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S16.E05: Pornstar's Requiem


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That was sad. I think I may have seen steam coming out of Barba's ears and Fire coming out of his nose. I Don't imagine that he and that judge are going to be getting along from now on.

The actor that plays Carisi was made a regular alwful fast. Raúl Esparza (Barba) had to be in 11(?) episodes over the course of a full season before being made a regular.

Edited by Dot Com
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Barba is everything.

The episode was good up until that twist with the judge. Raul's acting was incredible but it was so unrealistic. It cheapened the show's message it felt like. If they have to stretch reality to make a point about reality, maybe they shouldn't be the ones handling it.

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I definitely enjoyed angry!Barba and Raúl was magnificent to watch, but I have to admit I was borderline laughing when the judge was suddenly like "Surprise!  I'm an evil dick for no reason!"  It was a pretty poorly-foreshadowed twist.

 

I do think Barba and Olivia's rapport continues to be one of the show's highlights.  They are great foils to each other in a lot of ways, but Mariska and Raúl always manage to emphasize clear mutual respect between the characters.

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This reminded me of the mothership episode where some boys gangraped a r******* girl, and the judge made McCoy prove they knew she was r*******, and he did, and the judge still set aside the verdict and let them go. The judge also blatantly violated the shield law by letting info about what she was wearing into the trial.

Back to this episode, I liked most of it but the end was obviously intended to make us think she was going to kill herself, and once they revealed she was going to do porn it was sad but it made her video not make any sense in retrospect. It would have been better if it was something about how everyone judging her for doing porn (while still watching it) is exactly what is making her have to do porn since she can no longer go to college.

I knew they would have some dark ending. I was expecting suicide, or for her to be raped again.

I looked up Belle Knox just now and it seems she has been harassed on campus but not expelled. Wikipedia says some professors have asked her to speak in their classes about being a sex worker.

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So is there some larger arc here regarding the team, including Barba, going against the Mayor and Deputy Chief of the SVU?  I got the feeling the Judge flipped due to the Mayor or some larger power having an influence here.  I'm thinking that Olivia is going to be knocked down a few pegs and her position will be jerked out from under her and given to somebody else.  I know she is having a hard time juggling work w/new motherhood, but this just seems a little much here.  Maybe this SVU squad has stepped on too many toes after 16 years, and now a big shakeup is coming.

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I'm thinking that Olivia is going to be knocked down a few pegs and her position will be jerked out from under her and given to somebody else. I know she is having a hard time juggling work w/new motherhood, but this just seems a little much here.

Olivia is a sergeant. She should remain a sergeant and be treated as such. What I mean is that she is a sergeant doing the job of a captain or a lieutenant. They need to have someone who is at least a lieutenant running the SVU department.

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I thought the episode was pretty solid. 

 

I was surprised Nick wasn't in the episode but I didn't really miss him. I wonder if the "supporting" players (i.e. everyone who's not Olivia) are going to be rotated in and out of episodes now that there's one more member of the squad. Or maybe Danny Pino was just busy. 

 

Glad the new guy is going to be sticking around though. His little smile when Olivia finally paid him a compliment was nice. I also liked when Deputy Jackass told her to bring her number 2 into her office and she picked Fin. He's the obvious choice seeing as he's the most senior detective on the squad behind Olivia, but he never seems to get the credit for it. That scene would have been more interesting if Nick was there though, because I could see him thinking he'd be Olivia's pick since he was her partner. 

 

I don't have a problem with the obvious tension between Olivia and Amanda, but I am curious as to where they're going with it. I hope their issues get addressed in a later episode and it's not just forgotten about. 

 

Barba's reaction to the judge overturning the conviction was a little over the top but I don't blame him. I was pissed just watching it and I saw it coming from the moment he told Evie not to worry about the defense asking the judge to set aside the verdict.    

 

The ending was surprisingly sad. Seeing Evie lose everything but her porn career and be forced to retreat further into it was a bummer. And Amanda wanting so desperately to save her from herself but being unable to was heartbreaking.

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Has Olivia signed papers in order to adopt Noah?  If not, why does she keep calling him her son?  That bugs me. Yeah, she's taking great care of him, but he's not her son - at least not yet.  I'm sure we've got a very special episode coming in which Noah will get adopted and be ripped from Olivia's arms.  Dear show, please spare us this melodrama.

 

I like Carisi and hope he sticks around. On the other hand, I hate Peter Gallagher's character.  His attitude is unnecessary.

Edited by ChitChat
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A lot of people call their foster kids 'son' or 'daughter' without any differentiation. I guess it makes for a more inclusive family environment. I don't think there's a problem with Olivia doing that, especially since adoption is her endgame and she wants to bond with the kid. Plus, here the kid is essentially an orphan, so it's not like his biological mother is going to come take him back.

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I can't believe the judge overturned the verdict. One boy admitted that it was rape (and that the other guy told him it was) and the other guy agreed that the description of what they had done would have been rape. I don't know how that wasn't enough evidence. Just because she had made violent porn videos in the past shouldn't mean anything. I was fuming as much as Barba was. The judge pretty much implied that you can't rape a porn star.

Do universities really have code of conducts about what you do in your private life? it's not like she was making the videos on campus.

I didn't miss Amaro at all. Actually, it wasn't until they showed the previews for next week did I even realize he was missing.

I don't like Peter Gallagher's character at all. He didn't even want the case to go to trial because she had starred in porn videos (even though the entire thing was caught on tape - so it should've been an open and shut case). And they way he walks around Olivia's office like he owns the place makes me want to smack him (who walks into somebody's office and just picks things up off of their desk??)

Olivia seems to have very little patience when it comes to Rollins. It seemed like she hesitated when choosing who her number 2 would be (although I though that that would have been something already known). Obviously Fin is the number 2. He's the most senior detective on the squad.

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I felt like there wasn't enough clear discussion of what exactly their defense was and what the judge's reasoning was. Were they saying that they believed that the girl did explicitly negotiate to film a fantasy scene with them, with an explicit agreement that her no didn't really mean no, and maybe some other safe word? And that she was lying about this agreement after the fact? Or, did they admit/believe that the girl made no such agreement, but say that the boys were still justified in raping her because of her videos?

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I guarantee you they're setting up that judge to have taken heat from Hudson University or the mayor's office, and that this won't be the last we hear of it (I also feel like something is up with the defense attorney too). JMI. 

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This reminded me of the mothership episode where some boys gangraped a r******* girl, and the judge made McCoy prove they knew she was r*******, and he did, and the judge still set aside the verdict and let them go. The judge also blatantly violated the shield law by letting info about what she was wearing into the trial.

Back to this episode, I liked most of it but the end was obviously intended to make us think she was going to kill herself, and once they revealed she was going to do porn it was sad but it made her video not make any sense in retrospect. It would have been better if it was something about how everyone judging her for doing porn (while still watching it) is exactly what is making her have to do porn since she can no longer go to college.

I knew they would have some dark ending. I was expecting suicide, or for her to be raped again.

I looked up Belle Knox just now and it seems she has been harassed on campus but not expelled. Wikipedia says some professors have asked her to speak in their classes about being a sex worker.

 

I think Evie actually deserved to be expelled (or atleast disciplined by the school). The dean said she was flashing her student ID in the porn films, and that probably is a breach of the student code.

 

I don't think Belle Knox ever advertised herself as a Duke student, people just figured it out cause guys who went to her school also watched tons of porn. 

Edited by Maximum Taco
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The judge throwing out the verdict would have been a little more believable if (a) both boys hadn't admitted they never made an agreement with her and (b) her acting in the porn wasn't so deliberately bad. If they could have made it mildly more nuanced, I'd buy it. 

 

Also the judge offered two possibilities for why she accused them. Neither was "because they really did rape you and unfortunately there isn't enough evidence." It seems ethics would require some acknowledgment that it may have really happened but it just can't be proven. Maybe that's just wishful thinking on my part. (And of course I don't look to SVU for legal verisimilitude)

Edited by gesundheit
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I felt like there wasn't enough clear discussion of what exactly their defense was and what the judge's reasoning was. Were they saying that they believed that the girl did explicitly negotiate to film a fantasy scene with them, with an explicit agreement that her no didn't really mean no, and maybe some other safe word? And that she was lying about this agreement after the fact? Or, did they admit/believe that the girl made no such agreement, but say that the boys were still justified in raping her because of her videos?

I'm pretty sure that they were just saying that in all of her videos she said no but didn't mean it, so how were they to know that she meant it this time. Even the judge seemed to say that he didn't understand that the guys were supposed to know that no meant no when the videos said the opposite.

I can't believe that a judge couldn't see the difference between the two. It would have been slightly more believable if the two guys that raped her were also the two that had 'starred' in movies with her (and even this would still be rape). But considering they had never had any interactions with her before, I don't know how they could compare her videos to them raping her.

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I felt like this was pretty solid episode. Well acted. Decent writing with the exception of the character's motivation. The biggest problem is with the big picture. They really need to do something with that chief. I just don't find him believable and the lack of nuance or humanity is grating. How is the audience supposed to react when he is supposed to fill Cragen's shoes as the voice of reason/realism? Like the speech at the end about not making policy. If they were to humanize him a little bit or show him as having some other concern than being an old skool kop knuckle dragger it would be a little more watchable. I really think they'd be better off with a new CO instead.

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I was unimpressed with this episode. I think Hannah Marks did great as Evie and I really felt for her but nah I was disappointed.

 

I loved seeing Scanavino in the credits though, and he got the most awesome shot. & angry Barba was fun to watch. Part of me wanted him to be held in contempt though.

 

There were a lot of things I missed though. I don't mind a character being absent but I need some sort of explanation why. It's not like this case was over and done with within a day or two so was Nick away for week/s? Fin was missing in a previous episode and he'll be missing in the upcoming one again. I need that explained writers! After watching last weeks episode for about the fifth time I caught Benson saying Carisi was blocking of the street so at least they pretended he was around.

 

And I really don't like bad boss Benson. Seeing Carisi get so proud for a compliment made me think of Rollins back in the day when Liv gave her cred that one time and she looked happier than a kid in a candy store sitting there at her desk all proud. And look at her now, Liv being snippy at her every chance she gets. 

I wish Liv could've at least mentioned something about what Rollins went through the last ep, or checked in with her after she had that kid's blood splattered all over her face, oh no right she didn't know that cause she took of sprinting to her 'son' as soon as the kid was shot. Okay getting agitated, take a breath.

 

Bring on the Halloween special, surely a ghost story can lighten up my day right?

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A lot of people call their foster kids 'son' or 'daughter' without any differentiation. I guess it makes for a more inclusive family environment. I don't think there's a problem with Olivia doing that, especially since adoption is her endgame and she wants to bond with the kid. Plus, here the kid is essentially an orphan, so it's not like his biological mother is going to come take him back.

Yes I am a little surprised at the reaction to her calling Noah her son; would it somehow be more palatable if she referred to him as foster son? She has all the responsibility of a parent and like you said adoption is the end-game, it is the natural progression especially in a foster to adopt situation. I have five kids none of whom I am biologically related to and seeing, ''her son'' in quotes leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

Other than that, Carisi sounded more Stabler-like than ever in this episode; I don't know if it's his natural cadence or he is binge watching on USA but this is the first episode I really picked up on it.

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Olivia is a sergeant. She should remain a sergeant and be treated as such. What I mean is that she is a sergeant doing the job of a captain or a lieutenant. They need to have someone who is at least a lieutenant running the SVU department.

DONAL LOGUE! DONAL LOGUE! DONAL LOGUE!

I know, he's in something else now ... but he needs to leave that and come back to beat Our SVU into shape again.

 

Still want Carisi and Peter Gallagher [can't be bothered to learn his name] to go away.

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angry Barba was fun to watch. Part of me wanted him to be held in contempt though.

ALL of me wanted him to be held in contempt. It would have been fun and interesting to see. I kept saying to the TV "Barba don't push it or you'll be thrown in jail". Then the judge threatened him with contempt and I was hoping it would happen.

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Oddly enough something similar happened at my college, Santa Clara University, back in the 90's.  SCU is a small Jesuit (Catholic) university and some of the frats found out one of the female students had done some porn, back before internet porn.  Her videos were passed around, she was slut shamed.  I was actually surprised by how well the administration handled it. The school did not expel her, the frats were warned (there were only 5 on campus) but by then it was too late, she dropped out.  Some of the administration even tried to convince her to come back.  

 

I can't imagine how bad it would have been if it happened today, with the internet, facebook and all other social media.  

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The judge was so stop disrespecting is girl all the way through and then he suddenly decided to scorn her? Wtf?

I know. The judge changing his entire persona at the end just made no sense at all. It ruined the storyline IMO. The SVU writers made a bad call with that one.

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"The Honorable Bruce Van Exel from Judging Amy"

Yes! His voice was so familar; comfirmed with IMDB. Nice bit of ironic casting.

 

I recognized him right off. I just kept thinking, "Bruce, man! What would Judge Gray say about this? Maxine is going to tear you a new one for this too!"

 

(I loved Judging Amy.)

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I know. The judge changing his entire persona at the end just made no sense at all. It ruined the storyline IMO. The SVU writers made a bad call with that one.

To be honest I didn't think the rapist defense made much sense at all, other than in some sort of slut shaming jury nullification way. At best it was "my buddy said she totally agreed to get raped in a bathroom at a party" at worst it was "but she pretended to get raped in a movie so I thought I could just lock her in a bathroom and rape her again. No? So I shouldn't call Jodie Foster either?" Im surprised Barba didn't just ask them to prove their defense and then snicker when they couldn't. Ok so you say you thought you were making a porn movie? Ok, show me a contract, an email where she agrees, a script, proof she accepted payment. Anything to show you had a reasonable belief that this was a consensual act of commerce or art. No? You can't? And you clearly heard her say stop? Then you my friend, go straight to jail.

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So is there some larger arc here regarding the team, including Barba, going against the Mayor and Deputy Chief of the SVU?  I got the feeling the Judge flipped due to the Mayor or some larger power having an influence here.  I'm thinking that Olivia is going to be knocked down a few pegs and her position will be jerked out from under her and given to somebody else.  I know she is having a hard time juggling work w/new motherhood, but this just seems a little much here.  Maybe this SVU squad has stepped on too many toes after 16 years, and now a big shakeup is coming.

The Deputy Chief's comments at the end about if Benson wanted change go into politics, otherwise be a cop, made me wonder if they aren't setting up Benson getting into politics.

 

I loved Barba when the judge overturned the verdict. He looked ready to hit someone!

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I also love that Scanavino is in the opening credits. I wouldn't be too mad if Amaro wasn't a character anymore and Scanavino took his place. I thar he and Barba are my favorite characters.

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ALL of me wanted him to be held in contempt. It would have been fun and interesting to see. I kept saying to the TV "Barba don't push it or you'll be thrown in jail". Then the judge threatened him with contempt and I was hoping it would happen.

I wanted this to happen, too! One of my all time favorite Law & Order scenes is where Jack McCoy gets thrown into jail for contempt and Adam Schiff had to bail him out. I guess it wouldn't have fit the tone of this episode for a humorous scene like that, but I would have loved it if Olivia had to come and bail Barba out of jail.

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A lot of people call their foster kids 'son' or 'daughter' without any differentiation. I guess it makes for a more inclusive family environment. I don't think there's a problem with Olivia doing that, especially since adoption is her endgame and she wants to bond with the kid.

 

I understand that about foster parents, and I certainly didn't mean to offend anybody, but it wasn't clear to me that Olivia is actively pursuing adoption.  So I think that in order to spare herself the grief if the child is adopted by someone else (which I thought was the endgame,) then maybe she shouldn't get so attached. The judge asked her to take Noah, not the other way around, so her intentions thus far was unclear to me.   She's only had him a few weeks, so I thought it was a little soon to be referring to him as her son.  She can call him by his name. The squad will know who she's talking about.  YMMV.

Edited by ChitChat
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Dear lord, Olivia was a self-righteous ass in the beginning of his episode, wasn't she? I didn't even care that most of the time she was right, I really didn't care for how pompous she was, especially towards the people on her own team. To Peter Gallaghers character, I get, but how she acted (especially in the front half of the episode) towards Rollins, Finn, Barba and Carisi was pretty inexcusable.

That ending was just mind boggling, and didn't align with how the judge was acting during the rest of the trial. I was half expecting for us to get another 10 minutes where Barba would appeal to a higher court and the judge would get censured. But then I realized it was the very end of the episode, so that wouldn't happen.

I did like seeing Delany Williams again. I don't always love the character, but I've loved the actor since The Wire.

I am beyond thrilled that Carisi is part of the main cast. I will find it odd if they continue to rotate out a cast member a week though. I wonder if this episode was supposed to air earlier in the season before Amaro was back on the squad, and before Rollins had someone shot in front of her.

Edited by Princess Sparkle
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That ending was just mind boggling, and didn't align with how the judge was acting during the rest of the trial.

 

I know.  Between this and that long ago Law and Order episode, who knew that NYC judges felt so free to offer lectures on morality as their reason to overturn a verdict.  And I can't even start with the ridiculous Hudson University expulsion.  That place is already the rape and murder capital of New York City.   I can't believe they would buy themselves what would likely be an avalanche of bad publicity by expelling the rape victim. 

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I know.  Between this and that long ago Law and Order episode, who knew that NYC judges felt so free to offer lectures on morality as their reason to overturn a verdict.  And I can't even start with the ridiculous Hudson University expulsion.  That place is already the rape and murder capital of New York City.   I can't believe they would buy themselves what would likely be an avalanche of bad publicity by expelling the rape victim. 

 

The L&O franchise has convinced me that Hudson University is clearly a portal to hell disguised as an institution of higher learning.

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She's only had him a few weeks, so I thought it was a little soon to be referring to him as her son. She can call him by his name. The squad will know who she's talking about. YMMV.

The opening scene of the first episode of the season has Olivia putting Noah to bed. She's talking to him about his mother and she flashes back to his mother including her death and the judge giving Noah to Olivia. At the beginning of the flashback it says on the screen 'four months earlier'. So she already had Noah for four months when this season started.

Edited by Dot Com
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See if their defense was that they had an explicit agreement with her and she went back on it after the fact and accused them for some other reason, then maybe the judge setting it aside would have been more believable. But they both admitted they had no agreement with her. And I didn't get why the guy who didn't take a deal would take the stand and admit that. Why not at least claim she had consented and agreed to put on an act before the camera started rolling? He could have just lied and said "we told her we saw her porn and asked if she'd do the same thing with us and she said ok and then we turned on the camera". That might have seemed like reasonable doubt if they both said it. Instead they both admitted no such thing happened and yet somehow got away with it?

Edited by LeGrandElephant
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Re: Olivia calling Noah her son. It's the first time she's done that right? Or we heard it at least. I took it as she only said it to Dodds so she wouldn't have to go in to the messier parts, so she wouldn't have to explain it all. Olivia, to me, is a very cautious character and I'm pretty sure she's still fearing this kid won't be around for the reminder of her life (sorta like Calvin). I'm pretty sure her end game is to adopt him even if she mentally doesn't dare to go there just yet.

I do hope she gets to keep him and that she's a better mom to him than she'll probably ever be to the squad. There's no sign of mamaBear at SVU that's for sure.

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Re: Olivia calling Noah her son. It's the first time she's done that right? Or we heard it at least. I took it as she only said it to Dodds so she wouldn't have to go in to the messier parts, so she wouldn't have to explain it all. Olivia, to me, is a very cautious character and I'm pretty sure she's still fearing this kid won't be around for the reminder of her life (sorta like Calvin). I'm pretty sure her end game is to adopt him even if she mentally doesn't dare to go there just yet.

I do hope she gets to keep him and that she's a better mom to him than she'll probably ever be to the squad. There's no sign of mamaBear at SVU that's for sure.

 

It's not the first time actually. She referred to him as her son in the first episode of the season. When the playground gets shot up and she comes rushing to the scene, she says something along the lines of, "my son is in there" when she's making her way through the crowd. She also referred to herself as "mommy" in the episode where he was sick, I believe. So I don't think her using the term son was for Dodd's benefit, I think it's simply because she sees him as her son and has the intention of adopting him. Obviously things may not work out and it'd certainly be understandable if she was wary of getting attached because of what happened with Calvin, but that situation was entirely different, Calvin had family and adoption was never on the table with him. Noah had no one before Olivia, and when the judge suggested Olivia take custody of Noah she explicitly said that at the end of the year, she'd be given the option to adopt him. So Olivia has every right to think of him as her son, and her referring to him as such only goes to show that she already made up her mind as to what she wants to do at the end of the year long trial period. 

Edited by Everleigh
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I'm just not interested in the storyline of Liv becoming a Mom.  YMMV.  I think of the show Everybody Loves Raymond and how he said "the show is not about the kids."  That's why they weren't shown much.  That's how I feel about Law & Order.  It's not about Liv's kid!  I don't mind the occasional reference to him, but I hope they don't make the baby central to the storyline too often.  And no, I don't hate kids.  :)

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I'm just not interested in the storyline of Liv becoming a Mom.  YMMV.  I think of the show Everybody Loves Raymond and how he said "the show is not about the kids."  That's why they weren't shown much.  That's how I feel about Law & Order.  It's not about Liv's kid!  I don't mind the occasional reference to him, but I hope they don't make the baby central to the storyline too often.  And no, I don't hate kids.  :)

 

Yeah, but as I've said before, kids added to a show almost always means a show is running on fumes. At 16 seasons in - and with more and more episodes becoming sensationalistic "ripped from the headlines" in tone - I see why TPTB do it since they seemed to have run out of any fresh ideas ages ago.

 

Not to be mean, but if this is all that's left, then SVU should have been done last year as it almost was.

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I thought this was a good episode and did not see the judge's decision coming.  Very, very disappointing.

 

Agree with the other posters who said it would have made more sense if the case became a "he said/she said" as a lot of rape cases are.   Clearly the guy who took the stand was a cocky little shit and I could see him lying about what really went down versus admitting that they never had Evie's consent or believed they were filming a video. 

 

I did love seeing Barba riled and Carisi has grown on me. 

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I don't like Peter Gallagher's character at all. He didn't even want the case to go to trial because she had starred in porn videos (even though the entire thing was caught on tape - so it should've been an open and shut case). And they way he walks around Olivia's office like he owns the place makes me want to smack him (who walks into somebody's office and just picks things up off of their desk??)

 

 

Seriously! I said "PUT THAT DOWN ASSHOLE" out loud. Why are they making him such a colossal ass? He might as well have snagged Carisi's mustache so he could twirl it during his scenes. 

 

What was up with the secret cabal amongst Hudson, the mayor and the NYPD? Is there some nefarious plot afoot to shut down SVU?

Edited by Snookums
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I totally agree with you @ChitChat . Me not even reflecting on the fact Liv has called Noah her son before just proves how uninterested I am in that storyline, I usually take note of small details like that but when it comes to Noah I could care less. The only thing I care about is that he has the potential to make Liv a fun character to watch again, if she's happy at home she might be a better boss at SVU. If she's satisfied at home she might be that considerate colleague & partner she was in the beginning of SVU. But so far he's only making her even grumpier and stressed out. But I'm still hopeful Noah could be the happy pill Liv is in desperate need of.

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Agreed with whoever noted that the judge seemed to be doing a 180 compared to how he acted during the trial. I'll be very disappointed if this doesn't show up again/isn't actually part of a larger corruption storyline.

Overall, I have to say, I've been rather liking this season so far. I normally hate kids on tv shows, but IMO give me Benson struggling with working mom issues over melodramatic serial rapist issues any day. (I reserve to right to take it all back if/once they do a melodramatic "Noah is taken from Benson" story)

I have the faint hope that Benson being put in charge and acting a bit more like it will open some more avenues for storylines, maybe a bit more on the court/politics side.

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