S05.E04: The Sons Of The Harpy

[MrsRafaelBarba]

Jon Snow knows how to shut down your thirsty ass Mel.

Go flash dem titties at Stannis.

[HunterHunted]

Tywin was right. Cersei is not as smart as she thinks she is. She's armed religious fanatics who will quickly turn on her. The crown is broke. The Tyrell's are going to unlikely to lend the Lanisters any money. The Iron Bank is calling in their loans. Cersei is petty and shortsighted. She was so concerned about Margaery's influence that Cersei set off a nuclear bomb when she only needed a targeted strike. If she wanted to keep more control over Tommen, she could have had him come to the small council meetings. The problem is that Cersei doesn't want to rule through Tommen; she just wants to rule.

So much eye acting tonight. Bronn giving Jaime a"really?"at the mention of his niece. Stannis and Littlefinger at the mentions of Jon's parentage.

I kept thinking that if Stannis had showed this side of himself there never would have been a war of five kings. Robb and Renley would have fallen in behind him if he had just shown that he was capable of feeling.

[bunnyblue]

I just don't know what to make of Littlefinger. He seemed genuine in everything he said to Sansa down in the tombs but knowing how he betrayed Ned, I can't shake the feeling that he's setting Sansa up for a hell of a fall. He seems so sure Stannis will defeat the Boltons and make Sansa Wardeness of WF; so what is in it for him? And if Stannis fails does he really believe Sansa will bend Ramsay to her will? While she's learned to play the game a bit, she's nowhere near being a puppet master. Petyr, the Boltons flay their enemies alive. Leaving her alone in WF seems like a terrible terrible idea. 

 

Stay away from Jon, Red Witch!! I knew she was up to no good when she asked him if he was a virgin -- she wants to make a shadow baby with him. What does she see in her flames in regards to Jon Snow? Seems like she's souring on Stannis a bit, eh. When she said "you know nothing, Jon Snow" was that just a coincidence or was that her magic at work? 

 

Stannis and Shireen were so heartbreakingly good. Her sweet face when Stannis talked about his love for her; poor girl hasn't known much affection in her life. So, clearly both are probably marked for death. But Selyse can die in one of Melisandre's fires any day now please.

 

Farewell Ser Barristan Selmy. Went out like a true badass. Watching him in action, I now totally believe he was once the fiercest warrior in the Seven Kingdoms. The focus of that final scene seemed more on Barristan than on Grey Worm, so I'll hold out hope he actually survived. Man, that prostitute that's working with the Sons of Harpy really needs to be flambeed by one of the dragons. Soon.

 

Dany appears to be down to 2 (maybe 3) advisers. Jorah and especially Tyrion need to hurry the hell up and get to Mereen or there won't be a queen to serve. I think I'm going to love this Tyrion/Jorah road trip almost as much as the Tyrion/Varys one. Though, I doubt any could ever compare to the Arya/Hound trek through Westeros. ::sniff::

 

So, those are the Sand Snakes. I need to see more of them to believe they can truly avenge their father. Right now they seem more about making fierce faces and delivering stilted dialogue.

 

Kings Landing: yeah, it can fall into the sea for all I care. Smirking Cersei once again gaining the upper hand and religious fanatics imposing their views on people is not entertainment to me. 

[SimoneS]

Pity she couldn't do like Margery did with Joffrey but the thought of that leaves a bitter taste in my mouth.

 

But even Olenna did not believe that the experienced Margeary could use her wiles and intelligence to outwit and stay safe from a sadist like Joffrey in the long run which is why she murdered him rather than leaving her alone with him in the palace. With even less experienced than Margeary, Sansa has little chance against a sadist like Ramsay. Her only hope is that he falls for her and she is rescued quickly.

 

Makes sense SimoneS. But I still wonder why they weren't training themselves for their current tasks. Especially since the Harpies had already done damage and this wasn't their first strike.

 

The Unsullied simply are not trained for that kind of warfare. It would take years for them to train to use different weapons. Besides it would be impossible for them to blend into the local population when they are outsiders with little or no support. The U.S. military was in Vietnam for over 10 years and never could find a way to defeat the guerrilla tactics of the Vietcong.

 

The only way to defeat those masked killers to for Daenerys figure out who is hiring them, convince their wealthy allies to sell them out for money and power, and publicly execute them while disinheriting their families. Alternatively, Daenerys can have her dragons burn down the wealthy parts of the city.  

Edited May 4, 2015 by SimoneS

[RedheadZombie]

I loved Shireen and Stannis, how she must have been yearning to hear that from him all her life, this is probably the 1st time Stannis gave me some reason to love him.

 

Combining this scene with the hope that he'll destroy the Boltons and save Sansa, and I may root for Stannis to win the game of thrones.  One small qualifier - dump the red witch.  Preferably ..... rid himself of her by her favorite method.

 

Are we to believe that Stannis was deliberately sold a contaminated doll?  That reminds me of US soldiers giving small pox          contaminated blankets to Native Americans.  Stannis wasn't king or even trying to be at the time.  Why attempt to kill his baby?

 

After being one of my favourites for seasons I found I did not miss Arya. Just her current storylines pacing I guess.

 

I have to agree, and it's extremely disappointing.  I just adopted a kitten a month ago and named her Arya.  I may have to consider a name change.

 

Couldn't it just be his love for Cat that makes him so caring towards Sansa? I don't know why after all this time I want to believe him. Especially when Im re watching and he says to Ned about how not trusting him was the smartest thing he did since he got there. And I keep thinking he thinks Sansa has learned more than she has. She still seems weak and scared to me not at all ready for vengeance. She'll say something, even her comment about being married when he returns could have had such different meaning if said differently. I'm not convinced she can play Ramsey and not let him see her weaknesses.

 

I don't believe a word he says.  He put this whole horror show in action.  I hope he's well and truly in love with Sansa when she learns the truth, and I would treasure his tears when she rejects him.  And I hope she gives the order for his head to be chopped off.

 

Well, we got to see what LOOKED like Sansa liking Little Fingers' kisses.

 

I don't think she enjoyed it.  To me, it looked like she hesitated for a moment, then made the decision to allow him to kiss her.  She knows he's the closest thing to a protector she has.

[TudorQueen]

Goodbye, Sir Barristan, a good knight to the end. I was tremendously sad to see him cut down, but his amazing heroism before that moment was a reminder of how skilled and dedicated he truly was. I remember him scoffing at Joffrey and Cersei for offering him a 'comfortable' retirement. To him, retirement was a living death, and he ended up dying on his own terms, in action, serving a ruler in whom he believed.

But it still sucks,

[lampshades]

 

Are we to believe that Stannis was deliberately sold a contaminated doll?  That reminds me of US soldiers giving small pox          contaminated blankets to Native Americans.  Stannis wasn't king or even trying to be at the time.  Why attempt to kill his baby?

 

I didn't interpret it as something that was deliberate. I don't see germ theory being common knowledge in the GoT universe.

[SimoneS]

Bronn is an amazing swordsman. I hope that he survives long enough to help fight the whitewalkers in battle.

[GreyBunny]

Is it my imagination or was Tyrion humming the Meow Mix jingle?

[CletusMusashi]

Nature abhors a vacuum. I predict that before this series is over, every surviving redhead in Westeros will have told Jon Snow that he knows nothing. 

 

You've got to admire Ser Jorah's determination. How to do you apologize to the girl whose trust you've betrayed, and get the hell out of the Friend Zone? If words aren't enough, and flowers have already been done, and she already has a kingdom, an army, and even her own dragons... how do you let her know how important she is to you? Say it with dwarfs.

 

So is Varys still sitting around at the Khaleesi-themed whorehouse, tapping his fingers impatiently and making sarcastic, dismissive small talk? Because I will watch that! Get rid of Sansa and Littlefinger and divvy up their time between annoyed Varys and, I don;t know, maybe Gendry still paddling around in that rowboat having a zany mini-adventure each week.

 

I'm through trying to compare Dorne to anything realistic. it's not the Middle East. it's not Spain. It's "Xena: Warrior Princess." No wonder the Targaryans had so much trouble there.

Edited May 4, 2015 by CletusMusashi

[TudorQueen]

I think (and this is backed up by nothing) that Dorne is patterned after Morocco, or Moorish Spain.

[CletusMusashi]

Is it my imagination or was Tyrion humming the Meow Mix jingle?

I thought it was "Rains of Castimere." Which seemed like the last song he'd be humming. But, of the two songs that they actually have, it sounded more like ROC than like "The Maiden and the Bear." Besides, if one of them is gonna go around humming TMATB, it's gonna be Jorah.

[Knuckles]

Stannous finally showed his love for Shireen, which made the episode for me. I have always been a Stannis fan, and finally the show is giving him something to work with. And again, both Stannis and Littlefinger both suggest that Jon's parentage is not as advertised.

As for Mel, I suggest she go set herself on fire, and amuse the crowd. And take Selyse with her, and make it a twofer.

So, Sansa, Tommen and Dany, all three are in over their heads. Sansa is on her own with the sadist and his harem, Dany has lost Ser Barristan, and Tommen's mama has set him up to be publicly shown as powerless.

[dramachick]

Stannous finally showed his love for Shireen, which made the episode for me. I have always been a Stannis fan, and finally the show is giving him something to work with. And again, both Stannis and Littlefinger both suggest that Jon's parentage is not as advertised.

As for Mel, I suggest she go set herself on fire, and amuse the crowd. And take Selyse with her, and make it a twofer.

So, Sansa, Tommen and Dany, all three are in over their heads. Sansa is on her own with the sadist and his harem, Dany has lost Ser Barristan, and Tommen's mama has set him up to be publicly shown as powerless.

 

What did Littlefinger say about Jon's parentage?  I just remember him raising his eyebrows when Sansa said Lyanna had been kidnapped and raped. And what does the identify of Jon's mother have to do with anything?  I don't understand how that could affect the overall story. 

[CletusMusashi]

Much as I love having her as an excuse to give us more Jaime/ Bronn scenes, I think I might care a little bit more about Myrcella if we occasionally saw her. If next week she actually gets some screen time, then I'll worry. Until then, I wish her well and everything, but I'd actually be more concerned about the fate of an imaginary character if they were threatening Hot Pie. Or Ser Pounce. Shit, I'm even worried about Mace the Muppet, because at least I've seen him recently enough to miss!

[RedheadZombie]

. Cersei is petty and shortsighted. She was so concerned about Margaery's influence that Cersei set off a nuclear bomb when she only needed a targeted strike. If she wanted to keep more control over Tommen, she could have had him come to the small council meetings. The problem is that Cersei doesn't want to rule through Tommen; she just wants to rule.

 

Again vengeance came before love for her child.  Just as she eagerly watched Oberyn getting killed so Tyrion would die, without a moment's thought of Myrcella's safety, her desire to strike at Margaery led to Tommen standing in the open - vulnerable to a hate filled crowd, and armed religious fanatics.

[Pete Martell]

I hate this Loras plotline so much, and I hate the half-assed attempts at trying to tackle a serious topic when the show has done nothing but leer at Loras (and Oberyn) Benny Hill-style for 3 seasons. I hate it enough to where I'm going to be taking a break, possibly a permanent one, so as to spare you my bilge and misery.

 

I've enjoyed getting to talk to you guys and gals over the last year. 

 

Enjoy the show.

[Slovenly Muse]

So, that sighting of Tarth earlier on, that was for the purpose of having Brienne in our minds when Jaime was talking about the "woman he loves," right? I don't care either way if he loves her or not, but it seemed like a deliberate set-up by the writers to plant that idea. I hope it's going somewhere, because romantic or not, Jaime and Brienne are gold together. I hope this means there might be a reunion in their future!

 

But on this show, probably not. Or at least, not for five or six more seasons, the way some of these plots are moving.

[AbFabGab]

He's been a bastard all his life and treated as such, now he's legitimate and probably won't hurt Sansa now. However later when they're married and he gets comfortable, that's a different story. 

I don't think he's been legitimate long enough to even begin to make up for the anger issues he has from his years of being a bastard. I don't see things going well for Sansa, especially with that look his girlfriend shot her. I can only hope that Theon still has some regret for the role he played in bringing Winterfell under their control in the first place and steps up, maybe to assist Brienne in getting her out of there. But I can't see it going any other way than horribly at least once.

[Meredith Quill]

Mod note:

 

A few posts have been hidden whilst we review them.

[Law Mom]

Cersei's stupidity knows no bounds.Someone in her position needs to plot 10 steps ahead and she is incapable of considering the consequences of her actions on the day after tomorrow. I hope she never dies, just loses her wealth and power and is forced to live out her days in a small village in the North somewhere, drinking wine from horn cups and emptying her own chamberpot.

[Potanical Pardon]

What did Littlefinger say about Jon's parentage?  I just remember him raising his eyebrows when Sansa said Lyanna had been kidnapped and raped. And what does the identify of Jon's mother have to do with anything?  I don't understand how that could affect the overall story. 

 

I don't think Littlefinger said anything about Jon's parentage. This episode does have an awful lot of mentions of Lyanna and Rhaegar, though. Littlefinger made a point of talking up how beautiful Lyanna was and Rhaegar giving her that flower instead of his wife. He even sounded wistful about the story. It was Sansa who got all huffy and calling Rhaegar a rapist and kidnapper. Then later we hear Barristan Selmy talking to Dany about Rhaegar...and this is where it got really interesting. He talked about how Rhaegar abhored violence, though he was a great fighter. He spoke about how they sang songs in the streets, gave money to the poor, this and that feel good stories. To me, Littlefinger's word should always be suspect, but I'm pretty sure Barristan Selmy's word should ring true as he would have no reason to lie and with such a random story. So rapey kidnapper biggest-war-ever-starter who is peaceful, happy and generous sounds off bells and alarms in my head that there's some intentional misinformation and mystery out there both in Westeros and the real world.

 

All I know is that we're reminded again that Lyanna was betrothed to not-yet-King Bobby B. And Rhaegar was married to Elia Martell, who I think was Oberyn's sister. So it's like we're being recapped on why the Martells don't like shit above Dorne. I remember the Mountain was who Oberyn said was who killed her and he's Tywin's main attack dog, so I think maybe Tywin was the Mad King's Hand at the time. Okay, so that's the Martells hating Targaryens and Lannisters. I can't really think of a reason they'd hate the Baratheons. They probably don't since they weren't involved at all the first few seasons. It seemed like only once Tywin and the Lannisters solidified their place in Kings Landing did the Martells care.

 

I also recall from season 1, King Robert being down in those crypts with Ned reminiscing about Lyanna. He also talked about finally uniting their families together through Sansa and Joffrey. King Robert came across more obsessed with Lyanna than tragic soulmates ripped apart from each other based on Ned's reaction of silent nodding "sure, dude, whatever you say."  This episode made me look back at these earlier episodes tonight to see if they jibed. It made me think: Wait, wait wait! What if Bobby B and Lyanna were one of the bajillion arranged marriages/engagements we see happening where one of them just isn't into the other? I mean, Barristan Selmy was all like this was a good dude, Dany. A good dude. He sang songs. Bobby B wins the war and becomes king and I can see him rewriting the history books to make Rhaegar come across as a kidnapping rapist. He had the power to do something like that, the motivation because he was denied/was really into her, and he did go after every last Targaryen. Makes me also wonder if the Mad King really was mad, after all too, or if that could be another fabrication of the truth. I mean all the wildfire and stuff and witness by Jaime and some others do sound like he was insane...but maybe that's an embellishment too that was really desperation that turned into paranoia and actual insanity. 

Edited May 4, 2015 by Tandaemonium

[dr pepper]

On the subject of Lancel, what was the significance of the "tattoo" on his forehead? He appeared to be the only Sparrow with one, unless I missed other ones with it.  And yeah, Cersei is so going to get snakebit. It will be fun to watch!

 

Anyone can join the People's Crusade. But only the most proven of them can join the Templers or the Inquisition. That's a 7 part circle (hepticle?) being cut into his forhead, so i'm guessing he's joing the Inquisition. That makes sense, it's the best way to avoid being hauled before it.

 

I also notice that the newly puritanized church doesn't seem to be interested in working with the current power structure, Loras is one of the few members with significant social rank.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Makes me also wonder if the Mad King really was mad, after all too, or if that could be another fabrication of the truth. I mean all the wildfire and stuff and witness by Jaime and some others do sound like he was insane...but maybe that's an embellishment too that was really desperation that turned into paranoia and actual insanity.

Jaime and several other characters have described how crazy he was at the end, so I believe that he was going nuts killing people until Jaime took him out. But to compare that to the guy who hated violence and loved singing described by Barristan Salmy makes me wonder if something happened between those two points (maybe he was poisoned with some kind of psychotropic drug?). Or maybe he was just one of those psychos who liked killing AND singing!

[CletusMusashi]

I thought it looked like people they were targeting had the mark carved into their heads.

Not Loras, because despite what Cersei and Sparrow said, rank does matter. But some of the guys caught in the brothel were getting carved.

So I think it's a forcible recruitment technique. Which story is easier to tell? "One day I was minding my own business, offending the Seven Gods by committing sinful acts of sodomy, and a bunch of crazy people broke into the room and put this on my head..." or?

"I have become very religious..." (because if I try to live the same life I did before, I have no idea what these loons are going to do with their knives next. And I have been meaning to go to church more...)

[GreyBunny]

Okay, so that's the Martells hating Targaryens and Lannisters. I can't really think of a reason they'd hate the Baratheons.

 

The Baratheons were allied with the Lannisters and Robert took the throne on the backs of Elia and her dead children.  They have good reason to hate the Baratheons.

 

Makes me also wonder if the Mad King really was mad, after all too, or if that could be another fabrication of the truth.

 

Barristan told Dany her father was mad and cruel, I think he can be trusted to tell the truth.

 

Or maybe he was just one of those psychos who liked killing AND singing!

 

Aerys was the Mad King.  Rhaegar was his son.  

Edited May 4, 2015 by GreyBunny

[bunnyblue]

Jaime and several other characters have described how crazy he was at the end, so I believe that he was going nuts killing people until Jaime took him out. But to compare that to the guy who hated violence and loved singing described by Barristan Salmy makes me wonder if something happened between those two points (maybe he was poisoned with some kind of psychotropic drug?). Or maybe he was just one of those psychos who liked killing AND singing!

 

Two different guys. The Mad King was the one burning people and the one Jaime killed. Barriston, Littlefinger, and Sansa were talking about Rhaegar, the Mad King's son.

[dr pepper]

Also, i really like the way they're doing Dorne. It makes me think of medieval southern Spain. I keep expecting to see strolling minstrels or robed clerics playing chess.

[Potanical Pardon]

The Baratheons were allied with the Lannisters and Robert took the throne on the backs of Elia and her dead children.  They have good reason to hate the Baratheons.

 

 

Barristan told Dany her father was mad and cruel, I think he can be trusted to tell the truth.

I get that the Lannisters allied with the Baratheons, hence Cersei being set up to wed Robert, but I don't see why the Martells would hate them other than by association. I mean, I understand not jumping for joy at the Baratheon house, but I don't see any direct desire or reason to actively hate them particularly. It made sense for Oberyn to finally take his small council seat once Tywin came into town, but the Martells did not feel any need prior to that when Robert was in charge nor participate in any way allying with any of the other houses in season 2.

As I said with Barristan Selmy, I believe his word can be trusted, but I'm wondering if his, Jaime's and whomever else misinterpreted what they witnessed of Aerys as madness. The more I think about it, the more the "Mad King" sounds like an idea straight out of Tywin's playbook to position his family with the Cersei/Robert pairing while planting the seeds of doubt in other houses and Westeros that Aerys was unfit to rule.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Two different guys. The Mad King was the one burning people and the one Jaime killed. Barriston, Littlefinger, and Sansa were talking about Rhaegar, the Mad King's son.

D'oh! Total brain fart on my part. Thanks for straightening me out! That will teach me to multitask.

[jbrecken]

It was nice of Cersei to do Arya a solid and send Meryn Trant to Braavos.

[Sienna]

Unsullied need a new armor designer...daggers should not be able to penetrate...Gendry should row to Mereen.

 

Yes, yes he should.

 

Shirtless.

 

The whole way.

 

Just an entire episode of him rowing.

[paigow]

It was nice of Cersei to do Arya a solid and send Meryn Trant to Braavos.

Unfortunately, Arya will miss the opportunity because she will be too busy cleaning corpses, sweeping and poisoning the water supply.

[Boudicea]

I don't think Littlefinger said anything about Jon's parentage. This episode does have an awful lot of mentions of Lyanna and Rhaegar, though. Littlefinger made a point of talking up how beautiful Lyanna was and Rhaegar giving her that flower instead of his wife. He even sounded wistful about the story. It was Sansa who got all huffy and calling Rhaegar a rapist and kidnapper. Then later we hear Barristan Selmy talking to Dany about Rhaegar...and this is where it got really interesting. He talked about how Rhaegar abhored violence, though he was a great fighter. He spoke about how they sang songs in the streets, gave money to the poor, this and that feel good stories. To me, Littlefinger's word should always be suspect, but I'm pretty sure Barristan Selmy's word should ring true as he would have no reason to lie and with such a random story. So rapey kidnapper biggest-war-ever-starter who is peaceful, happy and generous sounds off bells and alarms in my head that there's some intentional misinformation and mystery out there both in Westeros and the real world.

 

All I know is that we're reminded again that Lyanna was betrothed to not-yet-King Bobby B. And Rhaegar was married to Elia Martell, who I think was Oberyn's sister. So it's like we're being recapped on why the Martells don't like shit above Dorne. I remember the Mountain was who Oberyn said was who killed her and he's Tywin's main attack dog, so I think maybe Tywin was the Mad King's Hand at the time. Okay, so that's the Martells hating Targaryens and Lannisters. I can't really think of a reason they'd hate the Baratheons. They probably don't since they weren't involved at all the first few seasons. It seemed like only once Tywin and the Lannisters solidified their place in Kings Landing did the Martells care.

 

I also recall from season 1, King Robert being down in those crypts with Ned reminiscing about Lyanna. He also talked about finally uniting their families together through Sansa and Joffrey. King Robert came across more obsessed with Lyanna than tragic soulmates ripped apart from each other based on Ned's reaction of silent nodding "sure, dude, whatever you say."  This episode made me look back at these earlier episodes tonight to see if they jibed. It made me think: Wait, wait wait! What if Bobby B and Lyanna were one of the bajillion arranged marriages/engagements we see happening where one of them just isn't into the other? I mean, Barristan Selmy was all like this was a good dude, Dany. A good dude. He sang songs. Bobby B wins the war and becomes king and I can see him rewriting the history books to make Rhaegar come across as a kidnapping rapist. He had the power to do something like that, the motivation because he was denied/was really into her, and he did go after every last Targaryen. Makes me also wonder if the Mad King really was mad, after all too, or if that could be another fabrication of the truth. I mean all the wildfire and stuff and witness by Jaime and some others do sound like he was insane...but maybe that's an embellishment too that was really desperation that turned into paranoia and actual insanity. 

 

Some interesting observations.

 

A lot of tonight's scenes went back to the first episode, the feather Sansa picks up was placed there by Robert. It has always been somewhat strange that someone as honorable as Ned Stark would have a bastard son while being married. Cat said that Ned once went South and came back with another womens child, so clearly Jon was born sometime during the rebellion, and it is also strange that Jon wouldn't just have stayed with his mother. Bastard children dont often grow up in the same household as the legitimate family, but perhaps it is a more common thing to do in Westeros or something?

 

So therefore it was quite interesting to hear that Stannis also basically says, that Ned is not the type of guy who just have bastard children. Then directly after that we see the Red Women going after Jon, and we know she likes royal blood. Then just after that Littlefinger tells the story of Lyanna and Raegar Targaryen. It does make one think back to the first episode in season 1. Ned told Jon "you might not have my name, but you do have my blood", he doesn't really call him his son, and of course the fact that he tells Jon that he will tell him about his mother the next time they meet, sets off some alarm bells. Ned is very secretive about Jon 's mother, at first I thought Jon might be one of Robert's bastards, but with all of the focus on Rhaegar tonight I think Jon might be his son. Robert wanted to kill all of the Targaryens, Ned fought hard not to have Dany assassinated. It would have been quite dangerous for Ned to raise a Targaryen all of those years.

 

What did Littlefinger say about Jon's parentage?  I just remember him raising his eyebrows when Sansa said Lyanna had been kidnapped and raped. And what does the identify of Jon's mother have to do with anything?  I don't understand how that could affect the overall story. 

 

Jon is part of the Nights Watch, so guess that takes him out of the line of succession. But perhaps he could control a dragon. 

Edited May 4, 2015 by Boudicea

[justawatcher]

What did Littlefinger say about Jon's parentage?  I just remember him raising his eyebrows when Sansa said Lyanna had been kidnapped and raped. And what does the identify of Jon's mother have to do with anything?  I don't understand how that could affect the overall story

 

.DOH!!! I think I just figured it out.

If Jon is the son of Rhaegar (dragon) Targareon and Lyanna Stark (of Winterfell) that might be your Song of Ice and Fire. Royal blood, fire and ice- there has to be something bigger coming that will let him out of his Night's Watch oath.

 

That's the theory I'm going with.

[Isazouzi]

So therefore it was quite interesting to hear that Stannis also basically says, that Ned is not the type of guy who just have bastard children. Then directly after that we see the Red Women going after Jon, and we know she likes royal blood. Then just after that Littlefinger tells the story of Lyanna and Raegar Targaryen. It does make one think back to the first episode in season 1. Ned told Jon "you might not have my name, but you do have my blood", he doesn't really call him his son, and of course the fact that he tells Jon that he will tell him about his mother the next time they meet, sets off some alarm bells. Ned is very secretive about Jon 's mother, at first I thought Jon might be one of Robert's bastards, but with all of the focus on Rhaegar tonight I think Jon might be his son. Robert wanted to kill all of the Targaryens, Ned fought hard not to have Dany assassinated. It would have been quite dangerous for Ned to raise a Targaryen all of those years.

 

 

Jon is part of the Nights Watch, so guess that takes him out of the line of succession. But perhaps he could control a dragon. 

 

Yes, let's just say that this episode somewhat confirmed the suspicions that some of us have, and raised questions for those who didn't have those suspicions yet. I especially liked LF's reaction at the word "kidnapped".

 

I also found the story of the poisoned doll from Dorne interesting, because until then, I thought Shereen's grey scales were a birth defect or something genetic. I thought all the fetuses we saw in Dragonstone were an indication that something was wrong with Stanis and/or his wife and that Shereen was some sort of marred miracle.

[justawatcher]

  

Jaime can't keep his mouth shut and at some point refers to Myrcella as "my
daughter". That makes it public. Myrcella gets offed by the Sand Snakes. Jaime
and Bronn live. Back in King's Landing, Jaime's public declaration about
Myrcella  has the people and/or the Sparrow Army take Tommen off the throne
and execute him, leaving Cersei alive after her three children have died and
alone with no power. No one is sitting on the Iron Throne and all contenders are
too far away....except Littlefinger, who was very prominently referred to by
name at the brothel (why this particular episode?), is known to have money and
power, and is on his way back to King's Landing after being summoned by Cersei.
My spitball is that the last scene of this season will be Littlefinger sitting
on the Iron Throne with Roose Bolton ruling the North and Sansa delivering
Ramsey's baby.

I have a spitball. I am going to spoiler it just in case. There sure were a lot of hints dropped last night about this and that so here goes:

 

 

 

Because I feel like they served that all up on a silver platter over the last two episodes.

[MrsRafaelBarba]

Also, i really like the way they're doing Dorne. It makes me think of medieval southern Spain. I keep expecting to see strolling minstrels or robed clerics playing chess.

The actual location used for Dorne is Spain.

And yes, it's beautiful.

[Advance35]

I can see why Dorne would be anti-everyone.  This story seems to make a point of saying, You are who your family is.   The Lannisters hate EVERYONE, Stannis wants Jaimie, Cersei and all of their children dead, The Fall of the Targaryens came at the hands of Houses Baratheon, Lannister and Stark so I can see House Martell having an aversion to all, I believe Dany has expressed disdain for those 3 Houses as well.    Sansa loathed Tyrion in her talks with Margaery quoting "He's a Lannister."

 

And I got to rewatch the scene and dare I say there was an air of flirtatiousness to Sansa's "the next time we meet,  I'll be a married woman."   It wasn't her usual couqettish, wide-eyed debutante, it seemed "more".   And I thought Stannis would  be good news for Sansa but if you think about it, the man is RIGID when it comes to justice and doesn't really take into account, situations, ask Davos Seaworth's former fingers.   How will Stannis feel about Sansa, Lannister marrier, Regicide Co-Conspirator, witness to Aunt-Murdering, Bolton Betrothed, Littlefinger intriguer, Stark.   The North could get more interesting than it already was and it's been awesome so far this season.

[Popples]

Jaime saw Tarth. Awww. I would watch a spin-off of Jaime, Brienne, and Bronn fighting and snarking up and down Westeros. Right after Sienna's suggestion of shirtless Gendry rowing. :)

 

I had an "Oh no she didn't!" moment when Melisandre said "You know nothing, Jon Snow." Go find someone else to make your creepy shadow babies with. I'm also tired of Selyse being a bitch about Shireen. She can offer herself up to the Lord of Light anytime now. Or just now.

 

Stannis gave me feels! Although him hugging Shireen back made me think of Dipper and Mabel's Awkward Sibling Hug. "Pat, pat."

 

I've been worried about Grey Worm ever since I noticed his actor's name didn't get bumped up to the opening credits along with Missandei's.

[Sakura12]

I don't think Margaery has much to worry about Cersei, she's going to cause her own downfall by arming an religious group hellbent on going after sinners, when she's committed many of her own perversions including one with the a guy that is hardcore follower said religious group. She has just put her last son in danger.

 

Jon's true parentage would be nice to have revealed finally. They dropped hints in season 1 and sort of brought them up again. Although he was hurt by fire when he burned his hand trying to kill a whitewalker. I guess you need to be full Targaryen to have that power, or maybe it's like Thor's hammer and you have to be deemed worthy by the fire, or the dragons just needed a mother. 

 

Speaking of the mother, Dany may have just lost two of her greatest assets. She better step up her game or Tyrion need to get there pronto to help her out. her dragons are feared, but she can't even control them anymore. She needs someone that can be the hand of Queen. 

 

I suppose it's nice to throw a bone to Jamie and Brienne with him seeing her homeland, since they completely took that storyline away. 

Edited May 4, 2015 by Sakura12

[JTMacc99]

Well, you have all given me a lot to think about Jon's origin story. I'm not sure what I would do with the information, even if I did know the truth.  Which baby daddy would be the most interesting?

 

So, last week I decided that a nice kidnapping would be exactly what we needed to snap the Tyrion story out of its funk. I think I was right about that.  He was at his best with the sharp mind and sharp tongue on full display. Nothing like the fear of death to get him up and going.

 

This week we did the exact same same thing for Dany's stagnant story line. It is a shame that we needed to kill or badly maim a couple of very likeable characters to get her ass in gear, but that's the way GoT rolls.

 

I'm hoping for an Arya boot in the ass in the next couple weeks as well, which should have lots of balls rolling as we hit the second half of season 5. 

[Fen]

I think what Stannis said was carefully ambiguous.  It could have been taken to mean that Ned is not the kind of man to have fathered a bastard.  However, it could also have meant that he wasn't the kind of man to father a bastard with a 'slut serving wench' (or whatever the charming Selyse said), i.e. - it was the result of a romantic relationship with some highborn woman. 

 

I am so, so worried that we're getting sympathetic scenes with Stannis after the little reminder last episode that Brienne wants to kill him.  I will be spitting nails if that happens.

 

It's a bad day in Kingslanding when I actually miss Joffrey.  He'd have slaughtered every last one of the fanatics.

 

Why Ser Barristan went for a stroll without his armour through streets riddled with insurgents is anyone's guess.

[annsterg]

Interesting that neither last week nor this week have the Boltons shared that important tidbit for those considering lordship of Winterfell: that they know that Bran and Rickon were NOT killed by Theon. Sure, since Locke never came back, they don't know where they are or if they are STILL alive, but Littlefinger is missing this critical info as he plots...

[Constantinople]

After being one of my favourites for seasons I found I did not miss Arya. Just her current storylines pacing I guess.

I have to agree, and it's extremely disappointing.  I just adopted a kitten a month ago and named her Arya.  I may have to consider a name change.

 

There's always "no one" or "a kitten".

A kitten knows to use her litter box.

A kitten knows it's time for dinner.

[Isazouzi]

How many Unsullied are there? Hundreds and hundreds, right? Dany has lost what, 2 dozens?

[Boilergal]

I thought Ygritte told Jon "you know nothing Jon Snow" right before she died,  and that is why he had an odd look after the Red Witch said it.  Like she was taunting him with Ygritte's memory.

 

 

After someone gives a sappy speech, Mrs Boilergal and I say, and now you must die -  sorry to see you go Selmy Barristan.

Edited May 4, 2015 by Boilergal

[proserpina65]

Dany better figure out how to call Drogon back, because she just lost her Unsullied Army (RIP Grey Worm and Ser Barristan Selmy).

 

She had something like 8000 Unsullied originally, so I doubt she's lost all of her army, but street-to-street fighting wouldn't seem to be their forte.  Yeah, she needs her dragons.

[Trichromatic]

I thought Ygritte told Jon "you know nothing Jon Snow" right before she died,  and that is why he had an odd look after the Red Witch said it.  Like she was taunting him with Ygritte's memory.

 

 

Was that just a coincidence or is she using magic here? She seemed to have an all-knowing look as she said that but it may just have been her face.

[Dobian]

Here's to snake-a-bobs and the golden hand parry!