S03.E03: Episode 3

[jrlr]

6 hours ago, bunnywithanaxe said:

 Bwah! When the ep opened on OSF and the book I grumbled out loud, "Meh, now watch, she's gonna reach between her legs." Then when she actually did, I groaned "I was just kidding!!!"

I thought exactly the same thing, but it was more of a face palm than a groan.  Next night I was watching Good Girls Revolt and there was another predictable femme masturbation scene and THEN I groaned thinking, oh no, now this is gonna be everywhere - next self love scene: Project Runway?

[Artsda]

This episode was horrible, I didn't make it through. 

I don't care at all about the teacher or her POV.

[MaggieG]

When I saw Chapter 1: Julliete, I just rolled my eyes! Why do we need her POV? The only thing I noticed during her masturbation scene was that her reading nook was awesome and I want it.

Like many, I am just hate watching at this point. This is the last season correct? If it is, at least we don't have to suffer long.

This is just speculation, but I really, really hope Cole and Alison don't end up together again. I think that would piss me off more than anything.

[grommit2]

17 hours ago, mjc570 said:

There is literally no character I really feel like I have any interest in watching.  

Except for Whitney.  Whitney is the best, the epitome of whiny, self-centered, all-knowing youngun.  Give me more Whitney!

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

When The Affair Thinks About Noah, It Touches Itself

All you need to know about this episode -- and perhaps this series -- is contained in the segment in which a character reads Noah's book and is moved to self-pleasure.

[cardigirl]

I actually liked this episode.  I watched it last night, and was thinking I would hate it, based on the opinions given here. I thought Juliette's point of view was very interesting and that the actress knocked it out of the park.

I'm not a fan of the college students, but I am old, so that may be part of it. They rather exhaust me. 

Brendan Fraser's character scares the daylights outta me.  I wonder what Noah really did to him at that swim meet. 

 

Quote

That entire dinner party was an argument against higher education. I also note how the writers continue to stack the deck against the ideas of female agency or female integrity, making every woman demanding, shrill, and hypocritical. I feel like someone in that room should have shouted the safe word "self-respect."

I didn't feel like the French professor was shrill or demanding, or even hypocritical.  I thought she was shown to have love for her husband who is suffering dementia, and also has a healthy(?) or at least, an appetite for sex.   She came to America for adventure, and looks like she's going to get it. 

Edited December 6, 2016 by cardigirl

[truthaboutluv]

Just now, cardigirl said:

I'm not a fan of the college students, but I am old, so that may be part of it.

Don't sell yourself short. It's because they were all annoying, pretentious and a complete waste of screentime. 

[islandgal140]

49 minutes ago, MaggieG said:

When I saw Chapter 1: Julliete, I just rolled my eyes! Why do we need her POV? The only thing I noticed during her masturbation scene was that her reading nook was awesome and I want it.

I thought Prof Cliche's house was awesome, the uncredited star and best thing about this episode. Didn't realize how big and rambling it was until Noah darkened its doorstep at the end of the episode. 

I can't believe I had to sit through another iteration of the dinner party of deplorables. I swear if that student actually winds up having sex with Noah, I will be officially done with this show. 

Felt like I had been baseball batted by Negan when the show opened and saw I was getting Prof. French's POV. With all the weird entanglements and stones left half unturned (if turned at all) the last thing I need is the perspective of someone I just met last week. Why don't they just put a beret on her head and shove a baguette under her arm and finish the stereotype once and for all? Surprised they didn't have her riding a bike instead of driving a car. 

Also not here for Noah's version of OZ.  I really wish the show hadn't gone with the unhinged, menacing prison guard stalker with a past connection to Noah story. It is like they just had to add another crime drama story to this mess, which I don't think is necessary. I would have been fine with Noah just serving his stint uneventfully or at worst have PTSD from prison in general. They seem to barely be able to deal with all the shit still going on in past seasons. 

Noah really does not like Helen. 

Lawd, did Brendan Fraser offend a witch or something? Because a curse is the only way to explain him to me right now. Even though I don't like the story itself Brendan is doing a good job. He makes me anxious and uneasy each time he is on-screen. 

[scrb]

The problem with having a criminal plot -- and I hope they don't plan to do another drawn-out whodunnit -- with a POV show is that if one of the characters committed the crime or knows who did, they'd be thinking about it constantly.

They wouldn't wait until the 20th episode of the show (or whatever the finale of season 2 was) to reveal all.  Noah would have thought about it all the time, as well as Helen as well as Alison.

Interesting theories though, that Gunther may have stalked Alison, after getting her picture from Noah.  Or that Noah may have stabbed himself.

If they have long-term plans for the show, they have to grow the number of characters and add more story arcs, I suppose.  Aside from a possible dependence on a criminal plot (again), it seems they want to continue to show how the affair continues to ripple through all these characters' lives, years after the fact.

[nyxy]

Ugh, I was bored with Professor Juliette within 30 seconds of her introduction in the first episode. Stupid, moronic, shallow dumb understanding of courtly love or any kind of love. YUCK. She's the perfect wet dream for a narcissistic neurotic jackass such as Noah.

Also this professor/student romance (implied with Audrey) really squigs me out. It's so cliched and it actually is officially disallowed when the prof is in a supervisory capacity to the grad student. Noah is so awful and unappealing at this point, it is ridiculous that all these women, including Audrey, are desperate to jump his bones. And of course it's Professor J, French High Priestess of unsanctioned love who provides the perfect venue for all this bloated love-talk.  Couldn't they at least have given her minimal intelligence and education? Her expertise is as unconvincing as is the thought that Noah's novels (kind of embarrassing, going by the excerpts quoted on the show) have helped him change careers from a felonius unemployed schoolteacher to a university professor.

Yes, that entire footage of the dinner party should have ended up on the cutting room floor. I too can't believe we're being made to sit through it twice. Even the Whitney scenes were preferable to this. That debate over rape and consent was so pathetic- surely grad students (some of whom are declared feminists) would have more interesting things to say about it than that exposition of The Culture of Rape 101.

I wish there were one character left whom I like. Helen, maybe, and Vikram come close- but not all the time. And that's about it.

I wish they'd sorted out (and added some nuance and layering) to the existing relationships instead of introducing a brand new idiot character and then make her one of the point of views. Come on!

I also can't believe that the brilliant David Henry Hwang wrote this episode. M. Butterfly has its gender stereotypes but it is also a play on stereotypes. This episode is so embarrassingly bad. Maybe some big twist is coming and I will have to eat my words. I'll be happy to do that as long as I don't have to sit through Juliette's narration again. Hwang was only consulted on some of the others. Hard to believe he actually wrote the dreck and bilge that this last episode was.

I don't know how long I can stick this out. I wish I hadn't started watching this stupid show (my excuse is it was playing on a very very long flight).

Edited December 7, 2016 by nyxy

[Lithogirl]

I chuckled at " Really? You just got stabbed. Now you want to go get a booty call?"  Nina knows her brother. 

[Sienna]

1 hour ago, Lithogirl said:

I chuckled at " Really? You just got stabbed. Now you want to go get a booty call?"  Nina knows her brother. 

Seriously.

When they first introduced Nina, I wasn't sure if I liked her, but with that comment, she became my spirit animal.

[Muffyn]

17 hours ago, jrlr said:

I thought exactly the same thing, but it was more of a face palm than a groan.  Next night I was watching Good Girls Revolt and there was another predictable femme masturbation scene and THEN I groaned thinking, oh no, now this is gonna be everywhere - next self love scene: Project Runway?

They do use the word vagina much more than one would expect on Project Runway, so maybe self pleasure is part of their next challenge.  You can experience a nub rubbing trifecta.

[taragel]

Getting Juliette's POV is like getting a second Noah POV. Zzzz. She's so into his bullshit, she's even imagining that Audrey's hostility is all about wanting to fuck him.

Also, if they're leading up to a reveal that Brendan Fraser raped Noah in prison, wouldn't Noah have felt differently/had a lot more interesting reaction to the discussion of consent in the first episode? He seemed so neutral about it, so above it and agreeing with Juliette that the kids only see black and white... I don't know. Unless they're leading up to him liking/wanting/not explicitly consenting but not non-consenting to sex with the guard? That would be a lot. 

[truthaboutluv]

24 minutes ago, taragel said:

Getting Juliette's POV is like getting a second Noah POV. Zzzz.

Exactly.

[Superpole2000]

Worst episode yet. The prison guard storyline is uninteresting and unenjoyable. Please tell me this isn't the main premise for Season 3.

[bunnywithanaxe]

... And was very glad that Lisa Schmeiser called Noah a Mary Sue in the Talk it out piece, because seriously, if the shoe fits...

[grommit2]

Ok...watch as I unravel the story line mystery:  Recall that there was an argument about "something" that happened 30 years ago, in the father's house. This was introduced when Noah's sister drove Noah to Mz French's house for, umm, rest. Right.

So, what happened 30 years ago?  Ah, the plot thickens.  Here's where Brendan Fraser, jail guard,  enters the scene.  SOMETHING happened back in the house, between two swimmers (Noah and the guard).  And what happened back then?  I guess we'll just have to wait for another episode.  Stay tuned...  tada! 

[izabella]

12 hours ago, grommit2 said:

So, what happened 30 years ago?  Ah, the plot thickens.

I thought it was that Noah's mother died?

[Valny]

Haven't seen this ep yet...So I can basically skip the first half then? Cause Juliette and the dinner party was boring in its first go round.

[grommit2]

1 hour ago, izabella said:

I thought it was that Noah's mother died?

Oops...and I thought I had a cool story line.  Oh well.

[Mackey]

I'm thinking (since it's an essential part of most dramas) that Noah was sexually abused as a kid and SIS didn't support him or believe him. Ergo, she doesn't deserve the house in which she did the act for which she can not forgive herself. 

Too much? 

[NutMeg]

What is scarier than a stalker who not only has access to you anytime, but also control where you are, what you do, what you have, any minute of your time? Even though I don't like Noah, this feels horrible. Then again, if Noah had been a little less self centred, maybe by giving the guy the time of the time he would have fared better later on, but maybe that guy (beautifully played by the way) would still have had it for him anyway. And I assume teenage Noah was as bad as reading the room as current Noah, and may have started something that doesn't make sense for anyone but John Gunther (I was so sure he was going to spell it wrong somehow, or maybe he did?)

I've always wondered, when I see sadistic prison guards on TV, is there really no recourse against them? I'm a bit of a Helen here, I just find it hard to figure how there would be no way to report that.

Juliet's viewpoint did and did not bother me. I really didn't need to revisit that dinner conversation just to learn that Audrey and XXX are exes, and that XXX and Juliet are currently fuck buddies. That being said, her conversations with her daughter and her husband (who in a split second I thought was her father) definitely gave her more depth, so there's that. And of course as she found Noah bleeding, we needed her point of view.

I was sooo wrong about the first episode!!!! Everything I thought was just Noah figuring every female would lust for him turned out wrong! Then again, maybe this one is less into Noah per se, and more into random sex that wouldn't involve one of her student. Now watch me be proven wrong next episode :D

Still, Helen still looks like a forever enamoured discard only from Noah's viewpoint. At least for now. ...

And can I say enough times that I love, love, love Noah's sister? She tells it as I see it :)

Off topic: Brendan Frasier in George of the Jungle is pretty close to the "lustiestable" man ever. I only saw him in so-so movies since, so I'm happy to see him land this gig where he can play many facettes of his repertoire and do it well. He's doing an excellent job, whether friendly, menacing or inconspicuous in the background. I never would have thought that I would find him scary, but I do now.   

[grommit2]

On 12/8/2016 at 4:02 PM, Mackey said:

I'm thinking (since it's an essential part of most dramas) that Noah was sexually abused as a kid and SIS didn't support him or believe him. Ergo, she doesn't deserve the house in which she did the act for which she can not forgive herself. 

Too much? 

Hmmm...a very interesting story line. 

[LilaFowler]

Noah said in his father's eulogy that Nina abandoned the family one day.  At another point, Nina said that Noah had forgiven her for something huge.  Then in this episode, we learn that neither one wants the house they grew up in.

We have the brother-sister-house mystery.

The John Gunther mystery.

The stabbing mystery.

FFS. Come on. This really is a soap opera for primetime. A lot of this is like, beyond plausible.  It sucks because I really enjoyed the first season, which seemed very grounded in reality.  Man going through a midlife crisis meets woman on vacation.  They fall in love/lust, cheat on their spouses and eventually get together for good.  Then the Show had to throw in all of this other stuff: drug dealing, baby daddy drama, a douchebag who is committing stat rape and then meets his Maker, Noah (the only one not culpable) goes to prison where OF COURSE he is bullied by a guard who knew him 35 years ago, his first day not living with his sister he gets stabbed and nearly dies but of course is saved by this random French woman...

The show seems like it's spiraling out of control but not in a good way.  Seems like the writers are just thowing shit at the wall to see what sticks. 

Audrey is shrill and may I never hear her voice onscreen again.  What a terrible dinner party, and we had to live through it not once but twice.

Endnote: I want to think that Noah stabbed himself.  The police found the weapon, right?  Helen knew that it was a knife. Should be easy enough to pull prints.

[Cranky One]

I binged watched the previous seasons and am now all caught up. Thank Dog for this forum because I have been so confused many times as to what was actually happening.  At least they've toned down all the 'awesome sex' going on 24/7. *Yawn*. All I've watched for 3 seasons is Wham, bam, thank you, m'am. No reason for any of these people to check their watches or think, "Will you hurry up? I've got shit to do!" .

None of these characters are likeable...except Whitney! She's such a brat, but I heart her.

However, I will stick around because the Helen twist surprised me and I want to see how that plays out.

I didn't get get a good look at Joanie when Cole brought her over, but as a baby she had big blue eyes and blonde hair.  Older Joanie looks like she could be Luisa's daughter with her coloring. She didn't even look like she had blue eyes.

I throw around the F word a lot, but this show makes me look like a saint! lol

p.s. It took me a bit to realize that was Brendan Fraser as the prison guard. My first introduction to him was Encino Man!

[Glade]

The show has 100% jumped the shark with this episode; honestly...what the fuck?  A completely uninteresting and unnecessary alternate version of a boring/obnoxious dinner party that happened two episodes ago, featuring some uber-French professor who sleeps with her students and masturbates to Noah's book...this is what happens when you decide to stretch a three season show to four seasons.  I did not come back to watch Juliette, I wanted to hear more about the characters we actually spent two seasons trying to give a fuck about.  But there's no way in hell I'm watching more of this.

[chocolatine]

34 minutes ago, Glade said:

...this is what happens when you decide to stretch a three season show to four seasons.

Has it been confirmed that there's going to be a fourth season? 

[Glade]

46 minutes ago, chocolatine said:

Has it been confirmed that there's going to be a fourth season? 

Treem said in an interview last year that showtime convinced her to change her three-season storyline to four seasons,  so presumably that's where the writing is going, though the show could still be cancelled.

Edited December 10, 2016 by Glade

[HollyG]

2 hours ago, Glade said:

The show has 100% jumped the shark with this episode; honestly...what the fuck?  A completely uninteresting and unnecessary alternate version of a boring/obnoxious dinner party that happened two episodes ago, featuring some uber-French professor who sleeps with her students and masturbates to Noah's book...this is what happens when you decide to stretch a three season show to four seasons.  I did not come back to watch Juliette, I wanted to hear more about the characters we actually spent two seasons trying to give a fuck about.  But there's no way in hell I'm watching more of this.

Exactly. It's hard to root for characters that are so repugnant anyway. Then they show us a horrible dinner party not once but twice. Over the next 7 episodes, maybe we'll get to see the dinner party from all of the attendees viewpoint. I can hardly wait! 

[HollyG]

On 12/7/2016 at 11:23 PM, grommit2 said:

Ok...watch as I unravel the story line mystery:  Recall that there was an argument about "something" that happened 30 years ago, in the father's house. This was introduced when Noah's sister drove Noah to Mz French's house for, umm, rest. Right.

So, what happened 30 years ago?  Ah, the plot thickens.  Here's where Brendan Fraser, jail guard,  enters the scene.  SOMETHING happened back in the house, between two swimmers (Noah and the guard).  And what happened back then?  I guess we'll just have to wait for another episode.  Stay tuned...  tada! 

I thought it was that Brandan was butt hurt because Noah was the star of the swim team. Add to that, Noah didn't remember him. There may be more to it. Brandan sure plays creepy well. 

[HollyG]

21 hours ago, LilaFowler said:

Noah said in his father's eulogy that Nina abandoned the family one day.  At another point, Nina said that Noah had forgiven her for something huge.  Then in this episode, we learn that neither one wants the house they grew up in.

We have the brother-sister-house mystery.

The John Gunther mystery.

The stabbing mystery.

FFS. Come on. This really is a soap opera for primetime. A lot of this is like, beyond plausible.  It sucks because I really enjoyed the first season, which seemed very grounded in reality.  Man going through a midlife crisis meets woman on vacation.  They fall in love/lust, cheat on their spouses and eventually get together for good.  Then the Show had to throw in all of this other stuff: drug dealing, baby daddy drama, a douchebag who is committing stat rape and then meets his Maker, Noah (the only one not culpable) goes to prison where OF COURSE he is bullied by a guard who knew him 35 years ago, his first day not living with his sister he gets stabbed and nearly dies but of course is saved by this random French woman...

The show seems like it's spiraling out of control but not in a good way.  Seems like the writers are just thowing shit at the wall to see what sticks. 

Audrey is shrill and may I never hear her voice onscreen again.  What a terrible dinner party, and we had to live through it not once but twice.

Endnote: I want to think that Noah stabbed himself.  The police found the weapon, right?  Helen knew that it was a knife. Should be easy enough to pull prints.

Damn Lilafowler, I think you got them all. I will be surprised if Gunther doesn't end up being the stabber. Although it could be one of the Lockharts. What is so different about this series is that all of the characters are equally awful. With the exception of Cole (sometimes Alison), there really is no one to root for. All the rest of the Solloway/Butler/Lockharts are horrible people.... from the adults to the obnoxious teens. I've never seen a show with so much negative energy. Maybe they will all disappear into a self created vortex in the last episode. 

[chocolatine]

47 minutes ago, HollyG said:

I thought it was that Brandan was butt hurt because Noah was the star of the swim team. Add to that, Noah didn't remember him. There may be more to it. Brandan sure plays creepy well. 

He went from creepy-friendly to violent bully when Noah singed his copy of Descent with "to my friend, Gunther". Sounded like the "my friend" part set him off. He also took Noah's picture of Alison. Perhaps Noah slept with Gunther's girlfriend in high school and doesn't even remember it.

[bilgistic]

It's a good thing I read this forum or I'd not have known it was the same dinner "party". I thought the most boring, pretentious "academic" assholes in the history of television had gotten together for dinner twice.

It seems ethically questionable to have one's current students at one's house for dinner, but then, if you're having sex with one or more of them, ethics aren't much of a concern, I guess.

Disclaimer: I've been to dinner at a former professor's house. He is married to a woman I used to work with at the university from which I graduated. I had dinner there after I graduated, when I was working on staff at the school at the time. No students were there. We didn't talk about pretentious bullshit. No one had sex with anyone else.

[chabelisaywow]

I can't believe I binge watched Seasons 1 and 2 to get to this.  Doesn't even seem like the same show.  But lol that Maura Tierney played Abby Lockhart on ER.

[Guest]

16 hours ago, chocolatine said:

16 hours ago, Glade said:

...this is what happens when you decide to stretch a three season show to four seasons.

Has it been confirmed that there's going to be a fourth season? 

I would presume there would have to be since they were able to bilk two seasons' worth of "Intrigue" about who killed Scotty. Using that accident as a baseline where pretty much everybody contributed to Scotty's roadside demise, I'm gonna assume they're gonna go all 10 Little Indians on this one where everyone who ever appeared on the show takes a turn stabbing Noah in the neck, including Mare Winningham (in a very special guest star role). 

[Fatkat]

My hunch is that Gunther is a red herring and Professor French Cliche stabbed Noah.

[nara]

On 12/11/2016 at 7:57 AM, Giant Misfit said:

I would presume there would have to be since they were able to bilk two seasons' worth of "Intrigue" about who killed Scotty. Using that accident as a baseline where pretty much everybody contributed to Scotty's roadside demise, I'm gonna assume they're gonna go all 10 Little Indians on this one where everyone who ever appeared on the show takes a turn stabbing Noah in the neck, including Mare Winningham (in a very special guest star role). 

that's not 10 Little Indians, it's...(spoiler tag because the book in question is still a classic).

Spoiler

Murder on the Orient Express

[Guest]

Oops! Thanks, Nara! I got my 1970s Agatha Christie movies (saw them when I was a kid, never read the books) confused. 

Edited December 16, 2016 by Guest

[Fisher King]

On 12/5/2016 at 0:21 PM, Blakeston said:

Speaking of Juliette, is it just me, or does her husband look a lot like Mark Margolis (ie, Hector Salamanca from Breaking Bad), who played Noah's father?

Oui, Tio without a bell but prefers banging his fists. The French lady seems to care about the guy though. I thought the acting was pretty good in this scene.

Watching this using headphones, I think the most annoying part of this episode was the detective crinkling the plastic cup while questioning Noah in the hospital.

Edited December 21, 2016 by Fisher King
Had to delete multiple quote boxes - not easy.

[AmandaPanda]

This was the episode that broke me. That first half was beyond unwatchable. I made it as far as Hattie from Parenthood lamenting how much she wants to fuck Noah and I couldn't do it anymore. I realized I hate all the characters and the show is my cure for insomnia. I just can't with this show anymore.

[JenE4]

Veeeery late to the party here... When Helen, “the wife” rushed to Noah’s bedside, she was wearing a huge-ass diamond  ring and wedding band set when she tried to hold his hand. At the funeral she also asked about getting back together with Noah, so are we to assume she’s NOT married to Vik but perhaps instead is wearing her wedding ring from Noah? I’m still holding Helen as a suspect here—angry that he wouldn’t take her back and when he survived thinking it was another in to nurse him back to health. Although of course even if it was Noah’s ring to her, I suppose Noah could have misremembered it thinking how she’s trying to horn back into his life as the wife—instead of his actual wife who won’t have anything to do with him. But, why? He went to jail to protect both Alison and Helen. Granted, we know she freaked out over Joanie and disappeared for 6 months, but from what we’ve seen so far, Helen was visiting him all along and Alison wasn’t. 

Hmmm. I guess technically Juliette could have stabbed Noah for the same reason—she IS the one who gets to play caretaker...just like the nurse caring for her husband. She can feed Noah yogurt and do other things like that to court him.

 The guard thing is just too obvious. I’m assuming Gunther had a crush on Noah back in the day and spent all these years wondering what could have been with the hunky swim champion in his speedo...but, then again, if he’s been keeping up with Noah all of these years because his old crush got famous, he totally would have read the book already. But, again, unreliable narrator from Noah’s point of view.

[cleo]

So I am spoiled, on s. 3 and 4 and just seeing how far I get before I bail. The show has turned into a soap opera about asshole characters acting like assholes and having ugly sex. I have zero interest in watching new asshole characters who happen to be French.

I like Cole, I like Ruth, so watching for them.

BF does indeed do the creepy well.

[millennium]

On 12/6/2016 at 11:58 AM, MaggieG said:

When I saw Chapter 1: Julliete, I just rolled my eyes! Why do we need her POV? The only thing I noticed during her masturbation scene was that her reading nook was awesome and I want it.

I loved the pillars.  But you're right.   I couldn't believe we had to go grocery shopping with her.

[Aqua]

On 6/3/2018 at 11:32 PM, JenE4 said:

Hmmm. I guess technically Juliette could have stabbed Noah for the same reason—she IS the one who gets to play caretaker...just like the nurse caring for her husband. She can feed Noah yogurt and do other things like that to court him.

 

However she's only known him for a day so that's not likely, even if the caretaker appeal were there.

On 4/7/2019 at 12:12 AM, millennium said:

I loved the pillars.  But you're right.   I couldn't believe we had to go grocery shopping with her.

She was fascinated by something on the shelf, looked like some kind of medieval Bavarian beer.

[Aqua]

On 6/3/2018 at 11:32 PM, JenE4 said:

 The guard thing is just too obvious. I’m assuming Gunther had a crush on Noah back in the day and spent all these years wondering what could have been with the hunky swim champion in his speedo...but, then again, if he’s been keeping up with Noah all of these years because his old crush got famous, he totally would have read the book already. But, again, unreliable narrator from Noah’s point of view.

I am thinking Gunther doesn't know Noah from swimming at all and that story is just a cover. Noah clearly didn't remember him and tried to fake like he vaguely did. I'm wondering if he has a past with Alison, hence his violent reaction to seeing her photo in Noah's cell.