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S02.E04: Lanford...Lanford

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Find the figure that doesn't fit. Is it the new mother in recovery, tending bar? How about the iconoclastic smartass, in couples therapy? Or is it the disgruntled Chicago transplant, making new friends at Lanford High?

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1 hour ago, Melina22 said:

What a great episode! Not just very funny, but showing the old scene with young Darlene and David was incredible. What other show could even do that? It was so great not to see the usual "Young Darlene played by..." scenario. 

How did you see this already?

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1 minute ago, RunningMarket said:

It airs in Canada on Mondays.

Oh wow I had no idea about that-  thanks! 

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(I DL'd this episode so I could watch it earlier than tonight..so happy that Canada gets early which I had forgotten about)

Anyway I liked this episode sorta...

Dan & Louise continue to be adorable! Louise continues to fit right in with the family...loved knowing how Louise got to be manager at the restaurant I was wondering how she got upped to that so fast..now I know.

I still hate the Darlene love triangle so I didn't really pay much attention to those scenes..okay I admit I skipped them.

I'm glad Louise at least is thinking(or thought) about giving Becky the job at the restaurant instead of just not at all & Dan had a good point about Becky's alcoholism, but Becky had a good point too and I can see both sides of it so I'm hoping they'll work it out and compromise on it somehow.  

Edited by ESS
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10 hours ago, UsernameFatigue said:

My only quibble with the season so far is that I hate the name Bev, and especially Little Bev, for the baby. I guess TPTB just could not bring themselves to let the kid be called Rose and be done with it. But if they couldn't go there, they should have let the kid have its own name that no one else in the family (and certainly no one living) has. 

My issue is it didn’t seem to take into account any of the names Emilio wanted.   I know Becky doesn’t have to chose any of those but between Harris and Mary and Beverley Rose it’s like if you are non-Conner, your choices are invalid lol

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I loved the episode, I love that David finally after all theses years of the toxicity of Darlene being controlling towards him. Spoke up about it. That’s all I’m saying for now till the ep airs tonight in the u.s.

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A very powerful moment between Darlene and David.   "I needed to be heard."  "I heard you."  "I don't think you've heard me since I was 15."    But the flashback scene shows that David isn't wrong.  And then Darlene goes from two boyfriends to no boyfriends in record time.  Still Poor Darlene.  

I thought the stuff with Becky and Dan was really well done as well.  Becky needs a better paying job but with addiction issues Dan is afraid she will go back to drinking.  The scenes between the two of them were very well done.  

Best line though was by Becky and had nothing to do with the story, to Mark, "You know you can't come out more then once just to get treats. "

I also liked Mark's motto.  "Lanford:  Free. Proud.  And Getting Cleaner"  

Edited by Chaos Theory
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Louise was great.  Katy Sagal is a good actress.  Peggy, Gemma and Louise are different.  Some similarities, but Louise is softer than Gemma, and nothing like Peggy.

The flat tire scene was hilarious.  I laughed when Harris blackmailed Darlene.

I'm glad Ben dumped Darlene, but I'm sad to.  I like Ben and Darlene as a couple.

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This episode was so funny and compelling and surprising!  I really can’t say at this point if Darlene is going to end up with David or Ben or neither.   I guess it SEEMS most plausible she and Ben can work things out, and things with David were a definite goodbye- but I also know with fiction, they like going a darkest-until-dawn route.   

But what I most loved about all this was how TRUE the reactions from David and Ben were-  David, with the support of a therapist, able to break free of the past and hopefully start to live without fear.   Ben is smart and confident and I like how figured things out and didn’t let what Darlene did to him slide.  

I hope whoever she ends up with, even if it’s another person entirely, she learns to be honest and respectful of them.  
 

Harris is a brat but she has been really funny lately-  I love her “she should have one but she has two” comment.   And Jackie was gold of course!  The flat tire scene had me rolling!  

Dan and Becky!!! I love how he has to always fix things- and Becky stood up for herself and for her daughter by saying she needs more money and she could be tempted by alcohol anywhere.   I could totally see Dan’s point and worry-   But this is one instance where life isn’t always ideal but you do the best you can.   Which is essentially the theme of the show.   

And Louise had me cracking up by selling out Dan lmao.  I love her so much!!! 

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I did a binge watch of this show in its entirety over the weekend. By far, this is the best episode of the series up to this point. 

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On 10/14/2019 at 9:36 PM, Melina22 said:

What a great episode! Not just very funny, but showing the old scene with young Darlene and David was incredible. What other show could even do that? It was so great not to see the usual "Young Darlene played by..." scenario. 

8 hours ago, RocknRollZombie said:

I loved the episode, I love that David finally after all theses years of the toxicity of Darlene being controlling towards him. Spoke up about it. That’s all I’m saying for now till the ep airs tonight in the u.s.

It was so awesome to see them as their younger selves. They were both cute teenagers. 

Ben really was a great guy and not to mention, fine as hell. Darlene was really stupid to mess that up.

Speaking of stupid...why would you text both of your lovers to come get help you with a flat tire?

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I still can't look at this episode title without hearing Jackie bemoaning "Lanford, Laaaannnford" (and Roseanne saying "Cities in Illinois") in the original series' season one mall episode.

Great opening; Darlene and Jackie are terrific together.  And the "Oh, hi, we've never met before ..." scene with Odessa feels like something out of the original series (and Dan's "no honking" reminded me of Mark picking up Becky for their first date).  We never saw Darlene go to Rocky Horror, and that's not really who she was then, but I'll go with it; Harris blackmailing her is fun.  ("She should only have one, but she has two" - ha!)

"A drunk could swerve over here and kill all of us, if we're lucky."  The flat tire segment was funny on the surface, but Darlene wouldn't have been stupid enough to text both secret lovers in texting everyone she knows, separately, to come help her (and, good gods, call your first option, e.g. Dan, and then if he's not available call the next person, instead of making everyone you know trek out to the access road -- or, you know, learn how to change a tire).

I'm glad Darlene got her ass double dumped like it belongs.  The veneer is nicer this go-round, but fundamentally she's been acting like as big an asshole as she was during her Chicago years as a teen and she deserves to have it finally blow up in her face. 

I didn't like Ben last season, but he's been written better this season, and I respect him for how he handled his end of the break-up.  I also appreciate the writers skipping the tired trope of making the expendable leg of the triangle a villain to prop up the connection between two main characters.

(Dear Lords of Interesting TV, Logic, Reason, Realism, Good Sense, Healthy Relationships, and Doing Right By Your Kids: Please let the "It's time to move on" break-up between David and Darlene hold.)  If you've broken up "so many times," get a fucking clue!  It can be hard when you got together so young you're each other's first loves, and you share kids, and there are still aspects of your relationship that work very well, but at some point you have to be an adult.  It's time.  And it's a much more relatable story on a series that has always sought to speak to realities of the American - especially the working/middle class, more likely to marry and procreate young - experience.

The alcoholics in recovery I know, along with those I've seen post in online discussions about other shows in which the issue is raised, would say it's a lot more tempting, when drinking is forbidden, to slip during quiet shitty times at home than while around others and focused on working, even if that's at a bar (or restaurant serving alcohol, which Becky's been doing all this time); it's kind of Recovery 101, and Dan needs to educate himself further.  But the root of his fear, especially as it's tangled up in his notions of being The Protector, makes sense. 

And, ha, Becky played that well, pouring out all Dan's beer and teasing him about how he shouldn't be a bartender because of the way he drinks.  I also like Louise outing Dan's trying to put the kibosh on the idea in that trio's initial scene.  (I don't love the missing apostrophe on the box of toys in their later scene together, but it's realistic.)

This was a good episode, and if they can stay true to the Conner-Healy family's realistic and best trajectory, it could also be a turning point in that storyline.  But they've had and abandoned that before, so I'll just enjoy it for what it is in this episode.

Edited by Bastet
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That flashback killed me. David and Darlene were so young! 

I was surprised David broke up with Darlene and a little sad. That being said, their relationship was always one-sided and toxic so good for David for realizing that. 

The tire scene both cracked me up and made me super nervous/stressed. I loved Jackie's reaction, though, as she drove away. 

I liked Ben so I felt really bad for him. It'll make working together awkward which I'm kind of looking forward to. 

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4 hours ago, TigerLynx said:

Louise was great.  Katy Sagal is a good actress.  Peggy, Gemma and Louise are different.  Some similarities, but Louise is softer than Gemma, and nothing like Peggy.

The flat tire scene was hilarious.  I laughed when Harris blackmailed Darlene.

I'm glad Ben dumped Darlene, but I'm sad to.  I like Ben and Darlene as a couple.

I never watched Married With Children, and only know Katy Sagal as Cate in 8 Simple Rules (I loved her in that show) and like her here as well. I don't know that I actually believe that Louise would be interested in a guy who has two out of his three adult children and their children all living with him. I do like that they have had her make comments about it. One to the effect that he is coddling the kids, and another that looking at Dan's life makes her glad she didn't have kids (paraphrasing of course). Lol. But I guess TPTB think that Dan needs to move on, and she is a great choice in that respect. 

I liked Ben and Darlene together as well, and as much as she deserved to be dumped I hope that they make their way back together at some point. 

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I wish Darlene and David were done for good, but I won't be surprised if they get resurrected at some point.  I'm wondering if David broke up with Darlene because his therapist recommended it.  To date, David has based his decisions on Darlene, Roseanne, and Blue telling him what to do.  He could still be keeping to his same pattern.

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47 minutes ago, UsernameFatigue said:

I never watched Married With Children, and only know Katy Sagal as Cate in 8 Simple Rules (I loved her in that show) and like her here as well. I don't know that I actually believe that Louise would be interested in a guy who has two out of his three adult children and their children all living with him. I do like that they have had her make comments about it. One to the effect that he is coddling the kids, and another that looking at Dan's life makes her glad she didn't have kids (paraphrasing of course). Lol. But I guess TPTB think that Dan needs to move on, and she is a great choice in that respect. 

Count me in whose never watched MWC and never will, but I'm gonna have to disagree about Louise not being interested in Dan romantically I can believe it because after all she's known him forever (since she was 15) and also has had a crush on him as well plus they have a lot in common with each other it seems. And of course what's not to love about Louise? she's perfect for Dan. I loved her as Cate on 8 Simple Rules as well, but that's another story for another time.

Edited by ESS
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23 minutes ago, TigerLynx said:

I wish Darlene and David were done for good, but I won't be surprised if they get resurrected at some point.  I'm wondering if David broke up with Darlene because his therapist recommended it.  To date, David has based his decisions on Darlene, Roseanne, and Blue telling him what to do.  He could still be keeping to his same pattern.

Oh man I hope not.  I hope this is his own decision.  I do think this will be a season long arc, but it’s possible that “moving on” is a part of that arc versus reuniting.  Honestly at this point I am not sure (after being pretty confident for a year) if they will reunite.  

On the one hand, I feel like Darlene has finally “heard” David.   And him declaring this is the final time they ever break up does not mean necessarily mean they won’t get back together.  

On the other hand, we heard her two texts.  It’s clear she is more interested in Ben and can open up more to him.  She also said she has been scared to stop trying with David.... that’s no way to have a relationship.   

So all that to say.... I have no idea what will happen.  My brain says Ben, my heart says David, but my heart is MUCH more hesitant now. 

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7 minutes ago, ESS said:

Count me in whose never watched MWC and never will, but I'm gonna have to disagree about Louise not being interested in Dan romantically I can believe it because after all she's known him forever (since she was 15) and also has had a crush on him as well plus they have a lot in common with each other it seems. And of course what's not to love about Louise? she's perfect for Dan. I loved her as Cate on 8 Simple Rules as well, but that's another story for another time.

Ah, I didn't know their backstory. (I haven't watched all episodes). That makes more sense - thanks for filling me in! 

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1 hour ago, UsernameFatigue said:

Ah, I didn't know their backstory. (I haven't watched all episodes). That makes more sense - thanks for filling me in! 

No problem, glad to help. Though I didn't watch her episode when it first aired I did however DL & watch it a few months ago plus I have a great memory of her character and the backstory as her storyline is really the only one I'm interested in

Edited by ESS

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My DVR recording always cuts off at the tag.  Can someone tell me how it ends?  Harris was playing some kid's game with Odessa and both were high.  Becky just came in, took the bong, and complimented Odessa's tattoo.  Harris started to say something and---

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4 hours ago, Brn2bwild said:

My DVR recording always cuts off at the tag.  Can someone tell me how it ends?  Harris was playing some kid's game with Odessa and both were high.  Becky just came in, took the bong, and complimented Odessa's tattoo.  Harris started to say something and---

Something like "I know she said something, but all I heard was 'mooooooo.'"

Someone with a better memory (or has it on DVR) can correct me if I'm a bit off. 

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I'm glad the romantic triangle storyline is over, even if it's just for now. I hope the rest of the season is not all about Darlene groveling forgiveness from Ben. For some reason, I never warmed up to Ben, even though I love the actor.

My favorite stories are the family dynamic. But if there must be a romance on the show, I'd rather watch Dan and Louise's development. It's nice and mature.

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I don't want Darlene groveling.  She screwed up, she apologized, Ben told her they were over, and she should accept that.  If Ben changes his mind, and Darlene realizes she needs to change the way she's been handling their relationship, then they can go from there.

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Like everyone has said, a really solid episode!  My favorite moment was when Jackie said "Lanford...Lanford" and it looks like she really breaks up John Goodman.  His reaction and her giggle afterwards seemed so genuine.   

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I'm glad to see that Darlene faced consequences for her duplicitous behavior.  I really don't want to see her and Ben getting back together, although I have a feeling that's probably where it's heading.  Ben was a little unnecessarily nasty with his coffee remark though,  Even if you can see where it comes from.

Also hope we haven't seen the last of David.  Is that a real beard on Johnny Galecki or is it makeup?  Because that is the scraggliest  beard I've ever seen, with the way the hair is crawling up his cheeks.  Why doesn't he trim that thing, and shave that part?  Looks nasty.

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2 hours ago, Snow Apple said:

But if there must be a romance on the show, I'd rather watch Dan and Louise's development. It's nice and mature.

Spoiler

I can't wait to see where Dan & Louise are headed in the romance department (if there is gonna be one which I believe there is at some point)

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33 minutes ago, rmontro said:

Also hope we haven't seen the last of David.  Is that a real beard on Johnny Galecki or is it makeup?  Because that is the scraggliest  beard I've ever seen, with the way the hair is crawling up his cheeks.  Why doesn't he trim that thing, and shave that part?  Looks nasty.

I'm thinking it's to differentiate from Leonard Hofstadter.  As it was I thought I saw Leonard break thru a bit....nerd can't change a tire. 

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I am really conflicted when it comes to Darlene and David.  I always did like them as a couple way back but as the flashback did show the relationship was always largely one sided.  That being said they had been together since they were 15 so finally breaking up is kinda sad.

I would love to see Darlene in a more give and take relationship like she was in with Ben.   Or to even have David find out about Ben and try to fix it for her because he really is over her which again is very conflicting for Darlene.

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11 hours ago, K-9 said:

I was fooled on three moments:

Thought David was going to use the counseling session to work on building the relationship.  180 degree twist - did not see it coming.

Then I thought Darlene was going to be privately relieved with David's breakup (it's what she wanted, after all) and act hurt/sarcastic.  The true reaction in Darlene's eye just hit the audience hard.

Last, I thought Ben was just playfully joking (trying to lighten the mood) when he re-opened the laptop to type/verbalize his breakup to Darlene.  While Darlene brought this onto herself, I still felt sympathy for her character. 

10 hours ago, BeachDays said:

Oh man I hope not.  I hope this is his own decision.  I do think this will be a season long arc, but it’s possible that “moving on” is a part of that arc versus reuniting.  Honestly at this point I am not sure (after being pretty confident for a year) if they will reunite.  

On the one hand, I feel like Darlene has finally “heard” David.   And him declaring this is the final time they ever break up does not mean necessarily mean they won’t get back together.  

On the other hand, we heard her two texts.  It’s clear she is more interested in Ben and can open up more to him.  She also said she has been scared to stop trying with David.... that’s no way to have a relationship.   

So all that to say.... I have no idea what will happen.  My brain says Ben, my heart says David, but my heart is MUCH more hesitant now. 

I really did not see why Darlene was giving a man, who abandoned her when things got rough, multiple chances when there was a perfectly great guy who wanted her. This episode made me realize she actually wanted her first love to work out so they can finally be a family. We think of David as weak, but it was actually Darlene who could not let go to the idea of him and move on. She was holding on to David and him letting her go was the best gift he could give her and her hurt was absolutely genuine. Bye D&D, I grew up with you guys and am glad that you are finally getting healthier in your relationship...it only took 25 years.

Edited by qtpye
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Is Johnny Galecki supposed to be sticking around? Or was he only in for a few episodes and will be off-screen-dad now that they've broken up?

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If Darlene is such a tough broad, why cannot she change her own tire?

I hope Johnny Galecki stays around and finds a real partner, not Darlene nor a flake like Blue (Juliette Lewis).

Edited by deirdra
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Great episode! Harris' Rocky Horror outfit bore more than a passing resemblance to Darlene's casino uniform.

I suspect we'll see Darlene and Ben back together again since they'll still be working together 40 hours a week. 

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4 hours ago, Superclam said:

Something like "I know she said something, but all I heard was 'mooooooo.'"

Someone with a better memory (or has it on DVR) can correct me if I'm a bit off. 

You’re memory is correct. She and Odessa were playing with the animal sounds toy but the only sound it made was “Moooo” because it was broken.  And they were obviously high.  Your quote was pretty spot on.

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5 hours ago, snarkylady said:

I'm thinking it's to differentiate from Leonard Hofstadter. 

That's fine, but at least shave the cheeks (although Leonard had a beard when they returned from the arctic).  As it is, it makes him look like a hobo.

Edited by rmontro
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apparently I napped longer than I thought I did during the show.  going to have to find it OnDemand or something.  

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It was probably the best episode of the series so far. Good stuff. That said, David was my favorite character in the original series so I'm sad that they've made him a deadbeat dad in this. I know Johnny Galecki wasn't available in the beginning but I wish they had come up with something else to keep him away that wasn't so out of character/ makes it hard to root for him now. I'm still hoping Darlene and David work it out and I hope they're able to grow into a more equal relationship as time goes on. I liked Ben well enough but I've always had a soft spot for Darlene and David.

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4 minutes ago, t7686 said:

It was probably the best episode of the series so far. Good stuff. That said, David was my favorite character in the original series so I'm sad that they've made him a deadbeat dad in this. I know Johnny Galecki wasn't available in the beginning but I wish they had come up with something else to keep him away that wasn't so out of character/ makes it hard to root for him now. I'm still hoping Darlene and David work it out and I hope they're able to grow into a more equal relationship as time goes on. I liked Ben well enough but I've always had a soft spot for Darlene and David.

This is how I feel-  I know it’s a long shot but I will always hope.   

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1 hour ago, rmontro said:

I'm glad to see that Darlene faced consequences for her duplicitous behavior.  I really don't want to see her and Ben getting back together, although I have a feeling that's probably where it's heading.  Ben was a little unnecessarily nasty with his coffee remark though,  Even if you can see where it comes from.

Also hope we haven't seen the last of David.  Is that a real beard on Johnny Galecki or is it makeup?  Because that is the scraggliest  beard I've ever seen, with the way the hair is crawling up his cheeks.  Why doesn't he trim that thing, and shave that part?  Looks nasty.


I think he look really sloppy too.  And very different than how David used to dress in the later seasons of Roseanne, where he was pretty stylish for the times.  What I’m hoping is he gets back on his feet, gets confident, and starts taking care of himself.   But if it’s just Galecki’s preferred look right now I don’t think there is anything they can do. 

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My love for beards goes back to Richard Dreyfuss in Jaws....that being said Galecki looks like he had pubic hair smeared all over his face, shave that crap man!!

I didn't find Ben's coffee remark to be all that harsh as I suspected whatever he said to her would be.  Darlene had it coming and I hope if they do get back together she will realize how good she's got it with him.  

Loved Jackie's maniacal laughing as she drove off instead of helping Darlene and the flat tire.

Dan and Louise are like a comfort bowl of mac and cheese, love them together and can't wait for more.

Finally, had to give my cat Spooky an extra hug...I told him I was glad I had him instead of children, because Harris last night was not funny and I swear to God if my daughter had tried to blackmail me while dressed as a two dollar whore, I would have caught a serious case.  She makes Becky look like Sweet Polly Purebread, and I hated Becky on the old show.

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OMG Johnny Galecki looked like such a baby in that flashback. Sara Gilbert didn't look all that different, really. I think the main difference (for me anyway) is that we've been watching Galecki for the past 10 years. What a trip.

Quote

My only quibble with the season so far is that I hate the name Bev, and especially Little Bev, for the baby. I guess TPTB just could not bring themselves to let the kid be called Rose and be done with it. But if they couldn't go there, they should have let the kid have its own name that no one else in the family (and certainly no one living) has. 

It would make more sense if Bev had died. As it is, none of them are overly fond of her to honor her this way. They probably have a passive "family is family" respect for her but nobody acts as though they are especially close to her, and certainly we've seen no evidence that any of Roseanne's children would want to name their baby after her. Mary or Rose would have made more sense.

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8 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Mary or Rose would have made more sense.

Yeah, but DJ's daughter is Mary already. Rose or, gee, I dunno, see if the father has any thoughts on what he'd like to name his kid?

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Oh, I forgot DJ's kid is named Mary. She's been kind of a non-entity. Like DJ.

I think Darlene deserves to lose both men because of her behavior, but it's going to be awfully awkward to have to keep working with Ben in such close physical proximity. Realistically he should be able to find just about anyone else to do what she's doing, no matter how good she is at it. I'm not sure I buy that he needs her that much, but he's in a tricky situation and could get sued if he fired her. Which is exactly why you should never date an employee.

Edited by iMonrey
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6 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Oh, I forgot DJ's kid is named Mary. She's been kind of a non-entity. Like DJ.

I think Darlene deserves to lose both men because of her behavior, but it's going to be awfully awkward to have to keep working with Ben in such close physical proximity. Realistically he should be able to find just about anyone else to do what she's doing, no matter how good she is at it. I'm not sure I buy that he needs her that much, but he's in a tricky situation and could get sued if he fired her. Which is exactly why you should never date an employee.

Agreed-  maybe he couldn’t find anyone else in Lanford but I’m sure he could in Chicago.   But I have a feeling their close proximity is so they can eventually get back together again.  

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