Cheer - General Discussion

[SuzySmith]

On 1/17/2020 at 6:09 AM, Spiderella2 said:

Yes, I saw the commercial for it. Basically grown adults who are high school alumni come back to act in a musical  theater play a la High School Musical. The show captures them preparing to open the show. That looked like it would be very good. 

Encore! Is great. 
 

I guess I’m the only one who was concerned about the lack of concern Monica showed when those kids got hurt. 
 

im also saddened that these kids didn’t move on even when bigger and better opportunities came along. I don’t believe a D1 school is for everyone but to go back to JC for year 3???  

Edited January 20, 2020 by SuzySmith

[ElectricBoogaloo]

On 1/17/2020 at 4:42 PM, EarlGreyTea said:

And at least they're still working toward another AA degree. Whenever I feel kind of uneasy about all these kids peacing out of  4-year universities, I remember that they're still studying SOMETHING and probably are on scholarship. At the very least, they won't drown in student loans.

I think that many of them don't bother getting an AA while they're at Navarro. If you know that you're going to transfer to a 4 year, an AA isn't necessary. All you need to do is have transfer-eligible classes and a good GPA. I briefly took some classes at JC and almost no one bothered getting their AA because they were all transferring to a university as soon as they completed their requirements.

(This is the part where I mention that in California, back in ye olden days before everything got revamped, there were specific transfer requirements to apply to a UC or CSU (and they were slightly different for UC vs CSU) so a lot of people went to JC specifically to complete those requirements and then transfer. The requirements for an AA were different so if you wanted to get an AA and transfer, you had to take more classes in order to fulfill all of the requirements for each. They have since revised the system so that the requirements line up for all three systems (UC, CSU, AA at JC) so that they are the same, but you still don't have to get an AA just because you fulfill the requirements. In order to get an AA, you have to file for graduation and get a degree check done by a counselor to make sure you fulfilled all of the requirements. Some people don't want to be bothered with filing for graduation. Some people don't see the point in getting an AA if they're transferring to a 4 year for a BA/BS. But the point is that not everyone who goes to a JC gets an AA.)

On 1/18/2020 at 8:59 AM, PityFree said:

Hate whichever one convinced Gabi to dye her hair that awful, flat, ink-black color.

I don't like it either. It reminds me of the goth/emo kids who would dye their hair jet black. It doesn't suit most people and even if you get it done professionally, black can look really flat, harsh, one dimensional, and fake. I'm guessing Gabi's mom wanted her to color her hair black so they would look similar.

4 hours ago, ExplainItAgain said:

I've read this thread and I'm still confused on where some of these people ended up. So Morgan was back at Navarro for the fall semester - did she transfer to Texas Tech for the spring or maybe she got accepted for this fall?

Jerry went to Louisville but he left? I'm sad if this is the case - I hope he had a good reason to leave that nice scholarship. And now La'Darius and Lexi are back at Navarro too? Perhaps they are filming another season and thus all the returns? Isn't the cheerleading team set in the fall because they cheer at football and basketball games? These guys can just return at will? 

No, Morgan never left Navarro. In the final episode (which was filmed in spring 2019), she said she wanted to stay for a third year (2019-2020), which is what she did. You can see my post above for the dates on her instagram posts that show she did exactly what she said she was going to do, which was stay for a third year. She visited Texas Tech in November 2019 with Austin and Allie. I assumed it was some kind of recruitment/audition for the cheer team because they were wearing Texas Tech cheer shirts and then got kidnapped by the team (a common stunt to welcome new members).

Lexi left Navarro because Monica kicked her off the team due to Lexi taking the blame for whatever drugs were found in the car. Lexi was only there to cheer meaning she had no incentive to stay at Navarro to go to school so she returned to Houson. Per the article above, her mother and grandmother asked Monica to let Lexi try out for the team again and Monica relented which is why Lexi is back on the team for spring 2020.

I don't know exactly what happened with Jerry and La'Darius. Jerry was at Louisville and on one of their cheer teams. There are pictures of him in uniform at football games. He posted last week that he is back at Navarro but he didn't say why he left Louisville or if he's going back. It's possible that he took spring semester off at Louisville so that he could compete at nationals with Navarro one more time.

Most schools do allow you to take a leave of absence and return without re-applying if you fill out a form with the registrar so if you go that route, it's not considered dropping out and you can return without any penalty. Some people do this so they can do a semester or a year abroad. Some people do it so they can get a full time internship. Some people do it when there's a death in the family. It's more common than people think.

And most 4 years allow you to take classes at JC even after you enroll at the 4 year. This allows students to take summer school, night classes, required classes that were full at their 4 year, electives that aren't offered at their 4 year, etc. You are allowed to transfer those credits to your 4 year to count towards your degree.

4 hours ago, dmmetler said:

NCA Nationals is in April, so I assume the returning kids did fall somewhere else, and came back to Navarro for the Spring to compete at Nationals, with the expectation of another season of the show. They can probably do that without losing admission at their other school, and take a class or two that will transfer, especially if they weren’t core complete and hadn’t actually completed an AS before transferring. 
 

It seems unfair to the kids who tried out for and made Navarro and cheered the entire football season. At most schools, you have to be on the team in the fall to go to Nationals-but there is nothing against the rules about it. 

Normally I would agree that it's unfair for the kids who were already on the team in the fall because at every school I've been to, cheer was a full year sport. There was an audition at the end of the previous year and everyone who made the team was on for the next school year. There was no joining for one semester/quarter.

But the difference is that this is JC and things work differently because they know not everyone will be there every semester. Based on the fact that Gabi was shown moving into her new place at the beginning of this season, she was not a student in fall 2018 which means she enrolled in spring 2019 just to compete at nationals.

The thing that kind of makes it okay to me that they bring in new members during the spring semester is that no one is guaranteed a position on the mat. Everyone on the team is competing to make it to Daytona. They know that not all of them will get to compete at nationals going in so bringing in a few new people doesn't really change that. Either you're in the top 20 or you aren't.

I don't have an issue with that because my dance team worked the same way. We had 30-40 girls on the team but before every pep rally, competition, football game, and basketball game, we had to audition to see who would actually get to perform. Sometimes the number chosen was based on size limitations. Sometimes it was just based on wherever there was a clear cut off in terms of who was performing that particular routine really well. But regardless, we all knew that being on the team didn't automatically mean that we got to be in every performance.

4 hours ago, nlkm9 said:

So i thought junior college is only 2 years? How can they go back for a 3rd year?

In theory, you should be able to get an AA in two years but that's assuming (1) you attend full time (2) you can get all the classes you need when you need them which isn't always possible. When you go to a smaller school, there are fewer classes offered so instead of 3 different psych 101 classes with an enrollment of 500 students in each class, there may be 1 psych 101 class that has an enrollment of 45 students. Sometimes the class gets full before you get in. Sometimes it's at the same time as another class you need to take. Sometimes it's a class that's only offered once a year (only in the fall, not in the spring).

But really, it's not much different from people who take more than four years to get a BA. Here in California, the UC and CSU campuses were so crowded that many people needed five years to graduate because they just couldn't register for all the classes they needed for their majors or GE requirements.

In addition, not everyone at JC attends full time or in consecutive semesters. A lot of people who attend JC have jobs so they squeeze in classes whenever they can. My mom took various classes at JC over the years but they were usually very specific and aimed toward getting certain skills for a particular job (I still remember the semester that she took computer programming). But she didn't actually get her AA until years later and even then she was only enrolled part time because she was still working. Most JCs do not have a limit on how long you can enroll in classes so you can take much longer than 2 years to get an AA (or just keep taking classes and never get an AA).

2 hours ago, auntiemel said:

Also, as soon as you complete one associates degree, you can start working on another.

Yup. There's no limit as to how many AAs you can get. If you want to get one in every subject they offer, you can (as long as you can keep paying for your tuition).

Monica has mentioned third years on the team but never anything higher than that. I'm guessing that's because she said they get fee waivers to attend Navarro and there's probably a max on that (similar to the financial aid cap when you're getting a BA/BS at a 4 year).

[ElectricBoogaloo]

'Cheer' Is An Incisive Look At Injury, Coaching And Competition

What I hated about this article is that this kind of criticism is seldom, if ever, leveled at male coaches of male sports teams:

Quote

But aren't there risks when you give a stubborn, highly competitive, extremely driven coach close to complete authority over a bunch of kids who see her as their only ally, and who feel obligated to satisfy her and the team at all costs while performing in a potentially very dangerous sport?

One risk, of course, is injuries. While Cheer begins as a tale of hard training, it's hard not to see it, as the season progresses, as a story of attrition. Girls — because it's girls who are typically thrown into the air, lifted, dropped — hurt their arms, hurt their shoulders, get concussions. Boys throw their backs out, screw up their wrists, blow a knee tumbling. None of it makes Monica hesitate or wonder whether she's pushing them too hard. If a girl hits the ground instead of being caught, the entire team does push-ups as punishment. But who is responsible for asking whether a cascading series of injuries that ultimately endangers the team's ability to compete at all has something to do with the judgment of the coach? Not the team doctors. Not the students. And apparently, not anybody affiliated with the college.

[...]

I thought hard about whether I was seeing this differently because it was cheer. Would I feel like it was too much if it were football or basketball? Was I instinctively babying these athletes because of their sport? I don't think so. I can't imagine thinking it's good coaching to ignore an injury and expect someone to practice because you're angry about the circumstances in which the injury happened, and I shudder to think how it would look if he'd dropped someone — which looks perilously close to happening.

This author is either willfully ignorant or just okay clueless if she believes that what Monica does is worse than what most football coaches do. How many times have we seen football and basketball players (from peewee through the pros) play with injuries? And which sport is it where CTE is prevalent due to multiple concussions (and has been blamed for multiple suicides/murders)? Oh, right, FOOTBALL.

And in Monica’s defense, she always defers to the trainers (and the trainers defer to the doctors as seen when Gabi asked if she could still compete with an injury). If the trainers say someone is injured and can’t practice, they sit out. The trainer said TT was fine to practice.

I’m not denying that cheer is a dangerous sport with an excessive amount of injuries because it clearly is. But to bring up men’s sports and then act like cheerleading is worse in terms of practicing/playing/competing while injured or blindly doing anything a coach tells them to do? Please. You can’t tell me that this doesn’t happen in football and basketball all the time.

Edited January 21, 2020 by ElectricBoogaloo

[Jane Tuesday]

Is cheerleading governed by NCAA/NJCAA?  I'm guessing not, and I'm guessing that's why the eligibility seems so "flexible" compared to what I'm used to with other sports.  (Eligibility for sports governed by NJCAA is two seasons, and you must be a full-time student carrying at least 12 credit hours during the season.)

[ElectricBoogaloo]

1 hour ago, Jane Tuesday said:

Is cheerleading governed by NCAA/NJCAA? 

No (not yet). Collegiate cheerleading/dance teams are covered by NCAA catastrophic insurance when they are at official NCAA sanctioned events (football and basketball games) but cheer and dance are not considered official NCAA sports so they're usually just classified by the schools as an extracurricular activity/club (like the chess club) or sometimes a club sport.

Edited January 20, 2020 by ElectricBoogaloo

[luckyroll3]

Lexie is one bad ass tumbler!  I can watch her tumble for hours.  Even in the video of their routine that was posted upthread, I couldn't take my eyes off of her.  I'm glad they gave her another chance to be on the team.  When she said she got kicked off, it made me cry, cause you can tell she's one of the kids that really needs something like this to keep them going.  

On 1/14/2020 at 9:17 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I'm glad that Monica is so proactive about who is on the mat. I could see that La'Darius wasn't trying to keep Scherbs up in her stunt and I felt bad for her that she kept coming down because of his lack of effort. He is a great tumbler and he CAN be a good stunter when he puts in the effort but it's not fair to a flyer to keep coming down because of her base. It's not on the flyer to put in all the effort. Stunting is a partnership and the person holding her up has to work to keep her up there. La'Darius just wasn't putting in any effort at all. He was acting like he was a flat tabletop that she should be able to balance on by herself. That girl's safety is in your hands so if you can't be bothered, then get out. And Monica saw this in him before the initially chose the top 20. It's disappointing to see that she was right.

I loved that Monica took La'Darius out and put Jerry in. Maybe having to fight for his position will light a fire under La'Darius' ass and get him to start putting in some effort.

 

On 1/14/2020 at 9:17 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I was rolling my eyes later in the episode when La'Darius had the nerve to passive aggressively complain about other people not going 100% during practice. This, coming from the guy who was dropping Scherbs time after time because he couldn't be bothered?

I was such a La'Darius fan up until that episode when he kept dropping his partner and blaming her.  Then he started badmouthing her, Monica, and the organization in an attempt to get the guys on his side.  The only reason he started putting effort in again is because everyone was routing for Jerry when he filled in.  Then all of a sudden, he's the "motivator" again.  I wanted to punch him in the face every time he chastised other people for not giving 100%.  What a dick.  I kinda feel like he did all that because he wasn't getting enough attention/camera time.

[FreetheGirlses]

Gabi's parents are total narcissists, right down to the barging into her shower to get an answer RIGHT NOW. Zero boundaries with them. I recognize it because my dad has NPD. I feel for her. 

On a shallow note, her mother's lisp was driving me nuts. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

2 hours ago, FreetheGirlses said:

Gabi's parents are total narcissists, right down to the barging into her shower to get an answer RIGHT NOW. Zero boundaries with them. I recognize it because my dad has NPD. I feel for her.

Also ridiculous was when they couldn't get Varsity TV to stream on their phones and Gabi's mom said she would just call Gabi. Sure, she's just at nationals waiting to compete but I'm sure the way she wants to spend her warm up time is helping her technologically inept mother figure out how to use an app.

That's why I laughed my ass off when they cut to Lexi's family, Jerry's family, and someone else watching without a problem. I mean, honestly, they probably had someone from production just log in and then hand over the phones to the parents but it still made me laugh.

My favorite thing about the final episode was seeing the genuine reactions from Lexi and La'Darius' brother. Lexi was in the water (because TRADITION!) but she was standing still with her eyes closed, just soaking it all in. La'Darius' brother's reaction made me so sad. He was sitting in a dark room all by himself watching the competition on his phone all alone. His tears when Navarro won were so much more sincere and loving than, say, anything Gabi's parents have said or done all season.

[Bobcatkitten]

Just finished and found this fascinating. Interesting back stories on some of the kids. 

 

Gabi's parents are pieces of work. They don't seem to care at all that she is doing a photoshoot at 3 in the morning and tired and crying. Honestly she doesn't look happy to me at all.

 

Really like Morgan and glad to hear she has moved on. And Jerry is so awesome. L'adarius annoyed me sometimes. He can be quite catty and not supportive of his teammates. I liked Jerry pointing that out to him. 

 

Lexi - terrible that she can't seem to get it together and keeps making the wrong decisions. I felt for her family. 

[FreetheGirlses]

3 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Also ridiculous was when they couldn't get Varsity TV to stream on their phones and Gabi's mom said she would just call Gabi. Sure, she's just at nationals waiting to compete but I'm sure the way she wants to spend her warm up time is helping her technologically inept mother figure out how to use an app.

That's why I laughed my ass off when they cut to Lexi's family, Jerry's family, and someone else watching without a problem. I mean, honestly, they probably had someone from production just log in and then hand over the phones to the parents but it still made me laugh.

See, I felt like that was all bullshit. Her family lives in Florida, you know damn well they were at that competition live. 

[TaxNerd]

Ok, short defense of Monica's techniques.

If she tells someone not to compete on the side and they do, they need to be held accountable. By physically punishing him by making him practice, she is using him him as a deterrent for the team.

Let's say he gets to sit this one out. How many additional times do you think this would come up on the team? Versus one punishing practice, and all 40 know when Monica says don't compete on the side, you stay in line. 

To me, addressing the issue one time and putting it to bed is safer overall than dealing with repeat offenses.

[dbell1]

Binged this yesterday and could not stop. I was like a meme. Went from “I’ll give it 20 minutes“ to “Monica, put Jerry on that damned mat” by the end of the first episode. 😂

Just so freaking good.

PS, Gabi, I know you love those people, but damn, sever the umbilical cord and stop being your family’s cash cow. 

[pasdetrois]

TMZ reports that some of the Cheer gang are in LA, shopping for more opportunities, such as a movie version of the series. I didn't read all of the details, but Jerry is there.

Also, Netflix and the Cheer production company are in talks for more shows, I presume a second season featuring the Bulldogs.

[Pepper Mostly]

I just wanted to give everyone a big hug and feed them and tell them to do their homework. Morgan broke my heart--she's so desperate for kindness and love. And Lexi! Just enchanting. She looks like a fairy or a water sprite, so tiny and dainty, with that waterfall of silvery hair! Gabi, being used as a cash cow by her overbearing family. Those girls need structure and love and guidance. I wanted to adopt them all.

I hope that everyone is back at Navarro for the show, and to compete one more time. I'd be upset with Jerry if he gave up his chance at an education to go back to the safety of Navarro, for example. All of them will have to leave the nest eventually. I hope they don't hurt their chances elsewhere by staying too long. Monica won't allow that, will she?

[Wicked Biscuit]

On 1/21/2020 at 9:43 PM, TaxNerd said:

Ok, short defense of Monica's techniques.

If she tells someone not to compete on the side and they do, they need to be held accountable. By physically punishing him by making him practice, she is using him him as a deterrent for the team.

Let's say he gets to sit this one out. How many additional times do you think this would come up on the team? Versus one punishing practice, and all 40 know when Monica says don't compete on the side, you stay in line. 

To me, addressing the issue one time and putting it to bed is safer overall than dealing with repeat offenses.

Except by having TT practice full out while injured and hurting,  she's putting his flyer at risk as well. How can he be effective at keeping someone from falling if he can barely stand up straight and isn't moving freely? There are other effective ways to keep people in line.  Disobey her and you lose your opportunity to be on mat, for example.

The blase approach towards injuries bothered me the entire series. That pyramid and the way three girls got concussions in one practice trying to learn it was alarming. At what point  do you think that maybe you change the pyramid instead of sacrificing more brains? 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Most unintentionally hilarious moment of the season for me: the assistant coach smearing coconut oil on himself at the pool straight out of the jar.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

A former Navarro cheerleader is suing over sexual assault

Summary:

Andre McGee attended Navarro 1995-2000 and was on the cheer team at some point during that time. He was an RA 2003-2004. At an unspecified time, he started working with the cheer team.

In 2015, the victim came to Navarro to cheer. Andre said he was the assistant coach. The cheer team had to give him their class schedules. According to the lawsuit, Andre would hit the male cheerleaders, make them drop their pants when he told them to, and force them to drink/take drugs. The lawsuit also says that Andre had hundreds of nude photos of the cheerleaders.

The victim said Andre forced him to take a Xanax and woke up to Andre sodomizing him. He reported the incident to Monica and Navarro, as well  to the police. A second cheerleader made similar claims to the police. When the first victim reported what happened, the school responded by saying that Andre wasn't employed by Navarro. They said he was an unpaid volunteer. Apparently they think that absolves them of any responsibility.

Andre was finally indicted for sexual assault in March 2017 but then nothing happened for 10 months. When the victim's family contacted the local news station, they learned that a man who was facing sexual assault charges was substitute teaching a few miles away. The criminal case was dismissed in December 2018 but the victim is pursuing a civil case.

 

[Armchair Critic]

Morgan reminds me so much of the actress Kate Mara

[Marcya23]

Disclaimer- I worked for NCA for many years. First as an instructor then later in the corporate office. I came up with Brad (the Cheer Athletics owner featured).  I loved my time there and still treasure the friendships. I cheered at a D1 school- albeit 20 years ago. I am amazed at how the sport has progressed. I would never make the team today!  
 

I  get so frustrated with most cheer shows and was skeptical when I heard this was coming.  But man, this hit the mark. I love how so many non-cheer folks have also enjoyed it.  I especially think that if you are ANY type of coach or athlete, this can speak to you on so many levels. 
 

2 things to add: one of our seniors (I am a teacher and school cheer coach) tried out for Navarro on Monday. They are having several open tryout days, so he won’t find out for a bit. He said that all of the “cast” was there, even Gabi.  But it makes sense because they were probably running through the Ellen routine on the 3 day weekend. He said everyone was pretty talented but was surprised how many girls who “base” showed up. Navarro being coed, there’s not much chance of them making it. 
 

As for filming and footage, it has pretty much always been the practice at NCA to not allow outside camera crews. Besides, the Daytona venue is tight. It would have been disrespectful and distracting to others competing. But I do know for a fact that the crew was given the Varsity footage but decided not to use it for some reason. 
 

 

[PicnicLife77]

I really enjoyed this show. 

Just curious, but anyone have an idea how to pronounce Morgan's last name? I really, really like her. And I don't think there's anything wrong with her staying a 3rd year. I know it's not the norm, but considering what she's been through I can see why she is happy to have found a place that appreciates her and to have the structure. Once she moves on from this she can't get it back later in life, so I don't blame her. I don't see her becoming someone who stalls on moving forward in life. If anything, I think this keeps her motivated. WHat's one more year doing something healthy for you, in the grand scheme of things? 

Lexi is interesting. I actually really like her. I find her very articulate. But I don't understand her affect. 

[PityFree]

I know I am in the minority, but I thought Coach Monica was a mean, arrogant, smug, unprofessional coach who thinks her poop doesn’t stink. Yeah, she occasionally did the right thing, (helping Lexi contact the police) but I still dislike her so, so much. Hey guys! Did you know she has an MBA from the best business school in the world but she *chooses* to work in that tiny, one-horse town instead of as a CEO in New York City??? She never mentions it!!!! 
 

[Starlight925]

1 hour ago, PityFree said:

I know I am in the minority, but I thought Coach Monica was a mean, arrogant, smug, unprofessional coach who thinks her poop doesn’t stink. Yeah, she occasionally did the right thing, (helping Lexi contact the police) but I still dislike her so, so much. Hey guys! Did you know she has an MBA from the best business school in the world but she *chooses* to work in that tiny, one-horse town instead of as a CEO in New York City??? She never mentions it!!!! 
 

Agreed!

I also believe that in getting the police to talk to Lexi, she calmed Lexi down enough to stay and work hard...a huge win for Monica.  I don’t believe she did it purely out of the goodness of her heart, sorry. 

Oh, and her bragging about going to the “Best business school”.....sooooo funny.  She was there in the late 80’s/early 90’s, when all you had to do was sign your name to get in.  How do I know?  I went there too back then.  No way in h*ll I’d get in today.  My SAT scores and class rank were literally HALF what you’d need to get accepted today.  She’s bragging as though she got in now.  Nuh. Uh.  
I make a joke when I tell people where I went.  By the skin of my teeth, I say.  Whenever people sound impressed, I always make sure to remind them of the different time it was, and what a simpler admissions process it was back then....whew.  It made me cringe when she bragged like that.  
Funny, I just drove through Corsicana today.  

Edited January 26, 2020 by Sterling

[GaT]

On 1/12/2020 at 5:55 AM, CoolMom said:

I am sad that Lexi backslid into her old ways because she took the fall for a "friend". 

That's what she told her grandparents happened, personally, I'm a bit skeptical.

As lots of other posters have mentioned, I find the whole Gabi situation off putting. It reminds me of child stars who have a parent as a manager & who support the family, only Gabi is not going to be able to transition to an adult cheerleader unlike child stars who possibly can continue as adult actors. Plus, every time she does a routine, she runs the risk of injury. Something just seems wrong about the whole thing.

[Shannon L.]

On 1/19/2020 at 6:55 PM, SuzySmith said:

I guess I’m the only one who was concerned about the lack of concern Monica showed when those kids got hurt. 

I just finished the series and I'm not a big fan of Monica's, either, and this was a big part of it.  I cringed whenever she made them do push ups because their form was so bad that I'm surprised they didn't have bad backs from that alone!  There were at least 3 people there who could have made sure that those athletes, who were performing ridiculously dangerous stunts, were doing every exercise properly.  When the one young man said that he hurt his back over the weekend and she basically shrugged and said "Oh well, not my problem." and made him go on anyway, I was livid.  I don't think he should have risked cheering over the weekend, but I'd have pulled him off the mat and said that an alternate would take his place until he could cheer and if he couldn't catch up after being out for a while, then he lost his spot.  And while I understand the theory behind why she made them go through routines while they were exhausted, I thought it was a dangerous risk.  I do, however, appreciate the tight hold she had on their behavior while representing the squad and how she stood up for the gay men on the team. 

I hope Gabi transitions well to life without cheer leading and that she can manage without her parents (who were driving me crazy, too).  I got the feeling that they were into her fame a lot more than she was. 

The kid that had to fill in the day of the competition with a half hour of practice is a rock star. 

[Scarlett45]

Poor Jerry! Losing his mother so young. I’m glad the cheer community rallied around him to give him love and support. 
 

My friend asked me to watch so we could discuss it. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

11 hours ago, Shannon L. said:

The kid that had to fill in the day of the competition with a half hour of practice is a rock star. 

It always cracks me up in the DCC forum when people are super impressed whenever they have to bring someone in to sub for a game. DCC routines are all in unison with a handful of roll offs/ripples and a few formation changes so as long as you know the dance, you just have to know which count your roll off is on and where to walk in the transitions.

In comparison, you see a last minute substitution like this where no two people do the exact same thing for the duration of the routine, and someone steps in at the last minute and does it flawlessly.

It makes me think that DCC fans would have their minds blown if they saw Broadway swings who have to learn different parts for shows that run over two hours!

[Tdoc72]

On 1/26/2020 at 9:55 PM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

It always cracks me up in the DCC forum when people are super impressed whenever they have to bring someone in to sub for a game. DCC routines are all in unison with a handful of roll offs/ripples and a few formation changes so as long as you know the dance, you just have to know which count your roll off is on and where to walk in the transitions.

In comparison, you see a last minute substitution like this where no two people do the exact same thing for the duration of the routine, and someone steps in at the last minute and does it flawlessly.

It makes me think that DCC fans would have their minds blown if they saw Broadway swings who have to learn different parts for shows that run over two hours!

Kelli is going to be pissed that you don’t think the DCC are the end all and be all. 😂

1/2 way through this series. Love all of the kids but especially Morgan and Jerry. I just want to hug them. 

[Keekski]

Kelli & Monica look like they could be sisters. I was trying to figure out all through watching Cheer who Monica reminded me of, and it's Kelli. Totally. 

[blixie]

Quote

And in Monica’s defense, she always defers to the trainers

Yeah I've only seen the first episode but I was really impressed by how much she clearly cares about the health of her team, while unfortunately still playing into pressing the limits of safety in the routines. I do think there is a major difference between football and cheer: COMPENSATION. Like CTE and the NFL are fucking garbage but at least those athletes have career paths post Uni if they are good enough. None such with Cheer. But I very much get that these athletes joy centers on the risks the difficulty of what they are doing, and at least with Monica they have coach that's way more caring and ethical than the gymnast ones I've seen. 

I do think the sport should stop allowing much less rewarding the pyramid transitions. At the very least they should be minimized. Increasing the number and speed of transitions seems to be the root of a LOT of the injuries. 

[Whimsy]

2 hours ago, blixie said:

ike CTE and the NFL are fucking garbage but at least those athletes have career paths post Uni if they are good enough

I don't understand why there is cheer in this format for peewee football, high school and college but then when it gets to the pros they're just glorified dancers.  Why not have a thrilling routine during halftime and cheers during the game, etc.  I don't get why it just stops after college. 

[heatherchandler]

On 1/13/2020 at 8:25 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

The crazy thing is that all kinds of injuries still happen even with the newer guidelines that require mats and only allow formations to be 2 1/2 people high. In the not so olden days, collegiate cheer squads were allowed to stunt on the sidelines at football and basketball without any mats (aka right on bare cement or floor) and they were allowed to go 3 high.

 

I'm glad that they touched on weight because it would be absurd not to. There is always the expectation that female athletes will look a certain way and their weight is often obsessively monitored (not just in cheer). Honestly, it's not uncommon for a college aged flyer to weigh 96 pounds. As Sparky Polastri said, "We throw people in the air."

 

 

What is 2 1/2?  Is that 1 holding the girl as high as possible, then a girl on her shoulders?

LOVE the Sparky Polastri reference!!!!!!   🤣

 

On 1/11/2020 at 3:40 PM, meatball77 said:

As for the gal that stayed for a third year, I don't know what she would benefit academically from that.  An associates is the first two years of a four year degree.  There are a few careers where the associates is enough (childcare, some lower level nursing positions).  If she's not taking out any loans a third year in a place where she's learning to handle herself academically and keep her life together.

 

I thought an Associates Degree is it's own thing.

 

On 1/11/2020 at 3:22 PM, fountain said:

Okay the lady who taught them about Texas was offensive as hell, it is hard for me to imagine with her language and comments on camera that she wouldn’t immediately be terminated. She did not do the college any favours.

 

She said some weird things, but I don't think she said anything that would be cause for termination.  She reminds me of most of the Texans I know.  Hard core republicans.

 

On 1/13/2020 at 12:42 PM, Loves2Dance said:

Gabi's parents are rich. Her father has several businesses and they live a very nice life in South Florida. 

Define "rich."  The house looks like a small, disorganized mess.

 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

12 hours ago, heatherchandler said:

What is 2 1/2?  Is that 1 holding the girl as high as possible, then a girl on her shoulders?

It has to do with height. The easiest way to determine if a stunt is a full or half level, look at where the flyer’s feet are.

A half elevator (also called a vator) is when the base holds the flyer’s feet at chest/chin level like this:

A full elevator is when the base extends their arms straight up like this:

Both of these stunts are considered 2 high (as is having the flyer stand on the base’s shoulders). Back in ye olden days, you could do 3 high pyramids with one of these stunts on top of another so the top person was truly 3 people high up in the air (sometimes higher than the height of 3 people if there was an elevator).

3 high pyramids have been banned so this was one of the few pictures I could find just to give you an idea, but they were usually much more dangerous than this one:

2 1/2 means if you have three people vertically, one of them can be in a vator/elevator/shoulder stand but one of them can only have their feet as high as their base’s waist in their stunt. This is why on Cheer you see a pyramid with one girl standing on another girl’s thigh (this was the stunt that Allie fell on during the showcase where La’Darius said she wasn’t watching where to put her feet - which was untrue, for the record). These are 2 1/2 high pyramids:

As long as one level has their feet no higher than their base’s waist, it’s considered a 1/2 level. This is another variation without anyone standing on someone’s thighs:

Edited January 31, 2020 by ElectricBoogaloo

[GaT]

I'm going to put this in spoiler code in case there's a season 2 (which, going by how popular the show is, I'm sure there will be)

 

Spoiler

This Is How Cheer Star Lexi Ended Up Back on the Navarro Team

 

[Joan of Argh]

9 hours ago, Whimsy said:

I don't understand why there is cheer in this format for peewee football, high school and college but then when it gets to the pros they're just glorified dancers.  Why not have a thrilling routine during halftime and cheers during the game, etc.  I don't get why it just stops after college. 

Probably because the majority of people who follow the NFL would rather have the sexy dancers.

I really don't think halftime cheers would be very popular with most NFL fans.

[Loves2Dance]

7 hours ago, heatherchandler said:

What is 2 1/2?  Is that 1 holding the girl as high as possible, then a girl on her shoulders?

LOVE the Sparky Polastri reference!!!!!!   🤣

 

I thought an Associates Degree is it's own thing.

 

She said some weird things, but I don't think she said anything that would be cause for termination.  She reminds me of most of the Texans I know.  Hard core republicans.

 

Define "rich."  The house looks like a small, disorganized mess.

 

Multi-millionaire. 

[heatherchandler]

1 hour ago, Loves2Dance said:

Multi-millionaire. 

That crazy dad is a multi-millionaire?  I’m going to need proof.  He’s too nervous and self conscious, or something.  Why does their house look like shit?  

[Loves2Dance]

1 hour ago, heatherchandler said:

That crazy dad is a multi-millionaire?  I’m going to need proof.  He’s too nervous and self conscious, or something.  Why does their house look like shit?  

Yup, and so is Gabi. He has started up several businesses and continues on as the owner of quite a few. Yes, he comes across as neurotic and crazy but he's actually a pretty successful business man. In truth, he was mildly more sane before his daughter became famous. The Butler's are well known in the cheer world and some of the stories about them are quite a doozey. 

Also, money doesn't equal class. 

Edited January 31, 2020 by Loves2Dance

[blixie]

Quote

 money doesn't equal class. 

Especially in Florida. Gabi should tell them all to fuck off. 

[Starlight925]

Remember the fruitcake company that was highlighted in Episode 1?  

Collin Street Bakery.

There's a movie coming out about a $16 million dollar embezzlement by their former Controller.  Starring Will Ferrell and Laura Dern:

https://www.corsicanadailysun.com/news/fruitcake-movie-in-the-making/article_0e0b17fe-99e7-11e9-a355-875eba9179d8.html

Interestingly, I was in this bakery just yesterday, and no one in the bakery had even heard of "Cheer", even though Navarro College is just down the street.  I drove through the campus as well.

Edited January 31, 2020 by Sterling

[EarlGreyTea]

On 1/19/2020 at 5:53 PM, dmmetler said:

NCA Nationals is in April, so I assume the returning kids did fall somewhere else, and came back to Navarro for the Spring to compete at Nationals, with the expectation of another season of the show. They can probably do that without losing admission at their other school, and take a class or two that will transfer, especially if they weren’t core complete and hadn’t actually completed an AS before transferring. 
 

It seems unfair to the kids who tried out for and made Navarro and cheered the entire football season. At most schools, you have to be on the team in the fall to go to Nationals-but there is nothing against the rules about it. 

And I'm guessing that since the show premiered only a few weeks ago, producers wouldn't have had time to see the great reception the show is getting in time to start filming this current semester? If so, I wonder if we will have to wait over a year for another season. Unless they greenlit a new season like, within days.

I wonder if they'll break the fourth wall and acknowledge the show's success and the media tour the main cast has been on.

[nlkm9]

On 1/21/2020 at 9:43 PM, TaxNerd said:

Ok, short defense of Monica's techniques.

If she tells someone not to compete on the side and they do, they need to be held accountable. By physically punishing him by making him practice, she is using him him as a deterrent for the team.

Let's say he gets to sit this one out. How many additional times do you think this would come up on the team? Versus one punishing practice, and all 40 know when Monica says don't compete on the side, you stay in line. 

To me, addressing the issue one time and putting it to bed is safer overall than dealing with repeat offenses.

That kid was in such agony he was sobbing . Sorry Monica’s action could have caused permanent damage, she should have figured out another way to punish him. 

On 1/26/2020 at 9:55 PM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

It always cracks me up in the DCC forum when people are super impressed whenever they have to bring someone in to sub for a game. DCC routines are all in unison with a handful of roll offs/ripples and a few formation changes so as long as you know the dance, you just have to know which count your roll off is on and where to walk in the transitions.

In comparison, you see a last minute substitution like this where no two people do the exact same thing for the duration of the routine, and someone steps in at the last minute and does it flawlessly.

It makes me think that DCC fans would have their minds blown if they saw Broadway swings who have to learn different parts for shows that run over two hours!

This post comes off as very “ braggity” all these kids are talented no matter which organization they cheer for .

[SG11]

Ok, I’ll make one post after watching the the season.

Im not the typical Cheer watcher, I’m sure. I was looking for something different to watch during workouts, and as a former college hockey player, I found the college athletics aspect of this to be interesting.

I was blown away by the kids’  commitment and drive and conditioning and level of talent. They are college athletes just like any other sport. The only thing that floors me as that when I was done, all I could think about was trying to play in the NHL. These kids had nothing after this. Nothing. Maybe a third year.

Heres the first thing I don’t understand. I know everyone doesn’t try for an AA while at a Jr college, but doesn’t cheering a third year reduce a participant’s eligibility if they transfer to a 4 year school? I couldn’t keep playing for 5 or 6 years just because I took more classes. I’d think someone SO committed to the sport would be laser-focused on cheering 2 more years at a 4 year school, especially with success at a great program like Navarro.

Of course, I don’t understand the sport to know if they should have won, that’s why I dislike “judged” sports. Was the fact it was the climax of a documentary a factor? How do you have a catastrophic event and still win?

Lexi was fascinating. Her affect sounded like she was high, brain damaged, autistic or... something. Oh, and she didn’t want to rat on a friend? Pleeeeze. She was a tremendous athlete, must watch in every scene and an attractive girl. Kind of a train wreck in waiting though.

In comparison to... Gabi. What am I missing there? OK, famous for a great stretch on you tube? What else? Not getting the Gabi thing at all. Good performer I suppose, Ok/ordinary looking I guess... what’s up there? She’s not in Lexi’s league. I never understood the Gabi thing, not at all. 

Hard to not love Morgan, kept plugging, hard worker, heartbreaking story. I liked her from the beginning. Was it Allie that she was competing with? Yikes, not seeing the “superior technique” and was afraid of her own shadow. No thanks.

Ladarious was impossible to like. Shut up man, seriously. You want people to give 110% because you do, except when you quit on your team. I would have not got along with that one. Not as a teammate, not as a coach.

I liked Monica a lot. Tough, excellent coach. Didn’t see any issues there.

Again, don’t know anything about the sport but if someone commenting wants to minimize what that kid did coming off the sidelines and plugging in under pressure like that, well there’s some envy going on, that’s all I have to say.

One thing that really disappointed me was the “rival” that Navarro was concerned with was... the entire field of competition. Y'know, those staged screen shots of Monica and others with all the big trophies lining the gym in the background? Not all that impressive anymore when there’s 2 teams in your class and you will get one of those trophies for getting off the plane. A serious downer for me.

Ugh Gabis parents were horrible. I think I hated Mom worse. Morgan’s Dad needed a beating. LaDarious looked like he had it rough, too. Jerry, nice kid, easy to root for.  Lexi made life tough on her family, but she was the character who took over the series, I think.

I enjoyed the hell out of that show, really really loved it.

Edited February 2, 2020 by SG11

[Starlight925]

2 hours ago, SG11 said:

One thing that really disappointed me was the “rival” that Navarro was concerned with was... the entire field of competition. Y'know, those staged screen shots of Monica and others with all the big trophies lining the gym in the background? Not all that impressive anymore when there’s 2 teams in your class and you will get one of those trophies for getting off the plane. A serious downer for me.

I enjoyed your entire post!

Re:  the "one rival".  It's my understanding that the one rival, was the one rival left, after the others in that class had been eliminated.  In other words, it came down to Navarro vs. Trinity, where there had been a field of others.  If I'm wrong, can someone please correct me?

[ElectricBoogaloo]

2 hours ago, SG11 said:

I know everyone doesn’t try for an AA while at a Jr college, but doesn’t cheering a third year reduce a participant’s eligibility if they transfer to a 4 year school? I couldn’t keep playing for 5 or 6 years just because I took more classes. I’d think someone SO committed to the sport would be laser-focused on cheering 2 more years at a 4 year school, especially with success at a great program like Navarro.

At many JCs, students are not required to be full time in order to participate in extracurricular activities so it's possible that the cheerleaders are not taking 12-15 units like a regular cheerleader would be taking at a 4 year university, which means that by the time these kids transfer to a 4 year college they may have only a handful of units (and depending on what classes they took, they might not get credit for all the classes they took).

In addition, if you're talking about eligibility to be on the cheer team wherever they graduate, cheer is not an official NCAA sport so there isn't any eligibility for them to exhaust by staying an extra year at Navarro.

5 hours ago, nlkm9 said:

This post comes off as very “ braggity” all these kids are talented no matter which organization they cheer for .

I'm neither a cheerleader nor a Broadway swing so I'm not bragging. I was just pointing out that having to sub one person into a group routine where everyone does the exact same choreography is nowhere near as difficult as jumping into a cheer routine with multiple stunts where no one has the same part for the entire routine or doing a 2 hour show where you have to learn every part done by each person in the ensemble (including harmonies, formations, partner tricks, etc.).

[SG11]

2 hours ago, Sterling said:

I enjoyed your entire post!

Re:  the "one rival".  It's my understanding that the one rival, was the one rival left, after the others in that class had been eliminated.  In other words, it came down to Navarro vs. Trinity, where there had been a field of others.  If I'm wrong, can someone please correct me?

The post by Whimsy on Page 1 that shows the image of the teams entered, indicates only 2 teams were in their division. Other comments do as well. I’d like to hear clarification too.

Thanks for the kudos, Sterling.

[Starlight925]

9 hours ago, SG11 said:

The post by Whimsy on Page 1 that shows the image of the teams entered, indicates only 2 teams were in their division. Other comments do as well. I’d like to hear clarification too.

Thanks for the kudos, Sterling.

Interesting. Yeah, agreed.... if there are only 2 teams in their division, then it's misleading, like you said, holding up all those trophies.  Hmmm.  

OK, found an article that explains it:

https://www.pajiba.com/tv_reviews/fact-checking-cheer-are-navarro-community-college-and-coach-monica-aldama-that-good.php

There are only 2 colleges that compete in Navarro's division.

But....they've won 6 Grand National Championships, which is a cumulative total of points higher than ANY college or university.

 

Edited February 2, 2020 by Sterling

[jrzy]

U of L has won many championships in Cheerleading,  I loved seeing the U OF L T'shirt on him.  I am biased of course as my family is from Louisville and my parents went to University of Louisville as did many cousins and other relatives.

 

 

[Whimsy]

17 hours ago, Sterling said:

I enjoyed your entire post!

Re:  the "one rival".  It's my understanding that the one rival, was the one rival left, after the others in that class had been eliminated.  In other words, it came down to Navarro vs. Trinity, where there had been a field of others.  If I'm wrong, can someone please correct me?

 

15 hours ago, SG11 said:

The post by Whimsy on Page 1 that shows the image of the teams entered, indicates only 2 teams were in their division. Other comments do as well. I’d like to hear clarification too.

Thanks for the kudos, Sterling.

 

6 hours ago, Sterling said:

Interesting. Yeah, agreed.... if there are only 2 teams in their division, then it's misleading, like you said, holding up all those trophies.  Hmmm.  

OK, found an article that explains it:

https://www.pajiba.com/tv_reviews/fact-checking-cheer-are-navarro-community-college-and-coach-monica-aldama-that-good.php

There are only 2 colleges that compete in Navarro's division.

But....they've won 6 Grand National Championships, which is a cumulative total of points higher than ANY college or university.

 

Yes. that is all correct.  There were only two teams in their division so winning their division alone isn't super impressive EXCEPT they won Grand Champs several times- which is the highest score of the entire competition.  Those competitions have hundreds of teams so that IS impressive. 

[Ynicknan]

I enjoyed this show. The one thing that makes me nervous is the fame that tends to come with a hit show like this. Many of these kids don’t come from great backgrounds and are ill equipped to deal with the quick rise and the quick fall that comes from fame like this. Makes me want to wrap my arms around Lexie, and Morgan, Jerry, and many of the others.

[SG11]

On 2/2/2020 at 8:58 AM, Sterling said:

Interesting. Yeah, agreed.... if there are only 2 teams in their division, then it's misleading, like you said, holding up all those trophies.  Hmmm.  

OK, found an article that explains it:

https://www.pajiba.com/tv_reviews/fact-checking-cheer-are-navarro-community-college-and-coach-monica-aldama-that-good.php

There are only 2 colleges that compete in Navarro's division.

But....they've won 6 Grand National Championships, which is a cumulative total of points higher than ANY college or university.

 

 

23 hours ago, Whimsy said:

 

 

Yes. that is all correct.  There were only two teams in their division so winning their division alone isn't super impressive EXCEPT they won Grand Champs several times- which is the highest score of the entire competition.  Those competitions have hundreds of teams so that IS impressive. 

Absolutely impressive. The program is elite, Id never debate that.

Although even in the case of Grand Championships, if all of the “hundreds” of competitors have their final scores compared and the Grand Champion winner is the one with the highest score, if all the competitors were not all judged by the same judges, theres a gaping credibility hole there. There’s a laundry list of problems there.  If all the class winners were pitted against one another in a Grand Championship round, and you had a winner, then perfect. But if a team that got a 98.99 from Sue and Bob and they won the GC over a team that got a 98.10 from Fred and Mary, well...

And watching the series, there was zero emphasis on the GC. Every word was about beating the team down the street, winning the division and jumping into the ocean. I just assumed you had plenty of teams to beat and that team down the street was just considered the best of them.

In this case although I never support poor sportsmanship, I can see why a kid losing at Daytona in 2017 would feel like they were a total failure. It’s all or nothing.

But, not picking on them. I just hate the glaring weaknesses of judging events. They are clearly an elite program and their record is spectacular. And Monica is a friggin’ stud. (Shes hot, too)