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Current Plots Discussion: Actually Today's Episode


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Spoilers are not allowed in this thread. Period. Any posts that include spoilers (and casting information qualifies) will be removed. There are several other threads that allow spoilers so take that discussion to one of them.

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45 minutes ago, kitmerlot1213 said:

Man, but I would watch the hell out of that :)  I'm good with the Eve reveal but the idea of Will's teaming up with her to get even with Ben sounds rather awesome.

Please let this be true. I will take back every eye-roll and exasperated sigh with what they've done to Will this year.

1 hour ago, kitmerlot1213 said:

I can't believe it hasn't occurred to anyone--Ciara, Hope, anyone else in law enforcement--that a family member of the one of the three people Ben killed might not be too happy that he gets to have his dream wedding while their loved one lies in a cold grave.

Ben probably doesn't even know why Eve kidnapped him.

 

2 hours ago, norcalgal said:

Has the show actually improved, or do we just feel this way based on nostalgia - (meaning: the time period when Lucas and Sami were key characters, not sidelined or just inserted into the story from time to time) - with Sami & Lucas being on our screen lately?

No, the show still sucks, but I love Lumi. I've also accepted that Sami and Lucas are amicable exes... better than nothing, I guess. Lucas's scenes with Kate were lovely. The actors are so at ease with one another. Seeing Shawn and Belle is nice, too.

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On 7/29/2020 at 3:38 AM, MsTree said:

For that to have happened, you'd need Martin Scorsese directing and a 5 million dollar budget....

At this point, I'd be happy with Martin Short and a budget drawn from the change in the couch cushions of the Kiriakis drawing room set.

I definitely feel there's something stilted about a lot of Sonny and Will's conversation -- I mean, a LOT of conversation on the show is pure exposition, but it seems greater than ever with them; like upwards of 80% of Sonny's and Will's purpose on the show is reporting on the activities of other characters -- to the point where the term "exposition fairy" occurred to me, but which seemed retrograde and cruel as well as the cheapest kind of on-the-nose.   

Edited by Sandman
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3 hours ago, pearlite said:

I'm not prone to nostalgia, but I'm finding the Sami and Lucas dialogues/interchanges to be a real pleasure, especially on BD's part. He handles humour and irony really well, and those scenes feel fresh.

Their scenes have been great.  I don't think it's pure nostalgia.  It's two characters with history who have been brought back to actually do something related to that history (parenting Allie) while maintaining the personalities of their characters.  The show has been using them very smartly.

11 minutes ago, Sandman said:

I definitely feel there's something stilted about a lot of Sonny and Will's conversation -- I mean, a LOT of conversation on the show is pure exposition, but it seems greater than ever  with them; like upwards of 80% of Sonny's and Will's purpose on the show is reporting on the activities of other characters

When I saw that question asked, that's exactly where my mind went.  It's exposition.  Will is actually okay because this is his sister and he's involved in other things.  But his character still feels connected. Sonny basically exists these days as "husband." 

I didn't mind Vincent except my mind wondered why the show felt the need to pay a day player when they could have just skipped right ahead to having Eve show up. 

Speaking of Eve, what was up with that "come fuck me" red dress?  Are things about to get twisted?

Did they switch the actors playing Clyde or am I crazy?  And the outfit Ciara is wearing is the kind of outfit they'd put on an actress if they were trying to hide a pregnancy.  I am 99% sure that's not the case but the bulky swearshirt and black tee is straight out of Allie's wardrobe.

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2 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

Did they switch the actors playing Clyde or am I crazy?  And the outfit Ciara is wearing is the kind of outfit they'd put on an actress if they were trying to hide a pregnancy.  I am 99% sure that's not the case but the bulky swearshirt and black tee is straight out of Allie's wardrobe.

Same actor.

I think she's wearing Ben's hoodie. At least she's dropped the damn shoe.

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3 hours ago, brisbydog said:

Am I the only one who finds Will and Sonny's conversations weirdly stilted? I just never feel like they are having natural conversations. Can't peg why but they irritate me

They have NO chemistry.

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19 hours ago, boes said:

Ciara is a total marvel.  Apparently, she learned how to be an obnoxious, judgemental, screeching harpie who thinks she can force people to agree with her by shouting over them just by listening to her Grandma Aunt Julie.

Hey, can’t say she didn’t learn from the best!

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15 minutes ago, RunningMarket said:

Is this relatively new? I swear I remember them being compatible back in the day (pre-Will's death).

They definitely used to have more chem/seem more at ease with each other.

Oh man, Eve showing up looking hot to torture Ben has me hyped!

Although, today I was thinking that when I was excited about all this I wasn't thinking about how bad RSW's acting was going to be. It's just painful. I need it to turn more UCG lol.

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Hit him again!

Hit him again!

Harder! 

Harder!

Ice Hockey Sport GIF by NHL

That was quite enjoyable.

RSW was terrible in those scenes.

Will and Sonny really need to learn how to read the room. The last thing Ari wants is a baby sibling. Like her life hasn't been fucked up enough.

"Aunt" Nicole, STFU. <-----lather, rinse, repeat until she listens.

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1 hour ago, Irlandesa said:

I didn't mind Vincent except my mind wondered why the show felt the need to pay a day player when they could have just skipped right ahead to having Eve show up. 

Eve needed muscle.  She wasn't going to drag Ben around or administer physical punishment.  I liked the fact that Vincent didn't waste any time talking/threatening.  He simply got out the stick and started whacking kneecaps.  Dedication to your job is an important quality in a thug😄  Eve hires only the best.  She should definitely look into a career in HR.

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1 minute ago, lb60 said:

"Aunt" Nicole, STFU. <-----lather, rinse, repeat until she listens.

On a show where Will sometimes call Marlena by her first name even though he has known her all of his life, Allie is sure quick to call her sister's kidnapper Aunt seconds after she married Eric last week.

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I would watch American Ninja Warrior Kids.

I like how Ari is the new young Ciara.  If Show were to last for several years, I'd love watching her turn into her grandmother and/or her mother.

I'm sure Victor would love having a new puppy in the mansion.

 

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11 minutes ago, nilyank said:

On a show where Will sometimes call Marlena by her first name even though he has known her all of his life, Allie is sure quick to call her sister's kidnapper Aunt seconds after she married Eric last week.

I think she does it just to piss off Sami. And me. lol

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2 minutes ago, Silver Raven said:

Why? She is her aunt.

For all of two seconds.

Plus, she did kidnap her sister.

And, like I said, she most likely does it only to irritate Sami. 

And, because Nicole tells the spoiled brat what she wants to hear.

Let's see how fast she would drop it, if Nicole told her to grow the hell up.

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(edited)

If Rafe ever does get his hands on Ally's kid, I'd like to be a fly on the wall when the little tyke is old enough to ask,

"Daddy, what do you know about my birth family?"

"Well, little tyke, I was married to your bio grandmother, had a one night stand with your bio great aunt and had a lengthy friends-with-benefits affair with your GREAT grandmother."

"Gee, Daddy, you're a real manslut!"

In other news, can anyone superglue Ally's mouth shut, and let a little spill over on Nicole?  

Eve looks fabulous!  Lucas and Kate are such fun to watch, Ciara looks like she's going to interview for a job as a gravedigger and Ben, as usual, is a bit slow on the uptake......"Eve?  Eve.......Donovan??"  Who the hell did he think it was, Eve Harrington?

Edited by boes
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1 hour ago, chediavolo said:

They have NO chemistry.

I kind of feel that way as well.  They're reminding me a bit of Luke and Noah on ATWT who were big partly because people really liked them but also probably, in part, because of what they represented in soapdom. I thought they lacked heat and I always felt there was potential for a better pairing for Luke out there so when Reid showed up, I was a goner.*

(*Both couples fell victim to the P&G curse on same-sex intimacy that @hypnotoad mentioned regarding GL's lesbian couple; although the ATWT couples were allowed to have kisses).

Even though Sonny is also the son of a supercouple, I see Will in the Luke role as we saw him grow up and his parents/grandparents have been more consistently relevant on the show. 

Basically, I'm not saying Sonny needs to go away but darnit, I would really love to see the next interloper be a serious love interest for Will.

54 minutes ago, lb60 said:

Will and Sonny really need to learn how to read the room. The last thing Ari wants is a baby sibling. Like her life hasn't been fucked up enough.

Very few kids want a younger sibling but it's not exactly a life ruining event.  People eventually adjust to their existence even when they're annoying the beejeeesus out of them. (I'm looking at you, younger sis, and you thinking I agreed to things that convenience you.)

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(edited)

So KDP was feeling a bit peckish and in need of chewing some scenery, so she agreed to another stint on DOOL as Eve? What ravising prospects for the next few weeks, at least for aficionados of ham acting.

A few days ago I suggested that the bombing might have been ordered by one Salem's more respectable citizens who hired professionals for the job. It looks like I was correct. Except for the "respectable" part.

We can now look forward to Eve sounding all self-righteous about substituting her own will to the due process of the law, just because she likes to play (or rather "overplay") the still-grieving mother. To me, that does not make her predictable claim of the high moral ground very credible, even in the context of Ben's crimes pre-therapy.

The scene between Allie and Sami was so annoying. Everyone made such a big deal out of every single detail and blew everything out of proportion. Sami would have every right to express her opinion to Rafe, even though that previous encounter was written as her being her usual bullying "your only option is to do what I want" self, but Nicole and Allie treated it as if it were the biggest betrayal ever. It was also normal for Allie to be irritated by it, but the default mode for the writers seems to be explosive conflict when these characters get together instead of trying to settle matters through some form of civilised discussion, including setting some clear boundaries. Not that the writers would have Sami respect such rules.

And no one, including Kate and Lucas, considered the possibility that Rafe might have come to the exact same conclusion even without Sami's intervention. It's as if he has no mind of his own and her will cannot be resisted.

Meanwhile, Sonny and Will continue to gleefully plan the adoption, unaware of the drama that is about to explode in their faces and jeopardize their plans (because Allie is portrayed as fixated on Rafe as the best option).

Ari's spoiled Horton princess genes are flaring up once again. She really has her three parents wrapped around her greedy little finger.

Edited by wurdalak
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6 hours ago, DaphneCat said:

I like Vincent.  Can we keep him?

I feel like this show would ruin Great Value Keanu Reeves if he stuck around long enough. This show has a way of neutering perfectly good villains if they stick around long enough.

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8 hours ago, norcalgal said:

Has the show actually improved, or do we just feel this way based on nostalgia - (meaning: the time period when Lucas and Sami were key characters, not sidelined or just inserted into the story from time to time) - with Sami & Lucas being on our screen lately?

Serious Q:  who in Salem has Alice's donut recipe?  I think Hope, but anyone else...?

Nostalgia if they stick around long enough it will fade fast.

Jennifer and JJ have the recipe.

 

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On 7/28/2020 at 1:38 PM, kitmerlot1213 said:

Who didn't enjoy seeing Ben tied to a chair and freaking out?

(Raises hand) "Me Sir, Me!"

It is such a frequent feature of the torture horror film sub-genre (like Saw et al.) not to mention various interrogation scenes in spy and action movies that it has become a tired stereotype.

 

8 hours ago, Katy M said:

You know what would have been better than Eve.  If Will was behind the whole thing and he'd only been pretending to be Ben's bestie.

That would contradict so much of past events and Will's recent portrayal in that friendship that it would be beyond the bounds of acceptable absurdity, even considering DOOL's low bar on that front.

 

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My twitter feed is filled with fan girls gushing about what a great thespian Ben is and how he conveys so much with a few grunts.. um, apart from Lani he is the most bland actor on the show to me but weird to see so much tongue bathing for him. 

 

P.s. I miss Xander 

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(edited)

Aunt Nicole, Aunt Nicole, Aunt Nicole, Aunt Nicole, we get it Ron, I am sick of this contrived relationship between Allie and Nicole.  Has Allie mentioned her twin, her little sister. How about her Aunts Billie, Carrie, Belle, who have been in her life since day 1, Billie is also her godmother. It is so annoying that Ron is making this Nicole/Allie bond like it is the greatest Aunt/Niece relationship ever.. Nicole needs to stay out of Allie's relationship with her mother, let them deal with their issues..Focus on your new husband and young daughter..

Go Eve, this is who she should have been and not her stupid rivalry with Jennifer.. Had Jennifer's uncle Mickey gotten Ben off for murdering her daughter, then her wanting to hurt Jack and Jennifer would have made sense.. I know in the end Ben will be deified and Eve will be tarred and feathered by the Salemites for daring to hurt the serial killer who tortured and killed her only daughter. I will enjoy the Ben/Eve scenes until the inevitable gnashing of teeth for Saint Ben..

Edited by Pearson80
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I actually liked Rob in his stint as Petey Cortlandt on AMC, but can't stand him here, not sure if it's writing or creative direction (or both). Ben's hoarse screaming today made me laugh every time and I don't think that was the intent...

 

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Will and Sonny seemed so bland today. It's like they are coworkers at the watercooler asking what they did on the weekend. Little Ari was cute and she still wants the puppy. I laughed at the bribe part and that she has learned that from her mommy. I really can't see them as parents at this point. Ari just shows up when it's convenient for them.

Aunt Nicole was meddling, but all the cards should be on the table when it comes to Allie making a massive life decision about her child. She has to know that Sami's previous behaviour would predict her current one. Actually, Rafe should have told her that her mom tried to influence him. Sami should not be running her adult daughter's life or telling her who should adopt the baby. It is what Sami wants. She also had no business having a go at Nicole in Nicole's own home.

So Ciara has to go to Rafe to get him to call Shane to see what happened to Orpheus? That should have been made known to the Salem PD - that he was moved to a federal prison.

Who is this Vincent person and who hired him to plant the bomb? He must be a pro because eventually there would be some leads on him. I did kinda enjoy him whipping Ben a bit. And why is Eve dressed like she is going out to a fancy restaurant or gala when she just drops in?

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1 hour ago, CanaryFan98 said:

Plus it would make Will seem interesting if he had done all this but the show wants their gay characters to be as bland as possible.

Considering all the negative reaction to his (admittedly surprising) friendship with Ben, I would say that the show has succeeded in making him non-bland. Blandness usually results in indifference.

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18 minutes ago, wurdalak said:

Considering all the negative reaction to his (admittedly surprising) friendship with Ben, I would say that the show has succeeded in making him non-bland. Blandness usually results in indifference.

Call me indifferent. But then again that predated to when Will was a child.

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22 minutes ago, nilyank said:

Call me indifferent. But then again that predated to when Will was a child.

I am on an island but I absolutely enjoyed Will as a child. Mophead Will was and still is my favorite incarnation of Will. He was a schemer like his parents but was not nefarious, I adored him scheming against EJ. I loved Will's maturity at his age, he got that from his Aunt Carrie.  He had Marlena's empathy down pat, he used to enjoy reading her psychology books and that used to scare Lucas due to his analysis of Sami. He could be a brat to Sami but she deserved it but he could also be tender and protective of her. He stood up to Kate trashing Sami to him. I loved his closeness with Kate and Roman.  He also looked like Lucas Austin Kate and Billie.  Whenever they were in scenes together, they looked like family.. Once he got recast, Will lost his complexity and became a weak passive character..I still loved him but I grieve for what could have been had his characterization remained consistent throughout the recasts over the years..

Edited by Pearson80
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When Ciara was browbeating-I-mean-talking to Rafe about Orpheus, and Rafe called Shane, didn't Ciara's reaction seem like she's forgotten Shane is her uncle?

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6 hours ago, wurdalak said:

The scene between Allie and Sami was so annoying. Everyone made such a big deal out of every single detail and blew everything out of proportion. Sami would have every right to express her opinion to Rafe, even though that previous encounter was written as her being her usual bullying "your only option is to do what I want" self, but Nicole and Allie treated it as if it were the biggest betrayal ever. It was also normal for Allie to be irritated by it, but the default mode for the writers seems to be explosive conflict when these characters get together instead of trying to settle matters through some form of civilised discussion, including setting some clear boundaries. Not that the writers would have Sami respect such rules.

And no one, including Kate and Lucas, considered the possibility that Rafe might have come to the exact same conclusion even without Sami's intervention. It's as if he has no mind of his own and her will cannot be resisted.

Meanwhile, Sonny and Will continue to gleefully plan the adoption, unaware of the drama that is about to explode in their faces and jeopardize their plans (because Allie is portrayed as fixated on Rafe as the best option).

Yes, it made perfect sense to me that Sami talked to Rafe about how inappropriate it was for him to consider adopting Allie's child. Sami should have just owned it and told everyone that she expressed her views to Rafe.  He still had the power to decide.

Allie is an immature brat, and she is supposedly approx 22 years old?  Not 16?  Good thing she is not raising this child.

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(edited)

I said it before but I blame Rafe for all this unnecessary drama. He was never interested in adopting Allie's baby and he should have told her that as soon as she mentioned it to him. There never should have been a scene where Sami had to tell him what a bad idea it was. Then  Rafe waits days before he tells Allie. Finally, when Nicole started on the whole Sami made you do it, he should have been clear and said that despite what Sami said to him, he was never going to adopt the baby.

But he didn't want to seem like the bad guy, he didn't want clear up any misunderstanding because he was a stupid lunkhead and despite what Allie has told him about her relationship with her mother and knowing how Nicole is, he dumbly makes it seem to Nicole that Sami managed to change his mind.

Dumbass.

Edited by nilyank
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Clyde took Ciara’s hands and told Ciara that she’s Ben Weston’s  wife now, and she’s responsible for his well-being. “You saved his life once before, you need to do it again,” Clyde said.

 

 

I think I am going to vommit !!!! 

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17 hours ago, boes said:

Question - and I don't mean this to be snarky or anything, but what would Claire be apologizing for?  If it's for all the horrendous stuff she did before she went to the facility, okay, but didn't she already do that?  If it's for things that have occurred since she got out, what did she do?

I meant the other way around.  Ciara apologize to Clair.  Typing while distracted error. 

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12 minutes ago, Rafael said:

How many kidnappings have we witnessed under Carlivati 's regime? 

1-2 per month..... I'd say somewhere around 20.

At least they didn't go to Kidnap Kabin.

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15 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

I kind of feel that way as well.  They're reminding me a bit of Luke and Noah on ATWT who were big partly because people really liked them but also probably, in part, because of what they represented in soapdom. I thought they lacked heat and I always felt there was potential for a better pairing for Luke out there so when Reid showed up, I was a goner.*

(*Both couples fell victim to the P&G curse on same-sex intimacy that @hypnotoad mentioned regarding GL's lesbian couple; although the ATWT couples were allowed to have kisses).

Even though Sonny is also the son of a supercouple, I see Will in the Luke role as we saw him grow up and his parents/grandparents have been more consistently relevant on the show. 

Basically, I'm not saying Sonny needs to go away but darnit, I would really love to see the next interloper be a serious love interest for Will.

Very few kids want a younger sibling but it's not exactly a life ruining event.  People eventually adjust to their existence even when they're annoying the beejeeesus out of them. (I'm looking at you, younger sis, and you thinking I agreed to things that convenience you.)

Or maybe she is another Lawrence? His response to getting little brother Forrest (John) was to plot his murder. 

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(edited)
21 hours ago, Sandman said:

At this point, I'd be happy with Martin Short and a budget drawn from the change in the couch cushions of the Kiriakis drawing room set.

I definitely feel there's something stilted about a lot of Sonny and Will's conversation -- I mean, a LOT of conversation on the show is pure exposition, but it seems greater than ever with them; like upwards of 80% of Sonny's and Will's purpose on the show is reporting on the activities of other characters -- to the point where the term "exposition fairy" occurred to me, but which seemed retrograde and cruel as well as the cheapest kind of on-the-nose.   

Posts like this make me proud of how well-spoken our little gang here is and slightly remorseful of how profane I've been lately. I'll try to choose my words better.

 

Now, Eve, if you would be so kind as to give me R S T L N E, I would like to solve!

🙄

After all these years of build-up, she gets less than 3 minutes of dialogue explaining why she wants Ben to suffer? And that's the dialogue? Boilerplate D-list generic horror movie revenge talk? Complete with pressing your face against your victim's head to invade their privacy bubble? I thought today was going to be her show. It was, but in a way I hadn't expected. I'm sorry my dear, but if you're trying to audition for the role of Phyllis in Follies, you should have gone through the door at the end of the hall...

And how nice of Robert Scott Wilson to try and upstage her during her big reveal scene by shouting over her. It's called sharing the stage, doofus. Show some respect. And stop sticking out your lips and looking like you want to have sex with everyone.

I love Gabi and Li and I hope they make out in front of Chad until he can't handle it anymore and gets in on the action. Threeway time! What? If the show's willing to do brainwashing over and over and over and over and over again, I don't think a threesome is that outrageous.

Bonus points if Abby walks in and sets herself on fire.

I liked Eric standing up for his wife, and I liked the way Allison is able to make me feel sorry for Sami.

Gwen needs to go. Like yesterday.

 

Edit: I always have to edit the autocorrect whenever I write the name Gabby. See? See how it spells it? And just for fun, since I need to vent about this inconvenience a little right now, let's take a look at how the names Ally, sunny and Sammy show up. See that? Yep. Every time I seem to manage to spell them correctly in a post...it's because I had to go back over my post and re-edit the whole thing and change them all manually. See how hard I work? Why couldn't this show use more traditional spellings? Oy.

Edited by DisneyBoy
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1 hour ago, DisneyBoy said:

Posts like this make me proud of how well-spoken our little gang here is and slightly remorseful of how profane I've been lately. I'll try to choose my words better.

Bonus points if Abby walks in and sets herself on fire.

 

DisneyBoy, don't you EVER change!  

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2 hours ago, DisneyBoy said:

I liked Eric standing up for his wife, and I liked the way Allison is able to make me feel sorry for Sami.

Isn't Allie short for Alice?

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1 hour ago, Katy M said:

Isn't Allie short for Alice?

.

1 hour ago, JBC344 said:

Yes, she is named after Alice Horton. Alice Caroline Horton. 

The actress who plays Sami. Is named. Alison. 

That was why he was commending “Alison”’s performance making him feel sympathy for the character Sami... I’m just guessing? 

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41 minutes ago, Petunia13 said:

The actress who plays Sami. Is named. Alison. 

That was why he was commending “Alison”’s performance making him feel sympathy for the character Sami... I’m just guessing? 

Of course, I'm so silly.  I love Alison Sweeney.  I have from day 1.

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So Eve Donovan is very much like the Spanish Inquisition, in that no one expects her.

Also similar to that renowned institution, she has set herself up as judge, jury and executioner. No wonder she was wearing an outfit whose color would truly suit a Cardinal of the Church.

Which means she was very quick to relinquish any possible claim to the high moral ground, planning to "balance" her daughter’s murder by killing someone who had nothing to do with that death, and using Ben as the instrument (I suppose she intends to deny him his meds, hoping that he will kill his wife while in a psychotic state).

That is certainly one way to make use of the Kiriakis money she inherited from her husband.

Ciara and Claire struck an interesting alliance. With each of them contributing half a brain, they might get somewhere the authorities won’t.

DiMera Enterprise is certainly a messily managed company. An ousted executive can still manipulate the agenda and communications of the CEO’s office to insert herself into an urgent negotiation, supposedly because she has knowledge no one else in the company has in Chad's absence? And who drew up the documents setting up the governance structure for the company; probably Justin considering the many absurd provisions like the CEO needing to be a DiMera, by blood or marriage, whether they possess the required skills or not. For a family that likes control so much, Stefano invested the board with a lot of power over the day-to-day leadership team and specifically over that CEO, who in effect turns out to be a DiMera in name only. Which becomes a problem when this power is exercised by a young turk like smarmy Chin Jr., who seems to be guided more by his gonads than by his brains and shuts off his critical thinking faculties when dealing with a "sultry" colleague like Gabi.

Predictably, Allie going into labor was only a pretext for the writers to insert another shouting match, with Sami once again trying to impose her will on everyone.

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I don't know what I liked more in today's episode:  Eve's coldly threatening Ben and his personal happiness or Claire's determination that she's going to hunt down the person who set her up.  If Claire had begged Ciara to forgive her or to give her another chance, I would have lost it--instead we had Ciara calling Claire back and the two of them deciding to team up.  I'm good with that because it seems like Claire has calmed down her Ciara worship and is instead focusing on clearing her own name--that's the Brady spirit 🙂

Allie chose Nicole as a coach to simply get back at her mom--damn cruel if you ask me.

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26 minutes ago, kitmerlot1213 said:

instead we had Ciara calling Claire back and the two of them deciding to team up. 

It is an interesting choice because it shows the two young female characters taking the initiative, together. For DOOL, that counts as major character development. Will it pan out or will they need a third-party savior to extract them from the danger they will necessarily run into?

28 minutes ago, kitmerlot1213 said:

Allie chose Nicole as a coach to simply get back at her mom--damn cruel if you ask me.

Also damn well deserved.

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Message added by scarynikki12

Spoilers are not allowed in this thread. Period. Any posts that include spoilers (and casting information qualifies) will be removed. There are several other threads that allow spoilers so take that discussion to one of them.

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