S11.E07: Week 6

[JenE4]

 Even showing all the makeout sessions, yet rarely showing a CONVERSATION between Kaitlyn and one of the guys.  

 

Granted, I'm sure she must actually speak to these guys, too, but the kissing is her top priority. In this episode AS SOON as she sat down with Benzie for their 1:1 time, she leaned in for a kiss, and he had to stop her and say I want to talk to you about why today was so hard for me. You'd think if she really cared about these guys or wanted to actually get to know them that SHE would be the one to ask how he was feeling about the fake wake, but, nope, she just goes right in for the smooching. (And even when he had the guys leave the room during the wake, the look on her face was like she had NO CLUE why this was hard for him or even remembered that his mother had died.) This one example I thought was really blatant, but I see her doing that a lot--kiss first, ask questions later. So to me it's not a matter of who she sleeps with and when. But, as I mentioned before, a HALF DOZEN GUYS (Ian, Tony, Clint, Kupah, Joshua, and sort-of Shawn in this cliffhanger) have ALL confronted her on her behavior of how she doesn't seem like she's There for the Right Reasons with how she's acting. And I tend to agree. They can't all be wrong about her. That doesn't mean that I think she's a shameful slut, yet just in it for a good time and nothing serious is considered Wrong Reasons in Bachelor Nation/Family. And all of this is BEFORE they even know about Nick (if they do find out), so a quarter of the cast and counting thinks she's Not There for the Right Reasons based solely on her interactions with them and observing her interactions with others. That's certainly enough of a basis to "judge" her behavior. I hereby declare Kaitlyn Bristowe guilty of Wrong Reasons [bangs gavel].

 

ETA: And that's another thing about all of these guys' (Ian, Tony, Clint, Kupah, Joshua, and semi-Shawn [we'll see how that cliffhanger goes]) confrontations. Every single one of them seemed "out of the blue" and were edited as how did this "nice guy" suddenly turn on Kaitlyn without warrant? In every instance the show tried to edit it like THE GUY was the one in the wrong. Yet I get the feeling that these probably are all basically nice guys who were genuinely trying to get to know Kaitlyn but then hit their limit when they felt like she didn't give a damn about truly getting to know any of them for who they are and that she had Wrong Reasons intentions. I think that's a valid reason to make all of them snap. They put their lives on hold--leaving their families and their jobs, and for what?! Granted, maybe she didn't care to get to know the bulk of them, but even Shawn, the one who cares about her and she supposedly (according to what she apparently told him) cares about the most is thinking that she's acting two-faced or shady or Wrong Reasons stringing him along, or what have you. And then on the other extreme we have Tanner joking, do you even know my name--why am I still here?--because he, too, apparently thinks Kaitlyn hasn't tried to get to know him at all. So, I think even those who haven't confronted her (yet?) are feeling something is off with her. And with EVERYONE crying in next week's preview, oh, hell, the entire cast might just revolt in a Wrong Reasons walkout. And I, for one, would not be the slightest bit surprised. That's probably why they keep dragging out these episodes (not only did we not have the rose ceremony yet--but we had a whole entire date to go) because so many guys are walking out on her Wrong Reasons ass that they can't even fill a season.

Edited June 24, 2015 by JenE4

[Alapaki]

Yet I get the feeling that these probably are all basically nice guys who were genuinely trying to get to know Kaitlyn but then hit their limit when they felt like she didn't give a damn about truly getting to know any of them for who they are and that she had Wrong Reasons intentions. I think that's a valid reason to make all of them snap. They put their lives on hold--leaving their families and their jobs, and for what?!

 

 

I think there's probably something to this.  And it gets back to the crappy Group Date activities that "soul of a chinchilla" (or whatever the fuck he called himself) complained about.  

 

In past seasons, many of the group dates at least involved activities that both the "suitors" and the "star" participated in together.  I can't recall this many date-activities that have had the suitors competing against each other, one-on-one, while the star sits back and watches, with some lame ability to get time with the star on the periphery of the activity.

[Padma]

So I had read what CH said that Kaitlyn felt such a strong connection for one guy, so fast, that it was like "game over" early on for the show, so that was why they brought in Nick.

 

With that in mind, I figured that "one guy" from the beginning was her first impression rose--Shawn--and it seemed confirmed by how she acted with him, even though we weren't even told about the 6 hrs in San Antonio (maybe, again, because they worried about the mystery). So, to me, that explained how so many guys felt she didn't have much interest in them (didn't explain all the random kissing though, but can't have everything with this show.)

 

So I was very surprised, figuring that Shawn from almost the beginning was "the one" (as he felt she'd told him as well), that she would have sex with Nick. I thought it was very weird and can't help being curious how much she told Nick about her relationship with Shawn (she should have told him it was serious, imo, but it didn't seem like she'd said much of anything at all about it.) If she'd basically told Shawn he was it, he was her bf (TM-Britt) then why keep kissing all the other guys when you don't really have to? And why sleep with Nick?  I'm always amazed that anyone actually develops strong feelings for each other on this show, but it seems Shawn really did get them for Kaitlyn and early on.

 

That makes her even dumber than I thought (and I already thought "kind of stupid") to risk what seemed like a relationship with a lot of potential--with someone who has a lot of trust issues--by having sex with Nick. Her choice, her decision, of course. But I don't think I'll feel sorry for her at all if she winds up with no one as a result.

[ByTor]

So I had read what CH said that Kaitlyn felt such a strong connection for one guy, so fast, that it was like "game over" early on for the show, so that was why they brought in Nick.

I heard that as well.  What I don't understand is, Kaitlyn said that they started talking during The Bachelor.  Why, then, did they need The Bachelorette in order to meet?  That's the reason I believe what Padma and I read is true.

[hnygrl]

From what I've seen thus far, and me being as jaded as I am, I believe this is what happened:

 

Shawn spent the night with Kaithlyn on their one on one. THEY HAD SEX. She ADMITTED to being IN LOVE with him and picking him in the end ("you're the ONE"), Then she goes and does all the kissy kissy stuff in this episode, and here Shawn was, (naturally) thinking "since I'm the one, she's gonna be more demure, not so much making out and touchy-touchy with the other guys. Sorry Nick!" Imagine his confusion (and anger) (and HURT) when NOTHING CHANGES! So at the end of the episode his handler convinces him to go to Kaitlyn's room to talk this thing out. (hey, great tv!) He basically asks her "what the hell babe? I thought I was "the one?" What's going on here?" And Kaitlyn, being the mature adult that she is, and having a major case of the guilties, because folks, the boy is IN PAIN...cries. A lot.

 

And confesses. On TV. In front of God and everybody. (cause, good TV! GET THAT CAMERA CREW IN THERE NOW!!!!)

 

THAT is when she admits to having sex with Nick. THAT is when all the crying and "I hope I haven't ruined everything" talking/crying head happens. Because in the previews, when Shawn is walking away, he's really really really upset/disgusted. I don't think he's leaving. I think she'll talk him around, because:

 

1) he's smitten. The boy is GONE.

 

and most importantly

 

2) his handler and the other producers (ala unREAL) will talk him out of it, and tell HER what to say/do to FIX this. All will be well by the end of the episode. And yes, no rose ceremony because...drama...

 

I don't think the other guys ever find out about the sex, because Shawn is a gentleman, and (weirdly enough) at heart, so is Nick.

[bantering]

 

I don't think the other guys ever find out about the sex, because Shawn is a gentleman, and (weirdly enough) at heart, so is Nick.

But they know now!

[backformore]

SO - what hnygrl is saying is that Nick was brought on to the show to mix things up a bit, to distract kaitlyn

 

uh oh - here's where my mind goes -    Nick, after being fucked over by Andi (was that her name?  I can't even remember if I have it right)  approached the show to be the next Bachelor.   they thought of the "brilliant"  idea that all he needs to do is to ONCE AGAIN be the F2.

  

So the story can be that Nick "fell in love"  and had sex with not one but TWO Bachelorettes, was jilted both times, and now needs a chance to "find love".  What better way than to be the next B?  

 

I would even wonder if the Sex scene behind a close door with sound effects and everything wasn't staged and scripted for the purpose of telling this story. Like, maybe they didn't DO anything except moan for the sound guy, and pretend that they had sex.   Because the true story of "Kaitlyn goes on the Bachelorette, falls in love with one guy, and has to string everybody else along for several weeks"  was too boring.  So Nick's role was to console her, make out with her, and make Shawn jealous so there was more to the season than "falling in love."  Drama!  Heartbreak!  Jealousy!

 

I'm joining the cynics  who watch 'Unreal"  and want the real story. 

Do we need a "Grassy knoll'  thread here? 

[ByTor]

I would even wonder if the Sex scene behind a close door with sound effects and everything wasn't staged and scripted for the purpose of telling this story. Like, maybe they didn't DO anything except moan for the sound guy, and pretend that they had sex.  

Wouldn't shock me at all.

[cinsays]

   I guess I'm just old, but if I met someone and knew right away that he was the one, no way would I be having sex with someone else.

Especially in this circumstance when it is being broadcast for the whole world to see.

   All this "what have I done" drama doesn't make it all go away and I don't think Kaitlyn really regrets doing it.  Getting caught, yeah, but not the act itself.

   I don't think much of Kaitlyn and really hope Shawn comes to his senses and realizes he deserves better.

   Just because you can have sex with every guy in sight doesn't mean it really is the thing to do.

   But then, I am of the opinion that our country started going in the wrong direction when it became ok to have 5 kids with anyone and everyone outside of a committed relationship and expect the rest of the world to support you.

 

[truthaboutluv]

So the story can be that Nick "fell in love"  and had sex with not one but TWO Bachelorettes, was jilted both times, and now needs a chance to "find love".  What better way than to be the next B?

 

 

Uh I can think of a lot of better ways to be the next Bachelor and that's not it. Hell, in my opinion Nick had a better chance of becoming the lead by not coming back on the show this season. Because while some viewers were upset about his ATFR reveal about sex with Andi, many sympathized with and defended him. The public reaction wasn't all negative and his quietly going back to his life did a lot to gain him more goodwill with some viewers, coupled with Andi and Josh quickly imploding. So if the producers wanted to make him the lead, they didn't need him coming onto the show again where those who already disliked him only hate him even more now, see him as nothing more than a famewhore, not to mention his once again being embroiled in a "negative" aspect of the season. 

 

I don't often make claims with a 100 percent certainty as life is very unpredictable but I do not see Nick being the Bachelor - ever and I do not think for one second the producers are considering it or considered it ever. If there is any manipulation that went on with this whole Nick and Kaitlyn business and his coming back on the show, the only thing I'm willing to entertain is that the producers were still holding the plane video over his head. So when Kaitlyn got too caught up in one guy and season was game over, they brought in Nick who had been talking to her and been friendly to her before she became the lead. 

Edited June 24, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[violetr]

uh oh - here's where my mind goes -    Nick, after being fucked over by Andi (was that her name?  I can't even remember if I have it right)  approached the show to be the next Bachelor.   they thought of the "brilliant"  idea that all he needs to do is to ONCE AGAIN be the F2.

 

So the story can be that Nick "fell in love"  and had sex with not one but TWO Bachelorettes, was jilted both times, and now needs a chance to "find love".  What better way than to be the next B?

 

 

I think the issue with this theory is that Nick is really detested by the majority of "Bachelor Nation." The producers would practically have to be magicians to make the public accept him as Bachelor, methinks. 

[Andromeda]

At this point I've got zero idea what is editing and what isn't.  Voiceovers, interviews apparently filmed weeks later that may not have anything to do with the actual event they're supposed to be discussing, the producers skipping over things (Kaitlyn in Sean's room for hours), really bad audio cutting to produce moaning and groaning behind a bedroom door (when they're obviously using a different track).  The editing has just sucked this season- I always expect a villain of the week etc, but the editing is so out there that I don't even care much about the storyline now.  Clint goes from vaguely cute triceratops drawing guy who gets along well with Kaitlyn to gay for TV to asshole in about 10 minutes, Ian (who certainly seemed like a well-adjusted man for the first few episodes) all of a sudden goes off his rocker, Joshua gets the idiot edit.  I never thought that I'd feel sorry for Britt, but that last bit with her was a bit painful to watch. 

 

And they seem to be going over the top with the previews, compared to what actually happens. Who knows what she's crying about in the ITMs (whenever they happened)- they'll be pasted in to produce whatever effect the producers want.  I didn't see her GMA appearance or anything, but from what I have seen, Kaitlyn seems to be owning the choices that she made during filming.  

And JJ -- remember him? He was the villain for two episodes, and now he's wallpaper.

 

As for previews, the show has always had misleading previews. Best to take them with a grain of salt.

[nexxie]

Nick just seems like a smooth con man to me - and Kaitlyn too eager to be conned.

It would make sense if this was a distraction storyline the two went along with.

[KR Vermont]

I consider a preview to be a snippet that will be shown in an upcoming episode, but this franchise seems to show things that never make it into any ep and leave some of us wondering if we blinked and missed it.

 

It almost looked, at quick glance, that dentist Chris could have doubled over with a belly laugh rather than tears. Though maybe he just got wind of a bad review of his treasured Broadway show moment and was actually sobbing. :p  Oh, this show.

[gator12]

I don't think Shawn deserve better than Kaitlyn

[Mu Shu]

 

 

 

I disagree. Four out of 25 is actually pretty good relative to most seasons. On virtually every season, by the time you get past the last couple of contestants standing, the rest of them were never really in the running and have hung in there because of the Stockholm Syndrome psychosis that overcomes them all and the competition of wanting to win the 'prize'. 

No, I mean that out of 25 guys,  only four seem willing to pretend they're interested.     Men are competitive creatures, especially in an all male group.   These guys are half assing it.   In past seasons even if they didn't want the "prize", they at least competed,  for the most part.    Take Jillian:   It was obvious out of the gate some of the guys weren't physically attracted (One even said as such),  but there was a lot of competition going on.    The guys who weren't initially attracted at least grew to be attracted to her personality. 

 

I don't see too many guys attracted to Kaitlyn at all, and I think physically she's prettier than Jillian.    I would make an unscientific guess that out of Jillian's season, at least half of the total group was interested in her.    Sure, they wanted to be on TV, but it seemed that they enjoyed her company, and even if she wasn't the "one", they were enjoying themselves and her, and competed to stay.  

 

For all Kaitlyn's sense of humor, she seems very humorless when she's asked "right reason" questions.     She's really sort of a drag, like Deanna was.    Both  are better looking than Jillian,  but less attractive because of their personalities, IMO. 

Edited June 24, 2015 by Mu Shu

[Bugs Meany]

I don't often make claims with a 100 percent certainty as life is very unpredictable but I do not see Nick being the Bachelor - ever and I do not think for one second the producers are considering it or considered it ever.

 

You beat me to it. Nick will never be the Bachelor.

[tessa]

I haven't watched the Bachelor or Bachelorette on a reg basis for a few years as it seemed most contestants had ulterior motives rather than the rel motive of finding love. I'm surprised at Sharlene's article as I didn't think she had much to do with the Bachelor alum. I found her to be more refined and mature than a lot of contestants on the show.

 

We all know that the scenes are heavily edited in any reality show - but again - due to that these contestants need to consider what consequences they face with every action. I personally have had a couple of one night stands in my younger days - but if I was on national TV - I would never embarrass myself nor my family like she has. I can't believe that any of those guys would think this behavior was acceptable and stay, but they're probably thinking ahead to being the next Bachelor.

[KnoxForPres]

Guilty as charged of having a few too many Makers and waters in my 20s and doing not great things, but.....

If I were a contestant I would play the game and expect the "prize" to as well. I think that's what gets me most. When they pan back to these pretty good looking, well spoken guys playing the game, I'm not ok with her sex choice.

In her best fantasy several of these men would never look at her twice in real life. And the pre requisite by all accounts appears to be bc Nick (I believe) fake acts interested in her and she feels chemistry. She said "come with me" or similar. I actually think the Nickster thought it would be a night of making out and her wanting more....you know, how it's done and done well.

I just don't see Kaitlyn being Nicks type. I'm not buying what he's selling. As much as I gag at his skinny jeans and bracelets and desperation to be cool, I oddly do see someone I think smart and probably worthy of a pretty damn good girl. He's a famewhore for sure and that's concerning.

It's a frustrating season. I like her less and less each week and like the guys more. That's how I felt with Ben Flapjack so guess it's the same, but damn, sometimes self control goes a long way. And better, provides clarity and strong decision making.

[bantering]

No, I mean that out of 25 guys,  only four seem willing to pretend they're interested.     Men are competitive creatures, especially in an all male group.   These guys are half assing it.   In past seasons even if they didn't want the "prize", they at least competed,  for the most part.    Take Jillian:   It was obvious out of the gate some of the guys weren't physically attracted (One even said as such),  but there was a lot of competition going on.    The guys who weren't initially attracted at least grew to be attracted to her personality. 

 

I don't see too many guys attracted to Kaitlyn at all, and I think physically she's prettier than Jillian.    I would make an unscientific guess that out of Jillian's season, at least half of the total group was interested in her.    Sure, they wanted to be on TV, but it seemed that they enjoyed her company, and even if she wasn't the "one", they were enjoying themselves and her, and competed to stay.  

 

For all Kaitlyn's sense of humor, she seems very humorless when she's asked "right reason" questions.     She's really sort of a drag, like Deanna was.    Both  are better looking than Jillian,  but less attractive because of their personalities, IMO. 

Trista, the first Bachelorette, seemed to know how to entertain the men. Ditto for the one who was a cook. I can't really recall that many bachelorettes being that good at entertaining multiple men in a space where these men don't really have access to the outside world. I think it requires major skills to entertain that many men at once. And  I think it's harder to be a bachelorette than it is to be a bachelor. For the bachelors, the women seem to be under some kind of weird spell even if the guy is a turd like Juan Pablo.  The differences are a little baffling to me in that regard. 

 

During the Deanna season, the men entertained themselves with basketball and then she ripped into them with some stupid temper tantrum about how they were paying more attention to basketball bonding than her.  However, I don't think we've ever really been shown   how the women entertain themselves, outside of the usual catfights over the bachelor himself.  

Edited June 25, 2015 by bantering

[JudyObscure]

Violetr quote :

As for someone's judgment on the show, all this and more is addressed in this wonderful, insightful post by Sharleen Joynt on the episode. Love this woman.

http://www.flare.com...-episode-seven/ 

 

In her blog Sharlene keeps asking us to ask ourselves things like this:

 

 

Ask yourself: With no private time with the opposite sex, and not being permitted to seek out distraction, how long before you would get—in the sage words of Ryan McDill—“horned up”?

 

Say what?   She thinks people can't go a few weeks without sex?  Throughout her blog she is very judgmental of the fans and scolds us as though we were gossiping about a neighbor and not discussing a person who has volunteered to be filmed for  a TV show.  Sorry Sharlene, that's sort of what reality TV is all about.  We watch it to talk about it.    These shows would be soon canceled if we all turned it on only to look politely away when something happened that might be embarrassing for the person on screen.  You can talk about editing, cameras, and alcohol all you want but these are not animals in a zoo, they are adult human beings of normal intelligence who should be able to manage a little self-control for a few weeks in front of the cameras.

[MakeMeLaugh]

Sharleen, Ali, and the other Bachelor franchise players are all being super pro Kaitlyn to the point of being strident and scolding about it. Give me a break and give Kaitlyn a vibrator.

I wonder if Sharleen is telling us she and Juan Pablo helped each other out when she was "horned up" during his season--the conditions she thinks caused Kaitlyn's need for sex existed then, right?

Edited June 25, 2015 by MakeMeLaugh

[bantering]

I personally think its the public nature of the sex that makes Kaitlyn's sexcapades rather mock-worthy. Although we're not shown the actual sex, I do think it's almost on the level of Kim Kardashian releasing her sex tape (I'm not sure there's really that much of a difference  in terms of someone  using their sex life for public entertainment). That level of intimacy is not  necessarily something I think we need to  be privy to, even if it is important to the contestants that they get to know each other on all levels. 

 

Kaitlyn and Nick  genuinely enjoy the act or sex, but there's an exhibitionistic streak to it that I find weird. Like, did they do it on tv for drama so people would have something to talk about, but it, uh, backfired? (not just for the gossip, but if whoever Kaityln picks sees the episode and winds up embarrassed that they sort of saw his financee have sex with another guy on tv). Anyway, it's dumb when people who aren't actors go on tv and are surprised that people, you know, gossip about what they saw which is apparently something that's "supposed" to be "real." 

 

We make fun of the Kardashians for using every aspect of their private lives for fame. Why would the contestants on this show be exempt from the same criticism?

Edited June 25, 2015 by bantering

[Bugs Meany]

Sharleen, Ali, and the other Bachelor franchise players are all being super pro Kaitlyn to the point of being strident and scolding about it.

 

Seriously. Sharleen's perspective used to be that of an outsider who was given insider access and was ready to spill the secrets. Now she's just writing blog posts to defend two friends of hers.

 

 

I personally think its the public nature of the sex that makes Kaitlyn's sexcapades rather mock-worthy. Although we're not shown the actual sex, I do think it's almost on the level of Kim Kardashian releasing her sex tape (I'm not sure there's really that much of a difference  in terms of someone  using their sex life for public entertainment). That level of intimacy is not  necessarily something I think we need to  be privy to, even if it is important to the contestants that they get to know each other on all levels.

 

Well, Kim Kardashian was a "civilian" when that came out. If she was known at all, it was as a friend of Paris Hilton's, or the daughter of the least-famous guy on O.J.'s Dream Team. Kaitlyn was already a reality star, so you could argue she's even more mock-worthy.

[MasalaCurry]

I don't care much about Kaitlyn. Ian was right, she is shallow and there to just make out with a bunch of dudes. I don't blame her for sleeping with Nick, but I do wonder why she could not get him out of her system before going on this show. From what I have seen of Shawn, it seems like she led him on and told him he is the one, to then go all crazy after Nick. Someone upthread said that Shawn must be exhausting, opening and closing up and then opening up again. I think it has to do with the process. He is scared of opening up because he doesn't want to get hurt, but develops feelings for Kaitlyn and opens up, then he sees that Kaitlyn's actions don't match her words, is confused and wants to close up again but is too involved emotionally to do that naturally. I do understand that part, he probably is not like that in real life, it is the Bachelorette process. Kaitlyn is incredibly boring. She really has nothing to talk about, can't carry a show, and most of the guys are disappointed and really not that interested in her. I can't stand her gummy grin and duck lips either. Having said that, when she speaks, I find her to be very sincere. When she first heard that she was chosen as the Bachelorette the first thing she asked is if Britt is fine. She is also completely honest about having sex, something people usually keep under wraps. It may seem like TMI but I like her honesty. But it also makes me question her because clearly she is not honest with Shawn in giving him the impression that he is the one and then sleeping with Nick after. She lives in the moment. It is hard to build a relationship with someone like that unless the person changes a bit. Relationships need more long-term thinking and commitment interspersed with living in the moment. She lives in the moment all the time, making what she says unreliable and doubtful because she can change her mind the very next minute. Nothing can be long-standing with her. So clearly she is not ready for a relationship.

 

I am tiring of this show's having recycled Bachelors and Bachelorettes. Chris was boring, I only remember his dolphin laugh, he was so vanilla, as is Kaitlyn. It is time to introduce someone new and fresh, not recycle from the past season. None of them come across as well as they did in the past season, none. I would totally tune in for someone new and fresh who can start with a clean slate. And nothing wrong with having eye candy.

Edited June 25, 2015 by MasalaCurry

[violetr]

Say what?   She thinks people can't go a few weeks without sex?  Throughout her blog she is very judgmental of the fans and scolds us as though we were gossiping about a neighbor and not discussing a person who has volunteered to be filmed for  a TV show.  Sorry Sharlene, that's sort of what reality TV is all about.  We watch it to talk about it.    These shows would be soon canceled if we all turned it on only to look politely away when something happened that might be embarrassing for the person on screen.  You can talk about editing, cameras, and alcohol all you want but these are not animals in a zoo, they are adult human beings of normal intelligence who should be able to manage a little self-control for a few weeks in front of the cameras.

 

 

Oh, I think Sharleen is well aware of this POV. She just wants to add one insider's perspective to the cacophony of fan comments and articles in the media that we see each season. She knows from experience that there's a crazy set of circumstances we never see that lead contestants to act out and do all kinds of crazy shit. There's a reason this formula is used over and over again. Put a bunch of attention-seeking people into a competition, keep them isolated from the outside world, add alcohol, and voila! Magic happens! During production, the contestants ARE animals in a zoo. They are literally mammals in confined spaces. That's why we watch. 

Edited June 25, 2015 by violetr

[bantering]

I can see the producers using certain tactics that would make a person lose their inhibitions with so many people of the opposite sex around, but I also think the cameras being there along with the camera crew would kind of be a buzzkill.  That's where I'm a little baffled as to how people lose control and let everyone see what's going on in terms of the kissing, etc. It all looks way too uncomfortable, even if you have a naturally extroverted personality. But then again I suppose people who think rationally don't go on this show.

Edited June 25, 2015 by bantering

[ByTor]

I can see the producers using certain tactics that would make a person lose their inhibitions with so many people of the opposite sex around, but I also think the cameras being there along with the camera crew would kind of be a buzzkill.  That's where I'm a little baffled as to how people lose control and let everyone see what's going on in terms of the kissing, etc. It all looks way too uncomfortable, even if you have a naturally extroverted personality. But then again I suppose people who think rationally don't go on this show.

I heard that alcohol flows pretty freely at all times.  When Kaitlyn is in the house she's rarely seen without that glass of white wine.  I'm beginning to think that wine glass is permanently affixed to her hand :)

[scenicbyway]

I don't really get Kaitlyn's reaction to her night with Nick.  She's worried he'll tell the other guys, shouldn't she and Nick have talked about this before he left her room?  Did he even need to spend the night? She seemed distraught that she could end up with  no one (Shawn) as a result--which makes me think that Nick is really no longer in the running after their "night,"  because surely she could be happy she'd end up with him if things had gone well.

 

I too think the same thing has happened between her and Shawn (which justifies him being so pouty in this last episode).  For some reason TPTB don't want us to know that's happened, only that it has with Nick.  Why?

 

I did think Nick handled it in a classy way, it can't be easy to come back and try to explain why you were out the whole night to the other "boyfriends." 

It is funny that during the wake, some of the guys openly admitted they didn't know why they were still there.

[Padma]

I thought Nick was pretty classy about it, too, considering the circumstances. And it doesn't reflect well on Kaitlyn (what does?) that she didn't apparently think enough about Shawn and his feelings (or Nick's need to know about their relationship) sometime during all those hours together. She really seems like the most vapid and shallow b-ette ever, and that's saying something.

 

I kind of appreciate Sharleen's need to defend her friends, because she -isn't- an outsider any more and she has lots of fans. It would be natural to try to do that when people you like are getting such bad comments made.

 

That said, I don't agree with her about Kaitlyn (and like Sharleen, I actually do like Nick).  The best thing I could come up with in Kaitlyn's defense (and its not much) is that the sexism on this show is really, really annoying. First it was the "two b-ette" thing. Now it's playing Kaitlyn's sex noises on a voice over of a closed door. (Did they include Nick? I don't think so!)

 

That was gross on so many levels. First, they must have either hidden mikes in the room (appalling) or pushed the microphone against the door from the hallway as Sharleen speculates. (disgusting).

 

Yet when Chris and Britt went into his bedroom and closed the door... no sex sounds there at all. It was just left to our imagination (and for Chris and Britt to deny it if they felt like it.)  Frankly, I thought they were telegraphing it all over the place--in bed together for a two hour "nap" then rudely running off together to the concert without even talking to the other women. But what said, "they had sex" to me (and would have had me telling Chris "adieu") apparently didn't come across that way to the others.

 

And the producers intentionally left it ambiguous on camera.  Here, with Kaitlyn, they could have left the edit without sound effects, could have talked to her intelligently not baited her on the balcony (and left that out, too). But...no.  They were protective of Chris, but went about showing enough of Kaitlyn to make her seem cheap and insincere.  I think it was quite a double standard.

[leighdear]

To me, classy would have been to NOT spend the entire night, then do the incredibly obvious "walk of fame" the next morning ( because there is no "shame" with Ick).  I don't believe that they would force him to stay in her room until the next morning.   He wanted it known, and it was.  Well played, Ick. 

[bantering]

Maybe the show decided to focus on Kaitylin's moaning after she confirmed to the camera that she had had sex.

 

The show might have left the editing of noises alone if no confirmation had been made.

[anony mouse]

To me, classy would have been to NOT spend the entire night, then do the incredibly obvious "walk of fame" the next morning ( because there is no "shame" with Ick). I don't believe that they would force him to stay in her room until the next morning. He wanted it known, and it was. Well played, Ick.

Or, Kaitlyn wanted him to stay.

Or, (more likely) the producers made him wander the garden so they could film him - think how many people on this show are shown aimlessly wandering a park or city with a voiceover about looking for love. Given the continuity issues with the show, we have no real proof that walk was him even leaving her room.

We have no idea what Nick "wanted" from that small clip that was shown.

Edited June 26, 2015 by starving artist

[ByTor]

think how many people on this show are shown aimlessly wandering a park or city with a voiceover about looking for love.

Yes, like how we always hear that (whatever location the show is currently in) is the perfect place to fall in love.

Edited June 26, 2015 by ByTor

[leighdear]

The producers can do a lot of things, but If Ick insisted on leaving Kaitlyn's room before morning, they couldn't have forcibly prevented him.

 

But he didn't want to leave.  Because his role was to be the instigator/shit-stirrer/gigolo/itch-scratcher for Kaitlyn.  And he was playing it to the hilt.  And you can tell that he's enjoying every minute of it. 

[Padma]

Frankly, I take Nick at his word, that he liked what he saw of Kaitlyn on Chris' season, he enjoyed their twitter exchanges and phone calls and wanted to compete for her on the show. (I also believe the producers called HIM, after seeing he was getting along well with Kaitlyn on Twitter. I totally believe CH that Kaitlyn seemed too serious about one guy from the start--risking ruining the show--so they brought in Nick.)

 

I don't blame him a bit for accepting especially since it was obvious from the beginning that, whatever Kaitlyn had with Shawn, it didn't keep her from also being very interested in getting to know Nick (even pre-sex).

 

We have no idea why he went back so late, but it appears to have been something Kaitlyn wanted as well--for him to stay. She didn't seem upset at all on the balcony, when it was already daylight.

 

If that's what they decided, fine, but they have to take the consequences, that's all. (And I'm astonished that Kaitlyn didn't think enough of her relationship with Shawn to spend time talking with Nick about it. It was obvious from her comments on the balcony and THs that he was pretty much an afterthought. What a stupid and shallow woman she seems to be! I'm surprised so many guys seem even a little bit interested in her.)

[NikSac]

I'm honestly surprised Kaitlyn even admitted that the noises were her. I think she could have claimed they weren't and were random voice-overs and gotten away with it. Nick could have kept up with the whole "we were just on the couch" spiel, too.

[Fannysue]

Kaitlyn seem like a really fun and attractive girl.  Unfortunately, she also acts like a 15 year-old girl with her thinking - not exactly marriage material.

[Flybutter]

Good catch by the poster who said the morning after balcony scene was most likely shot in San Antonio. I thought something was off about that shot, but I didn't put two and two together. The exterior shot of the hotel where they were staying was of a rather old stately european hotel. The balcony was rather stark white modern with tons of sun. It did not match with that hotel's exterior or interior for that matter. So, I tend toward the theory that it was shot in San Antonio and that she did have an evening of important intimacy (is this a producer provided word?) with Shawn. Also the editor provided word strips? Who knows if that is what she said in San Antonio or in an interview somewhere else? Such editing monkeying and fakeiity fake dramaz this season.

I thank all of you posters who pay attention to the show as I obviously don't. None of this would occur to me without y'all.

I too noticed the bright sunny balcony and thought it seemed out of place for a Dublin hotel. So I googled the hotel they're supposedly staying at there - the Radisson Blu St. Helens. Yup, no balconies like the one we see in that shot. So where was she, talking like she just got her field plowed the night before? Does anyone remember where they were staying on the night Kaitlyn supposedly hooked up with Shawn? I feel like the producers definitely pulled a massive editing switcheroo here. Edited June 26, 2015 by Flybutter

[Mabinogia]

I know it's silly but the bird tattoos bug me even more now that she is all about bird fear. It's just oddly annoying.

[ByTor]

That would be like me getting a centipede tattoo!

Edited June 26, 2015 by ByTor

[nexxie]

Ian is an ass. His ego wouldn't allow him to be eliminated via rose ceremony, and nobody would watch him as the Bachelor - but he was right about Kaitlyn being shallow. She laughs. She makes out. She has sex. And that's pretty much it.

[call me ishmael]

Or at least that is all the producers want us to see her doing. They seem to have decided to make her look poorly from the very beginning.

[Adeejay]

Or at least that is all the producers want us to see her doing. They seem to have decided to make her look poorly from the very beginning.

 

I think Mocking Bird said it best:

 

I really believe this season is one long "F*ck you!" from the producers to all the fools like me who wanted Kaitlynn as the Bachelorette.  They really, really wanted Britt and now we're all being punished for it.

 

[Canada]

I think this entire season has been one big 'fuck you' to all the fans, whether they are Britt fans, Kaitlyn fans, or fans of both/neither.  It's been a really shitty season. 

[himela]

I think this entire season has been one big 'fuck you' to all the fans, whether they are Britt fans, Kaitlyn fans, or fans of both/neither.  It's been a really shitty season. 

In fact I want to look at the other side of the coin for a moment. People who participate in this show become famous, they become a subject to adore, they become someones. Who makes them like that? Us. The fans of the show. The audience adores every person who has seen on their tv, even when (like now) there is no reason to do so. These people do nothing more than being pretty and showing their lives on tv. They are not extra smart, extra talented, extra gifted, they are just normal and average people. If the audience stops showing them this kind of admiration, if being in the show does not equal to them making a career out of it, then this kind of people won't get in the show anymore just to get famous. In the contrary, only people who really believe they can have an adventure and maybe find love will be in the show, if the show will even exist after that. What I mean is, lets stop making them feel like gods and start to eliminate the fame whores from this show. Turn off our tvs so that the producers see these fake, drama seeking seasons are not liked by the audience.

Edited June 27, 2015 by himela

[JudyObscure]

I really believe this season is one long "F*ck you!" from the producers to all the fools like me who wanted Kaitlynn as the Bachelorette.  They really, really wanted Britt and now we're all being punished for it.

]

I think if they had wanted Britt, they would have easily had Britt.  All they ever had to do would have cast one more professed Britt fan or influenced an undecided to vote Britt.  I thought they were beginning to despise Britt way back when they kept the camera on her long, curbside crying spell, neglecting to even give her the dignity of a limo to sob in.  They made sure she lost the vote and  then made a big deal of Gracious-Kaitlyn asking if she was alright.  Next, they give Britt a goofy, unattractive "boy friend," and keep the cameras on that, following her home, showing Mom's dismay and Britt looking stupid in that knit cap.  I think they're punishing her for something.

 

I think they thought the fans wanted a sexy time season and thought Kaitlyn would give it to us.

[ByTor]

What I mean is, lets stop making them feel like gods and start to eliminate the fame whores from this show.

IMO if that is done then there will be no more show.

[Ketzel]

IMO if that is done then there will be no more show.

This. Where are you going to find dozens and dozens of genuinely sane, kind, modest, intelligent, hardworking, attractive young women with satisfying careers and normal social outlets who are eager to fling themselves into the power of Fleiss and Co? Fame whore is one of the basic requirements.

Edited June 27, 2015 by Ketzel

[Lone Wolf]

Alright, I was going to do a rewatch before I posted my comments, but it seems like that isn't going to happen and if I don't get my thoughts out soon we're going to be on to the next ep.  So, off the top of my head...

 

Isn't is serendipitous that visiting Dublin was always on Kaitlyn's bucket list and here she is?  Last week she was all about Aladdin and rapping, and now she's a celtophile. She must be the luckiest. bachelorette. EVER!

 

That said, I guess her equally life-long ambition was to hear a C-level band that formed before she was born sing a 22-year old song that barely cracked the Top Ten while she danced with her "date" (has that ever been done before on this show?).  Wha' hoppen - they couldn't get Sinead O'Connor? Christ, I'd have rather heard The Irish Rovers doing The Unicorn Song; at least that one was written by one of my personal heroes, Shel Silverstein (and she could have jigged to it).

 

Also, did anyone else catch the opening shot of birds, and then the one of bees, after the night of schtuppery? Very subtle, Show.  Very subtle, indeed.

 

Seems like I had more snark bait, but it's escaped me now.  Although (1) I didn't understand the point of the fake conversation between Britt and her mother (I could be wrong, but I don't think her mom's interested in dating Britt's fake BF, so does it really matter how she views their relationship?) and (2) Girlfriend wasn't doing herself any favors with that do-rag or whatever she was wearing.  Her round face looked like an overly made up full moon.

 

That is all.

Edited June 27, 2015 by Lone Wolf