S12.E09: Patisserie Week

[J-Man]

So I guess this means there will be a limbo-off next week?  

[ZeeEnnui]

On 11/18/2021 at 4:18 PM, magdalene said:

Well, I am rooting for Guiseppe to win this. As long as it's not Chrystelle, who gives me big phony vibes trading on her looks and pretending big eyed "Oh my I am so shocked I am doing so well". While underneath it all is the soul of a barracuda.  That one is no Ruby who was genuine and gorgeous on top of it.

Umm...not sure how Chrystelle is trading on her looks in the tent. These aren't professional actors, they're home bakers that are not used to being on camera. A lot of them have awkward quirks that may seem outsized or "phony" -- hell constant Zoom's during the pandemic have alerted me to some of my most annoying fidgety quirks -- but that's because they're not used to being on camera. I remember Candice Brown who won a few years ago. A lot of people didn't like her bold lipstick or lip licking because it came off as a little affected but again just nerves. Chrystelle is really funny (Candice was too), and I'll bet she's a blast over a drink or three at the pub. Like these bakes, it's all down to personal taste when it comes to the bakers. 

This was one hell of a sugary Thunderdome. All four of the bakers came in really strong but if we had to lose someone, I'm okay with Jurgen. What can I say...I hate Matcha with the fire of a thousand suns! Love all three remaining bakers (Chigs can call me anytime) but unless there is a huge upset I'm leaning towards Italy snatching another victory from England this year. 

Side note: I nearly bought that David Bowie costume Noel was wearing in the opening sketch, but it was sold out. Next year! Also, is the show blackmailing Paul with something -- certainly not his affair scandal. Maybe admitting American desserts aren't terrible? -- to make him perform in the opening skit? No one asked for Paul Hollywood's cringe comedy fails.

[SemiCharmedLife]

I'm commiserating with the other posters from the US who were spoiled by social media (mine was a notification that was sent to me!).  I will watch the final online this week, so I won't have to isolate myself until Friday.

What an amazing episode!  The bakers did so well in all the challenges (with the exception of some "technical" difficulties).  It must have been excruciating sending someone home. I truly thought Jürgen would make it to the finals, but I am sure we will see him in a holiday special in the near future.  He has so many excellent baking skills and a wonderful calming presence.  

I can't wait to see Giuseppe, Chigs and Crystelle bring it next week!

[GaT]

JURGEN????? How did Jurgen get eliminated, he was a lock since the first episode. I'm in total shock.

[kittykat]

As I said last week Jürgen was my fourth favorite but that was still gutting.  Matt was so nonchalant going into the announcement that I thought for sure nobody was going home and man it would have been fine.  I thought Giuseppe was going home since I thought his Pisa setup was a little simple but he got saved by a handshake.  And it's not like you could go back, everyone's record is phenomenal.  And as we saw with Hermine last year, even the one with the most wins isn't safe.

After the technical I thought Chigs was doomed even after the handshake.  I was impressed how he bounced back after the biscuit broke off but beside his "pink lady" glaze those apples looked awesome.  Once Crystelle was judged for her flawless showstopper I knew the wunderkinds were in and the juggernauts were fighting for the last spot.

Absolutely thrilled Crystelle got Star Baker.  I don't sense anything fake in her.  I think out of the four she saw herself as the underdog.  Her loud cheery family is always a joy to hear.

In terms of baking and emotion, one of the best episodes they've ever had.  I have no problem with anybody them winning.  I just wish all four we're going.

Edited November 20, 2021 by kittykat

[SemiCharmedLife]

39 minutes ago, ZeeEnnui said:

Umm...not sure how Chrystelle is trading on her looks in the tent. These aren't professional actors, they're home bakers that are not used to being on camera. A lot of them have awkward quirks that may seem outsized or "phony" -- hell constant Zoom's during the pandemic have alerted me to some of my most annoying fidgety quirks -- but that's because they're not used to being on camera. I remember Candice Brown who won a few years ago. A lot of people didn't like her bold lipstick or lip licking because it came off as a little affected but again just nerves. Chrystelle is really funny (Candice was too), and I'll bet she's a blast over a drink or three at the pub. Like these bakes, it's all down to personal taste when it comes to the bakers. 

This was one hell of a sugary Thunderdome. All four of the bakers came in really strong but if we had to lose someone, I'm okay with Jurgen. What can I say...I hate Matcha with the fire of a thousand suns! Love all three remaining bakers (Chigs can call me anytime) but unless there is a huge upset I'm leaning towards Italy snatching another victory from England this year. 

Side note: I nearly bought that David Bowie costume Noel was wearing in the opening sketch, but it was sold out. Next year! Also, is the show blackmailing Paul with something -- certainly not his affair scandal. Maybe admitting American desserts aren't terrible? -- to make him perform in the opening skit? No one asked for Paul Hollywood's cringe comedy fails.

 I can't believe how many silly skits Paul has agreed to this year!  I have this thought that maybe being in the bubble, he, Noel and Matt are enjoying a pint after filming and come up with ideas for crazy opening sketches.  They all have a laugh and before you know it, Paul has agreed to it!

[phalange]

Normally I don't like spoilers but I spoiled myself on purpose because I knew this was going to be a tough elimination. I feel bad for Jurgen, especially because he didn't get a handshake when everyone else did, but he should be proud of everything he baked. With all of them being star bakers this elimination was always going to come down to the little details and the judges just didn't like his showstopper as much as the others.

Crystelle deserved star baker. Her showstopper looked beautiful. I love the bright pink and orange she used for the centerpiece and the glaze. Crystelle seems like such a nice person to me, and her reactions look nothing but genuine. Her phone call to her family was great and I love how excited they all are for her. And now she and Noel have to have a limbo contest!

The finale is really going to be a nail-biter because I could see any of them winning.

[Rickster]

5 hours ago, GaT said:

JURGEN????? How did Jurgen get eliminated, he was a lock since the first episode. I'm in total shock.

I think Jurgen was the best baker of the season from a technical point of view, but lagged a bit in creativity, both in design and flavors, which did him in this episode.

[ombre]

2 hours ago, Rickster said:

I think Jurgen was the best baker of the season from a technical point of view, but lagged a bit in creativity, both in design and flavors, which did him in this episode.

The most painful thing, I suspect, for him is that these are some of his most adventurous bakes. Beets! Matcha!*. If he'd stuck to more traditional approaches where he wasn't having to convince the judges to go along with his flavors would he have stayed?  I wonder what future contestants will take from looking at juergen's path. Don't go big in the first eps? Don't get known for perfection early on - let Paul feel like you've "grown" in the experience because that's the narrative arc of the show? Play safe with the flavors? (although even there you can go wrong - I think there was one ep where they complained that chocolate and orange don't go together? And another where they were very skeptical of... Was it cinnamon, cloves, and star anise? They sometimes take it into their heads to be inexplicably horrified by very traditional combinations.)

 

* And matcha approached through special techniques to appeal to even those who don't like matcha! I don't like matcha and I'd *love* to try those desserts! I've long been waving the banner of "if you hate green tea because you don't like the grassy flavor then you should try it one last time but not over-brewed, because if you get it in a coffee shop they always just pull the water out of the espresso machine, which is *way* too hot for green tea!" and yet I have the same complaint about matcha and have suspected there must be another, better way! 

Edited November 20, 2021 by ombre

[Cetacean]

9 hours ago, Nidratime said:

All season, I expected Chigs to go because he has little experience and seems to have learned everything on the fly via book learning.

Obviously he has natural talent.  My first batch of cookies as a kid were probably not very good but over they years they have improved tremendously.  The fact that he is a newbie makes it all the more impressive to me.  He's mastered some very tricky things in a short time (things I've never even heard of!) and manages to execute them beautifully.  I think he has incredible talent for doing so well.

[cynicat]

14 hours ago, blueray said:

I'm sad to see Jurgen go. But I think he struggled with the "creativity" part. Like you look at his show stopper and it was technically perfect but everyone else had way more elaborate bakes. He did win technical which shows where his strengths are. 

Agree.

This really was a tough call, and at least to me, they were all neck and neck.  Jürgen was creative in different flavors, but personally I thought that sometimes they were odd.  (Beets and matcha?) His real error was spending too much time on the centerpiece, which was clearly a passion, when he should have spent that time on the entremets which were meant to be the main focus.  The centerpiece was secondary as Prue and Paul alluded to multiple times during the judging.  

Last week many were upset because Lizzie was eliminated instead of Jürgen, even though he dropped his sausage rolls and had a relatively visually boring cake with no embellishments.  At these levels of competition, it's not who is worst as much as who is very slightly below all the other excellent bakers.  

[PaulaO]

I came here specifically for spoilers.  I didn’t want any of them to go home.  I’m gonna skip this episode and go straight to the finale.  As far as Juergen, remember when we all thought Richard aka Bob the Builder was a lock for winning the season?  Sadly, surprises do happen.  And I always liked Ruby T from season 4.  She really was a nervous wreck, but when she got her confidence, she was on fire.

[sharifa70]

1 hour ago, Cetacean said:

Obviously he has natural talent.  My first batch of cookies as a kid were probably not very good but over they years they have improved tremendously.  The fact that he is a newbie makes it all the more impressive to me.  He's mastered some very tricky things in a short time (things I've never even heard of!) and manages to execute them beautifully.  I think he has incredible talent for doing so well.

I agree that he must have a great deal of natural talent, but I also think that one year of baking experience during a pandemic lockdown with no kids to homeschool must be the equivalent of seven years of normal-life baking experience. My own ambitious lockdown baking attempts resulted in flat choux that tasted of scrambled eggs and never became eclairs; macarons that had the proper shine and feet but tasted terrible; a killed sourdough starter (the saddest of all because I was managing decent blueberry scones); and a loaf of bread that was actually edible but now I can’t find the recipe. 

Chigs is pretty fantastic is what I’m saying. I will be happy with any of the three winning and absolutely gutted for the two runners-up. Also happy for Crystelle and Giuseppe advancing and sorry to lose Jürgen. 

[Adiba]

1 hour ago, ombre said:

The most painful thing, I suspect, for him is that these are some of his most adventurous bakes. Beets! Matcha!*. If he'd stuck to more traditional approaches where he wasn't having to convince the judges to go along with his flavors would he have stayed?  I wonder what future contestants will take from looking at juergen's path. Don't go big in the first eps? Don't get known for perfection early on - let Paul feel like you've "grown" in the experience because that's the narrative arc of the show? Play safe with the flavors? (although even there you can go wrong - I think there was one ep where they complained that chocolate and orange don't go together? And another where they were very skeptical of... Was it cinnamon, cloves, and star anise? They sometimes take it into their heads to be inexplicably horrified by very traditional combinations.)

 

* And matcha approached through special techniques to appeal to even those who don't like matcha! I don't like matcha and I'd *love* to try those desserts! I've long been waving the banner of "if you hate green tea because you don't like the grassy flavor then you should try it one last time but not over-brewed, because if you get it in a coffee shop they always just pull the water out of the espresso machine, which is *way* too hot for green tea!" and yet I have the same complaint about matcha and have suspected there must be another, better way! 

Paul also has changed some of his "tastes" over the years. One earlier season someone used yuzu and he didn't really like it. Same with peanut butter--but when Nadia used it, he liked it. Go figure. I remember when Mary Berry was a judge that she might admit she wasn't that fond of a particular ingredient, but would praise the baker's item anyway if it was well-executed.

He seems to like lemon, ginger, and lime--and banana providing one can get enough flavor out of it without using artificial flavor. In the future, they should do a challenge that is "free-from" Paul's favorite flavors. Might be interesting?

I hope the show doesn't turn into the "Paul Hollywood's Most-Improved Baker Show" --could be a spin-off, but I really like to see all-round good bakers compete in this show. The finalists are all good, but I hope Crystelle doesn't use sesame or miso--or decorate her showstopper with piped rosette arches like she did the last two episodes--in the final. I'm still rooting for Giuseppe, though.

[Kiddvideo]

I would’ve liked to see more savory bakes. We’ve only had a couple this season, I think, and I like seeing the bakers tested on a wider variety of skills and ingredients.

ETA: I won’t be disappointed by whomever wins though. Some years I’m so offended by a finalist I’ve sworn to stop watching if they win.

Edited November 20, 2021 by Kiddvideo

[chaifan]

This was a great episode and had me guessing 'til the end.  Chigs or Juergen?  Chigs or Juergen? 

Juergen's elimination makes sense to me.  Yes, Chigs bombed on the technical.  But, no one did exceptionally well.  Even though Juergen won, it was far from perfect. 

On the signature, Chigs' looked amazing.  High end patisserie quality.  Juergen's looked a bit messy, especially on the sides, and the daggers didn't come off well. 

On the showstopper, I agree that Juergen's boats were a bit too plain.  Maybe he was going for Japanese minimalism.  I think they were beautiful on their own, perfectly glazed.  But as a scene, they failed to pop and were washed out. 

I really don't mind the rice krispy forms, but I think Giuseppe could have made his tower out of individual cakes.  His entrements were also minimal, but the bright green mirror glaze and the tiny white flower on top were just enough to set them off without being too fussy. 

I think Chrystelle really deserved star baker this week.  Even on her technical, while there were problems with the bake, it was the prettiest one at the table.  And I think in patisserie week, looks count more than ever.  Speaking of looks...  the "trading on her looks" comment above is just offensive.  Chrystelle has never done anything to deserve that type of comment.  (Really, no baker has.)  It not only should offend her, but the judges, too. 

I think any of the three could win.  It's either going to come down to someone having an off day or accident, or it will come down to the pickiest of details.  I'm hoping for the latter.

[iMonrey]

I have nothing against Jurgen, and if he opened his own shop I'd gladly frequent the establishment and sample his lovely baked goods. But the truth is I just never warmed up to him the way I have to the other three, so this is really my dream final three. It seemed like this episode was telegraphing that Chigs was going to go home. Prue described exactly what not to do in the technical, cut to Chigs doing just that. Also, the preview showing him breaking off part of his apple tree. I'm so relieved it was all just a misdirect. 

I really thought Crystelle had the best looking showstopper, and that Giuseppe had the worst looking. The judges seemed to have the strongest objections to Giuseppe and Jurgen's showstoppers so I kind of figured maybe one of them would go by the end, but it was still a nail biter. I'm glad I wasn't spoiled by social media. 

It seems like the two front runners all season have been Jurgen and Giuseppe and they are now kind of running out of steam, whereas dark horses Crystelle and Chigs just keep getting stronger. It wouldn't surprise me to see either of them win.

I thought the opening skit was really stupid . . . until Prue walked in and Noel called her Buddy Holly. LOL. 

[Suzn]

I've had enough of Paul's handshakes.  This time it sort of made me sick that he seemed to pointedly give handshakes to 3 of the 4.  I simply don't believe that all 3 were so exceptional that they deserved that special honor.  I think Prue was not happy about it either.

I hated to see Jurgen go.  He was my favorite and my pick as the winner from the first.  I know he was not putting on an expressive show and was more serious, but I he was patient and went along with nonsense well.  They went out of the way to eliminate him from the final and it was really a stretch. 

I have liked all the contestants this season, so there has been no one I was hoping to get rid of.  I would be happy with the final 3 if I wasn't sure that either Chiggs or Giuseppe should have gone rather than Jurgen.

[iMonrey]

Quote

I've had enough of Paul's handshakes.  This time it sort of made me sick that he seemed to pointedly give handshakes to 3 of the 4.  I simply don't believe that all 3 were so exceptional that they deserved that special honor.  I think Prue was not happy about it either.

I don't think there was anything deliberately mean about it. If I remember correctly, Jurgen was second to be judged, after Chigs got a handshake, and while Paul did like his signature bake he didn't "love" it. Paul himself may not have expected to be as impressed as he was with Crystelle's and Giuseppe's. I think if Jurgen was judged fourth, after the other three had gotten handshakes, that would have been more of a snub.

[Ellaria]

34 minutes ago, Kiddvideo said:

I would’ve liked to see more savory bakes. We’ve only had a couple this season, I think, and I like seeing the bakers tested on a wider variety of skills and ingredients.

ETA: I won’t be disappointed by whomever wins though. 

Agree on the savory bakes. I really enjoyed the soda bread challenge of last season because the bakers were required to do a savory and a sweet bake.

I will not be disappointed by the winner, regardless of who it is. I like all three of them. If I had to guess, I'd go with Crystelle. She seems to be gaining momentum (and confidence) as the season moves along. That often leaves a positive impression with the judges because it indicates that she is learning and improving.

Alternatively, Giuseppe may have peaked a bit early. The judges seem to be a bit more critical of his bakes now. I adore Chigs and think he must be a baking genius to be able to tackle this type of competition after only a year of baking. He certainly has a great story but that's true whether he wins or not.

[dgpolo]

7 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Quote

I've had enough of Paul's handshakes.  This time it sort of made me sick that he seemed to pointedly give handshakes to 3 of the 4.  I simply don't believe that all 3 were so exceptional that they deserved that special honor.  I think Prue was not happy about it either.

I don't think there was anything deliberately mean about it.

Almost the same thing happened in the finale of season 7

Spoiler

Paul gave a handshake to Candice and Jane, Andrew was the only one not to get one. Then he came first in the Technical.

 

[roseslg]

I wonder why we never hear comments about male bakers trading on their looks...🧐

[dleighg]

56 minutes ago, chaifan said:

I really don't mind the rice krispy forms, but I think Giuseppe could have made his tower out of individual cakes.  His entrements were also minimal, but the bright green mirror glaze and the tiny white flower on top were just enough to set them off without being too fussy. 

one thing that just occurred to me- what did the green balls have to do with the white "tower of pisa"? (although I'm not sure what Crystele's balls had to do with the wedding arch either, but at least they were in similar colors)

[Suzn]

38 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

I don't think there was anything deliberately mean about it. If I remember correctly, Jurgen was second to be judged, after Chigs got a handshake, and while Paul did like his signature bake he didn't "love" it. Paul himself may not have expected to be as impressed as he was with Crystelle's and Giuseppe's. I think if Jurgen was judged fourth, after the other three had gotten handshakes, that would have been more of a snub.

I think he decided to stick it to Jurgen for the last two.  I don 't believe they were both exceptional.

[illdoc]

1 hour ago, dleighg said:

(although I'm not sure what Crystele's balls had to do with the wedding arch either, but at least they were in similar colors)

There was also a tall, white candle in the middle. I believe the balls were supposed to represent votive type candles. I think in India, you would have a large candle in the center with votive candles around it (representing .... something I'm sure).

[Guest]

On 11/19/2021 at 11:42 AM, Adiba said:

What was it with Paul giving out three handshakes? If he was suddenly going to become a handshake whore, why wait until the semi-final and just not give Jurgen one? It screams producer-driven shenanigans to me.

100% this. The minute everyone got a handshake except for Jurgen, I knew he was a goner. I watched the episode this morning, looked up on Google who'd won, and stopped watching the rest of the show.

[pfk505]

Do people really think there's some kind of conspiracy and that Paul / the producers were "sticking it" to Jurgen by not giving him a handshake? For what possible reason? Its not like Jurgen has had a poor edit or anything like that, he's universally beloved!

I agree that 3 was too many handshakes but I'm guessing Paul just got caught up in the moment. Someone pointed out that its actually fewer total handshakes than last season, so that's a positive, but I can remember a time where it felt like there was less than 5 per season. Those days are long gone. Regardless, I really don't get the sense any of that was done specifically to single out Jurgen.

[akr]

5 hours ago, chaifan said:

On the showstopper, I agree that Juergen's boats were a bit too plain.  Maybe he was going for Japanese minimalism.  I think they were beautiful on their own, perfectly glazed.  But as a scene, they failed to pop and were washed out. 

I think he said he'd planned to decorate them, but ran out of time (presumably because of the troubles with his torii gate). They didn't need a lot, but they definitely needed something. 

[ombre]

18 minutes ago, pfk505 said:

Do people really think there's some kind of conspiracy and that Paul / the producers were "sticking it" to Jurgen by not giving him a handshake? For what possible reason? Its not like Jurgen has had a poor edit or anything like that, he's universally beloved!

I agree that 3 was too many handshakes but I'm guessing Paul just got caught up in the moment. Someone pointed out that its actually fewer total handshakes than last season, so that's a positive, but I can remember a time where it felt like there was less than 5 per season. Those days are long gone. Regardless, I really don't get the sense any of that was done specifically to single out Jurgen.

I don't think there was a conspiracy, but I do think that Paul saw Juergen as being less impressionable, less of an extension of Paul's... mentorship isn't quite the right word, but it's what I'm trying to get at.  I think Paul likes feeling that the bakers have grown through the experience of the show, which I suspect he sees as an extension of himself.  That their amazing bakes are because of his high standards, his feedback, etc.  And while I think that Juergen *has* been taking that feedback and growing from it, I think that Paul didn't see that growth.  Juergen seems to be a quiet, reserved, private person - he wouldn't be one to jump up and down and say "I just learned this thing!"  I used to work in a field that operated very much through old-boy networks.  "Patronage."  When working in a "patronage" system, *showing* that you've appreciated the patronage is often important to continuing to have access to it.  Juergen's good bakes weren't an "extension" of Paul, so after the initial rush of "discovering" his talents, Paul didn't feel invested in his work as much as he did in the others.  Paul was delighted by the works that he felt did reflect his feedback, and rewarded those with handshakes.  And then those handshakes meant more pressure on Juergen to pull off something amazing, which he clearly felt, as evidenced in his reactions to Noel's tasteless prodding.  I don't know what more he could have done, but I do think there were a lot of tricky emotional things to navigate.  All of which is just me guessing, of course, but this is how I read it from my experiences.  It seems clear his bakes were lovely, but for whatever reason they didn't delight Paul.

Edited November 20, 2021 by ombre

[Suzn]

16 minutes ago, pfk505 said:

Do people really think there's some kind of conspiracy and that Paul / the producers were "sticking it" to Jurgen by not giving him a handshake? For what possible reason? Its not like Jurgen has had a poor edit or anything like that, he's universally beloved!

I agree that 3 was too many handshakes but I'm guessing Paul just got caught up in the moment. Someone pointed out that its actually fewer total handshakes than last season, so that's a positive, but I can remember a time where it felt like there was less than 5 per season. Those days are long gone. Regardless, I really don't get the sense any of that was done specifically to single out Jurgen.

I don't think it was anything but Paul on impulse being nasty to Jurgen.  

[Suzn]

4 minutes ago, akr said:

I think he said he'd planned to decorate them, but ran out of time (presumably because of the troubles with his torii gate). They didn't need a lot, but they definitely needed something. 

Giuseppe's was every bit as plain.

[Adiba]

10 minutes ago, pfk505 said:

Do people really think there's some kind of conspiracy and that Paul / the producers were "sticking it" to Jurgen by not giving him a handshake? For what possible reason? Its not like Jurgen has had a poor edit or anything like that, he's universally beloved!

I agree that 3 was too many handshakes but I'm guessing Paul just got caught up in the moment. Someone pointed out that its actually fewer total handshakes than last season, so that's a positive, but I can remember a time where it felt like there was less than 5 per season. Those days are long gone. Regardless, I really don't get the sense any of that was done specifically to single out Jurgen.

I don’t know about conspiracy, but Paul looked like a dick (sorry for the vulgarity). I think anyone who discounts producer influence now that the show has moved to channel 4 is a bit naive. And Paul, for whatever reasons, can be a bit capricious at times, imo. Crystelle’s black sesame slices did not sound good to me, but that’s just my palate—apparently Paul didn’t mind her using sesame again.
I will say that her entremets sounded delicious and that I would go for them first on a dessert display— but technically, Jurgen did a genoise, gingerbread gate, tuiles and three bavarois for his showstopper while Crystelle and Giuseppe used rice cereal for their centerpieces. And I am rooting for Giuseppe, but I do think his showstopper wasn’t that visually impressive.
Now, if taste is king, all the judges would have to say is that the other bakes tasted better than Jurgen’s in their opinion. However, they didn’t really show the deliberations, so the judging seems off to me.

 

[ombre]

6 minutes ago, Adiba said:

However, they didn’t really show the deliberations, so the judging seems off to me.

 

Yeah, that's part of the hard part.

[akr]

14 minutes ago, Suzn said:

Giuseppe's was every bit as plain.

Fair enough. I pretty much agree (and liked Juergen's green better than Giuseppe's) but the little decoration on top of them helped make them look polished, and I think he did with them more or less what he'd intended. 

[justmehere]

13 minutes ago, Suzn said:

Giuseppe's was every bit as plain.

I thought Giuseppe was going to be eliminated. Pretty plain looking showstopper, and they said there was no flavor other than the center cherry, including missing the flavor of the pine nuts. He did get a handshake in the signature, but Jurgen was first in the technical. Jurgen's final design and execution were much more elaborate, and I believe they liked his flavors. The color on his entremets was a little pale, but they didn't look out of place to me. --I like Giuseppe a lot. I just thought that they criticized his final bake more than Jurgen's, and so he would go. Chigs' poor technical and his very simple tree decoration made me wonder about him, too.

The centerpiece requirement as a whole bothered me. They barely commented on them (which could have been editing) and didn't taste them (in which case, I'd think rice treats would have lost points). They've had other challenges where they had to make a variety of entremets... just let them do two or three different types rather than wasting time and resources on a centerpiece. 

I am surprised that they haven't called out Chrystelle for using the same flavors repeatedly - miso, sesame, and coconut seem to show up a lot. 

I like all of them. Any elimination this time was going to be rough. I wish we'd seen some of the discussion going into the decision.

[Enigma X]

My personal unpopular opinion is that I think the handshakes are stupid.

[ombre]

2 minutes ago, Enigma X said:

My personal unpopular opinion is that I think the handshakes are stupid.

I thought they were stupid before watching great pottery throw down, on which the male judge, Keith, is often moved to tears by his joy in the potters' work. In comparison to that, they look doubly so.  I get what they're supposed to mean - a gesture of respect - but when they just come from one judge it seems like a way of putting his opinion above the other judge's opinion. It's not lost on me that he started it when operating under the considerable shadow of Mary berry. Now, when he's the longest and better known judge, it feels ungracious and self-aggrandizing. 

[Suzn]

14 minutes ago, Enigma X said:

My personal unpopular opinion is that I think the handshakes are stupid.

It may be unpopular but I also think they are stupid and worse.

7 minutes ago, ombre said:

I thought they were stupid before watching great pottery throw down, on which the male judge, Keith, is often moved to tears by his joy in the potters' work. In comparison to that, they look doubly so.  I get what they're supposed to mean - a gesture of respect - but when they just come from one judge it seems like a way of putting his opinion above the other judge's opinion. It's not lost on me that he started it when operating under the considerable shadow of Mary berry. Now, when he's the longest and better known judge, it feels ungracious and self-aggrandizing. 

It definitely makes Paul out as the "important" judge.  I thought Prue looked irritated at the handshake shenanigans this time.  Paul is firmly entrenched in the show, but I think it would improve it to replace him.  I know that won't happen so they should at least add a third judge.

[caitmcg]

41 minutes ago, justmehere said:

I am surprised that they haven't called out Chrystelle for using the same flavors repeatedly - miso, sesame, and coconut seem to show up a lot. 

Crystelle has used miso twice, sesame a few times. Plenty of past contestants have used coconut a lot. I’ve lost track of the number of times Giuseppe has used cherries this season, including in two showstoppers in a row. Should I be surprised they haven’t called him out for using the same flavor repeatedly?

[Cetacean]

27 minutes ago, Suzn said:

I thought Prue looked irritated at the handshake shenanigans this time.  Paul is firmly entrenched in the show, but I think it would improve it to replace him. 

I thought she was peeved as well which she should be.  Her words of praise don't seem like they carry any weight when we have the Hollywood Theatrics upstaging her.  He's such a attention whore.

[kittykat]

Yeah I don't know why everyone keeps calling Crystelle out for the miso and sesame.  Giuseppe has stuck to classic Italian ingredients.  Chigs has used chocolate in nearly every episode.  Prior seasons had people using passion fruit over and over.  If you really break down how many people use the same flavor combos it's probably a lot more than we realize but people are calling out the miso because 1. it's uncommonly seen in this show and 2. People have decided they don't like Crystelle.  I understand that they're not as commonly used in baking but people are using it as some kind of proof that she's a one trick pony, which she is definitely not.  I had to bail on Reddit earlier because of the nasty comments.

Re: the handshakes, until this episode I thought he used them quite sparingly.  The four each had one but that was it.  I think he was overdoing it in earlier seasons (9 and 10 stick out) but I think he scaled back.  I'll handwave the triple handshake because the baking was that good.  Credit where credit is due.

Edited November 21, 2021 by kittykat

[JBurg58]

7 hours ago, roseslg said:

I wonder why we never hear comments about male bakers trading on their looks...🧐

I always wonder how tv viewers can guess the motivations of people on tv...

[Spunkygal]

29 minutes ago, JBurg58 said:

I always wonder how tv viewers can guess the motivations of people on tv...

Extend this statement to every facet of life and I’ll agree with you! But we’re venturing off topic and the mods should (rightly so) give a warning.

[Phebemarie]

26 minutes ago, JBurg58 said:

I always wonder how tv viewers can guess the motivations of people on tv...

I may not be able to guess Paul's motivations, but excluding one participant from his special recognition looked middle school level mean (even if that wasn't Paul's intention) to me (a retired middle school teacher).

 

[JBurg58]

2 minutes ago, Phebemarie said:

I may not be able to guess Paul's motivations, but excluding one participant from his special recognition looked middle school level mean (even if that wasn't Paul's intention) to me (a retired middle school teacher).

 

Specifically referred to what one person said  about Crystelle trading on her looks, but no one ever says that about the men. Let's judge people on the bakes they make, not their physical attributes.

And I love this show both for the kindness of the contestants and their beautiful creations. 

For the record, I felt terrible for Juergen not getting the handshake when the others did.

[roseslg]

From since Mary left Paul is pretty much the star of the show. I think being in the opening sketches and all of that is going to his show.  About this episode, we can't taste the bakes. Maybe Jurgen's didnt taste as well as the others. If it didnt merit one, Jurgen doesnt need a participation trophy. 

Everyone still gets along and are supportive. The viewers take it way more personal than the contestants.

[MisterGlass]

I think this is a case where no one failed technically, so it came down to a matter of taste, both literal and visual.  To me, Juergen's showstopper was the epitome of visual taste and it sounded tasty.  I also loved the whimsy of his opera cakes.  My tastes differ from the judges' taste on this. 

Best wishes to Juergen my fellow introvert.

If the centerpiece part of it doesn't matter, then they shouldn't be asked to do it.  It's like when they ask them to make burgers in the technical to put on their burger buns.

I believe Giuseppe's entremets were meant to be topiaries around the tower.

[Quilt Fairy]

I find it ironic that people believe that there is some conspiracy behind Juergen leaving when for the last 2 months people have been complaining that there was an on-going conspiracy to give the title to him. 

[Cetacean]

1 hour ago, roseslg said:

Everyone still gets along and are supportive. 

 I love how they jump in to help plate something or assist in decorations if they have the time.  It's so refreshing to see how they support each other.

I was just steaming when Noel kept blathering at Jurgen and I cheered when Jurgen finally got fed up and made it clear that Noel was messing up his timing.  That was just awful.

[pfk505]

5 hours ago, ombre said:

I don't think there was a conspiracy, but I do think that Paul saw Juergen as being less impressionable, less of an extension of Paul's... mentorship isn't quite the right word, but it's what I'm trying to get at.  I think Paul likes feeling that the bakers have grown through the experience of the show, which I suspect he sees as an extension of himself [...] And while I think that Juergen *has* been taking that feedback and growing from it, I think that Paul didn't see that growth.  Juergen seems to be a quiet, reserved, private person - he wouldn't be one to jump up and down and say "I just learned this thing!" [...]  Juergen's good bakes weren't an "extension" of Paul, so after the initial rush of "discovering" his talents, Paul didn't feel invested in his work as much as he did in the others.  Paul was delighted by the works that he felt did reflect his feedback, and rewarded those with handshakes.  And then those handshakes meant more pressure on Juergen to pull off something amazing, which he clearly felt, as evidenced in his reactions to Noel's tasteless prodding.  I don't know what more he could have done, but I do think there were a lot of tricky emotional things to navigate.  All of which is just me guessing, of course, but this is how I read it from my experiences.  It seems clear his bakes were lovely, but for whatever reason they didn't delight Paul.

 

5 hours ago, Suzn said:

I don't think it was anything but Paul on impulse being nasty to Jurgen.  

 

5 hours ago, Adiba said:

I don’t know about conspiracy, but Paul looked like a dick (sorry for the vulgarity). I think anyone who discounts producer influence now that the show has moved to channel 4 is a bit naive.

 

2 hours ago, Phebemarie said:

I may not be able to guess Paul's motivations, but excluding one participant from his special recognition looked middle school level mean (even if that wasn't Paul's intention) to me (a retired middle school teacher).

 

... And none of you think you're reading just a little bit much into this?

Edited November 21, 2021 by pfk505