S01.E13: Chapter Thirteen: The Sweet Hereafter

[Chas411]

9 minutes ago, docmatt said:

3 hours ago, Chas411 said:

 

With all due respect, they already look like 30 year olds

 

I don't think I'd go that far. They don't look 16 but they're more on par with teenagers then a lot of other teen shows I've watched aka 90210 - the original, Dawson's Creek.

i suppose it's based on opinion though so each to their own.

My point is that I don't want them all living alone like so many other teen shows end up doing when they don't know how to use parents. As much as I'm not in this show for realism I do like that they all have parents that are just as involved in the storyline.

[WhosThatGirl]

I'm used to actors looking older than the characters they play. But to be honest in this group, the only one who stands out to me in that way is the actor who plays Archie. That said I ageee with the above post, I enjoy when the adults are very much entangled with the teen stories. OTH did that really well for the first season but even by the second season while the adults were still around, most of the teens were acting Iike adults. 

[PeekaBoo]

OMG, OMG! Finally breathing normally again!!! What a freaking episode!!! (screaming that one loud!) Probably will come with more intelligent and coherent post afterwards but man! What a way to end things, what a way to end a first season!! Of all the theories and possibilities, the show pulled out a freaking end that I never could have expected. Thank you show for being so wonderful!!!

For one thing, luke perry cannot die!! I will not permit that!! He has to come back.

Love the small tid bits between veronica, jughead and Cheryl's attempt at being nice was soooo freaking cute! Two thumbs up for that one!

I definitely loved FP who seems at peace with what's getting to him next season. The entire conversation between father and son was so nice to hear. He wasn't ask for forgiveness, he's just advising on what to do next. I like that he advised Archie to watch over jughead and warning of how he could be. ARchie took it to heart and I hope that continues.

I'm still not entirely convinced by Archie's speech to veronica about that "wistful" stare of his but I am choosing to believe that he is trying to make things work with Veronica and that he really wants to be with her. I'll say it right away, I do think they are end game as well, I just hope he won't fuck it up somehow...

As for jughead, great and wonderful acting. FINALLY no whining or "weird" speeches, more like the stoic teen that is going to make it, somehow. You can see that Betty isn't giving up so easily on him or his dad and i think that is helping him a lot. And the short sexy bughead moment, i really wasn't prepared or expecting for that to happen! I really was expecting him to hide out again and go asexual (in whatever way the show wanted it) and that would be the focus for season 2...And then to get offered a serpent jacket, -that part- I was expecting (they do know of him/his existence, check out the archie comic books Riverdale) and hoped/feared it (still unsure what i'm shipping for). Although I didn't think he'd take it so willingly, I can understand the desire/curiosity to become a part of what most likely is "the only family" he has left (if he chooses to ignore his friends + Betty). And if all the speculation that Betty goes dark serpent betty or whatever, will we have a bonnie and clyde?!?! Will they "conquer the world" and create devastation everywhere they go... The dark side is strong...

I do hope those two will take down Mayor McCoy, really am hating her now.... Didn't we hear in ep 11 at the prom/dance that McCoy was offering Betty an internship at the mayor's office?!?!

And being speculative, could jughead's fosterparents be the famous Sabrina aunts?!?!?!

Hum, I wonder, will Archie try to get back at Hiram (who is the most likely suspect) next season if the shooting was anything but accidental? Didn't Mr.Lodge loathe Archie in the comic books for dating his daughter?

Edited May 12, 2017 by PeekaBoo
Regaining coherent thoughts thus correcting spelling mistakes and adding a few thoughts...

[Lady Calypso]

What I appreciate is that they don't seem to be going down the Archie/Betty route. I was worried this episode for a while, but I buy Archie's reasoning that he was only jealous of what Bughead have. He seems to really care about Veronica, and I think the show is realizing that they have two better pairings out on the table. Now, will Archie/Betty share a kiss of some sort down the road? Probably, if the network wants it to happen then it will. But I don't think they'll get into a serious relationship, which is wonderful.

Another thing I like? Pairings that wouldn't normally interact or haven't interacted yet, are interacting. Betty/Veronica are allowed to have a healthy friendship, filled with plenty of screen time. That rarely happens on any TV show for females. And Veronica bringing in the Bechdel Test was hilarious because it's just so meta. Also, Veronica/Jughead sharing a scene together for the first time. Also, Cheryl's interactions with both Veronica and Betty are great. I've grown to warm up to Cheryl. I may not love her, and I certainly get annoyed by her "Mommy" and "Daddy" affections, but I think they're getting her character right. Also, Archie/FP have a scene together, which I never thought would happen, at least this season.

Speaking of Archie, this is the guy that I could really grow to like. He was fantastic this episode. He was really caring for all of his friends, and he really showed that he is a good guy. I cringed a bit at the Sweetwater River scene, with him punching the ice. His happiness with Veronica is also really infectious, so I'm excited for Archie's story next year. I imagine Fred won't die and that we'll be finding out maybe a few of Fred's dark secrets. I mean we already learned that he has a DUI, so what other secrets is he hiding? Plus, shows that have these cliffhangers with a main character in peril usually don't end with said character's death.  

I've been mostly neutral on Josie up until now, but I really did think her role this episode was alright. I look forward to more of her next season because she deserves it, but I liked her this episode. First off, her blue hair is gorgeous. But secondly, she was really insightful with Archie. I don't blame her for saying no to his song, because she is right. The Jubilee is about the entire town, not just Archie and his friends, so it's so much bigger than him. But it was nice that Josie gave the song a chance, and it did end up to be ok. If they can just use Josie, she could be a good counterpart to the gang.

I totally believe that Hermione is just as bad as Hiram. I don't believe that Hiram's the worst of the two, or the only bad one. Hermione probably has a lot of skeletons in her closet as well, things that Hiram knows. 

So, Betty and Polly have an older brother. Now, I do question if the baby was really Hal's and I'm leaning toward it not being his, only because most shows go that way as a twist. I thought for a while that it could have been FP's but seeing as the kid is alive and out there, that Alice's reaction toward Betty and Jughead would have been much worse.

[Primetimer]

The season finale sees one life saved, another (perhaps) lost, and a raging inferno at Crimson Peak.

View the full article

[TobinAlbers]

This was the first finale of this season that had me screaming at the tv -mainly for the ONE more than decent parent in Riverdale being shot in front of his son and bleeding out in his arms. Neither Fred nor Archie deserved that (not that anyone ever deserves something so tragic).

But damn, Luke Perry sold Fred's fear and uncertainty and first and only thought being to protect Archie. And then Archie still tried to jump in front of his dad which had to horrify Fred in the moment. But then with Fred ultimately being the one shot, the gunman obviously made sure to hit Fred and not Archie.

I had a feeling that Luke Perry wasn't long for this show. His salary quote even in this day and age may still be a decent chunk for a CW show and they agreed to a one season deal to help launch the show with Fred's death helping to launch the mystery for S2. It also makes sense now when the produces promised more to the complicated history of the parents and their teen years with more flashbacks to their time if the main mystery has to do with Fred's death.  I hope he isn't dead, but I can see Fred having limited appearances in flashbacks as Archie grieves.

[Chick2Chic]

Here's hoping Riverdale can learn to write for its Black women and Asian men in S2. Integrating them into the main stories shouldn't be difficult.

[Dee]

7 minutes ago, Chick2Chic said:

Here's hoping Riverdale can learn to write for its Black women and Asian men in S2. Integrating them into the main stories shouldn't be difficult.

Since Riverdale is committed to the "Core 4" and Kevin they're never gonna be anything more than tertiary characters at best.

[truthaboutluv]

2 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

But to be honest in this group, the only one who stands out to me in that way is the actor who plays Archie.

This will always crack me up, because you're not the only one saying that, since K.J. is actually the youngest in real life. 

2 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

What I appreciate is that they don't seem to be going down the Archie/Betty route.

Yet. As much as I wish they wouldn't, I don't see the writers avoiding that drama. I'm just waiting for when it inevitably happens. My only hope is that if it happens, it's when the respective couples, Betty/Jughead and Archie/Veronica are broken up for other reasons. 

Edited May 12, 2017 by truthaboutluv

[HunterHunted]

14 minutes ago, Chick2Chic said:

Here's hoping Riverdale can learn to write for its Black women and Asian men man in S2. Integrating them into the main stories shouldn't be difficult.

The show is losing Ross Butler who plays Reggie to season 2 of 13 Reasons Why.

[maxineofarc]

None of them could help Archie punch through the ice? The ice that was supposedly too thin for them all to stand on? The ice that they were all standing on in a group?

[Eneya]

This is like PLL when the youngest Sasha looked the oldest.

What are the actors ages?

[VCRTracking]

Love this tweet. Network synergy and a good burn:

Edited May 12, 2017 by VCRTracking

[scorp01]

Good finale!  

I liked that Jughead was ok/fit in with the Southside High kids, and that he is being accepted and protected by the Serpents.  Didn't particularly like how the Serpents interrupted Bughead's seksi time, but I liked Cole in the Serpents jacket a little more than I probably should have, lol.

Poor Cheryl.  Her dad killed himself and her mom is a class A bitch.  

Speaking of class A bitch, what's up with the 180 degree turn that Hermione took over the course of the season?  She went from being one of the more supportive parents to shady AF.  In retrospect, maybe she's been shady in business all along (bag full of money to buy the drive-in land, forging Veronica's signature for the SoDale contract), but this ep really seemed to solidify that Hermione has a little bit of evil in her too (the look she gave Cheryl and the "What's SHE doing here" when Cheryl was at her apartment).

I hope Fred is going to be ok.  I can't imagine they'd actually kill him off.  Jughead's narration of the violence being "not random at all" makes me think that Hiram or aforementioned newly shady Hermione had something to do with the shooting.  But how would either of them know that Fred was going to Pop's that morning?

Sad that we won't have Riverdale Thursdays to look forward to for the next few months...

Edited May 12, 2017 by scorp01
more thoughts

[starri]

...did Cheryl remember to let her Grandma out of the attic first?

[SeanC]

3 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

I'm used to actors looking older than the characters they play. But to be honest in this group, the only one who stands out to me in that way is the actor who plays Archie. 

I've seen some people say that, which is funny since he's actually the youngest main castmember, 19 years old during filming.  In general, the actors on this show are a reasonably age range by teen show standards (Cole Sprouse, at 24, is the oldest, but I find him convincing enough).

[waving feather]

Archiekins looks super attractive the whole episode. Did he change his hairstyle or something? Seriously though, the last couple of episodes made Archie my character on the show.

[thefreeair]

Hey, so when Jughead was calling Betty from Dangerous Minds, what was that box connected to the wall he was talking into? Did he lose his phone?  

[imakicola]

7 hours ago, Eneya said:

Um... I read 2018 though? I am going to find the article and update the comment.

UPDATED:
OK, so, as per here: http://www.express.co.uk/showbiz/tv-radio/778682/Riverdale-season-2-when-out-Netflix-release-rumours-date-cast it is for 2018 BUT as per IMDB, it will be THIS fall.
I really am unsure but the sooner, the better. :)

I think they are filming June 2017-April 2018, to be AIRED September 2017 through May 2018. Most shows historically I think film just a few months before the air date, as in they don't finish filming the whole season before episodes start airing. 

[scorp01]

1 hour ago, thefreeair said:

Hey, so when Jughead was calling Betty from Dangerous Minds, what was that box connected to the wall he was talking into? Did he lose his phone?  

Yes!  I wondered that last week too, when Jughead called his mom on the pay phone at the bus station...

[Scott]

13 hours ago, VCRTracking said:

I was like "Damn, are they really crosscutting Archie/Veronica with Betty/Jughead  sex scenes! Wow! My 9 year old self's head is exploding." Well if they're not going to make Jughead asexual I'm glad they're going all in on making him sexual!

I was mostly just amazed that a bunch of horny 15-year-olds are having such cinematic sex, when in real life, Archiekins would likely have, um, shot his "pep" before Veronica had her shoes off.

[ZoloftBlob]

So, frankly I was disappointed in this episode. Yes, we get a whole lotta crazy and excitement and so much of it makes utterly no sense at all. Why did Papa Blossom blow Jason's brains out? Why did Hermoine do a sudden heel turn on Fred? Why in this town that's quintessentially small is there more than one high school? And the other high school is a gritty urban hell hole? Complete with uniformed gangs? (I seriously expected the Riffs and the Warriors to be throwing down in the cafeteria). I can kinda buy Jughead finally being on Child Services radar after FP's arrest for horrific murder (the first murder in small town Riverdale in ages, which means apparently the Serpents and the kids from Urban Hellhole High are law abiding despite all the drugs in the syrup) but really, the family friend that the kid is already living with isn't good enough to foster parent because of a DUI arrest? And while Archie was bandaged up professionally, after a near death suicide attempt, Cheryl Blossom gets... nothing but a brief moment by the fire? No one took her to the hospital? No one told her mom or a teacher or a parent that she tried to kill herself and almost took four other kids with her in the frozen river? I don't mind melodrama at all but it needs to be *faintly realistic*. And of all the people to shoot, of course its Fred.

[maxineofarc]

The Serpents are really the best behaved gang I've seen on TV in a long while. And queer-friendly! I mean, what do those guys do besides hang around looking tough and dealing a little weed?

That Riverdale, which we're constantly told is a small town, has both a "south side" whose residents apparently aren't invited to the town jubilee and a whole extra high school, is unlikely. I lived in a town of ~6000 as a kid and we and the surrounding towns (the surrounding towns were quite a bit smaller in population) had to join forces in a regional high school. It would make more sense if this was sort of a Springfield/Shelbyville situation with the "south side" a different town entirely.

NOBODY thought of taking Cheryl to the hospital to get her checked out for hypothermia? Of course, then Penelope might have put a psych hold on her and she wouldn't have been able to burn down Thornhill quite as dramatically. I do hope Nana was out.

Does Val just not have anything else to say since she dumped Archie? FIGURE THIS OUT, SHOW.

FP was reading a Sabrina comic.

Edited May 12, 2017 by maxineofarc

[PeekaBoo]

14 hours ago, SeanC said:

F.P. would have no reason to know this, of course, but I still laughed when he told Jughead that he'd need to be there for his mother in the future, i.e., the mother who rejected him in the previous episode.

That woman is going to come back at one point and they both know it... The boys also know that Jughead has the heart to let her into his life again... Oh god, getting teary eyed again. It's like FP was a dead man walking and just giving all the advice he could before...

15 hours ago, truthaboutluv said:

Well this is interesting. Maybe Jughead being tempted by the Serpents may not be as much of a deal breaker as the finale suggested. Putting behind spoiler bars just in case. 

  Hide contents

What about Betty? You’ve been teasing Dark Betty this whole season. Will that grow in season 2?

Absolutely. I think a lot of season 1 was Betty trying to control or suppress her dark side or contain her dark side. A lot of season 2 is about her owning it and harnessing it. Without saying too much, the idea of Jughead joining the Serpents is very provocative. Even more of a Riverdale subversion would be the perfect girl-next-door joining the Serpents, so that’s something we’re going to play with as well!

The quote is from a post-season finale interview in Entertainment Weekly, with show creator/executive producer Roberto Aguirre-Sacasa

Sorta gained respect for FP and his damn Serpents, he didn't want to give anyone away and that they look out for one another... I'm not saying they're much more nobler than the rest... They are crooks but honest crooks... Not like the secrets that every freakin' adult in that town seems to have... It's no wonder Betty and Jughead can get tempted of becoming part of them. The ones with the -bigger- secrets are the ones that are getting away with everything and still beign able to call the shots while the Serpents who have been there all the time doing their thing, are getting blamed for everything... Geez, I'm even getting fucking pissed off now writing this...

It's the same for Betty, her family is just pretending everything's fine and she wants none of that! Having to give that preachy speech at that gala thing showed how much guts she had! Shame on you adults! You go Dark Serpent Betty! Enjoy your freedom and rebel for a minute or two! I'm with you!

 

13 hours ago, VCRTracking said:

"Save the cheerleader, save the town." As someone who watched Heroes it's first two seasons I appreciated this.

I was like "Damn, are they really crosscutting Archie/Veronica with Betty/Jughead  sex scenes! Wow! My 9 year old self's head is exploding." Well if they're not going to make Jughead asexual I'm glad they're going all in on making him sexual!

Too bad the Southside Serpents cockblocked him but once he put that jacket on I thought Cole Sprouse actually did look like Skeet Ulrich!

Loved the Heroes reference. Not to start up yet another sexual/asexual discussion, after seeing those two in that particular scene, I so do not care about whether he is/isn't sexual or whatever, the guy has it in him. He loves that girl and goddammit, it's working for them (so far).

And the whole jacket exchange, yes, they both look alike so much!

When Cheryl was in Veronica's apartment, are we to assume they all just didn't talk about it? Did the whole "suicide attempt" got brushed under the rug?

[Craphole Island]

6 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

I'm used to actors looking older than the characters they play. But to be honest in this group, the only one who stands out to me in that way is the actor who plays Archie. That said I ageee with the above post, I enjoy when the adults are very much entangled with the teen stories. OTH did that really well for the first season but even by the second season while the adults were still around, most of the teens were acting Iike adults. 

Heh it's ironic because the actor who plays Archie is the youngest of the core 4. He's 19.

[Dobian]

90210 was the worst of the bunch.  Between Steve, Dylan, and Andrea, they looked like they needed to be in the cast of ThirtySomething in the very first season.

[Eneya]

1 hour ago, ZoloftBlob said:

So, frankly I was disappointed in this episode. Yes, we get a whole lotta crazy and excitement and so much of it makes utterly no sense at all. Why did Papa Blossom blow Jason's brains out? Why did Hermoine do a sudden heel turn on Fred? Why in this town that's quintessentially small is there more than one high school? And the other high school is a gritty urban hell hole? Complete with uniformed gangs? (I seriously expected the Riffs and the Warriors to be throwing down in the cafeteria). I can kinda buy Jughead finally being on Child Services radar after FP's arrest for horrific murder (the first murder in small town Riverdale in ages, which means apparently the Serpents and the kids from Urban Hellhole High are law abiding despite all the drugs in the syrup) but really, the family friend that the kid is already living with isn't good enough to foster parent because of a DUI arrest? And while Archie was bandaged up professionally, after a near death suicide attempt, Cheryl Blossom gets... nothing but a brief moment by the fire? No one took her to the hospital? No one told her mom or a teacher or a parent that she tried to kill herself and almost took four other kids with her in the frozen river? I don't mind melodrama at all but it needs to be *faintly realistic*. And of all the people to shoot, of course its Fred.

Papa Blossoms did it because supposedly Jason wanted out and tried to blackmail him?
Hermione supposedly is trying to save Frank from Hiram?
Apparently the town is not that small?
Also, darker secrets in Frank's closer, some anvils were a-dropping via that?
If Cheryl asked NOT to be taken to the hospital, saying "my mom will then have complete control over me and what happens to me", I see both Veronica and Betty agreeing and Veronica taking her home. Why are you expecting adult-level of reactions from a bunch of teens, most of which, from dysfunctional families? It was hell of realistic just not how quickly she was physically ok... :)

[tennisgurl]

You have to give it up to Cheryl. She tried to kill herself by throwing herself into the frozen stream her brother disappeared in, and then burned her own mansion down using a candelabra, and her lipstick game was STILL on point. She's the best.

This was a really good episode for Archie, even if he was mostly a supporting character. He was such a supportive friend, and him breaking through the ice (all that blood!) to save Cheryl was badass and very heroic. I like this version of the character, as someone who is there to support everyone during their dramatics. That might be thrown a loop now that his dad has been shot however. I'm really hoping he makes it out alright, as he's one of the only decent, non crazy parents on the show, even if he isn't perfect. Plus, I dig Archie and Veronica.

Bettys speech was a good one, but it was kind of a weird one for a big celebration event. I guess there's always time to call people out, but I'm just imagining all the people in this town who came here to see a show, and have no dog what so ever on this whole fight. I have to say, I've never been on the "Jughead is HOT" bandwagon, but the almost sex scene with Betty, and the leather jacket? Niiiiiice. Maybe because he finally lost that stupid hat.

Alright wait, Riverdale is big enough to have a Bad Kids School now? For as much as Jughead goes on about the town "losing its innocence" when Jason was killed, it seems like this place already had a shit ton of issues. Also, how big is Riverdale anyway? I always thought it was a decently small town where everyone knew each other (hence everyone knowing all about the Juggie family drama) and was all quaint and stuff, but now its big enough for two whole school systems? Is this going to be like in the later seasons of Friday Night Lights where the main town was a small town for the first four or five season, then all of the sudden its a big enough town for a whole second school, all for plot reasons?

I wonder if Hermione will turn out to be the real evil parent on the show? I've always liked her, but lately she's been increasingly sketchy and quick to back up her even more sketchy husband (unless she's the real mastermind...) and asking your teenaged daughter to seduce her teenaged kind of boyfriend to get to his dad is REALLY creepy.

This hasn't exactly been what I expecting for an Archie murder mystery, but its been a very interesting ride, and I'm glad I decided to check this out.

[TrininisaScorp]

The last few episodes of this show have been LIT.  This finale was really well done!  I'm in, you guys, totally in.

I hate myself and am ashamed, but good God, damn, hell, Cole S!  Between the sweet ILYs, the unexpectedly hot make-out, and the bad boy-ness of the Serpent jacket, I have a little crush on Cole/Jug.   The actor infuses a sweetness and vulnerability, but there is a streak of darkness.  It's kinda hot.  

Like many of you, this is first episode that I really liked Archie.  He wasn't a pain and the scenes at the frozen lake and with Fred were nicely done.

Fred isn't gonna die.  No.  Nope.  Nah.  You can't kill off the only decent parent in the series.  #savedylan

I agree with many of you:  Hermione isn't a Mrs. Soprano figure; she is a part of this thing and is just as bad as Hiriam. No question in my mind.  She was cold as ice in this episode.

I'm still of the mind that TPTB paired Jughead and Betty up so quickly because as a fan, I feel like I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop.  That said, they got the chemistry right with Jug/Betty and Archie/Ronnie.  I too felt Archie's look at Betty had a tinge of jealously to it, but I think any instance of Archie and Betty would suffer from a lack of chemistry.  TPTB may have painted themselves into a corner, but I'm sure the angst of Betty and Jughead not being a pair is a 'comin.

[Last Time Lord]

Holy shit, what a finale!

i was actually a little surprised there wasn't a late twist in Jason's murder. A man behind the man, or something. 

Anyone know what the name of the song from the end of the episode that stopped when the Serpents knocked and resumed when Jughead put the jacket on? I liked it. 

The Serpents' dog was named Hot Dog. That was the name of Jughead's dog in the comics, isn't it?

[dwmckim]

15 hours ago, imakicola said:

So ross butler did tape for this episode but was written out. Wow that's so sad :(!!!

Edited out, not written out - there's a difference.

Shows tend to tape a little more than they probably need for the final edit because having too much material and having to make cuts is a far easier problem to fix than not having enough to fill out the required time.  The scene with Reggie ultimately didn't contain anything essential story-wise so as much as it's sad that what would have been Ross-as-Reggie's scene didn't make it to air, i can understand the reasoning behind why it had to be sacrificed (then there's the possibility that when they were editing, they knew they lost Ross for S2, so they made the creative choice to leave Ross' Reggie scene out of the final episode to allow for an easier transition to a new actor next year.)  But either way, rather than holding on to that scene as one of many that would probably be included as a bonus feature on a dvd box set, they made it available to the public within 24 hours on the episode's airing, so that was a respectful thing to do for Ross/Reggie fans.

6 minutes ago, Last Time Lord said:

The Serpents' dog was named Hot Dog. That was the name of Jughead's dog in the comics, isn't it?

Yes it was!

[opus]

Favorite line--

Veronica, to Betty: At the risk of failing the bechdel test....

[BaskingsharkGTX]

5 hours ago, Dobian said:

90210 was the worst of the bunch.  Between Steve, Dylan, and Andrea, they looked like they needed to be in the cast of ThirtySomething in the very first season.

They did look ancient, but the reason for that was because nobody expected the show to be anything other than a summer replacement which would run for only one season, much less a 10-season phenomenon. So they figured casting "old" didn't matter. I can't recall who the interview was with where I read this (might have been Aaron Spelling) but he said that if they'd had any idea how successful it was going to be, they would have cast younger actors and they wouldn't have cast them all white. 

This finale was... kind of uneven, a bit like the whole series. The Drama of the Cheryl Rescue was undercut for me by the many, many problems with the whole sequence that everybody has already mentioned (cracking ice, moving current, etc, etc, etc) and Cheryl torching Thornhill felt like it came out of nowhere with little buildup. Still. More Cheryl next season please. And make her WORSE!

I also don't think Fred is dead. In a coma for half the season, maybe, so they don't have to pay Luke Perry so much, but if he does die, Molly Ringwald ain't going to be much cheaper than Perry. Unless Archie's Never Previously Mentioned Uncle or Aunt played by a less-famous actor moves in to take care of him. 

Oh and because it can't be said enough, here is a list of everyone who takes Valerie for granted and treats her like crap;

1. Josie
2. Archie
3. The Writers

Edited May 13, 2017 by BaskingsharkGTX

[truthaboutluv]

1 hour ago, Last Time Lord said:

Anyone know what the name of the song from the end of the episode that stopped when the Serpents knocked and resumed when Jughead put the jacket on? I liked it. 

Believer by Imagine Dragons

[ruby24]

7 hours ago, Scott said:

I was mostly just amazed that a bunch of horny 15-year-olds are having such cinematic sex, when in real life, Archiekins would likely have, um, shot his "pep" before Veronica had her shoes off.

Yeah, really. Betty/Jughead in particular. That was all the more surprising to me because I have to assume that was supposed to be their first time, and not just with each other, so, yeah. Not entirely realistic.

[Last Time Lord]

1 hour ago, truthaboutluv said:

Believer by Imagine Dragons

Thank you!

[loki567]

4 hours ago, opus said:

Favorite line--

Veronica, to Betty: At the risk of failing the bechdel test....

What's funny is that scene still technically fails the Bechdel test. As I understand it the phrase means two women in a work of fiction being able to have a conversation about something other than men. They were still talking about Archie. 

[methodwriter85]

3 hours ago, Sonoma said:

Well, without being too TMI-- although I was not sexually active when I was their age (16), I dated quite a bit and had my share of steamy make-out sessions. So when the time came, it wasn't awkward at all. And I never got the sense that Jughead was an "innocent". He seemed to be driving that moment and Betty was going with it.

Plus, it's a show! I don't Jughead and Betty to be realistic! But mileage varies and all that. =)

Jughead definitely looked like he knew what he was doing. Which was interesting, because his early kiss with Betty seemed really innocent and 5th grade.

[BkWurm1]

Quote

Fred CANNOT be dead, right? RIGHT? No dead Fred! He is the best parent in Riverdale, and a character that I have grown to become very fond of. I hope that's he's just injured...but not too gravely. Just enough for the drama and to move the storyline along. 

Normally my TV viewing gut would be telling me that Fred would recover, slowly and without it being a sure thing at first to drag out the drama, but I can't help consider the other possibility of him  just bleeding out since the scene was awful reminiscent of "The Death of Archie" in the comic book.  It wasn't Archie that died obviously, but it was Archie trying to save someone from a gun man in Pops.  The parallels had to be on purpose. Which makes Fred a lot closer IMO to being dead.  :(  

Edited May 13, 2017 by BkWurm1

[morakot]

I liked how the S-shape of the serpent repeats the S on Juggy's t-shirt in his flashback dream.

Oh, and the Scoobie-Do reference at the beginning.

[Grandmother Olivia]

...And the angry daughter burns down the house in which she was imprisoned. All it really needed was the lover of her mother rushing in to save the grandmother from the fire and both perishing in the roaring flames while the screaming mother, rendered insane, beats her daughter before the men in white coats drag her away. (VC Andrews, Petals on the Wind.)

This has been such a brilliant season. Pastiches from popular culture - books, movies, TV shows from the 80s on - every minute. Anyone started enumerating the tropes yet?

[indiscutable]

On 5/12/2017 at 3:50 AM, Eneya said:

 

The scene in which Jug puts the jacket and looks both smug, sure and confident and the next scene in which he looks lost and confused when Betty said his name were really, really well done.

 

Yes! It was like once Betty said "Juggy?" it broke a spell and he looked confused/a little ashamed. Really great. 

[Affogato]

On 5/11/2017 at 10:10 PM, The Crazed Spruce said:

Jughead as a Serpent? I mean, I get why he might be tempted, but I hope he doesn't go down that path. For Betty's sake if nothing else.

So far the Serpents are looking fairly good. Didn't FP say they were only selling Marijuana in small quantities, so the drug moving was likely not the group but a couple of bad guys (and FP was trying to figure out what was bad in his organization?) Loyal and kind to their children. Willing to work for a friend, the work crew things. Owning up to past mistakes. Sacrificing for others. Compare with the Blossom's cruelty to their children and contribution, probable, to the opioid epidemic, Veronica's mother running back to her comfortable amoral existance, the richer section of town ready to cut out the more vulnerable section to be more comfortable in their own places. Jughead was certainly welcomed by the kids, much more than he was in Riverside High.

Question is, does Betty have the guts to follow him down the rabbit hole? I'm guessing only to an extent. At some point, though, she'll find out her family's connections to the 'dark side' of town.

I'm sure the serpents aren't perfect, gang after all, by the way. We'll find out their problems, which probably have to do (like in the other side of town) with the weaknesses and backgrounds of individual.

Hey! Hotdog!

2 hours ago, Grandmother Olivia said:

...And the angry daughter burns down the house in which she was imprisoned. All it really needed was the lover of her mother rushing in to save the grandmother from the fire and both perishing in the roaring flames while the screaming mother, rendered insane, beats her daughter before the men in white coats drag her away. (VC Andrews, Petals on the Wind.)

This has been such a brilliant season. Pastiches from popular culture - books, movies, TV shows from the 80s on - every minute. Anyone started enumerating the tropes yet?

It's been so long since I've read VC Andrews.....Is she related to Archie :-)

[Affogato]

18 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Alright wait, Riverdale is big enough to have a Bad Kids School now? For as much as Jughead goes on about the town "losing its innocence" when Jason was killed, it seems like this place already had a shit ton of issues. Also, how big is Riverdale anyway? I always thought it was a decently small town where everyone knew each other (hence everyone knowing all about the Juggie family drama) and was all quaint and stuff, but now its big enough for two whole school systems? Is this going to be like in the later seasons of Friday Night Lights where the main town was a small town for the first four or five season, then all of the sudden its a big enough town for a whole second school, all for plot reasons?

 

That *is*the weirdest thing, usually high schools, especially big, vibrant ones like this (that aren't ones that include all the grades) in rural areas pull from several towns. I remember Sabrina is from the town over in the comic, I don't remember if her town had a 'rival' school. Two high schools with that many kids in each that don't know each other, don't combine for sports and so on, means a large and vibrant community. It is beginning to look like a small city.

Would one dui at a point in fred's life when he could be assumed to be vulnerable, no one hurt that we heard of, really justify moving Jughead from the place he was living, his best friend and his school district? Also, isn't jughead old enough to make that decision? He must be at least 16 or they wouldn't be showing him preparing to have sex on national television?

[opus]

11 hours ago, loki567 said:

What's funny is that scene still technically fails the Bechdel test. As I understand it the phrase means two women in a work of fiction being able to have a conversation about something other than men. They were still talking about Archie. 

That's why I liked it. The show was failing the test, but was smart enough to acknowledge they were.

Edited May 13, 2017 by opus

[starri]

In all honesty:  this weird little show on the CW had a group of teenagers handling a love polygon better than most shows with actual adult characters.  What a refreshing surprise.

[methodwriter85]

4 hours ago, Affogato said:

That *is*the weirdest thing, usually high schools, especially big, vibrant ones like this (that aren't ones that include all the grades) in rural areas pull from several towns. I remember Sabrina is from the town over in the comic, I don't remember if her town had a 'rival' school. Two high schools with that many kids in each that don't know each other, don't combine for sports and so on, means a large and vibrant community. It is beginning to look like a small city.

Would one dui at a point in fred's life when he could be assumed to be vulnerable, no one hurt that we heard of, really justify moving Jughead from the place he was living, his best friend and his school district? Also, isn't jughead old enough to make that decision? He must be at least 16 or they wouldn't be showing him preparing to have sex on national television?

For what it's worth, the town that Riverdale was supposedly based on had about 45,000 people at the time the comic books started. I think we're using the term "small town" pretty loosely.

[The Crazed Spruce]

On 2017-05-12 at 3:30 PM, Scott said:

I was mostly just amazed that a bunch of horny 15-year-olds are having such cinematic sex, when in real life, Archiekins would likely have, um, shot his "pep" before Veronica had her shoes off.

Apparently, "Miss Grundy" tutored him in a lot more than just playing guitar....

[The Crazed Spruce]

17 hours ago, Sonoma said:

Has anyone seen this guy? He is hilarious yet still sweet, and his reactions give me life! It makes me enjoy the show even more, seeing it through his "eyes".

I'm partial to Andre The Black Nerd's videos, myself.

[morakot]

On ‎5‎/‎12‎/‎2017 at 11:30 AM, Scott said:

I was mostly just amazed that a bunch of horny 15-year-olds are having such cinematic sex, when in real life, Archiekins would likely have, um, shot his "pep" before Veronica had her shoes off.

You forget that Archie spent the summer satisfying Miss Grundy so he should have some experience in slowing down.