S01.E09: See How They Fly

[formerlyfreedom]

Quote

Everything ends. For real this time.

Season finale airing on Sunday, December 15, 2019.

 

[LoveLeigh]

I hate manipulative cliffhangers..... unless there is a small piece attached after the credits roll. I don't like speculation or guessing games. 

Ok no piece after the credits so this finale sucked. 

[AimingforYoko]

Quote

Everything ends. For real this time.

I knew Lindelof was going to pull that shit. I vote: Not a god.

[Popples]

I'm disappointed the identity of Lube-Man was never revealed.

[Michichick]

5 minutes ago, DakotaLavender said:

I hate manipulative cliffhangers..... unless there is a small piece attached after the credits roll. I don't like speculation or guessing games. 

Ok no piece after the credits so this finale sucked. 

Oh gosh, I loved the episode. Even if there is no season 2, I’m satisfied. I’m pretty confident Angela took on his powers.

[mac123x]

Pretty predictable ending, and wow were there way too many villainous monologues (Keane, Trieu, Veidt) but at least the last two got cut short, but I enjoyed it.  They actually wrapped everything up besides the possibility of Dr. Angelahattan.  I was kind of hoping she'd fall in the pool after she ate the raw egg.  Congratulations, Angela, you didn't get omnipotence, just salmonella.

Edited December 16, 2019 by mac123x

[AimingforYoko]

Veidt was right about Trieu (Like father, like daughter) but seeing her completely outplan and outflank the extremely overmatched Cyclops was very satisfying.

[Affogato]

10 minutes ago, Popples said:

I'm disappointed the identity of Lube-Man was never revealed.

It wasn’t a mystery

[DearEvette]

I don't care whether Angela is or isn't.  I loved the finale. 

I loved that Laurie got to see Jon one more time.

I loved that Looking Glass came back kicking ass.

I loved that the senator went out like a chump in stupid looking panties.

I loved that my theory about Judd was correct.

I loved Lady Trieu to the end, but Adrien was correct about her so I wasn't mad about her fate.  But still, I enjoyed the hell out of that character. And I especially love how she just swatted the 7K and all their elaborate plans with her even more elaborate ones.  They were playing checkers, she was playing chess.

I loved that Jon was really in love with Angela.

I even loved the part that Adrien played -- finally. Also he was amusing for real in this one.  "Its been a hoot!'. Ha.

[mrc12671]

"I'm in every moment we ever shared...all at once."

That line is going to stay with me for a very long time.

[Popples]

6 minutes ago, Affogato said:

It wasn’t a mystery

I was being slightly facetious.

[Xantar]

So this episode is really about who gets to have Dr Manhattan’s powers. Senator Keene, Lady Trieu, or Angela. They each represent a different kind of vision. We know what Keene and Trieu would have done with their power, and this episode argues that they shouldn’t have it. 

 What would Angela do with that power? In some ways, she’s like Jon Osterman—unassuming and not really wanting ultimate power. But on the other hand, the comics and this show make it clear that Jon could see all time and was therefore helpless to take any action. 

[Amethyst]

I really hope this gets a second season.  That was a good finale, but I don't want it to be the end.  There's still so many questions.

Trieu vaporizing the 7th Kalvary was just too satisfying.  And Keene getting liquified (while wearing those stupid panties, no less) made it all the better.  I thought he was going to exit the machine looking like a horrible abomination, like Brundlefly.

I felt sorry for the Warden/Adam.  Assuming that he didn't even want the role of a villain, Adrien had to turn the knife sideways and tell the Adam that he didn't even do a good job of it.  

Poor Angela.  Even if she has supernatural powers, she's lost Cal, and nothing makes up for that.  Love them together.

[DearEvette]

Forgot to add, I  kinda giggled when Lady Trieu was monologuing (reading Angela's grandfather's speech) and Judd's wife was like 'Just do it.  You're gonna kill us right, so just kill us." and Lady Trieu gives a Kanye shrug and says ok.  Meanwhile all the other 7K bigwigs are panicing the hell out.  They wanted that speech.  It would have given them a few precious more minutes.  LOL.

[Lantern7]

Well. Okay, then.

I hope there will be a second season, though those nine episodes might as well stand on their own. The fact that "The Watchmen follow-up we never asked for" worked this well is such a miracle in of itself . . . such that Dr. Manhattan wouldn't have expected this at all.  Sure, there's the level of bugfuck (squidfuck?) presented by, say, Happy! and Preacher, but it also conveyed a lot of gravitas. That's a feat when you have an aged Adrian Veldt, in his Ozymandias costume, popping out from under the grass to make a run for a spaceship and his freedom. And then he got coated in gold by the daughter he never knew he had. Oh, and he caught a bullet with his hand. That was an awesome "Oh, fuck" moment in the miniseries, and it's a shoutout that didn't feel gratuitous.

One takeaway . . . the 7th Kalvary were dumbasses. Total disgraces and dumbasses. On the other hand, we had Senator Secret Supremacist Leader disrobing to reveal underwear modeled after Dr. Manhattan's look from the Sixties. Maybe we came out even.

I never would have thought Laurie would be that good an ass-kicker at that age. I liked the reunion with Veidt . . . and how that ended when Looking Glass clocked him from behind.

Man, I hope Jon was screwing with Angela with the egg. How funny would it be that one of the last actions of the indestructible man that wound up getting destroyed was to show the love of his life (well, one of them) he had a sense of humor?

[kay1864]

Heh.  After Angela and her family left the DREAMLAND theater, because of the damage from the frozen squid, all that was left was DR   M. 

[MrWhyt]

I need a cigarette

[Cthulhudrew]

2 hours ago, Amethyst said:

Poor Angela.  Even if she has supernatural powers, she's lost Cal, and nothing makes up for that.  Love them together.

Then again, if she did get Dr. Manhattan's powers, she gets to relive those moments with Cal eternally.

[ProudMary]

3 hours ago, Popples said:

I'm disappointed the identity of Lube-Man was never revealed.

https://www.hbo.com/content/dam/hbodata/series/watchmen/peteypedia/09/memo-dale-petey.pdf
 

Quote

Effective immediately, Dale Petey is no longer an agent of the Federal Bureau of Investigation and his employment by the Anti-Vigilante Task Force has been terminated.
A maintenance crew will be boxing up the contents of Petey’s office later this afternoon. Anyone interested in taking anything from the stacks of media, ephemera, and straight-up junk cluttering his workspace — multiple copies of Rorschach’s Journal, hundreds of “comic” books (why our society is still so obsessed with pirates is beyond me) and a jug of what appears to be some kind of canola oil, help yourselves.

😄

[jeansheridan]

So other than this show I am a total newcomer to The Watchmen. Never read it, never saw the movie. I was fascinated by its weirdness. And how the actors captured that weirdness. Lady Trieu is such a vivid creation. Her beats were always just a bit off. And Jean Smart was so wonderfully world weary. And Regina King makes a credible action hero. 

I feel like this show knew exactly what it wanted to say and how to say it and they were blessed with a perfect cast. Even the kid actors were solid. 

[Dev F]

I enjoyed the finale, but as a fan of the original graphic novel, I thought it leaned too hard into whiz-bang sci-fi beats and went too easy on superhero mythmaking to match the clarity and affective power of the original comic. I was grateful to see some complication of the good-versus-evil showdown the season seemed to be headed toward, with progressive champion Trieu's godlike ambitions needing to be thwarted just as much as those of white supremacist Keene, and Adrian finally facing justice for his crimes.  But with Will's final speech about how the problem was that Dr. Manhattan didn't try to do more, the season-ending tease of Angela maybe inheriting (some of?) Jon's powers, and Adrian being brought to justice by other superheroes instead of an anonymous schlub at a fringe newspaper, the ultimate thrust of the story changes from an intricate indictment of the very idea of superheroism, to some milquetoast thing about how you gotta stand up and be a hero -- but, like, not in a way that's too extreme in either direction, man! That's such a played-out message at this point, and not one, I think, that Alan Moore would much appreciate.

So, in the end, I appreciate the series more for what it did on an episode-by-episode basis, producing some of my favorite episodes of television this year (I especially adored "She Was Killed by Space Junk" and "A Man Walks into Abar"), than what it accomplished as an artistic whole.

Oh, and it took me till the What, are we gonna arrest the president? riff at the end for me to get the joke at the beginning of in the episode, when Veidt complains that Redford refuses to acknowledge that this outside agent arranged his presidency, because he wants to believe that he would've gotten elected all on his own. Cute.

Edited December 16, 2019 by Dev F

[thuganomics85]

Definitely went big for the season (maybe series?) finale and while there might have been a few quibbles here or there, I thought it mainly stuck the landing, even with the cliffhanger, since it was something I would be fine with leaving as a mystery.

So, not only was Lady Trieu really Adrian's daughter (although he didn't know since Bian/the mother stole his sperm that he kept hidden a frozen vault), but that golden statue of Adrian was actually the real one this entire time, and all of the scenes on the Jupiter moon was years ago.  Good old twisty time craziness!

The 7th Calvary being pawns in Trieu's game this entire time was hilarious.  While she certainly was no saint, it was satisfying watching her depose of all of the leadership.  Although, I almost (keyword, almost) respected Jane/Jud's wife for just telling Trieu to quit with the monologue and do what she is clearly going to do.

Still, I should have known Manhattan would have some way to at least take her out with him, and it is fitting that Adrian was the one to do it, since she probably thought she finally proved herself to be smarter than her father.  Instead, he will end up outliving her.

Wish we got a little more of Adrian and Laurie, but Jeremy Irons and Jean Smart were certainly fantastic in the scenes they got!

Even The Game Warden was just another toy of Adrian's, as he just wanted someone close to an adversary to make things interesting for him.  At least he seems to have found some in the form of Laurie and Tillman, but I kind of wonder if they'll actually be able to lock him up (not to mention bring down President Redford!)

I don't know how they managed it in two episodes, but I was way more invested in the Angela/Manhattan relationship than so many other television couples that have been going for episodes or even seasons.  Either the writing was just really damn good or Regina King and Yahya Abdul-Mateen II are just that damn awesome.

That Angela/Ben scene in the theatre might have been my favorite of the entire season.

Probably don't mention it enough, but alongside everything else that is great about this show (the writing, directing, and especially the acting), Trent Reznor and Atticus Ross produce one hell of a score and soundtrack.

I will be fine either way if this is just an one and done show or it comes back.  I will certainly love to explore this universe and these characters some more, but I certainly don't want diminishing returns if Lindelof and crew don't think there is anything left to tell.  Of course, I guess HBO could always look for someone else to take over as showrunner, but they better be up to the task.  Either way, I'm glad I watched it and it was certainly one hell of an experience!

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I just wish that Lady Trieu had told Judd's wife to STFU and that if she wanted to monologue for an hour before killing them, she would damn well do so.

Even though Veidt saw that Lady Trieu would most likely not be as altruistic about using her blue powers as she claimed, it was still satisfying to see her casually stroll in, derail the 7th's plans, and then vaporize them.

I thought I couldn't dislike Senator White Supremacist any more than I already did and then he had to complain about how rough he's had it, all while strolling around in those ridiculous underpants. I've never been so glad to see someone liquified.

Jon and Angela's last moment was so sweet. And I loved that he had a moment of selfishness when he told Angela that the reason he hadn't sent her with Blake, Wade, and Veidt was because he didn't want to be alone when he died.

I am going to miss hearing Lacrimosa crescendo whenever Veidt is around.

[arc]

Great, great episode.

That said, there's a guy on Twitter I admire who thinks Lindelof's driving principle (or one of them) with this show is that masks are bad and that guy think's it's wildly silly for multiple reasons and I gotta say, he's not wrong.

Honestly, I'm pleased to be wrong about my prediction that there would be an intrinsic field subtraction on screen on the show at some point.

On a sci-fi level I don't remotely buy the idea that the cage would inhibit Dr Manhattan because it's made from the "synthetic" lithium he created. I also don't buy that the Seventh Kavalry had to pull out and melt down zillions of watch batteries to create it. In the lore of this show, the residual fear of Manhattan cancer -- stemming from the cancer deaths Veidt engineered to create the scare in the first place -- helped take the electric cars he made possible off the road. A couple dozen of those old cars would be much easier to deal with than all the old watches. I guess I could headcanon it that Trieu just basically incepted the 7th Kav into doing it the hard way because she needed the time to build the Millennium Clock anyways.

In the Sepinwall RS interview with Lindelof, Lindelof clearly thinks Angela got the powers, because the other way is less satisfying. But ... I don't know. In the comic, what happened to Jon was he got disintegrated, and then spent around a year learning how to rebuild his physical body -- apparently his mind/soul* survived and his matter-manipulation powers manifested at that point. But once he fully manifested in his new blue body, he was all the way there, powers-wise. Which is my long way of saying Angela wouldn't have needed to see herself walking on water to believe. If she had those powers she would have all the other stuff too. Most obviously the superhuman perception (Manhattan can see quarks!) and the inhuman perception of time.

* I know, Cal doesn't believe in souls

I wonder if it was intentional that the power transfer thing sort of paralleled the discussion of teleportation in the comic: (paraphrased) "Without Jon's guiding mind, teleported objects tend to explode." Keene got in the power transfer machine and was reduced to goo. But Jon put his powers into a raw egg and it didn't just not-explode, it didn't even crack when Angela smashed the rest of the carton.

Looking Glass knocking Veidt out was fun, but he is still the greatest (non-powered) superhero this world has ever seen. A guy who can catch a bullet - twice - is probably not staying safely locked up on a multiple hour flight back to America.

Also, I assumed Dan Dreiberg and Laurie took Archie back to America in 1985. How did they get back otherwise?

I can't remember if we talked about it in the pilot, but Angela's access code to enter her bakery's superhero lair is "1985" and that's a cute shout-out to the comic and 11/2 but why would she care about 1985? She was in Vietnam when it happened.

Oh, one other thing: teleportation makes mutually assured destruction a kajillion times less stable. If multiple superpowers have teleportation, they don't just have ICBMs aimed at each other, missiles that take long enough to travel that they would trigger a devastating counter-attack. Now they have instantaneous murder at their command. Adrian sent frozen squid from the sky because that's all he could whip up with mere minutes to plan. But a superpower could do much, much worse. And the racist redneck Klan knockoff had teleportation working well enough to send basketballs that didn't explode on arrival.

Edited December 16, 2019 by arc

[Affogato]

1 hour ago, arc said:

On a sci-fi level I don't remotely buy the idea that the cage would inhibit Dr Manhattan because it's made from the "synthetic" lithium he created. I also don't buy that the Seventh Kavalry had to pull out and melt down zillions of watch batteries to create it. In the lore of this show, the residual fear of Manhattan cancer -- stemming from the cancer deaths Veidt engineered to create the scare in the first place -- helped take the electric cars he made possible off the road. A couple dozen of those old cars would be much easier to deal with than all the old watches. I guess I could headcanon it that Trieu just basically incepted the 7th Kav into doing it the hard way because she needed the time to build the Millennium Clock anyways.

Looking Glass knocking Veidt out was fun, but he is still the greatest (non-powered) superhero this world has ever seen. A guy who can catch a bullet - twice - is probably not staying safely locked up on a multiple hour flight back to America.

Also, I assumed Dan Dreiberg and Laurie took Archie back to America in 1985. How did they get back otherwise?

-

It is possible that Manhattan allowed himself to be imprisioned, because he needed to be there at that time. Or was always there. You know. 

Laurie would whack him repeatedly--no hesitation--if he tried anything.

I wondered about that, too. How did Veidt get Archie? Maybe he had Dreiberg's effects shipped to him when he was imprisioned? 

[kay1864]

6 hours ago, Cthulhudrew said:

Then again, if she did get Dr. Manhattan's powers, she gets to relive those moments with Cal eternally.

Hmm, nice thought, but I’m not sure that Jon experienced his entire life that way, I.e. that it’s retroactive. I got the impression it’s only the moments since he became Dr. M.

I’ll have to check the graphic novel to see if it included when his father rejected watchmaking, or when the fat man stepped on Janey’s  watch.

[Maire]

How’s Sen. Keene doing? 

Not great, Bob!

[arc]

Veidt said Archie was just stuck, frozen in Antarctica. Doesn’t make sense to me.

btw, one more thought: there’s a utopian idea in some sci-fi that real space travel will bring about lasting peace for humanity. Or at least it’ll make it so global nuclear annihilation won’t wipe out all of humanity. Well now Trieu is doing it! She sent a probe in 2008 to arrive at Europa in 2013. When she got Veidt’s SOS, she sent a rescue lander that arrived in just two years and came back in about the same amount of time. Meanwhile she’s even solved artificial gravity and hibernation!

and she spent so much time trying to steal Dr Manhattan’s powers instead. Some genius.

[Affogato]

I thought this was a great episode.

As far as Angela goes....Topher sees the Sister Night outfit, so there is that conversation. Cal was the main caregiver in the family and now that he is gone their adopted kids may need more security than a superhero can supply.  Manifestly the blue power doesn't make her safe, there is some general knowledge about how to capture and contain it, so that isn't a solution, and they make a point of showing that she still has the inhibitor. So my guess is she does have the power but uses the inhibitor and goes on with her life, running a bakery. Just because her Grandfather still believes in superheroes doesn't mean she does.

I really want to find out what happens on Europa in a few centuries. I wonder if the inhabitants can reproduce on their own or if they continue to pluck each other from the water. Still believe Veidt was their snake in Eden. 

[molotovcupcake]

10 hours ago, DearEvette said:

I loved that the senator went out like a chump in stupid looking panties.

I can't stop laughing at this.

[DearEvette]

5 hours ago, Dev F said:

But with Will's final speech about how the problem was that Dr. Manhattan didn't try to do more, the season-ending tease of Angela maybe inheriting (some of?) Jon's powers, and Adrian being brought to justice by other superheroes instead of an anonymous schlub at a fringe newspaper, the ultimate thrust of the story changes from an intricate indictment of the very idea of superheroism, to some milquetoast thing about how you gotta stand up and be a hero -- but, like, not in a way that's too extreme in either direction, man! That's such a played-out message at this point, and not one, I think, that Alan Moore would much appreciate.

I think the message I came away was a bit of  indictment of superheroism because when you distill it all, down people behind masks are still people with their own ambitions, jealousies and problems. 

And then you think about the only person who had real superpowers, Dr. M really did nothing because he wasn't really human anymore so was above all those human causes that ideally would cry out for a superhero to fix. He just didn't care.

So in a sense you have to be human enough to care in order to be a real super hero, but then if you are then you are subject to becoming corrupted by the power you have so you aren't a super hero after all.

Think about the people who are trying to become Manhattan:  a raging narcissist who would use the power to have people at her feet and a group of white supremacists  who would use it to perform mass genocide.  In the one case Lady Trieu may think she is going to use it to 'save the world' but we know in the end, with a personality like hers that justification would not last long.

I also can't help but think of Hooded Justice who we are meant to feel (rightly) about the righteousness of his cause but if you really think about it, he was willing to destroy Manhattan and give him over to Trieu because it served his own personal vigilante purpose.  He wanted to end Cyclops/7K by any means necessary, but in his tunnel vision he doesn't think or realize what that would mean in the end and how possibly worse Trieu is than the 7K are because she is smarter and a long term strategist and thinker.

So we are left wondering about Angela.  And would it really be a good thing if Angela had Dr. M's powers?  Even Angela who we like as the heroine of the story, but don't forget, when she was behind her mask as Sister Night, she wasn't above torture to get what she needed as well.

[Enigma X]

I liked the episode and the season, but I just don't get Manhattan (and maybe this is my bias against time travel). I will just say that I agree with Will; it seems as if Manhattan could have done more. I am not necessarily even talking about the greater good for humanity (but do believe he could have done more there too), but he is so wrapped up in the tired time travel trope of what happened happened. I am frustrated just typing it out.

[watchingtvaddict]

15 minutes ago, Enigma X said:

I liked the episode and the season, but I just don't get Manhattan (and maybe this is my bias against time travel). I will just say that I agree with Will; it seems as if Manhattan could have done more. I am not necessarily even talking about the greater good for humanity (but do believe he could have done more there too), but he is so wrapped up in the tired time travel trope of what happened happened. I am frustrated just typing it out.

I feel like Will was hinting Manhattan had done more. Similar to his hint about needing to break eggs to make an omelette. But, that could just be my optimism. 

[Affogato]

4 hours ago, arc said:

and she spent so much time trying to steal Dr Manhattan’s powers instead. Some genius.

I think that is part of the point. Stealing powers is a superhero thing. All of that energy, all of that squid cleverness, all of that focus on stealing the blue juice, could have been used to solve the problems of the world. 

[Macbeth]

14 hours ago, Michichick said:

Oh gosh, I loved the episode. Even if there is no season 2, I’m satisfied. I’m pretty confident Angela took on his powers.

I loved this episode.  I loved the entire season.  I don't know if it is coming back.  I don't think it really needs to.  This was a stunning show from beginning to end.  

The only question left is - will Angela be able to walk on water.  Of course she does.  Doctor Manhattan would not have left her the egg if she couldn't.

[Shorty186]

4 hours ago, DearEvette said:

I also can't help but think of Hooded Justice who we are meant to feel (rightly) about the righteousness of his cause but if you really think about it, he was willing to destroy Manhattan and give him over to Trieu because it served his own personal vigilante purpose.  He wanted to end Cyclops/7K by any means necessary, but in his tunnel vision he doesn't think or realize what that would mean in the end and how possibly worse Trieu is than the 7K are because she is smarter and a long term strategist and thinker.

But didn't Will tell Angela that it was Jon who told him to work with Trieu when he visited him 10 years before? So it wasn't his idea to betray Manhattan. It was just what was going to happen.

[mac123x]

The framing of one scene really made me roll my eyes.  When Treiu was standing in her machine getting ready to receive Dr. Manhattan's powers, she was on the right side of the screen and a crucifix was on the left side.  Symbolism!  Ham handed, film-school student obvious symbolism. 

It reminded me of a scene from Man of Steel where Clark is in a church trying to decide if he should turn himself in to save humanity.  He shares the frame with a stained-glass window of Jesus in the Garden of Gethsemane.  Blunt and unsubtle symbolism, so I guess the director of episode 9 was doing an homage to Zach Snyder.

[GustavMahler]

16 hours ago, DakotaLavender said:

I hate manipulative cliffhangers..... unless there is a small piece attached after the credits roll. I don't like speculation or guessing games. 

Ok no piece after the credits so this finale sucked. 

I did not care enough to care about how it ended, in fact, I was calling out the Sopranos end tag the moment we saw her feet...so with a shrug, I move on.. .

[AnimeMania]

6 minutes ago, mac123x said:

The framing of one scene really made me roll my eyes.  When Treiu was standing in her machine getting ready to receive Dr. Manhattan's powers, she was on the right side of the screen and a crucifix was on the left side.  Symbolism!  Ham handed, film-school student obvious symbolism. 

Although seconds later the arms snap off and the crucifix falls to the ground. Might have been just as interesting if the crucifix turned upside down before falling off the wall.

I understood everything perfectly, just kidding. What was the reason Lady Treiu purchased the egg farm and what was that thing that fell from the sky seconds later. How did she know it was coming.

If you hadn't heard, there was a theory that somebody on the show had already received some of Dr. M's powers long before Angela may or may not have received hers. I thought that was interesting.

[mac123x]

2 minutes ago, AnimeMania said:

I understood everything perfectly, just kidding. What was the reason Lady Treiu purchased the egg farm and what was that thing that fell from the sky seconds later. How did she know it was coming.

I don't think it was spelled out explicitly, but I assumed that was the spacecraft bearing Gold!Statued!Veidt back from Europa.

[AnimeMania]

Just now, mac123x said:

I don't think it was spelled out explicitly, but I assumed that was the spacecraft bearing Gold!Statued!Veidt back from Europa.

I thought that for a second as well but the perfection of the landing on Europa made me think that the Earth re-entry was way to Ham-Fisted to be a Lady Treiu production. I mean she built that rocket just for one purpose to bring home daddy, I am not sure why she would body slam it into the ground on re-entry.

[arc]

Well, there’s probably some anger issues she’s working out. But also Earth’s gravity is much stronger than Europa and its atmosphere is much thicker (besides the small bubble Jon left for his little vivarium.)

I was surprised she didn’t just teleport Adrian home.

[DearEvette]

1 hour ago, Shorty186 said:

But didn't Will tell Angela that it was Jon who told him to work with Trieu when he visited him 10 years before? So it wasn't his idea to betray Manhattan. It was just what was going to happen.

Ah, good point.  But this also makes me think of Dr. M's time paradox about which came first the chicken or the egg.  Did Dr. M make the suggestion first or did he make the suggestion because he knew that it was going to happen anyway?

Quote

I thought that for a second as well but the perfection of the landing on Europa made me think that the Earth re-entry was way to Ham-Fisted to be a Lady Treiu production. I mean she built that rocket just for one purpose to bring home daddy, I am not sure why she would body slam it into the ground on re-entry.

It was.  And it was purposely ham fisted because according to Lindelof "It was knocked off course. It hit a meteor or something. So it was landing in a different spot than it was supposed to."

Edited December 16, 2019 by DearEvette

[larapu2000]

11 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Probably don't mention it enough, but alongside everything else that is great about this show (the writing, directing, and especially the acting), Trent Reznor and Atticus Ross produce one hell of a score and soundtrack.

I agree.  The soundtrack was always complete perfection, without being distracting or unnecessary.

[Dev F]

59 minutes ago, DearEvette said:

And it was purposely ham fisted because according to Lindelof "It was knocked off course. It hit a meteor or something. So it was landing in a different spot than it was supposed to."

Yeaaah, that's the kind of explanation that to me makes logical sense but is completely unsatisfying, because it diminishes what seemed at the time to be a really interesting scene about Lady Trieu stealing some poor couple's mysterious cosmic destiny. Turns out she was just stopping them from calling "finder's keepers" on something that was already hers, which is basically just housekeeping business, and not an intriguing glimpse of the character's appropriative nature or her attempt to negate superhero origin myths or whatever.

[Charlesman]

I think she got the powers. 

This was her origin story.

[enchantingmonkey]

2 hours ago, Dev F said:

Yeaaah, that's the kind of explanation that to me makes logical sense but is completely unsatisfying, because it diminishes what seemed at the time to be a really interesting scene about Lady Trieu stealing some poor couple's mysterious cosmic destiny. Turns out she was just stopping them from calling "finder's keepers" on something that was already hers, which is basically just housekeeping business, and not an intriguing glimpse of the character's appropriative nature or her attempt to negate superhero origin myths or whatever.

You could say it was a demonstration of Lady Trieu's obsessive need to be in control of all details at all times.  I don't know if that makes it anymore satisfying, though.  I feel like we didn't get to spend enough time with Lady Trieu to make her feel like much more than a plot point, which disappoints me.  But that's the same way I felt about Adrian Veidt after I finished the graphic novel.    

Was there any kind of statement made as to why Lady Trieu would be more powerful than Doctor Manhattan?  Because Doctor Manhattan couldn't do anything he wanted to make the world a better place.  He was bound by time and events that couldn't be course-corrected.  So the theory that Trieu would somehow be able to triumph over these boundaries in a way that Doctor Manhattan couldn't seems faulty, in my mind.  Even Adrian Veidt should realize this, although I could see him not wanting Trieu to have the Blue Man's powers out of pure selfishness.  

The funny thing about the quest for Doctor Manhattan's powers is that Manhattan created a Paradise on Europa, and it was unsatisfying to both Adrian and himself.  So why would a Paradise on Earth be any more satisfying?  Although, the prospect of Paradise is certainly a great way to torment ourselves.    

[Ottis]

Well, everyone in the show is annoyed at Dr Manhattan for the same reason I was... given all you could do, why win the VW and that’s all?

I think I have to take this show as more of a “week in the life” series vs. any kind of overarching mythology or story. So many things don’t make sense, or have no clear background, that it is hard to build anything around it. It was just all delightfully weird. Characters all spun up in their own problems and situations, while the rest of the world was irrelevant. 

[DesertCyclist]

All I have to say is that James Wolk has the most perfect chest in the entire history of chests.

[Cthulhudrew]

4 hours ago, Charlesman said:

I think she got the powers. 

This was her origin story.

I can't see any other reason for Jon saying that it was important that she see him walking on water (in the last episode).