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Shanna Marie

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  1. Shanna Marie

    Season 4 Discussion

    The quitting everything and running off to be with a woman thing was even more jarring because I rewatched last season's finale right before this one came on, so it came right after he was wrestling with what to do about Amanda and realizing he couldn't leave the church for her. I guess he's not technically leaving the church and will be part of a cause, but I doubt he'll be able to be a pastor, given that mixed-race marriage was illegal at that time. You have to wonder what Amanda will think, given that he wasn't willing to give up his career for her, but he ditches everything for the next woman who comes along. They had a good built-in way to have written Sidney out. It seems like it was pretty commonly known in the village that he'd been involved with a married woman. Once he decided not to resign, the Bishop probably would have reassigned him, since his spiritual authority in that village would have been damaged by his behavior. He could have been sent to have a fresh start somewhere else. It isn't just the pedophiles who get reassigned because of scandal. I've reached the point when I'm glad he's going to be gone because the self-pity was getting to be overwhelming. We'll see how things go with the new priest.
  2. Shanna Marie

    OUAT vs. Other Fairy Tales: Compare & Contrast

    I think the live action Cinderella has been my favorite of the live-action remakes because it seemed more like a new version of the fairy tale, with a few Easter egg references to the Disney animated version, rather than like an actual remake of the Disney animated version. Beauty and the Beast was okay because it was interesting seeing that world interpreted in live action, but I'm not sure it added much to the story. I don't see the point of doing an animated remake of The Lion King (but then, even the cartoon was never a favorite of mine. There's a huge plot/character arc flaw, and now that I've seen it, I can't unsee it, and I thought the music was bland pop rather than the rather brilliant Broadway-style scores of the other animated films).
  3. Shanna Marie

    S06.E06: Dark Waters

    There's good stuff in this episode. I liked Nemo and the design of the Nautilus. I liked the follow-up about Liam 2.0. I liked Hook making amends, atoning, and taking responsibility. I also kind of liked the Charmings' and Regina's rescue mission to get Archie. But there's also a lot of nonsense. I still hate everything about the Savior plot. The shaky hands look stupid, and since no reason for them is given, the whole thing is just silly. At least say something like the human body isn't designed to channel that kind of power for long, so it starts to break down. Otherwise, you've got to wonder why certain people are given this power that's useless when they need it most, but they're still supposed to sacrifice their lives to hang on to this role, and oh yeah, they're destined to die. Plus, half the episode is about Emma convincing Aladdin that he can still help others even if he isn't the Savior, and the other half is about how terrible Hook is for not getting rid of the thing that could stop Emma from being the Savior, even though that will save her life. Shut up, Henry. If they wanted conflict between Hook and Henry, they needed to have set it up. The last time we heard anything about what Henry thought about Hook, it was when Henry insisted on coming along to save Hook from the Underworld (and he looked devastated when they learned Hook wasn't coming back). Before that, it was Henry talking about how he and Hook had picked out the house together for them all to move into. Now suddenly he resents Hook's presence. And even though he saw Hook sacrifice himself to save his family, Henry can say that Hook doesn't care about the family? Not to mention, Henry actually says that it's being the Savior that makes Emma special, like she isn't worthy on her own. Shut up. Most of the episode was so contrived and sloppy. How did the Evil Queen know what Hook had done with the shears? The scene showing what Hook was doing was juxtaposed against her confrontation with Regina. The villains on this show are so randomly omniscient. I don't think Emma even mentioned the shears when the Evil Queen was posing as Archie, did she? So EQ somehow found out about the shears, found out that Emma had them, found out that Hook was supposed to dump them, found out that Hook didn't dump them, and found out that Hook hid them in the garage in a toolbox -- even though she wasn't present for any of these things, and for a few of these events, nobody at all was present. Then we have Nemo so mortally wounded that he had to be taken to the Land of Untold Stories, but then he somehow survives days of lying in the forest in Storybrooke. There are multiple people in town who can magically heal, but David calls Snow to come to the hospital when they find Nemo. Unless Hook was somehow wearing his long pirate coat under his diving suit, he left his coat on the Nautilus. Did he somehow replace it during the curse? If Nemo took Liam away before the curse, then Liam didn't "grow up" alone on the docks. He was alone for maybe months. Not great, but it's not a lifetime, by any means. Sometimes I wonder if the writers even look at what they've written. The Belle stuff is utterly frustrating, given that she mentions a number of perfectly valid reasons why she shouldn't have Rumple in her or her child's life, and we see even more happening behind her back
  4. Shanna Marie

    The Cast in Other Lands/Roles

    That will require short hair and a shave. And I hope that working in Canada on an American show for all those years has improved his American accent since The Rite. I guess I'll have to hope it eventually ends up on some streaming service or on DVD because I don't have cable, and that channel is far enough down in the lineup that you usually have to get the more premium cable replacement streaming service to get it. I love the guy, but I'm not signing up for something like that to get one show. I read the book when I was in journalism school (it was an example of the New Journalism), but I'm not sure I ever actually saw the original movie. Incidentally, the mental image of him in clean-cut 60s mode reminds me that I spotted our King Arthur, Liam Garrigan, in one of the early episodes of Endeavour (I think it might have been season 2). He played the emcee of a beauty pageant and had that very slick mid-60s look, with the short, slicked down hair, no beard, and wearing a snug-fitting turtleneck. It took me a second to figure out who he was, but the voice was what made it click. He looks even more like Colin's brother clean-shaven than he did with the beard (as in, he looks a lot like Colin does when Colin is also clean-shaven). He'd have been much better casting for Liam.
  5. Shanna Marie

    S06.E05: Street Rats

    Rewatching this one had me yelling at the screen for numerous reasons. For one, how many times have these idiots been fooled by the villain pretending to be someone they trust? Just off the top of my head, there was Cora pretending to be Lancelot, Cora pretending to be Regina, Zelena pretending to be Ariel, Rumple pretending to be Hook, Zelena pretending to be Marian, and for bonus, there was Cora making the random murder victim look like Archie. You'd think they'd have learned by now to be more careful. They should have a whole system of passwords and verify a person's identity before they discuss sensitive info or if a person is acting at all odd. Archie should have mutual passwords with each patient, so that the patient can verify Archie's identity before spilling their guts and so that Archie can verify the patient's identity before bringing up anything from past sessions. The moment Archie barged into Snow's apartment and started to bring up Emma's sessions, she should have said, "Wait, what's the password?" Or, really, when he showed up at her car and started asking questions, she should have demanded the password. As Mad-Eye Moody would say, "Constant vigilance!" Though I suppose it depends on how the glamour thing works. Zelena seemed to get an instant infusion of all knowledge from the person she was copying, since she was able to perfectly imitate people she'd never actually met and knew nothing about. If it works like that, then the passwords would be pointless because the imitator would know them. But then if that's the case, Evil Queen-as-Archie wouldn't have needed to ask Emma questions. She would already have known everything. And it would certainly make figuring out what people are up to easier. Just cast a glamour spell and temporarily become that person, and then you know all! Then there's the Savior thing. I don't feel like the writers have any idea how it works. They seemed to be cribbing from Buffy, just change Slayer to Savior. Except on Buffy, the Slayers didn't die young because of some sort of destiny/prophecy thing in which they suddenly became helpless. They tended to die young because fighting vampires is dangerous. And I noticed that they didn't specify "young" when talking about Saviors here. They just said that it's the fate of all Saviors to die. Hello, it's the fate of everyone to die. The difference is when. I'm not sure what the deal with the shaky hands is supposed to be or where it comes from, but since that seems to stop the Savior from effectively using magic, why is severing the Savior fate such a bad thing? They already can't do anything and are more or less helpless. Staying as Savior just means they'll die, but they won't be able to do anything before they die. And if Aladdin got rid of his Savior status and, apparently, his magic, how did Regina's spell work to link Emma's magic to Aladdin's? He's not the Savior anymore, so they aren't alike. Nothing about this story line makes any sense.
  6. Shanna Marie

    S06.E03: The Other Shoe

    Thinking more about this one, the other way they copied "The Stable Boy" was in doing everything they could to stack the deck in the heroine's favor, only to then talk about her actions like she was the worst ever. So, we had Snow as a child, being manipulated by Cora, doing something she thought would help Regina, and yet later they talked about it as though Snow really was in the wrong, had wronged Regina, and deserved Regina's ire. If they were going to later act like she was at fault, all they had to do to set it up properly would have been have Snow get mad at Regina and tell Cora out of spite -- not thinking that would get Daniel killed, but thinking Cora would stop Regina from jilting Leopold and running away with Daniel. Here, they show Clorinda being awful to Ella. She was the one who burned the dress. Was she the one who coined the "Cinderella" name, or was that the other sister? There was no indication that she'd ever been at all kind to Ella, not even behind her mother's back. I'm sure she was aware that was possible, since I doubt the footman would have proposed if she'd been nasty to him all the time rather than only when her mother was watching. And yet Ella is considered the one who's truly wicked because she didn't put the happiness of the person who'd been tormenting her all that time ahead of her own. If that was the outcome they wanted, then why not show that Clorinda was nice to Ella behind Lady Tremaine's back? Then what Ella did would have looked more like a betrayal. I was rather amused by the "see something out of context and misinterpret it" part of the plot, where Ella saw the prince giving Clorinda a rose, since the big misunderstanding is a staple of the Hallmark movies, and the actress playing Ella/Ashley is in a lot of those. In this case, I'll let it slide, since the lifetime of abuse would have primed her to believe Lady Tremaine about a prince never wanting someone like her. However, it was still contrived because it seems like unlikely behavior for the prince. If you've just met the woman of your dreams, but you both barely know each other and therefore don't know enough to understand actions without context, are you going to risk even the slightest misunderstanding by excusing yourself to go give some other woman a red rose without first making it clear what you're doing? Most people would have said something like "I have a message to pass on for a friend" rather than just making a vague excuse because they wouldn't have wanted the woman of their dreams to think they were already with someone else. Without the explanation, jumping to the wrong conclusion is understandable. I'm not even sure why they bothered, since there's already the midnight thing built into the story if they needed a reason for Ella to run off, and Clorinda told her news right away, so the misunderstanding ended up being meaningless.
  7. Shanna Marie

    OUAT vs. Other Fairy Tales: Compare & Contrast

    I ran across a miniseries on Amazon Prime Video that might be of interest to OUAT fans: Jack and the Beanstalk: The Real Story. A wealthy real estate developer is building a casino at the castle his family owns, but work has to stop when they find bones. They're dinosaur-sized, but they're a human skeleton -- a human who's been murdered. He learns that he's descended from the original Jack, as in "and the beanstalk," that his family wealth came from the things Jack stole, and that Jack's actions were devastating to the world at the top of the beanstalk. Now he has to set things right or be executed for his ancestor's crimes. It's a Henson production (directed by Brian Henson), but not that muppety. There are really only a couple of puppet-type creatures (including the goose that lays golden eggs). I think most of the creature shop creations involve the makeup and prosthetics for the giants. It's from 2001 and was produced by Hallmark, so I guess it was on the Hallmark Channel (from the days before they specialized in sappy Christmas movies). The cast is pretty impressive for something so borderline cheesy. Matthew Modine is the lead, with Mia Sara as the female lead and supporting roles played by Jon Voight, Vanessa Redgrave, Daryl Hannah, and Richard Attenborough. Plus a bunch of people who were unknown at the time who became better known afterward. You pretty much need to keep IMDB open while watching to catch all the "Hey, it's that guy!" appearances. There's Anton Lesser (now known for Game of Thrones and Endeavour) as a nerdy scientist, a very young James Corden as the son of the giant Jack killed, Jim Carter (from Downton Abbey) as Odin, JJ Feild (Captain America and lots of Jane Austen movies) in a hideous wig as the original Jack, and a very, very young Freddie Highmore in a tiny role. For Once interest, we've got Tom Ellis (Robin 1.0) in another hideous wig as the bully whose treatment of Jack leads him to take the magic bean deal (and I think he also shows up as an extra in a crowd scene in a tavern) and there's Rachel Shelley (Milah) as the voice of the magic harp (possibly some motion capture there, too) and also in a tiny role as a woman picked up by Jon Voight's character (and, wow, is she stunning when glammed up). Like OUAT, we've got the modern day clashing with fairy tales, plus flashbacks and portal travel to a fairy tale world. And there's the revisionist look at fairy tales, though I think Jack was never what I'd consider a hero. This just takes the consequences of his stealing seriously, so it's not quite the Once-brand "the person you thought was a hero is really a villain." I'm not sure I'd call it good, but it is interesting and entertaining. IMDB lists two episodes and Amazon has it in three, so it's got some weird pacing. Nothing much happens until near the end of the first Amazon episode, but that would have been in the middle of the first part if it were just a two-parter. Still, it gets off to a really slow start, as we have to see the main character wake up in the morning, have a conversation with his butler about whether he should drink his coffee or his protein smoothie first, then have his insurance physical, then have a board meeting. But the last half of the series is pretty good. If you're missing the Once vibe but can't bear to rewatch season 6, this may be worth watching.
  8. While rewatching "The Strange Case," I had that "of course the good one is the villain because this show" reaction, but when I started to think about the characters who are traditionally heroes but who were turned into villains on this show, all I could think of was Pan and Arthur. Maybe Jack (as in the Beanstalk), but they didn't treat that one as the twist being that it turned out Jack was the evil one (James was the truly evil one there). It was more of a "hey, this girl is Jack" twist. Red might be a gray area, since her turning out to be the wolf meant she was actually both the villain and the hero of her fairy tale. Possibly Percival falls into this category, since he attacked Regina and nearly killed Robin, but he wasn't around long enough to really be a "villain." In season 7, there's Hansel the serial killer, but that wouldn't have been a factor in the impression for this episode. We may see Merlin as rather shady because he's ultimately responsible for a lot of the problems they faced, but the show doesn't seem to see or depict him this way. Were there any others? I think a lot of this impression may be helped by the fact that they liked to smear the heroes, so they were still heroes instead of being classified as villains, but because they did a bad thing, they're as bad as the villains. So there's Snow, who's a bandit and is a secret teller (the actual episode doesn't seem to show her as being horrible, but whenever it's referenced later, it seems to be acknowledged by everyone that this was a terrible thing for her to do and she deserves all the blame), and later a murderer, and then there's the eggnapping. Jiminy Cricket tried to get his parents killed and ended up destroying Gepetto's parents. Gepetto and Blue betrayed the Charmings. Emma killed Cruella. Ava told a secret and tripped Cora. Leopold didn't dance with Regina. And the fact that they generally give sympathetic treatment to villains helps with the impression that of course the one who seems good will be bad and the one we think is bad is just misunderstood. There are a lot of misunderstood/their evil was at least somewhat justified because they were wronged/they're really the victim villains: Regina, Rumple, Hook, Cora, Zelena, Ingrid, Maleficent, Ursula, Hyde. I guess having a few of the traditional heroes turn out to be villains, plus a number of heroes shown to be "just as bad" as the villains, plus a number of villains who were the real victims or misunderstood adds up to that impression that of course the good one would turn out to be the real villain and the bad one would turn out to just be misunderstood.
  9. Shanna Marie

    S06.E03: The Other Shoe

    Okay, I'll sort of give them this because her not talking to them could even imply that they were in another city, like Ashley had fake memories of growing up somewhere else and running away from home to Storybrooke, where she got by working as a hotel maid, and in reality, "another city" was the Land of Untold Stories. Though I liked the version where Anastasia was a stepsister better because it was interesting imagining one of the stepsisters going on to have her own story (instead of just a rehash of "The Stable Boy"). Plus, I think hers was a better redemption. The "I wasn't really being mean, I was just protecting myself by being mean to you all this time without so much as a single word of kindness to you behind my mother's back, so I'm actually good and that means it was evil of you to rat me out" thing is rather unsatisfying. I liked the idea that Ana really was selfish and shallow and awful, but ended up having a true redemption after going through a lot. I don't think that standing by while someone else is abused while not agreeing with the abuse is enough to redeem one of the stepsisters.
  10. Shanna Marie

    S06.E04: Strange Case

    I don't know if it was this episode or just the fact that I can't seem to get through two episodes back to back without zoning out, but I found it rather boring this time around. I kind of like the twist that Jekyll is the bad one, except how many times have they done the "the hero is actually the villain!" story on this show? Plus, Hyde has done some pretty nasty things. He's certainly no angel, though I don't think a truly good man would have come up with that potion. And if all the bad stuff was put into another person, how would Jekyll still be bad? It's like how Regina didn't change at all even when her worst qualities were removed and put in another person. I don't think these writers understood the point of the Jekyll and Hyde story. They also don't understand teaching or schools. Snow was teaching elementary school, and now she decides she wants to teach again and apparently just shows up and starts teaching high school physics. Considering that they were cursed into those roles, wouldn't there already have been a physics teacher? Or did that person skip out when they opened the door to send the Camelot people home? You'd think the position left open would have been Snow's old job making birdhouses, since she ditched it to run off to Camelot and then the Underworld. Henry should probably be a grade or two behind since he keeps missing so much school -- six weeks in Camelot, however long he was in the Underworld. He's probably been out half a semester, unless some of that came during the summer. Baby Snowflake is really cute now that he's big enough to be more than a blanket-wrapped bundle and is looking around and interacting with people. He was utterly fascinated with Jekyll, possibly because he could see his reflection in the glasses.
  11. Shanna Marie

    S06.E03: The Other Shoe

    Aside from the retread of "The Stable Boy" (as mentioned above), this episode comes closer to being what I'd have expected of the concept of "untold stories," with the characters from known stories whose stories were untold -- secondary characters, people behind the scenes, etc. There's a wealth of that in fairy tales and classic literature, and they could have had so much fun with that because there's a lot more latitude. Why butcher (and mostly ignore) the main character of a classic story so that their version has almost nothing to do with the original (Monte Cristo) when they can play with the background characters and do anything they want with them? I know they ended up ignoring all the hints they dropped that Anastasia from the Wonderland spinoff was one of Cinderella's stepsisters, and since they never outright said she was, I guess this isn't necessarily a retcon, but didn't they say something in season one about Ashley living with her stepfamily? She couldn't have been, if her stepsister and stepmother were in another land. Did Regina curse her into an entirely different stepfamily? This Lady Tremaine was absolutely wonderful. I don't know if there's enough story to the character for her to have been an arc villain, but it would have been great if they could have kept her around as an ongoing irritant antagonist -- not really a threat, but stirring things up. It's a pity they didn't give Emma more comedy-related storylines because JMo does some good physical humor. I love the way she was so agitated in Archie's office and just flopped over the back of the couch to lie down. Funny how Emma's complaint that barely gets addressed is about how she has to dedicate herself to helping other people get their happy endings but doesn't get one of her own, while Regina's complaint that has everyone rushing around to help her and that set off this whole Evil Queen plot is that she hates not murdering people and is sad because not murdering people doesn't guarantee her a happy life.
  12. I'm not sure it really did remain all that decent, unless we're considering "decent" to mean "average" and giving it a C grade. It had its moments, but the rewatch has shown me that the faults were already showing. It had become a show of "moments" and there were few truly good episodes. What helped, I think, was the fact that while they hit the same beats over and over again in a way that ruined the characters, they did have some variety in structure. After 2B, they spent the next arc in Neverland, so we had less of the Storybrooke routine, and during that arc they dialed back the Regina victim stuff (while still showing her being awful in the past). She actually owned up to failing to follow up on the possibility of being with her soulmate rather than acting like the universe owed her. Then in 3B, the flashbacks were mostly of the Missing Year rather than the distant past, which meant there was some variety rather than the usual round of Regina vs. Snow. In 4A, we had Frozen as a distraction, though just about everything else that arc hit all the usual beats -- the David suddenly hates Hook episode, Emma having intimacy issues, Regina feeling sorry for herself, Belle believing in Rumple while Rumple pursues power behind her back. We were just missing the annual Hook flashback of something bad in his past that he tries to atone for now (that came in 4B). 4B was utterly terrible and couldn't qualify as "decent." We had another change of scenery in 5A, with the twist of having most of the flashbacks being about Camelot in the recent past (though, again, we hit the usual beats). 5B was the same setting but different and had the distraction of bringing back a lot of the dead characters, but again, all the usual beats (with a small bit of variety -- this time it was Hook's brother, not Hook, doing something awful in a flashback that he regrets in the present). 6 was a disaster in part because there was no hiding from the flaws. The Evil Queen plot spotlighted the usual Regina story. The Savior Shakes emphasized the repetitive Emma WALLS story. They were in the usual setting, so there was no real distraction, and the Untold Stories characters weren't used enough to make anything feel fresh and new or to provide a diversion (like the Frozen characters did). They even tried to redo the feel of season one, so it was even more obvious how the show had changed (and not in the good way where it feels like progress). And it had become so predictable, so the moment anything was said about David's father not dying the way they thought he did, everyone who's ever watched the show immediately said "Hook did it." I think it also helped seasons 3-5 that Emma was actually fairly underdeveloped after season one, so she didn't get destroyed along with most of the others, and Hook remained weirdly immune to the kind of destruction they did to the other characters, and even when they did weird things with his backstory, Colin sold it in the present so we believed Hook's shame and guilt. That meant we had at least two characters who weren't shadows of themselves until season six, when the repetition got really tiresome and they were made to act so wildly out of character.
  13. I think a big part of the problem is that both of these things were going on, and most of the change came during season two. It was in 2B when Snow started alternating between hope speeches and despair, and those two beats were hit over and over again for the rest of the series. I think most of the Snow storylines, whether in flashback or present-day, were either about her despairing and being taught to have hope or about her choosing not to do the most appropriate thing to deal with the situation because of some vague idea of hope that some better way would come along. It was in 2B when they started having Regina be super evil in the past but a misunderstood victim in the present, and that was the only beat they hit with her. Even the Robin relationship storyline ended up boiling down to Regina as misunderstood victim who just can't win. Belle's downfall came earlier in season 2, when she saw just how evil Rumple had been and still was and yet she was still championing his good heart. That kept getting reset every season, when she'd be angry at him for something he did, break up, then come back to him, only to be shocked when she discovered that he was evil again. Rumple was seriously ruined in season 4 when he went off on an evil spree about five minutes after giving his heartfelt pledge at Neal's grave to do better, but I think the seed was planted in season 2 when he found his son and it didn't seem to matter at all to him. He no longer had that excuse for his actions, but he got even worse, and he pretty much ignored the long-lost son he was reunited with. Henry was ruined in 2B, as well, when the other characters stopped challenging his childlike declarations ("heroes don't kill!") and when he didn't seem to be all that bothered by what Regina and Cora were doing. Basically, 2B killed the series and most of the characters. Emma didn't get truly ruined until season six, but the problem was that they just kept hitting the same beats. Every season she would struggle with her magic, have a big breakthrough of believing in herself, then be able to do anything. They supposedly solved the WALLS problem in season 5, but then they're back in a few episodes. I find it utterly bizarre that they took a character whose main issue was a tendency to go it alone and not trust people, and her Final Battle and climactic moment in the series required her to face her enemy alone. Emma's big victory should have involved a group effort, her calling on the others for help. That would have demonstrated how different she was from the person who came to town in season one, and it might have provided a twist in the prophecy, rather than it just playing out exactly as we saw, like if she realized that the problem was that her friends and family were just standing by in the vision, and the way to change things was to get them involved. While they didn't actually ruin Hook, I think the problem with him was that although he'd changed so much internally and he went through so much, the character didn't actually change. He did the right things and usually said the right things, but they changed as little as possible about him -- same wardrobe, same piratey regalia, still carrying around the flask of rum to sip from in moments of stress (which gets uncomfortable in retrospect since they depicted WHook in season 7 as an alcoholic who stopped drinking when he turned his life around). We'd seen him change his life a couple of times in flashbacks, and in those instances he changed everything, so it makes little sense for him to perhaps make the biggest change of all without really changing. I guess that's another problem, that there were a lot of mutually exclusive things going on -- Snow is the pessimist who gives hope speeches. Regina is the super-powerful queen/mayor who's an underdog. Rumple always chooses power and does evil but he has a good heart and Belle is right to believe in him. Emma is wrong to have WALLS and always go it alone, but dealing with the current crisis is her sole responsibility as the Savior and she should sacrifice everything for others. Hook is totally reformed and has renounced evil, revenge, and darkness, but he can't change anything else about himself, like the way he dresses, talks, or acts.
  14. I think to some extent they did that with all the characters, even the regulars. Season one Snow wasn't at all about hope speeches. She stood up to Regina, was snarky, and was willing to fight. The time they made her like the cartoon Snow, she was under the influence of a potion, and it was done as a surprise twist joke, where she just looked like she was being all sweet and whistle while you work, before she went after the bird with her broom. It's only in later seasons that they retroactively made her more like the cartoon and had her be all about naive hope (without any plan for the "better way" she kept talking about) -- except for every other episode when she was all doom and gloom and gave up instantly. Hook did get fleshed out pretty well and got some decent storylines, but the character was never allowed to evolve naturally, the way you'd expect him to, given all his other growth. He never got to really change his costume other than switching from the leather pants to jeans, never got to change some of the key character traits. Emma had her WALLS. Even Regina, their favorite, never really got a storyline other than being worried that being a villain meant she wouldn't get a happy ending. Going back to the discussion of what storylines they should have done in the aftermath of season five, I have to say that if dealing even somewhat realistically with the effects of a storyline that involved what was essentially a demonic possession, a near death, a death, and torture is too dark for your show, then maybe the storyline involving demonic possession, death, and torture is a little dark in the first place. In a fantasy show, you don't have to go full-on realistic. People do die and come back from the dead without too much trauma, and they go through all kinds of crazy adventures without being too deeply affected, but when you pile things on to that extent and then it's instantly like it never actually happened, you can't tell any difference in the character, and it's never mentioned again, you have a cartoon, not a character. It's like Wile E. Coyote getting smashed by anvils, falling off a cliff, and blown up by an ACME bomb and then a second later it's like it never happened.
  15. Shanna Marie


    What Endeavor put back in the church was the real evidence that proved the guy really had been guilty--the evidence Thursday and his partner hadn't been able to find, even though they were sure the guy was guilty, and thus the planted fake evidence. But finding the real evidence was also proof that the previous evidence had been faked, which was why Morse hid it again. It wouldn't have changed the outcome of the case, but it would have possibly reflected badly on Thursday. Even if Thursday wasn't the one who faked the evidence, he went along with it, which still goes along with the idea that Thursday's always been willing to blur the lines a little. The difference is that he's been doing that to ensure that justice gets done, regardless of the details, while now he's benefiting personally.