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The Lonely Js Club: James, Jackson & Johannah

SpaghettiTuesdays

By SpaghettiTuesdays
in Counting On

Scarlett45
Message added by Scarlett45,

Discussing the charges against Jana is fine, but do not post any information that reveals her address/contact information- even if said documents are public (i.e. a part of court proceedings.)

Discussing charges against Jana is NOT a jumping off point to speculate on other instances abuse/neglect etc towards the M-children or to elaborate on Josh's conviction and potential victims.  

 

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Ijustwantsomechips
Ijustwantsomechips

Maybe Jana needs her own thread as a token of the respect she’ll never garner as a single woman in Gothardland.  

andromeda331
andromeda331

How about both hop in the plane close the door really quickly and fly off.  Abbie: "Where are we going?" JD: Cayman Islands. We're elope. And we're not coming back! Abbie: Wait we need

BitterApple
BitterApple

Wow, so this is what, the fourth guy to publicly release a statement denying involvement with Jana? That must be doing wonders for her self-esteem.  These guys are starting to piss me off, though

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lascuba

lascuba

On 7/5/2020 at 2:14 PM, cmr2014 said:

I think you're right, but I also think that horse has already left the barn.

Jana is Josie's sister, not her mother. Her mother (and father) have failed her as parents, and a firm, but loving sister will not be able to make up for that. I think that your cousin's fate is already in the cards for Josie.

I agree. Unlike for the rest of her sibling peers, Josie's older siblings are just her siblings and not pseudo parents, because Michelle actually raised her early on. She's not going to acknowledge Jana's authority like the other kids do.

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Temperance

Temperance

(edited)

I mentioned this in the TLC/media thread but US Weekly has interview with Jana Duggar! 

Full headline:

Jana Duggar Longs to Be Married But Is ‘Making the Most’ of Her Single Years: ‘I’m Not That Worried’

Dating herself first! Jana Duggar isn’t too stressed about her love life right now but hopes she’ll still be able to find The One someday.

“I’m not that worried,” the Growing Up Duggar: It’s All About Relationships coauthor, 30, said while speaking to Us Weekly exclusively with her mother, Michelle Duggar, on Thursday, July 2. “Yes, I long to be married and one day I think that will come, but I think … I’m just also just trying to stay busy with whatever comes along my path.”

While the 19 Kids and Counting alum admitted that she sometimes feels “a little more pressure” to take the next big step, she’s focusing on “making the most” of her single years. “I think if I sit there and I’m like, ‘Oh no, I’m not married’ and just [get] all worried about it, it makes things way worse,” she explained.

Jana previously opened up about her dating life during an October 2019 episode of TLC’s Counting On, admitting that there “have been a number of guys” who have asked her out — but “none of them worked out.”

“[My siblings] have been in relationships, courtships, whatever you want to label it as. Of course, it doesn’t always end in marriage and that’s OK,” she said at the time. “You have to sometimes talk to someone, get to know someone and realize, you know what, it doesn’t have to end in marriage.”

While many of her family members have already walked down the aisle and started families of their own, Jana is holding out hope that someday she’ll find a lifelong love like her parents have had for more than 30 years.

“They’re quick to forgive and to make, really try to make things right,” the reality star told Us of her mom, 53, and dad, Jim Bob Duggar, who exchanged their vows in 1984. “The genuine love that they still have for one another … this young love and they still have that, you know, today. I think that’s rare to see couples that are their age and been married that long.”

The season 11 premiere of Counting On airs on TLC on Tuesday, July 7, at 8 p.m. ET.

Edited by Temperance
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Marshmallow Mollie

Marshmallow Mollie

6 hours ago, Temperance said:

. “The genuine love that they still have for one another … this young love and they still have that, you know, today. I think that’s rare to see couples that are their age and been married that long.”

WTF?!?!

First of all, young love. I’ve been with my husband for 21 years and married for 15. Sure, he can drive me up one wall and down another, and I can anticipate what he is going to say before he says it, but I would take a mature, tested marriage over what I thought love was on my wedding day, any day of the week. Young love is shallow and sex-driven. Twenty years in, the depths of love and trust and shared experience is fulfilling and enriching. I don’t want to say better, but it’s better. And the sex is better.

Secondly, shouldn’t their culture celebrate the advantages of having a long marriage? Make a long and happy marriage the goal post and not a perpetual honeymoon marriage?

Finally, considering how few people Jana knows, what the hell with knocking other long term marriages? Is she saying her parents’ marriage is better than the Caldwell’s? The Forsyth’s? I know in actuality she is just parroting back what has been said, and tsk tsk to the Duggars knocking other marriages. At least talk about it only to each other, not in front of your children, however “grown” they are.

What a strange article from start to finish. Super weird Michelle was there. Interesting Jana backed off the courtship definitions. I think the Duggars realized they messed up with all this courtship business.

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ginger90

ginger90

7 hours ago, Temperance said:

. “The genuine love that they still have for one another … this young love and they still have that, you know, today. I think that’s rare to see couples that are their age and been married that long.”

Based on their ages when they married, it makes it somewhat “rare”, I suppose.

Their anniversary is July 24, 1984. Jim Bob was 19, Michelle was 17, from what I recall.

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lascuba

lascuba

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Taking her statements at face value (stupid thing to do considering she's a Duggar, I know), it seems like Jana really does idealize her parents' marriage and is waiting for that lightening strike. I'm comparing her to my perception of Jessa, who I think looks at her parents and understands intuitively that Michelle settled with a man a lot more into her than she was into him, and that she makes a thousand tiny compromises to keep him sweet so she can get what she wants in the larger scheme of things. That's something I thought Jessa was attempting to emulate when she settled on Ben.

Jana seems to look at her parents and genuinely believe that they're a love match for the ages, and she wants a man that she'll love so much it will be easy to submit, when the reality is that the reason that marriage works is because Michelle is much more calculating than her adoring gaze and high pitched simpering would have one believe. Jana is clearly a strong-willed person, and I think one reason her relationships haven't worked out is because she's waiting for a man that will make her want to do nothing but gaze and simper, not realizing that it's all an act on Michelle's part to keep things running smoothly.

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Minivanessa

Minivanessa

1 hour ago, lascuba said:

Taking her statements at face value (stupid thing to do considering she's a Duggar, I know), it seems like Jana really does idealize her parents' marriage and is waiting for that lightening strike. I'm comparing her to my perception of Jessa, who I think looks at her parents and understands intuitively that Michelle settled with a man a lot more into her than she was into him, and that she makes a thousand tiny compromises to keep him sweet so she can get what she wants in the larger scheme of things. That's something I thought Jessa was attempting to emulate when she settled on Ben.

Jana seems to look at her parents and genuinely believe that they're a love match for the ages, and she wants a man that she'll love so much it will be easy to submit, when the reality is that the reason that marriage works is because Michelle is much more calculating than her adoring gaze and high pitched simpering would have one believe. Jana is clearly a strong-willed person, and I think one reason her relationships haven't worked out is because she's waiting for a man that will make her want to do nothing but gaze and simper, not realizing that it's all an act on Michelle's part to keep things running smoothly.

This really resonates with me. It's hard to know if that's what Jana thinks or if she's just very good at spouting her parents' official party line.

Assuming she believes what she says, it doesn't surprise me. She apparently has had extremely limited contact with the world outside her family of origin. It's not just that she lives in her parents' home; lots of adults do that - but still develop their own lives and ideas. And they develop, over time, their own perspective on their parents (vs. what they believe about them as a child). That comes from having a mind that's strong enough to survive any indoctrination you went through in childhood (if any), and from getting out and about in the world on your own. Even just normal schooling, work experiences, being out and about in the world doing daily stuff. You rub up against different people and ideas and that affects how you view your own family. 

Jana's not just physically residing at the TTH; she has no life outside her family, as far as we can tell. Certainly she has no life outside the church/IBLP/family circles that her parents have staked out as acceptable. I don't know if they require Jana to have an accountability partner to leave the house, or if that's just made-for-TV bullsh*t.

OTOH, Jana may have some insight into how her parents' marriage really works. But if so, she's either buried them so far that she's unconsciously parroting the official family line, or she's more aware of those subversive thoughts and is somewhat consciously parroting it. 

I don't know what she really thinks, but she's certainly had few opportunities to mature in any way other than how her parents have shaped her life and mind. She may have a naturally very private nature and shy away from intimacy. But anyway she's been a Duggar rockstar at keeping sweet and spouting the party line, so JB must consider her a great asset to the family business. If only he could generate a courtship and marriage for her, to perk up the ratings for the TV show, she'd be just about perfect. For him.

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Churchhoney

Churchhoney

(edited)
18 hours ago, Temperance said:

Also if I didn't spend too much time here, I wouldn't know which brother is Jed!, running for office. That's pretty dumb; they should make it clear who Jed! is. 

I think that's an excellent point. ... As I look at Jed!, though, I see not just a punchable face but an unelectable face....So maybe there's an upside. 😁

Edited by Churchhoney
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Churchhoney

Churchhoney

16 hours ago, emma675 said:

Wtf are they trying to accomplish with this? It's basically just a row of ignorant, entitled, arrogant white men. You can find that almost anywhere. 

Is this the group that sings together? I think it might be.....I'm sure Josiah isn't part of the singing group, and I kind of think Jackson isn't either. but  Joe definitely is.

So....maybe they intend to use it as their PR picture....They don't seem to sing in public that much but they do once in a while. Maybe they'd send a picture around to solicit gigs or something. 

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dargosmydaddy

dargosmydaddy

22 minutes ago, Churchhoney said:

Is this the group that sings together? I think it might be.....I'm sure Josiah isn't part of the singing group, and I kind of think Jackson isn't either. but  Joe definitely is.

I thought at one point Jackson was allowed to sing with them... but maybe he got booted out since then.

(Found this video from January, and Jackson sang:

 

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Scarlett45

Scarlett45

I understand why Jana is not married. Jana has a lot more freedom NOW than many women her age in her social circle and why would she want to give that up for someone she’s not really into? 
 

Jana isn’t looking at it like we are- in her mind her choices are 1. Her life now, 2. Married to a guy who controls her every move and a baby every year whether she wants it or not. 
 

I would rather be single Jana than a married Jana either day of the week; and although she is a very private person I feel she values her freedom. I do think Jana will get married before the age of 40 (like most women), but not before she wants to. 

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lascuba

lascuba

6 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I understand why Jana is not married. Jana has a lot more freedom NOW than many women her age in her social circle and why would she want to give that up for someone she’s not really into? 
 

Jana isn’t looking at it like we are- in her mind her choices are 1. Her life now, 2. Married to a guy who controls her every move and a baby every year whether she wants it or not. 
 

I would rather be single Jana than a married Jana either day of the week; and although she is a very private person I feel she values her freedom. I do think Jana will get married before the age of 40 (like most women), but not before she wants to. 

That's definitely how I would look at it, and while I think she thinks that way up to a point--why get married to guy who's going to control her life and likely not provide the comfort and relative freedom she has now--I also think there's a lot of wanting to meet the "perfect" man who will sweep her off her feet. I believe her when she says she longs to be married, but she has enough pragmatism to not rush into anything. She also seems to a bit of a romantic with a very limited view of what love looks like, and if her relationships don't look like that, then it must not be love and she's not interested.

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Scarlett45

Scarlett45

3 minutes ago, lascuba said:

That's definitely how I would look at it, and while I think she thinks that way up to a point--why get married to guy who's going to control her life and likely not provide the comfort and relative freedom she has now--I also think there's a lot of wanting to meet the "perfect" man who will sweep her off her feet. I believe her when she says she longs to be married, but she has enough pragmatism to not rush into anything. She also seems to a bit of a romantic with a very limited view of what love looks like, and if her relationships don't look like that, then it must not be love and she's not interested.

Isn’t that most people* though who haven’t been married/partnered for a long time? 
 

Even though Jana has seen her parents be married (and other elders in her culture) how much perspective can she have if she’s never actually experienced it for herself. I am not trying to “infantilize” Jana here, I fully understand she is an adult woman with the cognitive ability to make her own choices- but until you’ve done something (like been partnered) you aren’t going to have the same view on it as watching others do it. Kind of like driving. 
 

*Im speaking of people in our culture who marry/partner due to perceptions of romantic love, not people who marry/partner for other reasons. 

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BitterApple

BitterApple

I think Jana is between a rock and a hard place. I totally understand not wanting to get married for the sake of getting married. However, normal Christian guys with an ounce of self-respect aren't going to tap dance for Boob, especially men in their 30s. 

Also, Jana gives off a weary, aged vibe. I know it isn't her fault, but she doesn't strike me as a particularly fun or upbeat person to be around. She's very pretty, but just sort of....there. 

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Churchhoney

Churchhoney

1 hour ago, dargosmydaddy said:

I thought at one point Jackson was allowed to sing with them... but maybe he got booted out since then.

(Found this video from January, and Jackson sang:

 

Thanks. Ever since I wrote that, I've had the haunting feeling that I'd seen Jackson sing with them, too. And this was it......! 

lascuba

lascuba

35 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

Isn’t that most people* though who haven’t been married/partnered for a long time? 
 

Even though Jana has seen her parents be married (and other elders in her culture) how much perspective can she have if she’s never actually experienced it for herself. I am not trying to “infantilize” Jana here, I fully understand she is an adult woman with the cognitive ability to make her own choices- but until you’ve done something (like been partnered) you aren’t going to have the same view on it as watching others do it. Kind of like driving. 
 

*Im speaking of people in our culture who marry/partner due to perceptions of romantic love, not people who marry/partner for other reasons. 

I might be projecting a bit. I've never been a stereotypical romantic type, and as a teen and young adult I would think that me not feeling/acting like my peers when I was really into a guy meant that it wasn't "real" or something, when the reality is that acting like the stereotype of "head over heels" is about personality type more than anything. I don't think Jana is at all interested in the Jeremy or Derick or Austin types, but I do think she looked at how her sisters acted in the first blush of infatuation with them and is expecting to be so in love that she acts that silly, and when that doesn't happen, the relationship becomes a non-starter for her.

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Scarlett45

Scarlett45

3 minutes ago, lascuba said:

I might be projecting a bit. I've never been a stereotypical romantic type, and as a teen and young adult I would think that me not feeling/acting like my peers when I was really into a guy meant that it wasn't "real" or something, when the reality is that acting like the stereotype of "head over heels" is about personality type more than anything. I don't think Jana is at all interested in the Jeremy or Derick or Austin types, but I do think she looked at how her sisters acted in the first blush of infatuation with them and is expecting to be so in love that she acts that silly, and when that doesn't happen, the relationship becomes a non-starter for her.

Oh I see what you’re saying. There are 7 billion human beings on this planet, so no two people are going to experience emotions in the exact same way. 
 

Also romantic love doesn’t carry the same level of importance to each individual person as it does to our culture at large in terms of partnering. Some people aren’t as motivated by their drive for partnered sex either. Nothing wrong with Jana if those things aren’t as important to her. 
 

I can admit that I may be projecting a bit because romantic love isn’t something that drives me to make choices, nor is it something I desire for myself. Jana may be like that. Why compromise your freedom for nothing?

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Ijustwantsomechips

Ijustwantsomechips

Nothing wrong with wanting a loving, fulfilling relationship. However...no one is perfect.  Not even your dad. And what works for one relationship may not work for another so it’s generally not a good idea to pattern your love life or prospective love life after that of someone you know.  Chances are they’re only showing you the good parts anyway. 

My grandmother always told us a story of a childhood friend who never thought any interested suitors were good enough. No matter who the man was, whenever you’d ask about him she’d always say, “That fool?”  My grandparents were married for 60 years, while she died a alone.  

Of course, there is nothing wrong with singleness  and child-free by choice. No one person can check every box on an extensive list of character and physical traits. Someone should warn Jana about being too picky though. 

image.jpeg.b23a6cc27cc1d6b0f2afd8ead1820786.jpeg

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lookeyloo

lookeyloo

We are assuming Jana does want to meet the perfect man, soul mate, to sweep her off her feet.  Maybe she has no desires, all this is lip service, and not saying she is “close” with Laura but maybe she is asexual, aromantic, etc and her lifestyle suits her. One day she and Josie will be alone, can dump the TTH and live a quiet life. Maybe Jana will have domesticated Josie by then. 

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Ohiopirate02

Ohiopirate02

54 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

Oh I see what you’re saying. There are 7 billion human beings on this planet, so no two people are going to experience emotions in the exact same way. 
 

Also romantic love doesn’t carry the same level of importance to each individual person as it does to our culture at large in terms of partnering. Some people aren’t as motivated by their drive for partnered sex either. Nothing wrong with Jana if those things aren’t as important to her. 
 

I can admit that I may be projecting a bit because romantic love isn’t something that drives me to make choices, nor is it something I desire for myself. Jana may be like that. Why compromise your freedom for nothing?

I feel the same way.  Finding a partner was never a big priority for me, and I am comfortable with myself being single indefinitely.  If it happens it happens, but I have never actively sought a partner.  Jana may feel the same way, but her cult will not allow her to publicly admit this.  Gothardism does not allow a person to choose the single life except for old Bill there.  

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rue721

rue721

It would surprise me if Jana didn’t have unrealistic views on romantic love and relationships. Where would she get realistic views? She’s been fed bizarre BS about it her whole life.

I think it’s also very possible that she’s just not all that attracted to men, and has interpreted her lack of attraction as not yet finding “the right” man. And to be fair, maybe that’s true. Maybe she actually hasn’t met someone she can really connect with yet. Or maybe she has but they were the “wrong” gender/religion/whatever, so it didn’t go anywhere.

That said, she doesn’t seem happy where she is. So I think she’ll ultimately get married on the off chance it’ll be better.

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Future Cat Lady

Future Cat Lady

2 hours ago, laurakaye said:

The main thing I got from the interview was that a 30-year old woman had to be interviewed with her mother present.

What really bothers me is that (it seems) she's not allowed to have her own life. She can't have a job, go to school, have an apartment. She most likely gets an allowance from her father, but you can bet they look at what she buys. There is nothing wrong with being single or living with yoyr parents by choice or necessity, but that's not her case. Jana is still needs her parents permission to do things.

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Scarlett45

Scarlett45

7 minutes ago, Future Cat Lady said:

What really bothers me is that (it seems) she's not allowed to have her own life. She can't have a job, go to school, have an apartment. She most likely gets an allowance from her father, but you can bet they look at what she buys. There is nothing wrong with being single or living with yoyr parents by choice or necessity, but that's not her case. Jana is still needs her parents permission to do things.

Oh yeah of course. Jana is not an autonomous adult in her social milieu- and she won’t ever be until her father or husband dies. But I don’t think she ever considered what life would be like as an autonomous adult- what examples has she seen of that among people she actually cares about? She hasn’t. That’s why I think she’s making choices based on what she sees her options to be not as the secular world sees her options. 

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Scarlett45
Message added by Scarlett45,

Discussing the charges against Jana is fine, but do not post any information that reveals her address/contact information- even if said documents are public (i.e. a part of court proceedings.)

Discussing charges against Jana is NOT a jumping off point to speculate on other instances abuse/neglect etc towards the M-children or to elaborate on Josh's conviction and potential victims.  

 

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