S03.E09: Who's Dead?

[Panopticon]

I always thought that Bonnie's end of the phone conversation had a very Frank-and-Bonnie sound to it. I was right, but I didn't foresee the twisted route that got them there. So she's asked Frank to live for her while Annalise told him to die (and Annalise stomping off after telling Frank he should have killed himself was horrifying in a way that's a credit to all involved) then got even more intimate with Annalise than we've seen before. 

I'm glad we aren't losing the Annalise/Bonnie/Frank dynamic just yet.

[jvr]

4 minutes ago, pinkelephant3 said:

I think wes was getting a deal for all of the k5 so they all had immunity against her and would finally take her out  nate killed Wes to save annalease

But if Nate killed Wes, why did he need to go to the hospital to confirm how he died? He would have already known.

Very good ep, I was anxious till the end. At one point I was like Nate is gonna die! Then I was like we haven't seen Wes or Nate yet (I forgot about Conner). The minute Wes listened to that voicemail from Anna I knew he was a goner but I still didn't believe it till we saw Nats face in the morgue. I'm happy with this death, he acted like everything was Anna's fault and his hands were clean.

Edited November 18, 2016 by jvr

[Milaxx]

I need to rewatch before I can post thoughts. They pulled off a great surprise. Congrats to whoever guessed correctly (@Doram?) Terrific episode.

[pinkelephant3]

2 minutes ago, jvr said:

But if Nate killed Wes, why did he need to go to the hospital to confirm how he died? He would have already known

To take the suspicion off of himself

[Panopticon]

Quote

That was horrible seeing little Wes end up like that. I'm thinking of that poor kid who lost his mother and not the annoyance he was starting to become as an adult for this viewer.

It really was. The sum total of Wes' life, from conception to death, was a study in NOT FAIR! Even the reminders of Rebecca and the way Wes dragged everyone into taking care of her despite her total lack of redeeming value doesn't take away the sting.

[bluvelvet]

Nice bait and switch, I really thought it would be Nate, not gonna lie I am gonna miss Wes and part of me wonders if I even want to continue watching the show. I know I will watch to find how who killed him but after that..who know?

Can't believe they did it, away from Anna he was the other central character.

Wow..!

Edited November 19, 2016 by bluvelvet
grammer

[Blue Plastic]

I kind of thought all along that it was Wes simply because I don't think Annalise would break down like that (upon seeing who was Under The Sheet) for any of the other regular characters.  And they've kind of been telegraphing all season that it would be him.  Nate warned him to watch himself around Annalise.  Laurel wrote "Wes" on the paper after regaining consciousness and didn't want Frank to know about their relationship to "protect" Wes.

They faked me out tonight though because some people were saying that Wes being shown at the end of last episode meant he was one of the safe ones.  I wondered how they were going to show a "safe" person each week and yet still have it be a big surprise in the finale.

I guess the Mahoneys are the best suspects but maybe it will turn out to be Meggy (a woman scorned!).  Or Frank (mad about Laurel).  Or Connor (mad about everything and blames Wes for it).

Poor Wes.  He really annoyed me in season 1 going on and on about Rebecca, but it tugged at my hard, cold heart a bit to see him walk out of the police station, knowing he was going to his death.  Sniff!

I liked how they incorporated events from seasons 1 and 2 in this episode, like Frank's death and Annalise still having the murder weapon, Rebecca's body being found (so Wes finally found out for sure that she didn't just go away on her own), Oliver looking into what happened the night of the bonfire, etc.  It was great to see them using the show's history.

So much to find out next half-season!  Who is/was the snitch?  Was Wes really going to rat Annalise out?  Who killed Wes?  Who started the fire?  What is going on with the stalker at the DA's office?

ETA:  I meant Sam's death, not Frank's.  Duh.

Edited November 18, 2016 by Blue Plastic
Made dumb mistake

[jvr]

19 minutes ago, pinkelephant3 said:

To take the suspicion off of himself

I don't see it. If someone suspects him he will say he went to the hospital to check to see how he died so it's not me? lol

The sequence was, Nate was looking mad suspicious hanging out near the interrogation rooms that Wes was in. Wes listens to voicemail from Anna and sneaks out (we see him pass behind Nate in the squad room). Wes gets to Anna's house during the day (light out when he leaves police), Anna has left to meet Oliver already (we don't see either of these things). We then see Nate get to Anna's house and ask out loud if she is home, no one answers and he walks upstairs. If Wes was there and alive wouldn't he have spoken? Nate leaves after finding no one home? Was Wes dead in the house and Nate missed it? We then see Laurel come to the house, it's dark at this point. Right after she enters house blows up. 

That might be wrong but it's what I recall.

Besides that, that Bonnie and Anna kiss...was that the first time they have kissed do we think? Any other hanky panky before? lol I know others have speculated about their relationship and what kind of love Bonnie has for Anna previously. Most seemed to fall on obsessed but not romantic love.

Edited November 18, 2016 by jvr

[LaJefaza]

9 minutes ago, pinkelephant3 said:

I think wes was getting a deal for all of the k5 so they all had immunity against her and would finally take her out  nate killed Wes to save annalease

If this is at all true, then Nate needs to be the next body in the woods. 

I have to say, Wes could be annoying, he could be frustrating. I disliked the character deeply during the Rebecca arc.  But in the end, when he was happy with Laurel, he was at his best... an adorable dork. I couldn't hate him, even at his whiniest.

But goddamit, that look on Wes' face as he left the police station and walked towards the light and looked directly at the camera...like he was saying goodbye to the audience...kudos, Alfred Enoch...you did a great job.  A lot of us will miss you.

RIP Christophe/Wes.

[blackwing]

Woohooooooo!  Thank the stars, Wes is dead!  I have loathed this character pretty much from the start.  The actor is mediocre and I won't miss those sad puppy dog eyes look that was his go-to move.  He ate the show during the first two seasons.  Kudos to Shonda and company for having the guts to kill off the show's special snowflake.  People like Meredith Grey and Daisy "Quake" Johnson who have the entire show revolve around them.   

For those who said they would be upset if one of the Keating 5 were killed, I don't share that sentiment.  I think it's refreshing that one of the major characters was killed.  It keeps viewers on their toes.  Game of Thrones has done it multiple times, Grey's Anatomy did it multiple times, thirtysomething killed off Gary, E.R. killed Mark Greene, Lost killed many people, etc.

This episode was masterful.  The only thing that seemed out of place was the purpose of Annalise's confrontation with Atwood.  Is that really what Brett Butler looks like now, or did she put some stuff in her mouth to make her face look jacked up?  I get that she has aged, but she looked rough.   I think Viola Davis and Famke Janssen are roughly about the same age and they look fantastic.

[yourpointis]

I have one question. How did Nate manage to make it out of the house without a mark on him? We the viewers never see him leave once he enters or was there a time gap between him entering and Laurel's arrival? 

[Kira53]

11 minutes ago, jvr said:

But if Nate killed Wes, why did he need to go to the hospital to confirm how he died? He would have already known.

Very good ep, I was anxious till the end. At one point I was like Nate is gonna die! Then I was like we haven't seen Wes or Nate yet (I forgot about Conner). The minute Wes listened to that voicemail from Anna I knew he was a goner but I still didn't believe it till we saw Nats face in the morgue. I'm happy with this death, he acted like everything was Anna's fault and his hands were clean.

Nate would be covering his ass. That would be excellent misdirection for any investigation. That is also a great way to trick the audience!

 I think this is a very worthwhile theory that Nate killed Wes.  He had the means, opportunity, and motive.  Well done.  I'm calling it.  When he met Wes in the house he killed him to protect Analise.  I was sure Wes was going to take the immunity.  Maybe Wes has agreed to immunity with a plan to send them back to rewrite it and hope to sneak out and disappear.  I'm looking forward to the rest of the season and learning more about Wes.  Who knows; we might even see him next season.  

Great episode.  

[pinkelephant3]

Random question and sorry it's a bit off topic and I may have just missed it because of playing on my phone while watching.....but did we ever see any wrap up of the whole incest twins thing/ her trying to kill herself and killing that female DA?

[wanderingstar]

Laurel's gonna be devastated that Wes is dead since she fought with him the last time she saw him. And if she's really pregnant with his baby - woof!

Alfie Enoch interview - gonna miss him so much.

[alihart41]

I love that they went through with killing Wes. Nate and the Mahoneys are my main suspects right now.

[Artsda]

They really tried to show it was Nate to throw of it being Wes. Good mis-direction.

[LaJefaza]

2 minutes ago, Gillian Rosh said:

Laurel's gonna be devastated that Wes is dead since she fought with him the last time she saw him. And if she's really pregnant with his baby - woof!

Alfie Enoch interview - gonna miss him so much.

I thought about this too. The last thing she said to him was "we don't need to talk". That'll be brutal for her.

[pennben]

HOLY SHIT! HOLY SHIT! HOLY SHIT! HOLY SHIT!

They actually did it.

Those are my initial thoughts....that's all I've got....now to go and read what everyone else thought.

HOLY SHIT!

[truthaboutluv]

16 minutes ago, yourpointis said:

I have one question. How did Nate manage to make it out of the house without a mark on him? We the viewers never see him leave once he enters or was there a time gap between him entering and Laurel's arrival? 

I think there was. It was meant to be misleading so you would not know right up until the end. But as someone else pointed out, I don't think it was dark yet when Nate came to the house but it definitely was when Laurel got there. 

The moment they showed Nate in the house and then later Laurel and there was fifteen minutes left in the episode, I knew Nate wasn't the one who was killed. I was more certain when they came back from the break and went back to the events we'd already seen but still weren't showing who was under the sheet. At that point if it was Nate, what was the point of dragging it out?

For those asking, no Alfred did not choose to leave the show. People Magazine has an interview with him (I'm guessing they were spoiled about the episode and did the interview in advance of the episode airing) and he confirms that none of the cast knew who it would be at the start of the season. Apparently they were just told someone would die and then the writers didn't make the decision until they were writing Episode 7. He is sad to leave the cast and crew but says he's happy the show had the guts to do something so shocking. 

Interview With Alfred

Goodness knows Wes annoyed me greatly, especially his inexplicable obsession with that moron Rebecca, but once I realized it was clearly going to be him, I was sad. Once I figured out it wasn't Nate after all, I knew it was either Wes or Connor (and I definitely thought it might be Connor when we were shown him leaving the guy's place) who I realized at that point, were both shown at times that were likely before the fire. Connor didn't make sense though because he didn't have his phone, so no way for him to have gotten Annalise's call and Laurel clearly left without seeing him. 

But back to Wes, yeah he was kind of an idiot but seeing his life end that way and I agree with others that with his mother and everything else, it's just really depressing. So now the big mystery is who killed Wes. The Mahoney widow and Frank seem like the likeliest possibilities but this show is always known for its curveballs. Hell I'd throw in Bonnie there, especially because Annalise told her the DA was coming for her. Bonnie killed Rebecca because she thought she was a liability and it's not unreasonable that she saw Wes as the same. Plus, for all we know, someone tipped her off to Wes being at the police station. The guy representing Wes did know Bonnie and Annalise. 

YMMV but I have no interest in seeing Laurel and Frank together again. It doesn't help that I was never a fan but I just think with everything that's happened, that ship needs to sail away. 

As sad as it was to see Wes' life end that way, I do give the writers props for delivering a truly shocking finale and they've set up a lot of story - who killed Wes, who put the bomb in Annalise's house and who ratted her out to the police. Not to mention them finding Rebecca's body. Frank was responsible for getting rid of Rebecca. I can't believe he didn't do a good enough job so when they mentioned Rebecca, I almost wondered if Frank tipped them off to find her.

Edited November 18, 2016 by truthaboutluv

[Dee]

Connor totally killed Wes.

[RedheadZombie]

So glad Frank's alive.  So mad Wes is dead.  Damn you, show, for the Nate fake out.

I'm sure Asher is upset he missed the Michaela/Laurel kiss.

I was very creeped out by the Bonnie/Annalise kiss, and thank God it stopped there.  I was thinking - I do not need to see incest survivors, who are also extremely codependent, dysfunctionally getting it on.  It's actually believable, but I didn't want to watch the fallout.

Meggie better hope her professor doesn't catch her sobbing on top of a patient.

[SimoneS]

14 minutes ago, Gillian Rosh said:

Alfie Enoch interview - gonna miss him so much.

So I was right. They fired him. Suddenly, I don't give a fuck who supposedly murdered Wes on the show knowing that Nowalk did it in real life.

Edited November 18, 2016 by SimoneS

[alihart41]

4 minutes ago, truthaboutluv said:

I think there was. It was meant to be misleading so you would not know right up until the end. But as someone else pointed out, I don't think it was dark yet when Nate came to the house but it definitely was when Laurel got there. 

The moment they showed Nate in the house and then later Laurel and there was fifteen minutes left in the episode, I knew Nate wasn't the one who was killed. I was more certain when they came back from the break and went back to the events we'd already seen but still weren't showing who was under the sheet. At that point if it was Nate, what was the point of dragging it out?

For those asking, no Alfred did not choose to leave the show. People Magazine has an interview with him (I'm guessing they were spoiled about the episode and did the interview in advance of the episode airing) and he confirms that none of the cast knew who it would be at the start of the season. Apparently they were just told someone would die and then the writers didn't make the decision until they were writing Episode 7. He is sad to leave the cast and crew but says he's happy the show had the guts to do something so shocking. 

Interview With Alfred

Goodness knows Wes annoyed me greatly, especially his inexplicable obsession with that moron Rebecca, but once I realized it was clearly going to be him, I was sad. Once I figured it out it wasn't Nate after all, I knew it was either Wes or Connor (and I definitely thought it might be Connor when we were shown him leaving the guy's place) who I realized at that point, were both shown at times that were likely before the fire. Connor didn't make sense because he didn't have his phone, so no way for him to have gotten Annalise's call and Laurel clearly left without seeing him. 

But back to Wes, yeah he was kind of an idiot but seeing his life end that way and I agree with others that with his mother and everything else, it's just really depressing. So now the big mystery is who killed Wes. The Mahoney widow and Frank seem like the likeliest possibilities but this show is always known for its curveballs. Hell I'd throw in Bonnie there, especially because Annalise told her the DA was coming for her. Bonnie killed Rebecca because she thought she was a liability and it's not unreasonable that she saw Wes as the same. Plus, for all we know, someone tipped her off to Wes being at the police station. The guy representing Wes did know Bonnie and Annalise. 

YMMV but I have no interest in seeing Laurel and Frank together again. It doesn't help that I was never a fan but I just think with everything that's happened, that ship needs to sail away. 

As sad as it was to see Wes' life end that way, I do give the writers props for delivering a truly shocking finale and they've set up a lot of story - who killed Wes, who put the bomb in Annalise's house and who ratted her out to the police. Not to mention them finding Rebecca's body. Frank was responsible for getting rid of Rebecca. I can't believe he didn't do a good enough job so when they mentioned Rebecca, I almost wondered if Frank tipped them off to find her.

It was dark when Nate got there, so you were meant to believe they got there minutes within each other and were both inside when the house blew up. But they could've been there hours apart. We know, based on Laurel's phone, that she got there at 10:12, so Nate could've been there at 10 minutes before or two hours before.

Interview with Pete Nowalk, in which he confirms Alfie will be in the rest of the season and that he didn't decide it'd be Wes until the seventh episode.
 

[Michel]

2 hours ago, Gillian Rosh said:

I'm glad Connor at least had the good grace not to pretend he gives a fuck about Wes dying, and tbh, I was stunned to see Michaela shedding tears over it since they both spent so much time launching attacks on him.

To me, that looked more like stonefaced and shocked than uncaring.  He never liked him, but I don't think he ever would've wished him dead.  Michaela actually did like him, just not the things he did for Rebecca.  I don't think she or Connor truly hated him.  Just distrusted him.

Anyway, I will be alone in my corner and happy that Nate came out of the episode unharmed.  Though I really did think he'd die when he went into Annalise's house and Frank was revealed as alive.

I don't trust Trishelle (not Rochelle, @Keepitmoving).  I wonder what she's really, truly after from Michaela?  I bet Brett Butler features fairly prominently in the second half of the season.

Now we know why Frank lives.  Laurel probably goes back to him eventually, and they figure out how to raise her child by Wes.  He still has to get over his hurdles with her, Annalise, and Bonnie first, though.

Liza Weil sold Bonnie's quiet devastation when she delivered the news about Wes.  Also, poor Laurel and Meggy, breaking down like that in Laurel's hospital room.

I can't believe they tricked us with Wes two weeks ago.  They should've just shown Nate visiting Annalise in jail instead for episode seven, not that misdirection crap with Wes.

I guess the second half of the season deals with who killed Wes, and how the main characters move forward without him.  Also, I don't think Alfred Enoch is done just yet.  He still has to play the scenes leading up to Wes's murder to end the season.

Damn, January.  You'd better get here fast.

Edited November 18, 2016 by Michel

[wanderingstar]

Quote

Connor totally killed Wes.

With that dead-eyed stare of his while everyone else was crying - let's just say it wouldn't surprise me if he was the culprit.

 

Quote

He never liked him, but I don't think he ever would've wished him dead. 

Connor did threaten to kill Wes a few weeks ago, so I'm not sure I buy Connor having any conflicted feelings about Wes' death. I guess we'll see.

Edited November 18, 2016 by Gillian Rosh

[jvr]

3 minutes ago, RedheadZombie said:

Meggie better hope her professor doesn't catch her sobbing on top of a patient.

She better hope that Laurel doesn't mind that she blabbed her medical business to anyone who wanted to hear it!

[possibilities]

I thought Bonnie told Frank to kill Wes. But the Mahoney matriarch is certainly a possibility, although she'd hire someone, not do it herself.

Why would Atwood kill Wes? I just don't understand what could be her motive.

I don't think it was Nate; it doesn't seem in character for him, but then again you never know. No one believed Anna would make peach cobbler, so anything is possible.

I thought of Connor, because him not crying at the news seemed like it was supposed to make us think that. And I suppose it might be his way of ending all the uncertainty and trying to clear the way for himself, but I am hoping it's not him because I irrationally find him one of the more interesting characters and I just don't want it to be him. Also, I just think that he's not really a killer. But now that I've convinced myself, watch the show prove me wrong. I think they like to do that to the extent that if there's a theory out there, they will

Bonnie is the one who killed Rebecca. Does anyone know it was her? She's becoming one of the scariest people on the show. Frank is scary but he still feels things, and is full of remorse. Bonnie seems to feel no regrets, though, and to be an even better liar than Annalise. She scares me for real. And her continued attachment to Anna scares me more and more. I think Bonnie herself is a grenade. I just don't know what it will take for her to finally and irrevocably explode.

Anna kissing Bonnie was chillingly horrible. Also, Anna taunting Frank to kill himself. And her ability to smile beatifically right after, when telling Wes that Frank is gone. They really did burn down whatever was left of

4 minutes ago, RedheadZombie said:

I was very creeped out by the Bonnie/Annalise kiss, and thank God it stopped there.  I was thinking - I do not need to see incest survivors, who are also extremely codependent, dysfunctionally getting it on.  It's actually believable, but I didn't want to watch the fallout.

Yes, this 1000%

I'm sure Enoch will be back in flashbacks, like Sam has been. I was surprised by how sad I was about his character dying, though I think I would have been crushed no matter who they killed.

[truthaboutluv]

1 minute ago, Dee said:

Connor totally killed Wes.

I can see why a lot of people would go with that theory - one, it would definitely be shocking and two, the writers planted seeds during the season by reminding viewers of Connor's dislike for Wes and that at the end of the day he really blamed him for everything that happened with them. Plus he and Wes' timelines were the ones that seem off. 

Whoever killed Wes had to have either done it somewhere else and then bring the body to the house or killed him in the house and then I guess plant the bomb in the house. For Connor to work, we have to assume that Connor and Wes' paths crossed at some point and I'm trying to figure out when that would have been. Connor hooked up with the guy, didn't have his phone and left. 

Wes left the police station after hearing Annalise's message seemingly to go to her house. I guess it's possible they randomly bumped into each other, Wes would be stupid enough to mention the immunity thing and they get into an argument. But then Connor all on his own, while still sort of drunk, would then have to make the decision to drive him to the house and why there? How would he know Annalise wasn't there? Especially again since he didn't have his phone and never got her call. 

Unless he randomly showed up at Annalise to ream her out some more, Wes shows up, that's when the drama happens and in an ironic twist of fate, since that's where all the madness started with Wes killing Sam, Connor kills him and then sets the house up to burn, not knowing Laurel was coming over because he never got the message. I guess it could work but that'd really ruin the character and make him an ultimate villain so I'm not sure the writers will go there. Because at that point they'd have to get rid of him too because how do they keep him in the fold with the others? People like Rebecca and Sam were always disposable. 

[wanderingstar]

Quote

I don't think it was Nate; it doesn't seem in character for him, but then again you never know. No one believed Anna would make peach cobbler, so anything is possible.

Ha! It always comes back to the cobbler!

Quote

I can't believe they tricked us with Wes two weeks ago.  They should've just showed Nate visiting Annalise in jail instead for episode seven, not that misdirection crap with Wes.

This irritates me and strikes me as a bit of bad faith by the show (the first time I've ever felt this about the show in 3 seasons of watching). To your point, Michel, it wasn't even necessary. I'm just mad they gave me hope that my darling Wes was alive.

In happier news, Aflie is super adorable on Jimmy Kimmel right now.

[dgpolo]

2 minutes ago, possibilities said:

Why would Atwood kill Wes? I just don't understand what could be her motive.

Atwood was very jealous of Nate, she thought he was hanging around the interrogation rooms to help Wes and Annalise, I can see her going to Annalise's house to see if Nate had gone there (which he actually does do) Nate and Wes are both tall, black men. We don't know how he died but she could have killed him before she realized it wasn't Nate. Or, just by finding Wes there she knew he wouldn't turn on Annalise and killed him in a rage since she really seems to hate Annalise (what is that all about??)

[Keepitmoving]

Quote

'm glad Connor at least had the good grace not to pretend he gives a fuck about Wes dying, and tbh, I was stunned to see Michaela shedding tears over it since they both spent so much time launching attacks on him.

Connor's reaction seemed real to me. I don't think he killed him because as far as he was concerned as long as Wes didn't give his name up to the police, Connor wanted nothing to do with him. He threatened to off him should Wes even think of giving up his name to the police should the authorities find out about Sam.  Michaela, I could kind of believe those tears were some for Wes, but some for just yet a fucking again, more death of people who they know, people in their circle, whether she was close friends with him or not. It's another one of the people in Anna's circle and in their five that's dead, the bodies keep piling up. I mean what kind of daily existence is this? I mean at this point, they're just waiting for bodies to drop?  Especially given what seems to be the chaotic childhood she seemed to have, she can run away fast enough from it, it never stops.  So I saw her falling apart over that as much as him being a close classmate that she lost and them having to unwilling be in the same body pile up club under the leadership of Anna.

Edited November 18, 2016 by Keepitmoving

[wanderingstar]

Thinking more about Connor and Michaela's reactions, I'm gonna need just one scene in the back half of the season where Laurel tells them both to sit the fuck down with their crocodile tears because they didn't care about Wes at all.

[pennben]

13 minutes ago, possibilities said:

 No one believed Anna would make peach cobbler, so anything is possible.

Line of the night!!

[Chaiboy]

Maybe I've been watching too much Miss Marple..but what if....NOBODY killed Wes...Maybe he commited suicide...and was on the bed when Nate entered Annalise's bedroom thus exxplaining the stunned look on Nate's face ???? Remember nobody in the hospital mentioned HOW he died...only that he had died BEFORE the fire..As for the fire...You all saw Annalise put a bottle of vodka. on top of the mantel...over a raging fire...and left the house...And as the explosion which was shown outside the house seems to have been on the ground floor...at the front of the house where her study was...it could be that the bottle fell into the fire and exploded...and spread to more combustable materials...Just a thought. 

[Keepitmoving]

8 minutes ago, Gillian Rosh said:

Thinking more about Connor and Michaela's reactions, I'm gonna need just one scene in the back half of the season where Laurel tells them both to sit the fuck down with their crocodile tears because they didn't care about Wes at all.

Hell no and I don't want to see a scene like that, because I had no issues with them not feeling close to Wes. Especially since I'm gonna need them to get back to Michaela and her mother.  No way do I want to sit around and see endless minutes of Laurel centered footage like she's some pregnant widow.I hope these writers don't try to make it seem like they really, really miss him and are not just pissed that one of their fellow peers life has been cut short and what the fuck did Anna have to do with it kind of attitude. Please, I'm not poor Wes when he's seen as someone who people were beating up on, no he wasn't. They had every right not to feel close to him and vice versa. He didn't feel close to Connor and Michaela. Everyone had the people they were bonded to the most. If  I hear Michaela or Connor talking some shit about how we should have been nicer to him, I'm gonna be pissed.  Especially Michaela, she's got her own problems and she never wished him dead she was just tired of dealing with his stuff. 

Edited November 18, 2016 by Keepitmoving

[yourpointis]

4 minutes ago, Chaiboy said:

Maybe I've been watching too much Miss Marple..but what if....NOBODY killed Wes...Maybe he commited suicide...and was on the bed when Nate entered Annalise's bedroom thus exxplaining the stunned look on Nate's face ???? Remember nobody in the hospital mentioned HOW he died...only that he had died BEFORE the fire..As for the fire...You all saw Annalise put a bottle of vodka. on top of the mantel...over a raging fire...and left the house...And as the explosion which was shown outside the house seems to have been on the ground floor...at the front of the house where her study was...it could be that the bottle fell into the fire and exploded...and spread to more combustable materials...Just a thought. 

Wasn't the fire completely out when Nate arrived at the house?

[truthaboutluv]

11 minutes ago, Gillian Rosh said:

Thinking more about Connor and Michaela's reactions, I'm gonna need just one scene in the back half of the season where Laurel tells them both to sit the fuck down with their crocodile tears because they didn't care about Wes at all.

Connor didn't cry and in fact was pretty stone faced, which is why so many people now think he killed Wes. I liked Wes, I'm sad he's dead but ymmv, I never blamed Connor or Michaela for their feelings towards him after all the Sam drama. Wes was incredibly frustrating and single-minded with his Rebecca obsession.

So yeah, they weren't the best friends and on many levels they blamed him for all the crap, which admittedly wasn't entirely fair. But I don't think they truly wished him dead and couldn't genuinely be upset that he's dead. For better or for worse, they have been through a lot of crap together. There are people I don't give a crap about but if they died suddenly in a tragic way, I'd feel some level of empathy.

Edited November 18, 2016 by truthaboutluv

[dgpolo]

I just had a thought, we now know that Annalise wanted Oliver to hack the DA's office, is that the info she wanted wiped from her phone?

[Keepitmoving]

1 minute ago, truthaboutluv said:

Connor didn't cry and in fact was pretty stone faced, which is why so many people now think he killed Wes. I liked Wes, I'm sad he's dead but ymmv, I never blamed Connor or Michaela for their feelings towards him after all the Sam drama. Wes was incredibly frustrating and single-minded with his Rebecca obsession.

So yeah, they weren't the best friends and on many levels they blamed him for all the crap, which admittedly wasn't entirely fair. But I don't think they truly wished him dead and couldn't genuinely be upset that he's dead. For better or for worse, they have been through a lot of crap together. There are people I don't give a crap about but if they died suddenly in a tragic, I'd feel some level of empathy.

Exactly, especially if they are your peers, they are all going through law school together under some unbelievable circumstances.

[RedheadZombie]

A murder, followed by wiring the house to explode to cover evidence, strikes me as professional.  And if Laurel's entering the house triggered the explosion, as it looked, one might assume the target was to catch Annalise entering her home that night.  I'm glad that Annalise's anguish was genuine versus an act, and I'm glad that she seemingly didn't commit the murder.

They've set up Connor to be a suspect, but he's an obvious red herring, IMO.  After drinking and a quick hook up, it seems unlikely he had time to rig an explosion.  I just don't see them writing off another K5.  Plus, I think Connor's expression was solemn, versus apathetic or coldly unconcerned.  Michaela's tears surprised me, but maybe the actress was reacting to the loss of Alfie, or the character getting caught with the news after thinking it was Connor who was dead.

Bonnie seems another suspect since we know she planned something with Frank.  But her quiet anguish seemed genuine, and if they made Bonnie and Frank kill Wes - I'm done done done.

The Mahoneys seem too obvious, but a lot of time was spent on that SL, and it would all be wasted otherwise.  It's obvious we'll be seeing Mahoney's widow again.  I wouldn't be surprised if the woman who helped set up Annalise's car crash is responsible.  She wants revenge for setting her up in court, and is well paid by Mama Mahoney. 

And what an utter waste to kill off Wes if we don't get a scene of Annalise breaking down while she tells Eve.  No one else will understand.

[blackwing]

36 minutes ago, SimoneS said:

So I was right. They fired him. Suddenly, I don't give a fuck who supposedly murdered Wes on the show knowing that Nowalk did it in real life.

Wait.  Peter Nowalk actually killed Alfred Enoch "in real life"?!?!?!?!?!   You'd think we would have heard about it in the news!

But seriously, it's show business.  Actors come and go as the storylines dictate what is going to happen. It's not the first time a character has been suddenly written off a show, and it certainly won't be the last.  The actor who played Sam was cut, and shows up infrequently in flashbacks.   The actress who played Rebecca was cut, had maybe one flashback, and thankfully hasn't been seen again.   The actor who played the quarterback boyfriend was cut with no explanation at all and never seen again.   Being a TV actor means always not knowing for sure how long you will have your job.  Shows get cancelled.  Characters get written off.  Then they move on.

Edited November 18, 2016 by blackwing

[possibilities]

It does seem like the Mahoneys are the most obvious people to have done it, aiming to get both Wes and Annalise.
But then what did Bonnie mean when she told Frank to fall on his sword? Did she want him to confess to framing the Mahoney brother? It's not like Bonnie to suggest telling the truth rather than orchestrating a gruesome, bloody illegality. I'm as curious about what Bonnie's truth is, as much as I am about who killed Wes.

[loki567]

Man. I think Wes' death hits so hard because you think about his three years on the show and how brutal his entire history was. His mother literally killed herself to protect him which inadvertently sends him into Annalise's arms which leads to a dead girlfriend and a generally miserable experience until his death. 

And now the Mahoney storyline can gain even more weight if they did end up killing him as there's something brutally realistic about a rich, white family completely destroying a poor, black family. 

I hope Laurel goes on the warpath. 

[twoods]

I wish I spoiled myself before watching this episode because that was brutal. I was a sobbing mess at the Wes reveal and I'm still gutted. I know he wasn't well liked but he was my favorite character and I don't know if this show will keep me as interested. No wonder they had to stop shooting when the cast realized that Alfred was the one killed off because all of them must be so close.

At least he will be on the rest of the season but I'm probably still going to cry through most of it. This TV death hurts- I think moreso since there was the false sense of security that Wes was alive with the flash forward scenes. But still, it sucks.

Meggie and Laurel comforting eachother was nice to see, but I don't think she knows that she's pregnant yet. 

[colorbars]

2 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

Bonnie seems another suspect since we know she planned something with Frank.  But her quiet anguish seemed genuine, and if they made Bonnie and Frank kill Wes - I'm done done done.

Not only did it seem genuine, but what would have even been the point for her to look upset and cover her mouth and all that, when she was completely alone in her house when Annalise told her Wes died? Of course if she was with Annalise face to face, she'd have to pretend, or around anyone else, but she was completely alone with no reason to fake her reaction. I don't see how Bonnie could have logically had any knowledge of Wes's murder beforehand.

Edited November 18, 2016 by colorbars

[pennben]

Are we supposed to find out who killed Wes soon?  If not, I'm not going to speculate until I see how the story goes in the next half of the season.  That seems to be what the writers do!!

[inkworks]

I'm not sad Wes is dead. He was a total brat who infuriated me every time he was on the screen.

I absolutely love the other four though so I'm so glad they're safe.

Honestly, Wes is the only one in the main cast I don't like so this worked out pretty good for me.

[love2lovebadtv]

5 hours ago, sking24450 said:

She was eyeing him really hard in the last episode.  This Annalise "snitching" thing is a distraction from the real killer.

I was distracted by it and kept thinking there was going to be a plot surrounding the snitching.  I didn't think they'd kill off such a key character. And he was my favorite. Was even getting used to the idea of him being with laurel. So unhappy about this. 

[dr pepper]

I was disappointed that Analise did not actually destroy the immunity idol, i'm sure someone will dig it out of the ashes and claim a free A. That's how this class works, right?

[love2lovebadtv]

7 hours ago, SimoneS said:

Yeah, it hurts like hell. I am a Wes fan too. Also, there are not a lot of black male leads of tv so it is loss for diversity too, but I am not ready to give up the show as yet. If he was fired then, I will rethink. Actually, most  likely he was fired.

I'm a Wes fan, too!  No idea why but he was probably fired.