The Kelly File: Duggar Interview 2015.06.03

[CaughtOnTape]

This is exactly what I didn't want to happen with these girls.  I don't think the public needs to send her back into that hell just because they didn't get to physically view her process and people want proof of what she went through so they can feel better about her state of mind.  No one needs to make either of these girls answer for anything.  Granted she could have stated her answers more clearly but as far as I'm concerned they can feel however they want to feel about it.  The public clamoring to get these girls to explain their positions is victimizing them all over again, IMO.

[Janet Snakehole]

I don't think it makes Jill look weak. She just processes differently than Jessa. It's empowering not to let others dictate how you feel or what you say. Whether those others are your parents or the community or the random strangers on the internet. We are all products of how we are raised. It seems to me the fact that Jessa & Jill seem to react differently in the snippet- proves that even being raised by the same parents in basically the same environment- they still have different personalities so I will continue to attribute what they say to them

personally unless someday they come out and say "My parents made me say all that but how I really feel is...."

Fair enough on the Jill part. I am going to bow out now, because I don't necessarily agree that Jessa is not letting others (ie, her parents) dictate how she feels. We will never know either way and like you I am not okay with subscribing any specific thought process to her. Edited June 5, 2015 by Janet Snakehole

[Twopper]

Oh, I wish someone had not mentioned  Megyn's nose. When I first saw it I thought it was a result of bad lighting and then last night I noticed there seemed to be a "slit" of some sort on both sides, and all I could think of was watching a demonstration of how make-up was applied to create the snakey face on Lord Voldemort.

 

 

 

 

It's astonishing to me that he thinks this will really make a statement. Mostly, it just shows how stupid he is. Again -- if he thinks the police chief and the city attorney of Springfield (I'm guessing the city attorney would be dealing with lawsuits against the PD) will sit quietly while he gets on national TV and maligns them, they're mistaken. Jim Boob has a lot more to lose as the result of stuff like oh, discovery than he could imagine.

It's astonishing to me that for someone so "shrewd", he has little to no common sense. Whoever dreamed up the "it was illegal to release the report" was uninformed. Every time he tries to refocus the narrative on how victimized he and his wife are due to the release of the report, he shows himself to be (again) less than concerned about the effects on his daughters. The best thing he could do for his family is to SHUT UP, but nobody seems to have the balls to tell him that.

 

 

Due to the doctrine of sovereign immunity, it would be difficult to win a suit against city officials.

 

I am utterly appalled at the lack of sensitivity both exhibit toward the daughters.  I would expect it based on the series, but I would have thought he would have been advised to sound more concerned, but the more concerned he sounds about the girls, the more he throws Josh under the bus.  I haven't a clue as to how many people normally watched the show, but I heard 4 million tuned into Jill's wedding.  That just isn't a large percent of the population so while they are somewhat well known they weren't known to the nation, but with this coverage on FOX and other networks, they  suddenly have better name recognition than most politicians. Anyone tuning in for the first time must be shocked at how they minimize what Josh did -- children asleep, over clothes, children not understanding, etc etc.  I just can't see TLC trying to save this show without serious revamping it.  Any of the earlier shows with Josh in his teens is not going to see the light of day again.  I don't think they would be in this mess had they been willing to stick to the show itself, but then they threw themselves out as parenting experts with books, speeches, etc. that suggested they had the secret to a perfect family. I do hope this exposes the Gothard/ATI connection.  

 

Jinger won't be in tonight's interview as she is damaged goods in their world, and she still needs to find a husband. I do think Jessa and Jill both are in a state of shock as they were expecting to be "stars' in their own spin-off. I can't really blame them, since they have been on tv for half their lives. Why would they expect anything different? But now, they are exposed to the cruel world and they are unprepared with no education and no skills.  It isn't their fault.  I hope this wakes them up a little to the real world as opposed to the Gothard world they have been living in. I really do wish good things to happen to them, and I might want to see a special in a few years to update on the adult children, except Joshie.

[melanie]

I think I have finally gotten my thoughts together on this whole Duggar situation and I have a few thoughts that I would like to share.  

 

The hypocrisy, I think, comes from the fact that this family comes from a place of complete arrogance which is typical of cultish thought processes.  They would not be willing, IMO, to extend the same mercy to others that they are expecting from everyone else.  If this were someone else's son dealing with this, they would be quick to blame the "outside influences" that they try so desperately to protect their children from.  But since they did everything right and are still dealing with this, then their "foolproof" method of childrearing that Gothard promoted must not have worked.  That is a huge pill for them to swallow and they seem unwilling to do that.  I do believe that they did their best to "deal" with the situation within their narrow scope because no one outside of their belief system is capable of doing anything no matter how much education or experience they have.  Again, it is the arrogance promoted in their belief system.  They were simply unwilling to go outside their sphere of influence because in their minds no problem could be too big for them. Instead of taking this as an opportunity to learn mercy towards others they have decided to buckle down and make this an "us vs. them" sort of thing.  

 

Their explanations of the molestation simply do not make any sense.  If Josh was just curious about women's bodies, he would not have been interested in a 5 year old.  That is something else that no one seems to be addressing and is the most disturbing to me.  No 15 year old young man should be aroused by an undeveloped 5 year old girl.  That is not normal curiosity.  I understand that this is the point where he was removed from the home, but I wonder if it was not too late.  

 

I worry about Josh's mental state and sincerely wonder if that is why we have heard nothing from him.  I have no doubt that he confessed this to his parents because in reading the accounts of other young men on recovering grace, this act of confessing even sexual thoughts to a parent is common behavior within this group.  He was calling out for help and needed more than just restricting access to his sisters, prayer, and stern "talking to" speeches.

 

This is truly a morality play being played out before our very eyes.  We can learn from it as objective observers, but the real lessons to the primary participants has been lost completely and they blame others and seem to have no empathy for their daughters.  Even Michelle's final little speech during her interview with Megyn Kelly seemed insincere as she talked about her daughters having their trust violated by law enforcement.  It seemed like she had to get herself worked up about this, but I did not sense any real empathy for the recipients of Josh's "improper touching".  

In thinking about what I would have done in this situation, I would would not have gone to the police.  However, my son would have been removed from the home immediately.  I would have sent him to live with his grandparents in another state where I would have gotten him extensive help.  I would never have allowed him in my home again ever.  

 

Sorry for the long post.  Just wanted to get it out there.  I have learned so much from all of you!

Edited June 5, 2015 by Rhondinella
added paragraph breaks

[JoanArc]

The guide on my DVR says Jim Bob and Michelle will also be on, in addition to Jill and Jessa. Maybe the girls will only be on for a few minutes to defend Josh, say it's all better, then get out? I'd prefer that to a whole hour of forcing them to go over the trauma in detail.

[Jellybeans]

I am not going to get into the specifics of it but I could be labeled a "victim" or "survivor" due to something that happened to me. But don't call me either.

Nothing pisses me off more than well-meaning people (advocates, lawyers, etc) telling me "how I should feel" (victimized, etc) because I have my OWN feelings. Whatever the girls say is theirs to say and I am not going to say it is wrong or they don't know what they are talking about.

I am not a victim. I am not a survivor. I am just a woman that had a bad experience, but dammit, it's over.

[parisprincess]

And I understand that it was meant as a compliment. But it does suggest that victims who don't handle it the way she does are in some way choosing to be victims.

 

I don't think the statement is suggesting anything at all about other victims.  I was a victim, and I don't choose to live as a victim; but I'm not projecting my personal choice of how to handle my circumstances on any other victim.  Every survivor of abuse has to deal with it in their own way and in their own time.  I would never suggest to anyone else how to handle it; we all have to do what we feel is best for ourselves.    

[andromeda331]

I haven't seen this question asked how is tonight's interview suppose to help the Duggars or for the girls to get a spin off? If they defend their brother which they most likely will all people will see is that they were forced to defend him. People already know thanks to their parents' interview and the police report their parents did nothing to protect them or their sisters. All they will see is two girls who were victims being forced to get on camera and defend their brother. Or believe they have to get on camera and defend their brother to save him and their family.

[Fuzzysox]

This interview thus far has been one of the biggest mistakes that the Duggars have ever made. Not only did they expose themselves as rotten parents but it also serves to open up even more cans of worms that might be hiding in their closet.

 

My local media in Chicago keeps reporting on it.....national news as well as all cable media aren't letting up. It's a complete PR hot mess.

 

I feel bad for Jill. Her fairytale indeed is her new nightmare. I sure hope that Derick still has/kept/wasn't fired from his Walmart job. She is learning a really hard lesson right now and her tears didn't seem for herself just the lost of what could have been, i.e. a new show that I will call Bored Housewives (lol what else can they be with no education?). I would hope that  Dr. Drew has reached out to the girls and asked if they wanted some free therapy. It might free them from the cult's hold on them.

[wovenloaf]

I just can't get over how whenever Michelle and Jim Bob are talking about how sad they are about this it is only in relation to Josh. Never the girls. "We are devastated by what Josh did." "We have so much grief in our hearts for what Josh did." "We feel like we failed because of what Josh did." 

 

What ever happened to - "We are so devastated that our daughters have been violated." "We have so much grief in our hearts over what our daughters have gone through." "We feel like we failed by not sufficiently protecting our daughters." NOTHING. Barely a mention. In that interview it seemed like the only mention we even got of the girls was "Yeah, 4 of the victims were his sisters." Then immediate switch right back to talking about Josh. =(

Edited June 5, 2015 by wovenloaf

[Lemur]

Given that one part of the report said it involved a five year old girl, who was the daughter of Michelle and James Duggar, no, the report was not redacted enough.

 

I'd say that's up for interpretation on the part of someone who has passed the Arkansas Bar and is familiar with their FOIA proceed.  This is a difficult situation due to the fact that the victims and the perpetrators share a set of parents and a residence.  

[fliptopbox]

I can sympathize with Jessa's position on things. I was assaulted at 14 and I have moved on and dealt with it in my own way. But you can bet your ass if suddenly it was the hot topic on tv and all over magazines I'd feel pretty victimized all over again. Nobody wants that kind of information to come out about their past. Nobody wants to admit they were a victim of any kind of sexual abuse, because it hurts and makes you feel powerless...or like you deserve[d] it. The main difference between me and Jessa is I'm a civilian nobody, so the likelihood of that happening is very low. But I can understand how she (and Jill too, probably) would feel that way. Whatever her relationship still is with Josh, I can definitely understand not wanting to deal with the fallout all over again.

Edited June 5, 2015 by fliptopbox

[Jellybeans]

Perhaps the women asked their parents not to talk about them, given they were sharing their story on Friday

Edited June 5, 2015 by Jellybeans

[mbutterfly]

Why the hell didn't the girls' PARENTS teach them what being touched inappropriately is? Talk about as basic a failure as there can be...

But what haunts me is that I start to wonder if in their world, this might actually not be seen as anything important, because they're just girls and since their spiritual leader was such a fan of groping young girls, why would they teach them what boundaries should be?

Their surprise might be genuine, because it really does happen all the time in their circles?

i know. I'm old enough to be Michelle's mother, but I taught my young children, don't let people other than Mommy or Daddy (or Grandma -- whatever) touch you where your bathing suit covers. Wait, I guess that would make no sense to the Duggars given their modest to the ankle swim attire. 

[Zanne]

      

 

 

Um it's too late to put the cat back in the bag!!!

 

        

    The Genie is out of the bottle.

 

    

 

The horse is out of the barn, and the toothpaste is out of the tube!

 

 

I'm surprised no one has gone for the obvious with the Duggars...

 

The baby is out of the uterus!

[Darknight]

The only reason the girls are speaking out now is because they're about to lose all thir benefits. Sorry THIS Interview Is bullshit. I feel bad that they were abused by their brother and their parents but now it's time to live in the real world and get a real job. No more baby registries or people spreads. It also looks like JB is behind this and is probably coaching them from behind the camera. We don't know how the girl feel but I can't believe anything they say since JB still controls them. If they break away and say this is how I feel I'm over it then that's different but JB is still running the show

[Happyfatchick]

I've heard nothing from Jana at all. Was she shown during this MK/Fox interview?

First sleekandchic, I think we can safely assume we're on different ends of the self respect spectrum, right?

Secondly, Jana is my GIRL. I think she's so terribly shy - I hope I hope I hope nobody has looked at her for a public statement of any kind. I have a sneaking suspicion because she was the oldest girl she probably knows a little more than the others...maybe. I don't want to think the things that happened affected her current personality, but I fear the worst. She's probably going like crazy trying to keep the house afloat, or she's under her bed with a pillow over her head. Was she even in the pic when Megyn was there, sitting at the end of the table and the kids were playing games or something? I don't recall.

Lastly, in the quick clip they did of jessa and Jill the other night after the interview Wednesday, I was very discouraged about what I thought was body language between the two sisters. Jill was crying, and Jessa seemed to be seated a fair distance away. It bothered me because, as two sisters having suffered the same trauma (although we don't know what, and don't need to know - only that it was traumatic), it seemed to me that "normally", sisters discussing these things would be huddled together to be in front of cameras. Close enough to hold hands. I saw the other teaser clip last night, and the chairs are closer. Close enough that when they asked Jess a question she hesitated and looked to Jill for assurance or guidance and they could look in each other's eyes comfortably. My heart just aches for them. I may be the only one, but I don't think they had to be asked to speak out. I think they are doing the best they can to help the family present a united front, and I think they volunteered to do so.

I also agree with everyone who says WHERE IS THAT COWARDLY LION??? He obviously can't face the press in general because they would eat him alive. Not like he can have a press conference and take questions at the end. (Snort!) I get that. But he also shouldn't sit back on his fat rear end and let everybody else in the family take his punches for him. I might stand up for my brother, even if he'd done something to me as a little girl. (And he DID, he played hide and seek with me and never looked for me!!! EVER!!! He STILL hasn't come to find me and it's been 50 years!). But I would sure as all heck be looking for HIM to speak out too. That circle of protection thing is just ridiculous. Lambert (Josh) could sit one on one with a softball lobber like MK and answer hard questions as easily as Jessa and Jill. Maybe EASIER!!! He's not the VICTIM!!!

My kids had a (Disney?) recording of "Laaaaaam-Bert, the sheepish lion when they were little. In my head, forever more after this debacle, Big J is LAMBERT.

Edited June 5, 2015 by Happyfatchick

[UsernameFatigue]

Their explanations of the molestation simply do not make any sense.  If Josh was just curious about women's bodies, he would not have been interested in a 5 year old.  That is something else that no one seems to be addressing and is the most disturbing to me.  No 15 year old young man should be aroused by an undeveloped 5 year old girl.  That is not normal curiosity.

 

THIS!!! Also Josh was 14 when this first happened, so his sisters would have been 12,11,9,8, and 5. He molested 4 out those 5 sisters, so most likely only one at the most would have been 'developed'. Has it been established that he did not molest the oldest sister? So was it the 11,9,8 and 5 year olds? At least three of those sisters would have been undeveloped, if not all. So the curiosity about women defense just does not wash. At all.

[Julia]

i know. I'm old enough to be Michelle's mother, but I taught my young children, don't let people other than Mommy or Daddy (or Grandma -- whatever) touch you where your bathing suit covers. Wait, I guess that would make no sense to the Duggars given their modest to the ankle swim attire.

But, again, the Duggar girls were wearing radical modest from a very early age. The first time they came to public notice was a photo of them going to the polls with their dad when he was still running for office with all the girls dressed in shapeless maxi pinafores.

 

Bluntly, I think Michelle lied. There's no way that they raised girl children to be teenagers and never explained to them why girls had to be completely covered at all times, and there's no way to explain that without explaining that bodies are private. The youngest children may not have known that there was something inappropriate about what Josh did, but the eldest girls certainly did (and according to the police report, said so).

[Churchhoney]

I just can't get over how whenever Michelle and Jim Bob are talking about how sad they are about this it is only in relation to Josh. Never the girls. "We are devastated by what Josh did." "We have so much grief in our hearts for what Josh did." "We feel like we failed because of what Josh did." 

 

What ever happened to - "We are so devastated that our daughters have been violated." "We have so much grief in our hearts over what our daughters have gone through." "We feel like we failed by not sufficiently protecting our daughters." NOTHING. Barely a mention. In that interview it seemed like the only mention we even got of the girls was "Yeah, 4 of the victims were his sisters." Then immediate switch right back to talking about Josh. =(

 

Yeah. Positive proof that the only thing they care about is their image. Josh damaged it. So prettying up what Josh did might get some of the dings out of their reputation. The girls' experience didn't affect their image one way or the other. So no need to talk or think about them.

 

I wonder whether any of the Duggar children notice these patterns in their parents' behavior.

[ladle]

Throughout the years, while I've found the Duggars' belief system to be stomach-turning on a lot of different levels, one thing I've always felt about them was that they were honestly devout.  True believers.  And that may have been naive, because now I don't know. How do you go on TV and violate one of the commandments not once but several times by outright lying about how you found out about the abuse?  How do you reconcile that with your faith?  Was the police report mistaken?  Have you convinced yourself that the lie is the truth?  Did you stop believing, or did you never believe?  Are there aspects of the Bible that are negotiable or mutable to you?

 

I mean, I understand the concept of picking and choosing when it comes to faith.  My mom's a Catholic, but she's pro-choice.  I have friends who consider themselves Jewish but do not believe in God.  I get all that.  But doesn't that kind of selectivity go against fundamentalism, as a very concept?

[Foghorn Leghorn]

Re: MS. Kelly's nose.

It look like mine with the nose jewelery out.  There are many ways to cover empty piercings and I'd bet she forgot hers when packing for the Duggars.

 

I thought the same thing, she wasn't wearing her nose piercings and likely because she was interviewing the Duggars who would be turned off by it I am sure!!  I wonder if that is why she also added those terrible hair extensions!

[Zung Li]

This is exactly what I didn't want to happen with these girls.  I don't think the public needs to send her back into that hell just because they didn't get to physically view her process and people want proof of what she went through so they can feel better about her state of mind.  No one needs to make either of these girls answer for anything.  Granted she could have stated her answers more clearly but as far as I'm concerned they can feel however they want to feel about it.  The public clamoring to get these girls to explain their positions is victimizing them all over again, IMO.

How is the public clamoring to get the girls to do an interview? It looks to me like they decided to do an interview just like JB and Michelle did. If anyone is clamoring it would be the Duggars, maybe TLC, and most of all Fox news. Who is making the girls do this interview? Not me- I wish they would all STFU forever.

[Churchhoney]

Throughout the years, while I've found the Duggars' belief system to be stomach-turning on a lot of different levels, one thing I've always felt about them was that they were honestly devout.  True believers.  And that may have been naive, because now I don't know. How do you go on TV and violate one of the commandments not once but several times by outright lying about how you found out about the abuse?  How do you reconcile that with your faith?  Was the police report mistaken?  Have you convinced yourself that the lie is the truth?  Did you stop believing, or did you never believe?  Are there aspects of the Bible that are negotiable or mutable to you?

 

I mean, I understand the concept of picking and choosing when it comes to faith.  My mom's a Catholic, but she's pro-choice.  I have friends who consider themselves Jewish but do not believe in God.  I get all that.  But doesn't that kind of selectivity go against fundamentalism, as a very concept?

 

I've had a different view of the Duggars' "faith" than you.

 

In my opinion, JimBob seized on this particular faith and, in his case, its accompanying cult, for one reason and one reason only: It looked like an excellent tool to shore up his huge but also fragile ego. Seems to me that nothing I've ever heard of them doing conflicts with this view, actually. HIs "faith," just like everything else in his life, such as his wife and children, exists to serve him. Never, ever, the other way around.

 

I'd love to hear some counterexamples if there are some. And I admit that I say this as someone who's barely ever watched the show. However, I've read about it extensively for years, including acres of recaps.

 

I do believe that JB believes he's some massively faithful person. He's just that blind and lacking in self awareness. But where is the evidence for his actually following scripture rather than just haranguing other people to do so and parading it about to show others how great he is. They may have a prayer closet, but that's not where JB does his praying. He needs a Senate seat and a tv show.

[melanie]

I feel terribly for the girls.  The police report was obtained legally, IMO, but it should have been redacted better.  However, no matter what because of the isolated lives they led, it would have led to the identity of the girls involved.  So, in that sense I can see the argument of erring on the side of protecting the girls by completely withholding the police report from the media.  These issues are never black and white.  

But, like a previous poster claimed, normal people that are not seeking to make money by being famous generally do not have to worry about revelations like these being made public.  They chose to live this life (at least Jim Bob and Michelle) did and that is all that most of these children know.  Famous people deal with this all the time.  They want to make movies or sing or be on TV, but they want to have private live too and our society just does not work that way.  People want to know everything about celebrities and it leads to tabloids looking into their pasts and paparazzi following them doing normal every day things.  It is a trade off, but one I fully believe this family made with their eyes wide open.  It is a tremendous risk/reward proposition and they are on the losing end right now.  Being famous isn't about being famous only when you want to be and showing only what you want to show.  

[Happyfatchick]

I hope someone remembers to hide the Kool-Aid

Megyn Kelly sure drank her load limit while she was there.

[Twopper]

Okay, I know this is an all out attempt to save the show, but what will it do for the marriage prospect of all the other Duggars? It seems in that world, all the molested girls may be seen as damaged goods (although I find that appalling), and will anyone want to court them now. And JimBob practically advertised poor JohnDavid on one of the episodes. I think this is going to be for the foreseeable future a very unhappy household with JImBob blaming everyone but himself, his wife and Josh for the shows demise.  And even if the girls are not seen as having defrauded Josh in their sleep, who on earth would want their child to marry into this family.  I thought the parents were creepy before this interview, but this interview makes them seem worse than I imagined. People viewing the Ma and Pa Duggar for the first time are not going to be impressed.  

[truthtalk2014]

i know. I'm old enough to be Michelle's mother, but I taught my young children, don't let people other than Mommy or Daddy (or Grandma -- whatever) touch you where your bathing suit covers. Wait, I guess that would make no sense to the Duggars given their modest to the ankle swim attire. 

I have a feeling that MEchelle or Boob never ever had the sex ed talk or the touching topic covered.  That would mean they would have to tell them about parts of their body and nasty worldly things.  We all know that the Duggars and their isolation are spared from that.  *Sarcasm*  (wish we had a sarcasm button!)

 

Reading the reports, I was surprised (I shouldn't be) that none of the children knew the proper names - Vagina, penis etc.  Everyone pretty much used the same term- privates.  Oh wait, there was one that called it a pee holder.  

 

I'm sorry if anyone disagrees, but I was of the opinion that I wanted to teach my children the proper names.  I had no problem saying penis or vagina.  That is what it is.  My mother was floored but oh well.  I didn't want my sons walking around calling it a pee pee.  I have a feeling those words have never been uttered in the Duggar household- for teaching purposes or for protecting your children.

[Skittl1321]

 

 

Reading the reports, I was surprised (I shouldn't be) that none of the children knew the proper names - Vagina, penis etc.  Everyone pretty much used the same term- privates.  Oh wait, there was one that called it a pee holder.  

 

 

I never had the cause (thank God!) to give a police report, but I grew up calling my private parts my "private parts". I was taught to refer to them that way, because it was polite. I'd think that at age 5-13 to a position of authority I would have used the "polite" word, unless asked to be more specific. So maybe they did know the other word (pee holder surprised me).  I definitely knew the word vagina, but cannot ever remember saying it to an adult.

 

Of course, most people are referring to the vulva when they say vagina. Unless penetration did occur. 

I've heard kids who were taught "proper" terminology tell me they pee out of their vagina- and you certainly do NOT do that.

 

 

It is weird that if they are called "privates" in the Duggar family that the parents had to explain (supposedly) to the girls that it had been improper touching (in the interview they said that the girls did not even realize it was improper until they were told). Is the SOTDT so bad, that they don't understand what "private" means.

Edited June 5, 2015 by Skittl1321

[graefin]

And even if the girls are not seen as having defrauded Josh in their sleep, who on earth would want their child to marry into this family. 

I don't know. Papa Seewald has defended the Duggars, as has Dan Dillard. So I don't think it's unreasonable to think others from their belief system wouldn't feel similarly. Less conservative people are horrified, of course, but these are not the types who would probably enter into a courtship with anyone in this family anyway.

[kassa]

Eventually, somebody will write a book, and the walls will tumble down.  You can't have that many kids and keep them all in line.  Maybe we'll have to wait for #20, but the chances of every.single.one.of.them toe-ing the line all the way into adulthood?  Would be slim in a happy family, and this ain't no happy family.

 

 

Say what you will about the Brown family and their gazillion children and their cheating ways... those kids seem really well adjusted and happy and loving with each other.  

[Seashell Lover]

I can not believe that all the kids and gramma were at the table and heard everything that was said.

[Zung Li]

Nobody told me by age 4/5 about bad touching, private parts, etc. but I damn sure knew I was being molested when it happened (over clothes by the way) so obviously even though I didn't know what all these things were called I still knew it was something really bad. The kid who did this was 13 -so younger than Josh- and he knew he was doing something wrong otherwise he would have done it in full view of other people. I'm hearing how Jessa and Jill shouldn't be told how to feel- fine- then don't tell me from your teevee pulpit that I shouldn't say your brother was a child molester. If he molested kids he was a child molester. If not, then I guess the 13 year old boy who molested me wasn't a child molester either? Talk about telling other victims how they should feel! This is the reason they (and others) shouldn't get to decide "in house" who is or isn't a predator or victim. That's what laws are for. Jessa taking the media and the public to task for calling her brother a child molester isn't fair to other victims out there who were "just touched over the clothes". So before people start talking about how we shouldn't judge the girls and "re-victimize them" maybe they should think about the message that JB, Michelle, Jill, and Jessa are putting out to all the other young girls out there who aren't given the opportunity to speak on tv about how they feel.

[wovenloaf]

I don't know. Papa Seewald has defended the Duggars, as has Dan Dillard. So I don't think it's unreasonable to think others from their belief system wouldn't feel similarly. Less conservative people are horrified, of course, but these are not the types who would probably enter into a courtship with anyone in this family anyway.

I don't think it's unreasonable to think other people from their particular belief system (cult) would feel that way, no. Particularly since Jimbo allegedly told church members about it and they all could relate to the problem, or whatever *shudder* - However, I don't think it's reasonable to think that anyone identifying as "conservative" or "very conservative" is some sort of Duggar apologist who doesn't see sweeping sexual abuse under the rug as utterly mortifying as the general public does. 

[HumblePi]

I've been trying to avoid commenting on the snipets.  Because the context of the whole interview will hopefully provide the best answer.  But....

 

Perhaps what they are saying is I didn't feel victimized by what Josh did 12 years ago but I do feel victimized by the leaking of these reports now.

 

So yes they can feel like they were not a victim then but are a victim now.  2 different pieces of cake.  You can eat one and keep one.

I think that what Jill means is that the negative publicity and the barrage of hate and anger directed towards the Duggars as a whole has made them (Jill) feel like a victim. It will be made more clear tonight when it's all said within a specific context.

[graefin]

However, I don't think it's reasonable to think that anyone identifying as "conservative" or "very conservative" is some sort of Duggar apologist who doesn't see sweeping sexual abuse under the rug as utterly mortifying as the general public does. 

Well, sure. Just look at all the conservatives who blasted Huckabee for his support on his FB page. But I still think that the Duggars would only allow courtships with those who are like them or aspire to be like them (like Derick, Ben, and Marjorie). And those who aspire to be like them are likely to think the way they do. So I don't know if they've lost anything in that regard.

[Twopper]

 

Papa Seewald has defended the Duggars, as has Dan Dillard. So I don't think it's unreasonable to think others from their belief system wouldn't feel similarly. 

  For better or  worse Derrick and Ben have already married into this family.  Now that the light is beginning to shine on the Duggars and the story of Josh has been broadcast to the whole nation, I am not so sure the Duggars are considered a great catch.  And especially with the money train being derailed.  I was hoping for at least one reference to Gothardism in the interview, but I should have know better.

[Potato511]

 I think it's still obvious that JB&M concentrated on all the wrong things to prevent more incidents.

Separating the perpetrator from the girls was actually a "right" move, though. I have seen survivors and experts recommend alarms on bedroom doors, which would have been better as far as that goes, but they did try. 

[mbutterfly]

I don't know. Papa Seewald has defended the Duggars, as has Dan Dillard. So I don't think it's unreasonable to think others from their belief system wouldn't feel similarly. Less conservative people are horrified, of course, but these are not the types who would probably enter into a courtship with anyone in this family anyway.

If it were my daughter-in-law (who in truth would have had a perp tied to the bed post before he even blinked, but different story) I think I would say almost anything protective she asked me to say. 

[Julia]

It's obviously important that the girls get a pass to deal with their survivor status as they see fit.

 

The problem I'm having is that they and their family are clearly attempting to portray

 

[disagreeing with how the situation was handled, taking away or not renewing or not creating a new show for the family and/or the girls, pointing out that there's been massive hypocrisy displayed by a family who portray themselves as moral exemplars, recognizing a huge disconnect between how they as a family (and Jim Bob as an elected official) demanded that "mistakes" by other peoples' children be handled and how they actually handled them, or even discussing the private lives of people whose every family event has been filmed for profit for a decade]

 

as things the girls get to veto because they're survivors. Of an violation which Jessa, at least, has taken on herself to define as not a serious violation. Which, no, not really. Any of it.

 

And I don't think that the fringiest conservatives define conservatism any more than the fringiest christians or the fringiest anything defines the group they're on the fringe of.

Edited June 5, 2015 by Julia

[Cherrio]

I'm surprised no one has gone for the obvious with the Duggars...

 

The baby is out of the uterus!

But, they are still trying to figure out who Sophie is.

[neece26]

 

I think it's still obvious that JB&M concentrated on all the wrong things to prevent more incidents.

 

The fact that it happened over and over again after the first incident tells you that they didn't do enough. Just listening to them minimize it now tells me that they probably minimized it then, especialy you know since the girls were sleeping and it was only a five second touch over their clothes. *eyeroll*  

 

Getting Josh real help and protecting those girls should have been the priority but instead they got busy making more kids.  

 

If they had told TLC the truth about Josh, they never would have got this show or been able to collect huge speaking fees for being such pure pillars of the community.  They should consider themselves very thankful that the gravy train went on for so long.

[Chai]

Separating the perpetrator from the girls was actually a "right" move, though. I have seen survivors and experts recommend alarms on bedroom doors, which would have been better as far as that goes, but they did try. 

yes. If I recall correctly, they have an intricate video surveillance system? I wondered why it even showed the laundry room.

[leighdear]

I know you mean the very best by this, but it's hard to read in that somehow we get to decide who are worthy victims.

Not at all what I meant, but I can see how my statement could be misconstrued.

 

Some individuals use past events as a catalyst to move themselves forward, while some use those events as a crutch to avoid moving forward.  And no, other people do not get to determine that.

[leighroda]

First of all... I am so thankful for this site, I keep trying to talk about this with my friends but nobody knows the details like I do and are usually like "eh I don't think it's a big deal" then when I try to inform them why in fact it is a big deal, I come off as crazy for knowing the details.

Regarding the crying (or lack thereof), I understand not everyone cries or produces tears, some people even laugh when you would expect them to cry, I fall under the rarely cries category and I sometime feel like others seee as heartless because I don't cry, but I digress, my issue is not so much that she wasn't crying, or even that there weren't actual tears, but that she was clearly (imo) trying to force herself to cry, and making a big show of it, if your not producing tears... Then no need to dab, the catch in her throat at one point sounded more like clearing her throat to me.

As far as Jill and Jessa's reasoning for the interview, because they had already been outed as the victims. I know a lot of people were speculating, but truthfully we didn't know who exactly. And actually in most of the speculation I heard Jill was the non-victim, so she kinda outed herself ( I don't know how to word that in a way that doesn't seem so insensitive), there was only 1 sister I was pretty certain about based on ages, but the rest I was never positive who didn't get touched. I don't think them doing the interview is going to be a great idea, since they are the victims I think the general public has been kind in not criticizing too much on their reaction, but I fear them going on TV and proclaiming none of this is a big deal is going to a) open them up to scrutiny and b) I kinda feel like it's a slap in the face to others who have been victims. I don't know how to explain it, but it's kinda like them coming out to support Josh and sweep this under the rug, to some degree is a step back for victims. I'm sure I'll get outrage for saying that, I wish I could express my point better. I hope the girls are being honest and they aren't carrying trauma from all of this, if they have truly forgiven Josh then good for them, they are better than I am... But if they are towing the family line and suppressing their true feeling, I hope this coming out and the aftermath helps them find some freedom from all of this.

[Zung Li]

"Josh was a boy, a young boy in puberty and a little too curious about girls," says Jessa. "And that got him into some trouble. And he made some bad choices, but, really, the extent of it was mild – inappropriate touching on fully clothed victims, most of it while [the] girls were sleeping."

Jill, 24, adds that they "didn't even know" about the molestation until Josh had confessed to their parents. "None of the victims were aware of what happened until Joshua confessed," Jessa agrees, adding, "My parents took [us] aside individually, and they said, 'Here's what happened,' and of course at this point, you're shocked."

 

http://www.people.com/article/jill-duggar-jessa-duggar-josh-duggar-not-pedophile-fox-news-megyn-kelly-interview?xid=socialflow_facebook_peoplemag

[JoanArc]

 

Separating the perpetrator from the girls was actually a "right" move, though. I have seen survivors and experts recommend alarms on bedroom doors, which would have been better as far as that goes, but they did try.

Separated for...3 months? With no real treatment. That's a marginal move, at best. Door alarms are nice...but how would that have stopped couch or laundry room incidents? Josh was escalating. Having the other kids sleep in street clothes or memorize bible verse, or forgive out of 'free will' wouldn't cut it.

[Jellybeans]

I find it pathetic when people go to Jill and Jessa's IG or FB and leave nasty comments.

People wonder why they're so quiet on IG or FB, I wonder why they haven't deactivated their accounts with a big FU for all the nasty comments. Just what did they do?

[Sew Sumi]

Me too. But its just hard to believe it was all their own idea. These girls have never been allowed to do anything on their own or decided anything themselves. But suddenly decide to give an interview? Married or not there's no way JimBob would let them do an interview without knowing exactly what their going to say. And he's not going to let them change the story he's been telling.

Exactly. That's why I am very skeptical about what we're going to see tonight. And why I say "very skeptical," I mean, it's going to be almost impossible to convince me that this was the girls' idea. Even the way Jill said it sounded like she'd been practicing it with the crisis manager and/or her father. No way they go off-script. I hope there's some truth in there somewhere, but I won't be holding my breath. 

[Schmoopy]

But even outside of reality TV, this simply isn't the way the world works. If the CEOs of the company I work for screw up to the point of the company shutting down - by financial malfeasance, by disregarding OSHA laws, by wildly mismanaging public relations and making it so customers no longer want to buy my product - my workplace is shut down and I no longer have a job. It's not fair and it sucks, but that's the way the world works. Even if I did everything properly. Hell, even if I was the whistleblower that reported the violations; if the company shuts down, I no longer have a job. That may be what happens to the "employment" of Jill and Jessa due to the management practices of their "company's" "executive team."

That's not how this works.....that's not how any of this works!