S13.E08: The Rainway

[Shibori]

Dear Heidi, unless you can sit behind that TV and still see the picture, at best you're getting a 180 degree experience, not 360.

I think this season should be subtitled "The Emperor's New Clothes." It has to be disheartening to the designers to see Amanda and Sandaya's designs applauded week after week with all the nonsense they've produced. And both have a raging case of special snowflake syndrome. I'd love to see one of the designers stand up to the judges and say, I understand if *I* didn't win, but if that crap is what you're looking for, I'm not wasting my time. I'll just cover my model in tape and have her roll around in the kids section of the dollar store.

I'd have had everlasting love for Fade if he'd sent his model out in a black turtleneck and leggings as a tribute to Mike Myers' Dieter from Sprockets. THAT would have been more avant garde than what he made.

Edited September 13, 2014 by Shibori

[Oldernowiser]

I think this season should be subtitled "The Emperor's New Clothes." It has to be disheartening to the designers to see Amanda and Sandaya's designs applauded week after week with all the nonsense they've produced. And both have a raging case of special snowflake syndrome. I'd love to see one of the designers stand up to the judges and say, I understand if *I* didn't win, but if that crap is what you're looking for, I'm not wasting my time. I'll just cover my model in tape and have her roll around in the kids section of the dollar store.

I'm wondering if that isn't what happened with Fade. It must have become rather clear that the winner is pre-selected so why the hell bother.

ETA: I keep waiting in vain for Nina to haul out her usual "It's not even PRETTY" criticism, because no season has ever deserved it more. But nothing.

Edited September 13, 2014 by Oldernowiser

[Tony]

I'm fine with both winners, but Sandhya's dress was the worst design I've seen this season. The judges should have their brains checked for putting that on the top. It was basically a clown outfit with pinwheels and ruffles attached to it. On top of all that it was muu-muu shaped and a weird length (and army boots?!). She deserved instant ridicule and auffing for sending that on the runway.

 

ETA: And holy fuck is she ever full of herself.

Edited September 13, 2014 by Tony

[mansonlamps]

I thought Heidi was very dismissive of Fade when he was auf'd and said "maybe we'll meet again" or something similar to her. Maybe he should have attempted to bond with her earlier when she kept trying to communicate with him in German?

[Calamity Jane]

Mansonlamps, I had the very same thought about Heidi's response. Surprisingly cool, it seemed to me.

[Bosman]

Really disagree with Sean's win. As gimmicks go, it was pretty cool, if not very original. But at the end of it, he was left with a very basic dress that looked like some popsicles had melted all over it. It was a mess.

I really wish Amanda would just SHUT UP. She's a dolt who obviously knows zilch about Cleopatra, or Egypt. Though I suppose hers was the most avant garde if you consider avant garde putting together colors in a design to incite nausea. Oh, and it fell apart. But pass her through because...well why not.

This season is just dreck piled on more dreck.

[Maya]

I thought Fade came across as kind of a creepy weirdo this week. I think he's more lovable in small doses.

[Funzlerks]

Santino's lingerie fiasco has been brought up a few times. I didn't think it quite was as awful as the judges did. Nina screamed at him. It's just aesthetically not pleasing!!! Well, I agreed with that and her diatribe was epic. Kors, bless him, acted like Santino sent maggoty garbage down the runway.

So, they did not praise him, make him top three, and seem to be afraid to offer the slightest bit of criticism. And I would rather look like a sexy Deutsch deer in a 30s glockenspiel inspired brothel than whatever Sandhya created. Sometimes it hasn't been done before because it is just a bad idea. Maybe McQueen thought one day, hmm I should make a shapeless, giant culotte romper striped in all the colors of a big-top circus tent and ... no, there is something more. I will haphazardly festoon a clear, ill-fitting rain shawl with plasticky faux-metal pinwheels. Then he decided to do aesthetically pleasing things that still resonate in the fashion world.

Though, I bet if you went to enough Juggalo conventions you could find someone who created it before. And there was nothing apparently curve-related in the design, and nobody cared.

[Gumby]

Well -  I HAVE heard in the tents that le mode d'Juggaleaux will be verrrrrry strong for Spring '15.

Edited September 13, 2014 by Gumby

[RedheadZombie]

I don't get Fade's thought process.  He quickly whips out a boring black dress, then proceeds to spend the next two days hunched on a stool, moving the play symbol a fraction of an inch in every direction.  What did he think was avant-garde about it?  The squiggly lines that he glued to the dress?  What was he thinking when he saw the other designers working long and hard?  Did he really think that he was so brilliant and the others were missing the mark?  He went home because the judges hate boring more than they hate bad.

 

I agree Heidi was a little off to Fade.  I've never seen an air kiss fall that short of the mark.

 

It was fun watching Sean's dress turn colors, but I don't think he should have won.  The basic white dress was ugly, and if the model hadn't lollygagged her way down the runway, the gimmick wouldn't have even worked.  I don't think the dye created a pleasing look - it was too random.  To be charitable, I'll call his dress performance art.

[Kromm]

To quote Mugatu from Zoolander, I feel like I'm taking crazy pills! What does Sandhya have on the judges that they keep putting her in the top? I do not understand her designs at all. I'm going to miss Fade and while I like Char, I wish Tim had saved his 'Tim Gunn Save' for Fade.

Once again Sandhya can put any old garbage on the Runway (sorry, "Rainway") and get in the Top.

If I roll my eyes any more, they'll be in danger of falling out.

Also, I'm beginning to actually feel sorry for Korina, in a way, as obnoxious as she is. She's said all those negative thing about Sandhya's desigms, there's no denying, but you can tell that she was probably asked for her reactions about EACH dress of each runway and probably went into detail about all of them. And the comments about Sandhya were cherry-picked in a manner to make it sound like Korina is obsessed only with her. Not that it recommends Korina that much, but I bet she slammed plenty of other dress designs we didn't hear clips about, simply because they wanted to hoard her Talking Head time and point most of it towards her Sandhya comments.

I'm fine with both winners, but Sandhya's dress was the worst design I've seen this season. The judges should have their brains checked for putting that on the top. It was basically a clown outfit with pinwheels and ruffles attached to it. On top of all that it was muu-muu shaped and a weird length (and army boots?!). She deserved instant ridicule and auffing for sending that on the runway.

 

ETA: And holy fuck is she ever full of herself.

True. But because she planted a "poor me" storyline in the face of the editors early on, and because Korina and a few others gave such juicy soundbites railing against her looks, and because the show has taken shit over not properly supporting ethnic looks, they've made her out to be a hero instead of the zero she actually seems to be.

While Tim is part of the production team, I still think that he doesn't have much choice about the "Tim Gunn Save"

 

My personal feeling is that they wanted him to use it earlier in the season- before it could really matter and before he could use it on someone who actually deserved it. Fade hasn't made a ton of completely amazing stuff, but a lot of his work has been interesting or at least finished. Char hasn't done anything all that interesting for the whole season... but this reeks of manipulation to me.

 

They like the idea of the Tim Gunn Save, but they've turned it into a joke because they don't want the judges to ever be "wrong".

Char is mediocre. Fade at least has a point of view and some potential, even if he does occasional veer into being a parody of the German Avant Garde designer (who oddly enough this week hardly seemed to know what Avante Garde is, admittedly).

Really the Tim Gunn save was wasted on Char and would have been much better spent on Fade this week, for sure.

[Kromm]

And... I just saw the preview for next week. You can tell that Sandhya AGAIN goes the Poor Me/People are Picking On Me route.

[Nonlinear]

Didn't McQueen do something like what Sean did on the runway? I think McQueen had robots shoot colour at the models as they came down the runway in a white dress. Sean's dress is also very very simple. Surprised Fade was picked on for this and not Sean.

Edited September 13, 2014 by Nonlinear

[RealityGal]

I don't get Fade's thought process.  He quickly whips out a boring black dress, then proceeds to spend the next two days hunched on a stool, moving the play symbol a fraction of an inch in every direction.  What did he think was avant-garde about it?  The squiggly lines that he glued to the dress?  What was he thinking when he saw the other designers working long and hard?  Did he really think that he was so brilliant and the others were missing the mark?  He went home because the judges hate boring more than they hate bad.

 

I agree Heidi was a little off to Fade.  I've never seen an air kiss fall that short of the mark.

 

It was fun watching Sean's dress turn colors, but I don't think he should have won.  The basic white dress was ugly, and if the model hadn't lollygagged her way down the runway, the gimmick wouldn't have even worked.  I don't think the dye created a pleasing look - it was too random.  To be charitable, I'll call his dress performance art.

 

You know, I found Fade's idea interesting.  And I think if he had been just a little more elaborate with it it might have worked.  I think the whole nod to technology with the circuit board, the play button and the rewind could have been interesting.  Because samsung has such new and innovative technology (according to the storyline of the show), his play button and rewind button with the circuit board design could have looked like a nod to earlier "cutting edge" technology, like when the walkman first came out, and we were all amped that we could rewind AND fast forward that tape.  The problem was, the dress was so simple, and by simple, it was simple.  There was none of the pattern play he had which made his other outfits so interesting.  If he had made the simple dress into more of a gown and worked in the play button in front, rewind button in back and the circuit board design in the dress (and maybe use a nice solid color for the dress) it could have looked like what his girl would look like going to a gala or to a ball.  

[RealityGal]

Can anyone tell me where I can find the preview for the next episode?  I can't find it anywhere on Lifetime's page, and I'm about to lose my temper.

 

ETA: I found the preview, but it didn't show Shandaya going whiny

 

ETAA: okay, saw the preview with Shandaya going whiny

Edited September 13, 2014 by RealityGal

[slensam]

When I saw Sandyha's creation come down the runway and Heidi's reaction I knew it was going to be in the top three. And when the runway was over I pegged it at third. It's like the Patricia thing again. I liked Patricia though. Sandyha definitely knows how to play this game at all angles. It's the lack of humility that gets me. There are so many artists who acknowledge those who came before them. Martin Scorsese constantly references the directors who have influenced him. Kurt Cobain openly stated that "Smells Like Teen Spirit" was a ripoff of the Pixies. Most of Rock music is built on the blues. This is nothing new. She dissed all these other designers to their faces and next week apparently she asks for compassion for herself. Priceless self-awareness!

[millennium]

I think Fade was tremendously dispirited—and entirely justifiably—by the lack of recognition his great designs got from the judges. I thought he made elegant, beautiful, sophisticated, and, yes, thoughtful clothes. I would've given up too. How confusing it must have been to see his work dismissed so easily as middle tier, when inferior designers got accolades. Go, Fade, go like the wind....somewhere where your excellence is appreciated and rewarded.

Fade left no memorable impression on me.  I always placed him in the safe zone, figuring he'd break out once some of the minor characters had left the workroom. 

 

As a competitive type myself, I can't imagine how he'll make peace with being sent home while individuals with significantly less talent continue on in the competition (Korina, Amanda, Alexander, etc).   

 

Question for Korina: if your win the previous week proved that you "deserve to be here," what does your performance this week prove?

[English Teacher]

Regarding an individual who wins fan favorite every week, it is funny that we seldom comment on Alexander aside from his open mouth, dazed look. It is almost as though the FF is producer driven as well. But that would NEVER happen, right?

[KimberStormer]

The ads were crashing my computer so I only saw part of the show.  I didn't even know who won and who lost till I came on here.  Now I sort of want to go back and see one last bit of Heidi speaking German.  But it will probably just crash my computer again, since if you skip ahead it plays a zillion more ads.

 

Anyway.  I thought Sean's was the clear winner.  Kini, well, I've seen that skirt before.  I wish I could remember where.  (Not Leanne.)  But literally that same umbrella skirt.  From the 60s? 70s? I forget, but I've seen it.  And the bondage vibe, boring.  Sean's was a different kind of thing.  To me, the fact that it was a simple white dress was the whole reason it worked--like Zac said, you think "what is this basic white dress for an avant-garde challenge?" and then she walks into the rain and you find out.  And yes, before and after the runway show, it's not very special--but that doesn't matter, it was designed for one specific moment, a few seconds in time when the dress was magic.  I thought it was quite a moment.  A coup de theatre rather than design, perhaps, but with the 'rainway' it was inherently more theatrical than fashiony anyway.  Of course avant-garde is a meaningless term on PR, but Sean's did remind me conceptually of some really avant-garde fashion concepts, which also required precise timing and were more theater than clothes--that McQueen thing, and also those amazing/gross Margiela dresses which were "dyed" by growing bacteria on them, and had to be kept warm and moist for that to work.  Sean's was not shocking and terrifying the way McQueen's robot arms and Margiela's bacteria were, but still, it was super-cool and exciting.

 

I actually kind of liked Amanda's too.  Falling apart is never good, but I don't see it as disqualifying either, and never have.  Anyway Amanda's was weird enough to interest me. 

 

Fade specifically said at the beginning "I'm excited about the Avant Garde challenge...I would call many of my own pieces Avant Garde".    I still don't understand why this particular challenge crushed him so utterly.  

 

I guess he was just not into the challenge.  Avant-garde yes, Samsung and rainway no.  I was hoping for something super-cerebral from him, but it didn't really happen, and the sell-out factor might have been a big part of it.  Tim Gunn's old-tyme-radio-style advertisement in the middle of the show was pretty painful to me at home only half paying attention; to be stuck in the seats listening to it must have been excruciating. 

 

No, I was thinking of Leanne Marshall. Her designs were not as structured as Kini's but the same design just turned upside down.

 

I guess it's a question of creativity VS skills--oh wait, no, Leanne had amazing skills.  Nope, Kini is not fit to kiss her sensible flats.  It makes me actually think that it's a shame someone like Kenley didn't wait for a later season--Kenley could sew the hell out of something too, and I think she is way more creative than Kini on his best day.  She would dominate a season like this.  A lot of the early designers would, really.

[RedheadZombie]

Yup, S/S 1999.

I tried to watch this with a straight face, but it's just an example of how pretentious the fashion industry can be. In part, it was the comical "acting" by the model, especially when she totters off post-assault. I found myself giggling rather than awed.

[PepperMonkey]

I'm mostly over the whole "fashion designer as artist" shtick in which a few special snowflakes participate on PR. Fashion CAN be art, but is not intrinsically art. It's clothes, people; covering for our bodies cause we don't wear fig leaves anymore and it's cold in some states. Also, it's illegal to be nude in public, still, except in New York, I guess?

Anyway, if you're an artist, and you don't really care if your stuff is wearable, then go BE an artist and leave the fashion design to innovators who DO care if someone looks stupid or not wearing their rainbow brite jumpsuit with pinwheel overcoat. Go make art and die penniless like Van Gogh, or be a fashion designer and realize that there's commerce involved and people have to like and want to wear your stuff enough to buy it, or you're the tree falling in the woods that no one hears because no one's around.

[Oldernowiser]

Amen.

Pretty much every REAL artist I know (as in, makes a living creating something beautiful or interesting or useful and often all three), never calls himself or herself An Artist. I've heard painter, sculptor, craftsman, metallist, photographer, but never ARTIST.

To me, it's the mark of the pretentious wannabe.

[Julia]

You know, in retrospect, between Sandhya who gets others sent home being stroked for another costumey mess and Amanda's in no way inspired by Cleopatra weirdness (do you suppose she skipped history the day they explained that the egyptian agrarian economy was based on flooding?), this episode is giving me flashbacks of Asha from Under the Gunn. I'm almost feeling bad for Tim. It seems this is the show his production company really wants to make, and he was unfortunate enough to be the one who got to roll it out.

 

I just really don't think your show is going to generate watercooler buzz if people are embarassed to tell their coworkers they watch it.

Edited September 13, 2014 by Julia

[Day2Day]

Kromm,    Your post made me LOL, and I totally agree with you.....

  !!!!

[terrymct]

I'm wondering if that isn't what happened with Fade. It must have become rather clear that the winner is pre-selected so why the hell bother.

I was really rooting for Fade, but he had two rough weeks in a row. From what he said, the contest was draining him. He should have thrived in an avant garde competition, but didn't. His outfit was actually kind of sad this week, just like he was. That said, Korina should have gone home instead of him but had immunity. I think Amanda should has been auff'ed for that ugly, ill fitting, and poorly made monstrosity she sent down the runway. I don't think there's a fix in, but I do think that Amanda is an undeserved favorite of the judges. She'll go soon, once all the week to middling contestants are gone. Char and Korina should be the next two.

[Beden]

 

Fade left no memorable impression on me.  I always placed him in the safe zone, figuring he'd break out once some of the minor characters had left the workroom.

 

As a competitive type myself, I can't imagine how he'll make peace with being sent home while individuals with significantly less talent continue on in the competition (Korina, Amanda, Alexander, etc).

I have to agree with you here. I've nothing against Fade and accept that he's a talented man but the simple facts are that this show is, at least on the surface, a competition, not an anointment. While I don't think he necessarily believed anyone would be falling at his feet (unlike a few of the other contestants), he didn't always bring it. It seemed to me that his designs were good, wearable and likely well made. He didn't always address the challenges, especially in the last which got him gone. Would I have sent him home for what he did compared with some of the other complete crap sent down (I'm looking at you Amanda)? No, I wouldn't but equally what he produced didn't answer the problem they were to solve.

 

Life isn't fair. The world of fashion (or any art or any part of life if you want to come down to it) isn't fair. If that's too hard for you, find another career. Harsh? Sure. True? Yup.

 

 

Pretty much every REAL artist I know (as in, makes a living creating something beautiful or interesting or useful and often all three), never calls himself or herself An Artist. I've heard painter, sculptor, craftsman, metallist, photographer, but never ARTIST.

To me, it's the mark of the pretentious wannabe.

Thank you and seconded. I spent 30+ years making my living as a professional designer and did just fine, thank you. Do I think I have some talent? Yes. Do I think I'm an 'artist'? Maybe once in a while I may hit the heights but I know too many people who can design circles around me and I know it. As my grandfather was fond of saying; 'There's always (ALWAYS) someone worse than you and there's always someone better and if you're smart you'll keep that in mind'. Papa was a smart guy. And right. I never forgot that.

[designing1]

 

You know, I found Fade's idea interesting.  And I think if he had been just a little more elaborate with it it might have worked.  I think the whole nod to technology with the circuit board, the play button and the rewind could have been interesting.  Because samsung has such new and innovative technology (according to the storyline of the show), his play button and rewind button with the circuit board design could have looked like a nod to earlier "cutting edge" technology, like when the walkman first came out, and we were all amped that we could rewind AND fast forward that tape.  The problem was, the dress was so simple, and by simple, it was simple.  There was none of the pattern play he had which made his other outfits so interesting.  If he had made the simple dress into more of a gown and worked in the play button in front, rewind button in back and the circuit board design in the dress (and maybe use a nice solid color for the dress) it could have looked like what his girl would look like going to a gala or to a ball.

 

I kept waiting for him to make a huge, cage-like hoop skirt out of the circuit lines but nope, he just stitched them right on the dress. I actually liked the dress, but he didn't even try to nudge it into avant garde territory.

Edited September 13, 2014 by designing1

[BradandJanet]

Sean's gimmick worked--the dress changed color. Sandhya's didn't--the pinwheels sat there stupidly. If Sean's dress hadn't "performed," he would have been in the bottom. Sandhya got a pass on that part. 

 

I think Sandhya really understands the show, however. She alternates arrogance and pathos perfectly. PR isn't about discovering a fabulous unknown designer anymore; it's about being another silly reality show. We are given a bunch of "designers" who will vanish from collective memory as soon as the show is off the air. 

[RealityGal]

I tried to watch this with a straight face, but it's just an example of how pretentious the fashion industry can be. In part, it was the comical "acting" by the model, especially when she totters off post-assault. I found myself giggling rather than awed.

 

That poor girl probably practiced that for weeks

 

I kept waiting for him to make a huge, cage-like hoop skirt out of the circuit lines but nope, he just stitched them right on the dress. I actually liked the dress, but he didn't even try to nudge it into avant garde territory.

Damn it that would have been fabulous!  Knowing what could have been makes it so much sadder!

[canter]

I agree Heidi was a little off to Fade. I've never seen an air kiss fall that short of the mark.

I agree that her verbal response to him was cool and dismissive, but regarding the awkward air kiss, I rewound it because it seemed odd to me too, and I think they were having to stand far apart and lean drastically at the waist to reach over the spill-over area for the water, and that's why it looked so odd. On their regular runway, Heidi can stand immediately next to it and reach the designers more easily.

Fade and his husband were sweet on the phone. I liked at the end when they said, "I love." "I love, too." Cute to see those little private exchanges that couples develop.

[PepperMonkey]

Agreed that the avant-garde challenge should have been time for them to throw all caution to the wind and just go crazy. I'm sure they would have all been lampooned by the judges since there's only room every season for one artiste, and I guess this season, it's Sandhya.

 

I don't shop at Target or TJ Maxx, not that there's anything wrong with that, and I disagree that fashion is EITHER art OR Wal-mart. To quote the great orange one himself, Michael Kors, "Lighten up, it's just fashion."

Fashion is many things, one of which I said CAN be art. It can be pretty, ugly, wearable, not wearable; for me it must be fun or what's the purpose of getting up and getting dressed every morning?

But even the great designers don't stand around calling themselves artists and they recognize the fact that there is a measure of wearability that has to go along with the show of fashion, which is why I've always liked when PR did their avant-garde paired with a version that's sellable. Of course, the last one of those I really remember was Chris and Christian from season 4.

Edited September 13, 2014 by PepperMonkey

[Broderbits]

 

To quote the great orange one himself, Michael Kors, "Lighten up, it's just fashion."

 

In the hands of an artist, like McQueen, fashion can be art. In the hands of a businessman, like Kors, it's just clothes. Successful execution of intent elevates mere coverings to that higher level.

[Julia]

I think a designer calling herself an artist - especially when she is surrounded by the pool of fellow aspirants, who give no indication of such - is much more relevant to the art of fashion than a person who keeps comically blathering for the cameras about "rock n' roll" and Cleopatra as she sends second-rate Etsy inspirations down the runway

 

I think comparing Sandhya to Amanda is probably the most useful, since they both are being rewarded far past their achievements. On that level, yes, I would have to agree that Sandhya's poorly-made garments are more outré than Amanda's.

Edited September 13, 2014 by Julia

[LisaBLingLing]

I kept waiting for him to make a huge, cage-like hoop skirt out of the circuit lines but nope, he just stitched them right on the dress. I actually liked the dress, but he didn't even try to nudge it into avant garde territory.

 

Yes, yes, yes!  Like I said before, when you got nothing, give them everything!  The avant garde challenge doesn't have to actually be something they've never seen before, it's just that if you must go the "been there, done that" route, give them overwhelming amounts of it.  Pile it on.  You know, we should hire ourselves out as advisers to folks about to go on this show, not about design, but about how to win.  

 

And speaking of fan favorite, anybody want to join me in an attempt to break the Alexander strangle hold?  I'll vote for whoever you want as long as it isn't Alexander, although I nominate Sean, Kini, or Char.  I like those three best, personality wise, among who is left but I will go along with this site's popular opinion. (Hope I'm not breaking any Previously TV rules.  I'll take the post down if I am.)  I wish I'd thought of this last week when Fade was still an option.  Sniff, sniff.  

[aradia22]

Underwhelmed by Char's look but I did like the riff on a pillbox hat.

I kind of liked what Sandhya was going for with the pinwheels. I could have predicted that they wouldn't move. The jumpsuit is ugly and garish. I wonder if it would have worked better if she had perfectly mimicked the pattern of the TV signal or confined the color to the top and did something else on the bottom. It looked nothing like her sketch.

Emily's look is OK but I'm so tired of bustier armor looks. 

I liked Alexander's look. I think the purple detail looked better when it was just one flower. The other purple things he added were just curves that looked like weird lesions or growths. I think a very feminine flower would have played nicely off the basic tent dress and the hardness of the clear textile. Missed opportunity but maybe it was difficult to manipulate the fabric to make those purple things.

Do you, Fade. Do you. I'm glad he didn't do something crazy but I wish the wires had maybe covered more of the dress.

I don't get Korina's look. Maybe it would help to have it explained because it seems to have nothing to do with the Thunderbird.

The silhouette of Amanda's dress is not flattering and I hate the colors but it looks better than some of her other looks. That might not say much.

Kini's look is fine. It wasn't a wow. I don't see it as Christian's dress but I do think it recycles a lot of ideas. Especially the napkin skirt. I thought we were done with those!

I'm underwhelmed by Sean's. I think he had a good idea with the dye but I immediately thought McQueen as well. I wish he'd created a better white canvas for the dye. That dress was super boring and kind of ugly. The little ruffle detail? No. It made it look cheap. It would have been nice to see him push himself to make a nice (if simple) white dress and put in more seams and get more interesting colors than red, orange, and yellow. If you're going to do something like that think about how you want to deploy the color. Amanda sometimes makes dresses with a lot of style lines. It would have been interesting to see something like her dress for the men's suit challenge with dye in all of those seams.

 

Wait, so if we get a two-day challenge then the episode has to be an hour and half long? Also, how did they miss so many things even in that time? We got no explanation of Korina scrapping her first garment. We did not really see Alexander making the purple things.

[wovenloaf]

Wait, so if we get a two-day challenge then the episode has to be an hour and half long? 

 

The new episode that they show on Thursday is always an hour and half long. But then when they show re-runs on later days, they've shrunk it to an hour. Not sure what they cut out...But I've noticed on my TV that the new ones are always longer on the actual Thursday they come out, but then shrunk in later re-runs. 

[panthergirl13]

What's the point of having two winners now that there's no more immunity? Winning is just an ego thing from here on out... right?

 

And Sandhya's insane 'esthetic' proves what I've been saying all along... as long as the judges on this show don't find your design "sad", you're in. 

[WearyTraveler]

The petition worked already;)

 

As much as I would love for that to be true, it's an impossibility because this episode was filmed months ago, and I only started the petition a few days ago :(

 

So, keep spreading the word!!!!

 

This episode highlights for me how stupid the people running PR are.  We got a fairly good runway show, because the designers had two days.  We also got a couple of interesting plot arcs (will Sean's dress work, who will win between Sean and Kini).  Hell, we even got pathos from Fade's story line.  There's enough here to make an interesting show without having to resort to unreal time pressures or screaming Sandros. 

 

I guess if the current format makes the producers money, they aren't so stupid.  But I really miss the early seasons.  I felt like I actually used to learn something about fashion on this show.  And there was plenty of drama (if that's your thing) in the early seasons without all the producer shenanigans.  This is the first show in a long time where I felt I learned something new and didn't have to put up with artificial drama.

 

Agreed, if you'd like to do something about this, you might want to start by signing my petition to have longer challenges again!

By the way, someone told me to watch Masters of Sex, and now I absolutely refuse.  I don't want to support anything she is on.

 

You should watch it, anyway, it's quite a good show, and the guest is in a supporting role (if that counts for anything).  All the actors on it, including her are pretty phenomenal (although they had a 3 or 4 episode recurring role for Sara Silverman which I did not like, but it's the only one in two seasons, so, not bad)

 

And speaking of fan favorite, anybody want to join me in an attempt to break the Alexander strangle hold?  I'll vote for whoever you want as long as it isn't Alexander, although I nominate Sean, Kini, or Char.  I like those three best, personality wise, among who is left but I will go along with this site's popular opinion. (Hope I'm not breaking any Previously TV rules.  I'll take the post down if I am.)  I wish I'd thought of this last week when Fade was still an option.  Sniff, sniff.  

 

I thought you could vote for anyone for fan favorite, no matter their status in the competition.  I think, if I'm not mistaken, that, in the past, someone who was not top three even won this thing.

 

_________________________

 

I liked the top two this week and agreed with the judges' tie decision.

 

I also agree that Fäde has more potential than Char, so, I wish Tim had not used his save on Char and that he could use it now.  That said, I don't think Fäde would have made top three, and I think Char won't either, so, I guess the point is moot.  Except I'd rather see more of Fäde than of Char.

 

I also agreed with the judges' bottom three, but I would have sent Emily home on the ugly factor alone.

 

I think I would have put Sandhya in the middle and would have put Amanda's in the top three.  I get that it wasn't everybody's cup of tea, but it was colorful, and I could see the hieroglyphic quality of the eyes. The one thing I liked about Sandhya's was the pattern on the top, in the front of the dress.  The rest was awful.  Maybe if she had made that same pattern on the back, and just have it be a vest and not floor length, it would have worked better.  I also think that having the color lines from top to bottom was too much.  Perhaps is she had given her model a red, flowing skirt covered in the same material Sean used to line his dress, it would have worked much better.

 

In any case, I thought Char and Alexander's were middle of the pack and Sandhya had a lot of editing issues, so I thought Amanda's was superior to Sandhya's. 

 

The thing that bugged me about Sandhya's comment was that it was like rubbing it in the faces of the other contestants: "the judges have never called me derivative of other designers like they just called you derivative of Steve McQueen....nah, nah, nah, nah. nah. nah!".  Maybe she didn't intend it as such but man, she needs to lear some tact and to consider how her words would make others feel.  Particularly since she expects others to be considerate of her feelings.  Quid pro quo, tit for tat, do onto others.... etc. etc.

Edited September 13, 2014 by WearyTraveler

[KimberStormer]

If people don't call themselves "artists" it's only because of people who roll their eyes at people who call themselves artists.  After the Renaissance made "artist" (and not just "artisan") into a thing you could be, and before our contemporary distaste for "pretension" (whatever that means) every visual artist called themselves an artist.  So for approximately 400 years.  And I think that the accumulation of meaning that the word took on over that period of time became an important part of the greatness of art, because of the personalities it attracted.  Someone like Delacroix would not have been interested in painting if he didn't feel he was Expressing Great Truths in his work.  There is no way Picasso would have stood for having to modestly refer to himself as only a humble craftsman working in one medium; he wasn't a "painter" deep down, he was an ARTIST and so he made drawings, sculptures, ceramics, collages, illustrations, ballet costumes, every kind of art available to him.  Even Matisse who probably was a painter deep down did all these things too, and I think the world is greater for having his "Back" series of sculptures and his Vence Chapel.

 

But fashion designers have always resisted that "artist" label; I think because they are afraid of being judged by criteria that are independent of sales.  "Fashion designer" only started existing as a thing to be in the very late 19th/early 20th Century when there really was an avant-garde and "true art" was assumed to be uncommercial.  If fashion designers had emerged in the days of Rubens and Bernini, when the greatest artists were quite popular, I imagine they would have readily thought of themselves as true artists.  And maybe they would have expressed themselves in other media as well.

 

Anyway, to me, if you're going to make an "avant garde" challenge in the first place, you are at the very least implicitly endorsing an artistic view of fashion.  It would be massively absurd to ask for "avant garde looks" and then ask the designers why they're so full of themselves with this "artistic vision" that they want to foist on the world, instead of well-made separates for the office and a tasteful sheath for evening.  (Have the judges done this kind of thing?  Yes.  They are massively absurd.)  If you see fashion as a service industry ("I just need something to wear") then an avant garde challenge is impossible; you don't have "avant garde" toiletries or motor oil.

 

I'm not a super-romantic about this stuff; I work as a seamstress making underwear in a small manufacturing facility.  But I hope that you're not somehow disqualified to make clothes if you want to make art and call yourself an artist.  Fashion as an artform is dying, in my eyes; and I think the reason is bullshit like Fashion Police and What Not To Wear.  As Zac mentions every time there's a red carpet or otherwise public-facing challenge, "you don't want to end up on the worst-dressed list".  If it wasn't plain from what I said before, I think the reason fashion designers won't call themselves artists is because they're cowards.  The world needs more Vivienne Westwoods and Rei Kawakubos, not less.

[zxy556575]

I like her fine, but Sandhya can be pretty derivative of Betsey Johnson, if you ask me.

 

The shoes on Sean's model were dire. I live in Florida so his plastic underskirt made me sweat via the TV.

[PepperMonkey]

The plastic underskirt was my favourite part ;)

[Beden]

 

What's the point of having two winners now that there's no more immunity? Winning is just an ego thing from here on out... right?

Not necessarily. Though they don't get immunity there is often a perk for winners in the next challenge--first pick of fabrics, choice of model, choice of some part of a project, choice of partner or some such. It's still a real plus beyond brownie points, or usually is, anyway.

[One Tough Cookie]

Well, I have to say I never got the Fade love and am not surprised he was sent home.  He reminded me of a creepy child molester who mumbled a lot. 

 

My husband was in the room when Sandhya's dress came down the runway and I asked him what he thought:  "I don't know what avant garde is, but this train wreck isn't it".  She has a point of view, but  I generally think he offerings are garish, to say the least.

[Gumby]

I could have sworn there was a Sponsors thread here - but not finding it.... so:

 

Each time the commercials appear I do look - but have not seen a single pair of Aldos which interest me in the least, or project for that company a fashion-forward vibe. I guess that anyone advertising on PR needs to have a wide appeal in order to pay off, as well as offer basic options in their line for the designers' use. But Shirley there is an imaginative happy-medium between Grasshoppers and Irregular Choice.

 

Like how I would love to see a Jeffery Campbell TV ad, say! 

Edited September 13, 2014 by Gumby

[panthergirl13]

I could have sworn there was a Sponsors thread here - but not finding it.... so:

 

I don't think there's a Sponsors thread, but we did have a laugh a few weeks ago after the Red Robin challenge proposing other 'high end' sponsors like Aqua Net and Prince Matchabelli. So you didn't imagine it. :)

[Kromm]

I actually don't think Korina's outfit was as bad as they made it out to be.  Was it a top look?  Not even a little.  Did it look like what she said it looked like?  No (then again she was right in assuming the judges would slag off on her if she made it literal).  It was a very weak idea overall in terms of colors and shape, but it wasn't a nightmare.  Actually, you have to look at the side and rear views (on the P.R. website) to begin to see that Korina put any work into it at all, but if you do it's far less boring (which the front view is).

 

She should have slapped for wasting an immunity--she should have gone much bigger and bolder--but I don't really think she should have gone home if she hadn't had immunity (unless we're now sending people home simply for being jerks).

 

Pinweel Clown Outfit was near the worst, even though the panel apparently will never call out Sandhya.  But Char's was mediocre and ugly.  Amanda actually had something fall off.  Emily's was cartoonish.  And yes, while Fade is a good designer, he barely tried this week.  Any of them could have credibly been sent home this time around.

[aradia22]

 

Fade was just so real when on the phone. I teared up.

I felt that, too. It was almost too real for this stupid show. That was real pain and angst. Not like all the other BS calls to home and crocodile tears.

[Muffyn]

The plastic underskirt was my favourite part ;)

It could be quite helpful if you have SAM in your pants.

[RealityGal]

We've been waiting for a challenge that gave the designers more than one day, thinking that would be the difference maker in what we saw walk the runway. Well, it was but not in the manner we expected. We saw how legitimately the creative barrel has been scraped dry. Multiple designers sent out simple black basics with shit piled on top of it (special kudos for Alexander's performance expression piece, "Woman Trapped in Shower Curtain"). There should have been MASS execution of contestants based on what they presented, precisely because they are lacking in seriousness, lacking in artistry, and yes, lacking in taking themselves and the art of fashion seriously.

^^This.  I can't deny it anymore.  The designers left just aren't as talented as those in previous years.  I still think Fade is an amazing designer, but just really had an off day, because I thought his dresses before these past two challenges have been really wonderful.  But, they not only gave them two days, but they gave them a challenge that gave them almost no artistic boundaries or limitations.  While Sean's idea was new and fresh, most of the other stuff was just not good.  And it wasn't great or amazing.

 

 

I could have sworn there was a Sponsors thread here - but not finding it.... so:

 

Each time the commercials appear I do look - but have not seen a single pair of Aldos which interest me in the least, or project for that company a fashion-forward vibe. I guess that anyone advertising on PR needs to have a wide appeal in order to pay off, as well as offer basic options in their line for the designers' use. But Shirley there is an imaginative happy-medium between Grasshoppers and Irregular Choice.

 

Like how I would love to see a Jeffery Campbell TV ad, say! 

 

There is a thread called "The Accessory Wall" - I have been in an Aldo, and 99% of what I've seen have been platform stiletto heels.  I have never seen those ugly ass glitter tennis shoes, or those clompy boots.  Apparently fashion forward at Aldo means glitter sneakers, strangely, its the same look 80 year old grandmothers have been wearing for years.

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

on the subject of fashion being art and Shandaya's comment

 

1) even if she is 100% original, thats fine, but why say the comment in a room full of people who have just been ripped apart for being derivative?  And really, I don't see how just by being original, someone is better.  I haven't seen a woman wear a bikini made of rat fur dyed bright yellow, but that doesn't mean when someone does it it will be art, just because its original.  I might understand someone taking her position if they had sent something down the runway that was just original and amazing, but IMO, and MV, her outfit was all sorts of ugly, and I think people could easily be original if they were okay making ugly clothes.  Even if you honestly feel that way, why be so arrogant as to say it.  I mean, I get being proud of your work, but come on now.

 

2) Clothing is not protectable under copyright law because it is labelled "utilitarian" and I think that is my view.  While there may be design and art in fashion, it is different from other art, because clothing is meant to, by its very definition, be worn and be useful.  A sculpture or a painting is almost never meant to be utilitarian, it is purchased only for its aesthetic value and not really for its usefulness.  At least most of the time.  In fashion, its the other way around most of the time, the functionality of the clothing is subordinate to the artistry in the clothing.  I think there is a certain degree of artistry, but its applied to something functional, like making clothing.   But MV, and my view isn't super strong on the matter, and so many of you have such interesting and impassioned views which I find interesting to read.

[paramitch]

It's interesting that the discussion of art versus design has come up so organically, because I felt like Sean's dress was a huge success as art, but a total failure as design. It was a plain white sundress. And while I felt like the moment of transformation was justifiably really cool, I was angry that the judges never seemed to actually address the design of his dress at all. Or, this:

 

Sean seems to have a little bit of design in him, but tonight's entry for me was weak. It was also Alexander McQueen-esque, Spring 1999, but I'll give him the dye idea vs the painting robots as original. What I cannot bear is that the dress wasn't particularly beautiful, with or without the color. It was basic as hell and depended on a trick that in the end made it look basic as hell.

 

 

7. Guest judge - what the hell is it with the guest judges.  Goodness, did she go to design school?  Or does she just somehow have a super special knowledge about fashion because she got cast in a TV show.  By the way, someone told me to watch Masters of Sex, and now I absolutely refuse.  I don't want to support anything she is on.

I actually thought Caitlin FitzGerald's comments were pretty succinct and on-point. I've never really minded when actresses are on the panel, because so many of them are subjected to constant fashion scrutiny from the moment they hit the spotlight (aside from the fact that many model when first starting out). I'd also add that "Masters of Sex" is a pretty amazing show, and I'd hate for you to miss it just because an actress's publicist called her up and said, "Go sit on this panel today, it'll be good exposure."

 

I do laugh each week when, once again, Alexander is fan favorite.

 

It fills me with total rage, as it's obvious that he or someone is gaming the system to get this result. There is simply no way that he is actually fan favorite each week. The fact that it never organically shuffles according to design wins or big moments (like, for instance, on "Face Off") says it all.

 

It was interesting seeing Sandhya make the comment about not being in the style of another designer, instead being herself.  Maybe it was a miss-timed statement, but it's true.  You aren't supposed to be in the competition or in design in general to get as close to the look of another designer as possible.  The really interesting thing, however, was seeing Amanda interpret Sandhya's comments.  Amanda's telling bore little resemblance to what we just saw in the clip.  Girlfriend does like to exaggerate and stir up trouble.   Amanda came out of that looking a lot worse than Sandhya did.

 

I disagree -- I felt like Amanda had a pretty accurate read on what happened, and I hope Sandhya winced just a little at seeing how she handled that entire situation. For her to smugly announce to a group that had just been hammered by the judges that she never has been compared to anyone else and she never wants to be compared to anyone else... ugh. Not a single losing designer sitting there was thinking happily, "Yay! I got compared to McQueen again!"

 

Tim is more than part of the production team, he is Executive Producer along with Heidi. I think he absolutely has say over the Tim Gunn save. I just think he decides on an emotional level, rather than based on skills demonstrated. Justin last season felt like and emotional reaction and so does Char's this season.

 

My understanding of Tim's EP title is that it's a combination of a prestige title that saluted his popularity and role in the show's success (for instance, the same way they give actors producer credits after contract renewals on other major TV shows) and one in which he is involved in the production but more from a middle management level (for instance, he went to the judges and producers to intercede for Michele after her dismissal -- he didn't simply decide to reverse it). With that said, though, I was sad when he brought back Char for emotional versus design reasons.

 

I don't happen to care for Sandhya's Punky Brewster aesthetic, but that isn't what gets under my skin about her.  It's her arrogance.  Here's where I'm coming from: The minute Tim Gunn began offering his critique, she shuts him down.  Facial expression, body language, tone of voice, all made it clear that she had no intention of listening to a single thing he had to say. She was so condescending as she dismissed his concern that the propellers might not turn in the rain.  Then later, when they did not, in fact, turn, she was surprised.  Gee, girl, shame nobody tried to help you think that through.  That getup looked perfect for a cross-dressing Ronald McDonald.

I agree. I want to like Sandhya, but I find her very arrogant, frustrating and unlikable. There is something about how she behaves on the show that feels calculated to me, and I don't often feel that way about contestants.

 

Pretty much every REAL artist I know (as in, makes a living creating something beautiful or interesting or useful and often all three), never calls himself or herself An Artist. I've heard painter, sculptor, craftsman, metallist, photographer, but never ARTIST.

To me, it's the mark of the pretentious wannabe.

 

I can't agree with this, or with the idea that "REAL" artists never use the word. I know many real artists and designers who can and do describe themselves as artists, and I don't think there's anything wrong with that. In a world in which arts support and training are dwindling alarmingly as part of daily life, I just can't see the word 'artist' as a badge of shame for anyone. Does everyone live up to the word? No. But I think it's a fine and wonderful thing to strive for.

 

If people don't call themselves "artists" it's only because of people who roll their eyes at people who call themselves artists.  After the Renaissance made "artist" (and not just "artisan") into a thing you could be, and before our contemporary distaste for "pretension" (whatever that means) every visual artist called themselves an artist. 

 

<snipped for length>

 

I'm not a super-romantic about this stuff; I work as a seamstress making underwear in a small manufacturing facility.  But I hope that you're not somehow disqualified to make clothes if you want to make art and call yourself an artist.  Fashion as an artform is dying, in my eyes; and I think the reason is bullshit like Fashion Police and What Not To Wear.  As Zac mentions every time there's a red carpet or otherwise public-facing challenge, "you don't want to end up on the worst-dressed list".  If it wasn't plain from what I said before, I think the reason fashion designers won't call themselves artists is because they're cowards.  The world needs more Vivienne Westwoods and Rei Kawakubos, not less.

 

Thank you for this, which I thought was beautifully said, and a lovely defense of the term 'artist.'