S33.E08: I'm The Kingpin

[AliShibaz]

1 hour ago, Daisy said:

because this is caused to make dramah - probably not. 
this is a dumb thing because it just makes people mad at you. this is why i'd never want to win a reward where you have to choose people. you never win. those challenges you toss and hope someone takes you lol

Good post!

I'm very surprised this is the first time I've ever seen anyone make this point. I have always thought that someone very clever came up with this idea of having to choose one or two other people to go on a reward together with the person who won the reward. Why? Because it causes very bad feelings towards the person who makes those choices. I'm surprised that hasn't been generally recognized.

That is also the reason I think they came up with this "advantage" that enables someone to steal a reward from a person who rightfully earned it.

I'm guessing that in the future, they will try to come up with more shit like this that will cause really bad feelings among the contestents.

Edited November 10, 2016 by AliShibaz

[Ellee]

I'm an old fart.  I'm loving how the Gen-x'ers are saying little but yet so much and the kids are feeling so in control but really aren't.  Ahhh, to be young again and have all....I mean....all the answers.  We were all there at one time.  :D

It will be interesting to see the reaction from the vote and how things get thought out next week. 

I know.  I'm oversimplifying. 

[iMonrey]

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Jay looks really good with the man bun. 

Nobody looks good with a man bun.

I understand the thinking behind the Michelle boot: even if they had a solid eight votes and split them four/four between Taylor and Jay, Adam would still go home because the other five were voting for him. They were too afraid of an idol play. Still - they should have risked it. Taylor and Jay are both much bigger threats, and the end result would still have been a Millennial going home.

I think Zeke nailed Adam's problem when he said Adam wasn't content to play with the Nerd Herd, he was desperate to sit at the Cook Kids table. If I'm being generous I'd say Adam sees how dumb Taylor is and thinks he could be easily manipulated if Jay isn't around. But since Adam wanted to target Will instead of Jay, the cynic in me says Adam has a big old man-crush on Taylor. 

Apparently everyone knows Adam has an idol (Taylor and Jay both seemed to know, anyway), and everyone in on the Michelle vote knew Jay had an idol. Worst kept secrets in the history of the show, maybe.

[piequinn35]

iMonrey, Adam only got 4 votes, Michelle 9.

[jsm1125]

Maybe the majority alliance thought that Adam would vote with Michelle, Jay, Will and Taylor and didn't want to risk being on the wrong side of a 4-4-5 split?

[survivinmt]

 I am completely baffled by Adam's relationship with Taylor. First they are on opposite sides of the tribe. Then Adam helps vote Figgy off. His "explanation" to Taylor is "No two ways about it - I screwed you over." Taylor agrees, so Adam thinks ? he's forgiven? I guess? Then Adam catches Taylor stealing food. Goes straight to him and spills his guts because now that Adam caught him, they are best friends again? What the -- ? Then Adam says, "Don't tell." Taylor tells. So Adam says, "Well, dang, Taylor. Don't tell THIS TIME." There is just no rhyme or reason other than a Kaa-like mesmerization of the blue eyes.

[Hera]

15 hours ago, mojoween said:

Not to mention, how shitty of an advantage is that steal a reward nonsense?  First you have to explain how you got it, then you take someone's family from them, if that is when you decide to use it?

That advantage is guaranteed to cost you votes if you make FTC.

That was my thought as well. Being able to steal immunity off of someone would be an advantage, but stealing a reward? Sure, it might be fun to steal one of those "overnight at the spa"-type rewards that come late in the game, but doing that doesn't guarantee your safety and might even endanger it. I guess the producers were thinking of immunity advantages as rewards when they came up with this idea? Or rewards where players are split into teams and all but one member of an alliance are on one team and win together?

Then again, people in Survivor are never as rational about rewards as those of us watching the game are. I'm pretty sure Chase in Nicaragua lost the game by failing to bring people on rewards after promising he would. Rodney got super mad at Carolyn in Worlds Apart for not giving up her reward for him after she promised she would (never mind how dumb it was of her to promise something like that and not follow through). I think being out there, dealing with both the discomfort and the long periods of boredom in the game means that rewards take on a significance to the players that's hard to get across to the audience. I still think that in the overwhelming majority of cases, using this "advantage" is a bad idea, but I think the producers are banking on the temptation being too great and someone doing it anyway.

3 hours ago, BusyOctober said:

I was confused why the Gen-X/Nerd alliance didn't gang up to take out Jay or Taylor.  Even if anyone suspected either had an idol, why not split the vote?  Maybe they didn't have the numbers to split?

Good point. The nine people who voted together definitely did have the votes to split: the vote would have been 5-4 which would get out the person who had the five votes against, unless the idol was played for that person, in which case there would have been a tie, and on the revote, there would be nine votes against whoever didn't use the idol. I guess they didn't because the trust wasn't quite there. If Hannah or Zeke flipped, then Taylor/Jay/Will/Michelle would know which guy is getting five votes, which means that they can use the idol to nullify them, and use their own five votes to boot whomever they wanted.

However, now that the nine have built some trust, maybe they'll split the vote next time. Or, since no one seems to trust Adam, they'll all put aside their differences and vote him out 11-1.

[Daisy]

I guess. the argument is.  If you steal a reward - you can get a clue for the HII. 
if no one knows about it, and you want to get a loved one/advantage to the immunity challenge (which if i recall correctly everyone who has that advantage has won the immunity... oh except Malcolm because he sucked at balancing things) or just get some love. 

so it could be useful. but you'd seriously have to be a complete poophead to use it. 

[spiderpig]

Swimming against the tide here, but for me this is the least interesting Survivor ever.  I can't identify any of the players except Ken (who is handsome).  They're just empty suits/bikinis.

I still watch, but miniaturized in the corner of my monitor. And I do word puzzles during all the tribal banter.

Sorry - this season just doesn't do it for me.

[Daisy]

1 minute ago, spiderpig said:

Swimming against the tide here, but for me this is the least interesting Survivor ever.  I can't identify any of the players except Ken (who is handsome).  They're just empty suits/bikinis.

I still watch, but miniaturized in the corner of my monitor. And I do word puzzles during all the tribal banter.

Sorry - this season just doesn't do it for me.

it's your opinion, you don't have to apologise for it. 

[plurie]

1 hour ago, AliShibaz said:

 I have always thought that someone very clever came up with this idea of having to choose one or two other people to go on a reward together with the person who won the reward. Why? Because it causes very bad feelings towards the person who makes those choices. I'm surprised that hasn't been generally recognized.

That is also the reason I think they came up with this "advantage" that enables someone to steal a reward from a person who rightfully earned it.

I'm guessing that in the future, they will try to come up with more shit like this that will cause really bad feelings among the contestents.

You really don't want to win the reward challenges. Not only does it create bad feelings in your alliance (UNLESS you've already decided the best way to pick the others so as not to leave "loose cannons" back at camp to be flipped by the opposing alliance), but it makes you a "challenge threat" to be voted out the first time you lose individual immunity.

[spiderpig]

5 minutes ago, Daisy said:

it's your opinion, you don't have to apologise for it. 

:-)

[iMonrey]

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Adam only got 4 votes, Michelle 9.

Oh crap. Then I don't know. Vote out Jay or Taylor you idiots!

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Swimming against the tide here, but for me this is the least interesting Survivor ever.  I can't identify any of the players except Ken (who is handsome).  They're just empty suits/bikinis.

I'd agree it's certainly not the most interesting cast they've ever had, but at the same time, it's one of the least offensive they've had as well. I tend to value to latter more lately. I don't even know who I'm rooting for, really - but there have been too many seasons where I had to shut the damn thing off and quit watching until they got rid of a certain player because I simply couldn't stand the sight of them (cough*hantz*cough).

[spiderpig]

4 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Oh crap. Then I don't know. Vote out Jay or Taylor you idiots!

I'd agree it's certainly not the most interesting cast they've ever had, but at the same time, it's one of the least offensive they've had as well. I tend to value to latter more lately. I don't even know who I'm rooting for, really - but there have been too many seasons where I had to shut the damn thing off and quit watching until they got rid of a certain player because I simply couldn't stand the sight of them (cough*hantz*cough).

Oh - totally agree.  Hantz was the poster boy of yuck.

[simplyme]

My thought on Adam's "advantage" is that you take it. You don't have to use it unless it's to steal something important, but you don't leave it there for someone else to possibly screw you over.

I think Adam really wants to work with Tayls and have Tayls be okay with him for voting Figgy out. I think that emotion, rather than strategy, is what was driving his sad, repeated attempts to bond. Yeah, I shouted at my TV, "OMG, Adam. Shut up!"

Zeke was never going to work with Michelle. She has always been the person he trusted least on his tribe since the Mari vote, so removing her from the game is a higher priority for him than Taylor or maybe even Jay. David has also mistrusted Michelle since she tossed his name out instead of CeCe's. I still see the whole belching scene a week ago as meant to reinforce Chris, Zeke, and David as a threesome and stoic Michelle as the awkward fourth, which is pretty much where she was. She never bonded with them.

So, if you're afraid Jay has the idol and you aren't sure WTF Adam is doing and don't want to count on his vote, you vote Michelle. No one who has actually met Michelle for more than two days sees Taylor as a bigger threat, except to their stomachs.

For some reason I thought Hannah made the comment about Adam wanting to be with the Cool Kids, which I thought was funny since she'd been blamed for the same thing by some viewers when she got stuck having to choose and run numbers mid-TC. (And can we agree now that Adam and Zeke have apparently at least somewhat gotten over her terrible betrayal despite her inability to shut the hell up when they needed to process? What can I say. Hannah's doomed, but she's my nerd princess.)

I kind of like when Jay has his buff around his head so his hair goes into that WhoVille almost-pigtails style. It shows off his cheekbones and simultaneously makes me laugh. I am so deep.

Edited November 10, 2016 by simplyme
Left out random words. Whoops.

[ljenkins782]

15 hours ago, Wandering Snark said:

Agreed on Hannah making a good move w/Adam. When the girl with the panic attacks and anxiety tells you you need to just chill? You should chill.

Loved how she rattled off that checklist of 'things that hurt right now' during the challenge.

Hannah came off much better in this episode than she has in the prior ones. Her TH about Jay thinking she's some pathetic idiot made me laugh. 

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Ugh.  Honestly, if I knew someone was stealing the food and he sat there and admitted it with a smug smile on his face, I would've voted his butt out then.  Jerk.  Here's hoping that doesn't come back to bite the Gen-Xers in the end.  With this game you never know.

Yeah, how the hell did he come out of that completely unscathed? I guess being pretty and dim really works for some people, like Fabio. 

I did laugh at the fact that Bret, the cop, said "I didn't want to be the one to say something." Hope that's not how he acts on the job! "Well, I saw that guy murdering someone, but I didn't want to be the one to say anything..." 

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Based on the fact that Michaela was such an integral part of the game, I found it interesting that the other teams didn't inquire about her.  I thought at least one person would remark on her absence. 

Right? I mean, I'm sure they did and it just didn't make the show, but I would have thought that boot would have been a big bombshell to the other tribe. 
 

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It takes me a long time to notice some people, and tonight is the night that I notice that Jay is beautiful I guess.  Taylor is too, but his looks are not really my thang.  It's so..... "obvious".  LOL.  It reminds me of a funny Seinfeld line or something:  (Sarcastically:)  "Yeah.... I like to work really HARD to see beauty." 

 

Jay's looks aren't really my taste, but he definitely looks like he could step into a boy band and blend right in. Taylor's got beautiful eyes but the 'duh' vibes radiate so hard off of him that I can't find him attractive either. Ken, on the other hand...just stunning. 

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Michelle's massive amounts of pre-merge screen time -- single-handedly saving Figgy and I believe, her attempts to vote out David -- coupled with her utter lack of screen time tonight make one of the strangest edits I've seen in a while. I can't get over that the last real decent screen time we saw from her was using a knife and fork while trying to eat over three guys' flatulence.

Yeah, they certainly did a nice job hiding this boot because she was not featured much at all tonight. I'm bummed out, I liked her and thought she had potential. 

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I know, let's put out 'advantages' that will only draw you a beating... and see if someone goes for it! This was the least advantageous advantage ever. I should be named the 'Get you kicked in the balls advantage.' And should be pronounced with air quotes when you say the 'advantage' part. Who could be horrible enough and power hungry enough to steal a reward from someone. Oh no, that won't backfire on you at all... and yet Adam seems to be so totally into it even if used in the worst possible way. (ETA: GMTA mojo) It's actually the only reason I'm glad he survived.

Ha, very true. 'Hey, you just held your arms over your head for four hours so you could see your family? NOPE, MINE!!' Adam's popularity is going to shoot through the roof with that! Also, the fact that Adam is the most awkward, over enthusiastic Survivor geek makes it pretty likely that he will handle it as ham-fistedly as possible. Someone like Taylor, who is apparently teflon when it comes to stealing stuff, or Jay, who has the social skills to smooth things over, could pull this off, but Adam does not have that kind of personality.

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I doubt Chris will turn into much of an individual IC threat.  In the team competitions, he's fantastic.  The individual comps require a more rounded skill set than I think he has.  He's an excellent player, though, and this actually may help him go deeper.

Yeah, the post-merge challenges don't favor the giant men. Their strength and size is useful in group challenges, but now is where they pull out the balance and endurance challenges. A guy that big isn't going to be able to balance on a floating lilypad or whatever. 

David's performance surprised me, he really hung in there. 

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I feel awful for Adam, knowing what we know about his mom.  But I do wish he'd stop talking in Gameshow Announcer Voice.  I feel like he's speaking in soundbites in order to get screentime, and it's working.

God, yes. I feel absolutely terrible about his mom being sick and now to learn that she has since passed away. But I can't stand his confessionals. The shouting pronouncements about "how the game works" etc. are just so irritating. And for someone who thinks he knows the game so well, he was fucking it up royally in that episode. I feel like his edit is setting him up for a big fall. 

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I think Zeke is in a great position. If they manage to knock off Will, Taylor, Jay - they're going to have to start turning on each other, relying on smaller voting blocks, etc. Zeke is close with Adam and Hannah. He's also close with Chris, who can bring along Sunday and Brett. David seems to really trust him as well. So he could really position himself well, if he's smart about it. Or it could be his downfall, if people start to notice that and see it as a threat. But I'm hoping they won't.

Zeke definitely seems like a sleeper threat. He's got the strongest bridge between the original tribes and seems most able to fit in with the lower key GenXers. Now that Taylor and Jay are an island unto themselves, the cool kids group that he was left out of doesn't matter so much. 

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

Survivor's Lines Are Blurring When Three Tribes Become One

Will GenXers and Millennials revert to their generational alliances post-merge, or have new friendships formed during their time away?

[simplyme]

Actually, the recap points out something that I noticed but forgot to comment on until now. Will did have a LOT more wiggle room in his rig than others. He could actually move his wrists around enough that even I noticed without his bar getting pulled.

I'm sure the rigs were adjusted for height, but they didn't do a good job of making sure everyone had the same amount of slack in the cuff-to-bar link. (Still, kudos for keeping both arms up and pretty damn still while balanced on a perch for that long. More wiggle room doesn't mean it was easy.)

[laurakaye]

1 hour ago, iMonrey said:

I'd agree it's certainly not the most interesting cast they've ever had, but at the same time, it's one of the least offensive they've had as well. I tend to value to latter more lately. I don't even know who I'm rooting for, really - but there have been too many seasons where I had to shut the damn thing off and quit watching until they got rid of a certain player because I simply couldn't stand the sight of them (cough*hantz*cough).

Which is why I'm loving this season so far.  A cast doesn't have to be controversial to be entertaining.  I'm liking the fact that we have thinkers and players this season in Ken, Zeke, David, Michelle, etc.  I've had enough of players like Dan/Will/Scot/Bounty to last me a few seasons.

1 hour ago, survivinmt said:

 I am completely baffled by Adam's relationship with Taylor. First they are on opposite sides of the tribe. Then Adam helps vote Figgy off. His "explanation" to Taylor is "No two ways about it - I screwed you over." Taylor agrees, so Adam thinks ? he's forgiven? I guess? Then Adam catches Taylor stealing food. Goes straight to him and spills his guts because now that Adam caught him, they are best friends again? What the -- ? Then Adam says, "Don't tell." Taylor tells. So Adam says, "Well, dang, Taylor. Don't tell THIS TIME." There is just no rhyme or reason other than a Kaa-like mesmerization of the blue eyes.

Adam is just so darned earnest with Taylor, I cringe with second-hand embarrassment for him.  There's absolutely no need for Adam to kowtow to Taylor, so it makes his excessive apologies seem strange.  The only thing I can think of is that, unlike Zeke, Adam wants very much to be in with the "cool kids," while Zeke recognizes that hanging with Tayls and Jay would get him nowhere except booted out at the first available opportunity.  I think all of Adam's talking about Jay's "right-hand man" was his way of trying to ingratiate himself into becoming Tayl's confidante, forgoing Jay for Adam.  Still don't know why, though.

33 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

Jay's looks aren't really my taste, but he definitely looks like he could step into a boy band and blend right in. Taylor's got beautiful eyes but the 'duh' vibes radiate so hard off of him that I can't find him attractive either. Ken, on the other hand...just stunning. 

THIS. ^^^

[iMonrey]

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David's performance surprised me, he really hung in there. 

I was trying to decide who that kind of challenge really favored. Maybe skinny people? If your arms are heavy maybe you're at a disadvantage.

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I'm sure the rigs were adjusted for height, but they didn't do a good job of making sure everyone had the same amount of slack in the cuff-to-bar link. 

I noticed that too - Jessica's arms were straight and taut, Will's were crooked. 

Quote

 I think all of Adam's talking about Jay's "right-hand man" was his way of trying to ingratiate himself into becoming Tayl's confidante, forgoing Jay for Adam.  Still don't know why, though.

Man crush.

[ghoulina]

4 hours ago, Dominii said:

 

Not upset that Michelle is gone. I haven't forgiven her since she persuaded her tribe to vote out Mari. It was a dick move.

 

I don't see how it was a dick move. Michelle's closest ally in the game, Figgy, was being targeted. Michelle wanted to save her, so she found a target from the other side. I believe Mari was picked because of how smart and cunning she was perceived as being. I think it was a compliment to Mari, more than anything. 

[ghoulina]

1 hour ago, plurie said:

You really don't want to win the reward challenges. Not only does it create bad feelings in your alliance (UNLESS you've already decided the best way to pick the others so as not to leave "loose cannons" back at camp to be flipped by the opposing alliance), but it makes you a "challenge threat" to be voted out the first time you lose individual immunity.

I agree. RCs are so tricky. I would absolutely sit down with my alliance members and say, "This is how I'm going to do it if I ever win reward. I will not take those I'm closest to, because we don't want to leave bitter Betties back at camp to hatch plans. So just know this ahead of time, and don't be upset by it." Orrrr....I'd let everyone know I'd take the person closest to winning or something. 

 

59 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

David's performance surprised me, he really hung in there. 

I know! I thought sure he didn't have the upper body strength to hang in more than a few minutes. 

 

15 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

I was trying to decide who that kind of challenge really favored. Maybe skinny people? If your arms are heavy maybe you're at a disadvantage.

Yea, the bigger dudes weren't going to do well. Not only do they likely have bigger feet, making it harder to balance on the perch; but they have more mass to balance AND to hold up. I figure it would be someone smaller, but strong. Will makes sense. He's slim, but fit. Plus, there's the whole incentive of knowing that you could be the one to go home. 

[Lamima]

For the reward challenge winners, couldn't they ask trivia questions of the other tribemates  (maybe Survivor history) and take those who can answer the questions? Or maybe pick your closest ally and say outloud that they get to pick the next person. And I always yell at the TV that they should just take the tribemates who were closest to winning (2nd and 3rd place people).

Adam...if I were him I would either: give it to Tayls to use right before a reward challenge as that dude is so arrogant he would use it and target would be on him. Or I'd wait until Tayls, Will or Jay wins reward and they take each other, then I'd swap for one of them...probably Tayls as he is the dumber one that would be safe to leave behind with the others. I think it would be best to give it to one of the millennial bros to use so that puts a target on them.

Does anyone know if Adam has to steal from the winner before the winner picks who to share the reward with or can he wait until all guests are chosen and then steal it from any of them?

Edited November 10, 2016 by Lamima

[iMonrey]

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Does anyone know if Adam has to steal from the winner before the winner picks who to share the reward with or can he wait until all guests are chosen and then steal it from any of them?

No, they haven't explained in detail how it works. If someone wins and picks two people to come along, I'm assuming that Adam could at that point "steal" the prize from whoever won it, and pick his own two people to come along. On the other hand, he might choose to steal it before the winner chooses who he wants to come with him.

[Trick Question]

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Also, his "advantage" doesn't seem like a true advantage, to me. I'd probably only use that if the reward from a challenge was ANOTHER advantage in the game. Otherwise, just snatching up someone reward? That's going to put a big old target on your back. 

Speaking of, Taylor the food hoarder is an asshole. Plain and Simple. 

 

Easy solution to both points....if Taylor wins a food reward, Adam steals it from him.  Only person really mad in that situation is Taylor (and Jay/Will, probably), rest of the tribe doesn't mind since Taylor is already over-eating.

[HurricaneVal]

Why are all the millennials so filthy dirty?  They are smudged all over with dirt.  Hannah, in particular, looked like she'd been rolling around in the sooty fire ashes.  When she raised her arms in that challenge, her belly was all black with dirt, and she had dirt all over her face.  Several of the others had big splotches of dirt on themselves.  At first I thought it was some kind of attempt at insect repellent, but it was all patchy and random, not like something purposely applied for that function.  Then I thought maybe it was a tribal thing, you know, like the tribe a few seasons back who used to paint themselves up for the competitions, but again the smudges were not in any sort of discernible pattern.  I just think they're dirty.  They all look like they're on Naked and Afraid rather than Survivor.  Don't they have a nice beach and cove they can rinse off in?  The GenXers don't seem to be as dirty (with the exception of David) as the Millennials. 

 

I hope keeping Taylor was a strategic move, because he is so obnoxious and unliked by most everyone remaining that he'll make a good goat at final tribal council.  But why not take advantage and get rid of Jay rather than Michelle?  Jay was the one doing all the scheming!

[tvfanatic13]

^^ Thank you HurricaneVal. I knew that there was something I wanted to post, and it was how absolutely filthy Hannah looked!

[piequinn35]

I hope there's an auction this season, 

and if someone gets an advantage can Adam use his advantage to steal it?

"Oh Jeff, I have this thingy..." :))

[Wandering Snark]

14 hours ago, loki567 said:

I don't want to say I like Taylor but I appreciate what's he bringing to the show as a character. I mean he was part of the most upfront romance that I can remember on Survivor. His frenemies dynamic with Adam is hilarious. And the fact that he would not only steal food but admit it at tribal council with a shit-eating grin on his face?

Somewhere Kel is eating jerky and telling everyone around him how he was wronged and this kid just skates by after being caught red-handed! Oh how times have changed.

14 minutes ago, HurricaneVal said:

Why are all the millennials so filthy dirty?  They are smudged all over with dirt.

Indeed they are... when they were showing Taylor his whole back was covered in patchy dirt so much I was distracted by it.

Edited November 10, 2016 by Wandering Snark

[ghoulina]

31 minutes ago, Trick Question said:

Easy solution to both points....if Taylor wins a food reward, Adam steals it from him.  Only person really mad in that situation is Taylor (and Jay/Will, probably), rest of the tribe doesn't mind since Taylor is already over-eating.

Ha. Yea, I would definitely use it on Taylor. 

[green]

4 hours ago, BusyOctober said:

... I was confused why the Gen-X/Nerd alliance didn't gang up to take out Jay or Taylor.  Even if anyone suspected either had an idol, why not split the vote?  Maybe they didn't have the numbers to split?  But Michelle was a dumb choice.  Sunday, Hannah & Jessica surely see the writing on the proverbial men's room wall - "Dicks B4 Chicks!"

 

Others, especially daisy, did a great job showing that it isn't a men's alliance thing.  All the women voted out had logical reasons. 

Ironically the one man voted out, Paul, was the one lone person voted out because of his gender because Jessica feared him forming an inner men's alliance within their larger alliance.  Other than Paul's either real or not real plans of a men's alliance we have blissfully NOT had alliances based on gender all season and I for one am grateful for it.

As for the remaining women: Jessica is closest to Ken.  Sunday is closest to Brett and Chris.  Hannah is closest to Zeke.  None of these men seem to indicate they would cast aside their female alliance mate to bond with other men instead.

Others have explained the reason not for a split Jay/Taylor vote already too.  A 5-4-4 could easily flip to a 4-4-5 and the large alliance would lose a member.  All it would take is one person flipping.  Given Adam was acting like a completely idiotic lunatic as the vote neared and was even seen huddling with The Jay Gang would you trust your future in the game to what Adam would do? 

Michelle was a very good choice strategy wise to me.  Jay could have gotten wind of the millennial outliers joining Gen-X.  Though from his expressions at tribal he didn't seem to have even consider they had gone in that direction there was no way the larger alliance could know if the plan would leak (again, see Adam the Motor Mouth).  So if he did he would either play the idol on himself or think they would guess that he had one and play it for Taylor who seemed the most logical target after him.  He would never think Michelle would be in danger.

1 hour ago, AliShibaz said:

... I'm surprised no one seems to question whether this is really and advantage or not. It sure seems to me like it could well be a disadvantage more so than an advantage.

If you won a reward as a result of a hard fought challenge and then some rat stands up and says, "Oh Probst? I think I'd like to take that reward. Here's a piece of paper that says that says I have the right to do that. What would your reaction to that be?

 

I think lots of people have discussed it in this thread and all find it a disadvantage.

I will add that there might be some place where it might work.  Like the reward is that it gives a person advantage in the next immunity challenge and Adam being Adam has managed to get himself on the chopping block with one of his dumb moves yet again and needs that I.C. win because his idol has been played by then and he knows everyone is gunning for him as "the easy next vote" so it is worth a "Hail Mary" to use it. 

So I don't think it would have been wise to re-hide the scroll.  Just tuck it away and wait and see.  They might have added an advantage that would be good to steal to a reward to match adding this advantage to the game even.  If not, you don't need to use it because under normal circumstances it would be a total disadvantage.

Of course Adam already blabbed the advantage to Taylor so it is the worst disadvantage possible now for him whether he plays it or not.  The one person who could totally screw up the use or not of this "advantage" was the one that found it, sigh.

 

20 minutes ago, jsm1125 said:

Maybe the majority alliance thought that Adam would vote with Michelle, Jay, Will and Taylor and didn't want to risk being on the wrong side of a 4-4-5 split?

I concur totally.  Adam has become such a loose canon at this point and he is lucky Hannah was willing to go talk to the others to patch things up for him.  And good for her knowing she could NOT even take him along for the patch-up meeting cause he was bound to mess that meeting up too. 

Sadly his days are numbered.  He seems a nice guy and big fan but just went bonkers over being able to be on the show for real like it was his dream of a lifetime and just messes up things right and left in his over excitement and over thinking everything..

Edited November 11, 2016 by green

[violet and green]

I am very  pleased to see Michelle gone. Didn't like her from the start, and was furious that she orchestrated Mari's boot, though it's all gone a bit blurry; she seemed pleased with herself and over-rated to me throughout the show, also. I do recall the scene after that tribal where Zeke and Adam were lying on the beach and Zeke was particularly blindsided and upset, as the way the vote went revealed his low bottom position on the tribe, and Hannah jawing on wanting to apologize/explain, and over and over him telling her to just leave it be for now, and then Adam having to say the same thing... ARGH! So I can see why Zeke might think flicking Michelle is not a bad idea v two guys who can swap an idol.

Apart from Mari, I haven't been too fussed about any of the women getting voted out. It is an odd pattern, but I am not upset over it. I don't really like many of this cast - but happily, Mari aside (sob), the ones I do find more interesting and do feel invested in have managed to stay.

That was a lot of shouty young men confessionals in that ep though, thank god that's over.

I found it interesting that Jay remarked at the start re Michaela's exit, 'I thought she was going to punch me in the face.' Seems he picked up the same vibe I did. Golly! Given he was there, I would trust his impression. (Not that I ever doubted mine. Been around enough silently raging women in my time.)

[peachmangosteen]

4 hours ago, simplyme said:

Zeke was never going to work with Michelle. She has always been the person he trusted least on his tribe since the Mari vote, so removing her from the game is a higher priority for him than Taylor or maybe even Jay. David has also mistrusted Michelle since she tossed his name out instead of CeCe's. I still see the whole belching scene a week ago as meant to reinforce Chris, Zeke, and David as a threesome and stoic Michelle as the awkward fourth, which is pretty much where she was. She never bonded with them.

LMAO at myself that I literally forgot about all this. Michelle's boot makes a lot more sense now even with the weird editing. Which actually makes the weird editing even weirder.

I forgot in my last post to comment on the advantage Adam found. It seems horrible. Like that is in no way an advantage. The only advantage in finding that is that someone else didn't so someone can't steal a reward you receive. I feel like maybe there's more to it or something, because it really doesn't make any sense.

[HurricaneVal]

I dunno.  I suspect that if Adam were to steal a steak dinner away from food-stealing Taylor that wouldn't go down as a disaster to the rest of the tribe.  But I do agree that he'd have to use it wisely, and where it will really count.  Otherwise he'll just stir up resentment.

 

IF he makes it to the final tribal council after doing such a thing, he needs to be able to claim that he took the family visit, or took the restorative spa trip, or the steak dinner, whatever, from so-and-so for these reasons, and those reasons had better be pretty damn strategic.  So, for instance, if he took a steak dinner away from Taylor or Brett, he should say it was so they would go into the next immunity challenge a little weaker and he could go in stronger and then back it up and say "See, it worked.  Here I am sitting here, and there they are sitting there."  That "advantage" is really a hidden bomb, but if used correctly, could take out an enemy.  The hard thing is, there's many, many more ways the whole thing could blow up in his face...

Edited November 10, 2016 by HurricaneVal
Typos

[Haleth]

Man, I can't believe I forgot Survivor was on AGAIN. Or maybe I was still in shock and couldn't deal with any sort of voting. Anyway, how dumb is Taylor?  And how close behind him is Jay?  I love it when a smug, over confident alliance gets blindsided. Their faces were precious.  I look at that and their posturing, all the threats of revenge, then take a glance at Chris, whose steely stare could pierce you right to your heart. That man has an intense glare. Separates the men from the boys. 

[JudyObscure]

Since we know Tayls is selfish, and that his stomach does weird things when he's hungry causing him to suffer unbearable agony.  Adam might want to wait until he's pretty sure Taylor and others are planning to vote him out and promise Taylor that if he does not vote against him, he can have the reward advantage after Tribal.

[LanceM]

9 hours ago, Dominii said:

Not upset that Michelle is gone. I haven't forgiven her since she persuaded her tribe to vote out Mari. It was a dick move. Survivor is skewed against most female players simply because of the physicality of the challenges. So, it's always disheartening when females vote against each other right out of the gate. It puts them at a disadvantage right away.

It seems like women have been losing a lot lately, and in much bigger arenas than Survivor. More's the pity.

Chris or Ken for the win, with David a distant third.

Just curious if you apply this same logic to Mari. Was it a dick move for her to try to vote out Figgy?

[Maverick]

10 hours ago, laurakaye said:

I'm not sure how "being good with Mason jars" translates into "I'm gonna steal this food 'cause I'm hungry," but whatever, Tayls.

 I don't understand how one is "good with Mason jars."  They're not exactly complex machinery.   Does he think screwing on a lid is a significant accomplishment?  Given his apparent intelligence I guess I can understand that.   

[Wandering Snark]

1 hour ago, peachmangosteen said:

I forgot in my last post to comment on the advantage Adam found. It seems horrible. Like that is in no way an advantage. The only advantage in finding that is that someone else didn't so someone can't steal a reward you receive. I feel like maybe there's more to it or something, because it really doesn't make any sense.

I get this feeling there is more to it, like a giant Acme cartoon hammer will come from the sky and splat him into the ground for even trying to use such a nasty thing... it was really the glee at his own mentioning of stealing a loved one visit that really set me off though.

[PerfidiousAmber]

Is it just me or does anyone else feel ripped off that we didn't get to see how Bret responded to the "let's introduce ourselves and say what we do" meet and greet? I was so anticipating either seeing reactions to him fessing up to be a cop or enjoying seeing him flounder around his funeral director schtick some more. I was glad to see him employing some thoughtful strategy though. I still wish we could see more from Sunday. Why is she being so totally ignored?

I was super impressed with Jessica for lasting so long in that immunity challenge. Girl is made of steel. She might even have won if Will hadn't been so totally focused on winning at all costs thanks to loud-mouth Adam's idiocy. I was also so happy that David did so well in the challenge!

I also loved seeing Hannah's handling of Adam  - "Dude, seriously just SHUT THE FUCK UP ALREADY AND DO WHAT I SAY." Adam has got to be a goner now though. That was some of the worst gameplay I have ever seen. He's gonna need that idol soon.

I was also disappointed that no one, even David, was able to make out the hidden message in the "congratulations you've made the merge" note, despite it being in plain view. Didn't matter in the end as Adam found it anyway, but still.

And how cute were those bats? Especially the yawning one near the beginning.

[Haleth]

Yes!  Lots of shots of the bats!  So cute!

[huahaha]

32 minutes ago, Maverick said:

 I don't understand how one is "good with Mason jars."  They're not exactly complex machinery.   Does he think screwing on a lid is a significant accomplishment?  Given his apparent intelligence I guess I can understand that.   

I thought he was going to somehow put the food in airtight containers and bury it for later. Instead, he just used the jar as a carrier, then scarfed several thousand calories in one late-night sitting. If I didn't know better, I'd say he had the munchies.

As abhorrent as the behavior looks from our side of the tv screen, I can't imagine what the people who had been hungry for weeks were feeling. That had to be some primal hatred.

[Wandering Snark]

16 minutes ago, PerfidiousAmber said:

I was also disappointed that no one, even David, was able to make out the hidden message in the "congratulations you've made the merge" note, despite it being in plain view. Didn't matter in the end as Adam found it anyway, but still.

I think people looked for a little rolled up clue (I thought it was what that thief was doing before I realized he was just riffling through the stocks) and when they didn't see anything they disregarded their little word game. I feel sorry for the intern that had to come up with that in 'Standard Survivor Rhyme' for it to not get recognized...

[OldWiseOne]

1 hour ago, huahaha said:

I thought he was going to somehow put the food in airtight containers and bury it for later. Instead, he just used the jar as a carrier, then scarfed several thousand calories in one late-night sitting. If I didn't know better, I'd say he had the munchies.

As abhorrent as the behavior looks from our side of the tv screen, I can't imagine what the people who had been hungry for weeks were feeling. That had to be some primal hatred.

He did bury it, at the end of his conversation with Adam he was burying the jar. And that is exactly where his claim that it wasn't stealing because everyone knew he had done it went off the rails for me - if he had just eaten a bunch of food from the containers they came in then you're selfish, but once you put it in a different container and hide it from everyone else that's stealing!

[huahaha]

1 minute ago, OldWiseOne said:

He did bury it, at the end of his conversation with Adam he was burying the jar. And that is exactly where his claim that it wasn't stealing because everyone knew he had done it went off the rails for me - if he had just eaten a bunch of food from the containers they came in then you're selfish, but once you put it in a different container and hide it from everyone else that's stealing!

Wasn't that just the dregs of his major scarf-down though? 

[Adeejay]

9 hours ago, AliShibaz said:

I have always thought that someone very clever came up with this idea of having to choose one or two other people to go on a reward together with the person who won the reward. Why? Because it causes very bad feelings towards the person who makes those choices.

I don't know when these people are going to realize it's a trap.  On Survivor Cambodia: Second Chances, Tasha, Jeremy and Spencer were  royally pissed that they were left out of the reward trip. They started working together and eventually got rid of all the people who went on the reward.  They wound up being the final three.   

[peachmangosteen]

2 hours ago, Maverick said:

 I don't understand how one is "good with Mason jars."  They're not exactly complex machinery.   Does he think screwing on a lid is a significant accomplishment?  

I don't know, sometimes those lids are really hard to screw on!

[Lingo]

7 hours ago, iMonrey said:

No, they haven't explained in detail how it works. If someone wins and picks two people to come along, I'm assuming that Adam could at that point "steal" the prize from whoever won it, and pick his own two people to come along. On the other hand, he might choose to steal it before the winner chooses who he wants to come with him.

Actually, Adam started to read the rules and it sounded like the rules said he needs to wait until the reward is all settled and the rewardee(s) are about to walk off the beach to their reward before he tells Jeff he'll use the advantage. So, what it sounds like to me (here I'm speculating) is that if it's a group reward, he may be able to take the place of any person on the winning team. And if it's an individual reward where person X wins the reward and then chooses Y and Z to come with, then Adam can switch places with X or maybe even Y or Z. But he probably can't pick his own reward posse (which is probably for the best anyway, as X will still take the heat for who he chose).

[AliShibaz]

There are so many different criteria you can use to choose who you want to ally with. Gender has to be one of the most stupid. How can being the same gender help you bond with someone? I can see how being the opposite gender might help most people bond with someone. But, IMHO, choosing to align with people because they are the same gender as you are is a really dumbell thing to do.

People who propose alliances based on gender seem to me to be the most stupid of all the contestants. I'm surprised Tails never proposed one.

[green]

18 hours ago, PerfidiousAmber said:

... I still wish we could see more from Sunday. Why is she being so totally ignored? ...

I think you have to say something interesting or funny in a confessional, do something in the game, be involved in some drama going down, win an individual challenge or just be dumbly entertaining like a Taylor to get face time on the show.  But we haven't seen Sunday do anything in the game other than be the loyal lieutenant.  We haven't seen her get dramatic over something.  She hasn't said anything of interest.  She hasn't done anything in any of the challenges worth noting.  And she hasn't entertained. 

If she had done any of these things I'm sure she would get some face time but she is the one that has to kind of earn it.  I mean the editors are looking -- nay, begging -- for people to give them something to work with.  They would probably have been gleeful if Sunday had provided them with some stuff I'd imagine.  Sometimes the casting strikes out with one of the Survivors and they bring zilch to the show.  It happens. 

But Sunday is still there so she hasn't struck out yet.  Maybe she will hit a homer in the ninth.

16 hours ago, Adeejay said:

I don't know when these people are going to realize it's a trap.  On Survivor Cambodia: Second Chances, Tasha, Jeremy and Spencer were  royally pissed that they were left out of the reward trip. They started working together and eventually got rid of all the people who went on the reward.  They wound up being the final three.   

You have to realize that hunger is a very real thing.  It isn't abstract.  A reward for food pushes everything else aside even if the players know intellectually it is a trap.  And I'd guess 99% of them know just that.  But a chance to have food when you are so very very hungry pushes the game to the background. 

Also people naturally want to do their best in a competition.  It is really hard psychologically to force yourself to try and lose even it intellectually you know it may be the best move.  Couple that with the hunger and it is almost impossible for anyone not to go all out to try and win a food reward.  A few have managed not to fall into the trap but it takes a will of iron at a level which most people don't possess.

In other words, living the game of Survivor is a lot harder than watching the game.  I'm sure lots of people who have watched the game then end up on the show know not to win rewards and have to make picks that get them in trouble.  But knowing that is different than being in that situation where every muscle and fiber of your being wants food and wants to compete and win as well.  So they end up like everyone else and go all out to win and get the food and "glory" of winning as well.

Edited November 11, 2016 by green