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Black Panther (2018)

DollEyes

By DollEyes
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starri
starri

Because they don't want a movie whose cast is almost entirely people of color and a large percentage of whom are also women to succeed. Let's just call it what it is.

mtlchick
mtlchick

I'm going through my own stage 3 treatment for ovarian cancer (2 weeks of radiation left as I write this and the prognosis looks very good) so hearing that he passed and was only a year and 6 days old

starri
starri

I'm glad she shared that story.

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DeeDee79

DeeDee79

On ‎7‎/‎31‎/‎2018 at 2:31 AM, scrb said:

I don't think there's anything noble about him.

He has a point that Black Panther's father abandoned him in Oakland, instead of taking him back to Wakanda.

It's one thing to grow up from that trauma, finding his dead father's body, having a chip on his shoulder.

But grown up, Killmonger killed without a second thought and made a fetish out of all his kills with the markings on his body.  OK this is a comic book world but that number of kills, even some of it from military service, are indicators of a psychopath.

The fetishization of the kills suggest he relished them.

One of his first acts was to call for the herb garden to be destroyed and when the priestess hesitated, he threatened to kill her, using vulgarity.  At least cartoon villains speak, if not nobly, then certainly not like a street thug.

As king of Wakanda, he immediately called for waging wars throughout the world.  Now that's cartoon villain stuff, so we shouldn't be shocked by it.  But the personal kills take him out of the comic book universe and more into the realm of serial murders.

I wouldn't think Coogler was having him represent or symbolize a reaction to discrimination against black people.  Killmonger says at one point he killed so many to come back to Wakanda.  But why would joining the military and killing hundreds of people personally be a necessary route to Wakanda?  Why would bringing the corpse of the Claw make him welcome in a society which is suppose to be enlightened and benevolent?

The vengeful and angry black man who would kill those who oppressed black people if given the power confirms the worst racial stereotypes of black men held by some people.  Killmonger's defeat is a rejection of that stereotype, as is BP's decision to engage with the world, to share Wakanda's wealth.

 

As much as I loved Michael B. Jordan's portrayal I agree with every word but most especially this:

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If they brought Killmonger back, it would be a commercial concession, to reverse the defeat of a character who embodied the worst aspects of humanity, in order to bring back a popular movie star.

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HunterHunted

HunterHunted

On 9/10/2018 at 2:45 AM, Zuleikha said:

However, I thought the basic facts of Killmonger's mother's story needed to be left in for Killmonger's story to have its full weight. As far as I knew, he wasn't orphaned. Leaving him in Oakland with his mother seemed like a very defensible choice! A few lines to clarify that his mother was in prison and he ended up in the foster care system as a result of N'Jobu's death would have helped make the ramifications of his abandonment clearer to me.

It's a weird little bit that not everyone picks up on. When the audience first sees N'Jobu and Zuri as James, they are actually in the middle of planning how to break Erik's mother out of prison. But it's similar to how a lot of people don't realize until the end of the film or after seeing it again that the intro is N'Jobu teaching Erik/N'Jadaka the history of Wakanda.

Costume design and soundtrack are the only two categories where this film should be remotely competitive. Maybe cinematography too, but none of the really big awards. In the io9 piece, one of commenters, PeruvianMap, writes "there is a difference between a good film and an important film."

This is an important film for many reasons, but it's got a lot of flaws, including the fact that T'Challa is the least interesting character in the film. We haven't seen a titular hero this boring since the first two Thor films. Luckily, Black Panther has a lot more going for it than those Thor films ever had except for Loki.

festivus

festivus

28 minutes ago, HunterHunted said:

This is an important film for many reasons, but it's got a lot of flaws, including the fact that T'Challa is the least interesting character in the film. We haven't seen a titular hero this boring since the first two Thor films. Luckily, Black Panther has a lot more going for it than those Thor films ever had except for Loki.

This was the thing that bothered me about this film. T'Challa was so great in Civil War, his quiet intensity stood out even in a film filled with superheros. It's a shame he got lost in his own movie. Black Panther was a good movie for everyone else but the title character.

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Lantern7

Lantern7

Given the nature of the Infinity Gauntlet, I feel that anybody could be brought back . . . even people who died before Infinity War. And I think some people would be returned subconsciously. So if T’Challa were to somehow return and use the Gauntlet like a reset button, he might accidentally bring Erik back. I’m not saying that’s a good idea in the big picture for the MCU. but the possibility is there.

galaxygirl76

galaxygirl76

On 9/9/2018 at 8:33 PM, starri said:

I saw a clip of an actor doing an appearance as T'Challa in costume at Disneyland, flanked by two of the Doras.  And then I realized, Epcot really, REALLY needs a Wakanda pavilion.  I will go stand in line for it NOW.

I don't believe Disney can use Black Panther on that side of the Mississippi.

Kel Varnsen

Kel Varnsen

13 minutes ago, galaxygirl76 said:

I don't believe Disney can use Black Panther on that side of the Mississippi.

There are some tricky rules behind the deal. From what I remember Disney can't use characters that Universal is already using and also can't use family members or team members associated with character's that Universal is using. If there are characters they use they can't advertise them as Marvel characters. When I was in Disney World in 2016 they had Dr Strange walking around but they couldn't say he was from Marvel comics. BP woulf probably be difficult becuse he is a member of the Avengers.

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starri

starri

On 9/16/2018 at 8:20 PM, Kel Varnsen said:

There are some tricky rules behind the deal. From what I remember Disney can't use characters that Universal is already using and also can't use family members or team members associated with character's that Universal is using. If there are characters they use they can't advertise them as Marvel characters. When I was in Disney World in 2016 they had Dr Strange walking around but they couldn't say he was from Marvel comics. BP woulf probably be difficult becuse he is a member of the Avengers.

I was bored and decided to read up a little about this.  Apparently, Black Panther may open the door for some renegotiation between Universal and Disney.  They cannot use characters in Orlando that are used at Islands of Adventure.  So, that knocks off the X-Men, Fantastic Four, Hulk, and Spider-Man because all have their own rides.  They additionally have a cast member dressed up as Cap who roams around for photo ops.  There is one small depiction of T'Challa--they have a lot of oh-so-90s art around Marvel Island--but the position is that does not constitute "featuring" him.  So, they may have some wiggle room.  There is also apparently consideration to making a Wakanda themed pavilion on the technology side that would, I assume, be hosted by Shuri.

At California Adventure and their international parks, they have a freer hand, so Shanghai and Hong Kong Disneyland will be getting their own Avengers Land, as well DCA and Walt Disney Studios Park at Disneyland Paris.

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DeeDee79

DeeDee79

On ‎5‎/‎14‎/‎2018 at 9:27 PM, SherriAnt said:

And on a shallow note, has anyone ever had as beautiful skin as Lupita Nyong'o? She looks like a porcelain doll, but in a good way. 

Yes! I have the same thoughts every time I rewatch. I loved her hair also. I wish that I was confident enough to rock a short natural style like hers and look even half as good!

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Dee

Dee

(edited)

Oscars: Disney Makes Up for Lost Time With ‘Black Panther’

Quote

The Oscar circuit is roaring to life with soirees and cocktail gatherings booked throughout New York and Los Angeles until the end of the year and beyond. Campaigns are looking for the usual footholds, shipping in talent to hold court with members of the Hollywood Foreign Press and Broadcast Film Critics associations, angling for representation on the groups’ televised awards shows in the thick of Oscar voting. And a little face time with Academy members along the way doesn’t hurt.

Usually the goal is setting the table for an upcoming release. But in some cases, the task is much more difficult: bringing a contender from earlier in the year back into the fray. That’s what Disney is attempting with the billion-dollar blockbuster “Black Panther,” which hit theaters in February and instantly became not just a pop-cultural event but a meta-cultural happening.

Edited by Dee
Dee

Dee

(edited)

Can Barrier-Breaking ‘Black Panther’ Become The First Superhero Movie Nominated For Best Picture?

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Black Panther has risen to plenty of challenges, shattering every expectation to far surpass the ticket sales of any film by a Black director, with a cast populated by African and African-American performers, on its way to a $1.3 billion global gross. But there’s one challenge remaining: can the film overcome a clear Academy prejudice and get a fair shake as a Best Picture candidate?

It’s a prejudice that, for once, is nothing to do with race. If history is a guide, what Black Panther must overcome is the kneejerk reaction of Academy voters to dismiss superhero movies outright. If it gets its Best Picture nomination, it’d be a first. Not even Christopher Nolan’s Dark Knight trilogy cracked that recognition, even as it spurred the Academy to broaden the Best Picture category from five to a possible 10 nominees. The challenge facing Marvel and Disney this season is preventing Black Panther from being marginalized as just another high roller in the Marvel Cinematic Universe assembly line. It is so much more.

Beyond the big business, Black Panther is as landmark for the superhero genre as Get Out was for horror, tackling deep-seated issues, often for the first time in mainstream cinema. When Wakandan king T’Challa addresses countries at the UN about nations building bridges and not barriers, it’s hard not to see his speech as an answer to Trump’s isolationism.

Among the bona fides worth considering this awards season: after playing color barrier-breakers Jackie Robinson and Thurgood Marshall, Chadwick Boseman brings the same quiet dignity to T’Challa, convincingly infusing intellect and physicality to a character first created by Stan Lee and Jack Kirby in recognition of the changing world of 1960s Civil Rights reforms. Both in front of and behind the camera, Black Panther featured a strong contingent of women, like production designer Hannah Beachler and costume designer Ruth E. Carter, who indelibly stamped the film as a celebration of African culture and created a living, breathing world in Wakanda. Michael B. Jordan, making his third film with Ryan Coogler after Fruitvale Station and Creed, left an indelible mark as Erik Killmonger, turning the grudge-holding cousin of T’Challa and rival for the Wakandan throne into a whirlwind of rage without making himself a scenery-chewer.

Black Panther’s living, breathing scale comes from its depiction of the fictional African nation of Wakanda, which brims with technological advancement and a profound connection to its imagined history and culture. 

But what may not be evident on screen—except in the most subconscious ways—is how profoundly everybody involved in its creation invested pieces of their personal journeys into Black Panther. As they searched for their own identities as African-American descendants of the continent of Africa, theirs is a celebration of a place so often depicted as volatile or violent. In the mix are subtle infusions of the Black Power movement, the unforgivable history of the slave era and the ravaging of Africa’s natural resources. All that wrapped up in a Marvel movie destined for maximum reach.

Edited by Dee
LydiaMoon1

LydiaMoon1

On 12/7/2018 at 9:34 AM, Morrigan2575 said:

Happy with the Best Picture nom even though it won't win. 

IA that it won't win, but, for me, that's not what's most important. The biggest significance of any Best Picture noms for BP is that it means that Danai and Lu will appear on the red carpet. I mean, all that other stuff (precedent, opportunity, etc) is great. Wonderful, but I just want to see Danai and Lu  Sorry, not sorry.

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Darlin

Darlin

11 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

Putting aside the award nomination implications for a second . . . I can’t believe Black Panther will wind up the highest grossing movie of the year, at least domestically. And it was released in February. Even for a Marvel movie, that’s insane.

I had no idea Black Panther eclipsed Avengers in box office totals!  Bravo!   I am so happy and proud of that movie's success!

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Lantern7

Lantern7

12 hours ago, Darlin said:

I had no idea Black Panther eclipsed Avengers in box office totals!  Bravo!   I am so happy and proud of that movie's success!

Technically, it won the battle domestically.  A:IW won worldwide.

10 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

It blows my mind. Back in the 90s when I was reading comics, probably the least popular ongoing marvel titles were Black Panther and Deadpool. 

I don't think that was the case. Deadpool wound up lasting seventy-plus issues, and made stars of Joe Kelly and Ed McGuinness. As for Black Panther? While it was taken out of the Marvel Knights stable after twelve issues, we ended up with 62 issues total, sixty written by Christopher Priest. I'd like to think the title make Marvel a little money, added to the critical acclaim.

Kel Varnsen

Kel Varnsen

8 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

I don't think that was the case. Deadpool wound up lasting seventy-plus issues, and made stars of Joe Kelly and Ed McGuinness. As for Black Panther? While it was taken out of the Marvel Knights stable after twelve issues, we ended up with 62 issues total, sixty written by Christopher Priest. I'd like to think the title make Marvel a little money, added to the critical acclaim.

Here is a sales chart from 1999. There were only a few ongoing marvel titles that sold worse than Black Panther and Deadpool. By the time of this chart in 2001 there weren't any ongoing marvel titles that sold fewer copies. 

xaxat

xaxat

(edited)
On 12/16/2018 at 6:10 PM, anna0852 said:

I'm not going to be suprised if they rack up Oscar nominations at this rate. Best Picture might be a stretch but I'm can easily see Best Director, Best Score, Best Costume Design, Best Art Direction and Best Song (All The Stars).

Oscar noms on the non-tech categories will be a MAJOR coup for Marvel.

Ruth Carter created a totally new aesthetic and had better win for best costume design over all those others who just recreate period piece fashion.

(Which they do well, but Ruth's work was on a whole 'nother level.)

And it's a longshot, but I want a nomination for Michael B. Jordan. 

ETA. The Academy just released nomination shortlists for several categories. Black Panther made the cut in all of the categories it was eligible for (ie non-animation, foreign film etc). 

Makeup and Hairstyling

Original Score

Original Song

Visual Effects

Edited by xaxat
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Apprentice79

Apprentice79

9 hours ago, xaxat said:

I wonder how many times he gets the Wakandan salute from strangers when he's out in public

He has been chased in cars by people requesting him to do it.   Some of the fans take it too far, but, he takes it in stride. He knows it is part of the job.  This is what he dreamt about when he moved to Hollywood, years ago.  

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Anduin

Anduin

Of the movies I saw last year, that actually stick in the mind, BP was the best. But I suspect the oscar will go to a more oscar-baity movie. Of course, I'm not into the Oscars or oscar bait. They could give the Oscar to whatever they want, it won't change my opinion. But if a person cares what the Oscar voters think, I can see how they'd feel it was important.

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VCRTracking

VCRTracking

The Onion guide to this years Oscar nominees:
 

Quote

Black Panther

Synopsis: The heartbreaking story of a white arms dealer who is tragically killed after getting mixed up in the political struggles of an African nation

Prospects: Shamelessly panders to Academy voters with its heavy-handed, one-sided take on the vibranium mining industry

Defining Line: “You are a good man, with a good heart. And it’s hard for a good man to be a king. And in a truly just society, of course, we wouldn’t have a king, or rich dynastic forces who wield undemocratic, unaccountable power. And anyone who desires and propagates that model of society, like a person such as yourself, is, frankly, immoral, and should not be looked up to in any circumstances. So that’s all pretty fucked up, and certainly nothing to celebrate. But, yeah, anyway, you’ll be good at being a king.”

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