S12.E03: Episode 3

[OtterMommy]

UK Air Date: January 15, 2023
US Air Date: April 2, 2023

Quote

Sister Veronica is shaken when a mother reveals a terrible truth about her marriage. Shelagh cares for a baby with a life-threatening condition, and Nancy harbours a secret.

 

[katisha]

This was a very thought-provoking episode for me.  Thankfully we are a lot more enlightened these days but it's almost scary to think that in those days domestic violence was so much more common, not to mention rape within marriage.  I started to like Sister Veronica more in this episode because she tried so hard to help Sandy.

[txhorns79]

On 3/9/2023 at 4:10 AM, katisha said:

Thankfully we are a lot more enlightened these days but it's almost scary to think that in those days domestic violence was so much more common, not to mention rape within marriage. 

It was a dark episode.  It's scary to think that marital rape was not a crime, and you are essentially trapped with your rapist by laws that make divorce almost unobtainable.  I did like Sister Veronica in the plotline, and I guess everyone has just kind of forgotten that she is supposed to be a chronic liar?

I just kind of roll my eyes at Nancy.  She's lucky to have Phyllis be willing to help her.

 

[debraran]

I guess you had to pick well or be just like a piece of cattle. It makes me almost physically ill to think they had to make domestic violence law in my lifetime for cops etc. to arrest the beaters. What insane logic did these laws come about and why do some argue that women shouldn't feel having men make laws about their bodies doesn't make them comfortable?

I think the initial Sister Veronica had mixed returns and I hope they really tone down the "fib" part if it returns. A dumb writing plot that didn't fit their usual standards.

Overall a good show but maybe better if Sister Monica bopped him in the nose!

[Badger]

Scenes they cut out:

Right before Phyllis tells Sr. Veronica about the two newly discharged mothers, Trixie says she'll see everyone at the clinic and remind the expectant mothers to drink plenty of water in the hot weather. Nancy says she wants to get Colette a paddling pool, but wonders if she's too old for one. Trixie says they aren't too old and that she can see them cooling off in their bikinis in the backyard.

They cut out some lines in the scene with Trixie and Matthew at the market. He asks her if it's true that mille-feuilles have 1000 layers in the pastry, and Trixie says she'll find out when she makes it. She then says they provide speciality ingredients but that she has to bring a dozen eggs and she's not sure she can do that on the bus.  Matthew says he'll drive her there and tries to sneak one of her strawberries.  She slaps his hand away, telling him hands off her strawberries and that he might not be taking it seriously, but she is.  He then says he'd be satisfied with corned beef hash and gravy.

They cut out part of the scene with Joe and Sandy. Right after he greets the kids, he says "Evening, Mrs. Talbot" and kisses her cheek, moving her hair out of the way.  She has a huge bruise on her neck.  He tells her it's not the ideal home and that he's been at work all day and shouldn't have to start again when he gets home.

They cut out part of the scene with Phyllis, Nancy and Trixie.  Trixie says she's going to have dinner at Matthew's flat because his oven is big enough for a rack of lamb. Phyllis points out she is vegetarian (much to Nancy's annoyance), but Trixie assures her there will be a meat-free alternative to the entree.

They cut out part of the scene with Nancy and Colette.  Colette tells Nancy that Uncle Terry and Auntie Vera are taking her to Brighton for the holidays.  Nancy says she's glad they're looking after her so well, but that one day they'll have a place of their own and  they'll go to the beach every holiday to the point where she is begging, "Not the beach again, Mummy."  Colette asks "When" and Nancy says, "Soon" but she looks worried.

They cut out a scene where Lorna's mother asks Miss Higgins why they said Ian was fine the day before, and she says that some of his symptoms did not become apparent until later but that he is in the best of hands. Lorna's mother says this would never have happened if he had been a girl.

They cut out a few lines where Shelagh says Lorna is desperate for news and she asks Miss Higgins if Dr. Turner has heard from the pediatrician yet. She says she connected them ten minutes ago.

They cut out a scene where Sr. Veronica and Sandy are trying to get into her flat, but Sr. Veronica can't get the key to work. Sandy says that he has changed the lock.

They cut part of the scene in Matthew's flat.  Cyril says he has a beautiful home,and Matthew thanks him, saying it's all the better with friends.  He then says that "Madame Le Chef" has ordered him to offer everyone an aperitif.  You can hear Trixie groaning in the kitchen, and Matthew says he'd pass around some olives, but that he's afraid to go in the kitchen. Nancy asks if Trixie is growling and Phyllis says it sounds like she's wrestling a bear.  Matthew says the bear might come off worse as he pours from a bottle.

The scene changes to Sr. Veronica and Sandy at the hostel.  Sandy apologizes to her, saying she spoke out of turn.  Sr. Veronica says it's highly possible she acted out of turn.

They cut out part of the scene with Shelagh and Patrick. He says that he once kept secret that didn't come out until they were trying to adopt a baby, and says that everything surrounding the birth of a baby is felt much more intensely. He also says that Lorna's mother not telling her about her father's hemophilia has shattered all the trust they once had.  Shelagh wonders how they will build it back up. Patrick asks "How did we?" and it no longer seems to matter.

[JustDucky]

Why couldn't they have written Sister Veronica like this from the start?  She had tiny flares of Sister Evangelina in this episode, and I was Here For It.  If they go back to The Lying Nun, I'm going to... pout.

The domestic abuse storyline made me squirm.  I was so proud of Sister Monica Joan for telling him to piss off in the most pristine way.

I did a bit of research, and nowadays a hemophiliac male's life span is "only" 10 years shorter than the typical male, with proper treatment.  Not sure what that translates to in the late 60's.  But I can see why Ian's mother was upset.  Leave it to Shelagh to bring the family together in her own gentle way.  (She never comes off as saccharine.  Sometimes a bit sticky, but never artificial.)

There is always a role that takes the part of the soul of the series.  Jenny started it, Trixie has had a turn, and now Phyllis.  She's got all sorts of common sense, and sometimes has the lion's share.

Speaking of Trixie, I think she was knocked down a peg tonight.  But not in a bad way.  In a "people don't expect the world from you, so relax" way.  And her chemistry with Matthew was much improved this episode.  Doesn't hurt that Helen George looks adorable when unkempt.

[Badger]

I could imagine Cyril having the same kind of talk (only about cooking) with Trixie that Phyllis had with Nancy about money.

[Jodithgrace]

Trixie says that her wedding cake is going to be soaked in Armagnac. Isn’t she an alcoholic? It’s not like food cooked with wine, which cooks off….cake soaked in liquor is full of alcohol. Did the writers forget? 

Inflation is a funny thing. When Nancy revealed that she was in debt for almost 100 pounds, I chuckled. But I imagine back then it was quite a sum. Phyllis was shocked!

I knew that rape wouldn’t  count if it was the husband. Disgusting. It was the same in the US for far longer than it should have been. 

Poor baby with hemophilia. You rarely hear about that anymore, thanks to genetic counseling and other scientific advances I imagine, though I don’t know for sure. It’s also associated with inbreeding, but I don’t think that’s the cause, just what made it run rampant in some families, like the Hapsburgs. 

[Nialla]

1 hour ago, Badger said:

He then says he'd be satisfied with corned beef hash and gravy.

Ah, that was what she served him in the ending montage. There was A Look over it but I didn't know why.

[BooksRule]

18 minutes ago, Jodithgrace said:

Inflation is a funny thing. When Nancy revealed that she was in debt for almost 100 pounds, I chuckled. But I imagine back then it was quite a sum. Phyllis was shocked!

According to google, 100 pounds in 1968 equals 1,670 pounds in 2023.  No wonder Phyllis was appalled.

[TomGirl]

1 hour ago, Jodithgrace said:

Inflation is a funny thing. When Nancy revealed that she was in debt for almost 100 pounds, I chuckled. But I imagine back then it was quite a sum. Phyllis was shocked!

That would be about $2,700 today.

[izabella]

55 minutes ago, Jodithgrace said:

I knew that rape wouldn’t  count if it was the husband. Disgusting. It was the same in the US for far longer than it should have been. 

I just looked it up, and it wasn't until 1970 that states started recognizing rape within a marriage and changing laws.  It wasn't until 1993 that all 50 states called it rape and made it illegal.  It's shocking how recent that is - only 30 years ago!  Even though I experienced that slow cultural shift as it was happening, watching this episode made me realize that I take those laws for granted.

1 hour ago, JustDucky said:

There is always a role that takes the part of the soul of the series.  Jenny started it, Trixie has had a turn, and now Phyllis.  She's got all sorts of common sense, and sometimes has the lion's share.

Phyllis is wonderful.  Nancy is so lucky Phyllis was there for her.  I know Nancy had not had the opportunity to learn about handling money, but I found her behavior frustrating.  She should have stopped digging when she saw she was standing in a hole, not kept spending until she was in way over head.

Did they teach budgeting in home economics classes in school, when there used to be home ec classes? 

[Sarah 103]

 

1 hour ago, LtKelley said:

When they're talking about the life expectancy of hemophiliacs, I do the math in my head and lil baby Ian would likely die of AIDS in the mid 1980s due to the blood supply issues. We lost a lot of hemophiliacs to AIDS. (I mean, along with all the others we lost)

When the midwives were discussing his life expectancy and his ability to live/lead a normal life, the thought that went through my head was "yes, if he manages to avoid getting HIV/AIDS from a blood transfusion, until they had a test to identify infected blood samples/products."

Slightly on-topic/slightly off topic: I want to see a Dr. Turner (It can be Patrick or Timothy, I don't care which one) dealing with the AIDS crisis. 

54 minutes ago, izabella said:

Did they teach budgeting in home economics classes in school, when there used to be home ec classes? 

Someone slightly older who was alive/going to school during this era may be able to give a more helpful/accurate response. I think of those home-ec classes as being uniquely American, and starting in what Americans call high-school during the 1940s. I'm not sure Nancy would have had those kinds of classes when/where she went to school.

 

[Andyourlittledog2]

We started home ec in seventh grade (So California) but were not required to have it at all after that. It was an elective course in high school. That was 1968 thru 1973.  And cooking, sewing, needlework (knit/crewel/tat/needlepoint) and child development and care were involved, no finances whatsoever. I could make a Baked Alaska but I could not balance a checkbook. 

This was a lovely episode, sad but hopeful at the same time. I do wish we could escape the intro and exit of Old Jenny pontificating in a syrupy purple prose but I guess I can't have everything. I find it almost painful to have to listen to it.

[bybrandy]

1 hour ago, LtKelley said:

No. Home ec was cooking, sewing, and cleaning at my school, and you only took home ec if you weren't college material. Personally I think personal finance should be the new home ec and everyone should take it, not just the girls

I never had any life skills classes because I went to a prep school. They werent offered. My mom had to take sewing and home ec. One each semester to graduate. She got a c in sewing and lost out on valedictorian.  She was still mad about it when she died at 82. 

[Daff]

8 hours ago, Badger said:

They cut out part of the scene with Joe and Sandy. Right after he greets the kids, he says "Evening, Mrs. Talbot" and kisses her cheek, moving her hair out of the way.  She has a huge bruise on her neck.  He tells her it's not the ideal home and that he's been at work all day and shouldn't have to start again when he gets home.

I saw this. Raised the hair on the back of my neck and left me cold. Is it possible that each affiliate can choose which scenes to edit, or that they release several edited versions from which to choose (depending upon local needs)?

8 hours ago, Badger said:

He then says he'd be satisfied with corned beef hash and gravy.

And that was seen at the end-corned beef hash, two eggs sunny side up. (Oh, yummy, yolky goodness)

[Daff]

Someone teased in the ep. 1 discussion that Sr. V lied again, in episode 3, but I saw no sign of that. I loved the way she championed the abused wife and kids.

BTW, what in hell did the monster mean-“I don’t expect to come home and start all over.”? 
 

Cyril saved the dinner party with eggs Benedict, (no mean feat) but I loved all his supportive comments about the food they were served. He has skills that apparently all those church ladies know nothing about, since his refrigerator is full of casseroles. 

Edited April 3, 2023 by Daff

[libgirl2]

6 hours ago, Sarah 103 said:

 

When the midwives were discussing his life expectancy and his ability to live/lead a normal life, the thought that went through my head was "yes, if he manages to avoid getting HIV/AIDS from a blood transfusion, until they had a test to identify infected blood samples/products."

Slightly on-topic/slightly off topic: I want to see a Dr. Turner (It can be Patrick or Timothy, I don't care which one) dealing with the AIDS crisis. 

Someone slightly older who was alive/going to school during this era may be able to give a more helpful/accurate response. I think of those home-ec classes as being uniquely American, and starting in what Americans call high-school during the 1940s. I'm not sure Nancy would have had those kinds of classes when/where she went to school.

 

It was the first thing I thought of too. I was in school studying to be a labtech in the early 80s. We used to pipette by mouth! I still remember doing a hospital rotation being in the ER and a kid, maybe 16 who was a hemophiliac.... after HIV became known just a couple of years later, I thought back to him and what might have happened to him. 

[Blackie]

1 hour ago, Daff said:

BTW, what in hell did the monster mean-“I don’t expect to come home and start all over.”? 

 

He said he worked all day and didn't want to come home and keep working doing the house work, child care and cooking he expected his wife to do.

[JudyObscure]

6 hours ago, Andyourlittledog2 said:

We started home ec in seventh grade (So California) but were not required to have it at all after that. It was an elective course in high school. That was 1968 thru 1973.  And cooking, sewing, needlework (knit/crewel/tat/needlepoint) and child development and care were involved, no finances whatsoever. I could make a Baked Alaska but I could not balance a checkbook. 

Same for me in West Virginia, only, even though it wasn't required for college prep, I took Home Economic classes 7 through 12. I wanted to get my degree in it, primarily because it was an all-girls class where anything could be taught.  Budgeting was one of the things I planned to teach which was not taught at all. Through those classes I was led to believe that being poor meant cooking lots of dishes made with hamburger and sewing my own clothes.  I found out the hard way that being poor meant not being able to afford hamburger or a sewing machine.

The one really worthwhile thing I remember from that class was the teacher saying we should breast feed, "That's what they're for, they aren't play things."  Which made everyone giggle because absolutely no women were breast feeding at that time.

That doesn't excuse Nancy.  I left home and got an apartment in Columbus at 19 and as ignorant as I was I knew that when I got paid I'd better pay the rent and buy food before buying the psychedelic miniskirts I wanted.

[angora]

3 hours ago, Daff said:

Someone teased in the ep. 1 discussion that Sr. V lied again, in episode 3, but I saw no sign of that. I loved the way she championed the abused wife and kids.

It wasn’t a self-serving lie this time. When they went to the police after Mr. Talbot changed the locks, Sister Veronica claimed they had to get into the flat because the little boy had a serious medical condition and he had a vital medication inside, rather than his beloved stuffed animal.

my heart broke for Sandy when she said that realizing her daughter had overheard was what made her decide to leave Mr. Talbot. She couldn’t leave for her own protection, but she knew she didn’t want that life for her daughter and didn’t want her growing up around it. And then again when Sister Veronica told her how brave she was and she argued that, if she was brave, she would have stayed. What a horrible thing, to feel that being abused is the “price” owed to keep your children fed.

[Mermaid Under]

Quote

I think the initial Sister Veronica had mixed returns and I hope they really tone down the "fib" part if it returns

This episode made Sister Veronica seem more likable, but I don't like the inconsistency in character development.

Speaking of inconsistent characters, for Trixie's dinner party, did Sister Monica Joan invite herself?

Colette being thrilled with her Mother's budget seemed unreal.  I can only suspend disbelief so far.  A child that age would want all the toys and clothes, and would want all of her mother's time and attention.  There are a lot of adults who don't understand the concept of making choices and saying no to some things for a long term goal.  Is Collette some sort of financial savant?

[dubbel zout]

13 hours ago, Badger said:

 He then says he'd be satisfied with corned beef hash and gravy.

So that's where that scene came from at the end. Though I wondered how Trixie managed even that. And if Cyril could make eggs Benedict, he didn't need endless casseroles from his congregation, though I get he probably didn't ask for them.

13 hours ago, JustDucky said:

Speaking of Trixie, I think she was knocked down a peg tonight.  But not in a bad way.  In a "people don't expect the world from you, so relax" way. 

It was a bit too much of a cliché for me that everything went completely wrong, but I loved that she could finally laugh at herself after the disastrous dinner.

[libgirl2]

18 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

So that's where that scene came from at the end. Though I wondered how Trixie managed even that. And if Cyril could make eggs Benedict, he didn't need endless casseroles from his congregation, though I get he probably didn't ask for them.

It was a bit too much of a cliché for me that everything went completely wrong, but I loved that she could finally laugh at herself after the disastrous dinner.

I'm sure the good women of the congregation took it upon themselves to feed him. I'm sure he didn't ask. 

[iMonrey]

Quote

They cut out part of the scene with Joe and Sandy. Right after he greets the kids, he says "Evening, Mrs. Talbot" and kisses her cheek, moving her hair out of the way.  She has a huge bruise on her neck.  He tells her it's not the ideal home and that he's been at work all day and shouldn't have to start again when he gets home.

No they didn't, that scene was intact. Daff saw it too.

I'm just glad the wife didn't go back to her husband. That's the sort of thing that would have more likely happened than not.

Quote

I do wish we could escape the intro and exit of Old Jenny pontificating in a syrupy purple prose but I guess I can't have everything. I find it almost painful to have to listen to it.

The gimmick ceased being relevant after Jenny left the show. I mean I get it, the whole show is based on the real-life memories of the real-life Jenny, but since Jenny hasn't been there in over 10 years, what's the point of her waxing philosophical about vague, unspecific platitudes? It sort of made sense when she could say "I remember when blah blah blah happened" but now she'd have no idea what's gong on and has no connection to the story whatsoever.

Edited April 3, 2023 by iMonrey

[libgirl2]

2 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

No they didn't, that scene was intact. Daff saw it too.

I'm just glad the wife didn't go back to her husband. That's the sort of thing that would have more likely happened than not.

 

I saw that scene too. 

[libgirl2]

2 minutes ago, LtKelley said:

Yes, she did. And so far this season, Sr Monica Joan's rampant dementia is in complete remission.

I don't think she's a financial savant and I suspect she hasn't internalized that Saturdays with Mom won't be spent shopping for toys and new clothes anymore, but Collette has voiced how she wants to live with Nancy and the bank savings book represents that goal. When the money available reaches x, they get to live together. I genuinely find it a little surprising no one was questioning Nancy's spending anyway. A personal tv up in the bedroom screams "I'm spending money" in 1968.

Yes. I was discussing it with a co-worker. I think the realization that dementia would limit the longevity of her character brought about the remission. I'm glad because I do like her. I also went thru dementia with my mom in real life and prefer not to on the show. 

I agree about Nancy. I don't think she realized just how much was going out and not being saved. She wants to have fun with Collette and treat her to everything, I understand that. 

[kwnyc]

15 hours ago, JustDucky said:

Why couldn't they have written Sister Veronica like this from the start? 

Seriously! This could have been her very strong introduction. And with Trixie's dinner party, I did sort of wonder whether she's effectively moved in with Matthew already. But "woman cooking fail" is such an old trope used to show a woman with a career isn't REALLY successful (see the film "Woman of the Year"). AS IF they won't have a cook and a maid...

Same kind of thing with Nancy: she was completely raised in institutions, and moved into what's essentially an adult women's dorm. She's never had anyone to teach her about real budgeting and homemaking. She's still younger than her real age in a lot of ways. She's got a version of freedom now, and has no idea how to use it.

A strong performance by the actress in the role of the woman who finally leaves her husband, and they did not stint in showing how hard it was going to be for her. What amazed my 21st century eyes were that a woman with 2 kids was sharing a bed in a hostel (aka homeless shelter) and that was considered safe acceptable. (Not to mention that her husband could have tracked her down in a shelter). Didn't they used to have shelters on the show where they could send women away to to hide from batterers?

Oh, and hemophilia, argh...the kids with it didn't just get infected with HIV in the '80s, they were shunned and persecuted (remember Ryan White?)

[libgirl2]

11 minutes ago, kwnyc said:

Seriously! This could have been her very strong introduction. And with Trixie's dinner party, I did sort of wonder whether she's effectively moved in with Matthew already. But "woman cooking fail" is such an old trope used to show a woman with a career isn't REALLY successful (see the film "Woman of the Year"). AS IF they won't have a cook and a maid...

Same kind of thing with Nancy: she was completely raised in institutions, and moved into what's essentially an adult women's dorm. She's never had anyone to teach her about real budgeting and homemaking. She's still younger than her real age in a lot of ways. She's got a version of freedom now, and has no idea how to use it.

A strong performance by the actress in the role of the woman who finally leaves her husband, and they did not stint in showing how hard it was going to be for her. What amazed my 21st century eyes were that a woman with 2 kids was sharing a bed in a hostel (aka homeless shelter) and that was considered safe acceptable. (Not to mention that her husband could have tracked her down in a shelter). Didn't they used to have shelters on the show where they could send women away to to hide from batterers?

Oh, and hemophilia, argh...the kids with it didn't just get infected with HIV in the '80s, they were shunned and persecuted (remember Ryan White?)

Yes, I liked Sr. Veronica in this episode. They should have started her strong like this. 

It makes sense about Nancy being  younger than her age. She has grown as a midwife but not yet as a responsible adult. 

Regarding the woman at that shelter, places were probably like that. We have a shelter in the city I live in. From what I have seen, it is a comfortable place with toys for the children. 

Ryan White... I remember that well. People were afraid, I understand that totally, but some took their behavior to excess and were downright inhumane. 

[DonnaMae]

I wish they would continue with Sandy's story.  I hope an attorney is able to help her get a divorce, and I'd like to know how she was able to provide for her and her children.

[libgirl2]

2 minutes ago, DonnaMae said:

I wish they would continue with Sandy's story.  I hope an attorney is able to help her get a divorce, and I'd like to know how she was able to provide for her and her children.

They do revisit stories, so maybe they will. 

[dubbel zout]

1 hour ago, iMonrey said:

I'm just glad the wife didn't go back to her husband. That's the sort of thing that would have more likely happened than not.

That's the typical CtM happy(ish) ending. 

1 hour ago, libgirl2 said:

I agree about Nancy. I don't think she realized just how much was going out and not being saved. She wants to have fun with Collette and treat her to everything, I understand that. 

I liked how compassionate Phyllis was while still being stern, and recognizing that money management is something that has to be taught. It seems obvious not to spend more than you make, but that doesn't mean you know how to set up a budget. And there's a lot of psychology tied up with having stuff, as both Phyllis and Nancy acknowledged.

[Sarah 103]

44 minutes ago, kwnyc said:

And with Trixie's dinner party, I did sort of wonder whether she's effectively moved in with Matthew already. But "woman cooking fail" is such an old trope used to show a woman with a career isn't REALLY successful (see the film "Woman of the Year"). AS IF they won't have a cook and a maid...

I saw it as operating on TV Land logic-if a character is throwing a dinner party, it will go horribly wrong. (At this point I have decided that TV Land logic operates the same in the U.S and the U.K. There may be cultural differences, but for the most part TV Land logic is consistent). I don't see it as genderded, because Fraiser wasn't about career women and it still had dinner party (or any kind of party) disasters throughout the series.  

[Shanna Marie]

3 hours ago, Mermaid Under said:

Colette being thrilled with her Mother's budget seemed unreal.

I don't think it was so much the budget she was thrilled with as it was she would have a concrete way to track progress toward getting their own home and being able to live together. She'd been asking about that, and Nancy had been vague because she had no clue. Now Nancy was showing how it would be written down in the book, and they'd be able to look in the book and see how close they'd be to getting their home. It's like an Advent calendar, but instead of a clear view of how long it will be to Christmas, it's a clear view of how long until they get a real home.

1 hour ago, kwnyc said:

But "woman cooking fail" is such an old trope used to show a woman with a career isn't REALLY successful (see the film "Woman of the Year"). AS IF they won't have a cook and a maid...

That scene was right out of Bridget Jones's Diary, with the woman wanting to impress a man with her brilliant French cooking and having fantasies about throwing the perfect dinner party, but she doesn't actually know enough about cooking to be able to pull off the fancy recipes, so everything goes wrong. I was laughing out loud when they said they had plenty of eggs because the solution in Bridget Jones after they realized the dinner was a total loss was to make omelets. Cyril really elevated things by making eggs Benedict instead. I did like that he was the one who could cook, and it's amusing that a man who actually could take care of himself is getting fed by all the ladies in the community.

But does anyone in real life actually make the salt instead of sugar mistake? You'd have to keep it in totally unmarked containers to mix it up, and you generally use them in such different volumes that you wouldn't be able to get the amount of sugar you'd need to make a dessert from your typical salt container. It happens all the time in fiction, and the only way I can see actually making the mistake would be adding a pinch of the wrong thing if you have an unlabeled sugar bowl and an unlabeled salt cellar near each other. I don't see how anyone could accidentally put a cup of salt in something, thinking it was sugar. Maybe this trope came from the days of buying in bulk rather than prepackaged, so you might mix them up and put them in the wrong canisters.

[MaryHedwig]

7 hours ago, Daff said:

Someone teased in the ep. 1 discussion that Sr. V lied again, in episode 3, but I saw no sign of that. I loved the way she championed the abused wife and kids.

I loved her fierceness as well. We did she her lick the ice cream of a mother tending to her child in one of the opening scenes so she is not totally reformed.

[AZChristian]

38 minutes ago, Shanna Marie said:

But does anyone in real life actually make the salt instead of sugar mistake? You'd have to keep it in totally unmarked containers to mix it up, and you generally use them in such different volumes that you wouldn't be able to get the amount of sugar you'd need to make a dessert from your typical salt container. It happens all the time in fiction, and the only way I can see actually making the mistake would be adding a pinch of the wrong thing if you have an unlabeled sugar bowl and an unlabeled salt cellar near each other. I don't see how anyone could accidentally put a cup of salt in something, thinking it was sugar. Maybe this trope came from the days of buying in bulk rather than prepackaged, so you might mix them up and put them in the wrong canisters.

I recall someone on one of the baking competition shows recently who used salt instead of sugar.  And on an episode of Hell's Kitchen, one of the chefs used sugar instead of salt in a risotto.  

[Badger]

2 hours ago, LtKelley said:

Yes, she did. And so far this season, Sr Monica Joan's rampant dementia is in complete remission.

I don't think she's a financial savant and I suspect she hasn't internalized that Saturdays with Mom won't be spent shopping for toys and new clothes anymore, but Collette has voiced how she wants to live with Nancy and the bank savings book represents that goal. When the money available reaches x, they get to live together. I genuinely find it a little surprising no one was questioning Nancy's spending anyway. A personal tv up in the bedroom screams "I'm spending money" in 1968

There was a scene they cut last episode where Nancy and Colette are in Nancy's room and Nancy tells Colette she has gotten her a new dress for the Maypole dance and tells her to go try it on.  Trixie,  who has been reading a bridal magazine, looks up and notices the box.  She tells Nancy that it's from an expensive boutique and that Matthew said his wallet needed gas and air after he bought a sailor suit for Jonty there.

 

[Nialla]

8 hours ago, Daff said:

Someone teased in the ep. 1 discussion that Sr. V lied again, in episode 3, but I saw no sign of that. I loved the way she championed the abused wife and kids.

I know there was a cut scene about going to retrieve things from her flat. That was referenced late in the police station, but Sr. V said something about they were trying  to retrieve medication. I think that was the fib, to perhaps get the police to take it seriously.

[Daff]

25 minutes ago, MaryHedwig said:

I loved her fierceness as well. We did she her lick the ice cream of a mother tending to her child in one of the opening scenes so she is not totally reformed.

Ooh…I missed that! It’s right up there in (disgusting) memories of my childhood with spitting on the tissue to wipe your face. I suppose childbirth gives moms the right to “share” their spit?

[Daff]

1 hour ago, dubbel zout said:

I liked how compassionate Phyllis was while still being stern, and recognizing that money management is something that has to be taught.

Yes. And this actress (Linda ?) has always seemed to play those types of supportive, no nonsense roles. I always pay attention when I see her included in cast lists. (I have, now also when I see Miss Higgins listed.)

Edited April 3, 2023 by Daff

[Badger]

9 hours ago, Daff said:

I saw this. Raised the hair on the back of my neck and left me cold. Is it possible that each affiliate can choose which scenes to edit, or that they release several edited versions from which to choose (depending upon local needs)?

And that was seen at the end-corned beef hash, two eggs sunny side up. (Oh, yummy, yolky goodness)

Sorry about that.  

[Daff]

24 minutes ago, AZChristian said:

I recall someone on one of the baking competition shows recently who used salt instead of sugar.  And on an episode of Hell's Kitchen, one of the chefs used sugar instead of salt in a risotto.  

I’m sure THAT didn’t end well.😬 (first time I ever went looking for an emoji, as I prefer descriptive words, but all bets off where potty mouth is involved).

[Daff]

4 minutes ago, Badger said:

Sorry about that.  

That is quite alright, as you’re valiantly filling in gaps for us, and better additions than misses, right? Thanks for doing that, btw. I look for it every ep.

[Shanna Marie]

52 minutes ago, AZChristian said:

I recall someone on one of the baking competition shows recently who used salt instead of sugar.  And on an episode of Hell's Kitchen, one of the chefs used sugar instead of salt in a risotto.  

Wow! I'm a moderately competent home cook, and I can't imagine that mix-up from someone who could make it onto a baking competition -- unless they deliberately made the containers ambiguous to get that kind of mistake for the drama. I'm more likely to read a recipe carelessly and switch baking powder and baking soda or forget one when the recipe calls for both. Or I forget salt because I have a stupid cookbook that doesn't include things like salt and water in the list of ingredients, just in the directions, so if I'm only looking at the ingredient list as a reminder of amounts because I know the process I'll miss salt entirely. It's hard to fathom making a dessert and mixing up salt and sugar and not knowing it. But back to the show, Trixie is so precise that it seems out of character. The kind of process that a nurse would use to make sure she had the right meds in the right doses would apply to setting out ingredients for cooking. She might screw up on the technique due to lack of experience. Her meringues might fall or weep or she might over or under cook things, or she might overextend and have too elaborate a meal planned for her abilities so that she can't get all the courses out on time, but you'd think that someone with her background would at least be able to get the right ingredients in the right amounts. It seems like they went for the obvious trope rather than really thinking about how that character might go wrong in that situation.

[Daff]

I keep going away, thinking about the dissatisfaction here surrounding the continued use of Vanessa Redgrave to narrate the opening. While I contend that Jenny’s journal sentiments provided the impetus for the show’s concept, I do believe that the writers continue this in an attempt to stay true to the source material. Sometimes her voice is stronger than at other times, but the very accomplished actress is 86 years old, and I try every episode to absorb the content of the narration.  I really don’t think the creators knew when they started, this would be as popular or long-lived as it has been, and I don’t think any stage directors are screaming “Get me VR, we have to have her!” (there was a time, I’m sure).  I really don’t think Jenny’s words, emotions, and revelations as expressed in her writings were unique to her, rather, they were (an ‘every woman’s’) realizations about life. What female actress wouldn’t want to sign up for that?  I listen to those sentiments with care, for both the actress and the author.

Would Phyllis or Miss Higgins (or those actresses), the writers, creators, or directors really want to tell Ms. Redgrave that her services are no longer needed? She has accomplished much in her lifetime and still wants to work. I respect that.

I also respect the opinions of others, expressed here, and harbor no ill will for expressing a different opinion. It’s just a sad reminder that as we age, our efforts to remain vital aren’t always appreciated.

 

[Cetacean]

While I appreciate that it was originally Jenny that was doing the narration and is long gone, I believe that Vanessa is speaking for all of the women as roles and times change, sometimes for the better and sometimes not. I look forward to her remarks and am delighted that VR is still able to do it. 

[zoey1996]

3 hours ago, Shanna Marie said:

But does anyone in real life actually make the salt instead of sugar mistake?

I did, when I was learning to bake. I was around 10, and making sugar cookies. I can see it happening with Trixie, cooking in an unfamiliar kitchen, and trying to make so many new dishes, and feeling frazzled from the effort. I'm glad she was able to laugh about it! It was beyond rude for Sr. Monica Joan to invite herself, and make Trixie figure out how to get another portion to serve. I like Sr. Monica Joan, and see that she still has good and bad days, but the sisters and staff at Nonnatus house put up with a lot from her.

I am not a trained nurse, but it was years before I figured out that setting out the necessary ingredients before beginning to cook was the way to go. And to read to the recipe more than once before starting was helpful in success.

[iMonrey]

Quote

They do revisit stories, so maybe they will. 

They don't do it very often though. Like the woman last week with the aggressive form of breast cancer. Will we ever circle back to that? Probably not. Granted they want to tell different stories every week so if they kept revisiting the same ones over and over they wouldn't be able to do any new ones.

[Suzn]

3 hours ago, Daff said:

I keep going away, thinking about the dissatisfaction here surrounding the continued use of Vanessa Redgrave to narrate the opening. While I contend that Jenny’s journal sentiments provided the impetus for the show’s concept, I do believe that the writers continue this in an attempt to stay true to the source material.

My problem with the narration has nothing to do with Vanessa Redgrave or her age.  The writing of the narration is the problem.  It seems to have very little to do with the episode and to me is overly sentimental glop.  I don't see how it adds anything to the story we about to see or to wrap up the story that just finished.  When the show still had Jenny, the narration added something about Jenny's memories and changing perspective and now it sounds like an anonymous person that we don't know.

Edited April 4, 2023 by Suzn

[proserpina65]

On 3/12/2023 at 9:42 PM, txhorns79 said:

It's scary to think that marital rape was not a crime,

It wasn't until 1993 that it became a crime in the entire US.  Even now, there are states where marital rape is treated differently than non-marital rape.  I was surprised to find that I live in one of them.  Scary as hell.

On 3/9/2023 at 4:10 AM, katisha said:

I started to like Sister Veronica more in this episode because she tried so hard to help Sandy.

Me, too.

On 4/3/2023 at 12:26 AM, LtKelley said:

No. Home ec was cooking, sewing, and cleaning at my school, and you only took home ec if you weren't college material. Personally I think personal finance should be the new home ec and everyone should take it, not just the girls

We all took home ec when I was in middle school (girls and boys) but it was just sewing and cooking.

On 4/2/2023 at 11:33 PM, izabella said:

She should have stopped digging when she saw she was standing in a hole, not kept spending until she was in way over head.

Speaking from experience, sometimes the reality is so depressing that you stick your head in the sand and keep digging, hoping somehow it will all go away.  Not logical, obviously, but often how it goes.

On 4/3/2023 at 1:41 PM, Shanna Marie said:

But does anyone in real life actually make the salt instead of sugar mistake? You'd have to keep it in totally unmarked containers to mix it up,

I have.  I once had a Morton's salt container tear and had to pour the salt into an unmarked jar.  Then, the next time I needed to fill my sugar bowl, I forgot about the salt and thought that jar had sugar in it.  Oops.  Fortunately I used the "sugar" for a cup of coffee first and not for something bigger, so I was the only one to suffer from my mistake.