femmefan1946 February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I wonder if Jack realizes that by taking all the credit . after the entire office had applauded Peggy's entrance, that none of his men will ever trust him again? He's a pretty face in a nice suit. With luck, the Senator will persuade him to go into politics so Souza can take over as boss. (I'm not familiar with the comics, but given the way people thought in the 40s and 50s, it would be very difficult for a woman to get the job. (When I was interviewing in the early 70s, I was asked a couple of times about how I planned to take care of my nonexistant children and work too. ) 4 Link to comment
FurryFury February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 Well, I guess I've found my ship, as non-canon as it is - Howard/Peggy chemistry still trumps any other relationship she has on the show, at least for me. I mean, that moment when he looked at her and asked her 'Missed me?' I totally swooned. Sousa's just nothing compared to that. The dynamic between them just rocks. Well, Peggy and Jarvis rock as well, but Howard's just more fun, imo. I loved that this episode has a big focus on him - if there is a season 2, I'd want him to be a regular. Thompson having to say the speech about Howard was just brilliant and hilarious and the funniest thing ever. Ivchenko/Fenhoff was talking about his brother's eye having been bitten off during the battle of Finnow. But this is, stuff like that happened in real life, without the use of a magic gas. I've recently read about the battle of Kunersdorf in 18th century, and holy shit, people literally clawed and bit each other. An absolute massacre. The show just reminded me of that article. Why the hell didn't Peggy shoot Dottie as soon as she saw her? This makes zero sense. I could understand why Sousa wouldn't, but Peggy should really know better. I'm disappointed that the whole operation was revealed to be, basically, Fenhoff's personal vendetta against Stark. Why would the Soviets give him resources and a well-trained agent to do this? Or did he just go rogue at some point and Dottie decided to help him? Making the finale go full circle to Steve and the effect his death has had on Howard and Peggy is a great idea and flows perfectly with the narration and character development. And that talk over the radio! That was so emotionally devastating! (and really, how can I not ship them when the script so obviously parallels Howard/Peggy to that last Steve/Peggy talk) SSR all applauding Peggy felt almost as good as when Buffy's class awarded her with "Class Protector" umbrella over on BtVS. She deserved that (and so much more!) Overall - great conclusion to the awesome season. I'll be heartbroken if it's canceled. 4 Link to comment
BooBear February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I hate to say it, but I was disappointed in this ep--I wanted it to be better, after last week was SO good. Peggy was sidelined for way too much of this episode, and while I understand why they wanted this episode to end the way it did, it fell flat for me. Sticking Peggy's Steve issues in here was too much. And Howard took over way too much of the ep--there was a stretch where it felt like the show should be titled Howard Stark because everyone else was a guest star. That said, Hayley Atwell really slayed all the Steve-related scenes and the secondary actors were uniformly excellent. Me too. I thought it was underwhelming. I also thought that Peggy was hardly in the start of the episode. I thought we might get a hint at Peggy's start of Shield and or some bigger hint about the husband or something... and I guess that was Souza but... no it seems like just another day at the office. Thompson is just a straight up jerk so I have to wonder why I am watching him and was it me or does wardrobe always put him in outfits that are way too big for him. That coat looked like his dad's. Jarvis is just awsome though. Link to comment
Jediknight February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I certainly hope that Daniel Sousa is the future Mr. Carter. He respects and admires Peggy. He is also smart and competent. Steve would like him very much. Yes, Daniel is definitely worthy of Peggy. Steve would like him, hell the Howling Commandoes would like him. I'm hoping he is the future husband of Peggy. Peggy has a type, and Sousa is it. I'd like to echo the love for the Howard Peggy radio scene. We knew Howard worshipped Steve, but it was great to see it more in this episode. Also that he felt he let Peggy down by not finding Steve. Howard also loved Peggy, but he didn't want to pull a hit it and quit it with her, he had way too much respect for her. This show is the complete reverse of Agents of SHIELD. The main characters here are Peggy and Jarvis, with Howard and Sousa behind them. I'm a fan of the main characters. On SHIELD the main characters are Coulson and Skye, who are probably my least favorite characters on the show. I'd much rather spend time with May, Simmons, Bobbi, Lance, Fitz, and Mack. 9 Link to comment
Advance35 February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 Steve would like him, hell the Howling Commandoes would like him. I'm hoping he is the future husband of Peggy. Peggy has a type, and Sousa is it. I agree he did have a Steve like quality, though Steve seemed to have a real innocence of spirit that Sousa doesn't, but I'd assume Sousa has had different life experiences, that doesn't make one better than the other in my eyes. I really liked that this show slowly evolved into how Peggy had to let go, of Steve, of her guilt over losing him (I never would have thought she'd feel guilty about what happened with Steve but this episode and SNAFU showed us she did) and moving on, even reluctantly. We the audience know she is awesome but I'm not sure Peggy always did, her saying she knows her own self-worth and she doesn't need the President or Jack Thompson for her to realize it just made me cheer and tip my hat. That was SO relatable. The scene on the bridge was very touching. And it gives it all a Casablanca like poignancy when you think about the fact that Steve Rogers will be back someday, just to a different world. 1 Link to comment
ElectricBoogaloo February 25, 2015 Author Share February 25, 2015 My absolute favorite moment was Peggy saying, "I know my value. Anyone else's opinion doesn't really matter." That was beyond girl power - it was becoming a confident adult who knows she is awesome. It made me so proud. I never saw Captain America but it was still very moving to see Peggy trying to talk Howard down and telling him to let go as she cried. I'm not surprised that Thompson took credit for the save. He may respect Peggy's skills but he is still thinking of his career. Ha, I'm imagining Peggy putting down a sheet before she sits down on any of the sofas or chairs in her new place. 9 Link to comment
shrewd.buddha February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 (edited) I wondered why Peggy didn't wreck the radio to stop Ivchenko, but I realized it was needed so they could do a callback to the Captain America scene with Peggy on the radio talking to Steve in the plane. It does get frustrating when Peggy, who should know better, doesn't shoot first, and stands within arm's reach of a trained assassin. I guess they were going for the standard slug-fest trope. Also Ivchenko's logic was off : an invention is discovered to have bad side-effects ; someone else exploits that to commit an atrocity ; why go after the inventor? And while I was happy they didn't put a cap on the series, I agree that it did feel as if a lot of elements were crowding out Peggy in this episode. That is not a bad thing for a typical episode - or if the series comes back - but unsatisfying if this was the last episode we will get.. But it was a nice ride, regardless. And the balance of action and humor was, again, done well. Enjoyed Stark telling Jarvis that, no, he would not prefer to be killed for the greater good. Edited February 25, 2015 by shrewd.buddha 1 Link to comment
ElectricBoogaloo February 25, 2015 Author Share February 25, 2015 I wondered why Peggy didn't wreck the radio to stop Ivchenko, but I realized it was needed so they could do a callback to the Captain America scene with Peggy on the radio talking to Steve in the plane. The other reason was because if she destroyed the radio, she couldn't communicate with Jarvis and he wouldn't know whether or not to shoot down Howard's plane. 2 Link to comment
kili February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 Thompson got knocked out so many times, he probably forgot what happened altogether. It would seem that all the events from the attempts to arrest Peggy to the foiling of the plan happened in less than 48 hours. Two knock-outs and a near strangulation has to take it out of you. I was hoping that Thompson would give Peggy the credit she deserved, but I`m kind of glad he didn't. He`s still has a major glory hound asshole side, even though we`ve seen there`s more to him, and he has his good traits too. It makes him more interesting, and maybe he`ll grow more next season. Yes, it was a totally believable response based on how they had built his character. I think that he would not have stepped forward and taken credit, but when a senator is handing it to him on a silver platter, he just cannot resist. What I found weird was that it took two people to get Jarvis into a plane while one person went looking for the command tower where the villains likely were. Thompson did give Jarvis a pep talk (although, since Jack has killed, I expected a more thoughtful response about how you find the ability to kill). but Sousa wasn't doing anything in that scene. It just seemed stupid to send Peggy like that alone. The fight scene there was a little lame. Where were all of Dottie's spider like moves? Why didn't the doctor get involved? He seemed to have to be glued to the microphone and then it was suddenly not necessary for him to be chatting with Howard at all. Which is it? Can he spare 30 seconds to help subdue somebody or does he need to talk to Howard the entire time? And take a baseball bat to the equipment before you flee so that your enemy can't undo all your good work. That entire scene required everybody to carry the stupid ball. Not a good look for one of the climatic scenes of the series. Dottie was the star of the episode for me. The way she kept trying her sunny, dim-bulb persona whenever she needed to trick somebody was hilarious. She even attempted it with Peggy when she knew Peggy was onto her. And you could just feel her getting more and more vexed with the Doctor. I loved how she slid in that he was her Grandfather and blind in one eye like it was almost a threat. Her expression when she got back to the car after taking out the hanger guard made me think that the Doctor was going to end up dead (the plan has changed?). Her reaction to Howard not remembering her were fantastic (when somebody who slept with you to be able to rob you and kill 100K people thinks you are a complete cad, you might just be one). When she suggested that she impersonate an SSR Agent next, I expected Peggy to snot back "Why, do you like getting people coffee?". I'm glad Dottie got away, but I think they could have put more effort into chasing somebody who is clearly badly injured and leaving a blood trail in the middle of nowhere. How does having a gas mask save you from death when everybody else around you are crazed killers? Why does the US government gas an entire divison when they don't know exactly what the gas does? Maybe try it on one or two people first. Ugh. Sousa was smart to put the ear-plugs in. Maybe getting yourself gassed ups your IQ. Certainly getting yourself gassed does not demonstrate it (seriously, you come into a room where people have mysteriously all killed themselves and you face the nozzle of a mysterious gas canister straight in your face? Dottie turned the canister on and it had no effect on her because she didn't huff directly from the nozzle). I loved his line about still wanting to murder Thompson. They actually played that all together well. Hapless Sousa not shooting first and wanting to kill Thompson fit neatly into fooling the audience in that final scene. 5 Link to comment
Sakura12 February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I liked that the finale wasn't a big bang. I feel too many shows are starting to depend on the shock value and move everything around to make that happen making the characters look stupid in the process. They forget the character moments where they deal with what happened and talk to each other. That's what I enjoy. I watch for the characters not the shocking plot points. I loved the parallel with Peggy talking to Howard on the plane. I re-watched Captain America last week so that scene was fresh in my mind. Hayley Atwell really showed Peggy's pain from losing Steve and not wanting to lose Howard and also realizing it was time she let Steve go as well. She realized while, yes she was being the best agent she can be, she wasn't actually living a life. So I also liked her little smile after Sousa asked her out. I'm not sure if he's the husband or just someone that helps her move on before meeting her husband. But I wouldn't mind if he was. He's a good guy and one of the smarter ones for wearing ear plugs when talking to a master Hypnotist. I hope we get a season 2, I would like to see Peggy, Angie, Jarvis and Anna all living in Howard's mansion. That should be different for Jarvis to live with a bunch of strong willed women instead of sending them break up gifts from Howard. 6 Link to comment
fastiller February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 Seconded! One of the funniest moments Jarvis has had. When he doesn't introduce himself to Peggy in the first episode and when he thinks he's too clever by half by removing something from the truck engine in Episode 3(?) are my favorites. Bless James D'Arcy! Nick and Nora Charles reboot, anyone? *g* & Yes! Yes! A million times yes! Two million! My absolute favorite moment was Peggy saying, "I know my value. Anyone else's opinion doesn't really matter." That was beyond girl power - it was becoming a confident adult who knows she is awesome. It made me so proud. Her quote s/b on a t-shirt. Link to comment
patchwork February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I like that things were mostly wrapped up but there's still hints of where the story can go if season 2 happens. It's all too easy to imagine Peggy getting sidelined again when a new director takes over, some of the agents might tell the new guy that Peggy is good at the job but no one apart Sousa is going to be insistent about it. Sousa could be the husband just like Angie's stage name could be Maria Carbonell but nothing has been confirmed so the show can easily go in another direction and as I'm never going to get a hot and heavy Peggy/Howard flig I'm having fun playing spot the spouse. I'm hoping S2 will skip to SHIELD's first big case, we don't need to see the nitty gritty of how they get set-up and Peggy leaving the SSR, probably taking Sousa with her, can easily be brought up when SHIELD inevitably clashes with her old agency. There's a lot about this episode I like especially Peggy on the radio trying to talk Howard around, but it also did what a season finale should and made me excited for what might come next. 1 Link to comment
FurryFury February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I liked that the finale wasn't a big bang. I feel too many shows are starting to depend on the shock value and move everything around to make that happen making the characters look stupid in the process. They forget the character moments where they deal with what happened and talk to each other. That's what I enjoy. I watch for the characters not the shocking plot points. Yeah, exactly. In the end, it felt like this was the story of Peggy the person and her getting over a personal tragedy and finding a new reason to live and prove to herself that she can do it despite all the odds against her. Everything else - smirking self-important colleagues, evil organizations, assassins trained from childhood - was just the icing on top. This was her story. Not SSR's, not SHIELD's, not Captain America's. Despite the show's title, it was about a character first, and about an agent second. More shows should follow this formula, imo. Especially comics-based. 9 Link to comment
The Kings Foot February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 The only man who Carter could possibly stand being married to in the series so far is Jarvis, Souza is nice but I think he;s more of the little brother/sidekick to her . One part that didnt make sense was the black cop being hypnotized instead of killed, after all they didnt know they'd need him later on. Link to comment
ElectricBoogaloo February 25, 2015 Author Share February 25, 2015 One part that didnt make sense was the black cop being hypnotized instead of killed, after all they didnt know they'd need him later on. I thought he was dead when Jarvis and Thompson found the abandoned police car and saw that Howard wasn't in the back seat. Link to comment
The Kings Foot February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I thought he was dead when Jarvis and Thompson found the abandoned police car and saw that Howard wasn't in the back seat. Earlier on , when he pulled the Doctor and Dottie aside for running a red light, then he gets the radio call that the car is stolen, and Dottie confronts him. He should have been killed at that point. Not conveniently hypnotized so that after the Doc changes the plan they can collect him to do their Howard Stark kidnap. Link to comment
Tiger February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 Was I the only who got a little teary when Peggy was on the radio with Howard? I'm not sure how the Emmy's work and if this show would be classified as a regular drama series or a mino-series, but it should definitely be submitted and HA should submit last night's episode. I'll be shocked if we don't get another season, perhaps with a few more episodes to boot. ABC's comedy development is really strong and allegedly they want to add another hour next fall. Butwith the split season scheduling and need for returning drama, I think Shield/Carter is a shoe-in for renewal, but will probably be moved back an hour to accommodate more comedy. Lee hates big scheduling changes so pushing Marvel back an hour gives the night stability. 2 Link to comment
I Love Me February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 Not my favorite of the Agent Carter episodes but it wrapped everything up very nicely. Glad Dottie is still out there in case the show comes back. Loved the Silence of the Lambs themed device on the doctor's face at the end. Frankly, I think Peggy is way to smart to date or marry anyone she works with. Company inkwell and all that. Moreover, I like to believe her world is much bigger than just the confines of the SSR office. 3 Link to comment
LucidDreamer February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 Nick and Nora Charles reboot, anyone? *g* From your lips to a producer's ears! That would be awesome, and they're the only two actors I can imagine doing such a thing. 1 Link to comment
Primetimer February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 The season ends on a traditional note: good guys are exonerated and partially redeemed, while bad guys are captured or at least severely punched. Read the story Link to comment
Malbec February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I continue to be neutral on who her husband should be but everyone is cheering for a specific person can find a way to keep that dream going after the ending. I give the writers credit for that. I'm sure Agent Carter fanfic is being born as we speak and everyone gets to feel included. I really like this too. I think it speaks to the care and thoughtfulness that the writers put into buildling Peggy's relationships with other characters that you could justifiably imagine her ending up with several different characters -- yet it doesn't feel like the writers were pandering to shippers. 1 Link to comment
DeLurker February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 Very well done mini-series. Not being familiar with the Marvel stories I was afraid I would be hopelessly lost and was pleasantly surprised that I did not "need" it to enjoy Agent Carter. Link to comment
Chicago Redshirt February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 Thompson got knocked out so many times, he probably forgot what happened altogether. It would seem that all the events from the attempts to arrest Peggy to the foiling of the plan happened in less than 48 hours. Two knock-outs and a near strangulation has to take it out of you. Yes, it was a totally believable response based on how they had built his character. I think that he would not have stepped forward and taken credit, but when a senator is handing it to him on a silver platter, he just cannot resist. What I found weird was that it took two people to get Jarvis into a plane while one person went looking for the command tower where the villains likely were. Thompson did give Jarvis a pep talk (although, since Jack has killed, I expected a more thoughtful response about how you find the ability to kill). but Sousa wasn't doing anything in that scene. It just seemed stupid to send Peggy like that alone. The fight scene there was a little lame. Where were all of Dottie's spider like moves? Why didn't the doctor get involved? He seemed to have to be glued to the microphone and then it was suddenly not necessary for him to be chatting with Howard at all. Which is it? Can he spare 30 seconds to help subdue somebody or does he need to talk to Howard the entire time? And take a baseball bat to the equipment before you flee so that your enemy can't undo all your good work. That entire scene required everybody to carry the stupid ball. Not a good look for one of the climatic scenes of the series. Dottie was the star of the episode for me. The way she kept trying her sunny, dim-bulb persona whenever she needed to trick somebody was hilarious. She even attempted it with Peggy when she knew Peggy was onto her. And you could just feel her getting more and more vexed with the Doctor. I loved how she slid in that he was her Grandfather and blind in one eye like it was almost a threat. Her expression when she got back to the car after taking out the hanger guard made me think that the Doctor was going to end up dead (the plan has changed?). Her reaction to Howard not remembering her were fantastic (when somebody who slept with you to be able to rob you and kill 100K people thinks you are a complete cad, you might just be one). When she suggested that she impersonate an SSR Agent next, I expected Peggy to snot back "Why, do you like getting people coffee?". I'm glad Dottie got away, but I think they could have put more effort into chasing somebody who is clearly badly injured and leaving a blood trail in the middle of nowhere. How does having a gas mask save you from death when everybody else around you are crazed killers? Why does the US government gas an entire divison when they don't know exactly what the gas does? Maybe try it on one or two people first. Ugh. Sousa was smart to put the ear-plugs in. Maybe getting yourself gassed ups your IQ. Certainly getting yourself gassed does not demonstrate it (seriously, you come into a room where people have mysteriously all killed themselves and you face the nozzle of a mysterious gas canister straight in your face? Dottie turned the canister on and it had no effect on her because she didn't huff directly from the nozzle). I loved his line about still wanting to murder Thompson. They actually played that all together well. Hapless Sousa not shooting first and wanting to kill Thompson fit neatly into fooling the audience in that final scene. To respond to a few points above: A) There are a fair number of potential reasons the doctor didn't get involved. He underestimated Peggy, or he had faith in Dottie's ability to take her on solo. He was needed to continue the hypnosis of Howard. Or he wasn't actually needed to continue hypnotizing Stark, but he wanted to enjoy that the target of his obsession and vengeance was at his mercy so he focused on that. B) I don't find it so tough to believe that someone who managed to keep his wits about him could escape a bunch of crazed killers with a little luck. Just getting to an isolated place while the crazed people killed each other, or being able to use weapons or a vehicle would probably go a long way to getting to relative safety. C) From what I gathered, the U.S. Government knew exactly what Midnight Oil (or at least had a very good idea) did and deployed it anyway. Stark said that it was meant to allow soldiers to stay awake for prolonged periods of time, but it turned out to only cause psychosis like that which came with sleep deprivation. He shelved it, but a general stole it and deployed it to use in the Battle of Finnow. 3 Link to comment
Wootini February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I agree that Peggy felt squeezed out of the first half of the finale in favor of Howard, but Dominic Cooper is just so freakin' adorable I can't really complain TOO much. ;-) This was a great limited series, and I also don't know if I want any more. I mean, obviously this is WAY better than SHIELD, and I would love to see more of Peggy, but at the same time, I think it might be better to have this one amazing story and not ruin it with a subpar followup series. (Imagine if the second seasons of Freaks & Geeks or My So-Called Life sucked…) I'm just glad we got Peggy at all, so I'll take whatever I can get! I appreciated they left Dottie alive just in case, because she was an awesome nemesis for Peggy. I was a little disappointed in the fight scene, though. Great choreography, but it just wasn't as elaborate as I thought it should have been for a finale face-off. As cool as the truck rooftop fight was, I think my favorite is probably the Automat battle. They just used the setting so well, and it was perfectly choreographed. I don't even care that they've finally given some SHIELD characters super powers… there's just no way that it will be able to measure up to the weakest Agent Carter episode when it comes back next week… :( Link to comment
Spartan Girl February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 Sticking the evil doctor in a cell with the OTHER evil doctor. Brilliant move, SSR. Idiots. Well, I loved the finale. Should have guess that 1) Dottie would escape and 2) Thompson would take all the credit, but both piss me off. I did love the emotional scenes with Peggy and Howard, and Jarvis. And Peggy pouring Steve's blood into the ocean and whispering "Bye, my darling" broke my heart for the millionth time. I was shouting "shoot him! shoot him!!" at Sousa. Damn you Sousa. You should have shot the crazy doctor. So was I. Got to give him credit for the earplugs though. Please for the love of God renew this show! 2 Link to comment
Raja February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 What year is it? Did they have black patrolmen in New York at that time? If so, it was probably realistic that he was riding alone. I didn't think New York got a black officer until sometime in the 40's. The Marvel Cinematic Universe is not real life, they have been fully integrated from their first scenes of crowds and the SSR basic training and assessment camp in the 1942 of The First Avenger. It was just a fluke that a Black agent wasn't shown in the SSR field office while two Asian agents were and two Black Howling Commandos are shown. I found the first episode more shocking when Bubbles, Andre Royo, showed up as Spider in the first episode who by all looks was about to have sex with White women without notice by any character, his henchmen, customers or federal agents. For a follow up MCU "historical" series I am interested in how did an open as the FBI it seems, SSR become a secret SHIELD that despite being as large as the USMC nobody knew about until the Battle of New York 1 Link to comment
VCRTracking February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 The parallel to the scene in Captain America: The First Avenger Peggy talking to Steve on the radio(which made me cry in the theater), this time to Howard who's one regret was not finding Steve, way to hit me square in the feels show. Howard saying Steve was the only good thing he helped bring to the world.... Holy crap Dottie looked good glammed up in the flashback. It's Bridget Regan Man so it shouldn't be a complete surprise but still. Man, she is all kinds of crazy too. Glad she didn't die. Awesome of Sousa with the earplugs. Too bad Thompson didn't deserve saving. Peggy and Angie moving into one of Howard's mansions together. That's going to keep the femslash shippers happy(and busy writing fic). Glad they had that final scene with Peggy and Jarvis, their scenes were the heart of the show to me. Peggy on the Brooklyn Bridge pouring Steve's blood over saying "Goodbye my darling"(that being the first time she ever called that) God I wish their romance hadn't been cut short. Zola! Holy crap. Didn't think they'd get Toby Jones to appear, but it's so awesome. There better be a second season! 1 Link to comment
Traveller519 February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 Very interesting call back with Zola in the cell. I'm wondering if this means that Peggy is the one that gets him out of jail and brings him into the fold when she forms SHIELD. That would mean that ultimately Peggy is responsible for allowing Hydra to form and set roots within SHIELD, she'd have a lot to atone for given she was (barely) still alive when the events of the Winter Soldier go down. I agree that she should have shot Dottie on sight, but like others have said I liked how they played out the fight, Peggy would be no match for Dottie straight up, but it was Dottie's Jealousy and obsession that brought her down, not unlike the Good Doctor. Peggy's ability to keep her head about her in these situations was the deciding factor. Jack really could have laid into Howard for him being responsible for a lot more mayhem, including dead red-shirts in the USS.... errr... Russia, and in the building across the street the week before. I was glad to see his PTSD from that one episode was all cleared up by this go around though. Link to comment
kili February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I'm disappointed that the whole operation was revealed to be, basically, Fenhoff's personal vendetta against Stark. Why would the Soviets give him resources and a well-trained agent to do this? Or did he just go rogue at some point and Dottie decided to help him? The plan also involved killing a lot of Americans. Fernhoff knows that the American government is behind the decision to kill all those Soviet soldiers, so that justifies killing Americans (in his mind). Giving them a taste of their own medicine. The Soviets would also be upset by that (at best, giving untested drugs to their soldiers as guinea pigs, at worse, knowing what was going to happen) and they may have wished revenge or to brush the US off the plate. There was a lot of positioning back then. If it goes badly, the Soviets can claim Fernhoff was a rogue agent. If it works, the US knows the Soviets have come to play. The Soviets did not have nuclear weapons at the time, so I can imagine that having a doomsday-like gas would make them feel like they are balancing the power. What I found bizarre is that Fernhoff seemed to know more about Stark's stuff than the Americans. He knew what most of the "toys" did, he knew about the secret vault and he knew about the secret airport (that is rather hard to hide). The Americans seems to know nothing. Was it because other branches were keeping that stuff secret? Time for the US to send some girls to spy on Howard. He happily gives away the farm to whichever woman he just met. I wanted to punch Howard when he stole Captain America's blood again. What a weasel. Link to comment
Bruinsfan February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I'm disappointed that the whole operation was revealed to be, basically, Fenhoff's personal vendetta against Stark. Why would the Soviets give him resources and a well-trained agent to do this? Or did he just go rogue at some point and Dottie decided to help him? I don't see Dr. Fenhoff having much difficulty convincing Russian spymasters or Dottie to do whatever he wants. 4 Link to comment
FurryFury February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 One person, yeah, but a whole organization is stretching it. He wouldn't need Dottie if he were that powerful. Link to comment
Wootini February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I do have to say, though, that I appreciated Fenhoff's confrontation with Howard where you basically had to admit that he wasn't wrong. Howard was kind of responsible for what happened. I mean, sure, he went about revenge in completely the wrong way, but at least his motivations were strong! :D (Also, when Howard was sighing that yes, he's a horrible person and should be punished for all the evils he's unleashed upon the world, didn't you just want to give him a great big hug?) Link to comment
kili February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I do have to say, though, that I appreciated Fenhoff's confrontation with Howard where you basically had to admit that he wasn't wrong. Howard was kind of responsible for what happened. Howard has a lot to answer for, but the death of Fenhoff's brother is not one of them. Fenhoff should have had General Whats-His-Name in the seat. Howard was trying to invent Speed (something to keep you awake and energetic which I actually think they had and used in the military at the time. They certainly use it today) and failed. That kind of thing is going to happen. Not every attempt at something is going to succeed. He recognized it and decided to cancel the program. It was the General and the US government which decided to use the drug on the Russians and Howard tried his best to stop him. If the V-E Day celebration would have gotten crop-dusted, then Howard would share part of the blame because he kept that scary gas around as a souvenier. What is the point of that? But his hands are pretty clean on the Russian gassing. 3 Link to comment
Izeinwinter February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 There are *much* better wakefulness drugs than speed now. Modafinil doesnt send you hyper or anything, it just makes you awake - entirely specific anti-sleep drug. Very popular with shift workers, people with sleep disorders, and yes, the military - because it doesn't impair judgment. I mean, you can kill yourself with it by staying awake for weeks, but that requires you to be very dumb *before* you take it. Link to comment
AnaRow February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 Peggy's career is going to get overshadowed by guys taking credit for her work. You do know that she's a co-founder of S.H.I.E.L.D.? Some 70 years later Simmons on Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. will be gushing over her signature. Her career's not going to get overshadowed. What year is it? Did they have black patrolmen in New York at that time? If so, it was probably realistic that he was riding alone. I didn't think New York got a black officer until sometime in the 40's. What I do when things like that come up is remind myself that the MCU is an alternate universe. It's very close to but not the same as the world we live in. Unlike DC, Marvel didn't bother about coming up with new cities. 1 Link to comment
ChelseaNH February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I really want to see a season of Peggy and Howard forming Shield so Jarvis should be around for that. The showrunners have said that the formation of SHIELD would be the last scene of their series -- in other words, they're doing Peggy in the SSR, not Peggy in SHIELD. just like Angie's stage name could be Maria Carbonell Tony's birth is some 15-20 years away. It's too soon to be introducing his mother. It would be interesting for Stark to meet Angie, though. She might be initially swept away, but she's a woman who'd call him on his antics. To the bitter end he was trying to hold onto the goldmine that is Steve's blood. I suspect Stark is motivated at least as much by curiosity as he is by love of money. But I suspect there's more to his desire to use Steve's blood. Solving the super-soldier puzzle would be a way to keep a little part of Steve alive. Why would the Soviets give him resources and a well-trained agent to do this? They're getting access to Stark technology and a major strike against the US. I doubt the doctor had to twist any arms. Not conveniently hypnotized so that after the Doc changes the plan they can collect him to do their Howard Stark kidnap. I could see them thinking that a police officer might come in handy. Security guards are a dime a dozen, but a uniformed police officer is a limited resource. But yeah, it's a stretch. 1 Link to comment
patchwork February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 (edited) I do have to say, though, that I appreciated Fenhoff's confrontation with Howard where you basically had to admit that he wasn't wrong. Howard was kind of responsible for what happened. I mean, sure, he went about revenge in completely the wrong way, but at least his motivations were strong! :D (Also, when Howard was sighing that yes, he's a horrible person and should be punished for all the evils he's unleashed upon the world, didn't you just want to give him a great big hug?) I can understand that once someone like Howard has an idea he can't move on from it until it's built even if what he builds doesn't match what he has in his head the attempt is enough to allow him to move on to another project. If nothing else this entire fiasco should convince him to have policy of destroying the really dangerous stuff he doesn't want anyone getting their hands on. Jarvis could do the actual destroying behind Howard's back if need be. Edited February 25, 2015 by patchwork Link to comment
tv echo February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 (edited) I love Peggy, Jarvis, Howard and Dottie. I'm more meh on Angie, Sousa and Thompson. I don't think Sousa is her future husband. I also don't think he's strong enough for Peggy (I don't mean physically). He just seems a little too in awe of Peggy. Steve is a very nice guy but he is also very strong internally (beliefs, character, etc.). I think Peggy's smile and response to Sousa's invitation was to show that she was ready to move on from Steve and start dating. Did anyone else think that when Angie went to make a phone call, we'd get a cutaway scene of her on the phone saying cryptically to someone, "I'm in"? Maybe they didn't want to leave a loose plot thread in case they didn't get a second season. Maybe the Angie surprise reveal is being saved for season 2. That last bridge scene when Peggy dumped Steve's blood in the river against the period song (I think it was "The Way You Looked Tonight") - just amazing acting by HA. I wanted to reach into my TV screen, grab her shoulder and yell, "He's alive! He's just frozen but he'll be fine." That was a great episode - in fact, all 8 episodes were great. I'm going to miss this show. Here's an article that explains how this episode tied into Winter Soldier (warning: spoilers):http://www.ew.com/article/2015/02/25/captain-america-writers-surprise-agent-carter-cameo Edited February 25, 2015 by tv echo 2 Link to comment
charis February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I may be the only one thinking this, but the little awkward look Thompson gave Sousa and, especially, Peggy when the senator was lauding him makes me think maybe the character hasn't gone back to being a complete tool. It'd be nice to see that the series did give him some evolution; I can think of plenty of plausible reasons for him to keep his mouth shut, and some even stem from not entirely selfish motives. (Partially, yes, but not entirely.) I watched the episode before work this morning when I woke up to texts from several friends full of capslocky glee, and I'm glad beyond reason I did. This show manages to strike a balance between seriousness, hilarity, and punching-you-in-the-feels that is really well-executed; that I could go from laughing over Howard failing to remember whatever name Dottie had given him and how indignant she was to tears over Peggy and Howard on the radio (not to mention the bridge, and Jarvis' declaration as he handed over the blood before) to squealing aloud at the end when Zola was revealed ... Agent Carter's handled things deftly throughout, and while I think the short season may have helped I don't think it's the only reason -- the writing here is head and shoulders above Agents of Shield (and a lot of other TV shows). Loved the Odysseus gambit Sousa pulled -- it seemed so very true to character, whether the origin of his idea was common sense or classical literature. Loved Jarvis' reaction to Howard hugging him. Loved Howard being Howard, that jerk with an essential humanity that he just can't shake. Loved Thompson and Sousa as buddy cops. Loved Dottie's ability to switch between wide-eyed innocence and kicking your arse. Loved the Angie cameo and how excited she was over the apartment. And loved everything Peggy. Hayley Atwell is a treasure, and I agree 100% with whoever said they want an Atwell/D'Arcy Thin Man reboot -- I am there. I had little problems here and there with the episode, and I'm sure if I sat down and rewatched critically that I would find more, but overall I'm just riding an excited high (despite this being the season end), and I'm too busy being delighted to focus on those. They didn't detract from my enjoyment, and that IMO is plenty. This show. This cast. All my incoherent feels and delight. There had better be another season (at least)! 2 Link to comment
Bort February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 My absolute favorite moment was Peggy saying, "I know my value. Anyone else's opinion doesn't really matter." That was beyond girl power - it was becoming a confident adult who knows she is awesome. It made me so proud. I like that she said that line to Sousa. He and his leg issues could also use that as his mantra. 2 Link to comment
ChelseaNH February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 Loved Jarvis' reaction to Howard hugging him Not too long ago I found a post from my uncle about the 1940s, so I can say with some authority that bro-hugs did not exist back then. Also, every single man would be wearing a fedora when he left the office. (It's an alternative universe, you say? How alternative?) 2 Link to comment
that one guy February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I really enjoyed "Agent Carter," but the finale was not my favorite episode. I see what they were trying to do, the parallel structure of beginning the series with the flashback of Steve going down, and ending with Peggy once again on the radio with a plane that might go down. But it didn't quite work for me, at least on first watch. I was so glad Black Widow 1.0 wasn't killed off. She ended up being one of my favorite characters. I don't see Dr. Fenhoff having much difficulty convincing Russian spymasters or Dottie to do whatever he wants. I pretty much believed that Dr. Faustus was on his own mission of revenge and had manipulated the Soviets into backing him... I was expecting Dottie to actually have a different mission he didn't know about, but the show didn't go there. I was certain she'd end up with Steve's blood for the Black Widow project! But instead Jarvis had it. I'm hoping if there's another series it's set in the 1950s. Let's do McCarthyism and Civil Rights as a backdrop! Link to comment
Raja February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 Not too long ago I found a post from my uncle about the 1940s, so I can say with some authority that bro-hugs did not exist back then. Also, every single man would be wearing a fedora when he left the office. (It's an alternative universe, you say? How alternative?) I remember hearing that the war started to change that standard fashion choice. First the shortages of material cut the use for civilians left behind during the war and then to the returning vets getting away from the sergeant who forced him to wear a hat it was a sign of freedom 1 Link to comment
Leia1979 February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I watched the second half of the episode again (and then accidentally deleted it, damn it!). The scene on the Brooklyn Bridge made me a little teary. Also, Peggy saying she didn't need a congressional medal reminded me of Steve not showing up to receive his in Captain America. I don't know if that was an intentional parallel or not. I didn't think this was the best episode of the series, but it still held 100% of my attention, which most shows these days don't do. Link to comment
Orion February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 You do know that she’s a co-founder of S.H.I.E.L.D.? Some 70 years later Simmons on Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. will be gushing over her signature. Her career’s not going to get overshadowed. You do know that the Marvel One shot, that in this timeline would follow after these episodes, has Peggy right back to being devalued by her coworkers and having to work around them because of their prejudice. My comment was in regards to where she will be right after this episode, not where she will be 50 years in the future. I'm well aware of where she ends up, thanks. Link to comment
AimingforYoko February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 My absolute favorite moment was Peggy saying, "I know my value. Anyone else's opinion doesn't really matter." That was beyond girl power - it was becoming a confident adult who knows she is awesome. It made me so proud. She just wasn't saying that to Sousa, she was also saying that for Sousa. 6 Link to comment
Linderhill February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I don't mind Angie but I wouldn't have been bothered if we never saw her again. She was ok but nothing more to me. This is my take on Angie too. She never really gelled for me as being interesting. Heck, I thought the roommate that was murdered was more appealing. I'd never seen the Angie actress before so I had no preconcieved ideas about her. I was somewhat relieved that The Chad has retained his unlikeablility. I was afraid I'd have to like him after seeing a couple of the previous episodes. Link to comment
Humbugged February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 I think Shield/Carter is a shoe-in for renewal, but will probably be moved back an hour to accommodate more comedy. Lee hates big scheduling changes so pushing Marvel back an hour gives the night stability. If they have to move it I would rather they move it to 10 .SHIELD has been helped by allowing it to go dark.Moving it back to 8 means the return of the ICER and people not actually getting capped. Link to comment
beedub February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 From the general tenor of this forum, there seems to be a desire for a second season of Find Agent Carter A Husband! ;-) With this character, we're seeing great strides being made for women, but still a strange obsession with who she'll marry. All in all a pretty decent finale, some great moments, and fine acting all around, although I really was waiting for some mention of SHIELD being proposed. But I suppose we can take that as encouragement that it's being saved for the series that will come, or at least it better be! 3 Link to comment
dargosmydaddy February 25, 2015 Share February 25, 2015 Well, that was fun. Fingers crossed for a second season. I've never watched Agents of SHIELD or any of the marvel movies, but I really enjoyed this. Jarvis continues to be made of awesome. Glad Sousa finally got his moment to be smart. Though I did wonder when he came up with his plan. I guess it could have been after he split up from Jack, but it seems unlikely that he'd both think of it and be able to find earplugs in what seemed to be a short amount of time. Which means he totally knew what he was going to do beforehand, and decided not to tell Jack to do likewise. Hee! Go Sousa! I really want Howard Stark to fix Sousa's leg. No way. It might explode or eat its way up his body or something equally horrific... 7 Link to comment
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