S12.E23: The Change Constant; S12.E24: The Stockholm Syndrome

[summitsw]

I found this season to be a chore, so was about 10 eps behind and then had to binge them. I did myself no favours with this plan, because watching that many episodes in a row was not fun. I’m not going to bother commenting on anything that went before the two part finale because it’s not worth it, but I found the first part of the finale to be better than the last part. The actual last episode was terrible.

I found Sheldon’s speech cringe-worthy, not because of what he said but where he said it. By no means did I find that a believable scenario. And having each of the friends stand up was a **crickets** moment, not helped by the dead silence in that scene. Seriously, if someone did that at the Oscars they’d be roasted on social media. For mine, it would have been better for them to finish the show in Leonard and Penny’s living room with Sheldon giving the same speech and then giving his friends tickets to join him and Amy in Switzerland as a thank you for all they’d done. The end.

There is also no universe in which I believe that Mary (and also Georgie and Missy) wouldn’t have attended that ceremony. Ending the show with the idea of them all heading off to watch the award ceremony rather than subjecting us to it would have also negated that ridiculousness.

They should have ended the show last season with Amy and Sheldon’s wedding. 

Edited May 19, 2019 by summitsw

[AAEBoiler]

No, the finale wasn't perfect and it was fairly predictable. However it was a very satisfying and a nice "love letter" to the fans. It was a million times better than the clusterf#*k that was "How I Met Your Mother" which I still have never watched in syndication. #NeverForget

[Biggie B]

12 hours ago, Friendly kitty said:

So if Sheldon becomes the father, then in 3-5 years, when he will mature even more and morally prepare for the new change.

He and Amy do have children. As the narrator of "Young Sheldon," he has mentioned his children at least once in one of the episode's voiceovers. 

[Badsamaritan]

I am so very very glad they didn't get cute at the end and kick their audience in the nuts, I can't even say! 

I really loved it. Did I get everything I wanted? No, but I'm square with that. Didn't see SMG coming, I really expected the surprise guest to be William Shatner. I can absolutely believe he would attend the Nobel ceremony, no question. 

I was thinking earlier, why would any of this family leave each other, at least for right now? Because that's what those strange, geeky, picked on, friendless, kids have always wanted. A family that chose them, in all their nerdy glory. And Penny - the Pretty Girl, who found hers with the same kinda weirdos she shunned in high school. A family that sees and knows the best and worst of you, and will be there through it all. 

I guess I took the last episode about Leonard supplying his sperm for Zach and his wife, and Penny's antics, differently. She tried real hard to get Leonard to change his mind, why did she care about that so much, if she still really really didn't want kids? Her conversation with her dad made it seem to me as if it was more about her being unsure if she would be any good at it. Babysitting Halley is one thing, you can go home. You can't leave your own kids, that's called child abandonment. 😉 

I can actually imagine, with the secret training Amy does with Sheldon, that he would be very attentive during her pregnancy. He would naturally read all the books and chart her stats and of course, there'd be tons of 'experiments' to try on children. And he has a baseline already with some of them via his study with the Wolotots.

I'm so happy I can watch reruns in peace, knowing they didn't fuck it all up in the end. 

Edited May 19, 2019 by Badsamaritan

[Chit Chat]

25 minutes ago, summitsw said:

I found Sheldon’s speech cringe-worthy, not because of what he said but where he said it. By no means did I find that a believable scenario. And having each of the friends stand up was a **crickets** moment, not helped by the dead silence in that scene.

Yes, I found it to be the wrong place for that particular speech.  As I said earlier, he and Amy needed to talk about their discovery and then he could've said that he couldn't have accomplished what he did by himself, and go on to thank his friends and family, but not make the entire speech about his shortcomings as a human being.    I was uncomfortable with the silence in the room too.  Those people didn't know what the hell he was talking about, nor did they care. 

The last few years have been all about showing Sheldon to be a jerk, then he apologizes, then it cycles back around time and time again.  I guess I was hoping for something a little different with the finale.   Chuck Lorre's vanity card on YS spoke of how he loved the character of Sheldon and that he always rooted for him.  I feel the same way, but the show seemed to continually focus on him, and some of the other characters got left by the wayside.  It's this aspect of the show that I found disappointing.  I'm okay with how they ended it, but I can still be sad about the opportunities I think they missed with some of the other characters. 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Winston Wolfe said:

Yet he was the only star - that I know of - who publicly stated that he wasn't interested in returning and that the show had basically run its course.  Not trying to be argumentative here, but will we ever know if any of his co-stars were interested in continuing? We'll never know unless they say.  Kaley certainly didn't seem ready to go. IMO, it just looks like Parsons said "time to go" and CBS said, "well, that's it."

By contrast, it's well-known that most of the cast of HIMYM wanted to go at least one more season and CBS vetoed it, since it wasn't the cash cow TBBT is.  We won't ever know for sure, but I'd bet the ranch that CBS would have been fine with Season 13 if JP was onboard.

It’s been reported that CBS wanted two more years. Apparently it was Lorre who chose to end the series because he only wanted to go forward if Jim, Kaley and Johnny were in. 

Edited May 19, 2019 by Guest

[aemom]

On 5/16/2019 at 9:04 PM, Browncoat said:

And the tiara, of course!  And the slap!  Those were great

I was glad to see the tiara again and the slap was epic. I rewound my DVR to watch it again because I was laughing so hard. If that wasn't a real slap, then they choreographed it brilliantly. 

On 5/17/2019 at 12:54 AM, ProTourist said:

No parents at the awards ceremony? I thought we'd see Amy's mother and father -- would have loved another opportunity to see those two -- and Sheldon's mother. It doesn't make sense to me that they would stay away. S&A paid for all their friends to make the trip, they could have paid for their parents

To me that was a big omission: That Amy's parents and Mary Cooper were all missing from the ceremony. 

On 5/17/2019 at 8:33 AM, Tosia said:

I don't think that they intended to show Stuart as an incompetent babysitter ---it was  just that the Wolotots  were especially  rambunctious that day. The actor did a marvelous job on the video with the eye tics and evading the truth. It was really funny.  

Even parents have those days and accidents always happen. 

Absolutely. My kids have managed to pull some doozies over the years, and Stuart was trying really hard by even getting the spaghetti strainer to try and save the tooth.

On 5/17/2019 at 1:37 PM, kariyaki said:

You can. If you expedite it, you’ll get it in a week. 

In Canada, you can get it in about 24 hours, but it will cost you several hundred dollars.

I also enjoyed the wink of why Leonard is always wearing a hoody.

I'm not ashamed to say that I teared up at the end.

[SmithW6079]

3 hours ago, TexasTiffany said:

I feared that they would do a Frasier ending (IMO that was AWFUL) Frasier left his family, friends, the home he always wanted, his livelihood, all of his favorite restaurants, theaters, etc. For what? He's so infatuated with Charlotte, who moved back to Chicago, that he takes the job in... San Francisco. WTF? 

Yes, I agree. That was absolutely awful. I wish Frasier had come to realize there isn't always someone for everyone, and that the love of his family and friends was enough -- something they could have done with Raj here.

[amass]

On 5/17/2019 at 12:49 AM, Mystery said:

Yeah, I guess they needed to make a dramatic choice for whether Howard and Bernadette would stay for the ceremony. But it felt off. 

All the bad things could still have happened (Michael having a fever and Hallie falling down the stairs and losing a tooth while trying to go comfort him) and Stuart still could have been shown as competently handling them, and they still could have wanted to go home.... so they didn’t need to make Stuart incompetent to set up the conflict.

[Driad]

Does the Nobel prize ceremony have a time limit for speeches?  The Ig Nobel ceremony does.  If someone speaks too long, they play a recording of a child saying "Please stop, I'm bored" over and over until the speaker gives up.

[Calvada]

1 hour ago, AAEBoiler said:

No, the finale wasn't perfect and it was fairly predictable. However it was a very satisfying and a nice "love letter" to the fans. It was a million times better than the clusterf#*k that was "How I Met Your Mother" which I still have never watched in syndication. #NeverForget

I wish I could like this post a million times.  I too will never watch HIMYM in syndication, and I will never watch another show from Carter Bays and Craig Thomas, those rat bastards.  

Lots of finales have not been great - HIMYM takes the cake here, but Frasier and Seinfeld were awful too.  Some were so overwrought - MASH, anyone?  I loved Newhart just because I knew immediately what was happening because before the lights came on I recognized the Hartley bedroom set from the Bob Newhart Show (including the freaking sheets) and TBNS is one of my top 3 favorite shows of all time.  I also liked the Everybody Loves Raymond finale.  Although I remember a lot of viewers of ELR were upset that Amy and Robert were not expecting a baby in the finale . . . 

The only thing I didn't like about TBBT finale was that Sheldon's mother was not at the Nobel ceremony, but I understand that Laurie Metcalf was not available.

[pennben]

4 hours ago, TexasTiffany said:

 I feared that they would do a Frasier ending (IMO that was AWFUL) Frasier left his family, friends, the home he always wanted, his livelihood, all of his favorite restaurants, theaters, etc. For what? He's so infatuated with Charlotte, who moved back to Chicago, that he takes the job in... San Francisco. WTF? 

You might want to rewatch the last minute of the Frazier finale. 

[TexasTiffany]

I know Frasier was on the airplane to Chicago relating the entire story to Jennifer Beals. That didn't change the outcome.

I was googling videos of the cast members earlier. I didn't know that Kunal's real life wife is the beautiful Miss India of 2006. I'm suddenly feeling okay that Raj is single during the finale. 

2 hours ago, Badsamaritan said:

I was thinking earlier, why would any of this family leave each other, at least for right now? Because that's what those strange, geeky, picked on, friendless, kids have always wanted. A family that chose them, in all their nerdy glory. And Penny - the Pretty Girl, who found hers with the same kinda weirdos she shunned in high school. A family that sees and knows the best and worst of you, and will be there through it all. 

This speaks to me and my nerdy, geeky friends. 

[shapeshifter]

3 hours ago, Winston Wolfe said:

We won't ever know for sure, but I'd bet the ranch that CBS would have been fine with Season 13 if JP was onboard.

But it seemed like a lot of the audience was ready for it to be over. I wonder if part of JP's bowing out was based on that.
  
  
  

5 hours ago, LoneHaranguer said:

On 5/17/2019 at 7:29 PM, SpiritSong said:

I agree with those who said why even bother introducing Anu if they were just going to drop it at the end?

I think the writers needed Raj to have another relationship fail so that they could do the "you don't have to feel lonely when you have friends!" scene.

Now that you mention it, I can look back on the Anu arc and see that this was always her purpose as a character in the show. They made her likable, but not too likable. And Raj was into her, but not that into her. So kudos to the writers, actors, directors, et al. for keeping us guessing.

[EllenB]

1 hour ago, Calvada said:

I wish I could like this post a million times.  I too will never watch HIMYM in syndication, and I will never watch another show from Carter Bays and Craig Thomas, those rat bastards.  

Lots of finales have not been great - HIMYM takes the cake here, but Frasier and Seinfeld were awful too.  Some were so overwrought - MASH, anyone?  I loved Newhart just because I knew immediately what was happening because before the lights came on I recognized the Hartley bedroom set from the Bob Newhart Show (including the freaking sheets) and TBNS is one of my top 3 favorite shows of all time.  I also liked the Everybody Loves Raymond finale.  Although I remember a lot of viewers of ELR were upset that Amy and Robert were not expecting a baby in the finale . . . 

The only thing I didn't like about TBBT finale was that Sheldon's mother was not at the Nobel ceremony, but I understand that Laurie Metcalf was not available.

Thank you, thank you, thank you!  I thought I was the only one who hated that M*A*S*H ending.  The only show I liked in which everyone was split up was Barney Miller.  It was sad, but made sense.  But this show did a great balance of funny and emotional in the ending, and wrapped up enough storylines without shoehorning too many things in.

[Meushell]

Bernadette’s “Help me” and Sheldon’s “Wait, is that Buffy the Vampire Slayer” made me actually laugh out loud for the first time in multiple episodes. I realize that’s not much of a compliment for a comedy show, but it’s the sad truth. At least the show went out on a high note.

I do like that Sheldon questioned congratulating a pregnancy that might have been unwanted. The rest of his response was his usual rudeness, but that question was realistic.

I didn’t like Amy’s makeover. I know she said she liked it, but it seemed like the show just told us she was never pretty. 

Edited May 19, 2019 by Meushell

[green]

21 hours ago, TexasTiffany said:

This is what I hoped, that they are together where I want them to be when I visit the reruns. 

I feared that they would do a Frasier ending (IMO that was AWFUL) Frasier left his family, friends, the home he always wanted, his livelihood, all of his favorite restaurants, theaters, etc. For what? He's so infatuated with Charlotte, who moved back to Chicago, that he takes the job in... San Francisco. WTF? 

I was worried Sheldon and Amy would announce their leaving for jobs across the country. Raj staying in England. Howard and Bernie moving away. Leonard and Penny making new friends which emotionally moves them away from their extended friends/family. I will not fear this episode as something I can't watch later.

Yes thank you for this post.  The Frasier ending was the worst for a comedy show ever.  (I never saw meeting your mother one and have no idea what you guys are talking about there though it sounds bad).

When you have an ending like Frasier's, it ruins re-watches in syndication so much.  Especially the Frasier, Niles and Martin moments of becoming a family together again ones.  Writers like that don't seem to "get" how this effects re-watching shows.  They just seem hell bent on showing off what they think are big artsy moves just to jump the shark instead.

Same for Battlestar Galactica which was brilliant the first two years until the show runner self-destructed it the last two and the ending with Apollo the Luddite makes re-watching the series totally impossible for me.  The prelude (Mini-Series pilot) is the only thing I can sit through now.

18 hours ago, Winston Wolfe said:

By contrast, it's well-known that most of the cast of HIMYM wanted to go at least one more season and CBS vetoed it, since it wasn't the cash cow TBBT is.  We won't ever know for sure, but I'd bet the ranch that CBS would have been fine with Season 13 if JP was onboard.

The rest of the cast needs to expand themselves as actors at this point whether they wanted to or not and it was time the show folded it's tent.  Good for Jim Parsons.

18 hours ago, Badsamaritan said:

I am so very very glad they didn't get cute at the end and kick their audience in the nuts, I can't even say!  ...

I was thinking earlier, why would any of this family leave each other, at least for right now? Because that's what those strange, geeky, picked on, friendless, kids have always wanted. A family that chose them, in all their nerdy glory. And Penny - the Pretty Girl, who found hers with the same kinda weirdos she shunned in high school. A family that sees and knows the best and worst of you, and will be there through it all.  ...

I'm so happy I can watch reruns in peace, knowing they didn't fuck it all up in the end. 

Exactly.  If they split up the gang just to throw grenades for the hell of it and call attention to some writer's artsy fartsy big ego trip (looking at you Battlestar Galactica's show runner and chief writer, Ronald Moore) I would never be able to watch the show in syndication again.  Now I can as long as I live.  So thank you so much, Big Bang Theory writers.  Props to you all!

Edited May 19, 2019 by green

[wendyg]

In the world outside the show, I think they'd have really struggled to find time in Laurie Metcalfe's schedule, since she's currently starring on Broadway in a play about the Clintons with John Lithgow. Eight live shows a week doesn't leave you with much time for anything else.

AIUI, it wasn't CBS that vetoed it but Chuck Lorre and Bill Prady who said they wouldn't consider doing the show without Parsons. Seems reasonable to me - from the beginning the three they thought were indispensable "persons of essence" were Parsons, Galecki, and Cuoco. Now, obviously the show changed a lot over the years, but I suspect they wouldn't have gone on without any one of those three - because then it's a different show and you have to rethink everything. And Lorre knows how hard it is to rethink a show midstream because he had to do it when Charlie Sheen combusted during season 8 of TWO AND A HALF MEN.

[Katy M]

10 hours ago, Winston Wolfe said:

Yet he was the only star - that I know of - who publicly stated that he wasn't interested in returning and that the show had basically run its course.  Not trying to be argumentative here, but will we ever know if any of his co-stars were interested in continuing? We'll never know unless they say.  Kaley certainly didn't seem ready to go. IMO, it just looks like Parsons said "time to go" and CBS said, "well, that's it."

So, what?  He's not a slave.  He gets to leave the show when his contract is up.

[Chit Chat]

I thought the show had run it's course.  As much as I loved it, it was time to end it.  As the saying goes, 'leave 'em wanting more!'  

I, too, am glad that they didn't do anything drastic with the finale.  Kaley said about a week ago that it was sad, but nothing catastrophic happened, so I was glad to know that going into the last episode.  

[CarpeFelis]

Although I enjoyed Sheldon’s speech, it seemed so out of character (as well as inappropriate for the Nobel ceremony) - not to mention, SMG being there seemed so off the wall - that I wondered if he was about to wake up back on the couch, still waiting for the phone call.

[Chit Chat]

1 hour ago, CarpeFelis said:

SMG being there seemed so off the wall - that I wondered if he was about to wake up back on the couch, still waiting for the phone call.

Her appearance in the finale was lost on me.  I know they've mentioned her in the past, but a spot in the finale?  It wasn't necessary.

[Mom x 3]

I liked it.  

I know people complained about Sheldon being a huge jerk in this one when he has had character development beyond this, but I expected him to be super selfish during what could potentially be the crowning achievement of his career.  He just had not yet learned that you can acknowledge others without diminishing your own achievements.  I cried like a baby during the speech, especially the Astronaut part.  

SMG didn't surprise me because it made sense for Raj, who is a HUGE buffy fan.  

Loved the callback to Howard being a perv, "You two have showered together?" and Bernadette calling him out on it.  

Loved Amy's speech.  Liked her makeover.  Glad it was Raj and not Penny that helped her with it, which makes sense given that Penny would probably push showing more skin.  I do wish we would have gotten that montage.

The Penny pregnancy didn't bother me as much because it was obvious they had known about it and had been given time to accept it.  Also, this was the happiest and most connected Penny and Leonard had been in years on this show.  It was nice to see them genuinely happy with each other, not just in being snarky about the others.  

Agree that Stewart wasn't incompetent.  Kids are kids.  If I had a nickel for every time my kids injured themselves when I was right there and didn't see it coming.  

I cackled at Kripke's prank call.  

I don't watch Young Sheldon, but I did watch the tribute one based on the comments here, and I'm so glad I did.  I teared up all over again.

I can't wait for the reunion show in ten years.  

[kathe5133]

The “astronaut” mention appeared to me to be more about Sheldon not wanting to acknowledge that he had a friend who didn’t have the title of “Doctor” preceding their name, than as a tribute to Howard, but YMMV!

[Meushell]

25 minutes ago, Mom x 3 said:

Loved the callback to Howard being a perv, "You two have showered together?" and Bernadette calling him out on it.  

I thought it was a valid question. 😀 How would Bernadette have seen Penny drinking in the shower?

[Homily]

17 minutes ago, kathe5133 said:

The “astronaut” mention appeared to me to be more about Sheldon not wanting to acknowledge that he had a friend who didn’t have the title of “Doctor” preceding their name, than as a tribute to Howard, but YMMV!

I didn't see that.  To me Sheldon's speech was heartfelt and genuine.  Oh sure vastly inappropriate for the venue!! but still I cut them some slack with this because, well, TV sitcom 😃

[Katy M]

24 minutes ago, Homily said:

I didn't see that.  To me Sheldon's speech was heartfelt and genuine.  Oh sure vastly inappropriate for the venue!! but still I cut them some slack with this because, well, TV sitcom 😃

I'm sure the audience appreciated it more than his 90 minute tribute to himself.

[k2p2]

33 minutes ago, kathe5133 said:

The “astronaut” mention appeared to me to be more about Sheldon not wanting to acknowledge that he had a friend who didn’t have the title of “Doctor” preceding their name, than as a tribute to Howard, but YMMV!

I saw it as Sheldon's way of acknowledging that Howard's achievements were valid and important. He has frequently refused to respect Howard's knowledge and skill in the past, but this time, Sheldon deliberately used the one word that would make it crystal clear to Howard that he was valued.

[Katy M]

44 minutes ago, kathe5133 said:

The “astronaut” mention appeared to me to be more about Sheldon not wanting to acknowledge that he had a friend who didn’t have the title of “Doctor” preceding their name, than as a tribute to Howard, but YMMV!

Penny's not a doctor, either.  He didn't try putting a fancy title in front of her name.

[Mom x 3]

1 hour ago, Meushell said:

I thought it was a valid question. 😀 How would Bernadette have seen Penny drinking in the shower?

I just thought it was one of those moments where Penny is in the shower and Bernadette is putting on makeup or on the toilet or something.  Close girlfriends are often less squicky about sharing a bathroom at the same time, at least in my experience.  

[ams1001]

1 hour ago, Katy M said:

Penny's not a doctor, either.  He didn't try putting a fancy title in front of her name.

Yeah, but he also didn't spend the whole series making fun of that fact like he did to Howard. 

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, k2p2 said:

I saw it as Sheldon's way of acknowledging that Howard's achievements were valid and important. He has frequently refused to respect Howard's knowledge and skill in the past, but this time, Sheldon deliberately used the one word that would make it crystal clear to Howard that he was valued.

Also, didn't Sheldon and Howard have a train trip together during which Sheldon admitted he was jealous of Howard being an astronaut who had gone into space?
Or something like that?

[Chit Chat]

4 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

Also, didn't Sheldon and Howard have a train trip together during which Sheldon admitted he was jealous of Howard being an astronaut who had gone into space?

I believe he finally admitted that.  Sheldon gave him the utmost respect by addressing him as "Astronaut."  It was a nice moment between the 2 of them. Way back in the episode when Howard & his fellow astronauts lifted off, Sheldon nervously said "Boldly go, Howard Wolowitz."  That was a nice moment too.  

[Homily]

23 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

Also, didn't Sheldon and Howard have a train trip together during which Sheldon admitted he was jealous of Howard being an astronaut who had gone into space?

The time I remember when this came up was when they were flying to Texas together.  IIRC they were making an effort to put their differences behind them (I think at Bernadette's instigation).  At first it didn't go well but they reached a point where Sheldon did finally admit that he was jealous because Howard had the chance to do something that he (Sheldon) had always dreamed of doing.

Edit:  It was in the "Friendship Turbulence" and when I went to see what we discussed about that one I can find the thread but all the posts are gone 🙃

Edited May 19, 2019 by Homily

[Katy M]

56 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

Yeah, but he also didn't spend the whole series making fun of that fact like he did to Howard. 

Not specifically about not having a doctorate. But about not having graduating community college, just being  a waitress, insulting her acting career.

[Reality police]

3 hours ago, Homily said:

The time I remember when this came up was when they were flying to Texas together.  IIRC they were making an effort to put their differences behind them (I think at Bernadette's instigation).  At first it didn't go well but they reached a point where Sheldon did finally admit that he was jealous because Howard had the chance to do something that he (Sheldon) had always dreamed of doing.

Edit:  It was in the "Friendship Turbulence" and when I went to see what we discussed about that one I can find the thread but all the posts are gone 🙃

Will this do? 

[Calvada]

18 hours ago, EllenB said:

Thank you, thank you, thank you!  I thought I was the only one who hated that M*A*S*H ending.  The only show I liked in which everyone was split up was Barney Miller.  It was sad, but made sense.  But this show did a great balance of funny and emotional in the ending, and wrapped up enough storylines without shoehorning too many things in.

You're welcome!  Barney Miller - another one of my all-time favorites.  I have a real affection for ensemble comedies.  Wouldn't you have loved to see Arthur Dietrich and Sheldon together?  

[Katy M]

18 hours ago, EllenB said:

Thank you, thank you, thank you!  I thought I was the only one who hated that M*A*S*H ending.  The only show I liked in which everyone was split up was Barney Miller.  It was sad, but made sense.  But this show did a great balance of funny and emotional in the ending, and wrapped up enough storylines without shoehorning too many things in.

I thought the MASH finale was way to OTT.  I did like that they all got to go home. Finally.  I mean it only took them 4 times as long as everybody else:)

I liked the Cheers finale.  If you ignore the Frasier updates, Rebecca and Woody left, (and then if you include Frasier he left) and everybody else stayed.  Kind of realistic.  People generally don't all move on at once.  

[shapeshifter]

5 hours ago, Homily said:

It was in the "Friendship Turbulence"

2 hours ago, Reality police said:

Will this do? 

Thank you, both.
Now I realize my memory of it is more of a composite:

[HOWARD onboard a plane to Texas with Sheldon] I'm an astronaut, and you know it. You just don't like admitting it, because you're jealous.

[SHELDON] Well, truth be told, as a child, I did dream of going to space. Those astronauts were my heroes. And when you got to go, it was hard for me.

[HOWARD] Thank you.

[SHELDON] Because it made me realize they'll just send anyone up there.

[SHELDON (during turbulence)] I'm sorry for every mean thing I ever did or said to you! 

[HOWARD] I'm sorry, too! It's all my fault! 

[SHELDON  (plane rumbling, rattling; passengers gasping)]If you weren't my friend, there'd be a hole in my life! 

[HOWARD] Thank you, Sheldon.

[SHELDON] Kind of like when Firefly was cancelled. But not as big.

[Guest]

12 hours ago, Homily said:

The time I remember when this came up was when they were flying to Texas together.  IIRC they were making an effort to put their differences behind them (I think at Bernadette's instigation).  At first it didn't go well but they reached a point where Sheldon did finally admit that he was jealous because Howard had the chance to do something that he (Sheldon) had always dreamed of doing.

Edit:  It was in the "Friendship Turbulence" and when I went to see what we discussed about that one I can find the thread but all the posts are gone 🙃

One of the interesting parts of that episode is that it starts with Sheldon revealing that Howard began insulting and pranking him as soon as they met. I loved Sheldon finally acknowledging that Howard is an astronaut but I haven’t felt bad for either of them since that episode. 

Edited May 20, 2019 by Guest

[brgjoe]

I thought it was a "Meh" episode until the end.  Sheldon's speech saved it.

When the show first started with them winning the Nobel, I thought, "Whew..they got that one out of the way quickly.  Now they can move on from it..."

Nope.  The whole episode pretty much revolved around Sheldon and the Nobel Prize.  And for most of the episode(s) I didn't think it was particularly funny.  I laughed maybe 2-3 times throughout the hour long finale.  Though as others have said, maybe it wasn't meant to be funny-haha like most sitcom episodes.

Disappointing that Stewart couldn't watch the kids for that short amount of time.  And that call to Howard/Bernadette was more cringyworthy than funny.  I mean, the kid not only fell, but rolled down the stairs and lost a tooth (yeah, I know it's a baby tooth, but still..)  I couldn't believe that was played for laughs.  That part of the show really seemed...off.

And on the plane when Sheldon was told about Penny's pregnancy, of course he wouldn't think it was that big of a deal.  Hey, Leonard -- you have known him longer than most anyone.  Of course he should have expected that reaction.  Be he seemed shocked..SHOCKED..that suddenly Sheldon would be pre-occupied with his winning of the Nobel and not really being that emotional over hearing the news. 

But I know it was all to set up his final speech.  Which I thought was nicely done.  Even though, yeah, a Nobel ceremony probably wouldn't have been the best time for it.  But who cares?  It was really well presented and a nice way to wrap up the show.

Disappointed that "Buffy" was the big celeb walkon.  And even then she only had a couple of lines.  Was hoping for a Shatner/Wheaton/Stewart/Lucas/Hamill appearance or similar to be made.  Oh well...

So it was an OK finale for me...not much more than that.

[DarkRaichu]

The speech at the end was the punchline.  Sheldon apology and acknowledgement of his friends in the biggest stage for science.  That was good.

The premise of the episode was meh, but got us to the speech.  I like Leonard's story & ending last episode better.  

They kind of tied this finale with Season finale of Young Sheldon.  

Goodbye show.  I am not going to miss you.

[Mermaid Under]

Quote

 Buffy was the big guest star?  Really? 

I remember reading a long time ago that "stars" that couldn't get other work would appear on game shows just to keep their SAG health insurance active.  So I'm hoping, rather than some sort of guest star comeback trick, this was just a game show appearance to keep her insurance. 

[Homily]

I thought "Buffy" being on was awesome.  Nice tie in to the fact that her show was one the guys referenced fairly often over the years.  Also it was nice to see Raj had a celebrity date for the big event  😊

[Deskisamess]

Some thoughts...

Penny getting pregnant isn't that odd, given the first episode. I've seen lots of comments about Penny not wanting kids, and being annoyed the show had her get pregnant anyway. It's not unusual for a woman to change her mind on that issue. I've been married over 40 years, and had a few friends who started off adamant about not wanting kids. Most of them ended up with a couple of children, happy they hadn't stuck to their first view. People change as they go through life, decisions made as young women don't always remain the same as life happens.

I wasn't thrilled with Amy's makeover...it didn't seem real to me at all. It was too much of a change all at one time. Amy would have been totally uncomfortable in the new clothes, especially the spiked heels and low cut dresses. It also fed the idea that women/girls have to look a certain way to gain acceptance, aside from the fact that she just won a Nobel, an accomplishment that had nothing to do with how she looked. It didn't feel right to me.

Raj...wow, total dis to the character. Boo hiss. I get the tie in with Buffy, but not for Raj. He wasn't the one who wanted Penny to love the show. It felt mashed in for the sake of tying it to a past show, with zero ties to Raj. Why not bring back one of the cute gals he dated, with some grand romantic gesture for him?

I loved Stuart and Denise together...some little nod to them would have been nice, beyond the incompetence. 

I loved Sheldon's speech, it made my eyes puddle. Overall it was a pretty good ending, and well past time I think. The show had been feeling a little forced.

[Homily]

1 hour ago, Deskisamess said:

Raj...wow, total dis to the character. Boo hiss. I get the tie in with Buffy, but not for Raj. He wasn't the one who wanted Penny to love the show. It felt mashed in for the sake of tying it to a past show, with zero ties to Raj.

For me I thought it was a nice nod to the way Howard and Raj (and to a lesser extent Leonard) were always lusting after the famous women (the models, Summer Glau, the girl from Battle Star Galactica and so on) and finally in the last episode one of them actually did achieve a date with one of the women who are "so beyond your reach".  I guess in a way it was sad because, of course, she only went with him for the chance to see the ceremony, but still, he got to have a date with "Buffy" so I think that made him pretty happy.  And pictures will end up his FB and blog 😉

Edited May 20, 2019 by Homily

[perkie1968]

On 5/17/2019 at 9:55 PM, ams1001 said:

My favorite part of that scene was Penny's gleeful grin when the door opened.

"Waddaya know, they fixed the elevator"

What's even better for me, is that Sheldon and Leonard are having this super serious discussion, then pause, then "DING" of the elevator.  I thought it would open up empty but to open up to Penny's with a huge grin on her face was just icing on the cake.  

I laughed a bunch in this episode, which is really all I'm looking for in a comedy.  I'm not expecting it to split the atom or anything, so I thought it was great.  

My only complaint was the lack of Laurie Metcalf.  They had Christine Baranski come back for one final episode and the "previously on" at the beginning had a clip of Howard with his mother's voice yelling at him, so to not have Mary at all, seemed rather strange.  Even if Laurie was busy with other stuff, they could have had a quick Skype call to congratulate Sheldon, at the very least.  Especially since we saw in Young Sheldon how much winning that award would have meant to him.   Hell, if Laurie really wasn't available for anything, they could have had a voice call using Zoe Perry since she sounds so much like her mother.  

Edited May 20, 2019 by perkie1968

[Homily]

I wonder if the same thing happened with this episode as with the wedding from last year and they did have cameos from Laurie Metcalfe and others that ended up being cut for time because of course it wouldn't be BBT without a boatload of commercials.

Edited May 20, 2019 by Homily

[DarkRaichu]

56 minutes ago, Deskisamess said:

I wasn't thrilled with Amy's makeover...it didn't seem real to me at all. It was too much of a change all at one time. Amy would have been totally uncomfortable in the new clothes, especially the spiked heels and low cut dresses. It also fed the idea that women/girls have to look a certain way to gain acceptance, aside from the fact that she just won a Nobel, an accomplishment that had nothing to do with how she looked. It didn't feel right to me.

Agreed.  Some makeover is fine, but I do not think it should have been a focus for her character (she was crying about her looks etc)

57 minutes ago, Deskisamess said:

I loved Stuart and Denise together...some little nod to them would have been nice, beyond the incompetence. 

Their ending (move in together) was last episode, no?  This episode is more about the core BBT gangs.

8 minutes ago, perkie1968 said:

My only complaint was the lack of Laurie Metcalf.  They had Christine Baranski come back for one final episode and the "previously on" at the beginning had a clip of Howard with his mother's voice yelling at him, so to not have Mary at all, seemed rather strange.  Even if Laurie was busy with other stuff, they could have had a quick Skype call to congratulate Sheldon, at the very least.  Especially since we saw in Young Sheldon how much winning that award would have meant to him. 

YS spoiler just in case:

Spoiler

Sheldon was all alone when he listened to the announcement in Young Sheldon. Mary stopped by but she was not with him during the announcement of Nobel in Physics

So the juxtaposition at the end of BBT with him surrounded by his current era loved ones is fitting.  Mary would not have been a good fit for this finale.  Although, I would have liked to see Mary in any other episode this season.

[perkie1968]

9 minutes ago, DarkRaichu said:

Mary would not have been a good fit for this finale. 

I disagree.  In YS she sees how alone he is because no one showed up, and how important the whole Nobel prize thing is for him, even though he's not the one winning it at the time.  So not to have her anywhere in the finale, where he's winning one, doesn't ring true for me.  They had a Kripke cameo and the facetime with Stewart, they could have had a cameo facetime of Mary  even if it was two seconds.