The Lonely Js Club: James, Jackson & Johannah

[Defrauder]

39 minutes ago, NewDigs said:

I think she should go with the vineyard.

Definitely.  And when she makes a profit not hand it over to her headship.  I think they could use a winery.

[Arwen Evenstar]

3 hours ago, Defrauder said:

Definitely.  And when she makes a profit not hand it over to her headship.  I think they could use a winery.

Do you really think you'd want to drink wine made from grapes squished by Duggardirty bare feet?  Dontcha know, the wine that Jesus drank was really grape juice ?  That's how it was explained to me in Fundy Skool...no shit

[NewDigs]

1 hour ago, Arwen Evenstar said:

Do you really think you'd want to drink wine made from grapes squished by Duggardirty bare feet?  Dontcha know, the wine that Jesus drank was really grape juice ?  That's how it was explained to me in Fundy Skool...no shit

[sometimesy]

2 hours ago, Arwen Evenstar said:

Do you really think you'd want to drink wine made from grapes squished by Duggardirty bare feet?  Dontcha know, the wine that Jesus drank was really grape juice ?  That's how it was explained to me in Fundy Skool...no shit

Poor lonely j's. Do they understand that the refrigerators were really unreliable 2,000 years ago? Even if they started out with grape juice it would become wine in the dinosaur baggage hold.

[Arwen Evenstar]

3 hours ago, sometimesy said:

Poor lonely j's. Do they understand that the refrigerators were really unreliable 2,000 years ago? Even if they started out with grape juice it would become wine in the dinosaur baggage hold.

I doubt chemistry was taught at SOTDRT.  The trip to the Creation Museum was allthesciencethey needed to know. Sex education is taught on the wedding day, using Legos.

Edited September 25, 2016 by Arwen Evenstar
Bad typos

[Zella]

48 minutes ago, Arwen Evenstar said:

 Sex education is taught on the wedding day, using Legos.

I just about died laughing at this. :D

[Trillium]

56 minutes ago, Arwen Evenstar said:

 Sex education is taught on the wedding day, using Legos.

Given what has come to light since Boob's Lego sex talk about Joshley, it's even more skeevy. He knew Josh had watched porn, but needed to parade his son's "purity" and "innocence" around for the cameras. Not that the audience needs to know anything about his or his family's sex lives. They could have just skipped the talk and Boob speaking to the congregation at the wedding. But lying about it to make money and make yourself look good to others makes Baby Jesus cry. 

[Jynnan tonnix]

1 hour ago, Zella said:

I just about died laughing at this. :D

Even "tab 'a' goes into slot 'b' ",  is more descriptive than legos!

[Arwen Evenstar]

Jana as Lorde in Royals.

It must really suck to be Jana. She's a grown ass woman, but she's trapped in the Stinkertoy House.  I just don't see how anyone could be happy under those circumstances.  She's either going to lose her shit big time, or she's going to pen a tell-all book that will be very damning.

[Sew Sumi]

Or she's going to end up like Sarah Maxwell. I hate to say it, but I'm afraid Jana is too taken in by the cult to either lose her shit or write a tell-all. Actually, I think she's the LAST Duggar I could see doing either. 

[GeeGolly]

I'm hoping that Jana is still at home and single by choice. She said recently that she wanted to be able to work beside her husband. Maybe its a calculated move not to be home alone with a dozen or so kids. I'm at least hoping that Jana being single means that JB's & M's love for their kids is greater than their want of a Fundy army and they're not forcing her to marry.

Maybe Jana still remembers being poor and hungry. Maybe she remembers her mother melting down.

For some reason I see Jana as a woman who questions their Gothardness, but with great fear. Like she has moments of real life clarity and finds ways to discount them to be able to toe the party line with some semblance of peacefulness. 

Or maybe I make that shit up in my head because I don't want to think of her wondering why God is punishing her by not bringing her the husband that she has be praying for.

[Marigold]

I have always suspected that Jana is not into Gothard but is yet a Christian woman. Just not so extreme.  I also think Jana stays only because of the children.   Jana loves those kids like crazy and fears what will happen if she leaves.  If anyone knows the truth about Michelle, it is Jana.  She stays because she loves those kids. 

Edited September 26, 2016 by Marigold

[laurakaye]

2 hours ago, Marigold said:

I have always suspected that Jana is not into Gothard but is yet a Christian woman. Just not so extreme.  I also think Jana stays only because of the children.   Jana loves those kids like crazy and fears what will happen if she leaves.  If anyone knows the truth about Michelle, it is Jana.  She stays because she loves those kids. 

I think this may also be true of JD, having to be the de facto oldest brother and protector of his sisters...and afraid of what might happen if he left, knowing that Josh is free and roaming around, knowing JB will cover up anything that happens, and that Michelle is too checked out to care.

[sometimesy]

Jana and JD are doing the parenting. The biological parents just stuff their head in the screen to keep up the act and get a cut for appearances. 

[Quilt Fairy]

I keep going back to Joy's comment on not needing algebra. Everyone needs algebra. I graduated with a bachelor's in mathematics, and I spent my whole working life of 35 years in various technical jobs. You know the one field of math I needed on a regular basis? It wasn't calculus or differential equations or number theory. I left those behind in college. It wasn't even high school geometry or trigonometry. It was - wait for it - algebra. And very basic algebra at that, being able to solve simple equations for an unknown. And it was the same skill I used in daily living, albeit in real life "word problems" that any adult needs to be able to figure out.  It's things like if the box of grits gives you measurements for 1 person and then 4 people being able to figure out what you need for 2 people. Or how many rolls of wallpaper you need to cover the walls of a room given the square footage of the walls and the square footage of each roll minus allowances for pattern matching. That's algebra, folks. People just don't realize it. 

Edited September 26, 2016 by Quilt Fairy

[Defrauder]

8 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

I'm hoping that Jana is still at home and single by choice. She said recently that she wanted to be able to work beside her husband. Maybe its a calculated move not to be home alone with a dozen or so kids. I'm at least hoping that Jana being single means that JB's & M's love for their kids is greater than their want of a Fundy army and they're not forcing her to marry.

Maybe Jana still remembers being poor and hungry. Maybe she remembers her mother melting down.

For some reason I see Jana as a woman who questions their Gothardness, but with great fear. Like she has moments of real life clarity and finds ways to discount them to be able to toe the party line with some semblance of peacefulness. 

Or maybe I make that shit up in my head because I don't want to think of her wondering why God is punishing her by not bringing her the husband that she has be praying for.

You may be completely right about Jana perhaps not wanting to be a mother of a dozen or more kids and also relating that to her memories of being poor and hungry.  Since she lived in the house where 14 kids were shoved into 2 bedrooms until she was 16 that's got to be ingrained into her psyche big time.  She, being the oldest daughter probably also had the most responsibility when it came to raising all of her mother's children.  She's practically been a mother her whole life already - so the anticipation of becoming a mom or taking care of newborns and tons of children - it's like been there done that.  She may want to get married but she knows what that means.  She spent most of her childhood in prairie dresses and being forced to be in awe of Gothard and his teachings so she probably equates that with being Christian and her religion has been her emotional support so she could have mixed feelings without any way to sort them out.  I think she just tries to make the best of things.  She's still in a dorm with a 6, 7, 9, and 11 year old.  Still doing most of the work.

[sometimesy]

1 hour ago, Quilt Fairy said:

I keep going back to Joy's comment on not needing algebra. Everyone needs algebra. I graduated with a bachelor's in mathematics, and I spent my whole working life of 35 years in various technical jobs. You know the one field of math I needed on a regular basis? It wasn't calculus or differential equations or number theory. I left those behind in college. It wasn't even high school geometry or trigonometry. It was - wait for it - algebra. And very basic algebra at that, being able to solve simple equations for an unknown. And it was the same skill I used in daily living, albeit in real life "word problems" that any adult needs to be able to figure out.  It's things like if the box of grits gives you measurements for 1 person and then 4 people being able to figure out what you need for 2 people. Or how many rolls of wallpaper you need to cover the walls of a room given the square footage of the walls and the square footage of each roll minus allowances for pattern matching. That's algebra, folks. People just don't realize it. 

There was a scene a while back with the girls trying to make a recipe change using a fraction... let's just say those girls (like Joy), also don't feel the calling to be engineers. 

[BitterApple]

11 minutes ago, sometimesy said:

There was a scene a while back with the girls trying to make a recipe change using a fraction... let's just say those girls (like Joy), also don't feel the calling to be engineers. 

I don't know if we're thinking of the same scene, but a while back they showed Jinger baking bread. She couldn't figure out how to multiply the bread recipe to get a larger batch of dough so she just guesstimated the proper ratio of ingredients. The result was a soupy mess. 

[Sew Sumi]

Jana also had trouble with rice to water ratios when she and Muffy made the Nepali dinner for Dreck.

[Arwen Evenstar]

1 hour ago, Sew Sumi said:

Jana also had trouble with rice to water ratios when she and Muffy made the Nepali dinner for Dreck.

That was pretty sad. I always thought in their world that a female's raison d'être was all about cooking and cleaning and being a proper wife.

[JoanArc]

Again, ratios? That's 5th or 6th grade level work. Max. Jesus.

Edited September 26, 2016 by JoanArc

[ginger90]

And rice is equal parts water and rice, the kind I make, so multiplying isn't a skill unless it's babies, I suppose.

[Defrauder]

I think the math problem the Duggar females have is accepted and even expected and excused by the fact that they are female and mathematical aptitude is exclusive for the the male brains only.  Women just aren't supposed to be 'logical' or as good at these things as men are - and if they were it might threaten the masculine ego.  As horrible as it is to even imagine I think being unable to comprehend mathematical concepts beyond simple addition/subtraction and multiplication is seen as a feminine quality to strive for and be proud of.

[Love2dance]

Just now, ginger90 said:

And rice is equal parts water and rice, the kind I make, so multiplying isn't a skill unless it's babies, I suppose.

Mine is always 2 parts water to 1 part rice. So it involves heavy duty multiplying beyond Duggar math.

[Sew Sumi]

5 minutes ago, ginger90 said:

And rice is equal parts water and rice, the kind I make, so multiplying isn't a skill unless it's babies, I suppose.

Mine's 2(ish...I go a little shy):1, and I think the Minute Rice they had was as well. They were feeding three. A cup of rice/half a cup of water would have been plenty. Geez.

[Vaysh]

Hell, if you want to be lazy just boil the rice in lots of water and drain it when cooked. I did this today and it actually came out better than when I measure the rice/water ratio. Just rinse the rice beforehand and it's all good.

[RazzleberryPie]

Seriously boxed rice has pictures on the back of how many cups of water go with how many cups of rice. You don't even have to be literate to make Uncle Ben's or Ricearoni type rice. 

That whole cooking segment befuddled me. Made me angry, too. These girls gave up real school (public/private/homeschool/take your pic) to focus on being future homemakers, and two of them can't handle making Minute Rice from a box. 

I guess homemaking skills = have long hair and a trim figure, and be a submissive doormat.

My grandmother and Nonna's (great grandmother) generations took home making skills very seriously, but those ladies could cook anything from scratch, sew, bake, preserve, garden, butcher, knit, clean, repair, etc. They could manage money like a boss, cure whatever ails you and were up to speed on child development issues.

Then my grandmother went back to school in her early 40s and taught home etc for 20 years. Nobody was ever a doormat. 

[PradaKitty]

Regarding Jana - she reminds me of a few of my friends who were the eldest in their families.  None of them have chosen to have children as they had already "raised" their brothers and sisters. Now, none of them were sister-moms on a Duggar level, so I can see why Jana has avoided marrying as she would be "expected" to have children. I really don't think she wants any of her own since the younger Duggars are already her children.

[GeeGolly]

9 hours ago, RazzleberryPie said:

Seriously boxed rice has pictures on the back of how many cups of water go with how many cups of rice. You don't even have to be literate to make Uncle Ben's or Ricearoni type rice. 

That whole cooking segment befuddled me. Made me angry, too. These girls gave up real school (public/private/homeschool/take your pic) to focus on being future homemakers, and two of them can't handle making Minute Rice from a box. 

I guess homemaking skills = have long hair and a trim figure, and be a submissive doormat.

My grandmother and Nonna's (great grandmother) generations took home making skills very seriously, but those ladies could cook anything from scratch, sew, bake, preserve, garden, butcher, knit, clean, repair, etc. They could manage money like a boss, cure whatever ails you and were up to speed on child development issues.

Then my grandmother went back to school in her early 40s and taught home etc for 20 years. Nobody was ever a doormat. 

You just described my mom.

[Arwen Evenstar]

9 hours ago, RazzleberryPie said:

Seriously boxed rice has pictures on the back of how many cups of water go with how many cups of rice. You don't even have to be literate to make Uncle Ben's or Ricearoni type rice. 

That whole cooking segment befuddled me. Made me angry, too. These girls gave up real school (public/private/homeschool/take your pic) to focus on being future homemakers, and two of them can't handle making Minute Rice from a box. 

I guess homemaking skills = have long hair and a trim figure, and be a submissive doormat.

My grandmother and Nonna's (great grandmother) generations took home making skills very seriously, but those ladies could cook anything from scratch, sew, bake, preserve, garden, butcher, knit, clean, repair, etc. They could manage money like a boss, cure whatever ails you and were up to speed on child development issues.

Then my grandmother went back to school in her early 40s and taught home etc for 20 years. Nobody was ever a doormat. 

THIS! It's the Duggar Conundrum...for all their fixation on training up young wifelings for godly marriage and motherhood, I've never seen a more hopeless or useless, laughable bunch of toe rags when it comes to their failing at making rice from a box with pictures. It would be comedic gold if it wasn't such a tragic case of a great disservice done to all the Duggar kids wrt an adequate education.

My mom made sure I knew how to cook, clean, sew, save money, garden, and repair things before I left home. When I got married was up to me, but my mom made sure her 2 girls and 2 boys could look after themselves. My mom didn't get to go to college, but she made sure we knew how important measurements and weights and fractions were to preparing meals.

[RazzleberryPie]

41 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

You just described my mom.

Aunt Connie is that you? Aunt Marie? Aunt Debbie? 

[laurakaye]

14 hours ago, Arwen Evenstar said:

My mom made sure I knew how to cook, clean, sew, save money, garden, and repair things before I left home. When I got married was up to me, but my mom made sure her 2 girls and 2 boys could look after themselves. My mom didn't get to go to college, but she made sure we knew how important measurements and weights and fractions were to preparing meals.

This is all basic information that a parent teaches a child.  It's common sense to give your child some life skills.  To not do so is neglectful.  That's why I simply cannot fathom how JB and Michelle can justify raising this large brood and sending them out into the world so unskilled.  They do understand that they won't be around forever, yes?  It's not funny to see Joy struggle to answer simple questions.  It's also not funny that Jinge has no freaking clue how to cook anything.  What might be worse is Josie possibly having delays in growth and not being treated.

Funny, it seems that the boys are able to learn independently, but the girls either cannot do the same, or have been taught that they don't actually need to use their brains, they just need to be able to pop out lots of babies.  

Edited September 28, 2016 by laurakaye

[Lemur]

15 minutes ago, laurakaye said:

This is all basic information that a parent teaches a child.  It's common sense to give your child some life skills.  To not do so is neglectful.  That's why I simply cannot fathom how JB and Michelle can justify raising this large brood and sending them out into the world so unskilled.  They do understand that they won't be around forever, yes?  It's not funny to see Joy struggle to answer simple questions.  It's also not funny that Jinge has no freaking clue how to cook anything.  What might be worse is Josie possibly having delays in growth and not being treated.

Funny, it seems that the boys are able to learn independently, but the girls either cannot do the same, or have been taught that they don't actually need to use their brains, they just need to be able to pop out lots of babies.  

Two things:

1.  Patriarchy.  Therefore, even if a girl knows math, her first response should always be "Math is haaaard, *giggle*." Because otherwise, she's encroaching on men's territory, which would gave her a stoning ... err, a burning ... err, make her a spinster ... err, is sinful.

2.  Who said anything about letting these kids loose out in the world?  They don't even get a Rumspringa to decide if they want to stay.  They don't need to have skills or jobs, they're Duggars.  They will continue to exist in their own little highly-processed world eating terrible food and living terrible lives. 

[Arwen Evenstar]

3 hours ago, Lemur said:

Two things:

1.  Patriarchy.  Therefore, even if a girl knows math, her first response should always be "Math is haaaard, *giggle*." Because otherwise, she's encroaching on men's territory, which would gave her a stoning ... err, a burning ... err, make her a spinster ... err, is sinful.

2.  Who said anything about letting these kids loose out in the world?  They don't even get a Rumspringa to decide if they want to stay.  They don't need to have skills or jobs, they're Duggars.  They will continue to exist in their own little highly-processed world eating terrible food and living terrible lives. 

1. The Wisdumb Booklets probably teach that being dumb at math is part of "keeping sweet".  A woman smarter than a man is likely an affront to the cult's beta male contingent.  This sort of cunning would make her a Jezebel, a word that Fundies love to hurl at women. Intelligence in females is likely seen by them as  a "gateway drug" to feminism, which, by extension, could turn a woman into a lesbian. It's idiotic, as one obviously has nothing to do with the other, but critical thinking isn't something Duggars do.

2. They don't even get a Rumspringa to decide if they want to stay. So much THIS. At least the Amish give their kids a chance to choose, even though there is likely more pressure to remain Amish than "go English". Allowing them to experience the worst of what the outside world has to offer, lets them get the rebellion and curiosity out of their systems and no matter what they've done at Rumspringa, gets forgiven by the community because they haven't yet taken adult baptism.

And so much the point...they're Duggars, like they are the highest order of special snowflakery on the planet, that being a Duggar is like they each have one of Willy Wonka's Golden Tickets to the world.  This delusional thinking will be their undoing, only they are too blinkered to realize it.

[RazzleberryPie]

I don't think they boys are encouraged to do much educationally/legit vocationally either. They just aren't tied down to raising siblings and never leaving the house. Except for one semester of college with Joseph, they all have hodgepodge occupations, too. Does JD pilot anyone besides his own family?

[NewDigs]

3 hours ago, RazzleberryPie said:

I don't think they boys are encouraged to do much educationally/legit vocationally either. They just aren't tied down to raising siblings and never leaving the house. Except for one semester of college with Joseph, they all have hodgepodge occupations, too. Does JD pilot anyone besides his own family?

I had assumed that JD and the plane were earners.

Now I wonder who would go up with him? 

Remember that bad weather near-incident? Yikes.

[Sew Sumi]

The plane can't be an earner because JD isn't a commercial pilot. Lacking this credential, he can't charge passengers. 

[Churchhoney]

2 hours ago, NewDigs said:

I had assumed that JD and the plane were earners.

 

You aren't allowed to fly anyone or anything for pay unless you have a commercial license. He doesn't have one, and my guess is he has zero chance of getting one because JB wouldn't give or lend him the money to get the flight time he'd need to get it (in a multi-engine craft, which they haven't got) because JB knows that if JD had such a license it could very very very easily be his ticket out the door.

So until JB drops dead or approaches dead broke so closely that he's desperate to have some real earners in the house, he's very unlikely to risk bankrolling a commercial license for JD. I think, anyway.   (Now, since i've said this on here, maybe they'll have to do an FU Internetz moment and show JD getting his commercial license. And if so, You're welcome, JD.)

Edited September 28, 2016 by Churchhoney

[RazzleberryPie]

I completely agree the boys still have more freedom.

[Vaysh]

Maybe he's a "lay" pilot.

If fundies think it's perfectly fine and safe to have unlicensed lay midwives deliver their babies, perhaps paying for a plane ride with an non-commercial pilot isn't such a big deal to them. Since they don't even like to report serious crimes like child molestation, who would even file a complaint about it?

Does anyone know what JD would have to do in order to become a commercial pilot? I'm assuming he'd have to pass some sort of test(s), but would there be extra lessons, coursework etc? Actual school? It seems a bit strange that he would put so much time and effort into becoming a pilot and then just... stop moving forward with it. Did Boob lay it on JD's heart that all those flight hours would best be put to use by just flying his family around for the rest of his life, or are there some other big hurdles to overcome if he wants to be a pilot for a living?

 

ETA: Sorry Churchhoney, I posted before I saw yours. So, extra flight time in a multi-engine craft is a requirement. Yeah, Boob isn't going to shell out for that. Which is infuriating in and of itself because JD's been a show pony for most of his adult life; he should have earned enough TLC money by now to pay for flight hours and renting a plane on his own. But I doubt he's seen a penny of it unless it's gone through Daddy's hands first.

Edited September 29, 2016 by Vaysh

[lianau]

On 26.9.2016 at 8:27 PM, Defrauder said:

You may be completely right about Jana perhaps not wanting to be a mother of a dozen or more kids and also relating that to her memories of being poor and hungry.  Since she lived in the house where 14 kids were shoved into 2 bedrooms until she was 16 that's got to be ingrained into her psyche big time.  She, being the oldest daughter probably also had the most responsibility when it came to raising all of her mother's children.  She's practically been a mother her whole life already - so the anticipation of becoming a mom or taking care of newborns and tons of children - it's like been there done that.  She may want to get married but she knows what that means.  She spent most of her childhood in prairie dresses and being forced to be in awe of Gothard and his teachings so she probably equates that with being Christian and her religion has been her emotional support so she could have mixed feelings without any way to sort them out.  I think she just tries to make the best of things.  She's still in a dorm with a 6, 7, 9, and 11 year old.  Still doing most of the work.

While I understand what Josh did was really bad , this is also the reason why I have a hard time hating him for it . He grew up during his parents religious conversion/awakening years before TLC showed up with the money . He probably had to confess a dried wet spot in his PJs to his parents  and no idea that finding a girl on the street hot  doesn't mean  he's  possessed  by a sinful sex demon.  Had he been allowed a normal childhood I don't think he would have ended up the way he did. 

 

On 27.9.2016 at 2:59 AM, Vaysh said:

Hell, if you want to be lazy just boil the rice in lots of water and drain it when cooked. I did this today and it actually came out better than when I measure the rice/water ratio. Just rinse the rice beforehand and it's all good.

That's what I do . One cup of rice and water to fill the pot . Drain over the sink when ready . It's not rocket science .

 

On 27.9.2016 at 3:18 PM, RazzleberryPie said:

 

My grandmother and Nonna's (great grandmother) generations took home making skills very seriously, but those ladies could cook anything from scratch, sew, bake, preserve, garden, butcher, knit, clean, repair, etc. They could manage money like a boss, cure whatever ails you and were up to speed on child development issues.

Then my grandmother went back to school in her early 40s and taught home etc for 20 years. Nobody was ever a doormat. 

My grandmother (born in 1929) learned all of that in a special school for girls after finishing school in her home village. That was in the late 40ies in Russian occupied Germany and before the war that school was primarily attended by the daughters of university educated people . Now it was opened for all the farmer kids . My grandmother always laughed about the fact that she got her education pretty much for free even though her father could have payed the full tuition . Being a farmer doesn't mean you're poor. 

So my great grandparents let their oldest daughter (they also only had 3 daughters) move away from home at the age of 16/17 to get a better education 

[Westiepeach]

7 minutes ago, Vaysh said:

Maybe he's a "lay" pilot.

If fundies think it's perfectly fine and safe to have unlicensed lay midwives deliver their babies, perhaps paying for a plane ride with an non-commercial pilot isn't such a big deal to them. Since they don't even like to report serious crimes like child molestation, who would even file a complaint about it?

Does anyone know what JD would have to do in order to become a commercial pilot? I'm assuming he'd have to pass some sort of test(s), but would there be extra lessons, coursework etc? Actual school? It seems a bit strange that he would put so much time and effort into becoming a pilot and then just... stop moving forward with it. Did Boob lay it on JD's heart that all those flight hours would best be put to use by just flying his family around for the rest of his life, or are there some other big hurdles to overcome if he wants to be a pilot for a living?

You said "lay." Sorry, I must be 12 years old today!

[Absolom]

31 minutes ago, Churchhoney said:

maybe they'll have to do an FU Internetz moment and show JD getting his commercial license. And if so, You're welcome, JD.)

Please.  I'd love to see JD do something like that. 

[GeeGolly]

@Vaysh

Lay pilot, lay midwife. My grand-dog jumped out of my lap because I laughed so hard.

[Churchhoney]

1 hour ago, Vaysh said:

Maybe he's a "lay" pilot.

 

Jana is a lay concert pianist. Joy, a lay high school graduate.

[Tabbygirl521]

7 hours ago, Arwen Evenstar said:

1. The Wisdumb Booklets probably teach that being dumb at math is part of "keeping sweet".  A woman smarter than a man is likely an affront to the cult's beta male contingent.  This sort of cunning would make her a Jezebel, a word that Fundies love to hurl at women. Intelligence in females is likely seen by them as  a "gateway drug" to feminism, which, by extension, could turn a woman into a lesbian. It's idiotic, as one obviously has nothing to do with the other, but critical thinking isn't something Duggars do.

2. They don't even get a Rumspringa to decide if they want to stay. So much THIS. At least the Amish give their kids a chance to choose, even though there is likely more pressure to remain Amish than "go English". Allowing them to experience the worst of what the outside world has to offer, lets them get the rebellion and curiosity out of their systems and no matter what they've done at Rumspringa, gets forgiven by the community because they haven't yet taken adult baptism.

And so much the point...they're Duggars, like they are the highest order of special snowflakery on the planet, that being a Duggar is like they each have one of Willy Wonka's Golden Tickets to the world.  This delusional thinking will be their undoing, only they are too blinkered to realize it.

Rumspringa is kind of bullshit, though, because if you choose not to return to the fold, you are 100% shunned by everyone you know and love. At best, you acquire kick-ass memories, then return to your regularly scheduled programming. 

[Jynnan tonnix]

1 hour ago, lianau said:

While I understand what Josh did was really bad , this is also the reason why I have a hard time hating him for it . He grew up during his parents religious conversion/awakening years before TLC showed up with the money . He probably had to confess a dried wet spot in his PJs to his parents  and no idea that finding a girl on the street hot  doesn't mean  he's  possessed  by a sinful sex demon.  Had he been allowed a normal childhood I don't think he would have ended up the way he did. 

 

 

I don't altogether disagree with this; there is no doubt in my mind that Josh's upbringing totally exacerbated any addictive, pervy, selfish, or otherwise questionable traits he was born with....but I also do think that he seems to have always had at least a sight tendency toward that sort of self-absorbed personality which even a very involved and proactive parent might find challenging. I won't say there might not be a decent person in there somewhere, but it would probably always be a bit of a gamble for anyone who linked their life with his not to end up on the short end of the stick at some point.

[bigskygirl]

Hmmm...I see your point of view, but there has been men and women with normal childhood who molested children. Yes, Josh had a crappy childhood and crappy parents, but he needs to take part or most of the blame for his actions. Time to grow up Josh and stop blaming your parents, evilness, and the devil for your wrongdoings. Get the help you need and grow a pair (or in his case, get a snip, snip job.) The sad thing is he is hurting his children the same way his parents hurt him by not getting the counseling and keep adding on to the family he has no way of supporting financially or emotionally.

[Henri205]

On 9/26/2016 at 1:58 PM, Quilt Fairy said:

I keep going back to Joy's comment on not needing algebra. Everyone needs algebra. I graduated with a bachelor's in mathematics, and I spent my whole working life of 35 years in various technical jobs. You know the one field of math I needed on a regular basis? It wasn't calculus or differential equations or number theory. I left those behind in college. It wasn't even high school geometry or trigonometry. It was - wait for it - algebra. And very basic algebra at that, being able to solve simple equations for an unknown. And it was the same skill I used in daily living, albeit in real life "word problems" that any adult needs to be able to figure out.  It's things like if the box of grits gives you measurements for 1 person and then 4 people being able to figure out what you need for 2 people. Or how many rolls of wallpaper you need to cover the walls of a room given the square footage of the walls and the square footage of each roll minus allowances for pattern matching. That's algebra, folks. People just don't realize it. 

I second this.  I remember thinking algebra was a confusing waste of time until I fell into my career as a Business Analyst.  Once I realized I could use it to show the developers in our IT department how to calculate things like interest adjustments and such in the financial software world, I was their hero.  I loathed anything to do with mathematics (graduated with a BA in English Lit and Communication) but found my niche as the financial calculations expert in the software field.  Go figure. 

[mythoughtis]

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Rumspringa is kind of bullshit, though, because if you choose not to return to the fold, you are 100% shunned by everyone you know and love. At best, you acquire kick-ass memories, then return to your regularly scheduled programming. 

.  The problem that I see (and no one has ever answered) is that the Amish, like the Duggars, often do not have a high school diploma.  Just how are they to survive  out of their elements if they choose not to return?   In my home state Amish are allowed to drop out of school much earlier than non-Amish, because that is what the Amish wanted. 

The Duggar offspring are just as out of luck.  Exactly how can they to earn a living if JB doesn't provide a business for them to work in? See how that worked out for Josh?  Derek at least has a college degree to fall bac on, Ben has a 2 year degree, Jeremy has a degree.   The Duggar offspring has some skills in the trades, but employers have lots of applicants.... they are going to hire 1)a high school graduate over a non-high school graduate, and 2) someone that won't look down their noses at their co-workers who are 'diverse'.  Diversity training is a BIG deal these days.