The Marvel Cinematic Universe: The Avengers, etc.

[HunterHunted]

On 7/6/2021 at 3:15 PM, dmeets said:

Someone's probably just bitter because Marvel's rebooting Blade without him.

On 7/8/2021 at 6:26 PM, xaxat said:

I would have put my money on Wesley to be the vocal one.

On 7/9/2021 at 10:26 AM, Bruinsfan said:

Against all odds he seems to be the one who doesn't take himself so seriously, what with making an appearance as Blade on What We Do in the Shadows.

 

 

Feige has also been very vocal about how important Wesley Snipes and Blade were for Marvel and the development of the MCU. Kevin Feige has also said that Wesley actually had been trying to make a Black Panther movie for years before Marvel approached him with Blade. And when Blade came up again for the MCU, they went to talk to him. They said that while he was probably too old to play the character for the MCU, he might have a role somewhere elsewhere in the MCU. I wouldn't be shocked if Wesley ended up with a cameo and a producer credit. I also think the fact that David S. Goyer's post-Blade Trinity work is so inconsistent has helped redeem Snipes.

I think the fact that Wesley has a decent enough relationship with Taika to do a What We Do in the Shadows cameo as Blade is another good sign of where Wesley is with Marvel as compared to Stephen Dorff. 

Stephen Dorff coming for Marvel like he's too good for their silly superhero shtick is ridiculous. He's done his share of shitty films, Feardotcom(.com). I'm not going to clock his work on Immortals because loads of people wanted to work with Tarsem Singh.

Loads of very well respected and awarded actors and directors have been associated with the MCU. They've also worked with loads of filmmakers that Dorff would probably love to work with in the future. You'd think he'd have the sense to STFU rather than pointlessly burn bridges. 

Academy Award Nomination

Edward Norton

Mark Ruffalo

Jeremy Renner

Samuel L Jackson

Terrence Howard

Don Cheadle

Scarlett Johansson

Robert Downey Jr.

Chadwick Boseman

Bradley Cooper

Ryan Coogler

Kenneth Branagh

Alfre Woodard

Owen Wilson

Sigourney Weaver

Glenn Close

Jeff Goldblum

Sylvester Stallone

Laurence Fishburne

Angela Bassett

Mickey Rourke

Jake Gyllenhaal

Djimon Hounsou

Academy Award Win

Anthony Hopkins

Gwyneth Paltrow

Natalie Portman

Taika Waititi

Robert Redford

Michael Douglas

William Hurt

Mahershala Ali

Matt Damon

Brie Larson

Cate Blanchett

Benicio del Toro

Lupita Nyongo

Jennifer Connelly

Sam Rockwell

Rachel Weisz

[Bruinsfan]

Also Tilda Swinton, who seemed quite happy to play a Marvel character and to spoof her former vampire role in What We Do in the Shadows. (She was apparently the first big star to say yes to the latter, setting the whole thing in motion.)

[Guest]

Also Daniel Kaluuya, Ben Kingsley, Rachel McAdams, Tommy Lee Jones, Forest Whitaker Josh Brolin, Annette Benning, Jude Law and Marisa Tomei. I’m sure there are still quite a few missing. I once saw a complete list from a few years ago and the most surprising one was that the diner owner in Thor is an Oscar nominee. 

[kiddo82]

John C. Reilly.  Benedict Cumberbatch.  The nominees are in just about every single movie.  I did a list off the top of my head for a friend of mine a year or so ago and I think the only movies that don't have any Oscar winners in them are the Guardians movies.  I may be wrong about that though.  Like I said, it was just off the top of my head.

[Guest]

58 minutes ago, kiddo82 said:

John C. Reilly.  Benedict Cumberbatch.  The nominees are in just about every single movie.  I did a list off the top of my head for a friend of mine a year or so ago and I think the only movies that don't have any Oscar winners in them are the Guardians movies.  I may be wrong about that though.  Like I said, it was just off the top of my head.

I was going to say maybe Guardians 2 since John C Reilly is in Guardians 1 but then I remembered Bradley Cooper.

Now, I’m curious which one has the most Oscar nominees. 

[Anduin]

55 minutes ago, Dani said:

I was going to say maybe Guardians 2 since John C Reilly is in Guardians 1 but then I remembered Bradley Cooper.

Now, I’m curious which one has the most Oscar nominees. 

It would have to be Endgame, because nearly everyone is in that one.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Anduin said:

It would have to be Endgame, because nearly everyone is in that one.

Very true. Let me rephrase that. I am curious which non-Avenger movie. has the most Oscar nominees. 

[Chyromaniac]

At a certain point, I kind of understand Dorff’s frustration - between Blade being announced, and just being an actor in general, who knows how many times he’s gotten some variation of “so who’d you wanna play in the MCU?” from hack entertainment reporters (not saying that’s the case this time, but it adds up).  Still, there are ways to deal with it where you don’t come off as pretentious, or jealous, or whatever.  And you really don’t need to be calling out other (more successful) professionals when you do.

[tv echo]

Part 1 of a two-part interview with Kevin Feige (recently conducted by Rotten Tomatoes)...

Kevin Feige Breaks Down the MCU’s Phase 4 – Part 1: ‘WandaVision,’ ‘Falcon,’ ‘Loki' & ‘Black Widow’
Rotten Tomatoes   Jul 8, 2021

Quote

In 2018, in the lead-up to the release of ‘Avengers: Infinity War,’ Rotten Tomatoes sat down for an extended interview with Marvel Studios president Kevin Feige, in which he gave us a complete oral history of the Marvel Cinematic Universe’s first three phases. This week, as Marvel gets ready to release, ‘Black Widow,’ its first film into theaters in more than two years – the last being the Phase Three-capping ‘Spider-Man: Far From Home’ – Feige again sat down with us for an exclusive extended chat, this time to reflect on the end of the Infinity Saga, the studio’s move into streaming limited series, and to preview some of the most anticipated titles coming up in a jam-packed Phase Four, from Chloé Zhao’s ‘Eternals’ to ‘Black Panther: Wakanda Forever.’ In this first instalment of our interview, Feige reflects on an ‘Endgame’ moment that still gives him (and us) chills, how Marvel Studios chooses which characters get limited series and which get films, the phenomenon of “Agatha All Along,” the choice to explore Sam’s struggles with the idea of being Captain America, and Scarlett Johansson’s journey from ‘Iron Man 2’ to ‘Black Widow.’ Plus, for the first time, Feige weighs in on the importance of LGBTQ+ representation in the MCU following the reveal that Loki is bisexual. Check the Rotten Tomatoes channel next week for Part 2 of Feige’s Phase Four breakdown.

Feature Film or Disney+ Series
-- Kevin Feige: "A lot of choosing what characters, what stories, go - uh, become a feature film first, what becomes a Disney+ series - it's still frankly early days for that. So we're still having those discussions. What you see now in Phase 4 is still the culmination of work five or six years - in the case of Shang-Chi, ten or fifteen years in the past. So we have been working towards a Shang-Chi movie for many, many years. Towards a Black Widow movie, as everybody knows, for many, many, years. So those were always set on as films, of what we wanted them to be. When Bob Iger told us about Disney+ and about, um, his desire for us to - to - to produce shows for Disney+, it gave us a new avenues, frankly, to do something we hadn't been considering before, which was, really doing a deep dive on characters who deserve a deep dive, but hadn't, um, had the chance yet. You know, we - it took us four or five films to tell even a tiny story of Wanda Maximoff and the Vision. Same thing with Sam Wilson and Bucky Barnes. It's a testament to those characters and particularly to those actors that the audience fell in love with them in what really amounted to a relatively short amount of screen time, uh, in a handful of films. But we knew they were being underutilized, um, both the characters and the actors, and we really wanted to have a showcase to, uh - to - to show off how amazing those characters are and how amazing those actors are. And certainly Tom Hiddleston as Loki as well. And also to - to do it in a way - in a new medium. And do it in a way that - that we couldn't - couldn't be done in, uh, a feature film."

Iron Man
-- Kevin Feige: "If [Iron Man 1] hadn't worked, it would have been our first and last movie that Marvel Studios made. And when the choice of Robert Downey Jr. came up, it really felt make-or-break. It really felt, we have nothing to lose because we're not a studio yet anyway. And if we only have one chance to do it, we want to do it right. And even though he hadn't been a marquee star before, he was an incredible, incredible actor and we were very lucky that he wanted to do it. So every decision since then has kind of been treated the same, of how do we swing for the fences? How do we do something unique? How do we - as I said earlier, um, meet or exceed expectations? But oftentimes that's by subverting those expectations and, selfishly, keeping ourselves entertained."

Unique Voices
-- Kevin Feige: "With Guardians of the Galaxy and Doctor Strange and Shane Black's Iron Man 3 and Taika Waititi's Thor: Ragnorak, uh, we've always tried to bring in new, unique voices - and Ryan Coogler's Black Panther - it goes on and on. With the Disney+ series, we've been able to do that but within a new medium. So suddenly, instead of just riffing off of, um, cinematic genres, we could go into the specifics of - of TV. Procedurals, like Loki is a bit of an homage to, and certainly and most clearly with WandaVision, in the sitcom, uh, in the sitcom tropes."

WandaVision
-- Kevin Feige: "Kathryn Hahn has been a phenomenon long before WandaVision and we were all fans of hers at, uh, at Marvel Studios. And she had come in for a general meeting, coincidentally right around the time we were trying to cast Agnes-slash-Agatha. And it was one of those, you know, 'why didn't we think of this before' that - 'oh, we met with Kathryn Hahn today, she was great.' Louis D'Esposito actually sat down and had a general with her, and it very quickly went from that, 'She's great, what could she do for us someday? Anyway, who's going to play Agatha? We really to to cast this part.' Wait a second. It was - it was, honestly, almost exactly like that. Seeing audiences respond for characters - that the characters they were not expecting, or that they were not asking for. I wouldn't say there was a huge contingency of people banging down the door for Agatha Harkness to appear in the MCU. But she's a great character, portrayed by great actress. And by the first few episodes, people are asking, where is she going to show up again? What else is she going to do? I think the same thing's happening right now with John Walker from the Falcon and the Winter Soldier series, and certainly with Mobius M. Mobius, as portrayed by Owen Wilson in the Loki series. So that is something that is so important to the MCU, is including new characters. The comic is filled with many lifetimes of spectacular characters. Uh, and when you find the best actors to portray them, uh, it can quickly go from - from an audience never hearing of a character to them upset with us that we haven't already announced their own standalone movie. And that makes us all very happy."

Supernatural Sorcery
-- Kevin Feige: "The supernatural sorcery with Doctor Strange, which you saw, not only in his movie, but in Infinity War and Endgame, um, and - and explaining the powers we'd seen, uh, Wanda have throughout the movies, now having this connection to witchcraft and - and magic, um, again right from the Marvel comics - it's always been there - uh, it's fun to be able to figure out a way to - to bring more of that into the MCU."

The Falcon and the Winter Soldier
-- Kevin Feige: "Of primary importance was allowing Anthony Mackie to, um, to show the full range of what Anthony Mackie can do. Such an amazing, amazing actor. And same thing with Sebastian Stan as, uh, as Bucky Barnes. But when Old Man Steve Rogers handed the shield to Sam Wilson at the end of Endgame, you could see the complexity in Anthony's performance there. Old Man Cap says, 'How does it feel?' And Sam says, 'Like it belongs to somebody else.' And Old Man Steve says, you know, 'It doesn't. It's yours.' And that it wouldn't be that simple - it wouldn't be that simple for anyone to step into those shoes, um, that Steve Rogers had worn, but particularly for Sam Wilson wearing the red, white and blue in America would be - would be complex. And - and that is what we were interested in exploring, that's what Anthony was interested in exploring, um, our fellow producers, Zoe and Nate Moore, uh, and - and thankfully when Malcom Spellman, our head writer, came on, is really when all of that, um, turned into the series that you saw. Um, a series that he had written with his - with his, uh, writing staff, um, before the pandemic. We started shooting that before lockdown, so in 2019. ... Some people have asked, um, 'Were you surprised that it became even more relevant after 2020, what we've gone through?' And certainly what Malcom says is, well, it was relevant in 2019 as well. It's been relevant for hundreds of years, which is exactly correct. And figuring out a way to both wear the red, white and blue with pride and acknowledge the past at the same time seemed like a, uh, interesting needle to thread and one that we needed a filmmaker like Kari Skoagland and writer like Malcolm Spellman and his team to pull off."

Loki
-- Kevin Feige: "Well, you know, I think everything we do, um, I hope, are building blocks towards the bigger - the bigger MCU, while also just being entertainment - entertaining pieces of art in and of themselves. The Loki series, um, explores an organization that - that we've been obsessed with, uh, for years at Marvel Studios, from - from the comics, called the Time Variance Authority. And honestly, 15, 20 years ago, going, 'This is a great idea. I wonder if we could ever do something with this?' And honestly, thinking it was a pipe dream that would never - would never come to fruition. Avengers was a pipe dream, uh, 20 years ago. And now that we have this series that, uh, that our producer Kevin Wright and - and our director Kate Herron and our head writer Michael Waldron, uh, and executive producer Steve Broussard, have - have taken the TVA conceit we loved so much and turned it into an entirely different way of looking at the MCU and looking at the timeline of the MCU and, yes, the potential of alternate realities that we've heard whispers of from the Ancient One and from other characters in a few of our movies. But actually being able to explore it and try to understand it in a - again, rather subversive way - in a bureau - in a very bureaucratic organization that may or may not be telling the truth about the way things work. ... The title character also being someone who you shouldn't necessarily take at face value and is perhaps the most famous, uh, trickster or God of Mischief that there is."

-- Kevin Feige: "Tom [Hiddleston] is as great an actor as they come. He's as charismatic a person as there is. But he also honestly loves that he's been given this chance and that, from the moment we hired him with Ken Branagh on the first Thor film to the response that episode 3 got the other - the other week when it debuted on Disney+, Tom is just as enthusiastic, from that first call to each episode of Loki coming out. And that is so important, I think. All of us at Marvel Studios, um, try to maintain that enthusiasm and acknowledgment and humility of how lucky we are to be in this position. And Tom can take that with his immense amount of talent and really rally a crew behind him as well, which is what he did on that show."

-- Kevin Feige: "So one of the other things that's - that personally is so exciting about continuing a franchise for this long is getting to evolve, um, your relationship with the cast. Tom [Hiddleson] started as a - as an actor that Ken Branagh knew, who, as people may know, famously auditioned, not for Loki, but for Thor. Then, you know, felt very thankful to get this job as Loki. I now find myself thankful that he said, yes, and that he is an executive producer on this Loki series and is helping us make this series what it is. So - so relationships evolving, um, over the years is one of the great pleasures of working with spectacular talents like that... And that's true on - on films like Black Widow, that Scarlett Johansson was a producer on with us as well and, uh, all of the Disney+ series."

LGBTQ Representation
-- Kevin Feige: "Representation is important across the board, and the comics charted, um, you know, charts the path in almost all ways for what we do in the MCU. And in the comics there are many LGBTQ characters, and we want to showcase that on the screen as well. We want to bring those characters to life on the screen. We also, as Stan Lee used to say, 'Marvel represents the world outside your window.' And outside of our window, there are, um, all different types of people, in all different types of places, with all different types of preferences. And we want that reflected in the MCU and in our - in our fictional world, as it is in our real world. So it is of utmost importance that when people go in and see one or our films, or log on to Disney+ and watch one of our series, that it represents the true world outside their window when it comes to the - the - to the types of people portraying the heroes and the characters."

Black Widow
-- Kevin Feige: "Scarlett Johansson is just the perfect representation of - of an amazing, amazing actor lending their talents to our stories for a decade. That is an amazing privilege and one that we don't - that we don't ever take for granted... She was nominated for two Academy Awards in one year a few years ago. She is spectacular and could do whatever she wants. That she chooses, um, to continue to work and to bring Natasha Romanoff to life is a - is a testament, I think, to the character of Natasha and how rich she is in the comics and how much more there was to explore, and a testament to Scarlett, who likes bringing these complex characters to life. So it really is kind of the - a perfect representation of - of when you find a perfect actor willing to dedicate their talents to an amazing character from publishing that you can go - you can go 10 years on and be on the verge of their first standalone movie and, thankfully, our first movie in a theater in almost two years... I just can't wait for people to see in a, uh, in a theater - or Disney+, if they want - but to get out there and see what Scarlett and the entire team has done."

-- Kevin Feige: "Florence [Pugh] is amazing and came in and won the part of Yelena. Yelena is a character that's been in the comics for many years now and a character that we'd wanted to bring to the screen for quite a while. Uh, soon after we cast her, I think, she was nominated for Little Women, which was amazing. And again, like Scarlett, being able to traverse these worlds of ... you know, classic literature like Little Women and moving over to what we consider classic literature of, uh, of the Marvel comics, and do both with equal importance and with equal pouring of their heart and soul into it. ... Florence did that tremendously well and, like some of the other characters we've talked about today, yes, the very first question that often comes out of people seeing Black Widow for the first time is, 'when will Florence Pugh show up again in the MCU?' And my answer to that is - is always, 'not soon enough,' because she's amazing."

-- Kevin Feige: "Another testament to Scarlett, um, who - who knew exactly the movie that we were making, who was a part of the development of the movie, to make that film an ensemble and to surround herself with new - with new characters portrayed by new actors entering the MCU, and allowing them all to shine, and knowing that lifting them up lifts up the whole movie, which is what a smart producer does, which Scarlett is. Um, so it is great. So every compliment that Florence or David or Rachel or O.T. get on the movie, um, I also turn back to Scarlett for being, uh, for being so smart to - to, um, allow the film to be - to be a showcase for multiple characters, which is what the best of our films can do."

Edited July 12, 2021 by tv echo

[HunterHunted]

16 hours ago, Dani said:

Also Daniel Kaluuya, Ben Kingsley, Rachel McAdams, Tommy Lee Jones, Forest Whitaker Josh Brolin, Annette Benning, Jude Law and Marisa Tomei. I’m sure there are still quite a few missing. I once saw a complete list from a few years ago and the most surprising one was that the diner owner in Thor is an Oscar nominee. 

And Jeff Bridges in Iron Man. Gah! I knew I was missing a ton of names.

[Kel Varnsen]

On 7/10/2021 at 6:09 PM, HunterHunted said:

Feige has also been very vocal about how important Wesley Snipes and Blade were for Marvel and the development of the MCU.

I hadn't heard that before so that is good to hear. I saw Blade in theaters and for a long time it was my favourite super hero movie. And for years I have thought that if it wasn't a success that comic book movies would look a lot different. Because a lot of things that Blade did well, X-Men did 2 years later. And the success of X-men changed the movie business.

Plus even today a lot of stuff that Blade did, like getting a big name star and making a movie about a lesser known hero, are things Marvel built their studio on.

[VCRTracking]

 

I knew Hayley Atwell was going to be in the upcoming Mission:Impossible but not Pom Klementief too.

Edited July 12, 2021 by VCRTracking

[Avabelle]

Ah Hayley - Peggy is one of my favourite female characters in marvel and i always thought it was a shame her show came out before the Marvel disney tv rollout began. 

I’ve heard rumours about Atwell and Cruise but it’s probably because they’re filming a movie together. 

Is it a UO to say that I am really struggling with Falcon and Winter soldier? I love both the actors, Bucky was always a favourite of mine and expected to love this but so far I’m just bored. The story isn’t really drawing me in. I’m only 3 episodes in and already watched Black Widow but don’t want to start Loki until I’m finished. It’s just so meh and while I like some of the odd couple humour, a lot of it doesn’t land for me. There’s just something missing. Does it get better? 

[tv echo]

Posting here because Scarlett Johansson talks about getting cast in Iron Man 2, learning that her character would die, and how her final scene in Avengers: Endgame was completely changed (there's deleted footage)...

"It's been an incredible decade!" Scarlett Johansson on the life (and death) of Black Widow.
BBC Radio 1   Jul 9, 2021

-- On getting the role of Natasha/Black Widow, Scarlett Johansson: "I met with Jon Favreau when he was casting Iron Man 2 and we had a really great meeting. He's wonderful, and I was a big fan of the first Iron Man. And I wanted to work with Jon and Robert. And then I did not get the role and I was, you know, was pretty bummed about that, uh, happens all the time. ... Several weeks later, the actor that was cast in the role originally was not able to do it because of a scheduling conflict.* And so Jon called me and we met again and I said, 'yes, I'm extremely available still.' ... If anybody ever asked me about what advice I would have for other actors that are trying to make it, I say, every opportunity is an opportunity to work, and you'll never get a better call than when you thought you lost a job and then you got it! ... I was so excited to have like a second chance at it. It's been an incredible decade of time. I never - at that point, could never have imagined how life-changing how all of this would be. I don't think any of us did... I mean, obviously, Jon and Robert had a sense of that, but as we collected other Avengers along the way, nobody could have foreseen - other than Kevin Feige probably - what potential this whole universe had, this whole cinematic universe had. And, uh, it's been rewarding in so many ways."

(* According to this media report, Emily Blunt was originally cast to play Black Widow in Iron Man 2. However, she had a scheduling conflict with Jack Black's Gulliver's Travels. Apparently, a similar complication kept Emily Blunt from playing Peggy Carter in Captain America: The First Avenger.)

-- On what she likes best about Natasha Romanoff, SJ: "I think the character has a lot of integrity. You know, she's not afraid to admit she's wrong about something... She works very well in a team, but she also has leadership qualities... She really doesn't have an ego that gets in the way of her decision-making and she's pragmatic... I think it's unexpected. I don't know that I'd describe her as humble, exactly... She's a cockiness to her, but she doesn't have this kind of flawed ego, I think, that sometimes a character that has that power can sometimes feel that way... She's not pretentious at all. I like that about her."

-- On finally releasing her own solo film and what she wants to say with it, SJ: "This film was a different experience for me because I produced the film and so was able to carve it out of nothing, really... We had a decade of back story and experience and all of that, but because the character's really in a place we've never seen her before, which is, without any sort of team or organization around her, and she's alone for the first time in her life, really. And because we didn't have the burden - what can sometimes feel like a burden - of having to hand off another storyline or wrap something up or answer a whole bunch of questions - we didn't have any of that, which is daunting, I wanted it to feel like there was some sort of closure for audiences... And I wanted it to feel different, also, than all of the other films in the MCU. I wanted it to look different and stand on its own... And I think we accomplish those things with this... I really feel that way about it. So it's wonderful for it to be finally coming out. And I also feel like this is the right time for it to come out... I don't think we could've made these kinds of decisions 10 years ago. And so it feels all like it's supposed to happen this way."

-- On learning that Natasha would die in Avengers: Endgame, SJ: “I think we all knew there were going to be some pretty big losses in the Infinity War to Endgame. None of us thought we would all be spared. And none of us felt like that would be fair either. There had to be some sacrifices. So I wasn't surprised when I got the call... Kevin Feige called me, our boss at Marvel. I think he was nervous to tell me and sad about it, saying something along the lines of, you know, we all expected that, you know, there would have to be - like I said - some big sacrifices... It didn’t surprise me that that was a choice that Nat would have made... I knew that she had to feel at peace with that decision and that she was doing it out of love. Love for - really for a friend. It had to feel like her - like she was resolved in that decision and that the decision was hers. And it wasn’t something that was happening to her, because all - so much of her life has happened to her."

-- On the deleted Endgame scene with Natasha and Clint on Vormir, SJ: "Shooting that scene... We actually shot it a couple of different times... I wonder actually if out there exists the longer version of the scene, because the first - how it was scripted originally was that Thanos' army, um, kind of comes - eventually finds us at Vormir and is like - launches this huge attack on the two of us, and basically we are like fighting to get to the edge to make that ultimate sacrifice, while also trying to survive long enough to get there.** And then I got a call from the Russos, and they said... we feel we need something like immediate. The stakes are so high and then it just kind of immediately happens and it feels like that will be a better, more, yeah, impactful experience for the audience, and I thought so, too. And so we went back and we shot that scene and really made it about the - that end moment between Nat and Clint - just the rush of it. It was tough. I mean, it was emotionally really upsetting, but also very powerful. Jeremy Renner, who I think is one of the finest actors around, to be able to share that moment with him made it all the more powerful and poignant and really a highlight of my career. It felt like something happening... and I think the scene is iconic because of that. ... So special, so special. And, of course, it's hard to accept it was the final moment for the character, but it makes sense, I think."

(** In this video at this point, brief footage from that deleted scene is shown while SJ continues to talk in voiceover.)

Edited July 12, 2021 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Part 2 of Rotten Tomatoes interview with Kevin Feige (Part 1 video was previously posted above)...

Kevin Feige on MCU’s Phase 4 – Part 2: Shang-Chi, Eternals, Black Panther: Wakanda Forever & More
Rotten Tomatoes   Jul 12, 2021

Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings
-- Kevin Feige: "Shang-Chi, as I'd said, is a movie that, I think, first ended up on a list of 'wouldn't-it-be-great-if ' list, uh, wouldn't it be great if we could do this as a movie, probably 20 years ago, because it's a great story of a, uh, of a young man that - that realizes his father is, um, is essentially one of the world's greatest, um, supervillains, one of the world's greatest criminals. And how do you process that and how do you deal with that as a child? And how do you evolve beyond that? And the heroism needed to, uh, to break free of that and grow beyond that. And, even in our film, to - to realize that there are many sides to all stories, and the world's perception of his father and his perception of his father, um, is more complex than perhaps he initially - he initially thought. That was a great driving story for us that we wanted to - to explore someday. Looking for a filmmaker to - to do it, um, was obviously, as it always is important, and Destin Cretton coming in and, again, dedicating his talents - he's an amazing filmmaker who does amazing movies that have been, um, on the smaller budgeted size compared to a big Marvel movie - but coming in and giving his personal vision to this story of this father and son, and really this family, was very special. And then how we could find somebody to play Shang-Chi was his biggest question when he signed up as, uh, as director. Our producer Jonathan Schwartz and, uh, casting director Sarah Finn looked at hundreds of people, and Simu [Liu] came up relatively late in the process, when you just start to get to that point of maybe it's not going to happen. Because what you want it everybody in your inner circle - the producers, the filmmakers - to see somebody and go - look at each other and go, we found this person, this is the one. We hadn't had that on Shang-Chi, uh, at this point. And Simu came in and Sarah Finn had seen him before and brought him in again and he did great. He did a great reading with Destin. He then did a great chemistry read with, uh, with Awkwafina, who's gracious enough to do that. And, I will say, he - you know, a little bit was, who is this fellow? Let's look him up. That's what you do nowadays. You look up, who is this guy? And he did have... an infectious personality online, in the way he interacted with the world and with fandom of his show that he was doing in Canada at the time - and with a sports team that he was a fan of that was doing well, when I happened to search him. So he's kind of the real deal. And, uh, brrnging a new Marvel hero into the fold is never easy and always there's a lot of pressure on us and, I'm sure, on the actors. But Simu has, uh, has pulled it off in ways that, again, I'm very excited for audiences to finally, uh, see in September."

-- Kevin Feige: "Well, that's what's fun about the MCU at this stage is we can do something like Shang-Chi, introducing a brand new hero into the MCU and into the - into the world at large. But that subtitle, 'and the Legend of the Ten Rings,' actually connects it back to the very beginning of the MCU, the Ten Rings being the organization that kidnapped Tony Stark at the very beginning of Iron Man 1, and that organization was inspired by a character called the Mandarin in the comics. And going back to Iron Man 1, we've been talking about when do we - when do we bring this character to the screen? And we only wanted to do it when we felt we could do it supreme justice and really - and really showcase, uh, the complexity of this character, which, frankly, we couldn't do in an Iron Man movie because an Iron Man movie is about Iron Man. An Iron Man movie is about Tony Stark. So Shane Black, in his film and his script that he co-wrote, came up with this fun twist that we love to this day, and it turned out to be Trevor Slattery. Just because that version wasn't real didn't mean there's not a leader of the Ten Rings organization. And that is who we meet for the first time in Shang-Chi. And - and, again, talking about actors making - making these characters come to life, Tony Leung playing Shang-Chi's father and the leader of the Ten Rings is another pinch-yourself-dream-come-true moment, because he's one of the best actors of our time and very excited to, I hope, a whole new fan base, uh, who might not be aware of his spectacular work that he's done."

-- Kevin Feige: "We just recently released that final trailer for Shang-Chi, the end of which had a character that looked very - some fans said, this looks like a character they hadn't seen in many years named the Abomination fighting a character that looks like Wong. And I can say, um, that the reason it looks like that is because that is Abomination fighting Wong, yes... Again, a fun thing to have a character that - that we haven't had on screen in over a decade, um, show up, uh, again in the MCU. And to see fans in that little tag of the trailer, um, recognize that and embrace that, uh, is great fun."

Eternals and Chloe Zhao
-- Kevin Feige: "Chloe [Zhao] had expressed interest in Marvel many years ago. Even when Brad Winderbaum, our producer on Black Widow, was looking for a filmmaker, her name came up. She'd done a great film called The Rider... She ended up not - not coming in on that film, I don't believe, and we're very lucky to get, uh, Cate Shortland to direct that movie at Scarlett's suggestion. But when - when we were working on Eternals and our producer Nate Moore was coming up with this pitch to really embrace one of Jack Kirby's greatest creations for Marvel, um, amongst all of his great creations, but the Eternals, this race of immortal beings who've been on Earth for millennial is one of his best, and he asked Chloe to come in and meet. And they really just clicked on this notion of a history of humanity and what it means to be human and the viewpoint of that through these characters, the Eternals. And she came in with a pitch that got into visuals, which was - which was beautiful, but more importantly into these characters. These are 10 new characters [introduced] into the - into the world, which is a very difficult thing to do, and she embraced that challenge and had a unique viewpoint for every single one of them. And I'm happy to say, from that initial pitch and meeting to the near final version of the film where we are now, um, she has both won a handful of Academy Awards in between and delivered on her promise of, uh, of what the Eternals could be. And I look forward to people seeing that one as well."

MCU Hope
-- Kevin Feige: "It was always our hope to pull off even a little bit, uh, in a cinematic form what publishing had been able to do in the comics for, uh, for 70 plus years. ... It is being able to do the world outside your window on a very personal, emotional level and come at it from a viewpoint that hopefully makes us - makes you think about your place in the grander scheme of reality in the universe. ... It's bringing the human imagination to life on a personal level and a cosmic level that makes Marvel, I think, what it is."

Disney-Sony Standoff Over Spider-Man
-- Kevin Feige: "There was a time when it looked like Marvel Studios would not be involved in Spider-Man movies going forward for Sony. Um, it was only a few months, but it was - it was, uh, an emotional few months for, I think, all of us on all sides, and a very public few months for whatever reason... But, yes, I had thought, if it were going - I always want to look at the bright side, and the bright side was, we got to make two great Spider-Man movies with Amy Pascal and Jon Watts and Tom Rothman and Tom Holland, uh, and I was very proud of that and very happy with that. Of course, I wanted it to continue, um, but - but I always want to be happy with what we have instead of upset with what we don't. Luckily, um, Tom Rothman and Bob Iger and Alan Horn and Alan Bergman and Tom Holland himself, um, all realized, wouldn't it just be more fun if we just kept doing it? Let's not let - let's not get business or politics in the way. Because the deal always started with Amy Pascal and I having nothing to do with numbers or contracts or, um, politics. It had to do with story and a love of Spider-Man and Peter Parker and the Marvel Universe. And it effectively has continued like that, uh, and that's - and that's where we find ourselves now."

Venom 
-- On whether Venom will ever join the MCU, Kevin Feige: "I don't want to talk about rumors or speculation about what could happen or what couldn't happen as it relates to any characters that Marvel Studios hasn't brought to the screen yet. But I will say what I've always said, which is, having been in Marvel for 20 years, I wouldn't dismiss anything. I wouldn't rule anything out. When and how and where remains to be seen. It could be - it could be - you know, any rumor that you read online could happen, uh, any time between tomorrow and never."

Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness and Sam Raimi
-- Kevin Feige: "You know, I spoke earlier about, everything we do in Marvel Studios is from the point of view of the audience and how do we make the audience feel one way and how do we evoke an emotion out of an audience. I really feel like I learned that from watching Sam [Raimi] on the Spider-Man movies, where I was just very lucky to be there, working for the former head of Marvel Studios, Avi Arad, and just watching - watching Avi, watching, uh, Laura Ziskin, the producer of that, watching Amy Pascal, who ran the studio at the time, and particularly Sam Raimi put that - those movies together. So now, being in a position that Sam is back in the Marvel Universe and - and working for us on Doctor Strange, which, aside from Spider-Man, both Steve Ditko co-creations, um, was his favorite characters, is really quite - quite remarkable and full circle for me personally from my journey at Marvel... But really it's just exciting to get to watch Sam work again and to see Sam Raimi put his Sam Raimi stamp on Doctor Strange, on the Multiverse, on Marvel. And, for people who know what that stamp is, um, they can be very excited. And for people who don't yet know what that stamp is, I can't wait for them to see this movie, be blown away by it and go, 'what else has he done?' and delve into Sam Raimi's filmography, which is, uh, which is one of the best of all time."

Black Panther: Wakanda Forever and Chadwick Boseman
-- Kevin Feige: "Yes, the death of Chad hit all of us, um, extremely hard and at the same time as it hit the world, because we didn't - we didn't know either. And there were all sorts of questions and - and our first thought for many weeks afterwards had nothing to do with the movie. It had to do with him and his - and his family and his wife and his legacy... And really we were looking to Ryan Coogler for guidance, as one, frankly, always should about almost everything in life, I'd recommend following Ryan Coogler for guidance. Um, and - and having discussions, which essentially came down to continuing, um, the legacy of Wakanda and continuing, um, with - with that storyline in a very, um, meaningful, respectful and yet still hopeful and fun and exciting way, which was - which was difficult, um, uh, after - after - after, uh, losing Chad. And I will say that Ryan and our producer Nate Moore and the entire cast and our co-writer Joe Robert Cole, um, have done some remarkable things in the story in the draft. And - and the - the team is assembling once again and - and cameras roll in the not too distant future on that. And it will be extremely emotional across the board. But I think they have something, um, very special in mind."

Phase 4
-- Kevin Feige: "You know, the definition of 'phases' often evolve with the phase and often I leave it up to writers and journalists to decide. That's for the film historians to tell us what the Phases were about. Truthfully, it is - Phase 4 was always about continuing in new ways and new beginnings... Even, uh, you know, with - with, uh, films that, uh, that seemingly are concluding story lines, there are - there are new beginnings within them. And that's what was most exciting to us about the opportunity to - to make shows for Disney Plus - about all of us at Marvel Studios choosing to continue, um, past Endgame and past Far From Home once and leaving the Infinity Saga behind to a new beginning. And, uh, that, I think, is what people will be looking at, uh, at Phase 4, uh, I hope, as having accomplished. But we're in the middle of it now. So it remains to be seen. We don't take our foot off the gas. We don't take anything for granted. And we all work extremely hard to, uh, to deliver."

Edited July 13, 2021 by tv echo

[FnkyChkn34]

On 7/12/2021 at 7:56 AM, Avabelle said:

Is it a UO to say that I am really struggling with Falcon and Winter soldier? I love both the actors, Bucky was always a favourite of mine and expected to love this but so far I’m just bored. The story isn’t really drawing me in. I’m only 3 episodes in and already watched Black Widow but don’t want to start Loki until I’m finished. It’s just so meh and while I like some of the odd couple humour, a lot of it doesn’t land for me. There’s just something missing. Does it get better? 

IMO, it gets better.  I don't remember how many episodes it takes, but the action picks up.  The villain is never super strong, and it's a strange story, but I still liked it.  For me, Loki is the boring show.  But, everyone is different!  

[scarynikki12]

I've seen the movie a couple of times now and I'm tentatively hopeful that Ross will eventually get his. I think this is similar to the Hulk in that it's being told over several movies instead of just one or a trilogy which is why we're getting little pieces at a time. In Black Widow Natasha uses the same phrasing when talking to Ross at the beginning and when talking to Dreykov during the interrogation. This directly links them as villains which I really appreciate.

I'm feeling more optimistic that he'll get his comeuppance eventually.

[Spartan Girl]

1 hour ago, scarynikki12 said:

I've seen the movie a couple of times now and I'm tentatively hopeful that Ross will eventually get his. I think this is similar to the Hulk in that it's being told over several movies instead of just one or a trilogy which is why we're getting little pieces at a time. In Black Widow Natasha uses the same phrasing when talking to Ross at the beginning and when talking to Dreykov during the interrogation. This directly links them as villains which I really appreciate.

I'm feeling more optimistic that he'll get his comeuppance eventually.

There’s always the chance that Valentina and Sharon are working together and will take him out when the time is right so they can be the big power. Wouldn’t quite make up for the MCU’s lazy writing with Sharon, but it would be something I’d be happy to watch over and over again.

[anna0852]

WandaVision scored Emmy nods for both Paul and Elizabeth!

[Guest]

Plus nominations for Limited Series, Kathryn Hahn, costuming, special effects and more. It got the second most nominations behind Mandalorian and The Crown who were tied at 24. 
The Falcoln and the Winter Soldier also got 5 nominations including one for Don Cheadle’s guest appearance.

Edited July 13, 2021 by Guest

[AimingforYoko]

Deadpool's first appearance in the MCU (flacking for Free Guy):

 

[JustHereForFood]

2 hours ago, AimingforYoko said:

Deadpool's first appearance in the MCU (flacking for Free Guy):

 

Well, it did serve its purpose at least a bit, I haven't cared enough to watch a trailer to that movie before, but now I'm interested.

[swanpride]

...What is this? A live action version of Wreck if Ralph? 

[Cobalt Stargazer]

"Poser."

[tv echo]

 

[swanpride]

Not bad, but honestly, I don't think too highly of the Emmys anyway. They are mostly an advertising tool anyway. 

[tv echo]

In this recent D23 podcast interview with Kevin Feige, he teased that Valentina Allegra de Fontaine will be showing up in future MCU projects. He also talked about how they coordinate the interconnected feature films and streaming series. He also talked about the Multiverse coming up "in a big way" in the MCU...

D23 Inside Disney Episode 96 | Kevin Feige on Black Widow
JULY 15, 2021
https://d23.com/podcast/d23-inside-disney-episode-96/ 

-- When asked about Valentina Allegra de Fontaine's apparent efforts to build a team, Kevin Feige: "She's doing something. Yes, she is. She seems - she's in a recruitment mode. Do they - does Yelena already work for her? They seem to have a connection at that point. Yes. And the future is bright for the MCU because Julia is in it. We are gigantic fans of her at Marvel. We had a general meeting with her many years ago where Louis D'Esposito and I really just geeked out that we were even meeting her, because she's such an icon and we're very big Seinfeld nerds at Marvel Studios. So the notion of bringing her into the world was always something - if we could find the right thing, was something we wanted to to. And when this role came about and the opportunity to have her in Widow, in Falcon, and maybe in some other things coming up, she was totally on board and really into it. So it's an amazing addition to the world and I look forward to people being surprised at just where she'll show up next."

-- When asked about coordinating the movies and Disney+ series, Kevin said that they have a team and that "one person is totally dedicated, full-time, to each project,"* and they also have "interconnect meetings" quite often. Also, he, Louis D'Esposito and Victoria Alonso "bounce between all of those." Sometimes something will come up and they'll need to change something, "but never to the detriment of the individual projects."

(* I would love to have one of those jobs, where my sole task was to make sure that my assigned series or film lined up with the rest of the MCU.)

-- Kevin Feige: "The Multiverse is coming up in a big way, so there's interconnectivity there that people have already started to see and suss out. And I had a meeting this morning with the whole broad Marvel Studios team, going through the Multiverse and the rules of the Multiverse, and exactly how to really deliver on the excitement surrounding the Multiverse. Because, like so much with Marvel, that is a topic - when we first had Sam Jackson appear in a cameo at the end of Iron Man, I really thought it would be a small group - relatively small group of people that were excited by that, and we'd have to then educate a broader public about what that meant and who Nick Fury was. But almost instantly, if you remember, way back to the Summer of 2008, it ignited really everyone's imagination. And in the same way, the Multiverse is really something that we geek out about and really love all the storytelling potential it brings, but thought we really had to slowly dole out what it was, in introducing the conceit, even briefly in Doctor Strange, and then as a fake-out in Spider-Man: Far From Home. But I will tell you something, it is more than just fans who are following along with the Multiverse storyline. It's really quite exciting to see it, even midway through the Loki series now, as people respond to the possibilities."

Related article:
Marvel Studios Just Held a Big Meeting About Multiverse Rules In the MCU
By Pierre Chanliau Posted: July 15, 2021
https://thedirect.com/article/marvel-studios-multiverse-mcu-rules-meeting

Edited July 16, 2021 by tv echo

[Morrigan2575]

I was watching the post credits clip from Black Widow and, it reminded me of the Phase 1 MCU post credit clips.

Spoiler bar to be safe

 

I know people have been talking about Young Avengers but, I don't see any setup in the shows/movies for that...other than the characters. What I do see is MCU setting up an Avengers type team with Val in the Fury role. So far we got US Agent and Black Widow 2.0. I'm guessing Hawkeye will be next.  So it looks like we are getting Thunderbolts (which many speculated after Falcon and Winter Soldier) as the next team...or maybe the D+ team while movies focus on the New Avengers...although I have no idea who will end up on that roster?

Edited July 16, 2021 by Morrigan2575

[tv echo]

Disney+ Reveals New MCU Timeline Order, Including Loki's Surprising Spot
By Richard Nebens    July 16, 2021
https://thedirect.com/article/mcu-marvel-cinematic-universe-timeline-order-disney-plus-loki 

Quote

Both WandaVision and The Falcon and the Winter Soldier definitively took place after the events of Avengers: Endgame, with the former coming in three weeks later and the latter starting six months later; both also were confirmed to come before Spider-Man: Far From Home chronologically.

While the specifics are unclear, Scarlett Johansson’s Black Widow was firmly placed after Captain America: Civil War, just as rumors had mentioned for the past 18 months. Additionally, Loki found its home in the aftermath of Avengers: Endgame, spinning off directly from the time heist in that film after 2012 Loki stole the Tesseract.

Now, to help clear things up even further, Disney+ has given fans a firm picture of how the MCU timeline is supposed to look.
*  *  *
The Disney+ home page recently updated the Marvel Cinematic Universe Timeline Order after the premieres for Black Widow and Loki. The current ordering of the projects can be viewed below:
*  *  *
Black Widow takes place directly after 2016’s Captain America: Civil War and before the events of 2018’s Black Panther. On the Disney+ side, Loki is dropped immediately after 2019's Avengers: Endgame and before 2021's WandaVision.
*  *  *
**Note: The Incredible Hulk (Universal) and both MCU Spider-Man films (Sony) are not currently on Disney+, and are thus omitted from the graphic.

 

Edited July 17, 2021 by tv echo

[Brn2bwild]

That makes me wonder if, in fact, Evan Peters's Pietro was a variant Pietro, but they couldn't say so at the time or it would have given away the surprise.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

"He's green, isn't he?"

[kiddo82]

Moving forward, I'm a little leery of the use of the multiverse.  I feel like it gives Marvel a way to bow down to fan pressure and change course on the fly should the more vocal members of the internet not be too happy about something.  It could be a very slippery slope.  I know there was an article circulating about Feige having a meeting with whomever and setting forth the rules of the multiverse which is at least a good start.  But it could also end up a huge mess.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

1 hour ago, kiddo82 said:

Moving forward, I'm a little leery of the use of the multiverse.  I feel like it gives Marvel a way to bow down to fan pressure and change course on the fly should the more vocal members of the internet not be too happy about something.

If anything, it's the other way around, that we don't really want some of the stuff we've been saying we do. The complaints about Sylvie being more involved in the finale of Loki's show than Mobius was were particularly annoying, because I thought that was a desirable outcome. Or maybe we only want more female characters as long as they're not interfering with all that male bonding we're so starved for, and why does that sound so familiar?

[swanpride]

What is so surprising about the placement? Logically Loki should be set at the same time as Endgame...which 

Spoiler

might even explain why the timelines branched off so fast in the end. Assuming that the TVA jumped on cleaning up what Loki would have caused by not being around any longer, but was already off track by the time when Thanos left HIS reality and Steve decided to have fun in the past. 

 

[Morrigan2575]

2 hours ago, swanpride said:

What is so surprising about the placement? Logically Loki should be set at the same time as Endgame...which 

Shouldn't it be after the first Avengers?

Edited July 18, 2021 by Morrigan2575

[Hiyo]

Quote

I feel like it gives Marvel a way to bow down to fan pressure and change course on the fly should the more vocal members of the internet not be too happy about something.

I think it's a way to come up with replacements should the actor decide not to renew their contract and/or possibly having an actor pass away.

[VCRTracking]

At this point 13 years on its still amazing to hear fans being disappointed after a Marvel movie or show because of the plot not being completely resolved and being just a set up for the future. It's a feature not a bug. This is what happens when you have something that visually looks like a video game but really is a soap opera.

[Wynterwolf]

20 hours ago, kiddo82 said:

But it could also end up a huge mess.

I'm more seeing this as a way to correct the huge mess they created when they decided partway through phase 3 that everything was supposed to be "connected". It also frees them up to tell different stories without fans expecting everything to be connected now. And given how haphazard their creation process is (per what what has been described about how Loki was handled), they need that leeway because the left hand doesn't tell the right hand what's going on. 

[kiddo82]

I know I'm complaining about things that haven't even happened yet, and who knows if they will, but I see it as a potential gateway for lazy writing or fan service and "shocking" twists that aren't earned.  And as an out if/when it backfires.  The internet really can read my mind because this article popped up on my feed and explains my feelings better than I can.

From the article.  Spoiler tags for Loki.

Spoiler

The reveal of He Who Remains is the most egregious of all because a character we never met literally swept in and stole the agency from everything the characters have done up until that point. (Even Loki becoming a variant was apparently part of this master plan.)

The writers of the series (and those who loved this episode) would be quick to argue that this is the point. Loki is all about whether or not free will exists. So the argument would go that having a character come in and steal agency and choice was actually earned because the show can’t stop talking about the possible illusionary force of free will.

But defending the utterly convenient and circular info dump from He Who Remains on the grounds that it philosophically checks out with the rest of the series might not really be a compliment. If you take his kind of thinking too far, you can literally justify any sloppy cliché or worn-out writing trick simply because the show owns that idea.

::snip::

The struggle for individuality might be the aim of these plotlines, but the actual result is bewildering. If nothing the characters do matters — and an unexplained deus ex machina is waiting in our future — what are we even watching for?

 

Edited July 18, 2021 by kiddo82

[Kel Varnsen]

On 7/17/2021 at 4:39 PM, kiddo82 said:

Moving forward, I'm a little leery of the use of the multiverse.  I feel like it gives Marvel a way to bow down to fan pressure and change course on the fly should the more vocal members of the internet not be too happy about something.  It could be a very slippery slope.  I know there was an article circulating about Feige having a meeting with whomever and setting forth the rules of the multiverse which is at least a good start.  But it could also end up a huge mess.

It could easily become super convoluted. I mean look at any comic book universe and how those have to get reset to make it easier for the audience. But I guess that Marvel has gotten people to understand that Any Man and the Wasp took place before Infinity War, even though it was released after and that the Loki of the show is a. Alternate Loki so I guess they figure that the audience will just as easily understand infinite other universes.

[VCRTracking]

On 7/18/2021 at 9:08 PM, Kel Varnsen said:

It could easily become super convoluted. I mean look at any comic book universe and how those have to get reset to make it easier for the audience. But I guess that Marvel has gotten people to understand that Any Man and the Wasp took place before Infinity War, even though it was released after and that the Loki of the show is a. Alternate Loki so I guess they figure that the audience will just as easily understand infinite other universes.

I never bought the reason DC restarted their continuity with "Crisis of Infinite Earths" because there were too many Earths with different versions of the same character and it was too confusing for new readers. Just explain this Superman is from "Earth whatever". The real reason they did it was the original versions of their superheroes had become staid and boring in comparison to Marvel's line of characters and they wanted to revamp them to appeal to younger readers. Same reason they did the "New 52" a quarter of a century later.  The history and continuity of the Marvel comics has gotten so convoluted especially the X-Men line but they never had to do a complete overhaul and rewrite. 

[swanpride]

Still, one of the big plus of the MCU is the fact that it actually offers a continuing story and not just a mess of different ideas and reboots. 

[AimingforYoko]

Captain America screenwriters answer questions on 10th anniversary of film.

Quote

The question of if and when Steve Rogers ever lost his virginity after being frozen in ice for 60-plus years has long been theorized and joked about by Marvel fans and pundits. One popular opinion is that Rogers didn’t have sex until he stayed in the past to grow old with Peggy Carter (Hayley Atwell) following the time-hopping climax of Avengers: Endgame.

“I think he loses his virginity!” McFeely reacts emphatically. “Why do people think he’s a virgin?”

McFeely suggests that Steve might have been doing a little more than singing and dancing during his USO Tour across the nation to introduce him as Captain America and promote war bonds.

“If you look like that, and you’re going to city to city, and you’re signing autographs for the likes of the ladies that he’s signing the autographs for, I’ve got to imagine that [he lost his virginity],” McFeely explains.

 

[Cobalt Stargazer]

HAH!

[Ohiopirate02]

On 7/23/2021 at 9:25 PM, AimingforYoko said:

Captain America screenwriters answer questions on 10th anniversary of film.

 

I'm not buying it.  Steve only has eyes for Peggy during his first movie, and he was looking for a way to get involved in the war during his tour.  He wasn't banging the showgirls.  If he was a Stark, then yes, but not Steve.  

And the "why do people think he's a virgin," that's the character you wrote.  You could have written a story where Steve and Peggy flirted with each other and with others, but you didn't.  Instead you wrote a story with that atrocious fondue dialog and Peggy firing a gun at Steve for kissing another woman.  

 

[JustHereForFood]

Nah, we can't let some guys think that their favorite manly hero is a virgin!

[Cobalt Stargazer]

46 minutes ago, JustHereForFood said:

Nah, we can't let some guys think that their favorite manly hero is a virgin!

If anything, it'd interfere with the idea that Steve was anything but a perfect saint. I'm pretty sure half the fandom is still convinced Rogers never even used the bathroom, much less did something REALLY bad like have premarital sex.

 

1 hour ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

I'm not buying it.  Steve only has eyes for Peggy during his first movie, and he was looking for a way to get involved in the war during his tour.  He wasn't banging the showgirls.  If he was a Stark, then yes, but not Steve.

Case in point.

[Ohiopirate02]

36 minutes ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

If anything, it'd interfere with the idea that Steve was anything but a perfect saint. I'm pretty sure half the fandom is still convinced Rogers never even used the bathroom, much less did something REALLY bad like have premarital sex.

 

Case in point.

I don't see Steve as a saint, just a guy who's more into monogamy than casual sex.   That's not to say that Steve was a virgin before the serum.  Pre-serum Steve was a genuinely nice guy and kind.  He had a lot of good qualities even though his body was imperfect.   Many women are willing to overlook an imperfect body.  

I just can't see Steve having a series of one night stands as he traveled across the country like that writer implies.  Steve's the type who needs an emotional connection before anything physical.  Look at his conversation with Natasha in WS.  

[Spartan Girl]

4 hours ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

And the "why do people think he's a virgin," that's the character you wrote.  You could have written a story where Steve and Peggy flirted with each other and with others, but you didn't.  Instead you wrote a story with that atrocious fondue dialog and Peggy firing a gun at Steve for kissing another woman. 

Seriously. And that last part is why I can’t get behind Steve and Peggy as a couple anymore. That and Endgame.

Edited July 27, 2021 by Spartan Girl

[Dandesun]

I go back and forth on the idea of when Steve possibly lost his virginity but, ultimately, I don't think it matters all that much. I will say that my favorite fan theory was that Marlene Dietrich got a hold of him on a USO tour.

Of course that probably didn't happen. But I love the idea that it did.

More than that is the idea that he and Bucky were already fucking but that's deep in the Stucky-ness of it all.

I'd give it to Marlene. I just like it.