S06.E04: Here's Not Here

[HalcyonDays]

Episode synopsis: A new face appears; trust issues form.

 

Here is your thread to discuss S06.E04: Here's Not Here. This thread will open Sunday November 1st, at 10:30 pm, because the episode is 90 minutes long!

 

Prior to the episode airing, you can mourn, speculate and live chat about the episode over here:

 

                           ---> S06.E04: Here's Not Here - Pre-Air Speculation and Live Chat

 

• Post No Spoilers (Comics, Talking Dead or Otherwise)
• Respect Each Other
• Always Be Civil
• Enjoy Yourselves!

[AimingforYoko]

John Carroll Lynch and Lennie James crushed it, but the severely PTSD-afflicted Morgan running across probably the only Zen, skilled-in-aikido forensic psychiatrist left in the world made me roll my eyes harder than any other time with this show. And that's saying something.
I will say this, it was a nice reversal of the "Magical Negro" trope.

[Starchild]

OMG I was so excited to see John Carroll Lynch in the credits. That guy is awesome!

 

Every once in a while, when I see our heroes killing scores of zombies, I think to myself, "Well, we've come a long way from when Rick would look at ID to discover their name, take a moment to remember they were human, and put them down with respect." It was so nice to see someone still doing that after all this time. I really liked this character, too bad we couldn't keep him.

 

But man, first Dwayne, then Eastman. Will Morgan ever stop making mistakes that get other people killed?

 

By the way, what does "Here's Not Here" mean? Did I miss that?

[MrsRafaelBarba]

Why Morgan, did you leave that Wolf in the House?

Locking no doors.

[SimoneS]

Okay episode, a bit boring at points. I cannot believe that Morgan is hiding this guy in that basement and the others do not know know. Morgan is still fucking crazy. The writers really are determined to ruin another strong black male character from the comics.

Edited November 2, 2015 by SimoneS

[Samsnee]

Tune in next week to see a special 90-minute episode where we learn how Deanna first met Reg and became such an incompetent leader!

[CofCinci]

You know it's a bad episode when you're pressing your work clothes for the week instead of watching intently. I'm going to look so great this week!

What a waste of a 90-minute episode! So many other episodes in the series could have been stretched to 90 - whereas, this episode could be been a webisode.

[raven]

 

By the way, what does "Here's Not Here" mean? Did I miss that?

Eastman said it to Morgan after he got bit.  Morgan's all "I said not here!" and Eastman says "here's not here".

[SzmuttyPratfall]

That was bad. Really bad. Really predictable. Really manipulative. Nothing in the goddamn episode added much to what we know, and was just telling us, the audience how to feel. Momentum has built to a huge degree the past 3 episodes, and this killed that momentum, and did nothing to serve the story. This should have been a series of webisodes. This should have been a one-off special between seasons. 

[Spartan Girl]

Okay, this the performances were great but this would have been a much better episode for the season premiere or at least BEFORE last week.

Morgan, a word of advice: you're an idiot.

[editorgrrl]

By the way, what does "Here's Not Here" mean? Did I miss that?

Morgan painted it in blood on a rock.

[lulee]

So much happened that 90 minutes!

 

I won 3 Trivia Crack random challenges, did some dishes, found a place to donate all the Halloween candy my kids agreed to donate, helped my sister-in-law convert Facebook back to English after it switched to Mandarin.

 

And Tabitha died and Morgan made more decisions that proved to be not super duper.

[FierceCritter]

Upon first goat bleat

A thought came to mind unbidden
"Enter the Cheeseman"

- A haiku by FierceCritter

[Rosiejuliemom]

John Carroll Lynch and Lennie James knocked it out of the park. However, Tabitha was the episode MVP. Hands down.

 

As interesting as this episode was, it was still better than Slabtown.

[natyxg]

I'm always so distracted by how sturdy those little wooden sticks are.

 

I figured the cheeseman was going to die saving Morgan, but that was lame.

 

Wasn't as bored as I expected to be, but if they had skipped this episode I wouldn't have minded.

 

Back to the Glenn situation now, please.

[minamurray78]

I guess the writers don't want the audience to trust Morgan, not one bit.

 

Sigh. 90 minutes, I can't believe it.

[mustbekarma]

The Walking Dead is trying to convince me this past 90 minutes was riveting and amazing. LIES.

 

I guess Morgan does fit the definition of insanity. He keeps doing the same thing again and expects different results. The first time, it was killing everybody. The second instance of madness is adhering to the motto "All life is precious.' I wonder how many people are going to die because Morgan won't kill a person.

 

This episode could have been shot and edited into the 60 minute format, easily. That half hour was just sheer indulgence.

Edited November 2, 2015 by mustbekarma

[Straycat80]

Why was this a 90 minutes episode? It was interesting in parts but a bummer that Eastman and the goat didn't make it. I can't believe Morgan has a wolf in a house and not telling anyone and letting him live. This will not end well

[mightysparrow]

It was ambitious and I don't know if it succeeded.  Lennie and John were sensational, really sensational.

 

I'm not blaming Morgan for Eastman's death.  Eastman saw the walker and it's on him to stay out of the fucking way.

[Nashville]

Eastman said it to Morgan after he got bit.  Morgan's all "I said not here!" and Eastman says "here's not here".

 

Eastman meant "Here" is not just where you're at in geographical terms; it also means where you're at mentally.

Even though they were in the same place where Morgan indulged his mental delusions, Morgan was no longer the same person who created and (for lack of a better term) "thrived" in such a gawd-awful place.

 

 

ETA: grammar

Edited November 2, 2015 by Nashville

[NorthstarATL]

I want Carol to bring Morgan's prisoner a casserole. Though maybe having to sit through that story was punishment enough?

Morgan's Psychiatrist missed something that undergrad psych majors learn: putting a killer to death is NOT supposed to make you feel better. It's to prevent further murders.

Why did Morgan have to vacate the cabin? I had to take a phone call, so I missed it. That was an awesome set-up.

I was hoping that when Morgan exited he'd be greeted with a row of smiling walkers, holding hands, and swaying.

[FierceCritter]

When Chris Hardwick said Lennie James and John Caroll Lynch would be there to answer your questions, I shouted at the TV screen, "Here's my question: IS GLEN DEAD?!?!?!?"

[bmoore4026]

So, you're a murderer, aren't you, Morgan?  Two directly, one indirectly.  And you're keeping a wolf in the midst of a town of sheep.  SYMBOLISM!  Once again, for all the shit he's done, Rick still looks better in comparison.  He's killed to keep his group together and, correct me if I'm wrong, hasn't committed cold blooded murder.  I mean, yeah, he went into a berserker rage last season, but he hasn't deliberately killed anyone.  Morgan, however and in a case of Unfortunate Implications, came at two different pairs of white people with a spear like a stereotypical savage.  He can't get killed fast enough.

 

Poor Cheeseman.  Poor Tabitha the Goat.  I liked them.

 

This episode made me sad and mad at the same time.

Edited November 2, 2015 by bmoore4026

[Samsnee]

Quit trying to make prequels happen, Walking Dead.

[raven]

Well I'll sit here by myself and really like it.  Without two good actors (and Tabitha) it would have been no good, but I wanted to know what happened to Morgan and I can wait for the answer on Glenn.

 

I think a better ending would have had Morgan kill the W (he's dying anyway! he said he's going to kill everyone!) just to show that he's still,,kinda crazy Morgan as well as kinda zen Morgan.  It would have fit the character better to be more complicated.  Unless he's going to torture the W for info, I'm on board with that.

[natyxg]

Why did Morgan have to vacate the cabin? I had to take a phone call, so I missed it.

 

He didn't have to. He did it because the other dude helped him learn that he needs people, so he went out to find more people.

[SoSueMe]

The Walking Dead is trying to convince me this past 90 minutes was riveting and amazing. LIES.

 

I guess Morgan does fit the definition of insanity. He keeps doing the same thing again and expect different results. The first time, it was killing everybody. The second instance of madness is adhering to the motto "All life is precious.' I wonder how many people are going to die because Morgan won't kill a person.

 

This episode could have been shot and edited into the 60 minute format, easily. That half hour was just sheer indulgence.

I'm guessing that TPTB have gotten wind of the Morgan/Lenny James fan club (big surprise), and decided to take the opportunity to cater to those fans. At the same time they can capitalize on the Glenn situation and build suspense. I hate being manipulated.

[HalcyonDays]

Morgan, a word of advice: you're an idiot.

 

How many times are we going to see a good person try to "help" someone who may or not deserve it, and subsequently get killed for their efforts. Crazy!Morgan had it right - Clear them all out of the area.

 

Crazy Morgan was crazy - dude, stop yelling "Kill me!!" You really want to die? Take that rifle of yours and put a bullet in your head. Problem solved.

 

John Carroll Lynch and Lennie James killed it - both were awesome. Very disappointed though that Lynch lasted only one episode. Wish he could have joined CDB/Alexandria and been useful.

 

I don't agree with the message "kill no one." There are bastards out there that need to be taken out. Wolf with bad teeth is one. Serial Killer Clayton Dallas Whoever was another. Sometimes there are just bad people out there. (Guess I missed the whole ZEN message of the episode)

 

Was Gimple smoking some herb and hanging out at a hippie commune while writing this episode. Very peace and love and zen and peacenik episode.

[Nashville]

It's telling that the goat was the most revered character in this episode.

[jay741982]

The preview for Next week looks good. Liking Jessie more. She gets it

[Eln5]

I think my inexplicable love for Morgan is really due to the actor. God that Lennie James is charming in real life. I think it must be bleeding into the character for me.

[raven]

 

Eastman meant "Here" is not just where you're at in geographical terms; it also means where you're at mentally.

I got that, I was answering the quote placement question :)

 

 

Very peace and love and zen and peacenik episode.

I don't know about that.  Eastman let someone die a long, painful death (who deserved it).  He's killed no other living people.

 

The message is pretty obvious to me - don't take a chance on anyone, bad things will happen.  Though the group did take a chance on Bob, which worked out, except for Bob in the end.

 

I have no doubt more bad is coming because of Morgan's decisions, that's how this show rolls.  Peace has no place in this world.

Edited November 2, 2015 by raven

[Nashville]

John Carroll Lynch and Lennie James killed it - both were awesome. Very disappointed though that Lynch lasted only one episode. Wish he could have joined CDB/Alexandria and been useful.

 

Echo - at least Eastman fully understood what he was talking about.  Hopefully Morgan at least hung onto the book.

[NorthstarATL]

He didn't have to. He did it because the other dude helped him learn that he needs people, so he went out to find more people.

Thank you! Now I imagine the musical version with the two of them singing "People" from "Funny Girl" (And there's even the visual of the rabbit's foot for "the LUCKIEST people" line.

[Cheetosandchoc]

Why Morgan, did you leave that Wolf in the House?

Locking no doors.

Because he is an asshole

[sluggish neko]

Interesting how different the "thank you" Morgan got was so different from the "thank you" Glenn got. Y'know, I might have enjoyed this more if I didn't feel so manipulated by last episode's cliffhangers.

 

I'm also disappointed that Eastman was not a kung fu monk.

[Nashville]

I got that, I was answering the quote placement question :)

 

I got that you got that.  I was answering for the folks with less practice in dissecting psychobabble.  :)

[Peanut]

Was the "Save terrapins" shirt a call back to the tortoise's unfortunate demise?

 

eta: Chris noticed too.

Edited November 2, 2015 by Peanut

[SnoGirl]

How did Eastman never have a horde walk through his camp? It seems also absurd knowing about the wolves that they never stumbled across Eastman and his bleeting Tabitha.

I liked the episode but not this week. This week I wanted to see the horde of Walkers dismantle Alexandria. I want to know how Rick escapes. And I want to know if GLENN IS DEAD. I did like that Tabitha and Eastman were both buried with name plates.

Bad form Walking Dead. Bad form!

[bmoore4026]

Because he is an asshole

 

And stupid

[Macbeth]

Love Morgan and Lennie but WTF.  

 

Morgan got 90 minutes for his origin story - Glen got 30 seconds for his death scene.

 

We don't need to look at what happened to Glen this week.  We need early morning beauty shots of Morgan practicing the art of Zen with his stick.

 

Show's message - we need to explore and revel in the beauty of life.  Take care and note the name of the zombies we are burying and put proper markers on their graves.

 

Meanwhile this f!!!ing show hasn't even mourned an important character's death or acknowledged that it actually happened.  It wasn't even the last shot of last weeks's episode.  Like I was supposed to care about anything after Glen died.  Rick going crazy again - please.  He will just slip into another coma and the zombies will ignore him as always.

[lulee]

The actors were great, yadda yadda yadda, but nothing in this episode really surprised me - a little surprise that we saw Morgan kill humans, maybe, but nothing about Morgan's journey, nothing about Eastman's story, nothing about their interaction.

[Timetoread]

What is bothering me the most is the self-righteousness of the decision "not to kill".  This seems to come from people who have been primarily alone.  The decision to kill seems to originate not from self preservation but from the desire to save those that you love.  Any person walking down the street who is not Morgan will kill for their child, their spouse, their family even now.  Our group has been through what comes dealing with bad PEOPLE when there is no longer a government or legal system to deal with them and what sets them apart is that they have opened themselves up to caring for each other.  It is why they are so strong.  If Morgan had gone with Rick in the beginning, he would kill too. 

 

Also, this did nothing to endear me to Morgan.  Basically he became somebody else.  He's a follower.  And Rick is a leader and this is why, in the end, they will never see eye to eye.

[ghoulina]

I probably shouldn't even be posting, because I didn't even see the first half hour. My stupid DVR...I don't even know what happened. We always wait a bit to start, so we can FF commercials. It was like the damn thing had a scratch. After the first sixty seconds it just froze! Sorry, I know no one cares, but I was PISSED.

Anyhow, I didn't get to see Morgan's peak of craziness, or how he met Eastman, so that may taint my opinion.

I liked the episode. Mainly because I love Lennie James and John Carroll Lynch is fabulous as well. They had me very invested in their stories, even though I still can't get on board with this whole "All life is precious" crap. I seriously can't. But that's how good they are.

Overall, it was just nice to get Morgan's back story, even though I think it might have been better to do episode one, instead of after the cliff hanger we got last week.

Just loved the vibe of the episode - the scenery, the music, the dialogue. Very Gimple.

But yea, I'm not sure how a crazy person murdering my wife and children would turn me into a pacifist. I get that torturing the dude drove him crazy, but can we find no middle ground??? Hopefully Morgan arrives at that realization soon, keeping Wolves as pets ain't cool, man!

Lastly, save the terrapins! (Especially from Enid.)

Edited November 2, 2015 by ghoulina

[SoSueMe]

Was the "Save terrapins" shirt a call back to the tortoise's unfortunate demise?

 

eta: Chris noticed too.

Pretty sure that I saw Eastman standing in front of a framed print of a turtle, too. Or maybe it was Morgan...

[FierceCritter]

Was the "Save terrapins" shirt a call back to the tortoise's unfortunate demise?

 

eta: Chris noticed too.

Also happened to notice the Audubon-style illustration of a turtle or tortoise on the wall of the cabin. First thing I thought was, "I thought he said he was a vegetarian. Tortoise counts."

[Nashville]

Pretty sure that I saw Eastman standing in front of a framed print of a turtle, too. Or maybe it was Morgan...

 

Several framed prints were on the walls in Eastman's cabin.

 

 

ETA: Jinx!

Edited November 2, 2015 by Nashville

[Geillis]

This episode did not make me like Morgan any better.  He can be walker food for all I care. He makes bad decisions and does not learn.

[Boofish]

While Morgan is practicing Aikido Rick is perfecting Ai-kick-yo-ass-doe

[Macbeth]

I probably shouldn't even be posting, because I didn't even see the first half hour. My stupid DVR..

 

You didn't miss much trust me.