S03.E04: Episode 4

[AmandaPanda]

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Cole is put in an increasingly impossible situation by Alison's return to his life. Alison must contend with Luisa while attempting to reconnect with her daughter. Simultaneously, a dangerous passion threatens to wreck everything.

[CleoCaesar]

Love me some episodes with no Noah. And no Solloway kids.

"I'm yours, Luisa."  *goes and fucks Alison*  I hate all of these assholes. Cole seemed like the one decent guy of the main characters.

[Thinbalina]

Damn Cole..

[Growsonwalls]

Damn. I don't care if Cole is now cheating on his wife -- the chemistry between Joshua Jackson and Ruth Wilson is off the charts. Their body language and comfort with each other is such a contrast to every other relationship on this show. This show just is at a higher level whenever it's a Cole/Alison centric episode because I care about these two characters and their journey together. 

[Primetimer]

The show finally remembers one of the gimmicks that makes it watchable, but forgets to answer a half-dozen burning questions in this episode.

View the full article

[Thinbalina]

1 minute ago, Growsonwalls said:

Damn. I don't care if Cole is now cheating on his wife -- the chemistry between Joshua Jackson and Ruth Wilson is off the charts. Their body language and comfort with each other is such a contrast to every other relationship on this show. This show just is at a higher level whenever it's a Cole/Alison centric episode because I care about these two characters and their journey together. 

I agree and I feel bad that I want them back together.

[KBrownie]

No Alison, I think you are the one who's the fucking monster.  That shit with the peanut butter was proof enough.  Never did get a definitive answer on if she used it or not.  

And damn you Cole.  You are no longer any better than Alison or Noah for cheating on your wife like that.  She tells you her fears about Alison and you go right behind her and prove yourself to be a lying piece of scum.  And for who? Alison of all people!? Who's already proven she doesn't give a fuck about you and your feelings?  And you know she's just going to use this to blackmail him over Joanie and further prove herself to be a damn monster.  She's saying  all the right stuff about how wrong she was, but she has this air of entitlement that it's everyone else who's keeping her from Joanie.  That she had nothing to do with it.  The best thing Cole can do is man up and come clean to Luisa and deal with the consequences and keep his daughter safe from Alison's mental instabilities.  She's going to run right back to Noah and he will have busted up his life for nothing.

Helen for the goddamn win with this group of losers.

Edited December 12, 2016 by KBrownie
left out a word

[racked]

Allison is the most infuriating character on this show, which is really saying something because she beats out Noah. Her POV paints everyone else, every single person, as out to get her and herself as innocent and taken advantage of. 

But Cole is unfortunately a dumbass. What drives me crazy is no one ever brings up Allison keeping Cole from his daughter for two years. Even Luisa, who was unfairly painted in both these POVs I'm sure. Are we supposed to think everyone is over that?

Edited December 12, 2016 by racked

[truthaboutluv]

So last week, I wrote this in the episode thread.

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And there's Alison (yes I know she wasn't in this episode but it always applies) - poor, tragic Alison who has never met a man who didn't want to fuck her. And even this season, despite leaving him for Noah, screwing creepy Oscar (yes I know he doesn't know about that), lying about his kid for TWO years, we all know Cole is going to blow up his marriage to Luisa for Alison, who despite her not being worth shit, he's still in love with. No, that's not a spoiler. It's just speculation based on the season long promo. So there's Cole and Helen still in love with Alison and Noah - two of the most selfish, narcissistic assholes that ever was. 

No, I did not read any spoilers. But even I didn't expect the shit show to happen this quickly. I really believe I am on the cusp of quitting the show. I cannot continue to watch Cole waste his life on Alison. I get that there is history, I get that he didn't leave her, I get that they now share a child again but he said it himself, all she does is bring chaos in his life. And for crying out loud, is Alison incapable of NOT fucking someone. If there is any consolation to Cole, unlike Noah who just seems to despise Helen, Alison at least still seems interested in sleeping with him. But then again, as previously noted, I don't know that Alison knows the option of not sleeping with someone. 

And once again, we continue to see how Alison sees herself versus everyone else. Cole sees Alison as better, he sees her a little as the woman he fell in love with and as a temptation. Hell there was almost a little of the sexy siren that Noah always saw her as. But of course Alison's version has her as dowdy and everyone is so mean to her. She even saw Cole as short and dismissive to her at first, while his version has him practically looking at her with stars in his eyes. I also found the two versions of Oscar interesting - Cole's memory showed Oscar happy and well, not creepy, while Alison's saw him drinking and hating his life or at least hating Montauk. I can't figure out if Alison is just such an unhappy, miserable person that that affects her entire perception, including how people treat her, how she sees other people and their feelings, happiness or lack thereof, etc.

I know Cole didn't stab Noah but I am curious where he was on the night Noah was stabbed because he didn't answer Luisa when she asked and Alison's version made it clear he wasn't with her either. Cole was my last hope but his treatment of Luisa is awful and no amount of history with Alison excuses it. This is a woman who has fucked him over in more ways than one. And they could flash back in Noah and Helen's versions, yet they are coincidentally just flipping past the reveal of Joanie being Cole's. Because I still want a damn explanation from Alison for why she felt it perfectly okay to deny Cole Joanie for two damn years. 

I just cannot do it if this is where this show is going - I have never been interested in Noah and Alison's awful relationship and I am not here to see Cole and Helen still in love with them. Helen I can almost forgive because Noah did go to prison for her after all but there is no excuse for this shit with Cole. Alison is just a whiny, selfish, self destructive mess and I am sick of seeing her play victim while men just fall all over for her. 

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She's saying  all the right stuff about how wrong she was, but she has this air of entitlement that it's everyone else who's keeping her from Joanie. 

This. Every time she said how she was being punished, I just thought that proved that she wasn't better and didn't get it. Because the fact that she thinks having to have supervised visits after she abandoned her kid in the middle of the night and had a full massive mental breakdown means she's being punished is ridiculous. 

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But Cole is unfortunately a dumbass. What drives me crazy is no one ever brings up Allison keeping Cole from his daughter for two years. Even Luisa, who was unfairly painted in both these POVs I'm sure. Are we supposed to think everyone is over that?

THANK YOU! This so much. The writers just brushed past it and it's like no, victim my ass. That lying bitch denied a man who lost a child with her his child for two years and now we're supposed to think it's all okay and he's right back to fucking her. 

Edited December 12, 2016 by truthaboutluv

[Sader87]

Think I'm done watching this show.....when it premieres on Sundays anyway, It just seems to have lost a lot of mojo this year....too bad.

[KBrownie]

13 minutes ago, truthaboutluv said:

This. Every time she said how she was being punished, I just thought that proved that she wasn't better and didn't get it. Because the fact that she thinks having to have supervised visits after she abandoned her kid in the middle of the night and had a full massive mental breakdown means she's being punished is ridiculous. 

Yep.  She's so damn selfish, I can't stand it.  Hey, Alison? No one is punishing YOU.  They are all trying to protect Joanie.  They could give a fuck about you and your tortured ass.  Well, this was true of Cole until tonight.  

Edited December 12, 2016 by KBrownie

[CleoCaesar]

Quote

 

But of course Alison's version has her as dowdy and everyone is so mean to her.

 

She's such a perma-victim. It's infuriating.

[GeminiDancer]

Goddamn it, Cole! You went from being the best character for saying "Too bad" to being the biggest idiot on the show. I hate that he's constantly snowed by Alison. And Alison, she needs to fucking stop with her constant self-victimization. Is she ever going to address her pushing Scotty or is that part of the story gone? I don't believe Alison's view of Luisa at all. This episode makes me think about when Oscar told Noah that everyone treats Alison like a wounded bird when she doesn't care about anyone but herself. She's very self-centered.

I needed Luisa's perspective for sure, especially since Juliette got one. I bet it would be her being dismissed at the hands of both Cole and Alison.

[izabella]

25 minutes ago, truthaboutluv said:

And they could flash back in Noah and Helen's versions, yet they are coincidentally just flipping past the reveal of Joanie being Cole's. Because I still want a damn explanation from Alison for why she felt it perfectly okay to deny Cole Joanie for two damn years. 

I am really annoyed by that.  I wanted to see the fall-out, and that would have felt more organic than "Noah gets stabbed in the neck" story line. 

[GeminiDancer]

I'm hoping that we'll get the full story of Joanie's paternity reveal in a future episode because it's too big to be glossed over. If they continue to ignore it, that's horrible story-telling on the part of Treem and co.

If Alison brings Noah back in her life, she deserves to lose Joanie permanently.

[Guest]

I laughed out loud when Joanie fell off the pony for, like, literally no reason. Did the invisible hand of god slap her off? I do not know.

Another amusing highlight included Cole saying to Alison, "Why would the cops think I stabbed Noah Solloway?" I liked that he had to add in the last name just in case Alison would have been confused in case she knew another guy named Noah who also got stabbed. Additionally amusing, that Noah identified himself as Noah Solloway on his own voicemail greeting. 

This show needs to once and for all drop the conceit of the he saw/she saw. In Cole's "POV," he motioned Alison go to Joanie after she was plucked off the horse by a ghost fell off the horse and she thanked him for that when he came over for illicit sexy times. Yet, in her "POV," Luisa ran over while Alison sidelined herself with a mini meltdown. These aren't two different points of view, these are two people living in alternate realities. 

But whatevs.  

[Mackey]

Have we viewers been given any hints as to why Allison is estranged from Noah? Does anyone have a guess? After all, he apparently never mentioned to anyone that she pushed Scotty in front of the car. That seems like something she'd be grateful for.  She kept it from him that his daughter was not his for a long time. Yet, he seems to be the one who's pining over her rather than hating her.  However, she got "caring" emotional about him being stabbed. I'm confused. 

[chocolatine]

Wow, Alison even played the victim with her own child's court-appointed advocate. The person that had to be appointed to put Joanie's needs first, because Alison herself wasn't capable of doing that. What a piece of work.

And Cole, it's almost like the more of a mess Alison is, the more irresistible she is to him. She shows up after six months away with no contact and whines about how she was "in a bad way" - he has a sex dream about her. She pouts about being on the sidelines of Joanie's birthday party and begs him to let her have Joanie for the night despite his better judgement - why, that's so attractive that he has to have sex with her right then and there. I hope Luisa finds out soon, makes Cole buy her out of everything they own together, and lets the two of them live miserably ever after.

[LilaFowler]

Some of the differences in POVs are just bizarre.  I understand small differences but honestly, unless Alison is truly mental and delusional, how could the details around the daughter falling from the pony vary so wildly? Does not compute. 

Cole, wtf? He's the new Noah, I guess. Has a pretty great life at home, throws it all away for irresistible Alison and her permanent victimhood. He should have never married Luisa if he still had such feelings buried for someone else. Totally unfair.

Edited December 12, 2016 by LilaFowler

[chabelisaywow]

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Wow, Alison even played the victim with her own child's court-appointed advocate. The person that had to be appointed to put Joanie's needs first, because Alison herself wasn't capable of doing that. What a piece of work.

I started watching this show because I hoped that karma would catch up to Noah and Alison.  Idiots.  I thought Alison sold her rights to Lobster Roll to pay for hospitalization.  Why is she saying that she lives off her share?

5 year old Joanie looks like Luisa's daughter.

[Sienna]

God, I hate all of these people. Cole was the one main character I was holding out hope for, and now.... seriously?!?

For Joanie's sake, I'm crossing my fingers there was a mix-up at the DNA lab, and Sebastian Junger is really the father.

[chabelisaywow]

Alison is now Carrie and she willed Joanie off that horse.

Damn Luisa and her dirty pillows!

[chocolatine]

57 minutes ago, Sienna said:

For Joanie's sake, I'm crossing my fingers there was a mix-up at the DNA lab, and Sebastian Junger is really the father.

Sebastian Junger is a long shot, but maybe it'll turn out that Noah is the father after all. Joanie has brown eyes and dark hair, like Noah. Cole and Alison both have blue eyes and lighter hair. The stealth DNA test that Helen had done only said that Noah was not the father, it said nothing about Cole being the father. The test could have been a false negative.

[truthaboutluv]

I think they just cast poorly with Joanie because frankly, she doesn't look a thing like Noah to me and instead looks like she could be Luisa's biological child. The DNA test Helen and Gottlief did wasn't what confirmed Joanie wasn't Noah's child to Noah. We were shown the scene of Gottlief telling Noah Joanie wasn't his and him saying he already knew. I think after the night of Cole's wedding where Alison confessed to Noah that Joanie may not be his, they did a DNA test that confirmed he wasn't the father.

Process of elimination says that once Noah was proven not to be the father, unless there was someone else Alison slept with (which wouldn't surprise me at this point), Cole was the father. Plus, I would like to think that Cole had a DNA test to confirm his being Joanie's father when Alison dropped the news on him a whole two years later. This season is already a mess. Trying to retcon that Joanie really is Noah's after all would be the death knell in my opinion. The whole basis of Scotty's threatening to Alison was because he figured out by looking at Joanie that she was Cole's.

The writing made sure to have Cole never around Joanie until that day in the court room. Joanie being born 5 weeks "early", hell the fact that they even had Cole and Alison sleep together, surprising then considering how they left things at the end of Season 1. I don't see any way that Joanie isn't Cole's. 

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Cole, wtf? He's the new Noah, I guess. Has a pretty great life at home, throws it all away for irresistible Alison and her permanent victimhood. He should have never married Luisa if he still had such feelings buried for someone else. Totally unfair.

I agree that he probably should not have married Luisa. But while I hate this storyline, I wouldn't say his actions make him like Noah. The fact is however much we all hate Alison and can see how awful she is, there is a long history between her and Cole. Yes, after all the shit she's done to him, you would think it'd be enough to kill whatever lingering feelings were there but life doesn't always work out that way and people don't always do the obvious and sensible thing.

I also think sharing Joanie is what's complicating things even more. Because I cannot imagine they'd even have much contact if Joanie had been Noah's. But I think having Joanie, plus the constant lingering cloud of the previous child they shared who died just brings up a lot of conflicting feelings for Cole regarding Alison. I don't agree with it and I don't like it in any way because again Alison has done so much to him - it's not just the cheating with and ultimately leaving him for Noah (and he still doesn't know about Oscar too) but again she lied to him for years about Joanie's being his. 

But she is so good at being the victim and yes, as someone else said, Oscar called it in S1 in saying that others see her that way as well. Hell Luisa said it Cole's version last night. That he sees Alison as this fragile little bird. So despite all she's done, there's still this desire to protect her, take care of her and love her. All the while she just continues to make bad choice after bad choice and leave a mess of destruction in her wake and then play the hurt and attacked victim, when she's called out for it. 

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Have we viewers been given any hints as to why Allison is estranged from Noah? Does anyone have a guess? After all, he apparently never mentioned to anyone that she pushed Scotty in front of the car. That seems like something she'd be grateful for.  She kept it from him that his daughter was not his for a long time. Yet, he seems to be the one who's pining over her rather than hating her.  However, she got "caring" emotional about him being stabbed. I'm confused. 

The only thing I can guess is that she was mad that he didn't just tell the truth about Helen driving and instead took the blame for the accident and in the process ruined their lives because he'd be in prison for three years. She probably saw it as his choosing Helen and their kids over the life he had with her and the kid that she lied about being his because that would be like Alison. 

Edited December 12, 2016 by truthaboutluv

[attica]

9 hours ago, Mackey said:

Have we viewers been given any hints as to why Allison is estranged from Noah?

I like to think it's because she's watched this show.

 

10 hours ago, Giant Misfit said:

These aren't two different points of view, these are two people living in alternate realities. 

This doesn't seem weird to me here in 2016, I gotta say.

[izabella]

2 hours ago, truthaboutluv said:

The only thing I can guess is that she was mad that he didn't just tell the truth about Helen driving and instead took the blame for the accident and in the process ruined their lives because he'd be in prison for three years. She probably saw it as his choosing Helen and their kids over the life he had with her and the kid that she lied about being his because that would be like Alison. 

Or that she knows that Noah saw her after she pushed Scotty into the road, in front of the car.  And she just doesn't want to have that conversation, nor face the fact that she pushed Scotty in front of an oncoming car, even if it wasn't intentionally to get him killed.

[jrlr]

1 minute ago, izabella said:

Or that she knows that Noah saw her after she pushed Scotty into the road, in front of the car.  And she just doesn't want to have that conversation, nor face the fact that she pushed Scotty in front of an oncoming car, even if it wasn't intentionally to get him killed.

I'm no Alison apologist, but I have never thought she was responsible for Scotty's death.  She did not push him in front of an ongoing car either intentionally or unintentionally, she shoved him away from her when he was trying to grope her in a thick fog that limited visibility, which is why the car struck him to start with.  In a moment of panic that I think a lot of women can relate to, you don't see your surroundings, you only act on a primitive fight or flight reaction.  

[izabella]

2 minutes ago, jrlr said:

I'm no Alison apologist, but I have never thought she was responsible for Scotty's death.  She did not push him in front of an ongoing car either intentionally or unintentionally, she shoved him away from her when he was trying to grope her in a thick fog that limited visibility, which is why the car struck him to start with.  In a moment of panic that I think a lot of women can relate to, you don't see your surroundings, you only act on a primitive fight or flight reaction.  

I think Allison might be concerned about it, though, regardless of what actually happened, which we don't really know since we saw it from her point of view (not Scotty's).  She is always someone's "victim" in her perspectives, so she might very well be afraid of talking about what happened with Noah because she thinks he might blame her.

[Blakeston]

5 minutes ago, jrlr said:

I'm no Alison apologist, but I have never thought she was responsible for Scotty's death.  She did not push him in front of an ongoing car either intentionally or unintentionally, she shoved him away from her when he was trying to grope her in a thick fog that limited visibility, which is why the car struck him to start with.  In a moment of panic that I think a lot of women can relate to, you don't see your surroundings, you only act on a primitive fight or flight reaction.  

I don't see Alison as being guilty of killing Scotty. But her failure to speak up about what happened resulted in an innocent man going to prison.

[grumpypanda]

Fuck you Cole you're dead to me! Anyway, I've always thought most of the acting on this show was pretty good but for some reason I thought Ruth Wilson and Joshua Jackson were awful in most of their scenes this episode. It was Days of Our Lives bad. 

Is it just me or does Luisa look really harsh this season? I wonder if it's intentional to make her look more like a bitch. I don't like her hair and her make-up is too dark or something.

Yep Alison you're a slut and you should feel like shit for sleeping with Cole. I hate her so much! And the peanut butter thing reminded me of the shampoo incident. Luisa might be a bitch but she has reason to be. She was right after all, Alison will destroy her life. Cole is dumb is fall for her act. 

[DarkRaichu]

31 minutes ago, grumpypanda said:

Is it just me or does Luisa look really harsh this season? I wonder if it's intentional to make her look more like a bitch. I don't like her hair and her make-up is too dark or something.

She was a little bit in Cole's POV and she was the main B in Alison's POV.  However, I did not know that making one's hair straight (she had curly hair in Cole's POV) was a make-up trick to make one look mean :D

Lol when Alison had a "I love it when plan comes together" look just after she swam.  Now she got ammunition to put Cole vs Luisa.

 

Also, Alison reminded me of Sookie from True Blood with her magical female part :P :P :P

[Trace]

3 hours ago, truthaboutluv said:

I think they just cast poorly with Joanie because frankly, she doesn't look a thing like Noah to me and instead looks like she could be Luisa's biological child. The DNA test Helen and Gottlief did wasn't what confirmed Joanie wasn't Noah's child to Noah. We were shown the scene of Gottlief telling Noah Joanie wasn't his and him saying he already knew. I think after the night of Cole's wedding where Alison confessed to Noah that Joanie may not be his, they did a DNA test that confirmed he wasn't the father.

Process of elimination says that once Noah was proven not to be the father, unless there was someone else Alison slept with (which wouldn't surprise me at this point), Cole was the father. Plus, I would like to think that Cole had a DNA test to confirm his being Joanie's father when Alison dropped the news on him a whole two years later. This season is already a mess. Trying to retcon that Joanie really is Noah's after all would be the death knell in my opinion. The whole basis of Scotty's threatening to Alison was because he figured out by looking at Joanie that she was Cole's.

The writing made sure to have Cole never around Joanie until that day in the court room. Joanie being born 5 weeks "early", hell the fact that they even had Cole and Alison sleep together, surprising then considering how they left things at the end of Season 1. I don't see any way that Joanie isn't Cole's. 

I agree that he probably should not have married Luisa. But while I hate this storyline, I wouldn't say his actions make him like Noah. The fact is however much we all hate Alison and can see how awful she is, there is a long history between her and Cole. Yes, after all the shit she's done to him, you would think it'd be enough to kill whatever lingering feelings were there but life doesn't always work out that way and people don't always do the obvious and sensible thing.

I also think sharing Joanie is what's complicating things even more. Because I cannot imagine they'd even have much contact if Joanie had been Noah's. But I think having Joanie, plus the constant lingering cloud of the previous child they shared who died just brings up a lot of conflicting feelings for Cole regarding Alison. I don't agree with it and I don't like it in any way because again Alison has done so much to him - it's not just the cheating with and ultimately leaving him for Noah (and he still doesn't know about Oscar too) but again she lied to him for years about Joanie's being his. 

But she is so good at being the victim and yes, as someone else said, Oscar called it in S1 in saying that others see her that way as well. Hell Luisa said it Cole's version last night. That he sees Alison as this fragile little bird. So despite all she's done, there's still this desire to protect her, take care of her and love her. All the while she just continues to make bad choice after bad choice and leave a mess of destruction in her wake and then play the hurt and attacked victim, when she's called out for it. 

The only thing I can guess is that she was mad that he didn't just tell the truth about Helen driving and instead took the blame for the accident and in the process ruined their lives because he'd be in prison for three years. She probably saw it as his choosing Helen and their kids over the life he had with her and the kid that she lied about being his because that would be like Alison. 

But Alison was shown shoving Scotty into the path of Noah's car! To me that is huge.  I said in a previous post that I think that incident was what threw Alison over the edge. I think no one but Alison (and Scotty) are to blame for Scotty's death.  Not Helen, not Noah. I'm going to be really pissed off it this is swept under the rug and not addressed.  Why show it in the first place? 

Edited December 12, 2016 by Trace

[BindsTheTuna]

9 hours ago, chocolatine said:

Wow, Alison even played the victim with her own child's court-appointed advocate. The person that had to be appointed to put Joanie's needs first, because Alison herself wasn't capable of doing that. What a piece of work.

That's not entirely true. (The appointment part, not the playing the victim part.) I work for a judge, and we appoint attorneys ad litem in hotly contested custody cases all the time. They're an unbiased 3rd party when ALL adults (which would include Cole and Luisa in this case) are putting their own interests ahead of the child/children. 

[Cranky One]

8 hours ago, chocolatine said:

Sebastian Junger is a long shot, but maybe it'll turn out that Noah is the father after all. Joanie has brown eyes and dark hair, like Noah. Cole and Alison both have blue eyes and lighter hair. The stealth DNA test that Helen had done only said that Noah was not the father, it said nothing about Cole being the father. The test could have been a false negative.

 

4 hours ago, truthaboutluv said:

I think they just cast poorly with Joanie because frankly, she doesn't look a thing like Noah to me and instead looks like she could be Luisa's biological child. The DNA test Helen and Gottlief did wasn't what confirmed Joanie wasn't Noah's child to Noah. We were shown the scene of Gottlief telling Noah Joanie wasn't his and him saying he already knew. I think after the night of Cole's wedding where Alison confessed to Noah that Joanie may not be his, they did a DNA test that confirmed he wasn't the father.

Process of elimination says that once Noah was proven not to be the father, unless there was someone else Alison slept with (which wouldn't surprise me at this point), Cole was the father. Plus, I would like to think that Cole had a DNA test to confirm his being Joanie's father when Alison dropped the news on him a whole two years later. This season is already a mess. Trying to retcon that Joanie really is Noah's after all would be the death knell in my opinion. The whole basis of Scotty's threatening to Alison was because he figured out by looking at Joanie that she was Cole's.

. 

But, Baby Joanie had blonde hair and bright blue eyes. This is really bugging me!!! I was trying to find a picture of her when she's in the stroller when Scotty hit Alison up for money and the nanny said that Joanie really looked like her father. All the pictures I could find show her definitely light blonde, but there's not a screen capture of that scene. I know blondes can turn darker as they get older (mine did), but mine turned to dark blonde.

2 hours ago, attica said:

I like to think it's because she's watched this show.

 

Hahaha! Yes!

[Kerrey92]

THE CAKE!  THE CAKE!

Was I the only thinking that it was good they had a second cake because there were a lot of people and Luisa's (or Alison's) small ass cake wasn't going to feed all those people?  Maybe I am just hungry.

Cole, Cole, Cole....getting caught in the web of Alison's magical vagina.  This can't go wrong.  Really.

I can't help but wonder if the writers know how despised Noah and Allison are and if THEY think they are writing them with depth when instead they are just so unlikeable.  They make the show very hard to watch.  

Edited December 12, 2016 by Kerrey92

[DarkRaichu]

2 minutes ago, Kerrey92 said:

Was I the only thinking that it was good they had a second cake because there were a lot of people and Luisa's (or Alison's) small ass cake wasn't going to feed all those people?  Maybe I am just hungry.

I thought Luisa's cake was huge in either PoV???

[Lemons]

3 hours ago, jrlr said:

I'm no Alison apologist, but I have never thought she was responsible for Scotty's death.  She did not push him in front of an ongoing car either intentionally or unintentionally, she shoved him away from her when he was trying to grope her in a thick fog that limited visibility, which is why the car struck him to start with.  In a moment of panic that I think a lot of women can relate to, you don't see your surroundings, you only act on a primitive fight or flight reaction.  

But she does have some responsibility of sending Noah to jail.  If she had come forward and told the truth she could have saved Noah from ruining his life.  But no.

[chick binewski]

15 hours ago, Growsonwalls said:

Damn. I don't care if Cole is now cheating on his wife -- the chemistry between Joshua Jackson and Ruth Wilson is off the charts. Their body language and comfort with each other is such a contrast to every other relationship on this show. 

I mostly agree with this - ironically I think last night's episode would be my only exception. But I'm having huge problems with the entire season - I can't suss out the story the writers are trying to tell. The fact we're 4 episodes in and we've been thrown Prof. Eau So Franch, Fur Cat, a sadistic prison guard, Vik's (alleged) sexytimes texts AND a three-year time jump is just infuriating given how little information has actually been given.  

15 hours ago, truthaboutluv said:

I know Cole didn't stab Noah but I am curious where he was on the night Noah was stabbed because he didn't answer Luisa when she asked and Alison's version made it clear he wasn't with her either. 

And another hanging thread to make me even more irrational while watching last night!

12 hours ago, LilaFowler said:

Some of the differences in POVs are just bizarre.  I understand small differences but honestly, unless Alison is truly mental and delusional, how could the details around the daughter falling from the pony vary so wildly? Does not compute. 

Alison's POVs are becoming more problematic for me. I must be repeating myself here but she seems to have consistently created stuff that we see could not possibly have happened. If the writers want to keep doing this, maybe bring some illumination to her condition, or IDK - have someone call her out on her batshit recollection skillz.  

3 hours ago, grumpypanda said:

Is it just me or does Luisa look really harsh this season? I wonder if it's intentional to make her look more like a bitch. I don't like her hair and her make-up is too dark or something.

Yep Alison you're a slut and you should feel like shit for sleeping with Cole. I hate her so much! And the peanut butter thing reminded me of the shampoo incident. Luisa might be a bitch but she has reason to be. She was right after all, Alison will destroy her life. Cole is dumb is fall for her act. 

Not just you but I've had problems with Luisa from the start. Why they let her & Jennifer Esposito appear onscreen with those "highlights" may be this season's biggest mystery.

45 minutes ago, Kerrey92 said:

THE CAKE!  THE CAKE!

Was I the only thinking that it was good they had a second cake because there were a lot of people and Luisa's (or Alison's) small ass cake wasn't going to feed all those people?  Maybe I am just hungry.

Cole, Cole, Cole....getting caught in the web of Alison's magical vagina.  This can't go wrong.  Really.

Showtime has apparently decided to loan Alison the Carrie Mathison Magical Vagina Pandemic story line. It's equally annoying & lazily written in Montauk as it is in the CIA.

And now I want cake. But what was that with the peanut butter? Did Alison really want to kill Luisa? Is murderous Alison a thing now? Are we gonna find out she killed Gabriel? I REALLY don't know what this show wants to do with itself.

Final thought - HOW AND WHY IS OSCAR INVITED TO ANYTHING? It's the one consistent in the show - he sucks in everyone's POV! 

[Snewtsie]

Hated this episode.  Cole has greatly disappointed me, and Alison's POV is always a waste of time.

[Chas411]

Good luck Cole - you deserve everything you get.

[Lemons]

3 hours ago, Cranky One said:

 

But, Baby Joanie had blonde hair and bright blue eyes. This is really bugging me!!! I was trying to find a picture of her when she's in the stroller when Scotty hit Alison up for money and the nanny said that Joanie really looked like her father. All the pictures I could find show her definitely light blonde, but there's not a screen capture of that scene. I know blondes can turn darker as they get older (mine did), but mine turned to dark blonde.

Hahaha! Yes!

There is no way a drastic change in looks would happen from being a baby to preschool age.  I wonder why they did that.  I can't believe there's a shortage of blue eyed kids in Hollywood.

I love the different clothing choices with the different perceptions.   With Cole, Luisa was dressed down in Jeans and a top.  With Alison, she's wearing an expensive looking outfit.  Alison always looks dowdy but even worse in Cole's version. 

[Chas411]

Does anyone really think that Luisa is the raging bitch that Alison point of view paints her to be? She's like a movie villain or something. That scene where Alison waves to her and she gives her the mean girl look and pulls Cole close to her... Like seriously?

[Armchair Critic]

Go the f*ck away Noah! I groaned when I saw his beady eyes at the end looking at Alison.

Hey where's the guy who usually writes the articles on this show for PTV? I missed reading his repartee with the female reviewer this time.

[Blakeston]

36 minutes ago, Lemons said:

There is no way a drastic change in looks would happen from being a baby to preschool age.  I wonder why they did that.  I can't believe there's a shortage of blue eyed kids in Hollywood.

My understanding is that it's brutally difficult to find toddlers who are bearable to work with. If they can find one, they're unlikely to care whether the eye color matches the baby who played the character earlier.

[grommit2]

Gadzooks!  The commenters here are REALLY annoyed!  My guess is that the writers decided to just mess everything up. Make every character do stupid, self-serving, short-term things and ignore the consequences. They probably had a good time (and lots of coffee) diagramming how every character would hook up.    Every character is jumping into the sack with every other character. Soon Helen's oldest son will be chasing his high school English teacher.  Gads...what a zoo!   Of course, the operational tag line for the show is: "danger lies in losing control".  Oh yeah.

BTW...why are the Livingston, New Jersey police investigating Noah's attack?  This is supposed to be a New Jersey college. Noah lived within walking distance of the college campus.  The French professor also walked to Noah's apartment.  Thus, the college campus has to be in or near Livingston.  But, there are NO colleges in, or near, Livingston.  Yes, there was a "Livingston College" in Jersey, part of Rutgers and based in  Piscataway.  No way you would walk from Piscataway to Livingston.  How about Caldwell University (formerly Caldwell College)?  That's a hefty 5-6 miles away. Rutgers is about 40 miles away. Princeton is over 50 miles.  This would not be a Community College.  And it clearly is not NJIT in Newark (over 12 miles).  Fairleigh Dickinson (both campuses) would be too far away, also.  Anybody know?

[Trace]

Recently, I was watching this show with my daughter, who had never seen it before.  I explained the story line (it was a Noah centric episode which involved both Alison and Helen).  My daughter had one comment. "Wow, Noah really has a thing for women with unfortunate mouths".  Proof positive that snark is a genetic thing in my family.

[Noelle87]

21 hours ago, Growsonwalls said:

Damn. I don't care if Cole is now cheating on his wife -- the chemistry between Joshua Jackson and Ruth Wilson is off the charts. Their body language and comfort with each other is such a contrast to every other relationship on this show. This show just is at a higher level whenever it's a Cole/Alison centric episode because I care about these two characters and their journey together. 

Totally agree. That's why I initially loved the show, their POVs, seeing the differences. Their chemistry is amazing. You could see how much they felt and understood each others pain. In a way only the two of them can. I love how Cole really does unconditionally love Alison, and he really does accept her and her flaws. He sees the person beyond the mental illness and bad choices. Cold said as much last season, before Joanie was presumably conceived, that he sees Alison as a valuable person, and understands her pain. Yes, she is depressed and anxious, probably dealing with PTSD, her mother leaving her at a young age, etc.  Cole had been dealing with depression and family issues as well. They both make bad choices, and have regrets. Life is like that, it's full of grey areas, emotion, miscommunications, timing, personal growth, selfish choices, searching for happiness, etc.  I feel like their storyline is realistic and compelling, seeing how two people manage life after a trauma, and how there is no perfect ending, no perfect choice, it's complicated, their are consequences, and people will inevitably be hurt. 

 

I have empathy for Alison, probably because I have struggled with loss, depression and anxiety as well. I have made choices and done actions I regret as a result of that. I have had ups and downs. I have had chaos in my life and in relationships despite my best efforts.

You can almost see Alison physically suffering under the weight of it all. She is trying to improve herself, to be a good mom, to be present, etc. Does she fail a lot? Yes. Make terrible choices? Yes. We all do, some more than others. 

Does having an affair make you a bad person?. Does a single choice define your life?  Can a relationship survive the loss of a child? Can people find their way back to each other after doing terrible things to each other? I like the questions the show poses. 

ETA: No excuse for the peanut butter thing. At all. 

Edited December 13, 2016 by Noelle87

[lvbalgurl]

I, too, come to this thread to begrudgingly admit how tender, sexy, and smoking hot I found the Cole/Allison love scene.  Allison is an absolute shit show - wtf was that with the peanut butter?? - but I find her scenes with Cole compelling and interesting.  They truly do have awesome chemistry.

That said, the chick AT BEST seriously contemplated hurting his wife with the peanut butter (at worst, she went ahead and put it in the frosting - who knows??), and is still really fucking messed up.  Not to mention the fact that she cheated on him with the biggest douchebag in the world and married him, passing off Cole's child as his for two years.  She is a truly horrifying mess and I feel badly for Luisa that she has been pulled into all of this crap, and that Cole just fucked her over.  (Still love Cole, tho.  But I have a huge JJ bias.) 

[chocolatine]

9 minutes ago, Noelle87 said:

Does a single choice define your life? 

Yes, if the consequences of that choice are severe and wide ranging. But we're not talking about a single bad choice here, it's a series of bad choices. Breaking up two, possibly three, marriages; keeping a child from her father for two years and letting another man believe he is the father; letting a man go to jail for a crime he didn't commit; abandoning her child ... yes, I'd say those choices most definitely define her.

[Noelle87]

They don't have to define her future. Or her daughters. She messed up. She knows, she said sorry. Took steps to right the wrongs, sought help. Accepted the consequences. 

 We all sin differently, doesn't mean some people can be forgiven and some don't. As she said, she left her child with her father and went and voluntarily sought treatment for her mental health. That was a brave and wise choice. She is trying to break a cycle of mother daughter abandonment, all while dealing with her own trauma and mental illness.

 Her daughter needs her. She should be in her life, in some capacity. 

I don't think Alison is some great person or mother. I don't think she makes smart choices. I just think she's very human character and I  have empathy for a women clearly struggling but trying to stay afloat. I can appreciate the struggle. However, I still think cheating is wrong, and I feel for Louisa as well. Life is messy. Affairs and cheating happens every day. We hurt those we love all the time, often unintentionally. There are paternity cases every day, custody cases far worse than the ones on the show. Doesn't mean the individuals lives are over.