Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

[subber]

Who would want to be associated with the Duggars after this? Marjorie fled after the first Josh scandal broke. I think Boob may be stuck with supporting the entire brood indefinitely since I doubt employable suitors are going to be lining up to court the unmarried girls and the guys will have a tough time finding fundie girls whose parents would welcome a Duggar into the family. No one has an education except Derick, and even he has abandoned a paying gig. Joshie's screw up will have repercussions for the entire family for a long time to come.

It's probably time to pull the plug on social media, retreat into the compound, make an accounting of their assets, and figure out how to live their lives out of the spotlight. It's about time.

Edited August 21, 2015 by subber

[HundFan]

HFC I had to look the term up as well. Not knowing what it meant when I first read it made me feel very unhip - and once I understood what it meant it also made me blush.

[BostonBlonde]

First, my prayers go out to Anna, and I am not known as much of a pray-er. Anyway she turns, her life is made of shit, and with a one month old!: Is she leaves Josh, won't her fundy parents will turn her away and tell her to get back to her man?  Has only a homefool education, no job experience.  Even if she could get a job, then can't afford child care for 4 kids.  Josh has no job future at this point, unless he goes out like everyone else and works in an office or warehouse. IT SUCKS TO BE ANNA.

 

Ok one kudos to Josh (yeh I know, it hurts)  earlier today b4 this broke I heard on the news that many email addresses on Ashley Madison are fake, and you could register  as Steve Doucey if you wanted (CUT ME SOME SLACK I SAW IT AT THE CAR DEALERSHIP WHO IS RIGHT WING AND ONLY HAS ON FOX NEWS OKAYYYYY?)  So Josh could've said it was fake.  really he could have.  I only can think he's broken and wants it all over and wants to have all of it off his back.  i will say one of my little rare prayrs for him too.  Because truly I blame his parents for the whole shebang, for the stupid cult like fundy way they raised him.

Nope. No kudos for him. He couldn't say it was fake...his authentic credit card info gave him away.

[sleekandchic]

Thank you for sharing your experiences, IntoTheMystic. I am deeply appreciative to learn about others and their life stories. Makes me a better human and a more helpful, understanding professional.

Please accept my kiss and loving stroke to your lower back. You didn't deserve that brutality, ever. Xoxxo

[cereality]

All the fundie families out there -- and families like the Jacksons who seemingly want/wanted to marry into fundie royalty -- should be holding up Anna as a cautionary tale. THIS is the reason that girls/women need an education and need not marry at 18 or 20 or whatever. You can be a Godly woman with a wonderful countenance who did all the right things when courting, cooked and cleaned for your man, produced a child every yr or 2 and married a man who was fundy royalty supposedly from a great family and $hit can STILL happen. And if it does, you need to be able to provide of yourself and your kids.

 

I honestly don't think Anna's parents will support a divorce. She may be welcome to come live in the trailer for a little bit as she recovers from this news and recent child birth but then they will "encourage" her to go back to her man quickly (like in 1-2 weeks), service him and please him in such a way that he never strays again -- bc that's supposedly what the Lord wants and that's her wifely duty. And let's be honest being 27 with no real degree (I think she did something online but I have no clue if that's high school or college or what) and no work experience and 4 kids, it's not going to be easy to say -- screw it, I don't need your support, I'll figure it out. I mean I realize she could get child support from Josh if she left but that involves a lawyer that she currently can't afford. In order to afford that -- and be able to have even a 1 bedroom for her kids -- she needs to earn income. Where could she be hired? I'm guessing without any experience or education, she could waitress or maybe stock shelves in retail. That won't exactly pay for daycare for 4 kids plus rent plus food until child support/maintenance kick in. The only way she could realistically leave is if someone supports her -- gives her a place to live, watches her 4 kids at least some of the time, and can feed her and the kids. I don't know if her parents will do it -- in part it looks like they're just scraping by themselves but even if they could make it work in their trailer with mom watching the kids and Anna working at Mickey Ds and handing over her paychecks to dad to cover their expenses -- I don't think they'd do it because they'd morally disagree with her choice.

 

She has an army of sisters in law who can easily raise 4 more kids, but even if they in their heart of hearts think their bro is a dick and she should leave -- they can't cross party lines given that their daddy pays all their bills. Same for grandma. Honestly her only hope is her own sister who left the cult.

[HundFan]

I also appreciate your sharing IntoTheMystic. What you went through sounds horrific and undeserved. Hugs.

[3girlsforus]

Do we know for sure that Anna had a "Duggan-Type" education? Just because she was homeschooled doesn't mean they abandoned all education. I know she didn't go to college but she could have an actual high school education. 

[riverblue22]

I think Anna took some online courses on how to be a teacher (in the cult way, I'm sure).  That won't get her far.  She would make a good teacher's aide in a classroom but who knows if they have those in Arkansas, and if they do the pay is probably not good.

[cereality]

According to their bio on their website -- she homeschooled and graduated high school; I seem to remember her saying something about studying "early childhood education" but she married so young that I'm betting it was some online courses until a suitor came along, not an actual classroom education -- which is what you'd need to teach. I don't see her being able to get a job at a school unless it's a teacher's aide or cafeteria worker -- and honestly I think waitressing would be more lucrative than that.

[Rancide]

If there's one bright lining in all of this (aside from the entertainment value it's providing me), maybe it will ease the path of some of the more normal, non-Gothardite-inclined children--you know that of the 19 there has to be at least one--into mainstream society.  With no TV show and an older brother who is a hypocritical hot mess, it should be easier for, e.g., John David or Jinger, to come out of the closet as a mouth-kissing, beer drinking, pants-wearing Methodist without having to issue a press release on the subject.

[CofCinci]

Most of the adult Duggars make excellent money speaking on the weekends. If Anna leaves Josh, she'd make more than enough to support the 4 Ms working only 2 weekends a month.

On that same note, she'd also make money if she stood with Josh because so many women think they can change their cheating man and will pay $40/seat to hear her story.

[IndianPaintbrush]

I knew that Anna would blame herself and never leave him, but actually hearing it from a source close to the family just makes me sad.   Anna's life is utter hell.

 

How do Gothardites reconcile the belief that wives should be "available" whenever their husbands want sex with the Old Testament practice of abstaining 40-80 days after a baby is born?  

[Sew Sumi]

First, my prayers go out to Anna, and I am not known as much of a pray-er. Anyway she turns, her life is made of shit, and with a one month old!: Is she leaves Josh, won't her fundy parents will turn her away and tell her to get back to her man?  Has only a homefool education, no job experience.  Even if she could get a job, then can't afford child care for 4 kids.  Josh has no job future at this point, unless he goes out like everyone else and works in an office or warehouse. IT SUCKS TO BE ANNA.

 

Ok one kudos to Josh (yeh I know, it hurts)  earlier today b4 this broke I heard on the news that many email addresses on Ashley Madison are fake, and you could register  as Steve Doucey if you wanted (CUT ME SOME SLACK I SAW IT AT THE CAR DEALERSHIP WHO IS RIGHT WING AND ONLY HAS ON FOX NEWS OKAYYYYY?)  So Josh could've said it was fake.  really he could have.  I only can think he's broken and wants it all over and wants to have all of it off his back.  i will say one of my little rare prayrs for him too.  Because truly I blame his parents for the whole shebang, for the stupid cult like fundy way they raised him.

He could have claimed it was faked, but fact-checkers everywhere verified the credit card and addresses attached to the account as Smuggles'. CNN even named the source they used to verify the information. So then, he would have been further outed as more of a liar than he has already proven to be. Better to just own up to it. 

[txvoodoo]

This... and JB would grind her into the ground no matter how it would affect his grandchildren. Anna can only leave Josh if her parents support her - both emotionally and financially.

Or gets her own agent.

 

She needs to write a book, get a podcast. America may love a redemption story, but even more, we love a woman who beats the odds after she's been put down.  If she did something to help other subjugated women?

[mimionthebeach]

Perhaps although I think a good lawyer can determine where Josh stored any of his 6 figure income from his independent job in DC while he was married.  Also if Anna left Josh for this the Duggars would look even worse if Josh didn't support his children.  I hope finances (or the threat of financial poverty) doesn't keep her tied to this adulterer. 

 

This... and JB would grind her into the ground no matter how it would affect his grandchildren. Anna can only leave Josh if her parents support her - both emotionally and financially.

 

I think Boob and Mechelle have been blindsided by this. They're probably reeling. Josh may have gone too far this time. Right now, I can see Josh leaving and Anna and the kids staying with the Duggars. I don't think Jim Bob would punish Anna for this. And, horrible as I think he is, I believe he loves his grandkids. His wife may be totally ambivalent, but he loves the kids.

 

Of course, given that they are the Duggars, they will probably prove me wrong... disappointing humanity again.

[txvoodoo]

This is one of the reasons the Duggars don't like animals, I think. Animals are too perceptive, often too warm. Those aren't Duggar things. They're just cold, arrogant...and dumb.

This was one of my first indications that these people were not good people. I don't trust those who don't like animals, and it keeps being validated. 

[Andrews m]

Anna should get her own talk show.

[CofCinci]

Could this blind item today posted by blindgossip.com be about Josh and Anna?

http://blindgossip.com/?p=73291

[blind Gossip] In what may come as a bit of a surprise, this celebrity’s wife is actually breathing a sigh of relief now that the public knows that her husband is a low-down, dirty dog!

Even though she also committed adultery in their relationship, he will look petty and retaliatory if he brings up her cheating during divorce proceedings.

Therefore, it looks like she is going to be able to walk away from the marriage with the money, the kids… AND and a clean reputation!

[Gbb]

Total guess, but Ben and Jennifer?

[EarlGreyTea]

I'm watching the episode where Anna makes salmon for the kids, and it's pretty crushing how happy she was, and how content the kids looked. Makes me think it's a good thing no one can predict the future. I don't think they'll be that way for a long, long time.

 

Could this blind item today posted by blindgossip.com be about Josh and Anna?

http://blindgossip.com/?p=73291

[blind Gossip] In what may come as a bit of a surprise, this celebrity’s wife is actually breathing a sigh of relief now that the public knows that her husband is a low-down, dirty dog!

Even though she also committed adultery in their relationship, he will look petty and retaliatory if he brings up her cheating during divorce proceedings.

Therefore, it looks like she is going to be able to walk away from the marriage with the money, the kids… AND and a clean reputation!

 

Nah. That fits Affleck and Garner to a tee. She cheated in both her previous relationships but no one ever talks about it.

Edited August 21, 2015 by EarlGreyTea

[sleekandchic]

I'm waiting for Josh to get a condom endorsement deal.

Ribbed for HER pleasure!

JOSH: Wait! HER pleasure?! Are the "females" supposed to have pleasure? Did they earn that? Deserve that? Eve was the the Original Whore! Women should be atoning....not sexing for pleasure, man!

[BostonBlonde]

Anna should get her own talk show.

Egad no. No one wants to hear her babble on about on how she's forgiven him...

Puke.

[Joe Jitsu913]

Could this blind item today posted by blindgossip.com be about Josh and Anna?

http://blindgossip.com/?p=73291

[blind Gossip] In what may come as a bit of a surprise, this celebrity’s wife is actually breathing a sigh of relief now that the public knows that her husband is a low-down, dirty dog!

Even though she also committed adultery in their relationship, he will look petty and retaliatory if he brings up her cheating during divorce proceedings.

Therefore, it looks like she is going to be able to walk away from the marriage with the money, the kids… AND and a clean reputation!

Josh isn't a celebrity so this can't be about him.

[Sew Sumi]

Do we know for sure that Anna had a "Duggan-Type" education? Just because she was homeschooled doesn't mean they abandoned all education. I know she didn't go to college but she could have an actual high school education. 

The Kellers were homeschooled. The family was into ATI pretty early, earlier than the Duggars, I believe. I think Pa Keller might have a college degree, but I've never heard anything about Suzette. 

[msblossom]

Fox News covered it tonight, called him by name, shook their heads - the guy in CA who's name I can't call did the piece on him.  Not sure why they used the CA guy unless it's a seniority thing - I think he usually covers political stories.  Maybe.  Without timing it, I'd say it was about a 5 minute piece.  They even mentioned that it's rumored that he has a FB account under a different name, and that his friends on there are strippers. 

 

Just repeating the gossip.

 

Thank you HundFan, for the explanation (she says with a red face), and I still say Next, STOP THAT!!!  Ewww!

Well, they sort of HAD to. I mean FOX would look really stupid with their bias showing if they hadn't. Hope Megyn Kelley ate crow for dinner tonight. I'm fairly conservative politically, although I don't drink the kool-aid and think for myself on the issues regardless of party (registered Independent, here), and I can't stand FOX News, although back in the day I was a die hard FN watcher in the late 90's until about 10 years ago. I'm not knocking you, HFC, or anyone else who does. It's just that that interview with MK burned me up, so I'm just a tiiny bit happy that karma got the last word.

[JoanArc]

Ribbed for HER pleasure!

 

"But I turned them inside out"

https://youtu.be/9zxpgTX_-Ok?t=238

[Dianaofthehunt]

I'm so glad InTouch was scooped on this story. Serves that rag right for dribbling out Duggar nuggets one Scrabble tile at a time.

 

But this has me uneasy:

"The family was so very close to repairing their brand and their relationship with TLC."

 

Could that really have been true? If so, this  newest news has got to be the rock-bottom for the bottom-feeders at The "Learning" Channel.

[Sew Sumi]

Megyn Kelly had a stand-in tonight. Believe me, I tuned in to see what she would do. I guess we must wait until next week? I don't watch FOX, so I don't know if she's on vacation or assignment. 

[Zanzibar]

Megyn is on vacation.  Not sure when she's expected back, I think she was supposed to be gone 10 days.

[msblossom]

I hate what this is doing to Anna because she worships the ground Josh walks on, I can still picture her in their TH's when she's looking up at him adoringly like all the female Duggars do.

You all are right, she will be made to suck it up and stand by her man, guilted into it on all sides or risk being shunned as if she's the one in the wrong for walking away from her marriage to a sleeze bag cheating hypocrite. I bet she sees all the signs that she missed or made excuses for. I can't imagine being raised in that culture with no options and little to no support should she want to leave him. She is stuck, and made to make lemonade out of lemons.

[Lillybee]

Megyn is on vacation.  Not sure when she's expected back, I think she was supposed to be gone 10 days.

 

 

I know that this is off topic but there are rumors out there that MK is on forced leave because she was mean to The Donald during the debate.

 

However, I really would like to see her take on Josh's latest sex scandal.

[LilyoftheValley]

Josh doesn't need counseling or prayers or healing; he just needs to be single.  He obviously only liked the idea of marriage because it made him more powerful in his church. Also, he wanted to bang Anna and that was the only way he could do it. Otherwise, he is very obviously just not that into Anna and he clearly would rather be free.  So let him be free. Anna, if you want Josh to be happy then refuse to forgive him so that he has an "out" (believe me honey he will take it immediately) and let him go on in life as a single guy.  It's what he wants.  He no longer has the respect of being a perfect fundie married man, which was the only benefit he saw of being married.  

 

Though I feel badly for Anna, it is great that people are seeing the other side of all this.  So far we have seen the "happily married" couples "proving" that an uneducated teenage bride can have a great life getting married and pumping out kids.  The reality is that Anna's situation is just as likely to happen.  And Anna actually has some options!  She can write tell-all books and do interviews.  

[cereality]

I realize Michelle is a loon and doesn't care too much about her kids, but if she cares about any of them it's Josh. When he was getting married, she was gleeful in saying "leave and cleave baby." I wonder if it's because after the molestation and the light contracting therapy, she knew he still had issues and she was thinking -- good, he's Anna's problem now; if he cheats on her or abuses her or whatever she'll have to deal with it and put up with it like a good fundie wife -- but at least we won't have to worry about his issues anymore.

[sometimesy]

Anna doing interviews? She is a good person, from what we've seen but, NO personality. She is so seemingly unaware I am not sure her "tell all" would tell much. Her nature seems to require more privacy, not less. Just a guess from limited info.

Edited August 21, 2015 by sometimesy

[IntoTheMystic]

It wouldn't surprise me one bit if we find out Michelle is staying with Josh/Anna to help plead Josh's case and intercede on the Lord's behalf. 'Cause, I mean, she has all the answers as that THING'S mother, right?

Thanks for the kind words about me sharing a bit of my own experience with Quiverfulling to QueeringFully. ;) It wasn't easy and it was devastating but maybe just maybe some girl out there will read this and think twice about the lies she has been force fed by Gothard and his ilk.

The best thing Josh could do to make amends is to take a look at how he was raised and PURPOSE to raise his own kids differently. He needs to change his life, be true to who he actually is, and not try to preach at anyone ever again ... especially his own kids. 

[HumblePi]

This is what happens when people like Jim Bob and Michelle Duggar live as though they are morally superior to others. With 19 children, there's bound to be at least one black sheep in the flock that will ultimately discredit their smug, sanctimonious charade.  I don't give a damn about Michelle and Jim Bob. But I do feel a deep remorse for the younger Duggar children, Anna and her children, and the family of Anna. They have all been humiliated and will carry Josh's stigma along with him.

 

One thing this whole Duggar experience is good for is to remind us all that people like Michelle and Jim Bob with their fundamentalist preaching, rigid customs and beliefs, are all nothing but frauds. Like the saying goes "if it seems too good to be true, it probably is". People that are sanctimonious and self-righteous are probably just very insecure people attempting to make themselves look better than anyone else.

[3 is enough]

IIRC, Anna has a bachelor's degree in early childhood education from some unaccredited online Christian school, so it isn't worth much in the real world.

 

This second scandal does prove, IMO, just how potentially disastrous the whole practice of courting, marrying young, and pumping out lots of babies ASAP really can be.

 

Josh really, really, really, wanted sex and he married the first girl who would have him, because that was the only acceptable way for him to get what he wanted.  I think he did love Anna, but instead of having a few years of couple time, she was pregnant within a few months.  Safe to say their sex life probably took a bit of a hit. Then came the  baby, and anyone who has had a baby knows how that changes things in the bedroom.  Then  ANOTHER baby, and ANOTHER- he's only 25 and has THREE little ones- Anna is tired all the time, the kids wake up at inopportune times, and he is wondering what the hell happened.  Maybe she didn't exactly refuse him, but it just wasn't the same-more hurry up and finish before someone wakes up or comes wandering in.

 

Not excusing his actions for one second-  I still think he is a supreme douche bag- but I also do not think he was prepared for the reality of married life, Gothard style.   I always got the impression he was never on board having a huge family- he always said 2 or 3 would be fine.  But he essentially had no choice in the matter.  No education and dependent on Daddy to earn a living, and having 3 kids in 4 years- he was somewhat trapped.

 

The whole situation is just so sad, and although he is ultimately responsible for his actions, his upbringing did him no favors.

[Skyline]

[sara416]

This thread has moved very fast, so this may have been said already, but I'm going to say it anyway. One of my first snarky thoughts when this whole thing came out was that this is double scandal for the Duggars because they don't believe in credit either and Josh had a credit card!

 

Also, I'm voting for a tell all from Jana. She's so quiet, but you know she's just absorbing everything around her. I bet she has some stories that would blow people away. 

[Darknight]

It's Anna's fault Josh cheated. She wasn't serving him right. If only she had sex more and dropped her pants when she was making lunch or while she's pregnant. Poor Joshie wouldn't have cheated.

[HumblePi]

The whole situation is just so sad, and although he is ultimately responsible for his actions, his upbringing did him no favors.

This abnormal thinking about sex was created because Michelle and Jim Bob preached to their children that sex is something to hide or be ashamed of. Sex is something that is natural. It's something they should have been open about with their children rather than make every attempt to shield them from it. Parents should be honest with their children and not hold them to standards of behavior and dress that are so rigid that no human could possibly mature normally in a sexual way. Suppression of a cough in church is right. Suppression of sexual thoughts and actions are wrong.

[Darknight]

IIRC, Anna has a bachelor's degree in early childhood education from some unaccredited online Christian school, so it isn't worth much in the real world.

This second scandal does prove, IMO, just how potentially disastrous the whole practice of courting, marrying young, and pumping out lots of babies ASAP really can be.

Josh really, really, really, wanted sex and he married the first girl who would have him, because that was the only acceptable way for him to get what he wanted. I think he did love Anna, but instead of having a few years of couple time, she was pregnant within a few months. Safe to say their sex life probably took a bit of a hit. Then came the baby, and anyone who has had a baby knows how that changes things in the bedroom. Then ANOTHER baby, and ANOTHER- he's only 25 and has THREE little ones- Anna is tired all the time, the kids wake up at inopportune times, and he is wondering what the hell happened. Maybe she didn't exactly refuse him, but it just wasn't the same-more hurry up and finish before someone wakes up or comes wandering in.

Not excusing his actions for one second- I still think he is a supreme douche bag- but I also do not think he was prepared for the reality of married life, Gothard style. I always got the impression he was never on board having a huge family- he always said 2 or 3 would be fine. But he essentially had no choice in the matter. No education and dependent on Daddy to earn a living, and having 3 kids in 4 years- he was somewhat trapped.

The whole situation is just so sad, and although he is ultimately responsible for his actions, his upbringing did him no favors.

Which is why you don't marry for sex or suppress your sons sexual desires. I'm kinda happy this happened. The duggars were too stuck up. Anna did everything right and guess what??? Josh still cheated. Josh did everything right. Guess what??? Getting married didn't do shit.

[Maharincess]

I always find it so entertaining when Satan manages to have his way with these oh-so-godly types. Meanwhile, little old non-churchgoer me just passed my 26th wedding anniversary, having managed not to cheat on my hub without even trying. Go figure.

Little old atheist me has also been in a monogamous, happy 26 year relationship (had our 26th anniversary on May 15th) but we aren't married and have no plans to be married.

We haven't cheated on each other and have a great loving, caring, happy relationship all without religion of any kind.

[HumblePi]

The 'barometer' of Josh and Anna's marriage will be how many more babies Anna will give birth to in the next few years. I bet there won't be a baby being born in the Josh and Anna Duggar home every 2 years. If there's no new baby by 2017 then their marriage is in deep doo-doo.

[Darknight]

Josh doesn't need counseling or prayers or healing; he just needs to be single. He obviously only liked the idea of marriage because it made him more powerful in his church. Also, he wanted to bang Anna and that was the only way he could do it. Otherwise, he is very obviously just not that into Anna and he clearly would rather be free. So let him be free. Anna, if you want Josh to be happy then refuse to forgive him so that he has an "out" (believe me honey he will take it immediately) and let him go on in life as a single guy. It's what he wants. He no longer has the respect of being a perfect fundie married man, which was the only benefit he saw of being married.

Though I feel badly for Anna, it is great that people are seeing the other side of all this. So far we have seen the "happily married" couples "proving" that an uneducated teenage bride can have a great life getting married and pumping out kids. The reality is that Anna's situation is just as likely to happen. And Anna actually has some options! She can write tell-all books and do interviews.

I agree. Josh should get a divorce and just be free. He can have one night stands if he wants. He can explore, watch porn, pay for strippers. Sex with other people isn't bad. Unfortunately his cult fucked him up.

[dillpickles]

Let's not be too hard on Josh, after all... Anna did say practice makes progress, and Josh has been practicing.

[Maharincess]

actually, satan is after whomever he can get. it doesn't matter how big or small your celebrity status is.

LOL!

[Maharincess]

Anna married a man who told her he molested girls, his own sisters, one as young as five, and had children with him. Even if she didn't get the whole story when she married him, she stayed with him with the grisly details became public and she's keeping her own girls in the line of fire of someone with an ongoing, disgusting history. Anna deserves it.

Thank you!!!! This is exactly Anna does not now and never will have my sympathy, I felt bad for her for a brief second until I really thought about it. Yeah she was raised to believe blah, blah, blah but anybody with any sense of right and wrong would have run from Josh. Anybody with a half a brain wouldn't marry and have kids with somebody who molested 5 young girls, one of which was 5.

If her parents had told her she had to marry him, she knows from her sister that she has choices and can leave.

I agree that she deserves what she gets. The kids are the only ones I feel bad for. In my opinion they are the only innocent ones.

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

I've read several news articles and studies about how first-born children are usually the most successful children in a family.

(for example- http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014/apr/26/firstborn-children-excel-study-reveals)

If that's true, the Duggars should really be ashamed at what their firstborn has "accomplished," such as bringing down their little fundie "empire" and destroying their brand. What's going to follow with the rest of the kids?

Edited August 21, 2015 by MyPeopleAreNordic

[HumblePi]

Serious stuff aside, flash forward 40 years, I have a mental image of Josh Duggar at age 67.