S05.E07: Kat's Got Your Tongue

[Coffeewinewater]

16 hours ago, gunderda said:

You'd be surprised at how normal it is.  Some people's skin gets too dry from taking showers every day so they do every other, which would be about 3-4 times a week. 

Austin bores me..... i actually fast forwarded through that date scene. I don't even do that with Whitney scenes. 

I have a feeling the ratings are going to increase x10000 next week only because Gizmo is making an appearance.  

If I let my 8yr old  shower/ take a bath everyday he'd love it,  kid loves water. His skin dries out so bad though. He has sensory issues so lotion is a fight every day.  So winter is definitely a 3/4 times a week bath routine.  Summer of course is more often because he's outside getting dirty.  Dr even told me showering 3/4 times a week is perfectly normal and healthy.  So Naomi isn’t weird in that aspect.  However, she's still a nutter about other things imo.

[Major Bigtime]

4 hours ago, queenjen said:

She needs (WE need) some K Cooper Ray on speed dial for THIS gig at Wynns, God of Bravo, please bring him back..

Kathryn and Cooper had a HUGE falling out, I think he’d rather be run over by a horse and carriage than to film with her.

[nexxie]

What makes Pat such a good catch - other than her own high opinion of herself?

[Major Bigtime]

Her money. 

[RHJunkie]

I'm trying to understand Thomas' draw to Ashley when he's actually turned off by her lack of Southern-ness. She's from California you dumbass.

Good for Katheryn if she's making real strides in getting her shit together...but I would never let her style me, lol. BUT I will admit, she did look nice at her dinner with Thomas. 

I can get why a woman would be drawn to Austen initially. He's got a prep school look that a lot of women can find attractive. But beyond a first few dates where you allow the physical attraction to die off,  I don't get how these women are really into him. I don't think I've heard him say a single interesting thing yet. All he does is talk about beer and about how a women who is down to party past 9:30 is important to him. I'm just not seeing the substance. 

Thomas is such a wasteman. I will question any woman's judgement that wants to be in a relationship with this man. He literally said 'I've got all the power and money, who are you?'. That is how any relationship with a woman will be defined in his mind because he wants to be the one to control his woman. 

Poor Cameron, she got induced and it still didn't work! I can only imagine how uncomfortable it must have been walking around past her due date and trying to be patient for her little one. 

[JenE4]

Last week we were complaining that the “charm” is off the show, so it was nice to see the guys all dressed up and displaying their best genteel manners for Patricia’s dinner party. It had juuuust enough of that awkward inappropriateness of Southern Charm 1.0...is this a lovely themed soirée or has Patricia just crossed the line into cultural appropriation? Patricia was also channeling a bit of the T-Rav Glass Menagerie Life Lessons dinner party: Let me gather you all together and tell you what you’re doing wrong and why you’ve never been married—learn from my experience.

And dying over Patricia’s reactions to Ashley comparing herself to a Barbie Doll and the prostitute from “Pretty Woman.” While both of these comparisons are dead-on accurate and 100% Ashley’s life ambition, she’s “too California” to know these are not the images to project in Charleston high society. Is this season of Southern Charm brought to you by Gwynn’s? Got $10,000 burning a hole in your pocket? Come to Gwynn’s! Free bracelet consultation with every purchase!

i am side-eying this whole Chelsea-Austin-Victoria triangle. I bet Austen and Victoria never actually broke up, but they all agreed to film a couple of episodes pretending like he was conflicted just because production was pissed they missed Austen jumping to Chelsea’s friend off season. Maybe they gave Victoria a Gwynn’s gift card for her troubles—oh, and TV exposure and the opportunity to shill on Instagram.

[Eater of Worlds]

I don't think Craig's leg crossing has anything to do with him being gay.  Rather, it's both generational and a societal thing.  Men of older generations all cross their legs like that.  Both my father, my FIL, and my sibling's FIL sit like that.  Heck, my brother often sits like that because it's comfortable.  You see a lot of men in higher class society sit like that.  My brother does it because that's what he learned from his father and the parents of his friends. all sat like that.  Sitting with your legs open is a relatively young way of sitting and has nothing to do with "that's just how men sit". Hell, Shep sits like that and no one has said boo about that.

[nexxie]

1 hour ago, Major Bigtime said:

Her money. 

Didn’t her money come from the men she caught before this latest one?

[slowpoked]

1 hour ago, JenE4 said:

i am side-eying this whole Chelsea-Austin-Victoria triangle. I bet Austen and Victoria never actually broke up, but they all agreed to film a couple of episodes pretending like he was conflicted just because production was pissed they missed Austen jumping to Chelsea’s friend off season. Maybe they gave Victoria a Gwynn’s gift card for her troubles—oh, and TV exposure and the opportunity to shill on Instagram.

No, that part is true. They did break up, got back together, and well....you can guess the next part of that story.

1 hour ago, JenE4 said:

these are not the images to project in Charleston high society.

Incidentally, who are these people in the "Charleston High Society"? Because I'm not seeing any of them on this show.

[MatildaMoody]

On 5/18/2018 at 8:21 AM, TeeMo said:

That scene  with Thomas and Kathryn was nauseating as they were both working overtime to play each other and prey on lingering feelings. Thomas is always gross and would happily jump back into bed with Kathryn if she asked and he was a dog for flirting with her in front of Ashley at the party last week and also for jumping in last night with the idea of getting back together. BUT Kathryn was also being totally manipulative moving the lock of hair in and out of his eyes and presenting herself as sad broken hearted Kathryn over the photo Thomas posted with Ashley. She could have easily expressed how uncomfortable the photo made her and how inappropriate it was for him to post it without talking about how sad she was alone at her couch at home while batting her eyes at him. Both of them were giving each other  coy doe eyes at that dinner. It was gross to watch.

Kathryn said how important it is for the kids to see them together but I honestly don’t think that is true in this case at all. It is important for the kids to see them being cordial and decent to each other during times they are in the same place but they don’t need to be going out of their way to make that happen. Saint probably has no recollection of them ever being together a a couple at all. The best thing these two could do for those kids is set boundaries with each other, be respectful, not fight or talk badly about each other in front of the kids and that is it. It is nice if they can celebrate birthdays and some holidays like Halloween together for the kids’ sake but there is zero need for candlelit dinners just the two of them where they make googly eyes at each other across the table. 

 

Honestly, I thought this was well played on Kathryn's part. Thomas does not see women as reasonable or logical or as human beings. He sees them as emotional things that he can swoop in to save or control. If she were simply upfront with him, he would either shut down or goad her into some type of argument and nothing would be accomplished. Instead she would once again look like a screaming banshee that Thomas was lucky to evade. But, by playing to his flirtatious side and showing just a enough emotion, she was able to reasonable reactions from him and actually make progress when it comes to seeing her kids more often. She played to his ego and if that is what works, then I say more power to her. 

Also, I do think that she still has feelings for him (which is so gross), but finally realized that they are simply toxic together. So she finally decided not to engage in the repetitive toxic pattern they established. Now, Thomas has no reason to go after her on Social Media unless he wants to look like the childish asshole that he is. So while I wouldn't recommend flirting to get what you want, it really seems to be the only way to get anything near an adult response out of someone like Thomas. It's as though she finally leveled the playing field, which is important because she is tied to him for the rest of her life because of the fact that they have children together. If she keeps on like this, maybe they can finally co-parent their children without the courts having to be involved. 

ETA: Am I the only one who hates the fact that Austen never closes his mouth? I can just imagine him mouth breathing all over the place and just get grossed out by it. 

Edited May 19, 2018 by MatildaMoody

[ninjago]

On 5/17/2018 at 10:46 PM, breezy424 said:

So is that Naomi with her new nose in some of those TH's? 

When she's wearing the black dress, right?  Obviously, her nose and her choice, but I am surprised by what we've seen of her new nose.  It looks kind of snubbed/blunt.  I would have thought she'd keep the length, just with a more refined tip.  More "French".

[Oosala]

Every time Shep mentions "mail box money," I want to punch him in his rapidly-ageing face as I get ready for another day of fucking work.

[scrb]

2 hours ago, slowpoked said:

Incidentally, who are these people in the "Charleston High Society"? Because I'm not seeing any of them on this show.

High society people would be older, married and have too many social and professional obligations to do this show.

As has been discussed here, Craig couldn't have a full time job with any kind of respectable firm and have time to do the show.

 

Bravo couldn't pay enough to people who got any kind of money to do the show.  Thomas is rich but he does the show for reasons other than money.

My guess it it's partly about notoriety.  Being on TV probably gets him some attention, including from women.  I remember in one of the earlier seasons they were at some event for Pat, on a navy ship.  And women were going up to him and taking selfies.

Edited May 19, 2018 by scrb

[slowpoked]

49 minutes ago, scrb said:

High society people would be older, married and have too many social and professional obligations to do this show.

So I’m not being glib here, but I really do want to know. I’m sort of fascinated by the south, especially Charleston. It’s a really nice, charming city, if you get past downtown. But aside from the Ravenels, who get by mostly with name recognition and that bridge, who else are in the Charleston High Society? Most people have said that that does not include Patricia, she’s mostly considered an outsider. Kathryn may have the name recognition but not the money.

And what social functions go on for these high society people? Because all I see are bars and clubs and dives and craft beer. 

[SuprSuprElevated]

4 hours ago, Eater of Worlds said:

Sitting with your legs open is a relatively young way of sitting and has nothing to do with "that's just how men sit".

I actually am not a fan of "manspreading".  I know what's in there, I don't need you to try and prove it or air it out.

3 hours ago, MatildaMoody said:

ETA: Am I the only one who hates the fact that Austen never closes his mouth? I can just imagine him mouth breathing all over the place and just get grossed out by it. 

Hey now, it's a real problem.    canidae.com

Edited May 19, 2018 by SuprSuprElevated

[scrb]

5 minutes ago, slowpoked said:

So I’m not being glib here, but I really do want to know. I’m sort of fascinated by the south, especially Charleston. It’s a really nice, charming city, if you get past downtown. But aside from the Ravenels, who get by mostly with name recognition and that bridge, who else are in the Charleston High Society? Most people have said that that does not include Patricia, she’s mostly considered an outsider. Kathryn may have the name recognition but not the money.

And what social functions go on for these high society people? Because all I see are bars and clubs and dives and craft beer. 

I don't know if there are older money people in Charleston.  There used to be a registry of high society people, who send their children to cotillions and such.  But that may be more in the Northeast and many of them inherit money from industries established in the late 19th or early 20th centuries.

Certainly old Southern families like Ravenels have history behind them but unless they own a lot of prime land, they don't necessarily have money, as we see with Kathryn's family.

Shep's family seems to have money but they don't seem to have a heritage which goes back to colonial days.

There's been so much new money families in the last 50 to 100 years and they may not care about participating in high society culture.  They may do some charity events but maybe not care about being in the Social Register like families in the early 20th century.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Register

[MatildaMoody]

I know it's cliche, but sometimes clothing wears a person rather than a person wearing the clothing. Kathryn was and still can be a perfect example of that. I think the same is true of Ashley, and I feel like she is getting the same "Pretty Woman/Prostitute" edit that Kathryn got in an earlier season- except it was Patricia doing the honors instead of Thomas. So instead of the much older man dictating the clothing choices he was willing to pay for, an older woman chose the clothing and sent the bill and video footage to the older man. I am not saying that is what happened here. I am simply saying that is how it felt watching it. 

I will say that the clothing and accessories were fine and even beautiful. Unfortunately, much like when Thomas chose Kathryn's clothes, Patti chose things that Ashley simply couldn't confidently wear. The black ensemble is a great example. I saw a beautiful Chanel bag, a gorgeous black gown, and a lot of hair. By the time I saw Ashley's face, the show cut to another scene. So all I remember are those beautiful clothes and accessories. I'm still not sure how Ashley actually looked in any of them.

Edited May 19, 2018 by MatildaMoody

[Major Bigtime]

7 hours ago, nexxie said:

Didn’t her money come from the men she caught before this latest one?

Yes, but she’s still got money. 

3 hours ago, scrb said:

My guess it it's partly about notoriety.  Being on TV probably gets him some attention

And got him banned from about a dozen different bars/restaurants in town.

[ProudMary]

9 hours ago, JenE4 said:

And dying over Patricia’s reactions to Ashley comparing herself to a Barbie Doll and the prostitute from “Pretty Woman.” While both of these comparisons are dead-on accurate and 100% Ashley’s life ambition, she’s “too California” to know these are not the images to project in Charleston high society. Is this season of Southern Charm brought to you by Gwynn’s? Got $10,000 burning a hole in your pocket? Come to Gwynn’s! Free bracelet consultation with every purchase!

As a matter of fact, here in the Charleston broadcast market, we did get a commercial for Gwynn's midway through the show.  I had never seen a TV advertisement for them prior to this.  Our local TV ads are predominately for ambulance chasing lawyers, including the one who fired Craig a few seasons back. ☺

[woodscommaelle]

No offense to anyone who is a personal shopper/stylist, but what an absolutely strange job.

"Here. This what I picked out for you to wear today."

[breezy424]

Well, as far as Kathryn and TRav are concerned,  TRav plays the game more than Kat does.  Hey, TRav even does it in front of his current girlfriend.  I think TRav will always be in love with Kat.  She is the 'one' who turns him on.  Maybe Ashley will eventually figure that out.  She will always be second.

Craig is a classic 'metrosexual'.  I know a few of them.  They're happily married but have a thing about certain stuff.

I could never not go without a daily shower by choice.  Just couldn't do it. I may not have to 'scrub' my body but those private parts needs some soap.   I could go deeper into the subject but....  Yeah, no.

I also cannot go to bed without washing my face, flossing, and brushing my teeth.  And that can be at four o'clock in the morning no matter how dead tired I am.  Ok.  Others may disagree.

[SuprSuprElevated]

30 minutes ago, woodscommaelle said:

No offense to anyone who is a personal shopper/stylist, but what an absolutely strange job.

"Here. This what I picked out for you to wear today."

I would love to have a job like that.  Spend other people's money in an attempt to make them look nice.  

A bit like grown-up paper dolls, for pay.

I can see two types of people hiring such a service; those with impossibly busy schedules, and those with no ability to put together a competent look.  From what I can tell, there are plenty of both walking this earth.

[woodscommaelle]

18 minutes ago, SuprSuprElevated said:

I would love to have a job like that.  Spend other people's money in an attempt to make them look nice.  

It could definitely be a cool job. Just random I guess. 

I also think Kathryn does not have the right personality for the job, manufactured storyline or not.

[Former Nun]

On 5/18/2018 at 4:43 PM, Gem 10 said:

Holy Shit !   Patricia is 77 yrs old.

Holy Shit!  Me too...for 23 more days.

[Former Nun]

1 hour ago, breezy424 said:

She will always be second.

She will always be an also-ran...and most (even Thomas) will have forgotten her in a year or two.

[Former Nun]

17 hours ago, Sage47 said:

To me he seems either gay or asexual. He just doesn’t have any raw masculinity to him. 

If Craig IS gay and ever realizes it, perhaps an older wealthy (confident) man would be the best companion for him.  Craig could pursue his various hobbies happily, develop new ones...and have someone cheer him on.  A female his own age will most likely want him to pursue financial success.   I'm sad that Craig had such early success (teen and pre-teen years) in academics and athletics yet couldn't bring that into his adult life.  He's one of those guys who will always look back on his glory days.

[HunterHunted]

2 hours ago, woodscommaelle said:

No offense to anyone who is a personal shopper/stylist, but what an absolutely strange job.

"Here. This what I picked out for you to wear today."

A personal stylist doesn't usually consult with a client on a daily basis. They will work with clients for big events, inform clients about seasonal fashion trends, go shopping for updated clothing, help the client get rid of outdated clothing, and frequently put together seasonal look books or outfit suggestions for the client. If the newest trend is pussy bow blouses, they might talk to a client about whether this is a trend that the client is into, shop for a couple of versions of the trend, and help the client figure out how to wear it.

Also suspecting that Craig might be gay because he's well groomed, crosses his legs, and sews is part of the misogynistic and toxic masculine ideals that lead to TRav, Whitney, Shep, and Jax Taylor. These same assholes, minus Jax, also made fun of Craig gardening and lots of straight men garden. There are men who sew. Some are fashion designers, others are cosplayers, and some just like doing it. It's an unusual hobby, but there are lots of unusual hobbies.

Edited May 20, 2018 by HunterHunted

[nexxie]

12 hours ago, Major Bigtime said:

Yes, but she’s still got money. 

Pat seems very proud of herself for being able to catch multiple men - as if that somehow represents a skill set to be envied. Can Pat do anything that isn’t about men and their money/power? She even throws dinners for men only - and herself, of course, preening at the center of the event.

[Starlight925]

Re:  Personal Shoppers.  My sister has always had a flair for fashion and putting things together.  She worked at Nordstroms (selling shoes), and they ended up having her do Personal Shopping as well, as she was so good at it.  She would actually go to women's homes and work within their closets, and bring them clothes, shoes, accessories, from Nordstrom's, to put with what they already owned.  These women were often career women who just didn't have the time, or the knack.  They were navy suit-wearing women who needed help figuring these things out.  She'd sell thousands and thousands of dollars to these women, and she loved every minute of it.  Unfortunately, Kathryn does not have that knack.  Sigh.

Re:  Patricia and her money.  Does this Mr. C. really have enough money for that ring?  Or did she maybe pick out a little something for herself and call it her "engagement" ring?  I'm suspect, as even her son seems to know little about him.  Side-eyeing you, Ms. Patricia.

Whether Craig is gay or straight-metrosexual, he simply has no drive, no ambition.  Sure, he has hobbies and Gizmo, but he has no....uuumph.   Like, he appears to be lacking in the testosterone necessary to move himself forward.  Even his embroidery is amateur.  Remember that gift he gave Cameron for her shower, which was only partially complete?  The embroidery was too small, as if he simply used the pre-set setting.  Poor Craig, such a sweet guy.

[HunterHunted]

5 hours ago, nexxie said:

Pat seems very proud of herself for being able to catch multiple men - as if that somehow represents a skill set to be envied. Can Pat do anything that isn’t about men and their money/power? She even throws dinners for men only - and herself, of course, preening at the center of the event.

Kim Zolciak has managed to nab multiple men with money; Kim is straight trash. Kim Richards has too; Kim is a narcissistic addict who is determined to punish everyone in her life for her failings. Reality TV is littered with terrible people who have managed to glom themselves to wealth and or power. There is nothing commendable about any of it. Nor am I the least bit envious.

I find Patricia to be an enormous male chauvinist. She never has boo to say about how any of the men in the cast treat women. She might advise Ashley to get her nursing license in South Carolina, but she's never really called out Thomas' reprehensible behavior or flat out said no woman deserves to be treated by Thomas the way he treats women. I think the worst I've ever heard her say about him is that he's an idiot, which was really in regards to his on and off again relationship with Kathryn. I've never been impressed by Patricia. She's educated and traveled in well-heeled circles, but we get so little of her actual accomplishments and more of what "a lady should do." Finally, the fact that she raised the odious Whitney is a huge black mark against her for me.

[SunnyBeBe]

5 hours ago, nexxie said:

Pat seems very proud of herself for being able to catch multiple men - as if that somehow represents a skill set to be envied. Can Pat do anything that isn’t about men and their money/power? She even throws dinners for men only - and herself, of course, preening at the center of the event.

I normally like Patricia, but, she seemed way too impressed with her alleged ability to nab a husband.  She must not realize that anyone can do that. It's not that difficult, depending on what your standards are.  Hers may be very high, but, I just don't think what she accomplished with her previous husbands was due to her charm or outstanding beauty.  And you know what they say about marrying for money......those who do it, earn every dime. lol

Edited May 20, 2018 by SunnyBeBe

[nexxie]

17 minutes ago, HunterHunted said:

Kim Zolciak has managed to nab multiple men with money; Kim is straight trash. Kim Richards has too; Kim is a narcissistic addict who is determined to punish everyone in her life for her failings. Reality TV is littered with terrible people who have managed to glom themselves to wealth and or power. There is nothing commendable about any of it. Nor am I the least bit envious.

I find Patricia to be an enormous male chauvinist. She never has boo to say about how any of the men in the cast treat women. She might advise Ashley to get her nursing license in South Carolina, but she's never really called out Thomas' reprehensible behavior or flat out said no woman deserves to be treated by Thomas the way he treats women. I think the worst I've ever heard her say about him is that he's an idiot, which was really in regards to his on and off again relationship with Kathryn. I've never been impressed by Patricia. She's educated and traveled in well-heeled circles, but we get so little of her actual accomplishments and more of what "a lady should do." Finally, the fact that she raised the odious Whitney is a huge black mark against her for me.

True - and you have to wonder if her self-esteem is really what she pretends, when she can’t seem to handle the competition of other women at a dinner party.

[Sage47]

12 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

 

Also suspecting that Craig might be gay because he's well groomed, crosses his legs, and sews is part of the misogynistic and toxic masculine ideals that lead to TRav, Whitney, Shep, and Jax Taylor. These same assholes, minus Jax, also made fun of Craig gardening and lots of straight men garden. There are men who sew. Some are fashion designers, others are cosplayers, and some just like doing it. It's an unusual hobby, but there are lots of unusual hobbies.

 

I don’t only suspect Craig of being gay due to crossed legs, dapper dressing and high interest in fabric shopping. And yes, of COURSE there are straight men into that stuff! 

 It is his non-sexual chemistry with Naomie or any of the girls, Cameran saying he’s basically a girl, his utter lack of ambition and testosterone as Sterling put it.  His saying he “wishes he were into guys”...just lots of things. 

I think he should be who he is and I wish him the best. Maybe he IS straight/metro. Either way dude, please light a fire under your ass. Get some mojo. He’s so...meh all the time. 

My final thought: this show has turned into pure BS/script. Peyton shows up on the show and Naomie says that Craig says Peyton is the “first girl he could see himself with”. Eyeroll. There are a hundred cute girls in Charleston but OF COURSE it is the new cast member that Craig is interested in. Lame. So lame. Fake. 

[queenjen]

On 5/20/2018 at 3:39 AM, MatildaMoody said:

ETA: Am I the only one who hates the fact that Austen never closes his mouth? I can just imagine him mouth breathing all over the place and just get grossed out by it. 

I agree with all you said about the TRav and Kathryn learning to deal with him, onerous task that it is. 

 

Austen is really a reptile, he unhinges his jaw in the potential presence of beer, nachos and women

[queenjen]

15 hours ago, breezy424 said:

I could never not go without a daily shower by choice.  Just couldn't do it. I may not have to 'scrub' my body but those private parts needs some soap.   I could go deeper into the subject but....  Yeah, no.

I also cannot go to bed without washing my face, flossing, and brushing my teeth.  And that can be at four o'clock in the morning no matter how dead tired I am.  Ok.  Others may disagree

I'll share a bathroom with you next housewive's trip.

Where i live in Australia, bathing every day is not optional in summer, which is hot and humid most of the year. I get that people in cooler climes may not necessarilly do so, and it still creeps me out. 'Clean bodies in clean beds' was the mantra at my house, not to mention 'cleanliness is next to sexiness'. No offense to anyone with skin issues, I get that. 

[HunterHunted]

8 hours ago, Sage47 said:

I don’t only suspect Craig of being gay due to crossed legs, dapper dressing and high interest in fabric shopping. And yes, of COURSE there are straight men into that stuff! 

 It is his non-sexual chemistry with Naomie or any of the girls, Cameran saying he’s basically a girl, his utter lack of ambition and testosterone as Sterling put it.  His saying he “wishes he were into guys”...just lots of things. 

I think he should be who he is and I wish him the best. Maybe he IS straight/metro. Either way dude, please light a fire under your ass. Get some mojo. He’s so...meh all the time. 

Just because Craig has no chemistry now with any of the women in the cast doesn't mean he's gay or suspected of being gay. We saw him be really into Kathryn in season 1. We saw him be into Naomie in the beginning of their relationship. We've seen him move on from those feelings since then. It's understandable that he wouldn't have the same chemistry with them.

Whitney has no chemistry with any of the women in the cast except for his mother despite claiming to be straight. Frankly, he has no chemistry with anyone except for Patricia and Thomas. It's the reason why there were fan questions about Whitney being into Thomas at the reunions for the first 2 years of the show. It's also why we've joked about about Patricia and Whitney being runners up at Mother Boy for 49 straight years. At this point, he's wisely decided to keep himself and his relationships largely off the show.

The only men who come across as unassailably straight are Thomas, Shep, JD, and Austen and they're douchey pigs. I've got to figure that there is something between Thomas and Whitney and Craig falls in that middle area.

Craig lacking ambition is no indication of his sexuality. It's just evidence of his laziness. Both Shep and Jax Taylor completely lack ambition and they are regarded as very straight cheating douches.

And I've heard a decent number of straight guys joke that they wish they were gay or into guys. Most of the time because they don't really want to deal with women or relationship shit. It's probably much more common than Craig's sewing.

All of these stereotypes about what does and doesn't make "a real man" only reinforces sexism, homophobia, bigotry, and utter shitbags like Thomas. All of this questioning his sexuality and masculinity by the cast is a way to diminish him for being "more like a woman" because he doesn't disdain "feminine things." It's fucking gross. Shit like this emboldens abusers. Craig says he's straight, then he's straight. Until he says different or we catch him with a dick in his mouth, then he's straight.

Criticize Craig for being lazy, whiny, and half-assing things. Criticize him for not having the self confidence to just tell the rest of them to go fuck themselves when they make fun of him. But don't second guess his sexuality and lump it in with his actual character flaws like they are the same thing.

The one thing I will give him is that I've known other attorneys who have been briefly on reality tv. The smartest thing Craig has done is after season 2, he's largely kept his legal stuff off the air. Craig's problem is that he has this whole other life that he's pursuing that he correctly keeps from the cameras. This means he is forced to come up with dumb shit to occupy his time when they film.

Edited May 21, 2018 by HunterHunted

[Sun-Bun]

1 hour ago, HunterHunted said:

I've never been impressed by Patricia. She's educated and traveled in well-heeled circles, but we get so little of her actual accomplishments and more of what "a lady should do." Finally, the fact that she raised the odious Whitney is a huge black mark against her for me.

Awwww, Whitney ain’t that bad, is he? I hear he’s actually pretty awkward on camera because he’s so self-conscious—-according to Shep and Cameron, he’s hilarious and pretty different offscreen. More relaxed and very humorous. Hey, I’m not a fan or anything, but I think it’s brilliant how he’s grown this quirky little television empire on Bravo. He may not be the greatest relationship-material and he comes off as rather slimy onscreen, but it’s interesting to see how he’s evolved since the show began.

Now Patricia may not be everyone’s cup of tea, but she’s sharp as a tack, witty and elegant, not to mention she isn’t your typical dumb golddigger who got lucky: the woman knows exactly what works with the upper echelon fellas in her scene. Her life views may be archaic and outdated, but consider her age: she’s a baby boomer who’s lived her whole life mostly surrounded by misogynists; doesn’t excuse her, just explains her. 

Patricia pretty much makes the show for me because her scenes are just so delightfully over the top and she always brings the extreme wealth porn.

[HunterHunted]

@Sun-Bun They can swear up and down that Whitney is great, but I basically trust this cast as much as I trust the Vanderpump Rules cast. This show has way more fingerprints of producer manipulation than Vanderpump Rules has. Plus all of these folks continue to hang out with Thomas when they aren't filming. I don't know how they can refrain from vomiting at the sight of him. I can barely choke back my bile just watching him on TV.

My mother is the same age as Patricia, an Ivy league grad, and an African woman with a PhD. She's sailed around the world. She's been a merchant marine. She's lived in Europe for extended periods and worked for the UN. She's also worked and traveled in some of these same circles as Patricia. She's been on boards with some of these same people in Patricia's set. Patricia is a snob who has internalized all of that misogyny. My mother is nothing like Patricia because my mom, as a Black woman, never had the luxury of reinforcing the status quo.

[Sun-Bun]

Oh I agree with you there: much as I like and enjoy Mama Pat, she’s a big ol’ snob. Ditto Whit. 

[SoTheresThat]

On ‎5‎/‎19‎/‎2018 at 7:32 AM, Sterling said:

What is NTTAWWT ?

snip

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

[lisalionheart]

On 5/18/2018 at 10:06 AM, Duke2801 said:

But I'm not buying Kathryn's oh-so-chaste redemption arc.  She's just masking the crazy with heavy psych meds - and yeah, staying off the booze is probably also keeping it in check, too. 

If this is true (and I have no idea whether it is), it is exactly what we want people with mental health problems that contributed to addition to do: take prescribed medication and be sober. Those are hard things. We know she is self-conscious about her body, and lots of psychiatric medications cause weight gain. She's behaved badly in the past, but I don't think we can fault her for taking care of herself--and needing to take medication isn't a moral failing. She also doesn't seem overmedicated to me, given that she seems engaged with her colleagues and is making some pretty self-aware jokes.

[ivygirl]

On 5/19/2018 at 8:20 AM, JenE4 said:

And dying over Patricia’s reactions to Ashley comparing herself to a Barbie Doll and the prostitute from “Pretty Woman.” While both of these comparisons are dead-on accurate and 100% Ashley’s life ambition, she’s “too California” to know these are not the images to project in Charleston high society. Is this season of Southern Charm brought to you by Gwynn’s? Got $10,000 burning a hole in your pocket? Come to Gwynn’s! Free bracelet consultation with every purchase!

Five percent of every sale goes to support Gwynn’s Personal Shopping Internship for Wayward Girls!

23 hours ago, SuprSuprElevated said:

I would love to have a job like that.  Spend other people's money in an attempt to make them look nice.  

A bit like grown-up paper dolls, for pay.

I can see two types of people hiring such a service; those with impossibly busy schedules, and those with no ability to put together a competent look.  From what I can tell, there are plenty of both walking this earth.

Yep, and services like Stitch Fix aim to serve women who may not have as much money, but who lack time and don’t want to spend it shopping and/or appreciate the fashion help.

9 hours ago, Sage47 said:

I don’t only suspect Craig of being gay due to crossed legs, dapper dressing and high interest in fabric shopping. And yes, of COURSE there are straight men into that stuff! 

 It is his non-sexual chemistry with Naomie or any of the girls, Cameran saying he’s basically a girl, his utter lack of ambition and testosterone as Sterling put it.  His saying he “wishes he were into guys”...just lots of things. I

Yeah, I’m with those above who think this has more to do with the women he’s around, rather than his sexuality. He also may just be one of those guys who doesn’t like to put his sexual chemistry on display, or who’s nervous about it for whatever reason.

[RedHawk]

On 5/19/2018 at 8:53 PM, ProudMary said:

As a matter of fact, here in the Charleston broadcast market, we did get a commercial for Gwynn's midway through the show.  I had never seen a TV advertisement for them prior to this.  Our local TV ads are predominately for ambulance chasing lawyers, including the one who fired Craig a few seasons back. ☺

LOL! I’m here in Charleston visiting friends. Turned to the local NBC station this morning and the first ad I saw was for that lawyer Craig worked for. And just as you said, all the other commercials were for ambulance chasing lawyers!

[Former Nun]

3 hours ago, RedHawk said:

And just as you said, all the other commercials were for ambulance chasing lawyers!

...for ambulance chasing lawyers too!

[slowpoked]

19 hours ago, lisalionheart said:

If this is true (and I have no idea whether it is), it is exactly what we want people with mental health problems that contributed to addition to do: take prescribed medication and be sober. Those are hard things. We know she is self-conscious about her body, and lots of psychiatric medications cause weight gain. She's behaved badly in the past, but I don't think we can fault her for taking care of herself--and needing to take medication isn't a moral failing. She also doesn't seem overmedicated to me, given that she seems engaged with her colleagues and is making some pretty self-aware jokes.

I agree with you. Plus part of what you originally quoted goes to the stigma of treating mental health issues - "eh, they can do whatever, they still going to be cray-cray." We want these people to get better, we want them to be on a better path, whether it be just for show or not.

I watch another show that deals with mental health issues - Homeland - and we've had a lot of discussions about whether the medication is working, if it stops working, how to cope, etc.

So far, Kathryn keeping sober and taking her meds is a good sign. Whether it just be with the promise of a Bravo paycheck or not.

Edited May 21, 2018 by slowpoked

[Duke2801]

18 hours ago, lisalionheart said:

If this is true (and I have no idea whether it is), it is exactly what we want people with mental health problems that contributed to addition to do: take prescribed medication and be sober. Those are hard things. We know she is self-conscious about her body, and lots of psychiatric medications cause weight gain. She's behaved badly in the past, but I don't think we can fault her for taking care of herself--and needing to take medication isn't a moral failing. She also doesn't seem overmedicated to me, given that she seems engaged with her colleagues and is making some pretty self-aware jokes.

Yes, of course. My point was that I don't like - or trust - the woman because of what she's done to her kids, NOT because she's an addict or mentally ill. She's having a redemption arc, though, and even though I don't like her, I do honestly hope she continues on the sober path.  Do I have doubts? Hell yes.  But I hope I'm wrong.  

I'm not sure what your comment about the meds and the weight gain have to do with anything?  She doesn't look like she's gained weight?  And even if she did and that was "hard" on her because she's "self-conscious about her body"?  Sorry but.... cue the world's tiniest violin. That should be the LEAST of her worries at the moment.   

Edited May 21, 2018 by Duke2801

[SuprSuprElevated]

KD from season one, KD after Kenzie's birth, and KD from current Instagram.  I'd say she's gained a bit.  She's down a lot from her heaviest, after giving birth to Kenzie, but I'd say she's bigger than before motherhood.

Edit - I think she looks great right now.  She looked perfectly skeletal in the first photo.

Edited May 21, 2018 by SuprSuprElevated

[Major Bigtime]

My one observation is that Kathryn knows nothing about being a stylist. The wardrobe crew dresses her on the show, and the things she picked out for the imaginary client were.... well.... not good. She didn’t accessorize anything.

Craig runs like a girl.

Austen’s mouth is now taking on a life of it’s own.

Cam.... pop that kid out already!

I wanted to eat the food at Patricia’s dinner, but the company could mostly go home. All J.D. was missing is a skipper’s hat for that getup.

[SunnyBeBe]

I try not to be mean, but, Austen really does have thin calves.  Or was that my tv being wonky?  He looked too delicate to run on those legs. 

[ProudMary]

47 minutes ago, Major Bigtime said:

I wanted to eat the food at Patricia’s dinner, but the company could mostly go home. All J.D. was missing is a skipper’s hat for that getup.

LOL!

I also like Dustin Waters' description of J.D. at Patricia's party in his latest Southern Charm review for Charleston City Paper.

https://m.charlestoncitypaper.com/HolyCinema/archives/2018/05/18/confessions-of-a-southern-charm-newbie-a-deadmans-party

Quote

Then J.D. runs in looking like he just got back from a Little Rascals audition. ‘My mom said I could come to the party if I quit stealing crabapples from Old Man Gregory’s yard.’

The entire write-up is fairly well side splitting!