S03.E09: Patisserie

[Athena]

Quote

There are only four bakers left vying for a place in the much sought-after final of the Great British Bake off. The weight of the occasion is getting to the most unflappable of the bakers as they frantically work against the clock to deliver petits fours to Paul and Mary's exacting standards.

The hardest technical bake ever seen on Bake Off finds two of the bakers left wanting as their fraisier cakes collapse.

It's possible to hear a pin drop in the kitchen as the bakers pull out the stops for their show-stopping choux gateaus. Paul and Mary think they have seen it all until they are presented with a tribute to the Tour de France...

[dargosmydaddy]

John really needs a hug.

The fraisier cakes were pretty, at least James's and John's.

James was funny with his winging-it bicycle. Glad he got star baker again.

[Rinaldo]

Too bad, they're all good, but if someone had to go, this week it had to be lovely Danny.

This show is so educational. I had thought that petits fours had to be those cubes of cake iced on all sides. But I learn that the definition is broader than I thought.

I'm with James. As Technicals go, the Frasier cake looks yummy (excuse me, scrummy) -- or in his word, "brilliant."

And we have an all-male final three this time.

Edited August 11, 2018 by Rinaldo
Because I didn't mean to type "scummy"

[mjc570]

I have a sweet tooth, so everything looked yummy.  I didn't agree with the judges about Brendan's showstopper - I thought the stripes looked boring, and not very creative.  While he is obviously an excellent baker, I think his smugness is starting to get to me.  My fave at this point is James.  Sorry to see Danny go, but she really had some problems.  I also thought that petit fours were always the little iced squares - but nobody really did that, perhaps that would not have been creative enough.

One aspect of the show that I really like is Sue and Mel.  They are so warm and funny, and try to help the contestants when they can.  I identified completely with Sue, when she had some trouble piping the cake.  Good thing I don't live in Paris, I'd probably weigh 300 pounds. 

[echo.Echo.ECHO]

I was surprised Paul told Brendan his decorations are always spot-on. Didn't he complain earlier in the season that Brendan's stuff all looked dated?

[DHDancer]

39 minutes ago, Rinaldo said:

... (excuse me, scummy) -- or in his word, "brilliant."

It's actually "scRummy" meaning scrumptious.   I love Mary's words --- "informal" instead of rustic (or not quite up to the required standard) for instance :)

[AZChristian]

So help me, if I can't find Frasiere cake anywhere in Phoenix, I will FLY to the nearest city where they are available.  That looks amazing!!!

I'm not a very high-class person, but I have been to Paris three times.  The first time, we found a boulangerie (bakery) near Notre Dame . . . and we made a point of going back there every time we returned to Paris.  I was a typical American . . . standing out front, sampling each of the pastries we had purchased, saying, "OMG . . . this is the most delicious thing EVER" . . . for each and every pastry.

[suebee12]

Question? Did anyone else notice the spelling of macaron? They spelled it macaroons. I know that many say the word macaroons but here is the explanation I found.

https://www.berries.com/blog/many-differences-macarons-macaroons

[Mystery]

I felt for Danny, but in the end I was rooting a little more for John, who so has his heart set on being a baker. 

I was thinking of Danny with her busy job as a doctor (aren't John and James students?) and I wondered if Brendan, who I believe is semi-retired, just has more time to practice these things during the week. 

I love James's creativity and his little Scots-isms, like "I made a wee list...." 

I'm still not sure how Honore became the patron saint of bakers. If it's just the baking paddle thing, shouldn't his nanny be the patron saint?

Edited August 11, 2018 by Mystery
skipped a word

[GaT]

When the show started & they did THs with everyone & Brendan was the only one whose name they didn't put up, I was sure he was gone. It became pretty obvious it was going to be Danny though, none of her bakes really worked out this week. I can't believe next week is the final already.

[Sharpie66]

I’ve been rewatching season 6 eps all week, followed by rereading the posts for each ep here. Unfortunately, a post in the thread for the penultimate ep compared that season’s fourth place person to others including Danny, so I knew she was going to be eliminated. Oh, well. 

I really like James a lot, but hearing John’s wish to attend Le Cordon Bleu made me sympathize with him, even if his bakes haven’t been all that consistent. 

[adhoc]

I was charmed by James's "wee list" too! 

Well, seeing as how it's a French-themed week, some "escargot" (and rabbits, or should I say, lapins) were filling in for our regularly scheduled sheep. 

I think I counted 3 times where they have Brendan mentioning that he just wanted to get into the final, that was his aim, that was his goal all along, etc.  It just struck me as odd--like, really, he had nothing else to say?  

[Jordan Baker]

1 hour ago, adhoc said:

Well, seeing as how it's a French-themed week, some "escargot" (and rabbits, or should I say, lapins) were filling in for our regularly scheduled sheep. 

I missed the sheep. Is this the second week in which we've been sheep-less? And, yikes, I've never seen snails that large. They looked like atomic snails.

I felt bad for Danny, but it was pretty clear she was the one to go. For all of John's "the sky is falling," he managed to pull off some pretty good bakes (after the first round, that is). I was confused, though, when he mentioned going to the Cordon Bleu. Isn't he in law school? I know he could do both, but I wasn't sure that's what he meant.

I find all three of the remaining contestants adorable. I laughed when Mel (or was it Sue?) was trying to help Brendan with his swans. I think it's the only time I've seen him look anxious. He's a self-described perfectionist, and I liked that he admitted it makes him not-so-easy to live with. I also liked that he said it would be "impertinent" to do too much with the final bake.

The only bad thing about this show is that someone has to go home each week. Otherwise, it's just perfect.

[Mindthinkr]

7 hours ago, suebee12 said:

Question? Did anyone else notice the spelling of macaron? They spelled it macaroons. I know that many say the word macaroons but here is the explanation I found.

https://www.berries.com/blog/many-differences-macarons-macaroons

That was a great link. Thank you for posting it. 

[Mindthinkr]

7 hours ago, forumfish said:

I noticed the spelling, too. And when they were describing the cake, I laughed and said it sounds like strawberry shortcake, only fancier.

Here is Mary Berry's recipe.

“Sift two-thirds of the flour onto the mixture, then gently fold in with a metal spoon. Add the remaining flour and fold in gently to retain as much air as possible, but make sure all the flour is incorporated.”

^^ Does anyone know why Mary’s recipe specifically calls for the mixture to be folded with a metal spoon? I would have used a large silicone spatula. 

[Rinaldo]

1 hour ago, Mindthinkr said:

Does anyone know why Mary’s recipe specifically calls for the mixture to be folded with a metal spoon? I would have used a large silicone spatula. 

I've often wondered this over the years, both why metal and why a spoon. As far as I can tell, this seems to be an unexpected UK/US divide. The reason for metal is always stated to be that the implement mustn't retain a speck of fat, so that it doesn't contaminate beaten egg whites when the other ingredients are folded in; but with modern dishwashers I don't see why a silicone spatula couldn't be just as immaculate. And surely a flat rather than rounded utensil would accomplish the process more readily? But they're universally devoted to the big metal spoon for the job.

Yes, of course I know the word is "scrummy" and not scummy! (I've corrected it in my original post.) I blame autocorrect, which I've just verified does suggest that substitution.

I'm always delighted when local word usages persist in our increasingly homogenized age, and "wee" is a particular favorite. (My Scottish colleague still says it all the time, despite residence in the US for 25 years, and I hope always will.)

Oh, and this episode contains one of my favorite remarks from one baker about another: As John sums up their technicals, he repeats what the judges had just said, that his and James's Frasiers were just about equal, but James's cake had risen that bit higher -- "That wily minx." Love it!

Edited August 11, 2018 by Rinaldo

[illdoc]

10 hours ago, Rinaldo said:

I had thought that petits fours had to be those cubes of cake iced on all sides

I think those are what they are calling "fancy fondants". Petits fours is probably a broad category name covering all types of small cakes, including fancy fondants (which they did as a show stopper last PBS season).

[Mindthinkr]

57 minutes ago, Rinaldo said:

wee" is a particular favorite.

Having lived in Scotland for many years I use it regularly as well as a few other expressions that I’ve incorporated into my language usage. (From the Inverness area: Settle Petal) (Aberdeen: Fit like= How are you doing)

[Sharpie66]

The thread for the Season 6 Chocolate episode has a lot of metal spoon vs. silicone spatula discussion re: how to mix a soufflé. The professional chef who was commenting for the Washington Post was all about the spatula. 

Edited August 11, 2018 by Sharpie66

[Winter Rose]

I'm sad to see Danny go, she would've been the one I was rooting for in the final. But it was the right decision, unfortunately nothing went right for her. And using floral flavors seems to backfire more often than they work out.

In spite of John's bad first round, he was second in the technical and did well in the showstopper, so I don't think he was really in trouble despite the judges acting like he was. I also think it's great that this is something he wants to do as more than a hobby. I like how he clearly wants to learn and doesn't just act like his way is right and everyone else is wrong. I also like James's creativity. Even with his slightly winging it, he still seems to have a gist of what he's doing and it actually leaves him room to adjust if things go wrong. I'd be happy with either James or John winning.

[dubbel zout]

14 hours ago, Rinaldo said:

This show is so educational. I had thought that petits fours had to be those cubes of cake iced on all sides. But I learn that the definition is broader than I thought.

Same here. Given the bakers had to make three different petit fours, I was a bit surprised the small cakes weren't the one required element. But maybe the time limit was too short? This season we haven't always heard how much time the bakers get for each segment.

14 hours ago, echo.Echo.ECHO said:

I was surprised Paul told Brendan his decorations are always spot-on. Didn't he complain earlier in the season that Brendan's stuff all looked dated?

I took "spot-on" to mean "well executed." The overall appearance might be dated, but the decorations are never sloppy.

5 hours ago, Jordan Baker said:

I felt bad for Danny, but it was pretty clear she was the one to go.

If her technical hadn't been so disastrous, I think Mary and the male judge would have had a harder decision between her and John. He wasn't cut only because Danny's bakes were so bad.

4 hours ago, Rinaldo said:

But they're universally devoted to the big metal spoon for the job.

Every time I see that, I think, "What do you people have against the rubber spatular?" LOL. This divide gets discussed in every season!

2 hours ago, Winter Rose said:

And using floral flavors seems to backfire more often than they work out.

Rose is an intense flavor. I forget what recipe I was trying, but it included a bit of rosewater, and it overwhelmed everything else. Maybe you need to use it in the same manner Winston Churchill used vermouth in his martinis: a quick glance at the bottle from across the room.

I've never been one for French pastries. I appreciate the skill that goes into them all, but they're nearly all just too much for me. Luckily, not wanting dessert leaves room for a lot more cheese and bread!

[Kathira]

2 hours ago, dubbel zout said:

Rose is an intense flavor. I forget what recipe I was trying, but it included a bit of rosewater, and it overwhelmed everything else. Maybe you need to use it in the same manner Winston Churchill used vermouth in his martinis: a quick glance at the bottle from across the room.

A friend made a Lebanese rosewater drink for a party last weekend, and I'm sad to report that it tasted like cherry Koolaid or possibly Hawaiian Punch. Either way, the flavor was definitely overwhelming and very sweet. It's possible that it's suposed to be that way, but it definitely wasn't to my taste. It was one of those awkward situations where someone has gone out of their way to make something fancy and you just have to smile, say nice things about the effort the person put in and dump it discreetly.

Edited August 11, 2018 by Kathira
Grammerz

[Mabinogia]

1 hour ago, dubbel zout said:

I've never been one for French pastries. I appreciate the skill that goes into them all, but they're nearly all just too much for me. Luckily, not wanting dessert leaves room for a lot more cheese and bread!

I'll join you for the cheese and bread. I'm not a pastry person. I do think that Frasier cake looked good though, because it was more like pudding and strawberries with some cake holding it together. 

I thought the show stoppers were kind of a mess. Brendan's was neat looking, James' was certainly creative in comparison to the others, but kind of a hot mess. Danny's was just nice. John's was a hot mess. I didn't get their love for the appearance as it looked a mess to me. The hearts were nice, but the rest was kind of a beigish blob of mess to me. 

I'll join the masses in my surprise that petit fours aren't just those little square cakes. I didn't realize they were more like a category. Live and learn. 

It was interesting watching first Mel and Sue then Paul and Mary huddled together talking about what was going on. I wonder if the bakers see/here this going on because that would make me super paranoid if I was baking and two of them were huddled together giving play by play of my mistakes. 

[meep.meep]

10 hours ago, Mindthinkr said:

^^ Does anyone know why Mary’s recipe specifically calls for the mixture to be folded with a metal spoon? I would have used a large silicone spatula. 

This is just me, but I think it's so that you have an excuse when your cake turns out more like Danny's than James'  "Oh, of course, I forgot to use my metal spoon.  I'll remember next time."

John's inability to get the plastic sheeting into the pan reminded me so much of my own life!  And the desperation in his eyes.

[dleighg]

1 hour ago, meep.meep said:

John's inability to get the plastic sheeting into the pan reminded me so much of my own life!  And the desperation in his eyes.

I couldn't help but think, cut it to approximately the right length! He seemed to be trying to fit 10 feet into a 2 foot circle!

[Destiny74]

I wonder if the receipe is an older one.  Mary's been baking forever and I'd imagine she's a "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" type of gal.  The receipe may have been originally written before rubber spatulas were so common in the household.

Edited August 12, 2018 by Destiny74

[cherrypj]

7 hours ago, dubbel zout said:

Maybe you need to use it in the same manner Winston Churchill used vermouth in his martinis: a quick glance at the bottle from across the room.

That's a wonderful turn of phrase.

[Rinaldo]

1 hour ago, Destiny74 said:

I wonder if the receipe is an older one.  Mary's been baking forever and I'd imagine she's a "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" type of gal.  The receipe may have been originally written before rubber spatulas were so common in the household.

It goes way beyond this recipe. In pretty much every season, in any recipe involving "folding," this practice has come up (and been discussed here, see above), and the bakers always seem to do it automatically, even without being specifically instructed. I think we have to accept that they just do it differently there.

[mjc570]

2 hours ago, Destiny74 said:

I wonder if the receipe is an older one.  Mary's been baking forever and I'd imagine she's a "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" type of gal.  The receipe may have been originally written before rubber spatulas were so common in the household.

Ha ha, I started to read that as "before rubber spatulas were invented."  No disrespect to Mary, a lovely lady of course.

[Quilt Fairy]

15 hours ago, Jordan Baker said:

For all of John's "the sky is falling," he managed to pull off some pretty good bakes (after the first round, that is). I was confused, though, when he mentioned going to the Cordon Bleu. Isn't he in law school? I know he could do both, but I wasn't sure that's what he meant.

That made me cock my head as well, thinking  "Where the heck did that come from?"

I went back this evening and re-watched the first episode of this season.  John is only one year older than James, although he seems several years older (not that James seems immature).  John just looks older than 22.  So that makes a final with a 21 year old, a 22 year old and Brendan, who is obviously in his 60s.

[mlp]

I like all three of the finalists so I won't be disappointed by whoever wins.  However, there's something rather endearing about James so I'm sort of pulling for him.

[biakbiak]

I thought James’s chocolate mousse technique was interesting. I have a friend who is allergic to dairy so may experiment with it. 

I knew that petite four came in different versions because I am always super disappointed when they only offer the poured fondant cakes because I have never had a good one.

I clearly am going to have to go to the classic French bakery that sometimes has fraisier cakes.

My British grandmother always used a metal spoon but than like 20 years ago I should her worked just as well with a spatula and she didn’t go back.

I was sort of surprised that none of them had used cornflour/cornstarch as a thickener. Did it come up earlier this season because I believe I looked it up recently to make sure I wasn’t misremembering and cornflour was the equivalent of cornstarch?

I would be curious to know how Danny’s rosewater/lychee tasted to her because as Paul noted lychee is such a subtle flavor, though I adore eating it fresh, I can’t imagine there would be any taste of it given the rosewater. If she thought it was just there to lighten it up a bit she might have just not have listed it in the name of the dessert.

I thought Brendan was rightly praised for his stripes because they didn’t bleed into each other but they looked precise.

This season is certainly showing the fickleness of the English weather. Last week it’s crazy hot and this week it’s grey and raining.

I like all of the finalists but that is usually the case on this show. If I had to choose probably James followed by Brendan. 

[Mindthinkr]

5 hours ago, biakbiak said:

I thought James’s chocolate mousse technique was interesting. I have a friend who is allergic to dairy so may experiment with it. 

That really intrigued me too. I’m going to have to go back and rewatch his technique on making that mousse and give it a try as well. It looked like regular mousse save it didn’t seem to have the volume. 

[dleighg]

This looks like the method for the mousse. But didn't he get dinged for the chocolate mousse being too intense a flavor, combined with the rest of the dish? So it seems Mary and Paul thought it would have been better the traditional way.

https://food52.com/recipes/16044-herve-this-chocolate-mousse

[biakbiak]

10 minutes ago, dleighg said:

This looks like the method for the mousse. But didn't he get dinged for the chocolate mousse being too intense a flavor, combined with the rest of the dish? So it seems Mary and Paul thought it would have been better the traditional way.

https://food52.com/recipes/16044-herve-this-chocolate-mousse

I don’t speak fluent Mary but I thought her response was she was shocked about the flavor of the mouse being  intense despite drowning the chocolate in water you still got the chocolateness. Intense in this situation being good because the chocolate flavor came out.

Edited August 12, 2018 by biakbiak

[Mindthinkr]

10 minutes ago, dleighg said:

This looks like the method for the mousse. But didn't he get dinged for the chocolate mousse being too intense a flavor, combined with the rest of the dish? So it seems Mary and Paul thought it would have been better the traditional way.

https://food52.com/recipes/16044-herve-this-chocolate-mousse

Thank you for posting that link. It might be a week or two before I get to trying to make it (vacation coming up) but I’ll let anyone know how it worked for me if you’re interested. 

[dleighg]

18 minutes ago, biakbiak said:

don’t speak fluent Mary but I thought her response was she was shocked about the flavor of the mouse being  intense despite drowning the chocolate in water you still got the chocolateness. Intense in this situation being good because the chocolate flavor came out.

I just rewatched that section; she said  "I think I would have like a lighter chocolate in the middle" BUT that was for John, not James. I cannot keep those two apart!

She actually didn't say much about James' chocolate mousse!

[biakbiak]

11 minutes ago, dleighg said:

I just rewatched that section; she said  "I think I would have like a lighter chocolate in the middle" BUT that was for John, not James. I cannot keep those two apart!

She actually didn't say much about James' chocolate mousse!

Paul and Mary praised his mouse which given how it was made I listened closely to both their critiques.

[chaifan]

12 hours ago, Destiny74 said:

I wonder if the receipe is an older one.  Mary's been baking forever and I'd imagine she's a "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" type of gal.  The receipe may have been originally written before rubber spatulas were so common in the household.

My take on the "metal spoon" issue is that this is a bit of an older rule, when the choice was between metal and wooden spoons.  In that situation, yes, you would definitely choose the metal spoon.  When it comes between metal spoon and rubber spatula, I think it comes down to metal having less chance of holding an oily residue from prior use.  I still see recipes that call for using glass or metal bowls instead of plastic (and not just due to a heat issue). 

Sorry to see Danny go.  I also think John's showstopper looked messy and was shocked the judges liked it so much. 

I think/hope the final will come down to a battle of James' creativity and Brendan's perfection.

[illdoc]

12 hours ago, Quilt Fairy said:

So that makes a final with a 21 year old, a 22 year old and Brendan, who is obviously in his 60s.

In this week's "Parade" (a magazine that comes in our (Chicago) Sunday newspaper), it mentioned the (current) ages of the bakers in the finals. I remember it said one was 28, one 29 (which does agree with the above "21/22"), but I can't remember how old it said Brendan was and the magazine has been thrown out.  ETA: Found it! Quote from article: with an all-male finale between bakers Brendan Lynch, 69, James Morton, 27, and John Whaite, 29. The three amateur bakers will face their final three battles, preparing for a British summer fête as judges Mary Berry, 83, and Paul Hollywood, 52, pick the best of the best underneath the show’s iconic white tent in the English countryside.

Edited August 12, 2018 by illdoc

[mlp]

I get the same Parade in my downstate paper and was going to quote it also.  I thought it was odd that they used current ages instead of the ages the fellows were during their season and didn't qualify that.

Does anyone know what James and John are doing now?  I'd be interested to know if they finished med school/law school.

Edited August 12, 2018 by mlp
add something

[illdoc]

From Wikipedia (don't know how recent the update is though): John Whaite gained a first-class degree from the University of Manchester after sitting his law exams while filming Bake Off, but he rejected a career in law and opted to take classes at Le Cordon Bleu and pursue a career in baking. James Morton aimed for a career in medicine but has written a book on bread, titled Brilliant Bread. Brendan Lynch is teaching cookery classes. Cathryn Dresser and Sarah-Jane Willis teamed up to open a stall at Horsham Market.

[Mabinogia]

8 minutes ago, illdoc said:

Cathryn Dresser and Sarah-Jane Willis teamed up to open a stall at Horsham Market.

I'm happy for all of them but this makes me deliriously happy. I loved those two adorable ladies and am glad they get to do something together. 

[springbarb]

2 hours ago, illdoc said:

In this week's "Parade" (a magazine that comes in our (Chicago) Sunday newspaper), it mentioned the (current) ages of the bakers in the finals. I remember it said one was 28, one 29 (which does agree with the above "21/22"), but I can't remember how old it said Brendan was and the magazine has been thrown out.  ETA: Found it! Quote from article: with an all-male finale between bakers Brendan Lynch, 69, James Morton, 27, and John Whaite, 29. The three amateur bakers will face their final three battles, preparing for a British summer fête as judges Mary Berry, 83, and Paul Hollywood, 52, pick the best of the best underneath the show’s iconic white tent in the English countryside.

I saw this before watching the episode and was annoyed to be spoiled! I wasn't expecting spoilers in Parade.

[Rinaldo]

This whole what's-happened-since discussion is making me nervous. Looking at such articles is almost guaranteed to bring spoilers. (I don't mind for myself -- I saw this series long ago -- but for others who might be reading along. Certainly no actual spoilers have been posted here, but if someone goes looking....)

Edited August 12, 2018 by Rinaldo

[dleighg]

48 minutes ago, Rinaldo said:

This whole what's-happened-since discussion is making me nervous. Looking at such articles is almost guaranteed to bring spoilers. (I don't mind for myself -- I saw this series long ago -- but for others who might be reading along. Certainly no actual spoilers have been posted here, but if someone goes looking....)

Yes I got mostly spoiled (knowing who didn't win, anyway) by just googling for the list of contestants because I couldn't remember one name. Be careful out there, kids.

[carrps]

15 hours ago, biakbiak said:

I knew that petite four came in different versions because I am always super disappointed when they only offer the poured fondant cakes because I have never had a good one.

 

The only good ones I've ever had were from Valerie Confections (here in L.A., but they do mail order) -- https://valerieconfections.com/collections/petits-fours. They were absolutely delicious. But they also don't use fondant (blech).  Paul wouldn't like them, though, as they're definitely not one-bite. 

[Mindthinkr]

25 minutes ago, carrps said:

The only good ones I've ever had were from Valerie Confections (here in L.A., but they do mail order) -- https://valerieconfections.com/collections/petits-fours. They were absolutely delicious. But they also don't use fondant (blech).  Paul wouldn't like them, though, as they're definitely not one-bite. 

I liked looking at everything but didn’t like not seeing their prices as I perused. Was considering trying some but as they say, if you have to ask you can’t afford them. 

[carrps]

5 minutes ago, Mindthinkr said:

I liked looking at everything but didn’t like not seeing their prices as I perused. Was considering trying some but as they say, if you have to ask you can’t afford them. 

Yeah, sadly, they're pretty spendy. :-(

[allirish47]

Did anybody else hear James (I think it was he) saying that he put 'icing sugar' on top of his mousse to keep it from developing a skin? Is icing sugar the same as powdered sugar? Would that work on homemade puddings as well?