"The View": Week of 11/24/14

[dumbdownus]

 

I never want to hear that Keke woman's voice EVER again

Hopefully we will NEVER be subjected to Keke again. Funny, I was feeling sorry for Keke, this young actress, having to put up with Sherri during the performances & all the picture taking/autograph signing, now I feel they deserve each other!!!

[ginger90]

Keke shared some thoughts about the show:  http://instagram.com/p/vytQqcErnP/

[Dreamboat Annie]

Whoopi called other people rude.  Whoopi called other people rude.

[ginger90]

I think Whoopi was probably like this all along. There were others who in a way distracted from it. She also seems to be getting crotchety old lady syndrome. I think she took over where Barbara left off, now she gets to be longer winded and louder about it. I wonder about TPTB at ABC more this season.

[CMH1981]

 

Keke shared some thoughts about the show:  http://instagram.com/p/vytQqcErnP/

 

So KeKe thinks it's rude how others interrupted her and would not let her finish a thought/sentence.  How funny, considering she interrupted Rose P and...well...every other co-host constantly.  Like I said before, Rosie P looked like she wanted to bitch slap KeKe for interrupting her and not shutting up.

[Dissy]

 

Keke shared some thoughts about the show:  http://instagram.com/p/vytQqcErnP/

Even her tweeter feed is annoying!

[Dreamboat Annie]

I think Whoopi was probably like this all along. There were others who in a way distracted from it. She also seems to be getting crotchety old lady syndrome. I think she took over where Barbara left off, now she gets to be longer winded and louder about it.

 

 

I thought that for a little while too, how Whoopi might be enjoying her spot at that table a lot more now without her boss sitting right across from her, to whom she was obligated to constantly defer (and did).  But now, with what has become The Whoopi Show, her not letting anyone else speak, her cutting her co-hosts off (her co-hosts, not her subordinates - she's not their boss), her obvious notion that it's only her opinion that matters, her ranting lectures and finger shaking at the audience at home, her "I don't care" crap*, her boob droop talk, her pee talk, her farting and letting us all know about it...I'm thinking now... nah, she's just rude.

 

Less than five minutes into today's show, I decided that any and all guest hosts are completely unnecessary**.  I actually liked one last week, Jessie J, who is incredibly talented and is a genuinely pleasant person.  But she seemed uncomfortable when the topics went to U.S. politics knowing it was not her place to comment***.  Today I just thought hey, there's not enough time to hear from the regular co-hosts with Whoopi making sure we don't, and I would much rather hear from them than a guest co-host.  I am just not interested and do not care to hear what any guest co-host thinks about anything.  If I can't hear from the regular hosts, why do I want to hear what a guest co-host thinks?  Way too crowded at that table.  Why can't they just have these guest co-hosts as guests on the show?  I won't support a show with a guest co-host even when one of the regular hosts is absent.  It might be refreshing and a little fun for us if just three of them are at that table when one is away **** (provided Rosie O's not the one who is away - then I won't watch at all). 

 

**** Is it me (I know I didn't watch regularly after Rosie left in 2007, but I watched sporadically) or did Whoopi used to take a lot of days off?  I recall she was away quite a lot.  Babs:  "Whoopi is feeling under the weather today"..."Whoopi has the day off"..."Whoopi isn't with us today because she's in (insert city) working...".  I'm thinking she's not pulling that shit now because she knows that not only will she not be missed, but it will be our pleasure to enjoy her absence(s).

 

***  This show in itself is so rude.  I can't stand the thought of guest co-hosts, but if you're going to have them, you have to be aware of exactly whom you have invited to sit there and of your requirement to accommodate them.  Have them, don't have them, but at least be aware, polite and intelligent about it. 

 

** Unless a chair opens up at that table and there are the inevitable auditions..

 

* Whoopi sure does spend time and puts forth much effort into letting us know she doesn't care, um...I mean, for someone who doesn't care.

[CathinAZ]

Just watched today's show. Hadn't ever heard Keke before but know she had done some work with sherrie and they are together in the Broadway show. She was incredibly annoying! Her voice, her demeanor, her meandering comments, the fact she dominated the conversations in the first 10 minutes of the show...what an oddball and kind of a wierd version of Sherrie. Those two having conversations backstage must have driven all the other actors in the play NUTS!

[TheGreenKnight]

I thought exactly the same thing as one of the first posts in this thread: although I hate when Obama interrupts hot topics, I was glad because of the guest co-host being the most annoying person to be on the show since Sherri Shepherd was cast out. Loved Rosie P's smackdown during the pitbull topic. When the show came back on, they were at the end of the Cosby discussion. Rosie O didn't look happy, but she didn't say anything either. I noticed Rosie P was talking to her as the show went to break.

 

Whoopi really needs to go. I'm surprised I've come to that point, but she brings down all possibility of a serious discussion on any subject. Pick up Queen Latifah for moderator. She's likable, but not a personality who could hold a show alone--perfect for an ensemble. Funny and charismatic, but not dominating.

[maggiemae]

WG,s worship of keke was OTT, IMO.

As is her lectures and finger wagging....and I don't give a crap what you think attitude to us.....the viewers.

I was thinking Perez - NEtflex, TVLand etc let alone social media didn't exist "way back then" when the rapes occurred.

Glad NW gave RO two nods and the guests as well.

Edited November 25, 2014 by maggiemae

[bannana]

OK, i'm going back to a stance i've taken before - the original premise of this show - intelligent discussions by women of different backgrounds about topics that matter to women. WHAT HAPPENED?

Whoopi is my age. She is being deceptive when she talks about this issue. She knows damn well that when she was a teen/young woman, sexual assault was not something that was viewed the way it is today. Any woman who was groped, or drugged, or threatened, was not taken seriously. the response was all about asking her why were you alone with a guy? why did you go to a party? why did you accept something to drink? why did you accept a ride home if you didn't want sex? why were you wearing clothes that made you look sexy? Any woman who reported being attacked would be accused of having consensual sex and then experiencing regret the next morning. Whoopi KNOWS this, she's pretending she doesn't.

The original View panel would have DISCUSSED the accusations against Bill Cosby, and discussed how things have changed over the decades. They might have shared personal stories, but they certainly would have talked about how men were in control, and women were powerless. they would have discussed it in terms of how women have been empowered in recent years, and NOW, women can come forward and talk about their experiences of powerful men taking what they wanted.

but they would have TALKED about it, listened to each other, and considered the issue intelligently, from a number of points of view. How BC was a product of that era, where it was accepted and expected to take advantage of young women by putting something in her drink. How a man's secretary, assistant, intern, was referred to as his "gal" or "girl", and he could have her if he wanted. the executive banging his sexy secretary was not a myth, but something women went along with in order to keep a job. How a woman could go to college, and then end up with a job as an assistant to a man who made twice her salary even though he lacked her credentials. How it was acceptable to pay men more than women for the same job, because men had to support families. How HELP WANTED ads in the paper had two sections - male and female. How women could get fired for getting pregnant, or for being married, even for gaining weight.

How about how the country was still grappling with the issue that Black men were supposed to be equal to white men, but everyone knew women of any color were inferior? Women were not equal - not in the workplace, not in the home, certainly not in the entertainment industry.

Bill Cosby was a powerful man in the entertainment industry who understood that society saw women as there for the taking, that a woman who wanted to succeed in the industry was going to have to go along with advances from men, whether she wanted to or not. And he understood that if a man takes it too far, and crossed a line, then having someone give the woman some cash would make the guilt go away.

Society changed, gradually, over the years, and what we used to accept is now considered a crime of sexual assault. Bill Cosby didn't change, he kept up the same behavior for a long time. The thing is, I really think Bill Cosby himself probably does not think he "raped" anyone. By the standards of the time, he had sex and then was generous by sending cash and gifts to the women. Yeah, he gave them a little something to loosen them up and make them "relaxed", but so what? He didn't beat them up! That was the mentality at the time, and that is the discussion they should be having - about race, gender, and power and control. It's worth talking about.

To be clear, I'm not excusing Cosby - I think he's a pig. But a bigger issue is how he was allowed to be a pig. And a rapist.

Cannot agree more.  I think this is what the "news item" is really about.  It was a different era, and you have described it well.  My hubby when he heard this news--and he is 60--said this was probably what all male stars at that time did/got away with, plus producers, directors etc.  It's not even a guess, the autobios are out there and women have been reporting this behaviour for years.  The story/discussion should really be about how this was so prevalent, that women could not be heard.  Now they will be heard, and there is absolutely nothing in it for them but heartache.  Instead, we have a cast of women who mostly seem to want to divert from this real issue.

 

It is similar to the issue of child abuse, which was hidden for many years, and spousal abuse.  These things were accepted when I was a child.  Now celebs are being called out for this.

[Cosmocrush]

Cannot agree more.  I think this is what the "news item" is really about.  It was a different era, and you have described it well.

On the radio today a man asked, "Why did these [bill Cosby] stories take so long to come out?  A woman reporter answered, "It didn't.  We are just now ready to listen."  She went on to describe seeing this story about ten years ago but it never went anywhere, in part because so many editors (and Cosby's biographer) were loathe to report it - which rang true to me.   Also she added, "There is courage in numbers."  

 

WG,s worship of keke was OTT, IMO.

Ahhh, but I don't think it was really about Keke at all, but it was about the mention of the Golden Days of Goldberg when Whoopi had a part in the TV version of Cinderella.  Just like Babs before her, Whoopi loves any opportunity to remind us she used to be a big deal. 

 

 

I think Whoopi was probably like this all along. There were others who in a way distracted from it. She also seems to be getting crotchety old lady syndrome. I think she took over where Barbara left off, now she gets to be longer winded and louder about it. I wonder about TPTB at ABC more this season.

I wonder if crotchety old lady syndrome is contagious because Whoopi can sure can bring it out in me this season. 

 

***  This show in itself is so rude.

Week by week this show seems to be devolving into The Spew of the last few years - only then it seemed easier to laugh at the rudeness because I didn't expect anything else.      It's a shame too, because I thought they came so close to having a good show at the beginning so seeing it slide (or Whoopi leading the charge) back into craptastic territory is a bummer. 

 

 

Whoopi really needs to go. I'm surprised I've come to that point, but she brings down all possibility of a serious discussion on any subject. Pick up Queen Latifah for moderator. She's likable, but not a personality who could hold a show alone--perfect for an ensemble. Funny and charismatic, but not dominating.

Nothing against Queen Latifah, and I never caught her talk show,  but I don't think the answer is another actress as moderator.  I'd like to see someone with successful broadcasting experience.or someone with successful talk show experience do it (hmmmm wonder who that could be, lol)  That's who did for the first 10/11 years of this show [first Meredith and then RO] and I thought it worked.  Today when Whoopi decided to tell us What This Show is About, I thought, "Shut up.  I've been watching this show longer than you have."

[bannana]

To me they just came off worse than Thurs. I'm glad Ro just sat there saying nothing. There's nothing for her to say, we know what she meant and she knows we know by being silent like she was. Whoppi came off like a bully who thinks she's better than us viewers. She's so ignorant, what kind of 'proof' are these rape victims to show? She pissed me off so bad today wagging her damn finger at us 'viewers' I flipped her off! I never want to hear that Keke woman's voice EVER again

Whoopi's rant is like so many we have seen before.  She puts her "view" out there, and then doesn't like it when in her daily life, the plebes like us call her out on it.  You cannot have it both ways.  If you are going to have these views, and espouse them daily, you are going to get taken to task.  No matter what the topic.  If someone yelled at her about her views on rape-rape, that should not be a surprise.  What I find hilarious is that she is supposedly this counter-culture person who is then admonishing us, the viewers, or the audience.  She has been pretty clear that she only does what she does for the money, so her contempt for the viewers/audience is a bit hypocritical.   Would love for someone to call her out on that sometime.  

[Dreamboat Annie]

Oh, yes.  Whoopi has made it clear doesn't care about her View gig, she is in it only to collect the pay check and imo, it shows.  Always has.  I need to clarify my point about her "caring".  She doesn't care about her job on the View, and yes, she's there just to collect her pay check.  But I do believe, although she does not want to show it, she cares what people think of her, she personally.  She "doth protest too much", and I do recall a very shocked, hurt and wounded soul, back around 1993-4, when her boyfriend at the time, a black-faced Ted Danson being boo-ed during a Friar's Club roast, which was her idea and for which she had written all the jokes.  It did not go over well. 

[RogerFromOhio]

Remember when Whoopi first started this gig..... some magazine columnist criticized her.... I think her outfit or something..... and she went off at the end of the show. She was really nasty to the reporter.

 

Yeah... she doesn't care at all  *eyeroll*

[Dizzy9]

Cosmocrush a big two thumbs up as I have been thinking all those thoughts too.  Whoopie has lost her filters and will say what she thinks as she is the Queen Bee of the show.  In The Daily Beast article of July 16 Whoops says "I will do my best to respect the audience" during her "angry on-camera rant",.  Looks like that is harder than she imagined.

 

This show has been a trainwreck for me since Rosie left the last time.  And even then Sherri and Bits lowered the IQ of the table to less than average intelligence.  I like the idea of Eva Longoria to replace "none of my business" RP and a Deborah Roberts or Tamron Hall type of personality to replace Whoop.  I think the View would have a longer shelf life in the talk show world with a classier panel.  I also think that Rosie would up her game and appearance with this type of panel.

[imjagain]

I don't have much to add, because the show was interrupted twice, heh.

I love reading everyone's posts. I enjoy it more than the show. I came back to The View because of RO and I wanted to see RP because I really enjoy her. But it is getting hard to watch. For me it really is WG who ruins the show. The more I hear from her, the more I dislike her. I agree with those that have called her the new Barbara. She really is.

Edited November 25, 2014 by imjagain

[Former Nun]

A very small excerpt from the ASPCA's website on the history of pit bulls:  "Today’s pit bull is a descendant of the original English bull-baiting dog—a dog that was bred to bite and hold bulls, bears and other large animals around the face and head. When baiting large animals was outlawed in the 1800s, people turned instead to fighting their dogs against each other. These larger, slower bull-baiting dogs were crossed with smaller, quicker terriers to produce a more agile and athletic dog for fighting other dogs."   I assume KeKe wanted to present some of this information but was interrupted (the word of the day...yesterday?) by RosieP.

[Bronzedog]

What was Rosie P talking about when she kept bringing up the umbrella people, or whatever it was about people with umbrellas?

[marny]

She was trying to talk about the peaceful protests in Hong Kong that have been going on for over a month now. She bungled it and said it was in Japan before she was corrected by one of the other women.

[Morbs]

I haven't seen any news reports about slow response times of the firefighter department.   Everyone is equipped with a camera nowadays, so of course there will be shots of just the fires before the EMTs can get to it.  It's like Rosie wants to have an intelligent discussion and Whoopi is just loony tunes and Rosie Perez is afraid to get anyone mad at her and Nicole just sits backs and reads official statements.  It's just bizarre to announce that a decision was about to be made midday and then announce it at night.  It's like they were encouraging people in Ferguson to tailgait for the indictments to ensure as much firestorm as possible, so it's hard to believe people could be that stupid.  It's like the Ferguson police wanted this to happen because to them it justifies what they already think of the black population and protesters.

Edited November 25, 2014 by Morbs

[Bronzedog]

Oh! Thanks! My brain seems to work differently than Rosie P's. I rarely know what she's talking about.

[susieq147]

It's just bizarre to announce that a decision was about to be made midday and then announce it at night.  It's like they were encouraging people in Ferguson to tailgait for the indictments to ensure as much firestorm as possible, so it's hard to believe people could be that stupid.  It's like the Ferguson police wanted this to happen because to them it justifies what they already think of the black population and protesters.

 

 

 

I totally agree with you.  This way Ferguson officials can say "see this is what we have to deal with". 

Edited November 25, 2014 by susieq147

[redlaces]

I had not yet fully understood why Nicole was called Cackles.. until today. My GOD! She sounded like she lost her damn mind during that weird challenge near the end of the show. I didn't see most of it, but oh man did I hear. 

[Tunia]

I haven't seen any news reports about slow response times of the firefighter department.   Everyone is equipped with a camera nowadays, so of course there will be shots of just the fires before the EMTs can get to it.

 

 

CNN did a report around 11:00 p.m. showing that, indeed, the Fire Dept. had been on the scene in a timely manner, but had evacuated due to the immediate gunfire threat.  The situation was deemed too serious for them to remain on the scene.  The CNN camera panned to show the fire hoses laying on the ground, abandoned.  Loss of buildings trumped a possible loss of firefighters' life.  I was surprised Nicolle didn't bring that up since she said she was viewing three cable stations...maybe wrong station, wrong time.

 

It's just bizarre to announce that a decision was about to be made midday and then announce it at night.

 

 

True, but I was already annoyed that for the past week the news stations have been proclaiming that "a  decision could come at any moment", so they've been fanning that flame for a while.  All that does is put everyone on edge and get them into response mode, only to be frustrated by the delay and ready to blow.  None of this was handled in a thought out, positive manner.

Edited November 25, 2014 by Tunia

[Vinyasa]

Less than five minutes into today's show, I decided that any and all guest hosts are completely unnecessary**.

 

Yep and today seemed to be a Pitbull infomercial. Between Rosie P.'s voice, I can only watch when she isn't talking and can't really get much of RO, that I would like to hear talk.

[athousandclowns]

Blown away by Whoopi and her continually taking what ever side is the opposite of Rosie or from the human race.  Rosie said that the young man laid in the street for 4 hours dead no EMT no ambulance and Whoopi said yeah I did not see any fire fighters or EMT's in Ferguson last night. WTF?? I am glad she repeated it after Whoopi attempted to derail it.  This is something she should feel passionate about not  throwing it out there about being choked to death.

Rosie P sure does ramble. Impressed the decanter had alcohol and it smelled ??  I half ass heard (walking in and out of a room) a poll this morning that 80 percent of people agreed with the outcome? I must be from another planet.

[Diane]

Yes, they said he laid in the street, but they also laid out all of the evidence last night in the press conference.  Witnesses that lied and contradicted each other, the fact that he was on camera stealing, then he charged the police officer.  I thought the evidence was pretty compelling, but we all have the right to our opinions.  I saw last night on the coverage fire fighters and EMT's so not quite sure what the heck Whoopi was talking about.  But then that's nothing new.

[kaygeeret]

I was curious after the Ferguson discussion on The View that was weird I thought.  Once again RO was clear and incisive in her statement while the others rambled.  So I watched THe Talk and it was handled differently.  THe intro by Julie Chen was a clear statement of the facts as well as her opinion and then they went around the table.  I thought the two black women (don't know who they are) were very powerful each in her own way.  I was impressed at their approach as opposed to the one taken by The View.

 

On a different note, there is an article by David Carr in today's NYTimes which discusses how wide spread the information was in show business and the media.  THe writer interviewed Cosby and also did not confront him about the previously reported stories - many of which had been published already.  RO was right and the rest of the panel was wrong - big time wrong! 

[Bronzedog]

The Talk did handle it well. Alisha Tyler was on the verge of tears and Sheryl Underwood, who frequently plays the Sherri Shephard role of a buffoon, but is obviously much brighter than Sherri, made a very well thought out statement but it was ruined for me when Sharon Osbourne commented on something irrelevant at the end of Sheryl's statement. Don't think Sharon listened to Sheryl at all. In that way, it was exactly like The View.

[maggiemae]

Let's see-

WG - yes, it took 55 months for the grand jury to decide not to indict, really?

And why would the fire dept go in to fight the fires while under gun fire?

Nice save for Perez for her chatter about umbrellas in Japan - COMMERCIAL!

[maggiemae]

Let's see hère-

WG-

Yes, it took the Ferguson Grand Jury 55 months to decide whether to indict. Really? (I know she was joking but made no point of that's......I hope).

And the fire people are not required to STAY and fight THE FIRES WHILE THEY are under gun fire.

Nice save for Perez and her comments on umbrellas in Japan......

[Dreamboat Annie]

When they went around the table, each giving their opinion on the outcome, Nicolle was last to speak.  There was nothing wrong with what she said about Michael Brown's parents.  I agree - they could (and would be entitled to) be so lost in their grief but instead choose to be out there trying to effect positive change to what is just a horrible situation.  She mentioned President Obama's live address, echoing the sentiments in it, as well as Michael Brown's parents same wishes for more peaceful and non violent protests.  (In fact even Whoopi said something like "don't wreck your own stuff" - I agree.  I can't wrap my head around the destruction of one's own town and living space, and the destroying of people's property, businesses and dreams they worked so hard to achieve just because you're disappointed.  They didn't do anything to you.)  But, and it's a big but, it was subtle, but the look on Rosie's face when Nicolle was speaking was not lost on me.  I would have wanted to hear Nicolle's feelings on the outcome too. 

 

I was in awe of Pitbull's backup dancers and thought they were dynamite.  (LOL - does anyone even say "dynamite" anymore?)

[CMH1981]

 

But, and it's a big but, it was subtle, but the look on Rosie's face when Nicolle was speaking was not lost on me.  I would have wanted to hear Nicolle's feelings on the outcome too.

 

I didn't pay that much attention today Dreamboat Annie, but what did you mean by the look Rosie was throwing toward Nicolle?

 

I really think that Nicolle and Rosie P have upped their game when it comes to HotTopics after the spanking they got in the media over the Cosby discussion last week.  It really seems like they are thinking before they speak, unlike Whoopi who just likes to go off the cuff.

 

I thought all the hosts were on point today w/their thoughts about what was happening, well except Whoopi.  I noticed that too that after Rosie O's comment about him laying in the street for all those hours, Whoopi wanted to know where the emergency help was in this tiny, speck of a town.  I have a feeling that Whoopi was asleep when the announcement came down last night and so she was playing catch up on everything this morning before they went to air.  They really need to switch Whoopi and Rosie O and let her be the moderator.  Rosie O is showing such a calm and collected voice when it comes to these tense topics, she speaks so much more eloquent than Whoopi could ever dream to.  When Rosie O brought up Selma and how things went down back then, it was very obvious how fast Whoopi jumped in on that argument b/c one is a white woman bringing up the history of the civil rights movement that the african american woman on the panel should be taking charge with the parallels.  It must chap Whoopi's ass that Rosie O can convey her thoughts better than she and explain it all so much better.

[Dreamboat Annie]

I didn't pay that much attention today Dreamboat Annie, but what did you mean by the look Rosie was throwing toward Nicolle?

 

 

Thank you for asking.  Just to be clear, Rosie was not "throwing a look toward Nicolle".  It was easy to see when it was Rosie's turn to speak of her opinion on the outcome that she was completely devastated, and it was not difficult to see the reaction of Rosie P to the outcome.  (Whoopi I did not really listen to - I think I've reached a point where sometimes when she's speaking I tune her out).  Nicolle did not share her opinion on the outcome, something which I was hoping would come but must admit did not really expect.  Nicolle spoke for a few minutes, sometime during which the camera did shoot to Rosie O, and she just looked how I felt at the time - you agreed with what Nicolle was saying, but at the same time you knew she was dodging the conversation - the one where each panelist shared her feeling on the outcome.  Like I said, it was totally subtle.  I know I could be wrong, but she just looked the way I felt at the time, listening to Nicolle and agreeing with what she was saying, but yet discouraged at knowing she was not going to share her feeling on the outcome of this highly anticipated decision. 

[Medicine Crow]

Whoopi is a bonafide asshole & I'm discounting anything she says!!!

[shok]

I had not yet fully understood why Nicole was called Cackles.. until today. My GOD! She sounded like she lost her damn mind during that weird challenge near the end of the show. I didn't see most of it, but oh man did I hear. 

 

Ahhh, so Cackles has come to life on the View. Knew it wouldn't take more than a couple of months. Now that you've heard it, you're never going to be able to unhear it.

[shok]

Yes, they said he laid in the street, but they also laid out all of the evidence last night in the press conference.  Witnesses that lied and contradicted each other, the fact that he was on camera stealing, then he charged the police officer.  I thought the evidence was pretty compelling, but we all have the right to our opinions.

 

No, they didn't lay out all the evidence in the press conference. Barely a smidgeon.  Now that the transcripts of the witnesses testimony have been released and legal experts and journalists have had a chance to go through it, it has just confirmed what most of them felt about the D.A. and his never before done style of grand jury and how there wasn't a hope in hell that Michael Brown and his family would ever get justice.

 

McCulloch kept praising witness #10 as the only eye witness who supposedly consistently told the same story (while all the other eye witnesses lied and changed their stories or didn't even see the incident - yeah right) and #10 was the only one whose story matched Wilson's that Michael Brown had charged at him and never had his hands up in surrender.

 

Lawrence ODonnell on his show tonight completely shredded Witness #10's testimony. In his police report two days after the murder, he said that he was 100 yards away from the scene. At the GJ he said he was 50, maybe 75 yards away. LIE!!! He stated that just before Mike Brown charged at Wilson (LIE!!) Brown had made some sort of gesture. When asked what kind of gesture, #10 stammered that he wasn't really sure, he wasn't that close, he couldn't recall exactly but he thought he had shrugged his shoulder or maybe put his hand in his waistband but he couldn't be sure. But he was absolutely sure he never saw Brown put his hands up (despite at least 6 or 8 other witnesses swearing under oath that he had). I could go on but this post would become a novel. I sure hope Rosie was watching his show.

 

McCulloch totally acted as Wilson's defense attorney throughout the GJ hearings and in his presser. He's supposed to be the prosecutor, speaking for the victim who isn't there to speak for himself!!! As Mike Brown's dad said, Mike can't tell his story because he's buried.

 

[suomi]

MB's body was not recovered from the street for a prolonged period because the scene was volatile. The funeral director responded and staged in a timely manner but had to take cover in a police vehicle for a long time because of close random gunfire and the menacing crowd, which the police were hesitant to incite further. The funeral director, a very level headed speaker, related all of this in coherent detail during an interview aired by a local TV station. The City would be liable for damages in a lawsuit if they allowed civilian personnel to be injured/killed, even while those civilians were performing official duties. The funeral director was grateful that he (along with his wife, who accompanied him) was not required to leave the police vehicle while the scene was so dangerous and uncertain.  

 

As for the witness interviews, many of them changed their perspectives during a series of interviews as they were confronted with verified crime scene and autopsy information which indicated that their earlier accounts were less than truthful. They were granted immunity from prosecution - false statements hindering an investigation - after admitting to various versions of "wanting to be part of something big." As for the yardage, I'd venture to say that a lot of people have difficulty with large measures of distance. I know what a football field of 100 yards looks like from the stands or viewing it on TV but I would be hard pressed to tell the difference between 50 yards and 100 yards in a different setting. There is no denying that racially charged incidents occur but I remain unconvinced that this was one of them.

 

McCulloch has been faulted for convening a grand jury. There would have been hell to pay if he hadn't. I thought a GJ "will indict a ham sandwich." Evidently not. If a grand jury (with a much lower threshold) did not indict would it have been better to fund a trial (with a much higher threshold) that ended with the same result? If the evidence isn't there, it isn't there. One of the talking heads on Lawrence O'Donnell's show yesterday and today said "they presented so much formation to the grand jury that they hid the truth." I kid you not.

Edited November 26, 2014 by suomi

[shok]

MB's body was not recovered from the street for a prolonged period because the scene was volatile. The funeral director responded and staged in a timely manner but had to take cover in a police vehicle for a long time because of close random gunfire and the menacing crowd, which the police were hesitant to incite further.

 

Maybe if the police hadn't left an unarmed 18-yr old, college bound, never been arrested before, brains leaking out from bullet holes in his skull, boy's body on the street for four and a half hours the crowd would have been less volatile. They were outraged at Brown's body being treated like an animal that had been hit by a car. His mother, his horrified MOTHER, had to go and get a blanket to cover him as he lay bleeding-out on the street.

 

As for the witness interviews, many of them changed their perspectives during a series of interviews as they were confronted with verified crime scene and autopsy information which indicated that their earlier accounts were less than truthful.

 

And several of them didn't change their perspective yet were accused of lying at McCulloch's presser while he stood there and praised over and over again the one witness who agreed with Wilson and whose testimony in the written transcript showed that he DID alter his story and was very unsure about other parts of it.

 

 

McCulloch has been faulted for convening a grand jury. There would have been hell to pay if he hadn't. I thought a GJ "will indict a ham sandwich." Evidently not.

 

Yes, some people have faulted McCulloch for convening the GJ but that is because he had enough prima facie evidence to indict Wilson immediately and simply have a Discovery Hearing. You can be damn sure that if it was Michael Brown who shot someone, his ass would have been hauled off to jail in an instant. Yes, the 'ham sandwich' thing is well known because it is the prosecutor and the prosecutor only who decides what evidence to present and normally s/he can present only the witnesses or information that is most damning to the defendant. It is virtually unheard of to have a GJ that hears all the evidence, especially that which is favourable to the defense. Wilson was able to get up on the stand and talk for four hours without any cross examination or anyone questioning his version of events. Michael Brown had NO ONE speaking for him in that grand jury room and he was the victim, not Wilson.

 

 

If a grand jury (with a much lower threshold) did not indict would it have been better to fund a trial (with a much higher threshold) that ended with the same result? If the evidence isn't there, it isn't there.

 

Of course it would be better to fund a trial where BOTH sides have a chance to present all the evidence and cross examine the witnesses and then let the jury decide based on fair procedures. This grand jury heard only one side of the story. The most recent stats, 2010, showed that there were more than 600,000 grand juries convened in the country and 99.99% of them returned an indictment. Only 11 of those 600,000+ juries did not. McCulloch's GJ was a sham.

 

 

One of the talking heads on Lawrence O'Donnell's show yesterday and today said "they presented so much formation to the grand jury that they hid the truth." I kid you not.

 

Why would that be kidding? Hiding the truth is despicable in a country of law and order. All the more reason to have a proper trial and let the victim, Michael Brown, have his day in court even if it is, tragically, posthumously.

[buffynut]

Per her Twitter, looks like Rosie O won't be there today: 

 

Rosie @Rosie  ·  19h 19 hours ago

and I am off for thanksgiving- enjoy gaga tomorrow - sad to miss her ... have a happy holiday #off4now #usetheFORCEluke
0 replies 6 retweets 101 favorites

[Wings]

The thing is this.  They all have a point of view/opinion on current affairs.  There is no right or wrong.  They, like we, are entitled to have our opinion.  You may not agree with Whoopie but that does not make her an asshole or insert whatever word works.  :>)  Same with Ro.   What I find tiresome with both of these women is the anger behind their words and their need to argue their point into the ground with one who disagrees.  It is like listening to republicans and democrats discuss politics.  Minds are not changed.  Speak your truth and then shut the fuck up and allow the others to do the same.  

 

They spend way too much time going at it.  This is why I watch The Talk and tune into this one only when I find something interesting here that makes me want to check out the episode.  

[movado23]

Very well said Wings707.  I started watching the View because of RO.  I am a fan.  I have found NW to be an absolute delight.  She is intelligent, well spoken and I get a kick out of her joy in doing this job.  I also enjoy RP and Whoopie as well.  Whoopie is so clearly hated here I wonder why so many people even watch this show ?  Rosie O has very strong beliefs as does Whoopie.  When all this started going downhill was the Cosby discussions.  What I heard was the other three women saying they wanted to wait for evidence before condemning him.  NONE of them came close to saying Rape is okay.  Someone upthread wrote a great post about how common it most likely was "back in those days" for powerful men to behave this way.  I agree.  I'll bet it was rampant.  It was horribly wrong but I'll bet that was the only way for many, many women to get a chance in that industry.  I didn't hear anyone "disagreeing" with Rosie at all.  Do they step over each other to be heard ?  Yes.  What I am seeing now is a show where the other three are stepping all over themselves to not upset RO.  I see RO as being absolutely miserable.  She is quiet and keeping her distance from all of them.  I'm not inside her head so I can only read her body language and it doesn't look like someone who even wants to be there.  That makes me sad because I think all four of them are funny, intelligent and from different worlds.  I miss the original foursome this show started with.  That was an entertaining show.

[susieq147]

There is no denying that racially charged incidents occur but I remain unconvinced that this was one of them.

 

 

 

I don't know if Officer Wilson reacting the way he did was racially motivated but I absolutely believe everything that came after Michael Brown's death has been racially motivated.  It seems like when a black man is shot by a white police officer (or a wannabe like George Zimmerman) that their loss of life is looked at as less tragic.

 

While I think the behavior of the protestors who reacted violently was wrong I can understand their frustration at yet another young black man killed and there are no repercussions.  But unfortunately  it's this behavior that perpetuates the stereotype which of course makes police officers more likely to be trigger happy around someone they view as this stereotype. It's a vicious cycle that needs to be broken.

 

Speak your truth and then shut the fuck up and allow the others to do the same.

 

 

 

I do think Rosie O is willing to listen to other's opinion Whoopi is most definitely NOT willing to.  She tells us almost daily not to tweet her because she doesn't care what we think.  For a woman who makes a lot of money being employed by a show to give  her opinion you would think she might understand other people who also like to voice theirs.   Oh wait a minute, what am I thinking?  Whoopi is a award winning movie star and the rest of us are just a bunch of nobodies.  But she would be wise to remember just because she doesn't care what we think her bosses might.  And if enough people let them know Whoopi is not well liked they might take notice.

[Wings]

 

There is no denying that racially charged incidents occur but I remain unconvinced that this was one of them.

 

 

I share your opinion. 

Edited November 26, 2014 by wings707

[Diane]

MB's body was not recovered from the street for a prolonged period because the scene was volatile. The funeral director responded and staged in a timely manner but had to take cover in a police vehicle for a long time because of close random gunfire and the menacing crowd, which the police were hesitant to incite further. The funeral director, a very level headed speaker, related all of this in coherent detail during an interview aired by a local TV station. The City would be liable for damages in a lawsuit if they allowed civilian personnel to be injured/killed, even while those civilians were performing official duties. The funeral director was grateful that he (along with his wife, who accompanied him) was not required to leave the police vehicle while the scene was so dangerous and uncertain.  

 

As for the witness interviews, many of them changed their perspectives during a series of interviews as they were confronted with verified crime scene and autopsy information which indicated that their earlier accounts were less than truthful. They were granted immunity from prosecution - false statements hindering an investigation - after admitting to various versions of "wanting to be part of something big." As for the yardage, I'd venture to say that a lot of people have difficulty with large measures of distance. I know what a football field of 100 yards looks like from the stands or viewing it on TV but I would be hard pressed to tell the difference between 50 yards and 100 yards in a different setting. There is no denying that racially charged incidents occur but I remain unconvinced that this was one of them.

 

McCulloch has been faulted for convening a grand jury. There would have been hell to pay if he hadn't. I thought a GJ "will indict a ham sandwich." Evidently not. If a grand jury (with a much lower threshold) did not indict would it have been better to fund a trial (with a much higher threshold) that ended with the same result? If the evidence isn't there, it isn't there. One of the talking heads on Lawrence O'Donnell's show yesterday and today said "they presented so much formation to the grand jury that they hid the truth." I kid you not.

I agree. The grand jury heard the evidence and didn't find probable cause to charge the officer, from a robbery suspect (on tape).

Edited November 26, 2014 by dcmjdc2

[sugarbaker design]

Whoopie is so clearly hated here I wonder why so many people even watch this show ?

 

 

Because its fun watching Whoopie morph into Bawa!  She's exhibiting Bawa's old behaviors:  breaking the flow of conversation to say something obvious, discounting what the other panelists have to say, et al...

[Haleth]

On a lighter note the Tony Bennett Lady Gaga duet was fabulous. I may have to check out the cd.

[Milk-Eyed Mender]

WOW WOW WOW WOW WOW!!! Nicolle is the first voice for the GOP I have ever heard call George Zimmerman "the thug who jumped Trayvon." It's about f*cking time someone from the right verbally nailed that POS. As someone who will never recover from Trayvon's murder and that farce of a trial in Sanford, I thank you, Nicolle. Too little, too late, but still, thank you.

[Morbs]

I don't know if Officer Wilson reacting the way he did was racially motivated but I absolutely believe everything that came after Michael Brown's death has been racially motivated.  It seems like when a black man is shot by a white police officer (or a wannabe like George Zimmerman) that their loss of life is looked at as less tragic.

 

Me too.  I don't know what factor race played into it, but since it seems like the Ferguson police got major boners when they got to dress up in military garb and spray people with pepper spray that the "dirty cop" problem, men who go into the force because they like the idea of being a bad ass and controlling other people , is the area of major concern here.  As for Rosie Perez's comment that Wilson should have just shot for a leg, I'm not a gun person but I've heard that people who say things like that know little about handguns and that accuracy of aim would be nearly impossible in a heated situation.

Edited November 26, 2014 by Morbs