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S05.E03: The Long and Winding Road


jewel21
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When an accident brings a familiar patient into the Chastain ER, the doctors must face the reality of figuring out how to proceed with the best care, which leads the whole staff questioning every decision. The Raptor and Leela deal with a patient returning with the long-term effects of CoVID.

Airdate: 10/05/2021

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Yeah, they’re going to milk this one. No thanks.

I was so distracted by the stand in not even close to looking like EVC.

If you read the post interview with Matt and the EP they had time to do better here.

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What a beautiful episode.  I'm gutted (it got me in all the feels), but I am especially glad that there was a link at the end of the show how to donate one's organs.

I have a friend who is alive because of a liver transplant- there was an incredibly generous person who gave my friend a gift so now they can see their children grow up.

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Oh, this was a rough episode to get through. I knew the outcome and it didn't make it any easier when she finally died. But the show really did a beautiful job with her sendoff. I appreciate that, despite not having the actress, they still chose to show Nic onscreeen, even if she was played by a different actress. Yes, it could be distracting by the fact that it wasn't EVC, but I think having her story end the way it did was way more important than either trying to get EVC back to lay in a bed, or worse, not use a different actress at all and have her closure feel a little more empty.

Of course, they could have killed her offscreen and had Conrad mourning from the premiere, but I don't think that Nic would have been honoured quite as much and it would have been such a quiet end to her character. This way kind of paves the way to a whole arc for Conrad, with trying to find out how she got in the crash, although I'm not so sure I love that takeaway. It's going to make it that much harder for Conrad to mourn properly if he becomes fixated on how she died, instead of the fact that she's gone. So I don't think I'm gonna love that aspect, unless it ends with Conrad quickly finding out that an accident is just an accident and that's all there is to it. 

Plus, I really liked Nic's final wishes to be an organ donor. It fits perfectly, AND we also got to see, upfront, one of the first people she got to help save after her death.

Of course it was a sad sendoff for her and it was a heartwrenching episode, but they only had a couple of choices here: die or have her in a coma. And, since EVC chose to leave the show for her family, death was the only option. So, with that path, there's only two options: onscreen and offscreen. And they could not half ass either way. 

There was no easy way to handle this, but I do think the show did the best job they could have possibly done. Killing Nic off between seasons wouldn't have provided much closure to the audience, and I think this helped solidify for people that Nic is gone and not coming back.

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I started watching this show because of EVC so I'm annoyed that they killed off her character. Yes, it was a nice send off. The scene at the end where they're wheeling her into the surgery room and the staff is all lined up is what finally got me teary. Before that, I was just glaring at my TV in anger, heh. I just wish they had either re-casted, or just had the character off screen somehow. Maybe she decided to be a stay-at-home mom or something. I'm just annoyed I devoted all this time to her character, and her pregnancy, and her marriage, and her stabbing, just to have it end this way. 

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27 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

There was no easy way to handle this, but I do think the show did the best job they could have possibly done. Killing Nic off between seasons wouldn't have provided much closure to the audience, and I think this helped solidify for people that Nic is gone and not coming back.

I mean she could have been driving home with not a care in the world and swerved to avoid a lorry and end up splayed out dead with blood dripping off her face with her cold dead eyes wide open like they did to Matthew on Downton Abbey for you know, the Christmas episode. Not that I am bitter. 

Didn't like it, although I understand the necessity of it happening. I REALLY hope we don't get a lot of episodes of Nic's dad not getting over it. At the same time, I didn't like how he was odd man out here. 

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12 minutes ago, jewel21 said:

I started watching this show because of EVC so I'm annoyed that they killed off her character. Yes, it was a nice send off. The scene at the end where they're wheeling her into the surgery room and the staff is all lined up is what finally got me teary. Before that, I was just glaring at my TV in anger, heh. I just wish they had either re-casted, or just had the character off screen somehow. Maybe she decided to be a stay-at-home mom or something. I'm just annoyed I devoted all this time to her character, and her pregnant, and her marriage, and her stabbing, just to have it end this way. 

Same here. The first blow for me was Mina but the fatal blow was Nic. I hope others can still enjoy the show but I’m out. 

They knew last season she was leaving. They chose to give us the happy ending with all the bells and whistles knowing they were yanking it from us the next day. I don’t care if it makes me sound like a bitter old woman but they could have done it differently. 

Win some and lose some I guess. 

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7 minutes ago, EllaWycliffe said:

Didn't like it, although I understand the necessity of it happening. I REALLY hope we don't get a lot of episodes of Nic's dad not getting over it. At the same time, I didn't like how he was odd man out here. 

I felt really bad for Nic's dad. He has now lost both his children. And I forget what happened to Nic's mom, but I believe he lost her too. At least he has his granddaughter, I guess.

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Corbin  Bernson broke my heart. Every reaction spot on. We saw everyone at the end but Nic's father. Where was he?

I know that EvC wanted to leave the show but I wish that they had put Nic in a coma off-screen instead.

Otherwise, I'm glad that they showed the effects of long Covid.  I keep seeing "it's not so bad, it's got a 98% survival rate" but what kind of survival?

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Nurse: "We want to help."

How about closing the blinds to give Nic some dignity? And in what universe would the door be wide open while those tests are being given?

Edited by Leeds
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OK, I'll admit to getting a little something in my eye towards the end of the episode.  Probably would have had a more emotional impact if it hadn't literally been all over the internet that the actress was leaving.  I'll never understand why they publicize stuff like that.  Back in ye olden days of only three channels, the deaths of characters, especially main characters, were surprises and kept the viewer much more invested.  Would it really be that hard to keep that kind of thing under wraps until the episode airs?  I'll get off my soapbox now.  

While I fully support organ donation and think its a good thing for shows like this to highlight it, it seems to be a very tired trope that every time a character dies on a medical drama and donates their organs, there conveniently happens to be another patient who just happens to be in the exact same hospital at the exact same time and just happens to be a perfect match.  Bonus points if the character has some sort of pre-existing relationship with the deceased.  Frankly, I could have done without the other patient and his wife taking up air time.  Seems the whole episode should have been devoted to Nic. 

I did snicker at Devan calling the patient with the breathing problem his favorite COVID patient, when Nurse Hundley, who we know had a severe case of COVID (which was even featured in a flashback) was standing right there beside him. 

I know Conrad is supposed to be the absolute best doctor on the planet (and I actually don't usually have a problem with that), but not sure I really want to spend time with him becoming the best detective, accident reconstructionist, engineer and whatever else he has to become to solve the mystery of the crash.  

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I thought they did a really good job. It was incredibly sad but I thought all the actors were fantastic. I liked that it was written so that we got to see all the people who were close to Nic as they came to terms to what was happening. So often when a character dies on a show it's just 1 or 2 characters reacting then it's onto the next story. I'm a fan of EVC and loved Nic but for me having her go off somewhere or lay in a coma would not have worked for me. 

Quote

And of course we don't know what caused the accident so we won't move on for ages.

Spoiler

Amy Holden Jones said on Twitter we find out next week.

 

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8 minutes ago, Bulldog said:

 

I know Conrad is supposed to be the absolute best doctor on the planet (and I actually don't usually have a problem with that), but not sure I really want to spend time with him becoming the best detective, accident reconstructionist, engineer and whatever else he has to become to solve the mystery of the crash.  

That's okay, Severide from Chicago Fire will hear about what's going on and will rush in to save the day.  After all, he's added to his resume of absolute best firefighter on the planet the titles of best detective and arson investigator.  I'm sure he'll also be able to add best accident reconstructionist, etc, as needed.

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That was a great episode; incredibly well-written and acted by everyone.  It was really sad, and I don't know how a new viewer who just stumbled onto this show tonight would react, but I was very moved by the emotion of it all.  The actor who plays Conrad (I still call him "Cary" from his "The Good Wife" days) hit it out of the park.  He was riveting.  

We've had quite a turnover in actors on this show over the last few months.  First Mina, then Dr. Cain, and now Nic.  This is one of the best shows on TV; I hope they can keep their momentum with all the new characters they're introducing.

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1 hour ago, Bulldog said:

I did snicker at Devan calling the patient with the breathing problem his favorite COVID patient, when Nurse Hundley, who we know had a severe case of COVID (which was even featured in a flashback) was standing right there beside him.

If I recall correctly, he said "my favourite long Covid patient". Nurse Hundley doesn't have long Covid, as shown by the fact that she's back at work.

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One of the truest things about Nics death is the sudden devastation and shock and how sometimes life makes no sense and you’ve no control.

I really hope the show can resist the urge to fuck this up by turning it into a season long mystery where Conrad needs to investigate and avenge her death. That would be just be eye rolling.

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That was really sad. I thought everyone did a good job. I'll miss Nic, but I think this was the best option and the show handled it pretty well. I always like when medical shows highlight organ donation.

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9 hours ago, KaveDweller said:

I felt really bad for Nic's dad. He has now lost both his children. And I forget what happened to Nic's mom, but I believe he lost her too. At least he has his granddaughter, I guess.

That's when I cried. I couldn't imagine losing both your kids in a period of a few years. That's just too much. The other moment that really hit me was when Devon came into the room and quickly glanced at the brain scans and said that he was sorry. Everyone was appeasing Conrad but that showed that there was zero real chance of her coming out of this.

One thing I hated was when they needed to test Nic for any brain function and that was left to Devon because there was no one else to do it according to Bell and Kit. I'm sure somewhere in that hospital there's a neurologist. The idea that the people we see on screen are the only options is so ridiculous. Devon shouldn't even be back at work but apparently he's the only other doctor in the hospital? What? I know they wanted a personal connection but I think that could have been achieved with Nic's nurse friends being in the room.

I think considering the off-show circumstances, this was the best way to handle it and I love that Nic saved and changed so many lives by donating her organs. That's so very in character.

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4 hours ago, vibeology said:

One thing I hated was when they needed to test Nic for any brain function and that was left to Devon because there was no one else to do it according to Bell and Kit. I'm sure somewhere in that hospital there's a neurologist. The idea that the people we see on screen are the only options is so ridiculous. Devon shouldn't even be back at work but apparently he's the only other doctor in the hospital? What? I know they wanted a personal connection but I think that could have been achieved with Nic's nurse friends being in the room.

This, and also: I was surprised Conrad didn’t insist from the beginning on getting Cain or some other top neurosurgeon flown in to handle Nic’s case. Have the writers forgotten how he didn’t trust Billie when she first showed up?

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Nothing says the character/actor are truly, truly gone quite like not only a death, but also a removal of organs.  If they wanted to close the door firmly in fan's faces of any possible return, organ donation pretty much puts the kibosh on that.  

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First Mina, now Nic. I’m not counting Cain since he was a villain. Good thing I still like the other characters or I’d be out.

The writers don’t seem to care much about continuity. It seems like since Mina’s been gone they barely make any reference to her—even AJ never mentions her. It would have been good to have a brief scene where he calls her to break the news about Nic. Probably too much to hope she’d be there for Nic’s funeral. (Happy for Shaunette, though—IMDB says she’s in Indiana Jones 5.)

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20 hours ago, statsgirl said:

Corbin  Bernson broke my heart. Every reaction spot on. We saw everyone at the end but Nic's father. Where was he?

I know that EvC wanted to leave the show but I wish that they had put Nic in a coma off-screen instead.

Otherwise, I'm glad that they showed the effects of long Covid.  I keep seeing "it's not so bad, it's got a 98% survival rate" but what kind of survival?

He has not aged well.

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On 10/5/2021 at 8:23 PM, statsgirl said:

I know that EvC wanted to leave the show but I wish that they had put Nic in a coma off-screen instead.

 

EvC?

20 hours ago, vibeology said:

I love that Nic saved and changed so many lives by donating her organs. That's so very in character.

Of course it's wonderful that she chose to be a donor, but what makes her so special?

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4 hours ago, Leeds said:

EvC?

Emily VanCamp.

I just watched the show last night but I already read about it. I thought it was pretty well written/done, though I have some criticisms as others have.

Nic's dad is admittedly my least favorite character on the show, to me the show slows down when he is onscreen. I wish they hadn't done the usual trope about someone being completely angry that someone is dying/died. I mean, of course I understand the anger, but him lashing out at Conrad saying that he will never forgive him was too much. The same with the trope about people disagreeing with someone's final wishes. Conrad did the right thing and clearly stated that he was honoring Nic's wishes by taking her off life support and donating her organs. I wish Nic's dad had come around and was able to say "Conrad, you are right, Nic wanted this and it's the right thing to do." It's terribly heartbreaking and the dad would be beyond devastated, but I would have rather seen that personally over the anger (which, I know, is sadness coming out but still....) Conrad was able to understand that the best way to make any any sense of Nic dying was to not let her suffer in a vegetative state and to have her organs help countless others. But it looks like he's going to go off the deep end trying to figure out what happened in the accident by the looks of scenes from next week!!! 

 

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52 minutes ago, hookedontv said:

Nic's dad is admittedly my least favorite character on the show, to me the show slows down when he is onscreen. I wish they hadn't done the usual trope about someone being completely angry that someone is dying/died. I mean, of course I understand the anger, but him lashing out at Conrad saying that he will never forgive him was too much. The same with the trope about people disagreeing with someone's final wishes. Conrad did the right thing and clearly stated that he was honoring Nic's wishes by taking her off life support and donating her organs. I wish Nic's dad had come around and was able to say "Conrad, you are right, Nic wanted this and it's the right thing to do." It's terribly heartbreaking and the dad would be beyond devastated, but I would have rather seen that personally over the anger (which, I know, is sadness coming out but still....)

I hated this, too. Kyle came across as not just in serious denial, but incredibly dense. Only a young child or a super naïve person in this day and age would not understand what was going on. I wanted Conrad to shake him and say something like “You’ve never heard of the concept of brain death before? Seriously?!” Yes, the person may look like they’re just sleeping, but NOBODY’S HOME. This is not that hard to grasp!

I really hope they don’t draw this out by having Kyle set out on some personal vendetta against Conrad. 100% positive he will return to drinking and/or drugs and turn into a complete mess. And I bet the show will go for maximum drama and have him show up completely wasted at Nic’s funeral and take a swing at Conrad.

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Very sad episode, but a great sendoff for Nic. Couldn't have been done any better. And with the announcement of her leaving, you had to know there was only one way her character was going to exit the show. There is no universe where she's alive, and not with Conrad and Gigi. 

And there is no recasting Nic. Maybe after a show's first season, if the actor/actress isn't well received, or if it's a child character that's aging, a show can get away with recasting a main character. But not after 4 seasons. Emily is Nic. Emily and Matt had 4 years to build that chemistry. A new actress will be put in virtually a no-win scenario. Having to instantly do heavy scenes with Conrad, with no chemistry whatsoever with the actor. Not to mention, getting a new actress would turn off viewers who only consider Emily VanCamp to be the true Nic.

It sucks she's gone, but the show will not fall apart just because the character is no longer there. Conrad & Nic were a big part of the show, but not the only part. 

I do feel bad for Kyle, as he's lost both his daughters. And while it is understandable that he's grieving, he needs to lay off Conrad. He's not choosing not to save her like he does everyone else. Kyle should know that Conrad would give up his life in an instant, if it would save Nic. He, as a doctor, knew there was nothing more that can be done for her, as she is brain dead. And he's respecting her wishes of not wanting to be kept alive on a machine. 

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1 hour ago, cameron said:

At age 67 he looks really old to say Kevin Costner who is the same age.

Agree, but Kevin Costner is the exception rather than the rule.  But to your point, yes he looks more like 75ish to me.

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Welp. I said I wanted a show where Matt Czuchry had more to do. I really should've known to be careful what I wished for.

I'm not mad at the show - Emily VanCamp is clear she wanted to leave, and this is one of those rare instances where I think this was the only logical choice. I'm generally really bitter when they kill off major characters, I do not appreciate the "shock value", but I just don't think there was much of a choice here. An offscreen coma would have left Conrad unable to function about anything else knowing how he is. 

That said, I really liked Conrad and Nic. A rare adult couple that moved forward in a plausible, not annoyingly childish way. This is a major bummer for me. 

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10 hours ago, CarpeFelis said:

hated this, too. Kyle came across as not just in serious denial, but incredibly dense. Only a young child or a super naïve person in this day and age would not understand what was going on. I wanted Conrad to shake him and say something like “You’ve never heard of the concept of brain death before? Seriously?!” Yes, the person may look like they’re just sleeping, but NOBODY’S HOME. This is not that hard to grasp!

I was willing to hand wave at that due to shock and grief. To be fair, Conrad was clearly in denial earlier when they were doing the ct and Pravesh was all "Oh, I'm so sorry" when he looked when everyone else was going along with Conrad's inability to accept. 

Its also sadly true that some people really can't accept the diagnosis - there was a case a few years ago where a teen girl ended up brain dead after an anesthesia issue and the family refused to pull the plug even when the hospital declared the girl dead. She got moved to a long term care facility... the body was still breathing on a vent so the parents didn't want to give up. 

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On 10/5/2021 at 11:23 PM, statsgirl said:

Corbin  Bernson broke my heart. Every reaction spot on. We saw everyone at the end but Nic's father. Where was he?

I know that EvC wanted to leave the show but I wish that they had put Nic in a coma off-screen instead.

I'm guessing from him saying "I will never forgive you" means he won't be back for a bit. Maybe he'll be at a funeral for Nic, maybe turn up wasted, but yeah.

I was also hoping for offscreen coma.

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Well that was sad. I also thought it was a good sendoff for Nic. When I read that Emily was leaving, I thought maybe they can keep her alive by having her and Conrad break up. Or her going to Nigeria to work with Mina. That way they can bring her back at some point. But then I realized she and Conrad wouldn't split, not after all the buildup to their relationship. So this seems like a fitting end. She can always come visit as a ghost!

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I'm not that wild about Kyle, so while objectively I could feel terribly that he's lost two daughters in a couple of years, I ended up feeling worse for Conrad in that scene when he just (understandably, and probably for the best) wouldn't even defend himself. Because the truth is, Kyle didn't lose Nic in the hospital, because for all intents and purposes she was dead when she arrived. Conrad could not save her, and I'm sure it's the worst moment of his life that he couldn't save her, being thrown in his face by her often deadbeat father. 

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13 hours ago, MaggieG said:

Well that was sad. I also thought it was a good sendoff for Nic. When I read that Emily was leaving, I thought maybe they can keep her alive by having her and Conrad break up. Or her going to Nigeria to work with Mina. That way they can bring her back at some point. But then I realized she and Conrad wouldn't split, not after all the buildup to their relationship. So this seems like a fitting end. She can always come visit as a ghost!

I could have bought them splitting if they had time to lead up to it. I've seen shows break up solid couples before. But Nic wouldn't just leave her baby, no matter what happened with Conrad. They really had no choice, but it still totally sucks.

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I think some people had speculated that maybe Nic would take a new job at a different hospital or clinic and just be off-screen with sporadic references to how she was doing, so no need to break them up or kill her off. But alas...

This one got to me. I don't think I've ever been so moved by a "losing one of their own" storyline. It was definitely very well done.

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On 10/5/2021 at 11:44 PM, Gregg247 said:

That was a great episode; incredibly well-written and acted by everyone.  It was really sad, and I don't know how a new viewer who just stumbled onto this show tonight would react, but I was very moved by the emotion of it all.  The actor who plays Conrad (I still call him "Cary" from his "The Good Wife" days) hit it out of the park.  He was riveting.  

We've had quite a turnover in actors on this show over the last few months.  First Mina, then Dr. Cain, and now Nic.  This is one of the best shows on TV; I hope they can keep their momentum with all the new characters they're introducing.

I actually do think Morris Chestnust was planning to leave after Season 3, but due to the pandemic, he wound up staying for an extra season to close out his storyline.

On 10/6/2021 at 7:31 AM, vibeology said:

One thing I hated was when they needed to test Nic for any brain function and that was left to Devon because there was no one else to do it according to Bell and Kit. I'm sure somewhere in that hospital there's a neurologist. The idea that the people we see on screen are the only options is so ridiculous. Devon shouldn't even be back at work but apparently he's the only other doctor in the hospital? What? I know they wanted a personal connection but I think that could have been achieved with Nic's nurse friends being in the room.

This type of thing bugs me on all the medical shows these days. The only options to do any surgery or procedure or test are the main characters. And if nobody's available, the whole hospital falls apart. I don't know why shows don't invest in having recurring surgeons and physicians that can help when needed. In a big hospital like Chastain, Billy Sutton, who is still on a probationary status, is the only available neurosurgeon. No other ones in the entire hospital. And Devon is the only physician available to test Nic's brain function? They make it seem like Conrad, Devon, and Irving are the only available physicians in the hospital. Not to mention, to your point, no neurologists available, which is something all hospitals should have.

I know they want to focus on main characters, but hospitals are bigger than just 5-6 doctors.

Edited by WinJet0819
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10 hours ago, Giuseppe said:

I think some people had speculated that maybe Nic would take a new job at a different hospital or clinic and just be off-screen with sporadic references to how she was doing, so no need to break them up or kill her off. But alas...

This one got to me. I don't think I've ever been so moved by a "losing one of their own" storyline. It was definitely very well done.

I think it was the excellent music choices.

3 hours ago, WinJet0819 said:

This type of thing bugs me on all the medical shows these days. The only options to do any surgery or procedure or test are the main characters. And if nobody's available, the whole hospital falls apart. I don't know why shows don't invest in having recurring surgeons and physicians that can help when needed. In a big hospital like Chastain, Billy Sutton, who is still on a probationary status, is the only available neurosurgeon. No other ones in the entire hospital. And Devon is the only physician available to test Nic's brain function? They make it seem like Conrad, Devon, and Irving are the only available physicians in the hospital. Not to mention, to your point, no neurologists available, which is something all hospitals should have.

I know they want to focus on main characters, but hospitals are bigger than just 5-6 doctors.

I mean I understand them wanting to lower the number of extras because of COVID - but they could've just had someone guest star as a neurologist for a few episodes, maybe have a few episodes where they need a neuro consult (Or maybe have Devon see one to make sure he didn't have any brain damage from the TOXIC GAS or the MEMORY LOSS?????). Didn't Billie not finish her residency?

Also, doesn't brain death need to be verified by two doctors, one of whom isn't treating the patient?

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Emily VanCamp & Matt Czuchry are the reasons I started watching in the first place: LOVED her from 'Revenge' & him from 'Gillmore Girls'. I still think the first season into the second was the best - hasn't been quite as good (to me) since. I wasn't happy when the actress who plays Mina left last year - even though it was her choice. And I know EVC also chose to leave too, but I think I'm done with the show. At least for now. I can always change my mind & binge it later. And 'Mina' is NOT dead - so that could lure me back too. 

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I thought the stand-in looked pretty good, but I am surprised that she didn't have some cuts and bruises, maybe some swelling.  It would have helped hide the fact that it wasn't EVC, and it would have made more sense. I would think that it is pretty rare to have enough brain trauma to die, yet have no external injuries.  

On 10/8/2021 at 7:27 AM, MaggieG said:

Well that was sad. I also thought it was a good sendoff for Nic. When I read that Emily was leaving, I thought maybe they can keep her alive by having her and Conrad break up. Or her going to Nigeria to work with Mina. That way they can bring her back at some point. But then I realized she and Conrad wouldn't split, not after all the buildup to their relationship. So this seems like a fitting end. She can always come visit as a ghost!

I was hoping they would have her decide to stay home with the baby, then the show centers around the hospital and not Conrad's home life.  Added bonus - we avoid the baby storylines, since adding a baby is rarely a good thing for a tv show.  

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(edited)

I’m very late, I know, but I’ve only been watching the show since late last year and I just got to this episode last night. For the most part I thought it was well done, but I was definitely taken out of it at a couple minor points (and maybe I’ve just watched too many medical shows now and seen a lot of the tropes):

I noticed at one point it looked like Nic’s stand-in had brown hair instead of blonde.

Conrad’s lucky he didn’t crash on the way to the hospital driving like he was.

Why did all of the nurses need to be in the room during Nic’s test? Jessica said they wanted to help but she and Hundley just kinda stood there.

I didn’t realize the nurse with the blonde bangs had hung around until they brought her back near the end. 

I will keep watching the rest of the season to form my own impressions but I’m skeptical of how the time jump will play out. 
 

ETA: When they’ve brought in babies on the other medical shows I watch (ER and New Amsterdam) either the kid becomes non-existent after a while or it’s a contrived plot point to add unnecessary drama. The actress who plays time skip Gigi looks adorable, though, so I will see how it goes. 

Edited by Cloud9Shopper
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For such a big hospital, they seem to have very few doctors and surgeons.  Yet these same doctors and surgeons have all day to hang out in patient rooms… and perform CT scans.  There’s never a radiologist or technician in the room- but there’s always 5 doctors there.  

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