S09.E13: She Loves Me, She Loves Me Not

[OnTime]

Are we really to believe Amber's best friend just happens to be at the same bar, same day, and same time as Matt and sees him leave with another girl?

I think the producers are working overtime...

[meligator]

18 minutes ago, shouldbedancing said:

Poor Amber. Why did they ever put her on this show? Did she get new gray hairs? I bet she never asks Matt about this and says yes on decision day.

I will be so sick if that happens.  Read the neon signs above your head Amber.

[humbleopinion]

On behalf of the boxes of rocks, we object being declared mentally inferior to stupid stupid Amber.

Any rock in the box can see Amber just annoys Matt every which way....her neediness, her desperation, her blubbering, her wailing....

[humbleopinion]

Doug needs to brush JamieO’s extensions before she clips them in...they look like a cheap Lady Godiva wig you wear with a beige leotard with fig leaves sewn on the boobs and crotchal area....

[Stella Rose]

6 hours ago, Ilovepie said:

Nah, this show is too boring for something actually that shocking. It's gotta be the whole Matt talking to a girl in the bar thing they've shown 200 times already........

Ding! Ding! Ding!   We have a winner!

[spunky]

Deonna was finally on unfiltered. Beth’s mother was so sweet saying that she’s a lot to deal with. No she’s not a lot to deal with, she’s a hot mess. If Jamie is considered a southern gentleman, I’d hate to see how the others act. Keith is the Will of this season, he’s politely playing Iris to the end. He tells her he’s opened up to her, yet he can’t tell her how he truly feels. Deonna is horrible when she’s put on the spot, she could have found another way to tell Greg that she doesn’t love him yet but definitely has feelings for him. Amber needs to stop crying over Matt. Raven confirmed both hers and Pastor Cal’s initial suspicions that Matt had another woman.

[nutella fitzgerald]

Serious question: other than Beth, does anyone think that a relationship can come back from one party insulting the other’s sexual technique? She seemed shocked at Jamie doubling down on his assessment of her as a non-sexual being, but I called this marriage as dead in the water back when she first dropped the “basic Caucasian sex” bomb.

[answerphone]

Iris is so frustrating.😒

[Stella Rose]

2 hours ago, Ohwell said:

So wait.  Jamie and Big Red are lovey dovey again? 

For the next 43 minutes  (or maybe 33 if you ask Big Red....)

[ECM1231]

3 hours ago, meligator said:

Iris has been open and vulnerable?

She's really delusional and has no clue. If Keith says no, she will be devastated.

[Kcard]

3 hours ago, meligator said:

ATTN  Beth - your life will be infinitely better apart

Yes!!! Omg I want to save her from that creep! How are the experts not sitting her down & telling her she’s in an abusive relationship? So far he’s told her to shut up, called her the “C” word & basically criticized everything about her🤦🏼‍♀️

45 minutes ago, answerphone said:

Iris is so frustrating.😒

Yes! So freakin’ uptight! Get over yourself already! 

[ECM1231]

2 hours ago, topanga said:

And I’m sorry, but Deonna is too. Why does Greg have to sink a pool ball to be able to ask her questions about her feelings? And she still makes the answers all about herself. 

Greg continues to do 99% of the giving in this marriage. And that just isn’t fair. 

What was her reply to his question that got him exasperated? I rewound 2x but still could not make it out. It was when he asked her to tell him something she liked about him that she'd not told him or even the experts. Her ( I am assuming) pat answer upset him, as well it should.

[Kcard]

The experts found some real winners this time🤦🏼‍♀️ Jamie is an emotionally abusive scumbag & Matt has no business being on the show because clearly he isn’t interested in being married. Iris & Deonna are completely unappreciative of the incredible men they were matched with! 

[Jeanne222]

Iris is a baby.  Keith is a nice guy.  Matt's a cheater and Ambers a cry baby!  Deonna thinks and speaks baby talk.  She's smart but dumb!  Greg wants sex but is to scared of Deonna to ask!  Jamie wants sex every night no matter how vile he's been all day!  Beth is nuts!

Jamie is driving me  crazy  with those droopy looking extensions and Dr Cal is living in the state of denial!I

That's all I've got!!!

[humbleopinion]

The drinks and horse doobers that Deonna, her cousin and friend were sharing looked delicious.

Damn, those are some ugly clip earrings, Iris....that pop top ring necklace/choker looks bad bad with the plastic earrings...fashion disaster...what happened?

Matt STFU. You spent the 8 weeks hiding out from Amber and hating her clinginess.

Jamie is calling Liz a prick tease...

Amber’s green dress with 2 cutouts to cover her boobs looks like what a drunk girl at the wedding reception wears...her straggly hair is the usual disaster.

Anyone notice that at the last married Supper Iris changed her earrings from some ginormous ugly door pulls to some understated drop jeweled ones.....

Iris...lose the earring sculptures....they distract from your natural beauty....

Definite accessory abuse.

Like her bearded iris shirt

[Kcard]

Can someone please tell me why Amber doesn’t hook up with her bestie, Raven? He’s so much hotter & sweeter than Matt!!!

[Kcard]

2 hours ago, LennieBriscoe said:

As others have mentioned, Amber Alert needs to look at the man who is right in front of her, there for her,  crying for her. 

And she can always call him "Bran Stark."

Yes! He’s way hotter & seems like a good guy. Why aren’t they together? Does she only like a-holes?

[Lindz]

3 hours ago, LennieBriscoe said:

WTH does Jamie MEAN,  Elizabeth is "not a sexual being"?! Does he think he's saying "sensual"??

She's thinking, "Stop looking me in the eyes!"

Prolly complaining about the frequency, AGAIN. Or maybe throwing the basic Caucasian sex thing back at her. 😂😂 You mean she didn't ask what he meant & just made stupid faces? I'm SHOCKED!

[Lindz]

9 hours ago, Jeanne222 said:

Keith is a nice guy.  

Nah. He just plays one on tv. 😒 He didn't try to grow the relationship. No affection. No emotional connecting. No sharing important info with his wife. That's NOT nice!

Edited September 5, 2019 by Lindz

[Rae Spellman]

21 hours ago, Jeanne222 said:

Greg wants sex but is to scared of Deonna to ask! 

Greg and Deonna both said they've been having sex. 

Piko: Have y'all already smashed and all of that?

Greg: Sir, that's my wife...

Piko: Okay. How do you think Deonna views that?

Greg: We're good. 

Piko: A+?

Greg: A+

Then Greg laughed and gave a thumbs up.

Piko: That's good.

My dream scenario for Greg and Deonna is the same as Piko's dream scenario for them. That they work things out. 

Greg might be less of a pushover than some have suggested. He was clear that infrequent sex wasn't going to do it for him. He has also been pretty clear about his need for Deonna to share her feelings. Deonna seems to knows what Greg wants even if it's not clear if she can provide it. Apparently, the quality and quantity of sex that is working for both of them. But, Deonna's struggling with sharing her feelings is a significant problem that they both acknowledge. Greg said he's praying to make the right decision. Hopefully he will. Whatever that means. 

Edited September 6, 2019 by RaeSpellman

[Ms.C.]

3 hours ago, LennieBriscoe said:

Matt needs to dribble his lame arse outta here! "We've been through some tough times..." YOU DIDN'T COME HOME!

"I just don't want to be with her all the time," said no newlywed man in love ever. 

4 hours ago, LennieBriscoe said:

"I just don't want to be with her all the time," said no newlywed man in love ever. 

And I can no longer take his unrelated-to-any-extant-language drawl.

Mat also said she was cloying.  I agree with that. They’re married but not really in love. That has to grow.   I said early on that she was smothering him. He was a different guy when they visited his home town and later walked a hike with her.  She blew it. Too needy and immature. Not saying Matt is great but he’s been around and is not needy. Wants relationship and friendship.  Amber too needy. Deonna and Matt better match IMO.   LOL.  

[Lindz]

3 hours ago, topanga said:

she needs to feel connected emotionally before she wants to connect sexually

Ehhhh. That has proven false. Soooo. IGNORED. Elizabeth said she wanted gifts & romance. She also said she had sex with him to shut him up. She's a weak fighter, but we appreciate some fight. Even though he wears her down. Issa DYSFUNCTIONAL MESS!

Edited September 5, 2019 by Lindz

[Ms.C.]

4 hours ago, LennieBriscoe said:

WTH does Jamie MEAN,  Elizabeth is "not a sexual being"?! Does he think he's saying "sensual"??

She's thinking, "Stop looking me in the eyes!"

Honestly, Beth is practically falling out of her tops.  She’s a tease who doesn’t want to follow thru.  Nothing puzzling there.  Maybe dad liked sexy...  hope not. But she turns it on and off.  

[topanga]

1 hour ago, ECM1231 said:

What was her reply to his question that got him exasperated? I rewound 2x but still could not make it out. It was when he asked her to tell him something she liked about him that she'd not told him or even the experts. Her ( I am assuming) pat answer upset him, as well it should.

Question 1: 

Greg: What’s one thing you like about me that you haven’t told me or the experts yet?

Deonna: I like that you let me be the big spoon occasionally.  [Laughs]

—That’s when his TH talked about it being super frustrating when Deonna isn’t sharing feelings, communicating, or taking this seriously.

Question 2:

Greg: Do you love me? [🎶Do you love me? Now, that I can dance. Watch me work—hey!🎶]

Deonna: [Long pause] ...Hmmmm...Really didn’t think this was coming...I honestly—I don’t know.

Really, Deonna? After 8 weeks, you can’t say anything more than ‘I don’t know?’ Of course you know if you do love him, if you’ll never love him, or if you don’t love him right now but could feel yourself possibly heading in that direction one day. You couldn’t give Greg anything more affectionate or kind than ‘I don’t know?’

Hell, even Fatal Attraction Jamie and Elizabeth were more open and expressive with one another — before their inevitable argument, that is. 

[Spectator]

What is it exactly that Deonna is debating? She said she needs to think about decision day and whether Greg offers her everything that she has been looking for? Huh??? What does she want???

Oh right, a man that doesn’t compliment her as often and isn’t as in touch with his feelings. Ok. Great. No problem, Deonna. There are a ton of guys out there with those awesome traits. Enjoy! 

This is what happens when a girl doesn’t date anyone since high school...she has no idea what’s out there in the dating world and she doesn’t have the perspective or common sense to grab a tremendous thing when it’s plopped in her lap. 

I don’t think there’s been such an unappreciative participant on this show since maybe Sam (I actually think Deonna is even less appreciative). Sam resisted everything Neil had to offer then when she finally realized that he was actually a pretty decent guy it was too late. Be careful Deonna...even if you both decide to stay together, in time Greg could tire of your nonsense too and go out and find an easier relationship with a woman who appreciates all of his qualities. Based on this forum alone, it sounds like he would have a ton of opportunities! 

[Ms.C.]

4 hours ago, LennieBriscoe said:

Matt needs to dribble his lame arse outta here! "We've been through some tough times..." YOU DIDN'T COME HOME!

"I just don't want to be with her all the time," said no newlywed man in love ever. 

And I can no longer take his unrelated-to-any-extant-language drawl.

4 hours ago, topanga said:

I think all of these couple have the coolest, most helpful friends. But Jamie obviously didn’t retain a word of what Beth’s friend said when he mentioned that she needs to feel connected emotionally before she wants to connect sexually. In Jamie’s mind, that means she’s not a sexual being. Huh?

I agree, BUT, Keith also doesn’t get to sit on his ass and wait for Iris to act the way he wants her to. She’s not a mind reader, and it’s not fair that he doesn’t talk to her specifically about his concerns. Stop saying sexual immaturity and emotional immaturity. Tell Iris that it’s not just about her withholding sex. She doesn’t even want to talk about sex, and that’s a problem. Or tell her he doesn’t like her grandma clip-on earrings. Give her something useful that she can learn from. 

Keith has tried.  The counselors have tried. She starts talking fast and doesn’t listen.  She becomes a little girl. She has put up walls for some reason and she’ll need prof help to tear them down.  Even her mom and sister/friend didn’t know what to say.  She rattles on trying to keep away fromtalk os intimacy.  

Also, I like Jamie Otis and her hair.  She was very vulnerable her season and she gets it right.  

[Lily247]

4 hours ago, LennieBriscoe said:

Matt needs to dribble his lame arse outta here! "We've been through some tough times..." YOU DIDN'T COME HOME!

"I just don't want to be with her all the time," said no newlywed man in love ever. 

And I can no longer take his unrelated-to-any-extant-language drawl.

Ive also noticed his style of speaking and it kind of doesnt seem.to match him and his upbringing (suburban middle to upper middle class) at all, but I assumed he must have picked it up from basketball teammates. 

[luckylou]

The only goodbye kiss that looked even slightly natural to me was Keith and Iris’s. Everyone elses kiss and hug looked like an after thought. I expect some of the couples will decide to stay married, but of course by six months everyone will be divorced.

[Spectator]

3 hours ago, OnTime said:

Are we really to believe Amber's best friend just happens to be at the same bar, same day, and same time as Matt and sees him leave with another girl?

I think the producers are working overtime...

I thought the exact same thing. That’s a mighty big coincidence that they would bump into each other. And I’m thinking it’s pretty unlikely that Matt would continue to carry on with another woman knowing his wife’s best friend was at the same bar. Nope. Not buying it.

I’m thinking the producers were well aware of Matt’s shenanigans and wanted a way to work it into the storyline so they asked Raven to pretend that he saw it and then spill the beans. 

I’d also like to think the producers have a shred of decency and wanted to spare Amber the humiliation of saying she wanted to stay married (we all KNOW that’s what she would have said!) when Matt clearly wanted to catch the first train out of town, so they dumped this news on her ahead of the big day to protect her.

[Lily247]

3 hours ago, nutella fitzgerald said:

Serious question: other than Beth, does anyone think that a relationship can come back from one party insulting the other’s sexual technique? She seemed shocked at Jamie doubling down on his assessment of her as a non-sexual being, but I called this marriage as dead in the water back when she first dropped the “basic Caucasian sex” bomb.

Nope, it could never be salvaged after her comment insulting his sexual technique. That was crossing a serious line.

I just cant stand Beth and her stupid attitude, the dumbgirl way of talking that she has, and how she shits on the male participants on the show while being the biggest assh*le herself. She reeks of entitlement in the worst way.

Jamie wasnt clued in yet on their wedding night when she got naked in front of the crew, who were possibly male, that maybe Beth is batshit crazy. She reminds me of an old pal of mine from my early 20s who was the same crazy, and all the guys had one night stands with her and blocked her number afterwards. 

"OMG look.... my hair.... is INSANE...." 

who talks like that ??????

Edited September 5, 2019 by Lily247

[becauseIsaidso]

I want to smack Matt right in the mouth. He knows every piece of crap he utters is just that and doesn't have the stones to tell the truth even once.

[Meowwww]

 Man, Jamie is fixated on sex.  In a weird Chernobyl-era-Soviet-military kind of way. To call Big Red a nonsexual being???  Eye for an eye? Not ok.  I mean, he should chat with Iris to see what that’s really like. 

Watch, the mystery woman at the bar turns out to be Matt’s sister or something.  Someone clearly told Matt to be all-in for the cameras.  I didn’t know he had so many words   

Edited September 5, 2019 by Meowwww

[Empress1]

9 hours ago, topanga said:

I think all of these couple have the coolest, most helpful friends. But Jamie obviously didn’t retain a word of what Beth’s friend said when he mentioned that she needs to feel connected emotionally before she wants to connect sexually. In Jamie’s mind, that means she’s not a sexual being. Huh?

I thought that was exactly right, what Elizabeth's friend said. They ARE on opposite sides when it comes to sex. Elizabeth needs some kind of emotional connection to be in the mood; Jamie sees sex as a way TO connect - but I actually think that's too generous for Jamie. Really, I just think Jamie wants to bang and isn't that interested in Elizabeth's feelings (and, I suspect, pleasure, given what she said).

I loved Deonna's dinner with her friend and cousin. When she said she and Greg had sex and it was good, the cousin was like "Wait, wait, I didn't even ask all that!" and I fell out. She's much more animated with them. I think she's an introvert who is slow to warm up to people but when she's around people she's comfortable with, she really shines. 

Amber needs to play all of Lizzo's music on a loop, get some therapy, and push the hell on. Matt didn't come home for 24 hours and left his ring at home. Like, of COURSE he was cheating. That's just common sense. Not saying Amber deserves it - she doesn't - but if she stays, she's choosing to accept that behavior, and she should not.

[humbleopinion]

Jamie is pissed at himself that he is turned on so easily by Lunatic Beth.

She is flirtatious and teases him visually with her tits out, flouncing  and jiggling around the apartment..at bedtime she just wants to cuddle while he has a throbbing hard on....

Jamie's rage and seething anger comes from her saying no.

Why is she the gatekeeper to sex?

Why isn't he in control of the frequency of sex?

He seethes every time she pushes him off of her...

Jamie is angry Beth won't let him have sex with her anytime he wants...

When she says no...he stops hearing her because the blood is rushing in his ears as his anger rises...why can't she understand that they will cuddle  after sex...

Lizzy desperately wants Jamie to connect to her soul but he is not wired that way...his peniz is in the driver seat.

Here's an idea....

Jamie and Amber start hooking up...they both have strong sex drives and  they can keep it friends with benefits, just fork buddies with no emotional attachment.

Both get their voracious sexual needs met...

Amber knows Jamie is not emotionally available to her so sex is just sex...Sex soothes her...

Jamie knows Amber will not say no so sex is guaranteed. Sex soothes him...

It's not healthy...it's a band aid.

but it is a fail...

Amber would never break the girlfriend rule and sleep with Beth's huzzy.

Jamie is not attracted to Amber.

Edited September 5, 2019 by humbleopinion

[Yeah No]

10 hours ago, CSunshine76 said:

Was this Amber and Raven scene re-enacted? She doesn’t seem at all shocked that  Matt was seen with another woman.  Say nothing about the fact she’s wearing completely different clothes than when she left to go to his place.

Do better editors.

I know, I didn't even notice the change in wardrobe but something about that scene made me almost suspect that production tailed Matt and saw him with another woman, then made the "news" come from Raven.  Or am I just being optimistic that SOMEONE involved in this morally decrepit franchise has something resembling a CONSCIENCE and wanted to make sure Amber said "no"?  Yeah, it's probably just me.  😢

[Yeah No]

10 hours ago, topanga said:

I think all of these couple have the coolest, most helpful friends. But Jamie obviously didn’t retain a word of what Beth’s friend said when he mentioned that she needs to feel connected emotionally before she wants to connect sexually. In Jamie’s mind, that means she’s not a sexual being. Huh?

What gets me is that it's pretty much common knowledge that it's important for a lot of women to feel an emotional connection before feeling comfortable connecting sexually with their partners.  It's been talked about for decades already in popular psychology and relationship counseling.  All he would have to do to accomplish this is have some emotionally intimate time with her that makes her feel loved before jumping in the sack.  All the experts would have to do is make Jamie consult the internet for an explanation of how this works, and how it DOESN'T make a woman a "non-sexual" being to be that way.  But why should I expect any of them to do their jobs or even know about these things?  If he wants to have sex with a woman that doesn't prefer to feel an emotional connection with him first let him go hire a hooker and be done with it.  But the ignorance on this show never fails to astound me.

Edited September 5, 2019 by Yeah No
Grammar.

[Yeah No]

6 hours ago, Spectator said:

I thought the exact same thing. That’s a mighty big coincidence that they would bump into each other. And I’m thinking it’s pretty unlikely that Matt would continue to carry on with another woman knowing his wife’s best friend was at the same bar. Nope. Not buying it.

I’m thinking the producers were well aware of Matt’s shenanigans and wanted a way to work it into the storyline so they asked Raven to pretend that he saw it and then spill the beans. 

I’d also like to think the producers have a shred of decency and wanted to spare Amber the humiliation of saying she wanted to stay married (we all KNOW that’s what she would have said!) when Matt clearly wanted to catch the first train out of town, so they dumped this news on her ahead of the big day to protect her.

Hah, I posted the same thing before I saw your post!  GMTA (great minds think alike)!

[Kdawg82]

I really enjoyed Jaime's friend he was speaking to at the bar/restaurant. He is more useful than those "experts." Everyone should have a friend like him. 

I barely watch anymore. I keep this show on in the background while I do other stuff, beyond the first 10 minutes. Or while I chow down on my breakfast/lunch. 

I think Beth isn't attracted to Jaime. That's why she's not "a sexual being" with him.  

[Yeah No]

9 hours ago, spunky said:

Deonna was finally on unfiltered. Beth’s mother was so sweet saying that she’s a lot to deal with. No she’s not a lot to deal with, she’s a hot mess. If Jamie is considered a southern gentleman, I’d hate to see how the others act. Keith is the Will of this season, he’s politely playing Iris to the end. He tells her he’s opened up to her, yet he can’t tell her how he truly feels. 

I think Keith has told Iris how he truly feels.  She is well aware of his concerns about her "emotional maturity" and whether she is right for him based on that because she's mentioned it on-screen.  Only she says she thinks he is saying that because she is a virgin and is doubling down on that like he is being so unfair.  She is not even willing to listen to him.  Meanwhile we all know it's not her virginity that concerns him, but her obvious immature attitude toward just about everything relationship-related, not just sex.

7 hours ago, Ms.C. said:

Keith has tried.  The counselors have tried. She starts talking fast and doesn’t listen.  She becomes a little girl. She has put up walls for some reason and she’ll need prof help to tear them down.  Even her mom and sister/friend didn’t know what to say.  She rattles on trying to keep away fromtalk os intimacy.  

Yes, I pretty much said this in another thread.  She uses the virginity mantra to keep distance between her and Keith.  Every time he might try to get closer to her emotionally she makes it impossible for him.  She's not just a physical virgin, but a relationship virgin in a lot of ways and Keith is scaring her to death.  I also said I didn't think Keith should have to take on the role of her therapist to "tear down her walls".  She needs more help than he should be expected to give her, or that even would work if he tried.

[sasha206]

Admittedly, I am not caught up with this series (currently binge watching) but my observations are that the women, except for Deonna, are really thirsty for reality fame.  She's the only one that I don't feel is acting her love for her husband.

John Travolta (Amber) is a teacher? I'm only on episode 5 but I haven't heard one intelligent word out of her mouth to make me think she finished high school, much less a college grad with a job in teaching.  I think her "he's so hot" is an act for the cameras.  Meanwhile, Matt also seems quite stupid.  I don't see the hot in him.  If she's attractive to his pro ball playing, does he really make much dough playing overseas?  I'll bet he's hoping he gets an overseas contract to get the fuck away from her. 

Iris is beautiful, although the way she holds her head is odd -- like she tilts it back and it's like her chin juts out.  She's also very manic and I think that would be so irritating.  I think she's hoping to get some acting jobs out of this. 

Elizabeth is soooooo extra.  For someone who thinks she is witty, I haven't heard one witty thing out of her mouth.  Just b/c you dye your hair a shade of red that doesn't exist on a natural redhead and try to act quirky, you are not quirky.

[Lindz]

10 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

I think Keith has told Iris how he truly feels.  She is well aware of his concerns about her "emotional maturity" and whether she is right for him based on that because she's mentioned it on-screen.  Only she says she thinks he is saying that because she is a virgin and is doubling down on that like he is being so unfair.  She is not even willing to listen to him. 

HA! & WHAT ELSE?? WHERE did either ask or explain what they meant? WHERE did either ask or explain how to address those concerns? That's what smart people would do. Not just drop vague soundbites. 😒😂 WHY would she be guessing if he explained? He's NOT saying anything else to clarify & she's asking dumb questions & not trying to address his lame responses. DOOMED

[Jeanne222]

I could be wrong but I thought the sex Deonna and Gregg both speak of was that ONE TIME on their one month anniversary!

Since then they both just talk about it!

I'm guessing Raven might be gay!  The men that hear your heart, have long discussions, know how to do the right things usually are!  

[Jeanne222]

28 minutes ago, Kdawg82 said:

I really enjoyed Jaime's friend he was speaking to at the bar/restaurant. He is more useful than those "experts." Everyone should have a friend like him. 

I barely watch anymore. I keep this show on in the background while I do other stuff, beyond the first 10 minutes. Or while I chow down on my breakfast/lunch. 

I think Beth isn't attracted to Jaime. That's why she's not "a sexual being" with him.  

That was Elizabeth's friend talking to Jamie!

[Katie111]

Does Jaimie have any friends?  On the episode when the other couples had friends over, Jaimie and Beth just had their parents over.   Same with Beth, they have not shown her with any girlfriends ever.  Amber either.  She seems to have Raven (who I think is gay) but no girl friends.  Maybe if these couples had a life outside of their marriages, things would work out better for them.  Maybe if Amber had a group of girlfriends, Matt would ask her to join him when he goes out with his buddies every night.

 Iris’s Mother is great, but my virginity would not be a hot topic I’d want to discuss with my mom on a daily basis. And just get over yourself already Iris.  Keith has been with plenty of women, deflowering you is not going to be as exciting for him as you think it is.  Just get it over with already. 

[Maccagirl]

13 hours ago, Spectator said:

I’m thinking the producers were well aware of Matt’s shenanigans and wanted a way to work it into the storyline so they asked Raven to pretend that he saw it and then spill the beans. 

I’d also like to think the producers have a shred of decency and wanted to spare Amber the humiliation of saying she wanted to stay married (we all KNOW that’s what she would have said!) when Matt clearly wanted to catch the first train out of town, so they dumped this news on her ahead of the big day to protect her.

Oooh, I never thought of the production crew trying to swoop in in time for Amber to not say "yes" and save her from public humiliation.  I really like your theory and hope this helps her to say "no, she wants a divorce" on next week's decision day. 

Edited September 5, 2019 by Maccagirl
made poorly worded sentence easier to understand!

[Lily247]

2 hours ago, Empress1 said:

I thought that was exactly right, what Elizabeth's friend said. They ARE on opposite sides when it comes to sex. Elizabeth needs some kind of emotional connection to be in the mood; Jamie sees sex as a way TO connect - but I actually think that's too generous for Jamie. Really, I just think Jamie wants to bang and isn't that interested in Elizabeth's feelings (and, I suspect, pleasure, given what she said).

I loved Deonna's dinner with her friend and cousin. When she said she and Greg had sex and it was good, the cousin was like "Wait, wait, I didn't even ask all that!" and I fell out. She's much more animated with them. I think she's an introvert who is slow to warm up to people but when she's around people she's comfortable with, she really shines. 

Amber needs to play all of Lizzo's music on a loop, get some therapy, and push the hell on. Matt didn't come home for 24 hours and left his ring at home. Like, of COURSE he was cheating. That's just common sense. Not saying Amber deserves it - she doesn't - but if she stays, she's choosing to accept that behavior, and she should not.

Honestly, I dont think Elizabeth would require emotional connection for sex. I think she just couldn't keep up with his sex drive (eww) OR like she said, the sex is boring for her and its not worth her effort. Plus, I think Jamie is trying to bang her as much as possible before their inevitable divorce. 

Dont the experts ask candidates about their sex drives ? "I need it daily/3 times a week" is not compatible with "once every 2 months maybe" (Cough Deonna and Greg)

[Lily247]

49 minutes ago, Jeanne222 said:

I could be wrong but I thought the sex Deonna and Gregg both speak of was that ONE TIME on their one month anniversary!

Since then they both just talk about it!

I'm guessing Raven might be gay!  The men that hear your heart, have long discussions, know how to do the right things usually are!  

The problem with guys like that are, that they tend to orbit a girl that they like, giving friendly vibes, and the girl senses those friendly vibes and is sexually turned off. The guy then is FRIENDZONED and the girl uses him for male attention/validation.  Cue:Raven and Amber. 

[Ohwell]

As pitiful and needy as Amber is, I can still understand her friend zoning Raven dude.  He looks ok but he just seems.....boring, whether he's straight or gay.

Edited September 5, 2019 by Ohwell

[cinsays]

15 minutes ago, Maccagirl said:

Oooh, I never thought of the production crew trying to swoop in in time for Amber to not say "yes" and be publicly humiliated.  I really like your theory and hope this helps her to say "no, she wants a divorce" on next week's decision day. 

But I don't think even hearing that he's into another woman will make her decide to end it.

She just loves the idea of being married!!!!!! In her mind, she NEEDS to be married.

Even if she's miserable the whole time.

But, gosh Amber,  find someone who also wants to be married. This guy has checked out.

[lids]

I think the reason Amber doesn’t like Raven is because he’s short. When they were both sitting in their chairs with their feet up, I was thinking: look at these cute little people. Amber seems to be enamored with tall though. She is willing to accept anything from Matt and tall is his only redeeming quality.

I think the key to Beth and Jaime’s disconnect is what her friend said at lunch - Beth needs affection and intimacy. Of course, Beth is not a genuine person and doesn’t know how to initiate affection and intimacy. She also likes to come off a exciting and fun, so she leads all her interactions with sexy-time moves - nakedness, inappropriate touching and words. Then when Jaime reacts sexually, she’s all, “I just want affection.” And Jaime thinks she’s being manipulative. She is being manipulative; but I don’t think she knows how to play it straight and she’s not a warm person, so she doesn’t engender warmth in her partners. Something about Beth’s upbringing is weird, like, why is she even sexual when soliciting affection from her father? She should figure out how to show warmth and vulnerability and then she and Jaime could communicate better.

We finally get to see the breakdown between Iris and Keith. Iris’ mom said all Iris relationships have been a disaster. I guess Iris thought the reason was because the men wouldn’t commit, but hopefully from watching this she’ll realize her personality pushes men away. Like Beth, it appears that Iris doesn’t have close female friends. I imagine they both annoy people with their need to be the center of attention.

Also, in interviews Iris said the exact opposite about Keith of what she said in the episode. Here, she complimented Keith on being open and understanding, allowing her to open up. But in the web interview, she said Keith was very closed off and never told her what he thought. I guess watching things back, she’s realized that Keith was NOT open and honest. When Keith said if he had to be married at first sight to anyone, Iris was the perfect person, it reminded me when Will told Jasmine she was like the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. Why do men say these things if they don’t mean it???