kids going to regular school (and seeing what Derrick has been able to do with a real education), maybe that can swing them in the direction of public school or a church preK program. They might also see the difference between an educated Izzy and “homeschooled” Spurgeon. 

Edited by StaceyNotStacie
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Zella

Zella

(edited)
34 minutes ago, StaceyNotStacie said:

They might also see the difference between an educated Izzy and “homeschooled” Spurgeon. 

I think one of the problems, though, is that their worldview doesn't look at an educated person and see it as an advantage. Where we would see curiosity, knowledge, critical thinking, articulateness, and creativity as a plus, they look at it as basically paving the way to hell. So, no, I don't think they're going to look at Izzy and see how genuinely happy he seems to be at school or the fact that he will likely end up better read and better spoken than his cousins. They'll just see him as someone who is routinely rubbing elbows with heathens on the daily and more likely to question beliefs and rebel and doubt. Whether or not he actually does those things is besides the point. 

Edited by Zella
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Salacious Kitty

Salacious Kitty

7 minutes ago, ozziemom said:

Can you imagine poor Joy trying to help Giddy with modern math homework? They will homeschool - it was good enough for them, so it will be fine for their kids. 

Yup. Giddyup will learn the trades from Daddy. As for Evy, who needs an education when you're going to be a broodmare? 

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MamaMax

MamaMax

13 hours ago, ozziemom said:

Can you imagine poor Joy trying to help Giddy with modern math homework? They will homeschool - it was good enough for them, so it will be fine for their kids. 

This is an aspect of the fundie home school culture that I don't know if its a feature or a bug - like Michele went to a real school and therefore was KINDA able to teach her kids the basics, as she had professional instruction. However, you know there were holes - things she herself never understood and so she either taught them incorrectly or not at all. But these holes will get bigger with every generation -- they will get farther away from any real theory of education or access to someone who actually understands the material.  I know people who homeschooled - but they are college educated themselves and also know where their personal weaknesses are and have made arrangements for help there - other teachers, on-line classes, etc. 

Jim Bob et al may think that education isnt important but I think the downplay how crucial their own organized education has been to help them succeed in their own businesses. How are the grandkids going to be business owners when/if they cant keep up enough to get a GED? 

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Ljohnson1987

Ljohnson1987

I hope Joy got some real counseling after losing Annabelle.  She shouldn't feel pressured to have sex on demand. Stand up for yourself, Joy! Show your children that a woman does not have to submit to a man. 

Do either Joy or Austin have enough education to teach their children? Send them to public school. 

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ozziemom

ozziemom

1 hour ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

Austin teaching Gideon his trade will result in Giddy learning math.  It will be practical application instead of theoretical.  I cannot think of a trade that does not use math, and depending on the job the math involved is more complex than basic addition and subtraction.  

I’m not seeing Austin teaching math to Giddy. He may take Giddy along to work sites as Giddy gets older and start showing him how to handle tools etc. But I hope Giddy will be learning to read, write and do math well before then. And Joy doesn’t seem suited to homeschooling. The Duggar grandkids who live near TTH  could certainly start attending SOTDRT together, seems like a lot of them are already there. 

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Notabug

Notabug

(edited)
17 hours ago, Zella said:

Yeah I just checked and ours was the 15th. A cursory search of the biggest school districts in Benton and Washington County also show them all going back on the 15th or 16th. 

Personally, I think Joy and Austin would be some of the absolute last of the Duggar offspring to send their own kids to school. I think they're definitely some of the most indoctrinated of the kids. 

Around here, Pre K programs tend to start later and finish earlier than the regular school year.  Maybe that is the case with Gideon?  I think he could really benefit from a true Pre K educational experience.  However, I also agree that neither Joy nor Austin seem to be the type to value a public school education.  They are also unlikely to see Joy as anything but a wonderful teacher/mother despite the many reasons we all think she is not going to be able to educate her kids well and, in fact, probably won't enjoy it and won't do anything but the barest essentials for them.

Around here, a lot of churches have Pre K programs for kids.  My niece and nephews actually attended one at a Baptist church near their home even though they are not Baptists; mainly because the teacher came highly recommended.  She was an actual licensed educator with a college degree.  The kids got a lot of Bible stories and knew a lot of religious Christmas songs; but they were really well prepared for entering regular public school kindergarten too.

Edited by Notabug
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sagittarius sue

sagittarius sue

1 hour ago, Ljohnson1987 said:

I hope Joy got some real counseling after losing Annabelle.  She shouldn't feel pressured to have sex on demand. Stand up for yourself, Joy! Show your children that a woman does not have to submit to a man. 

Do either Joy or Austin have enough education to teach their children? Send them to public school. 

Judging by the age Evy is now, it appears that Joy and Austin are using some method of birth control.

SMama

SMama

(edited)

For Gideon to attend real Pre K one of the parents has to believe that their homeschooling is not as good as a public school. Austin and Joy have the kool aid coursing through their veins. 

A few years ago there was an event at Fort Rock. They were called on the Pearl’s abusive methods. Austin and Joy defended the Pearls, were proud to have been subjected to corporal punishment, and both felt they turned out just fine.

Israel and Samuel are enrolled in public school because of Derick. No matter how much lip service he paid to homeschooling when Izzy was kindergarten age he gave up the pretense and made sure his child would get a good education. 

Edited by SMama
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SMama

SMama

Joy posted about Gideon’s glasses and confirmed they are prescription. Now here’s where she loses me. Joy said she found out AFTER she bought them that they are too big. How the hell does that happen? SGirl has been wearing glasses since first grade (10th now), a few times she has selected a frame and has been told she needs something smaller. SGirl tends to go for larger frames. Did Joy order them Online? Walmart has reasonably priced frames. Just found that weird. Still, Gideon does look adorable. 

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ozziemom

ozziemom

IIRC didn’t Joy hate her glasses as a child? Maybe she ordered kid’s glasses online without checking out the choices figuring there wasn’t much and it brought back bad memories. JB probably made her get the cheapest glasses, I don’t think you can buy “used and save the difference “ But at least Giddy has seen an eye doctor.

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Notabug

Notabug

33 minutes ago, ozziemom said:

IIRC didn’t Joy hate her glasses as a child? Maybe she ordered kid’s glasses online without checking out the choices figuring there wasn’t much and it brought back bad memories. JB probably made her get the cheapest glasses, I don’t think you can buy “used and save the difference “ But at least Giddy has seen an eye doctor.

Even the online glasses sites have kids' glasses broken down by age.,  They also give the basic measurements for each frame. It should be pretty close to impossible to get the wrong size.  Maybe she 'sized up' so he could grow into them and they could save?  Since kids' eyes change a lot in their younger years, probably not a good idea.  And, considering most of the kids' sites have frames for under 10 bucks in many cases, probably not necessary.

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madpsych78

madpsych78

I've worn glasses since I was eleven. I don't trust the online measuring sites and would rather try on the frames themselves to see how they fit. That said, if the frames are cheaper at Wal-Mart than, say, Visionworks, then I can see how one would get the frames at Wal-Mart and then perhaps bring them to the eyecare site where they could put in the lenses?

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SMama

SMama

33 minutes ago, madpsych78 said:

I've worn glasses since I was eleven. I don't trust the online measuring sites and would rather try on the frames themselves to see how they fit. That said, if the frames are cheaper at Wal-Mart than, say, Visionworks, then I can see how one would get the frames at Wal-Mart and then perhaps bring them to the eyecare site where they could put in the lenses?

The Walmart frames I referenced are in their vision center. Giddy would be fitted by the staff and they would also take care of measuring his optical center.

We have only used Walmart twice. Both times we were leaving on vacation and they had the fastest turn around time. On both instances we bought a spare set. We were happy with the glasses even if SGirl didn’t need them. I really hope they take Gideon to get a proper pair of glasses. 

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Zella

Zella

2 hours ago, SMama said:

Joy posted about Gideon’s glasses and confirmed they are prescription. Now here’s where she loses me. Joy said she found out AFTER she bought them that they are too big. How the hell does that happen? SGirl has been wearing glasses since first grade (10th now), a few times she has selected a frame and has been told she needs something smaller. SGirl tends to go for larger frames. Did Joy order them Online? Walmart has reasonably priced frames. Just found that weird. Still, Gideon does look adorable. 

12 minutes ago, SMama said:

The Walmart frames I referenced are in their vision center. Giddy would be fitted by the staff and they would also take care of measuring his optical center.

We have only used Walmart twice. Both times we were leaving on vacation and they had the fastest turn around time. On both instances we bought a spare set. We were happy with the glasses even if SGirl didn’t need them. I really hope they take Gideon to get a proper pair of glasses. 

Yeah I have been getting my frames at Wal-Mart Vision Centers for years because of the price. They always fit them for me, and they've actually been pretty helpful in helping me with finding frames. Actually my most recent pair I got in June, and the first frames I selected, the person assisting me pointed out that the glasses didn't actually fit my nose well, so she found another pair that looked very similar but set better on my face. It wasn't something I'd ever have noticed while trying them on, but after she pointed it out, it was pretty obvious it was going to be an issue with them. 

I find it pretty hard to believe that Joy would have gotten anywhere in person without someone mentioning the fit issue or them noticing it if they'd bothered to try them on. 

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awaken

awaken

7 hours ago, SMama said:

A few years ago there was an event at Fort Rock. They were called on the Pearl’s abusive methods. Austin and Joy defended the Pearls, were proud to have been subjected to corporal punishment, and both felt they turned out just fine.

Yet, I’m blocked from her IG because I asked if they’re supporters of the Pearls’ methods. She actually posted a 🙄. Then blocked me. 

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Gemma Violet

Gemma Violet

Another satisfied Walmart glasses customer here.  I got a pair at the Walmart Vision Center in 2005 and wore them until 2020--yes, 15 years.  (I hate getting new glasses and my prescription had barely changed.)  I finally got a new pair in 2020, again at Walmart, and have been wearing them since with no problem.  Both times I brought in my prescription from my own eye doctor instead of using the Walmart Vision Center doctor.

Gideon is adorable in glasses, but yeah, I agree they're too big.

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Notabug

Notabug

13 hours ago, Dehumidifier said:

Isn't distance between the pupils matching up -- eyes vs, lenses -- important with glasses? If the frames are too big, wouldn't the center point be off? 

Could be.  Even the online glasses' sites like Warby Parker and Zenni give instructions as to how to measure the interpupillary distance.  It isn't hard.  My brother is constantly losing/destroying his glasses and his insurance only pays for new glasses every few years.  I went to the Zenni site, he picked the frames, I measured him up and we ordered them.  They even keep your prescription and measurements on file at the site so it is easy to order  replacements when he sits on them or drops them in the lake or otherwise renders them useless.  He wears bifocals and that is no problem either.  Under 40 bucks and they mail them straight to him.  Terrific.

If Giddy's glasses don't fit him properly, that is on Joy and Austin.  I don't even know how that could happen in this day and age,

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Scarlett45

Scarlett45

1 hour ago, Notabug said:

If Giddy's glasses don't fit him properly, that is on Joy and Austin.  I don't even know how that could happen in this day and age,

I agree. If they made a mistake and the glasses were too big, another pair should've been ordered straight way. This is a NEED not a want for their child.

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FizzyPuff

FizzyPuff

17 hours ago, beckie said:

Even if they refused to send them to public schools, they could send them to private school. I know they won't do anything other than homeschool, but they do have other options.

These two don’t value education if they’re not gonna send their kids to public school there’s no way they’ll pay for private education.

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SMama

SMama

I forgot to mention that Walmart’s Vision Center also carries a decent number of kid frames that  have cartoon characters and other popular things with kids. I recall they had Transformers, Lego, Disney characters, Hot Wheels, My Little Pony, etc.

SBaba, big brother, and myself wear glasses full time. When SGirl needed glasses she saw it as normal, because of us. But I understand how some kids may be unsure about wearing glasses, especially Gideon’s age. Another reason why it baffles me how Giddy ended up with such ill fitting frames. The Duggars are all about Walmart, it’s hard to believe they didn’t consider browsing there. Vision care is not the place to cut corners, Joy and Austin. 

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Scarlett45

Scarlett45

28 minutes ago, SMama said:

I forgot to mention that Walmart’s Vision Center also carries a decent number of kid frames that  have cartoon characters and other popular things with kids. I recall they had Transformers, Lego, Disney characters, Hot Wheels, My Little Pony, etc.

SBaba, big brother, and myself wear glasses full time. When SGirl needed glasses she saw it as normal, because of us. But I understand how some kids may be unsure about wearing glasses, especially Gideon’s age. Another reason why it baffles me how Giddy ended up with such ill fitting frames. The Duggars are all about Walmart, it’s hard to believe they didn’t consider browsing there. Vision care is not the place to cut corners, Joy and Austin. 

I think a lot of people wear glasses these days, so they don't have the stigma they may have had 60-70yrs ago (when my Mom was a kid and bullied for wearing glasses). It also may be the social circle you are in- if you come from a family where most people use corrective lenses, you see it as just a part of life. (like I consider contact solution a hygiene item not a prescription item). But if no one in your immediate circle does, you might not know about the options out there.

I don't doubt Joy and Austin love/care for Gideon, but I don't see them as being the most conscientious and aware about things that don't effect them personally. But I need to check my privilege, I was a grown ass woman in my 30s before I realized there are adults who wear prescription glasses and don't have prescription sunglasses for driving (yes I was super embarassed). So I will cut Joy/Austin a bit of slack- so long as they got it fixed quickly. Gideon isn't that old, they are new parents, and everyone makes mistakes.

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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

31 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I think a lot of people wear glasses these days, so they don't have the stigma they may have had 60-70yrs ago (when my Mom was a kid and bullied for wearing glasses). It also may be the social circle you are in- if you come from a family where most people use corrective lenses, you see it as just a part of life. (like I consider contact solution a hygiene item not a prescription item). But if no one in your immediate circle does, you might not know about the options out there.

I don't doubt Joy and Austin love/care for Gideon, but I don't see them as being the most conscientious and aware about things that don't effect them personally. But I need to check my privilege, I was a grown ass woman in my 30s before I realized there are adults who wear prescription glasses and don't have prescription sunglasses for driving (yes I was super embarassed). So I will cut Joy/Austin a bit of slack- so long as they got it fixed quickly. Gideon isn't that old, they are new parents, and everyone makes mistakes.

Joy, Jill, Jenny and Jana wear glasses, so Joy's not totally clueless about them.

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SMama

SMama

49 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

But I need to check my privilege, I was a grown ass woman in my 30s before I realized there are adults who wear prescription glasses and don't have prescription sunglasses for driving (yes I was super embarassed). So I will cut Joy/Austin a bit of slack- so long as they got it fixed quickly. Gideon isn't that old, they are new parents, and everyone makes mistakes.

We got a lot of criticism for getting SGirl prescription sunglasses with her first glasses. We were told it was unnecessary. Well, her father had them, her brother had them, and her mother had them. SGirl is not a second class citizen, we were not going to deny her the same comfort we had. We live in Southern California, it’s sunny, no one likes the sun messing with their eyes. Funny thing is the same people who criticized us would put regular sunglasses on infants. 🤦🏽‍♀️
 

On topic, I don’t expect Gideon to get expensive frames or Rx sunglasses. He does deserve the best care for his eyes. It’s the only set he will ever have.

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SMama

SMama

(edited)
51 minutes ago, Lady Whistleup said:

Joy was reading a kids book about whales on her IG stories. 

That IG post is proof that Joy has no business teaching anyone anything. First, she is reading Proverbs 2 to a 2 and a 4 year old. Not from a kids bible but from the very kid friendly KJV. 

Then Joy decides to demonstrate she can get down to a kid level when needed. She tells the kids that a blue whale is between 80-100 feet long. Cue the WOOOOOOOOOOOW! Except that again, that is meaningless to 2 year old Evy, and 4 year old Giddy. A better way to help the kids visualize the information is to just walk outside the home. Tell the kids that means the whale is as long (or longer) than their RV, or any other landmark at their disposal. Their kids are doomed,  Joy and her siblings at least got the basics. Gen 2 won’t even have that. I can’t believe Derick turned out to be the better husband and father in terms of providing what his family needs. 

Edited by SMama
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AstridM

AstridM

(edited)
On 9/1/2022 at 2:37 PM, SMama said:

For Gideon to attend real Pre K one of the parents has to believe that their homeschooling is not as good as a public school. Austin and Joy have the kool aid coursing through their veins. 

A few years ago there was an event at Fort Rock. They were called on the Pearl’s abusive methods. Austin and Joy defended the Pearls, were proud to have been subjected to corporal punishment, and both felt they turned out just fine.

Israel and Samuel are enrolled in public school because of Derick. No matter how much lip service he paid to homeschooling when Izzy was kindergarten age he gave up the pretense and made sure his child would get a good education. 

Austin’s hateful, barely literate father also thinks he is qualified  to dictate public school curriculum. The apple probably didn’t fall far from the tree.

18 hours ago, awaken said:

Yet, I’m blocked from her IG because I asked if they’re supporters of the Pearls’ methods. She actually posted a 🙄. Then blocked me. 

That really says it all, doesn’t it?

Edited by AstridM
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