S03.E22: Alexander Kirk

[Tara Ariano]

Quote

Part 1 of 2. Red and the task force continue to seek revenge as they inch closer to the mysterious criminal behind recent tragic events, but they must work outside the law in order to succeed.

[ottoDbusdriver]

i understand why Red is seeking revenge -- but why is the task force seeking revenge ?  That seems a little unprofessional for the FBI.

[ottoDbusdriver]

Scotty Hargreave is Tom's mom -- FFS !!!  Yet another reason for the spin-off NOT to happen.

Some top notch security at the hospital if a stranger could just wander in and start cuddling Agnes.

Big hint drop from Tom when talking about his childhood -- what, did somebody just fake my death ?   Boom, goes the anvil !!!  Who else's death did they probably fake ?  Can't quite put my finger on it.

Even though it was mostly setup for the spin-off -- Tom gets a job, they humanize Scotty, Mr. Solomon still isn't dead -- a just ok Lizzie-free episode.

[willco]

OK, I'm confused. After the first commercial break, we come back to Tom and the FBI working with the evil black guy. How did that happen ? Did I doze off and miss something ? Last I remember about him is he was missing after the wedding shooting and everyone was looking for him. Now they are working with him ?? I can't believe Tom, of all people, would agree to that. Of course, he did shoot him later, but it wasn't a head shot as it should have been, so of course he walked away from that. But I'm still lost as to how the whole thing came together. Wish I had recorded this so I could watch again but I didn't.

[aliya]

11 minutes ago, willco said:

OK, I'm confused. After the first commercial break, we come back to Tom and the FBI working with the evil black guy. How did that happen ? Did I doze off and miss something ? Last I remember about him is he was missing after the wedding shooting and everyone was looking for him. Now they are working with him ?? I can't believe Tom, of all people, would agree to that. Of course, he did shoot him later, but it wasn't a head shot as it should have been, so of course he walked away from that. But I'm still lost as to how the whole thing came together. Wish I had recorded this so I could watch again but I didn't.

Me too. I thought I was paying attention, but obviously not. I look up and the evil black guy is acting like they're all friends. Didn't this guy kill a bunch of people? Innocent or semi-innocent people?  

And what are they going to do with Tom in the spinoff? At some point, Lizzie will be back from maternity leave.Won't she be wondering what happened to her husband?

I did like Red in the makeup and beard, tho.

[ottoDbusdriver]

2 hours ago, aliya said:

And what are they going to do with Tom in the spinoff? At some point, Lizzie will be back from maternity leave.Won't she be wondering what happened to her husband?

And wonder where Agnes went after Tom takes her to the spin-off ?  And wonder who the hell named "her baby" Agnes ?

Edited May 13, 2016 by ottoDbusdriver

[Free]

23 minutes ago, aliya said:

Me too. I thought I was paying attention, but obviously not. I look up and the evil black guy is acting like they're all friends. Didn't this guy kill a bunch of people? Innocent or semi-innocent people?

And what are they going to do with Tom in the spinoff? At some point, Lizzie will be back from maternity leave.Won't she be wondering what happened to her husband?

I did like Red in the makeup and beard, tho.

Yeah, the Solomon stuff was just confusing.

As for Tom, I guess he'll just do the same thing based on the episode.

[yourmomiseasy]

2 hours ago, willco said:

OK, I'm confused. After the first commercial break, we come back to Tom and the FBI working with the evil black guy. How did that happen ? Did I doze off and miss something ? Last I remember about him is he was missing after the wedding shooting and everyone was looking for him. Now they are working with him ?? I can't believe Tom, of all people, would agree to that. Of course, he did shoot him later, but it wasn't a head shot as it should have been, so of course he walked away from that. But I'm still lost as to how the whole thing came together. Wish I had recorded this so I could watch again but I didn't.

When Famke sneaks into the hospital to see Agnes and Tom finds her, she hands him the baby, says some blah blah blah crap about protecting Agnes and blah blah blah dead son and then leaves saying "10 minutes.  I'll send Solomon to pick you up.  We've got a lot of work to do."   So it wasn't so surprising that he was with Tom in the next scene.  It was kind of weird that Solomon was acting jovial, but he's an ass bag, so it was probably kind of in character.  The peppy action movie music and snappy dialog didn't help matters in that scene -- I guess it was okay for a pilot exposition scene, but not a guy having to grudgingly work with the asshole he feels is responsible for his baby-mama's recent death scene.

2 hours ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

And wonder where Agnes went after Tom takes her to the spin-off ?  And wonder who the hell named "her baby" Agnes ?

Liz is actually the one that named the baby Agnes after her adoptive dad's mom or some other dead relative along that line.  She had to do one last annoying thing before she died and saddling her baby with that name fit the bill.

[Dowel Jones]

I take it the general theme of the spinoff will be action figures all round, with the team trying to accomplish their extremely complex missions in split second timing, but always with everything neatly dropping into place at the last second.  With a dash of unnecessary joviality from Aram and Three Cheeks.  Ho Hum.

Aram needs to exercise his dongle more often.

[mertensia]

So we find out who Tom's parents are (as if I cared) but Lizzie never got a goddamned straight answer on anything? That's rude even if it was Lizzie.

Poor Agnes. She'll be living the plot of Nikita by 8.

[desertflower]

9 hours ago, Free said:

Yeah, the Solomon stuff was just confusing.

As for Tom, I guess he'll just do the same thing based on the episode.

Solomon works for Scotty Hargrave. So in deciding to work with her (which Red seemed to think was necessary to get the bigger bad guy), they have to work with her crew, which includes Solomon.

This episode in general was a bit confusing; so much explanatory dialogue and if you missed a couple lines you're lost. I kind of missed the whole connection with the "next president" and all that stuff. All I know is they stole a bunch of money to get to the big baddie. 

I find Ryan Eggold immensely watchable, so I might like the spinoff. But the flirty undertones with his mother are icky. Let her find out who he is quickly so she can act appropriately with him, please! 

[Free]

1 hour ago, desertflower said:

Solomon works for Scotty Hargrave. So in deciding to work with her (which Red seemed to think was necessary to get the bigger bad guy), they have to work with her crew, which includes Solomon.

This episode in general was a bit confusing; so much explanatory dialogue and if you missed a couple lines you're lost. I kind of missed the whole connection with the "next president" and all that stuff. All I know is they stole a bunch of money to get to the big baddie.

I find Ryan Eggold immensely watchable, so I might like the spinoff. But the flirty undertones with his mother are icky. Let her find out who he is quickly so she can act appropriately with him, please!

Thanks, it was definitely exposition heavy, especially with them setting up the spinoff.

[Primetimer]

Sure, most of it is political tension, but there's a fair amount of creepy sexual tension too!

View the full article

[callmebetty]

No two characters who are being set up to be mother and son should have so much chemistry and sexual chemistry as Ryan and Famke. Yeesh. 

I do love how Famke's character is the female version of Red, with her long winded stories and all. She needs her own kick ass Dembe. 

Edited May 13, 2016 by callmebetty

[The Real Chon]

Red may be smarter than the average bear, but the current big bad has on his payroll an insane glasses-wearing man with a chainsaw who likes to beat up on Amish people ...

[Artsda]

Tom and his mom look too close in age. 

[milkyaqua]

Famke is 51 and Ryan is 31.  They are more believable age-wise than some of what's on TV and the movies.

Okay set-up for a pilot (that still hasn't been officially green-lit).  It will be interesting to see Tom and Mr. Soloman work together though.  Is there going to be glowering and fisticuffs between the two every epi?

Edited May 13, 2016 by milkyaqua

[AConspiracy]

Wow I thought I had tuned in some kind of Mission Impossible reboot for a while there.

[Drusilla]

Ryan looks just as old as Famke. The idea of this spin off sounds like The Blacklist reworked, why the hell would anyone want to watch 2 shows that are almost identical unless the new one has new better writers and Mr Jokenkamp isn't in charge? I'm bored of it already and it hasn't even been green lit.

Someone told me that Jokenkamp's wife writes for a soap. Perhaps this is why it has nose dived into bizarroland.

[Ottis]

This show is so much better without Lizzie. I can live with suspect alliances if there is no special snowflake.

It just needed more Red.

It's annoying that this was to help set up a spin off though. 

[TV Anonymous]

Being from Indonesia, I laugh hard at the opening.

Since when do cars in Indonesia have the steering wheel on the left-hand side?

When the actors speak Indonesian, they sound like Stephen Hawking's speech machine. Word-by-word reading with all the wrong pronunciation and intonation.

USD 3 million is almost IDR 40 billion. As the highest denomination of the money is 100k, that means 400k bills of money. The bills are usually bundled in 100, so it is 4000 bundles. No way they can fit that in two boxes and a plastic bag.

 

As for the rest of the episode, I know that they are planning the spin-off. But WTF with NBC that they like to spin detestable characters into heroes? For what they did all along, Solomon and Rowan deserve a bullet in the head, each. They have innocent blood in their hands. But no, Solomon is going to star the new spin-off and we are expected to root for him. This is as bad as Sgt. Hank Voight went from a criminal into the head of the Intelligence Unit. Even worse, perhaps.

[Biggie B]

Even with all the absurdities already pointed out, I really enjoyed this episode a lot! I absolutely 100% do not miss Liz in any way, shape or form. To the point that if her character does come back, I'd consider ditching this show to watch the new spin off. Or actually, I'd rather they blend the two together in some workable way, although I guess that would be overkill - Scottie and Red are cut from the same cloth, and sometimes too much of a good thing is just that: too much.

I thought that Scottie was Liz's mother for a while. So I was a wee bit surprised that she's Tom's mom. So how and where did Tom/Jacob grow up? I know we've been told but I can't remember. I thought he'd said he was an orphan? Or a foster child? But then was specially selected to be trained as a super criminal? Thank goodness Scottie didn't kiss him! Ewwwww!! 

Quote

Some top notch security at the hospital if a stranger could just wander in and start cuddling Agnes.

Tom asked Scottie how she got in there, to which she replied something about having made a seven-figure donation to the hospital. Which is absolutely ridiculous, of course - that still shouldn't entitle you to roam free in a hospital and touch patients!! But whatever...

I was glad Tom shot Solomon, he deserved that, but it was the wrong place and time. Of course, it did appear that Solomon got away and will surely bounce back. I wasn't confused at all at his involvement; it was made clear that Solomon worked for Scottie and Scottie did tell Tom that Solomon would be by to pick Tom up. 

At any rate, I had fun watching this all unfold. It was fast-paced and sure, a bit convoluted, but that was fine. I missed Red, but if they are setting up the new show, they needed to put Red aside for a moment and introduce us to this new cast of characters. Will I watch both shows? Not sure.

[Grace284]

Someone. Please. Tell Scotty that Tom is her son before she tries to fuck him.

Anyway, that was an interesting episode of an entirely different show that I didn't choose to watch. It needed more Red but at least they stopped eulogizing Liz for ten seconds to allow the plot to happen.

[Drusilla]

So the spin off has indeed been picked up and the creative minds have come up with this blinding idea to name it: The Blacklist: Redemption

I'm kinda lost for words. Someone step in please.

The Blacklist Spin off

[Princess Lucky]

I gotta say I really enjoyed this episode and I'm really happy to hear the spinoff was officially picked up.

I've always been a Tom fan, and when this season started I was worried because it looked like he'd be isolated from the main plot/the rest of the cast for a while. Imagine my surprise when his scenes turned out to be ten times more fun than The Liz Show. He was doing all sorts of action-packed badass shit, trying to clear Liz, going undercover, infiltrating groups, delivering quips, just being all-around awesome. It was almost like he was on a different show, all on his own. Meanwhile, I kept thinking, "man, I'd totally watch a show starring Tom". And now it happened! And they got Famke Janssen for it, whom I've loved since Goldeneye (and who has barely aged since then, by the way). Sign me up.

Also, I'll say it. Do we really know Scottie is Tom's mom? How do we know? Just because Red said so? Maybe they should make out first and we can solve the mystery later (Lizzington who?)

[ottoDbusdriver]

2 hours ago, Drusilla said:

So the spin off has indeed been picked up and the creative minds have come up with this blinding idea to name it: The Blacklist: Redemption

I'm kinda lost for words. Someone step in please.

The Blacklist Spin off

That is a terrible name for the Spin-off.  Was 'The Blacklist: The Quickening' or 'The Blacklist: Electric Boogaloo' or 'The Blacklist: The Wrath of Red' already taken ?

Redemption from what exactly ?  Is Mr. Solomon going to turn good and quit killing people ?  Is Scotty only going to take on 'good' clients ?  Is Tom going to try and be a good daddy ?  And what happens when Tom inevitably finds out that

Spoiler

Lizzie  isn't really "dead" dead.

ETA: That Deadline article calls Famke Janssen's character Scotty Halsted in the first line of the article, but then gets it right later in the body of the article.

Also, does this mean that Tom will get to grab Scottie's boob at some point, like that client of Scottie's ?  Because that could be awkward.

Edited May 14, 2016 by ottoDbusdriver

[misstwpherecool]

Reaction to backdoor pilot/spin off.

Ummmm, Nah, No, NO WAY, GTF out of here, ARE YOU KIDDING ME, Buh Bye

As soon as the FBI in on an illegal revenge plot and the federal crime of bank robbery I was done. Didn't even take/wait until they tried to execute their plan and "accidently" injure an innocent bystander. They pushed their luck with Harold the last 2 seasons. There is/was no room left for this type of crap.

A stupid epi as far as I'm concerned.

Someone just needs to be happy with Blindspot and move on.

Edited May 14, 2016 by misstwpherecool

[Happytobehere]

Just three thoughts: 1) This show is so much better without Lizzie. 2) No way in hell is Famke as Tom's mother even remotely believable. 3) Susan and Tom have a creepy sexual vibe.

[ottoDbusdriver]

23 minutes ago, Happytobehere said:

Just three thoughts: 1) This show is so much better without Lizzie. 2) No way in hell is Famke as Tom's mother even remotely believable. 3) Susan and Tom have a creepy sexual vibe.

The weird thing is -- even that Deadline article refers to Scotty as Tom's biological mother.

And yes, this show is so much better without Lizzie -- I hope she stays dead.  Then again zombie Lizzie might actually be an improvement.

[misstwpherecool]

How come Red never got a bat cave?

[paigow]

3 hours ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

That is a terrible name for the Spin-off....

  Hide contents

 

It will be Tom & Solomon struggling to use regular manufacturer's coupons at Costco, having a meltdown, taking hostages and throwing down with Jane & Weller...

[krimimimi]

5 hours ago, Princess Lucky said:

I gotta say I really enjoyed this episode and I'm really happy to hear the spinoff was officially picked up.

I've always been a Tom fan, and when this season started I was worried because it looked like he'd be isolated from the main plot/the rest of the cast for a while. Imagine my surprise when his scenes turned out to be ten times more fun than The Liz Show. He was doing all sorts of action-packed badass shit, trying to clear Liz, going undercover, infiltrating groups, delivering quips, just being all-around awesome. It was almost like he was on a different show, all on his own. Meanwhile, I kept thinking, "man, I'd totally watch a show starring Tom". And now it happened! And they got Famke Janssen for it, whom I've loved since Goldeneye (and who has barely aged since then, by the way). Sign me up.

Oh, Princess Lucky, I was right there with you. (Ok, I didn't actually like naggy teacher Tom, but I did like Spy!Tom2.0.) I do think part of the reason his scenes were so good is that he was free of Liz, and by contrast, her presence dragged down Red and the FBI's SLs. But I, too, sat there thinking it would be nice to see him freed of her permanently in his own show. Unfortunately, I just can't see this thing they've come up with doing it for me at all. 

First, in the blessed absence of the Lizbatross, I've really enjoyed Tom as the Agent Keene 2.0. I even like his interactions with Aram. (It's one of the problems the techies/support staff have in shows like this, that they are too isolated and don't have enough character interactions, instead just mostly info dumps. That leaves them underdeveloped, which is a pity as I like Aram.)  So I'll miss Tom when he leaves. Additionally, he brings some humor and actual kick assishness (it's a word if I say so?), which the show can use. 

Second, apparently some idiot has decided the show Tom needs to have is a crappy variant on Leverage. Except (unlike Leverage) the characters (other than Tom) should be completely loathsome and impossible to root for. Further, and also unlike Leverage, apparently the team pulling off the good ol' Mission Impossible schtick should be doing so for Evil!Corp as opposed to the little guy. Yeah, that sounds appealing. (Not in the least.) I currently hate Scotty (and why did she have to be such a Red rip off?), Solomon and Rowan, and I'm not fond of the computer guy either, so it seems like the spin off would be pretty hard for me to watch. My only hope is that "redemption" means they're about to do a 180*, but then why bother setting up such a repulsive group to begin with? That's a deliberate choice. They had a largely blank canvas - these characters could have been anybody they wanted (except Tom, I guess).

Honestly, I wish they'd keep Liz dead, Tom on Blacklist, and just wind Spader up and let him run. Run, Red, run. That could make for some prolonged enjoyable viewing. (imho, ymmv)

[kitmerlot1213]

On 5/13/2016 at 9:14 AM, desertflower said:

I find Ryan Eggold immensely watchable, so I might like the spinoff. But the flirty undertones with his mother are icky. Let her find out who he is quickly so she can act appropriately with him, please! 

I agree that Tom is a fascinating character and Ryan Eggold has star presence but I just can't with Famke Janssen--the woman is so fake looking with her overly died hair and plastic surgery--her face does not move.  Christine Lahti has had some work done, but at least she hasn't gone overboard with the Botox--there is no crime with aging gracefully.

And honestly, we were finally able to unlaod the micro-talent of Megan Boon but now we have to deal with the one note Janssen?

At least Red is still entertaining along with the FBI crew.

[torqy]

6 hours ago, krimimimi said:

 the Lizbatross

Love it! You win the Internet!

[Kelda Feegle]

3 hours ago, kitmerlot1213 said:

I agree that Tom is a fascinating character and Ryan Eggold has star presence but I just can't with Famke Janssen--the woman is so fake looking with her overly died hair and plastic surgery--her face does not move.  Christine Lahti has had some work done, but at least she hasn't gone overboard with the Botox--there is no crime with aging gracefully.

And honestly, we were finally able to unlaod the micro-talent of Megan Boon but now we have to deal with the one note Janssen?

At least Red is still entertaining along with the FBI crew.

I have to agree with this,  Famke's face is driving me crazy, I spend more time analysing exactly what work she has had done than ever listening to the dialogue. I will pass on the spin off methinks.

[dwmarch]

Interesting episode of a different show altogether. But considering how formulaic and contrived The Blacklist 1.0 was, Blacklist 2.0 has potential.

I couldn't help but think that Tom's outrage at Red comes from the fact that Tom totally got a boner for his own mother. Red might have made it happen but you're the one who got the stiffy, Tom... so who are you really mad at?

I also got the feeling that Tom shot Solomon in some non-critical area on purpose. He definitely had enough time for a coup de grace and he deliberately didn't take it. And while I appreciated that he took the time to get the wounded girl some help he also took his mask off while doing so. I will pay actually money if in the new series Solomon complains about how in every heist Tom has to start yelling his name...

There was a weird continuity glitch at the end. The FBI is trying to figure out why Diaz subpoenaed Kirk. "Red musta stolen his money!" they discern. Um, dudes... you were there! You knew what the plan was all along. Did Aram pass a joint around at the office to relieve the tension of the robbery and everyone was so high they forget what they were doing?

Tom's a social engineering genius, figuring out that just by accusing that finance guy of being a pig he can get a waitress to spill an entire tray of drinks on him. She's a waitress at an embassy! As if no drunk rich dude has ever propositioned her before! What if she had the opposite reaction and decided that since a night with the guy would be worth a month's pay she might as well just do it? Now that would have been awkward and awesome at the same time.

Red controls the President would be an awesome show. Here's hoping.

[Dowel Jones]

Quote

The Blacklist: Redemption

Okay, then.  We should have an election for best rebranding.  I have two nominations to twist your imaginations:

The Blacklist:  Under the Dome

and

The Blacklist:  How I Met Your Mother.

[ottoDbusdriver]

31 minutes ago, Dowel Jones said:

The Blacklist:  How I Met Your Mother.

I think we have a winner.

It works on two levels -- Tom could weave tales to Agnes about how wonderful Lizzie was (or maybe Aram could do it when he's babysitting), and about how Tom first wanted to kill and then went to work for his own mother.

[thuganomics85]

Tonight in The Tom and Susan show, featuring the FBI and a cameo or two from Red.....

Actually, as far as backdoor pilots go, it wasn't that bad.  Tom is way more interesting of a lead then Lizzie ever was, and Solomon continues to be fun antagonist, even if Tom clearly disagrees with me on that part.  Cracked up when Tom had enough and just shot him, but of course Solomon somehow survives it.  Hell, he'll probably won't even all that mad about it.  Just be like "That was cool, buddy!", when he sees Tom again.

Of course, the big twist from Red that Susan is Tom's biological mother sure came out of nowhere, and it has suddenly made all their scenes very awkward, since Ryan Eggold and Famke Janssen were playing the character's interactions a bit more... er... hot and heavy, I guess.  Way to be creepy there, show.

So, basically The Blacklist: Redemption (ha!) is going to be Tom working for Susan's group, who are mainly a group of killers who do bad things, but every now and then, they do something good (like save those captured dock workers?), so they aren't all evil, I guess?  I'm not sure how this show is going to work, when everyone on it is kind of bad.  I mean, Tom of all fucking people, is apparently going to be the responsible person.  That alone is kind of scary.

Even if he was backed by an evil billionaire, I'd vote for Senator Benito Martinez!

[MostlyC]

So I think there needs to be another thread here about BlackList Redemption so we can stay on topic for the episode threads. 

But for the moment, does anyone have any pithy names you would suggest?

[Gregg247]

I hold Mr. Solomon responsible for Lizzie's death.  For that reason, the man deserves a show of his own and all the money and adulation that comes with it.  I'm glad to see Tom there as well.

[mandigirl]

I really enjoyed that. More so than I have enjoyed an episode in a long while. I didn't know about the spin-off. I too was hoping that Tom would get integrated into the Blacklist 1.0 team. Elizabeth Keane was never compelling and she was (supposedly) the main character. I know many people blamed the actress, but I think the character was bland and the actress was mis-cast. Tom brought some much needed new energy to the FBI team. 

3 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Of course, the big twist from Red that Susan is Tom's biological mother sure came out of nowhere, and it has suddenly made all their scenes very awkward, since Ryan Eggold and Famke Janssen were playing the character's interactions a bit more... er... hot and heavy, I guess.  Way to be creepy there, show.

Actually, I've read the Blacklist pilot and Red and Elizabeth were also supposed to have that weird sexual chemistry. Thankfully, neither actor ever played it that way. Whether that was an acting choice or it came from higher up, I don't know.  Ironically, in Blacklist 2.0, Susan and Tom have amazing chemistry. They led with that foot and now the mother-son revelation is weird. I hope Red is wrong about this one. Also, if Red wanted to get rid of Tom, why not bring up Scotty ages ago? The quickest way to have got rid of Tom would have been to tell him about his past. 

[Danielg342]

Well, I liked it. There was enough "weirdly silly" for me to find it quite enjoyable. I'm glad that, finally, Ryan Eggold is getting his own series, and I like the thought of Tom going on several dangerous missions undercover to root out the world's greatest evils...it'll be like Mission:Impossible only slightly more realistic.

Only thing I really have to say is that I didn't like the writing or the direction for Solomon. Edi Gathegi is a fine actor, he's a joy to watch, very charismatic, a scene stealer in every sense of the word. Simply put, Gathegi ought to have his own series, because he could carry it, and do it all by himself. I don't like him as a bad guy, and I hope that's not where he's going- although I fear, after he got shot, that's where he's headed.

I understand that Tom would be angry that Solomon lead the team that killed Liz. I also understand that smoothing things over between the two won't be a one-scene or one episode job. I get that. However, Solomon could have shown a bit of remorse for what happened- he didn't intend to kill Liz, after all- and he could have told Tom that he "was only doing a job".

I don't know. I just think Gathegi is a wonderful talent and this show has completely wasted them. I don't want the spin-off to do that too.

As for Alexander Kirk- can't say too much about him. Nor can I say much about Robert Diaz, though it's a shame a criminally-funded President doesn't get used a bit more often. Perhaps if this show makes it to S5 or S6, Red fighting the U.S. President would be the perfect cap for the show.

Spoiler

As for Kirk, I saw enough of him to know he'll likely be good enough as a worthy villain for S4. I just hope the writing will keep up.

Episode Grade: B. An entertaining hour, and there's enough here to suggest that the spin-off could be fun. They just need to work out a few details first.

[paigow]

6 hours ago, MostlyC said:

But for the moment, does anyone have any pithy names you would suggest?

1. TNG (Thx Roddenberry)
2. Bigger, Longer & Uncut (Thx South Park)
3. Home (Thx Mulder)

[Drusilla]

5 hours ago, Danielg342 said:

Well, I liked it. There was enough "weirdly silly" for me to find it quite enjoyable. I'm glad that, finally, Ryan Eggold is getting his own series, and I like the thought of Tom going on several dangerous missions undercover to root out the world's greatest evils...it'll be like Mission:Impossible only slightly more realistic.

Only thing I really have to say is that I didn't like the writing or the direction for Solomon. Edi Gathegi is a fine actor, he's a joy to watch, very charismatic, a scene stealer in every sense of the word. Simply put, Gathegi ought to have his own series, because he could carry it, and do it all by himself. I don't like him as a bad guy, and I hope that's not where he's going- although I fear, after he got shot, that's where he's headed.

I understand that Tom would be angry that Solomon lead the team that killed Liz. I also understand that smoothing things over between the two won't be a one-scene or one episode job. I get that. However, Solomon could have shown a bit of remorse for what happened- he didn't intend to kill Liz, after all- and he could have told Tom that he "was only doing a job".

I don't know. I just think Gathegi is a wonderful talent and this show has completely wasted them. I don't want the spin-off to do that too.

As for Alexander Kirk- can't say too much about him. Nor can I say much about Robert Diaz, though it's a shame a criminally-funded President doesn't get used a bit more often. Perhaps if this show makes it to S5 or S6, Red fighting the U.S. President would be the perfect cap for the show.

  Reveal hidden contents

As for Kirk, I saw enough of him to know he'll likely be good enough as a worthy villain for S4. I just hope the writing will keep up.

Episode Grade: B. An entertaining hour, and there's enough here to suggest that the spin-off could be fun. They just need to work out a few details first.

Tom being one of the world's greatest evils himself... but hey that's okay, he's cute and has great abs so who cares, right girls? Never mind redemption in this show comes overnight, nevermind that anyone who does any research for sociopaths/psychopaths (yeah he kills without compunction) cannot CANNOT be redeemed. Unless they are cute and have great abs and favorite ALL your tweets to them.

 

This post contains sarcasm. Drusilla is not responsible for anyone who doesn't get it.

[Danielg342]

On 13/05/2016 at 2:00 AM, yourmomiseasy said:

When Famke sneaks into the hospital to see Agnes and Tom finds her, she hands him the baby, says some blah blah blah crap about protecting Agnes and blah blah blah dead son and then leaves saying "10 minutes.  I'll send Solomon to pick you up.  We've got a lot of work to do."   So it wasn't so surprising that he was with Tom in the next scene.  It was kind of weird that Solomon was acting jovial, but he's an ass bag, so it was probably kind of in character.  The peppy action movie music and snappy dialog didn't help matters in that scene -- I guess it was okay for a pilot exposition scene, but not a guy having to grudgingly work with the asshole he feels is responsible for his baby-mama's recent death scene.

Liz is actually the one that named the baby Agnes after her adoptive dad's mom or some other dead relative along that line.  She had to do one last annoying thing before she died and saddling her baby with that name fit the bill.

For what it's worth, St. Agnes is the patron saint of childhood and little girls. In fact, on the eve of her feast day, January 20, girls are to perform a number of rituals so that their future husband appears in a dream.

2 hours ago, Drusilla said:

Tom being one of the world's greatest evils himself... but hey that's okay, he's cute and has great abs so who cares, right girls? Never mind redemption in this show comes overnight, nevermind that anyone who does any research for sociopaths/psychopaths (yeah he kills without compunction) cannot CANNOT be redeemed. Unless they are cute and have great abs and favorite ALL your tweets to them.

 

This post contains sarcasm. Drusilla is not responsible for anyone who doesn't get it.

Add to that is the fact that Tom is a white guy and there’s one big reason why he can be “redeemed” and Solomon supposedly can’t.

I also believe that the writing has let Tom down. Eggold plays him- and plays him very well- as a sympathetic character, but the writing is anything but. It’s kind of like Patrick Jane on The Mentalist- Simon Baker played him to have a heart, but the writers couldn’t have been bothered to show it. It ultimately dragged down The Mentalist, and it will drag down the spin-off if the writers are not careful.
 

Edited May 16, 2016 by Danielg342

[ItCouldBeWorse]

17 hours ago, Dowel Jones said:

The Blacklist:  How I Met Your Mother.

How about "The Blacklist:  How I Met My Mother."   Too obvious?

[Princess Lucky]

1 hour ago, Danielg342 said:

For what it's worth, St. Agnes is the patron saint of childhood and little girls. In fact, on the eve of her feast day, January 20, girls are to perform a number of rituals so that their future husband appears in a dream.

Add to that is the fact that Tom is a white guy and there’s one big reason why he can be “redeemed” and Solomon supposedly can’t.

I also believe that the writing has let Tom down. Eggold plays him- and plays him very well- as a sympathetic character, but the writing is anything but. It’s kind of like Patrick Jane on The Mentalist- Simon Baker played him to have a heart, but the writers couldn’t have been bothered to show it. It ultimately dragged down The Mentalist, and it will drag down the spin-off if the writers are not careful.
 

 

9 hours ago, Danielg342 said:

Well, I liked it. There was enough "weirdly silly" for me to find it quite enjoyable. I'm glad that, finally, Ryan Eggold is getting his own series, and I like the thought of Tom going on several dangerous missions undercover to root out the world's greatest evils...it'll be like Mission:Impossible only slightly more realistic.

Only thing I really have to say is that I didn't like the writing or the direction for Solomon. Edi Gathegi is a fine actor, he's a joy to watch, very charismatic, a scene stealer in every sense of the word. Simply put, Gathegi ought to have his own series, because he could carry it, and do it all by himself. I don't like him as a bad guy, and I hope that's not where he's going- although I fear, after he got shot, that's where he's headed.

I understand that Tom would be angry that Solomon lead the team that killed Liz. I also understand that smoothing things over between the two won't be a one-scene or one episode job. I get that. However, Solomon could have shown a bit of remorse for what happened- he didn't intend to kill Liz, after all- and he could have told Tom that he "was only doing a job".

I don't know. I just think Gathegi is a wonderful talent and this show has completely wasted them. I don't want the spin-off to do that too.

I agree that Edi Gathegi is a very charismatic actor and, much like Ryan Eggold, he has created a villain who is a joy to watch. But are we to assume Solomon won't be part of the "redemption" idea? I think Tom, Solomon and Scottie are all included in the "redemption" part. That's the idea, as far as I understand it. A group of criminals doing (sometimes/mostly) good deeds. Leverage-style. Instead of having one Red and a bunch of Feds, it'll be a bunch of Reds (if you will). I'm not sure Solomon will be a villain at all (would the villain be a regular? I don't think we've had that on The Blacklist, it's just guest stars, no?). I think he's going to be a part of the team. And Tom shooting him, that was almost funny, I thought. Like, it could be a running joke. Tom shooting Solomon in non-vital organs every couple of episodes just 'cause.

11 hours ago, mandigirl said:

Actually, I've read the Blacklist pilot and Red and Elizabeth were also supposed to have that weird sexual chemistry. Thankfully, neither actor ever played it that way. Whether that was an acting choice or it came from higher up, I don't know.  Ironically, in Blacklist 2.0, Susan and Tom have amazing chemistry. They led with that foot and now the mother-son revelation is weird. I hope Red is wrong about this one. Also, if Red wanted to get rid of Tom, why not bring up Scotty ages ago? The quickest way to have got rid of Tom would have been to tell him about his past. 

Seriously that was CHEMISTRY between Ryan Eggold and Famke Janssen. I gotta say, I used to judge the "Reddington" fans but now I feel their pain. "She's his mother!" "But what if she isn't?" I totally agree that Red/Liz has always been a deeper, more tender relationship, even in the beginning, and I never felt that Spader played up an overt sexual chemistry between them. Tom/Scottie, though? That was definitely played up by the actors who, I assume, were told to act like they're about to kiss.

By the way, what does it say that I, as a hardcore Tom/Liz shipper (no shame!), forgot about Liz within 5 minutes and now I'm like "yeah forget The Blacklist, I'mma watch the spinoff and ship Tom and his mother"???

[Danielg342]

4 minutes ago, Princess Lucky said:

 

I agree that Edi Gathegi is a very charismatic actor and, much like Ryan Eggold, he has created a villain who is a joy to watch. But are we to assume Solomon won't be part of the "redemption" idea? I think Tom, Solomon and Scottie are all included in the "redemption" part. That's the idea, as far as I understand it. A group of criminals doing (sometimes/mostly) good deeds. Leverage-style. Instead of having one Red and a bunch of Feds, it'll be a bunch of Reds (if you will). I'm not sure Solomon will be a villain at all (would the villain be a regular? I don't think we've had that on The Blacklist, it's just guest stars, no?). I think he's going to be a part of the team. And Tom shooting him, that was almost funny, I thought. Like, it could be a running joke. Tom shooting Solomon in non-vital organs every couple of episodes just 'cause.

Seriously that was CHEMISTRY between Ryan Eggold and Famke Janssen. I gotta say, I used to judge the "Reddington" fans but now I feel their pain. "She's his mother!" "But what if she isn't?" I totally agree that Red/Liz has always been a deeper, more tender relationship, even in the beginning, and I never felt that Spader played up an overt sexual chemistry between them. Tom/Scottie, though? That was definitely played up by the actors who, I assume, were told to act like they're about to kiss.

By the way, what does it say that I, as a hardcore Tom/Liz shipper (no shame!), forgot about Liz within 5 minutes and now I'm like "yeah forget The Blacklist, I'mma watch the spinoff and ship Tom and his mother"???

I hope you're right about Solomon.

I fear you're wrong. The next episode talks about a betrayal, and, given that Solomon escaped but was never seen again, I fear the betrayer is him.

It could be a funny running joke, I agree.

"Hey, hit the left kidney this time...I got a stone I don't want to pass."

[mandigirl]

9 hours ago, Princess Lucky said:

I agree that Edi Gathegi is a very charismatic actor and, much like Ryan Eggold, he has created a villain who is a joy to watch. But are we to assume Solomon won't be part of the "redemption" idea? I think Tom, Solomon and Scottie are all included in the "redemption" part.

ITA. We don't know anything about Solomon's backstory. I'm expecting that once we do learn about him, there's more shades of gray. Edi Gathegi is an actor who can totally pull off nuance, so I'm hoping Blacklist 2.0 goes deeper into that character.  

I don't think it's a great idea to take the more interesting characters off to have their own adventures. I still believe a hybrid as opposed to a spin-off made more sense.