S06.E04: Episode 4

[monakane]

On 2/16/2017 at 5:31 PM, kieyra said:

Something I haven't seen mentioned is the way the male obstetrician acted as overlord over the women's health, and the women were not allowed to participate in their own care. He was "prepared to consider" whether the one woman would be allowed to have the cervix procedure, and while taking his time considering, she miscarried. Even Sheilagh was quickly negged by him when she spoke up. Doctors playing "God" is a familiar theme, but it was still shocking to see how thoroughly the women were disregarded as actual people. 

(I don't work in medicine so I'm sure there's a flip side to this--it must be difficult to deal with people in pain and distress day in and day out. But there was a clear gender thing going on here too.)

I think his attitude was very common in that era based on the stories my mother told me about her experience with ob/gyn practices during the late 50s/early 60s.  I remember my mother being in the hospital and calling the house in hysterics because of the way her ob/gyn talked to her.  My normally fiery mother would not speak up for herself because doctors were gods in those days.

[Fireball]

5 minutes ago, Clanstarling said:

I'm not quite sure why they were all so shocked about it - women have had to do this to save their children forever.

That stood out to me too! Trixie & the Sisters were just so so shocked that Marnie was considering giving up her child. All I could think was "how long have you been working in the East End again?" I could see Jenny in season 1 being so shocked, but Trixie and the Sisters have been working there now for years. 

[Clanstarling]

In the 90's I was forced to go to a male OB/GYN (I wanted the woman in the practice but she was booked up), and he had that same attitude. I had previously had gestational diabetes, and my then doctor (she was wonderful but no longer accepting my insurance plan) had planned to give me my blood test early. He said no several times, but I wore him down (nevertheless, Doctor, is a phrase I used a lot with him). He finally acquiesced by saying "I guarantee you that you won't have gestational diabetes at this point. When he called back with the results, he insisted that technically I didn't, because one of the four (three?) measurements was 2 points less than the gestational diabetes indicator, but I should go see the nutritionist for the rundown on how to deal with it. Asshole. There are a few more horror stories, but once I had my child, I decided my female general practitioner was good enough for my needs.

[Brattinella]

I was once assigned a male gynecologist, and he pinched me with the speculum.  Never again.

[Clanstarling]

4 minutes ago, Brattinella said:

I was once assigned a male gynecologist, and he pinched me with the speculum.  Never again.

My first gyno exam ever - the young male (cute) intern did the same. One of the reasons I decided on female gynos.

Edited April 24, 2017 by Clanstarling

[Pallida]

I think sometimes this show is subtle to the point that if viewers aren't paying full attention, things can be missed. Reference how often people in this thread are referring to Dot as "sister" rather than "cousin."

Marnie's financial problems stemmed from spending on credit in the expectation that she would have money coming from her husband. They didn't explicitly say this, but I imagine part of why she wasn't asking for assistance is because she didn't want to believe he wasn't coming back. I think the show clearly established that she wasn't trying to live a lavish lifestyle; rather, she spent according to a budget she thought  she would have and got burned by a husband running off and not contributing. She can make different choices (and presumably try to approach paid work differently) now that she can make decisions based on accurate information. 

When Nurse Crane first started on the show, I really didn't like her - but now I think she's my favorite character, even if she scoffed at an American midwife.

[howiveaddict]

I remember either the show or one of the books doing an adoption story where the mother had had an affair with a black man, and thus immediately gave the baby up for adoption. She may have told husband the baby died.  No one acted shocked like on this episode. Also, there was a story in the book where the mother was married to an older man, and had a biracial baby.  Older husband, excepted child like it was his own, never commenting on the baby's looks.  Of course, this was several years ago and I could be remembering totally wrong.  Don't ask me what I had to eat yesterday.

If Downton Abbey had Anna get her cervix sewed shut, then why did this physician wait until it was too late to sew up this lady's cervix?  Not like it was a brand new thing like he acted.    He really was a d bag doctor.

I used to go to a male gyno.  He would do uterine ablations, in the office, with only nitrous oxide.  I thought he was killing me, it hurt so bad.   Later I found out that the procedure is usually done under general anesthetic.  He wanted to charge the whole fee for himself. Also, he could practice more how he wanted being in a private office.  I now have a female gyno.  

[marceline]

As long as I'm complaining, another thing I disliked about the adoption story was the fact that Marnie named the baby with apparently no input from Dot. Granted it was just a christening and not a birth certificate but it's just another example of how poorly the situation was handled. Was Dot supposed to call him Andrew or was she going to be allowed to give him the name of her choice as his official one?

One thing I found interesting was the juxtaposition between how Marnie had to let her baby go and how Shelagh's roommate (I looked it up. Her name was Gloria.) had to let go of her stillborn child. The Nonnatans were doing everything possible to keep Marnie from giving away her baby while Gloria wasn't even allowed to see hers. She didn't get the chance to hold her lost baby and say goodbye which I think she would've been given now. Both women were losing babies they wanted. The difference in how they were treated - in both cases by well-meaning people - was stark.

On 4/24/2017 at 1:36 PM, SunnyBeBe said:

I'll repeat my question from last week.  Does anyone know who keeps the Dr. and Shelagh's young daughter when they are at work during the day?

Didn't Timothy mention sending Mrs. Someone away before Patrick got home? I think I remember hearing that.

Edited April 27, 2017 by marceline

[h2ogirl]

Dot told Marine if it was a boy she was going to name him Andrew, I believe. So it was only the middle name that Marnie gave him herself. Which I do not begrudge her doing honestly. 

[Fireball]

32 minutes ago, marceline said:

As long as I'm complaining, another thing I disliked about the adoption story was the fact that Marnie named the baby with apparently no input from Dot. Granted it was just a christening and not a birth certificate but it's just another example of how poorly the situation was handled. Was Dot supposed to call him Andrew or was she going to be allowed to give him the name of her choice as his official one?

There was a scene where were Dot told Marine that she could have a say in naming the child; Marine said something along the lines of no you should name it it'll be your child.

Dot then was talking about baby names and she said if it was a boy that she would like Andrew after Prince Andrew and if it was a girl she wanted something that ended in an a. So Marnie did respect Dot's wishes with Andrew as the first name, but the middle name was not discussed at all.

ETA: I didn't like the christening myself. I'm not saying there shouldn't have been a christening, but the whole thing really was poorly handled. I can understand why religious Marnie wanted a christening; however, Dot & husband should have imo been included. Also if you change your mind and now want a say in the child's name why not just talk to Dot & husband? I didn't like that Marnie decided on the middle name after telling Dot they could decide on the child's name.

Edited April 24, 2017 by Fireball

[marceline]

Ahh so I clearly missed a scene. Good to know. That's what I get for watching and cooking at the same time.

[Sarah 103]

14 hours ago, txhorns79 said:

I think it's nice to see a generally well behaved kid on television, and I don't really want to see him turn into a stereotype of a teenager.  Besides, the last thing this show needs is a regular character that is an angsty teenager.  I mean, the show is Call the Midwife, not My So Called Midwife.     

I don't want him to turn into a moody, angsty teenager for the rest of the season. One the other hand, it would be fun to see him get into a bit of minor trouble or engange in some form of tame rebellion. It could be a subplot that's introduced and resolved in a single episode.  

[Kohola3]

Quote

Older husband, excepted child like it was his own, never commenting on the baby's looks.  Of course, this was several years ago and I could be remembering totally wrong.

You are correct. I think it was in the first season.  It was quite touching because the dad knew immediately that the child was not his but just seconds later he'd pulled himself together and was adoring the little thing.

 

3 hours ago, Pallida said:

When Nurse Crane first started on the show, I really didn't like her - but now I think she's my favorite character, even if she scoffed at an American midwife.

I love her and that statement just cracked me up.

 

2 hours ago, Fireball said:

There was a scene where were Dot told Marnie that she could have a say in naming the child; Marine said something along the lines of no you should name it it'll be your child.

That whole thing was just ten shades of wrong.  I thought Dot was very understanding throughout everything.  I can't imagine being that excited, running around buying things, being present at the birth only to get the big "Never Mind".  I'd have had a word or two for Marnie.  And unless Marnie wins the lottery, that kid will be living hand to mouth like his siblings for his whole childhood.  I guess we were supposed to be rooting for Marnie but I thought the best interests of the kid would be more important.

[MaryHedwig]

Quote

One the other hand, it would be fun to see him get into a bit of minor trouble or engage in some form of tame rebellion.

Well, he did sneak in to visit Shelagh even though he knew the hospital had a no-minors visiting policy. Gateway to sneaking into pubs with a fake I.D.?

Honestly, I have no desire to meet Tim's dark side. But if he must break a rule, let it be this one: he and Sister Monica Joan go off and deliver a baby on the docks that requires an emergency C-section. MJ and Tim then celebrate by finishing off Nonnatus House's secret éclair stash.

[Calvada]

I feel we are all probably missing a few minutes, since PBS in the past have never shown the full episodes.  I have all the DVDs and watching them I'm always seeing a scene that was not televised in the U.S.  I've never understood why they do this, since it's usually just a couple minutes per episode.

I really failed to get engaged in this story.  They sort of half-heartedly tried to make the cousin unlikeable, but as many of us did, I felt sorry for her.  Her husband refused to consider going to an adoption agency, and only changed his mind when he saw how devastated his wife was when little Andrew went back to Marnie.  People like Eugene drive me nuts.  My extended family has been blessed with children who have been offered for adoption, and there is absolutely zero concern that these children are not of "our blood."  One of the situations was just as portrayed here - birth parents having 3rd child, barely able to support two they had, so they decided to offer the baby for adoption.  Such an overwhelming gift they gave, and one for which my family will always be grateful. 

The closed captioning was a bit screwed up for this episode - every time Marnie said Mr. Hereward when talking to Tom, it showed up in CC as Mr. Arrowwood. 

[Amethyst]

3 hours ago, Fireball said:

ETA: I didn't like the christening myself. I'm not saying there shouldn't have been a christening, but the whole thing really was poorly handled. I can understand why religious Marnie wanted a christening; however, Dot & husband should have imo been included. Also if you change your mind and now want a say in the child's name why not just talk to Dot & husband? I didn't like that Marnie decided on the middle name after telling Dot they could decide on the child's name.

The christening was another reason the story line was such a flop.  When Dot said she was against "all of that", Marnie said "That's why I did it."  Which was a head scratcher.  What was that supposed to mean?  It sounded like she really had Andrew baptized so she could still assert some control in his life as his birth mother, rather than an actual desire to have him baptized.  Pretty sure that's not what they were going for, though.

And like it or not, Dot was going to be this kid's mother, and Marnie didn't have the right to baptize Andrew without speaking to Dot and her husband first.  And the whole thing could have been for naught, anyway.  If the adoption had gone through as planned, Dot and her husband could have just avoided telling Andrew that he'd ever been baptized in the first place.

[movingtargetgal]

When I was a teen I went to a Family Planning clinic and was seen by female Nurse Practitioners.  I was very nervous and they were wonderful and supportive.  I kept this a secret from my mother ...well because I was a teenager.  Mom had just had a hysterectomy after years of suffering from endometriosis and fibroid tumors.  She had been going to her family doctor since she was a child and the one and only time he had done a pelvic exam on her is when he delivered me. He just kept telling her that the pain was not that bad and that it was something women have to deal with every month.  When my mother finally went to an OBGYN, she was scheduled for surgery within the month.  After my mother recovered, she made an appointment for me with him.  She wanted to make sure I was okay and would teach me to go for an exam every year.  I had already been fully examined at the clinic but I was afraid to tell her, so I went to the male doctor.  I was wearing a paper gown while he examined me.  He started with the breast exam.  This is when he ripped the gown to expose my breast.  I totally freaked out and screamed at him to stay away from me and  would not let him touch me.  I then told him I already had been examined by the nurses at the clinic and was on the pill.  He told me the nurses did not know what they were doing and I was endangering my health.  My mother heard me screaming and came into the room.  The doctor kept my secret and told my mother I needed to see a female doctor.  She was so angry with me and kept demanding that I submit to the exam, luckily he refused.   I was alway so passive and "well behaved" but what he did was such a trigger for me it caused me to fight for myself for the first time.  All these years later I go to Planned Parenthood for my annual exam and never once has anyone torn a gown off of me.  Nurses Rock.

[Lillybee]

If my ex ever looked at me the way Patrick looks at Shelagh, he wouldn't be an ex. Tim was a bit bratty during the first two seasons so maybe he wised up. I love that he refers to Shelagh as Mum. I think that Marnie went to the council to report Andrew,s birth, she was given an increased allotment and since Dot's husband paid off all the back debts, she may have enough to live on. The British was well on their way to starting a welfare state in the sixties.  On a shallow note, my sister wore her hair almost as high as Dot's in high school.

[Gyproselee]

It has been many years since I have been pregnant but I was perplexed ,Shelagh said she has not felt the baby moves yet at five months because nobody did. I am fairly sure I felt it much sooner and my daughter who just had a baby three weeks ago says yes she felt it around three months.

[Mindthinkr]

11 hours ago, Calvada said:

 

I feel we are all probably missing a few minutes, since PBS in the past have never shown the full episodes.  I have all the DVDs and watching them I'm always seeing a scene that was not televised in the U.S.  I've never understood why they do this, since it's usually just a couple minutes per episode

 

My guess is because they have to put the names up of all the big donors who financially put big bucks into keeping shows like this on. I'm sad to hear that we are missing nuggets (are they important storyline wise or  insightful?) but in the long run I'd prefer seeing their names if it means we have less of those telethons to raise funds. 

[Kohola3]

18 minutes ago, Mindthinkr said:

My guess is because they have to put the names up of all the big donors who financially put big bucks into keeping shows like this on. I'm sad to hear that we are missing nuggets (are they important storyline wise or  insightful?) but in the long run I'd prefer seeing their names if it means we have less of those telethons to raise funds. 

And if the cuts to PBS proposed by the current government are approved we'll get more telethons - if there is enough money to keep it on the air at all. We'd be a poorer nation without the arts.  I'm happy that there are at least some philanthropists who donate and aI don't mind seeing their names even if it means a cut scene or two.  Life without the Midwives (and many others) is a nightmare to think about.

[Clanstarling]

1 hour ago, Gyproselee said:

It has been many years since I have been pregnant but I was perplexed ,Shelagh said she has not felt the baby moves yet at five months because nobody did. I am fairly sure I felt it much sooner and my daughter who just had a baby three weeks ago says yes she felt it around three months.

That sounds about right - I was scheduled for an amniocentesis, which I believe is at 17 weeks and I felt the baby before then.

[Capricasix]

3 hours ago, Gyproselee said:

It has been many years since I have been pregnant but I was perplexed ,Shelagh said she has not felt the baby moves yet at five months because nobody did. I am fairly sure I felt it much sooner and my daughter who just had a baby three weeks ago says yes she felt it around three months.

Well, it depends on how the baby is sitting inside the uterus - if baby is facing the inside, generally speaking, a woman might not be able to feel movement until relatively later.

I can't remember exactly when I felt my first baby move...I want to say it was 18 or 19 weeks, but I can't be sure. I felt my second baby earlier, at about 15 weeks, because I knew what it felt like. When it's your first, it's hard to distinguish between gas/muscle twitches and baby movement.

And when they get hiccups, it's hilarious ?

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

After Birth: I've Dried Up More Tears And Mopped Up More Milk Supplies...

Marnie's husband scarpered and left her with two kids and a third on the way. Is he a bigger scumbag than Marnie's cousin, who basically wants to buy her baby?

[Beezella]

Can someone tell me where Trixie was out of breath? There was a little bit of Keep Fit toward the beginning where Barbara came in late. But Trixie was just standing there. I am wondering if it was cut on my station?

[Clanstarling]

5 hours ago, Capricasix said:

And when they get hiccups, it's hilarious ?

One of my favorite parts of pregnancy.

[latetotheparty]

20 hours ago, Kohola3 said:

You are correct. I think it was in the first season.  It was quite touching because the dad knew immediately that the child was not his but just seconds later he'd pulled himself together and was adoring the little thing.

 

I love her and that statement just cracked me up.

 

That whole thing was just ten shades of wrong.  I thought Dot was very understanding throughout everything.  I can't imagine being that excited, running around buying things, being present at the birth only to get the big "Never Mind".  I'd have had a word or two for Marnie.  And unless Marnie wins the lottery, that kid will be living hand to mouth like his siblings for his whole childhood.  I guess we were supposed to be rooting for Marnie but I thought the best interests of the kid would be more important.

You know, I think it was that scene with the father of the biracial child that made me fall in love with this show forever.  Sometimes they are not and they showed us the flip with the other biracial birth with the hairdresser.  But sometimes people really are that good and we need to see those times and be inspired by how people can rise to the occasion.

Edited April 25, 2017 by latetotheparty
must stop typing in the dark

[MaryHedwig]

Quote

Honestly, I have no desire to meet Tim's dark side. But if he must break a rule, let it be this one: he and Sister Monica Joan go off and deliver a baby on the docks that requires an emergency C-section.

Dr. Turner is furious when he finds out: "Timothy Patrick Turner, what the hell were you thinking?"

"Don't worry Dad, I didn't let Sister Monica Joan touch anything."

Edited April 25, 2017 by MaryHedwig

[marceline]

23 hours ago, Calvada said:

The closed captioning was a bit screwed up for this episode - every time Marnie said Mr. Hereward when talking to Tom, it showed up in CC as Mr. Arrowwood. 

The captioning was a mess all over this episode. Tom was a "curit" and Sr. Julienne mentioned Mother "Shisu" Emmanuel. There were also some small errors like Shelagh saying "Now?" when the nurse said it was time to listen for babies heartbeat but the CC claimed she said "No." I feel like the captioning was done by someone who had a tough time with the accents.

Re: the conversation of Timothy. I have no interest in Bad Boy Timothy either but that doesn't mean he can't be given some drama and conflict. I'm thinking of the story when he confronted Patrick about his smoking. And frankly, I think a story where he gets into a tough situation with Sr. Monica Joan could result in some good television. Or maybe he tries to help a pregnant classmate. I'm kind of amazed we haven't had a story where Tim brings a friend or classmate to Patrick or the sisters. That said, I agree with others above who like having a well adjusted (if just a slightly too perfect) teenager on TV. I suspect we could fill a whole topic on "TV's Most Annoying Teens." (I'm looking at you, Wesley Crusher.)

Edited April 26, 2017 by marceline

[Calvada]

5 minutes ago, marceline said:

The captioning was a mess all over this episode. Tom was a "curit" and Sr. Julienne mentioned Mother "Shisu" Emmanuel. There were also some small errors like Shelagh saying "Now?" when the nurse said it was time to listen for babies heartbeat but the CC claimed she said "No."

I feel like the captioning was done by someone who had a tough time with the accents.

It was a flashback to My Fair Lady, with the H's dropping, changing "Hereward" to "Arrowwood."  I'd have to re-watch but I think at one point the CC had someone (Dot perhaps?) saying Barney instead of Marnie!  But I sympathize with those doing the closed captioning, with the various accents.  That's exactly why I watch this show with CC on, because otherwise I'd be wondering "what did she say??" throughout.  But wouldn't a copy of the script be given to the company doing the captioning?  Or does that make too much sense?

[Kohola3]

2 minutes ago, Calvada said:

I'd have to re-watch but I think at one point the CC had someone (Dot perhaps?) saying Barney instead of Marnie!

I know!  I got so confused with the christening because I saw the name Barney and couldn't figure out why they were christening the kid as Andrew.  

And I also agree that it makes more sense to use the script.  I can never figure out why news programs get screwy with the closed captioning.  They are reading off a teleprompter - why not just post that?

[marceline]

2 minutes ago, Calvada said:

It was a flashback to My Fair Lady, with the H's dropping, changing "Hereward" to "Arrowwood."  I'd have to re-watch but I think at one point the CC had someone (Dot perhaps?) saying Barney instead of Marnie!  But I sympathize with those doing the closed captioning, with the various accents.  That's exactly why I watch this show with CC on, because otherwise I'd be wondering "what did she say??" throughout.  But wouldn't a copy of the script be given to the company doing the captioning?  Or does that make too much sense?

That's what I think too but I admit that I have NO idea what's involved with captioning a TV show.

I do pretty well with the accents in this show but I like to keep the CC on so I know the difference between an accent issue and the show referencing something I don't understand like a street name or a product. (I can't tell you how many times I've had to pause and Google something like "What is Babycham?" ) But CTM is way easier to understand than Doctor Who. Without captions, I might as well be watching a telenovela.

[txhorns79]

Quote

That whole thing was just ten shades of wrong.  I thought Dot was very understanding throughout everything.  I can't imagine being that excited, running around buying things, being present at the birth only to get the big "Never Mind".  I'd have had a word or two for Marnie.  And unless Marnie wins the lottery, that kid will be living hand to mouth like his siblings for his whole childhood.  I guess we were supposed to be rooting for Marnie but I thought the best interests of the kid would be more important.

I was very mixed on the storyline.  They kind of glossed over the fact that Marnie was weeks away from eviction at the beginning of the episode with two children she could not provide for, so I don't really see how adding a third child to the mix makes things better. 

[Calvada]

Marceline, I think it was the very first episode when I had to pause and Google "what is Horlicks?" 

I find I need CC more and more with each passing year!  But the shows with the various British accents are the most difficult for me.  For example, I watch Elementary, and I find Jonny Lee Miller extremely difficult to understand, mostly because his character speaks in that clipped, quick fashion that I think would be called British Public School.  Of course, it also features Aidan Quinn, or as I call him "Mr. Mumbles," which makes using CC a necessity for me for that show. 

Regarding Tim, I think it would be an interesting situation to have some friend put pressure on him to get a drug from his father's office.  I'm thinking of a kid who contracts a venereal disease and is afraid to go to their parents/their family doctor, or a girl who wants birth control pills.  Isn't he at a school now that is not in the neighborhood, so he's not with the kids his parents would know, right? 

[MaryHedwig]

Quote

Or maybe he tries to help a pregnant classmate.

I love this idea! And Patrick and Shelagh are worried the baby might be his.

[jschoolgirl]

2 hours ago, Calvada said:

It was a flashback to My Fair Lady, with the H's dropping, changing "Hereward" to "Arrowwood."  I'd have to re-watch but I think at one point the CC had someone (Dot perhaps?) saying Barney instead of Marnie!  But I sympathize with those doing the closed captioning, with the various accents.  That's exactly why I watch this show with CC on, because otherwise I'd be wondering "what did she say??" throughout.  But wouldn't a copy of the script be given to the company doing the captioning?  Or does that make too much sense?

But we did get "uplifting music"!

[izabella]

On 4/24/2017 at 9:55 PM, Amethyst said:

The christening was another reason the story line was such a flop.  When Dot said she was against "all of that", Marnie said "That's why I did it."  Which was a head scratcher.  What was that supposed to mean?  It sounded like she really had Andrew baptized so she could still assert some control in his life as his birth mother, rather than an actual desire to have him baptized.  Pretty sure that's not what they were going for, though.

The way I heard it, Dot said she didn't believe in all of that, and Marnie said that's why she had done it.  It makes a little more sense that Marnie would do it if her cousin just didn't believe in it as opposed to being against it.

[3 is enough]

I loved the Jamaican nurse.  Would like to see her as a recurring character. The adoption storyline was just "meh".  I was surprised that Shelagh got to go home.  Will she be on bedrest until she delivers?

[Mindthinkr]

3 minutes ago, 3 is enough said:

I loved the Jamaican nurse.  Would like to see her as a recurring character. The adoption storyline was just "meh".  I was surprised that Shelagh got to go home.  Will she be on bedrest until she delivers?

I loved her melodious accent. She was brusque but kind. 

[latetotheparty]

20 hours ago, MaryHedwig said:

Dr. Turner is furious when he finds out: "Timothy Patrick Turner, what the hell were you thinking?"

"Don't worry Dad, I didn't let Sister Monica Joan touch anything."

This post made wish for a giggle button. Thanks for the laugh. I can totally see this. Timothy would be so earnest!

Edited April 26, 2017 by latetotheparty
Typos are strong this morning

[marceline]

2 hours ago, Mindthinkr said:

I loved her melodious accent. She was brusque but kind. 

She reminded me a lot of Sister Evangelina.

[latetotheparty]

On ‎4‎/‎24‎/‎2017 at 8:33 AM, Fireball said:

Sister Ursula really doesn't seem to have had a point. The house has gotten funds to hire a new midwife something I doubt would happen if things were as bad as Sister Ursula was implying. 

I've wanted to respond to this for a few days now.  I agree 100%.

I've made no secret of my dislike for her character.  She made no sense to me.  I found her unbelievable.  Then they slapped an ounce of humanity on her and sent her packing.

I find myself really angry about this.  CtM used to do a much better job of showing the truth of their characters.  They were careful to show the humanity of their "bad" characters and show the very real flaws of characters we loved.  Sister Ursula was misdrawn from start to finish and those writers should be ashamed.  To have an actor of Harriet Walter's caliber and waste her on sloppy writing is an insult to her talent and intelligence but she sure gave it her best.  She didn't have to be a saint.  Make her an adversary - she rocks that - but give us a character we can enjoy even when we know she is wrong.  These are the first episodes I don't think I'll be rewatching much.

This situation has shown me what I have been missing this season.  I really love the balance between the chaotic world of post-war healthcare and the inner lives of the sisters.  They were the peaceful counterpoint to all the drama.  I miss the chanting.  It was handled so sensitively - heartfelt but not preachy at all- and it's what made CtM really special.

[Beezella]

I love this show so much, I would binge watch the whole season if I could. I love how much detail and action is in the montage scenes, like the chariot race at the end. I watched in slow mo to try to see everything. I THINK that Fred and the boys were having trouble with the starting pistol when Phyllis waltzes right in and adjusts it and shoots it off. And the race begins! I think the chariots were prams, wheelchairs, and patched together things. I appreciate that it must have been a lot of work for just a few seconds of screen time.

[Sarah 103]

On April 25, 2017 at 8:57 PM, marceline said:

Or maybe he tries to help a pregnant classmate. I'm kind of amazed we haven't had a story where Tim brings a friend or classmate to Patrick or the sisters. 

I love this idea. It's even better if he tries to help her on his own for part of it, because he thinks he's capable of it. She's heard all sorts of myths about how to tell if you're pregnant. Tim knows the facts and asks her questions and finds out that she is pregnant. 

On April 25, 2017 at 10:28 PM, MaryHedwig said:

I love this idea! And Patrick and Shelagh are worried the baby might be his.

Too perfect! I would love to see how Tim would react. Probably a mixture of pride that they thought he was capable of getting a girlfriend and horrified that they thought he'd be so irresponsible. 

[Hudson0325]

There is not much more I can add to the thoughts already expressed regarding the adoption. I agree that Dot seemed to be unfairly villianized by the writers. My heart went out to both Marnie and Dot throughout the whole ordeal. There is one act of Marnie's that hasn't been mentioned that I thought was rather petty and bitter. When Dot sweetly brought Marnie' s young son a birthday present, rather than being either appreciative or nicely explaining why it might be inappropriate due to the circumstances, she angerly took Dot's head off about it because she (Marnie) couldn't afford a present. Then she says the child is too young to understand birthdays. So what the hell was the problem? She was just bitter because her cousin could afford something nice for her child but because she couldn't do the same, the child should not have the gift. 

[jschoolgirl]

7 hours ago, marceline said:

She reminded me a lot of Sister Evangelina.

I miss her!

[ItCouldBeWorse]

On 4/24/2017 at 10:55 PM, Amethyst said:

The christening was another reason the story line was such a flop.  When Dot said she was against "all of that", Marnie said "That's why I did it."  Which was a head scratcher.  What was that supposed to mean?  It sounded like she really had Andrew baptized so she could still assert some control in his life as his birth mother, rather than an actual desire to have him baptized.  Pretty sure that's not what they were going for, though.

And like it or not, Dot was going to be this kid's mother, and Marnie didn't have the right to baptize Andrew without speaking to Dot and her husband first.  And the whole thing could have been for naught, anyway.  If the adoption had gone through as planned, Dot and her husband could have just avoided telling Andrew that he'd ever been baptized in the first place.

Isn't the point of a baptism to "save" the baptized?  Even though Marnie would not be Andrew's mother, she believed she was giving him that sanctioned safety net, for want of a better term.  If infant baptism has a purpose according to the church, it wouldn't matter whether the baby knew of it or not, since no baby consents to baptism.

Edited April 27, 2017 by ItCouldBeWorse

[AnnieBeez]

I'm still not seeing Dot as a villain. We don't know that there were strings, do we? Do we have any reason to believe that Dot and husband wouldn't help her? My impression from what she said at the beginning with Tom was that she was too proud to ask for help. 

Edited April 27, 2017 by MischaMouse
I do know the difference btwn there and their.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

On 4/23/2017 at 11:20 PM, Fireball said:

Vera is going to be a midwife that was predictable. However, I thought she was a nurse in the war, so is she going to take some midwifery training? If she has to take training doesn't that defeat the purpose of hiring someone who knows what they are doing like Phyllis wanted. 

 

On 4/24/2017 at 9:33 AM, Fireball said:

On 4/24/2017 at 3:01 AM, caitmcg said:

Phyllis objected to the male candidate who responded to the placement ad because he wouldn't be able to do midwifery duties, and when Sister Julienne brought up district nursing, Phyllis pointed out that 50 percent of their time is spent on midwifery, and nixed men for that reason. So it did seem they didn't want someone with no midwifery training, even though I assumed all along that the new nurse would end up being Vera in the end. 

This is how I interpreted it. It totally seemed to me that they didn't want someone with no midwifery training and it didn't seem like Vera had any. 

Vera's acceptance letter welcomed her as a midwife, so there's definitely some inconsistency.

On 4/24/2017 at 9:33 AM, Fireball said:

Sister Ursula really doesn't seem to have had a point. The house has gotten funds to hire a new midwife something I doubt would happen if things were as bad as Sister Ursula was implying. 

Is Patsy being paid while she is on leave?  couldn't her salary be uses to hire someone temporarily without additional funding?  Losing a nun-midwife such as Evangelina or Mary Cynthia is a double loss, since they don't require a salary, presumably.

Does anyone know why Sister Julienne put a blue head covering on after praying in her room at the beginning of the episode? They made such a point of showing it that it must be significant.

[Fireball]

10 hours ago, scout305 said:

There is one act of Marnie's that hasn't been mentioned that I thought was rather petty and bitter. When Dot sweetly brought Marnie' s young son a birthday present, rather than being either appreciative or nicely explaining why it might be inappropriate due to the circumstances, she angerly took Dot's head off about it because she (Marnie) couldn't afford a present. Then she says the child is too young to understand birthdays. So what the hell was the problem? She was just bitter because her cousin could afford something nice for her child but because she couldn't do the same, the child should not have the gift. 

Oh I forgot about that scene! Dot was just being nice and bringing her godson a present for his birthday. I really didn't understand Marnie's problem. What was wrong with Dot giving the son a present? I get that Marnie felt bad that she couldn't buy her son a present, but wow to not allow her son the present Dot brought him was petty.

 

8 hours ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

Vera's acceptance letter welcomed her as a midwife, so there's definitely some inconsistency.

Is Patsy being paid while she is on leave?  couldn't her salary be uses to hire someone temporarily without additional funding?  Losing a nun-midwife such as Evangelina or Mary Cynthia is a double loss, since they don't require a salary, presumably.

There does seem to be a bit of inconsistency with Vera.  I guess they could use Patsy's salary to pay Vera, but I got the impression that Sister Julienne had gotten permission from the head office to hire another midwife which implied to me that they were getting more funds.