Donald John Trump: 2016 President-Elect

[SoCal4Us]

5 hours ago, KerleyQ said:

...We're physically rather isolated, in terms of the fact that we are the strength in our region, there is no other country in spitting distance that is a threat to us.  And my generation (and younger) has absolutely no experience living through the legitimate threat of Russia tossing some bombs our way.  There haven't been bomb drills in schools in generations.  

 

Schools teach the Active Shooter - Run Hide Fight plan, at least in our area.  So many potential dangers the schools have to prepare for today...

[Stuffy]

55 minutes ago, SoCal4Us said:

Schools teach the Active Shooter - Run Hide Fight plan, at least in our area.  So many potential dangers the schools have to prepare for today...

We (teachers) had ALICE training. The police acted like a shooter with fake bullets, and we had to use the training we had just learned to survive different scenarios. Beforehand they went through the Virginia Tech classrooms and told us how many were killed in each room and what each room did differently. They also showed us a movie scene that looked like Columbine security footage. They didn't tell us it was from a movie while it was playing which I thought was a dirty trick. I was so pissed.

We also had a teacher slip on a shell casing and bust her mouth. It was a very morbid day. 

Edited December 14, 2016 by Stuffy

[EyewatchTV211]

8 minutes ago, Stuffy said:

We (teachers) had ALICE training. The police acted like a shooter with fake bullets, and we had to use the training we had just learned to survive different scenarios. Beforehand they went through the Virginia Tech classrooms and told us how many were killed in each room and what each room did differently. They also showed us a movie scene that looked like Columbine security footage. They didn't tell us it was from a movie while it was playing which I thought was a dirty trick. I was so pissed.

We also had a teacher slip on a shell casing and bust her mouth. It was a very morbid day. 

Wow. I work in public schools, but we didn't do anything that involved. We do lockdown drills, fire drills, weather emergency drills (some called by different names now). 

Edited December 14, 2016 by VMepicgrl

[Stuffy]

11 minutes ago, VMepicgrl said:

Wow. I work in public schools, but we didn't do anything that involved. We do lockdown drills, fire drills, weather emergency drills (some called by different names now). 

We did it for a professional development day. The students do the standard drills you mentioned. 

Edited December 14, 2016 by Stuffy

[EyewatchTV211]

Just now, Stuffy said:

We did it for a professional development day. The students do the standard drills you mentioned. 

As far as I know, we adults haven't done anything more than what we do with the students. It's possible I've missed something, as I am split between schools and am not a teacher. So I don't attend all trainings. I'd likely hear about something so significant, though....

[Stuffy]

2 minutes ago, VMepicgrl said:

As far as I know, we adults haven't done anything more than what we do with the students. It's possible I've missed something, as I am split between schools and am not a teacher. So I don't attend all trainings. I'd likely hear about something so significant, though....

We were kinda guinea pigs for the sheriffs department too. We only did it the one time. 

[Rae Spellman]

1 hour ago, SoCal4Us said:

Schools teach the Active Shooter - Run Hide Fight plan, at least in our area.  So many potential dangers the schools have to prepare for today

When I taught in a school district that isn't an inner city school district but is in a town that borders a city that DJT referred to as among the most dangerous in the world, we had lockdown drills. 

[stormy]

I saw Ta-Nehisi Coates on Chris Hayes tonight.  Excellent interview.  Great story in the Atlantic.

Edited December 14, 2016 by stormy

[theredhead77]

After the San Bernardino shootings my office brought in someone from the PD to tell us what to do. The irony was, we were in a training room with one way in/out and no windows. We would be sitting ducks and would be sitting ducks in most areas of the building I work in. I decided my hiding place would be in the bottom drawer of my filing cabinet.

I grew up in the 80s, don't recall bomb drills but I do remember seeing them in movies. Our desks (then, and now at work) wouldn't do shit to protect us from a nuke. Just as well they don't start doing bomb drills at school. Kids have enough to worry about without worrying about a nuke they literally cannot protect themselves from.

[scriggle]

Russia’s American coup

Quote

The U.S. is finally waking up to the fact that it has been turned into a subordinate ally to Russia, thanks to Putin and Trump

Scott Gilmore

December 12, 2016

Russian President Vladimir Putin (C) and Defence Minister Sergei Shoigu (R) take part in celebrations for Navy Day in Baltiysk, Kaliningrad region, Russia, July 26, 2015. (Mikhail Klimentyev/Ria Novosti/Reuters)

Some of the most important moments in history happen fast, like a flash of lightning. A tank crosses a border or a prince is assassinated and everyone knows the world has changed, even before the sound of thunder rolls over them.

Other epochal shifts are more subtle and incremental. In 18th-century England, very few people would have known what a Spinning Jenny was, and fewer still would recognize what the automation of weaving meant for the world.

For the last two years we have been living through one of those less obvious historic transformations. It didn’t happen all at once, it’s still not over, and even now we can’t say how deep or far it will go. But it happened, moment by moment, until we woke up in a cold day in December and realized that Moscow had effectively installed the next president of the United States.

That sounds hyperbolic, doesn’t it? Even writing it I have to pause and stare at that sentence. But these are the facts: The CIA and over a dozen other U.S. intelligence agencies have concluded Russia hacked into both the Republican and Democratic party computers. Senior Russian officials have admitted that they leaked the Democratic data to WikiLeaks. Those emails were then strategically published over the course of the presidential campaign. Why? A member of the House Intelligence Committee states there is “overwhelming evidence” Russia’s goal was to elect Donald Trump.

‘TRUMPUTIN’: The disturbing parallels between Donald Trump and Vladimir Putin

The result of Putin’s intervention in the American election cannot be downplayed. If Hillary Clinton had garnered just 107,000 more votes in Pennsylvania, Wisconsin and Michigan, this would have given her the Electoral College and the White House. According to pollster Nate Silver, the Russian intervention contributed to eroding up to three per cent of the swing-state vote from Clinton. That small margin was all it took to decide the election.

By any definition of the word, this may be Russia’s greatest coup since Sputnik. It was a spectacular success—it toppled one political candidate in order to place Moscow’s man in the White House—and no matter what happens next, it has dealt a damaging blow to America and its political institutions.

And there can be no doubt that Trump is Moscow’s man. Throughout the campaign, his pro-Russian policies were his only inflexibly consistent proposals. After winning the Republican nomination, his team asked for only one change to the entire party platform—removing support for Ukraine in its fight against Russia, contradicting almost the whole Republican foreign policy establishment.

LONGREAD: How Donald Trump won the presidency

On the campaign trail Trump inexplicably defended Putin at every turn, even when it would seem to undermine his own political chances. Once elected, Trump quickly brought back Paul Manafort, his former campaign chair who had been forced to resign after public concerns about his close ties to Russian oligarchs. His pick for National Security Adviser, Gen. Michael Flynn, is a former contributor to the Russian state propaganda network RT, openly admires Putin, and joined him at a gala dinner last year. Flynn is being paired with a deputy who once said “Vladimir Putin is the one who really deserves that Nobel Peace Prize.” And, topping all of this, Trump’s likely Secretary of State nominee, Rex Tillerson, has been described as the closest American to Putin. As the CEO of Exxon Mobil he tirelessly campaigned to remove Russian sanctions, and last year he was awarded one of that country’s highest civilian honours for his efforts in promoting Russian interests.

How did we get here? Habituation. Every paragraph in this column would have been laughably unbelievable 18 months ago. Putin interfering in the U.S. election? President Trump? A pro-Russian administration? But when this slowly unfolded, day by day, and inch by inch, we gradually became de-sensitized to the change that Trump has brought to America: campaigning on lies, turning America’s foreign policy on its head, and making the United States a subordinate ally to Russia.

MORE: Donald Trump becomes America’s commander in confusion

I have a sense that Americans are only now beginning to realize what has happened. Even leading Republicans are demanding to know what is going on. But unless something even more extraordinary occurs in the next few weeks, Russia’s American coup has already succeeded. No matter what happens next, the United States, its institutions, its place in the world, all have been left dangerously weakened, fractured, diminished.

European leaders are openly questioning America’s role in NATO. Beijing is flying nuclear bombers over the South China Sea. Russian and Syrian troops are retaking Aleppo from the rebels. That’s the sound of thunder in the distance; the world has changed.

Unless the republicans wake up and decide the country is more important than "winning", the orange menace's presidency will be the end of the US as we know it.

[AntiBeeSpray]

Yep and that's in part what's very frightening.

[FuriousStyles]

Can somebody explain why this guy is still "campaigning"?  He's still holding rallies and having meetings witb celebrities...WTF is going on here?

[Duke Silver]

https://twitter.com/MattOswaltVA/status/808783492507017216

Edited December 14, 2016 by Duke Silver

[AntiBeeSpray]

3 minutes ago, FuriousStyles said:

Can somebody explain why this guy is still "campaigning"?  He's still holding rallies and having meetings witb celebrities...WTF is going on here?

It's who he is. He feeds off the rallies and the meetings.

[Lunata]

5 minutes ago, FuriousStyles said:

Can somebody explain why this guy is still "campaigning"?  He's still holding rallies and having meetings witb celebrities...WTF is going on here?

Oh that's just all part of the 'black hole' that Tony Schwartz said that Donald Trump is. The black hole that just can't be filled. Donald will probably have 'rallies' every week while he's President too. What can I say, the guy is a nut.

[Duke Silver]

8 minutes ago, FuriousStyles said:

Can somebody explain why this guy is still "campaigning"?  He's still holding rallies and having meetings witb celebrities...WTF is going on here?

He needs to feel the adulation that he can only get from an adoring, mindless crowd of rubes.  It's the applause from these (Nuremberg) rallies that justify his lies about "landslide" electoral victory, and claims of a mandate.

[Lunata]

1 hour ago, Duke Silver said:

https://twitter.com/MattOswaltVA/status/808783492507017216

Okay this is about to cross the line. If I start seeing Kim, Khloe and Kourtney waltzing into the 'Gold-White House' then, I'll move out of this country and leave it all to the trash.

Edited December 14, 2016 by Lunata

[Toomuchsoap]

I think we're done. Does anyone really believe that this very same gang - THOSE guys  - who met on Obama's first inauguration and vowed they would do anything and everything to guarantee that he'd be a "one time president"?  Since they failed that first attempt, they doubled-down and blocked all significant legislation to this day.  The rethugs stonewall for the past four years is just one of the reasons people voted against their own personal and financial best interests and elected this dreamcicle horror.  These rethugs will do nothing to stop these nazis. Nothing.

[navelgazer]

2 minutes ago, Toomuchsoap said:

I think we're done. Does anyone really believe that this very same gang - THOSE guys  - who met on Obama's first inauguration and vowed they would do anything and everything to guarantee that he'd be a "one time president"?  Since they failed that first attempt, they doubled-down and blocked all significant legislation to this day.  The rethugs stonewall for the past four years is just one of the reasons people voted against their own personal and financial best interests and elected this dreamcicle horror.  These rethugs will do nothing to stop these nazis. Nothing.

And ain't it a coinkydink that the same people -- the big old money fascists of the day who financed the German Nazi Party are the same people, the next generation on of course, set to benefit from Twitler.

About the book.   

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Is_a_Racket

The book.

https://archive.org/stream/WarIsARacket/WarIsARacket_djvu.txt

[Lunata]

Who is going to head the EPA? Oh yeah it's the guy that wants to eliminate the EPA, Scott Pruitt.

Remember those Standing Rock Sioux Indians in North Dakota protesting the pipeline with Jill Stein? North Dakota officials estimate more than 176,000 gallons of crude oil leaked from the Belle Fourche Pipeline into the Ash Coulee Creek. State environmental scientist Bill Suess says a landowner discovered the spill on Dec. 5 near the city of Belfield, which is roughly 150 miles from the epicenter of the Dakota Access pipeline protest camps.

oops...

[BuckeyeLou]

On 12/8/2016 at 8:44 PM, callmebetty said:

Kurt will be one of the first on the hit list when the IRS and FBI come a calling after Jan 20th. 

To paraphrase him Stick  a fork in the USA cause were done .

Oh Lordy...scary thought, along with all the other folks who dare 'defy" Trumpster.  And btw: whatever happened to Katy Tur?  She seems to have disappeared from NBC....maybe the threats from Trump fans became too much?

[FilmTVGeek80]

7 minutes ago, stewedsquash said:

Maybe we should be mad at the media instead of Trump?

Eh, I'll be mad at both. The media for not doing their job and letting the Orange Nightmare get away with his lies and Drumpf for being the lying, narcissistic, sexist idiot that he is.

[callmebetty]

9 minutes ago, BuckeyeLou said:

Oh Lordy...scary thought, along with all the other folks who dare 'defy" Trumpster.  And btw: whatever happened to Katy Tur?  She seems to have disappeared from NBC....maybe the threats from Trump fans became too much?

Here you go:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2016/12/12/msnbcs_katy_tur_to_guest_explain_to_the_trump_supporter_why_they_need_to_acknowledge_russia_hack.html

[BuckeyeLou]

12 hours ago, choclatechip45 said:

Condoleeza Rice is the last person I want any president taking National Security advice from. Her tenure as NSA was a disaster plus Exxon is one of her clients. I do respect her work at Stanford though I just don't want her near any security decisions.

AND: Condoleeza has a huge Oil Tanker named after her!  Hmmm...she has friends in the oil business.

[BuckeyeLou]

7 hours ago, random chance said:

Yep I was not being remotely sarcastic, I was wondering about it quite awhile ago just due to the limited vocabulary and some physical tics, and lately I've seen other people mentioning it.

Trumpster's Father died of Alzheimer's & I wonder if he is showing early signs of it?  I mean all his crazy talk and bizarre delusions of grandeur.

[Lunata]

The Electoral College votes will be cast on December 19. Michael Moore was just on Last Word with Lawrence O'Donnell and he looked into the camera and begged those electors to change their votes and do not vote for Trump. Until those electoral votes are counted, Donald Trump is not official. The odds are that he will end up with enough electoral votes, but there have already been a few Republican electors that have said they will not cast their vote for their party candidate (Trump).

Leaders of that faction, known as the "Hamilton electors," acknowledge their chances are slim. The Republican National Committee is overseeing an expansive whip operation designed to lock down Donald Trump’s Electoral College majority and ensure that the 306 Republican electors cast their votes for the president-elect. The RNC’s elector head count, the sources emphasized, is standard practice in presidential election years. But this year it also serves as an early-warning system for potentially wayward GOP electors amid an intense push by Democratic electors to convince 37 of their Republican counterparts to jump ship. The Democrats are hoping that dozens of GOP electors — many of whom were picked at local conventions and party meetings dominated by Trump’s opponents — are already primed to resist Trump.

I doubt that's going to happen but it's interesting to imagine the fallout from it.

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/12/rnc-trump-electoral-college-232537

[BuckeyeLou]

12 minutes ago, callmebetty said:

Here you go:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2016/12/12/msnbcs_katy_tur_to_guest_explain_to_the_trump_supporter_why_they_need_to_acknowledge_russia_hack.html

Thank You....good to see Katy looking well and still on-air

[sistermagpie]

29 minutes ago, stewedsquash said:

Obama did talk to Trevor and confirmed that Russia interference ain't nothing new, didn't hack the election, emails no big deal, media played it up.

Yes, weird that everyone remembers the Russia hack being a thing before except Trump who, oddly, recently asked why nobody brought this up during the election.

I assume that when you say "no big deal" you're being sarcastic about how the media got distracted from the hacks by the Access Hollywood tape and happily published the email stuff without worrying about the larger context and not suggesting that it's no big deal that Russia so aggressively and successfully interfered with the election. The manipulation of the minority of Americans who fell for this stuff is obviously a big deal.

[statsgirl]

47 minutes ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

Eh, I'll be mad at both. The media for not doing their job and letting the Orange Nightmare get away with his lies and Drumpf for being the lying, narcissistic, sexist idiot that he is.

Some of the media did try. Every day, after every speech, Daniel Dale would tweet out how many lies Trump told (usually 30+) and why they were lies.

The problem is that this election is Post Truth.  If Trump hit the emotional nerve, people blocked out whether  it was true or not.

The Russia issue just gets worse and worse.  I belong to a group that sponsored a Syrian family. Since they arrived they've been desperate to get their Aleppo relatives out but every time the UN wanted a cease fire to get civilians out, Russia vetoed it.  On Saturday, her sister and three small children were buried in the rubble of their home and died.

And today,  Rex Tillerson, holder of the Russian Friendship Medal, will be the new Secretary of State.  It's setting the fox to guard the hen house (Putin must be thrilled) but worse, the rest of the world is also paying the price.

[izabella]

8 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

And today,  Rex Tillerson, holder of the Russian Friendship Medal, will be the new Secretary of State.  It's setting the fox to guard the hen house (Putin must be thrilled) but worse, the rest of the world is also paying the price.

That doesn't have to happen.  The Senate gets a chance to reject him during the Confirmation hearings.  The Senate can stop this from happening.  The Democrats are only outnumbered by a few, so if John McCain can get outraged enough to bring some other Republicans with him, they can stop Tillerson from being SOS. 

Of course, Trump will then manage to find someone else who is worse, somehow, so we're screwed either way.

[statsgirl]

Even if Tillerson doesn't get confirmed, Trump will put in someone else whose priority is the big deal rather than morality or a decent life for people who aren't as rich as he is.

In all these appointments, Trump has demonstrated that selfishness and profit are his guiding rules.  IQ is irrelevant.

Edited December 14, 2016 by statsgirl

[jhlipton]

On 12/12/2016 at 4:25 PM, Lunata said:

Market manipulation that will effect every one of us.

On Boeing...
1) Drumpf hears that Boeing will sell planes to Iran
2) Drumpf lies about how much Boeing charges for Air Force One
3) Boeing stock plummets
4) Drumpf buys stock in Boeing through one of his shell companies
5) Boeing announces plans to build planes for Iran
6) Boeing stock rises
7) Drumpf sells stock

4 and 7 are conjecture but pretty reasonable.

 

On 12/12/2016 at 6:33 PM, Lunata said:

Even if Trump made a public statement saying "Yes, I worked with Russia closely to make sure the election was rigged", his supporters would hotly defend him saying "What he really means is that he wanted all of Hillary's emails made public so he could lock her up, and God bless him for that".

Yep

On 12/12/2016 at 7:25 PM, tenativelyyours said:

He drove a casino into the ground.

This "great businessman" couldn't sell steaks to Americans!

 

15 hours ago, Lunata said:

I think that Putin, Trump and OPEC plan to carve up the world. one big chunk for each of them to manage and dictate to.

A Treaty of Tordesillas for our time.  Yay?

13 hours ago, choclatechip45 said:

Condoleeza Rice is the last person I want any president taking National Security advice from. Her tenure as NSA was a disaster plus Exxon is one of her clients. I do respect her work at Stanford though I just don't want her near any security decisions.

 

During the 9/11 Hearings: "Nobody gave me a plaaaaaaaaaaan!!!"  You're head of the NSA, bitch, it's your job to give everyone else a plan!

[Duke Silver]

OH SNAP!!!

https://twitter.com/Evan_McMullin/status/808884868474142720

[Padma]

Based on what he's saying about his business, it's impossible to imagine Trump won't be in violation of the emolument's clause on Day One.

That is a REQUIREMENT of the Constitution, the highest law of the land. Why isn't it a bigger deal if Trump is breaking the law on the first day of his presidency (and every day afterwards until he truly divests (inc. the DC hotel) and has independent trustees watching over something like T-bills for him.

He will be breaking the law from day 1. How is this not a bigger deal?

[Duke Silver]

^^^ Did you watch the Bernie Sanders town hall thingy in Wisconsin last night?  Responses from the Trump voters panel there make it pretty clear:  they don't care what Trump says or does, apparently.  They only care about what they make up in their own minds about what he's gonna do for them individually.  This conformed perfectly w/ my encounters w/ Trump supporters.

[navelgazer]

12 minutes ago, Padma said:

He will be breaking the law from day 1. How is this not a bigger deal?

IOKIYAR -- it's OK if you're a Republican.  For example, Rep. Anthony Weiner (D) was driven from office b/c of his sex addiction; Senator David Vitter (R) was not.  

Another example  goes like this --

Quote

 

A Death in the Congressman's Office
Does Anybody in the Press Care About Lori Klausutis? 
By Denis Wright and Chris George

August 8, 2001 (APJP)

Once upon a time, the phrase "investigative reporter" actually meant something. It usually involved hard work, possibly even mentation. Now, it seems, they just make stuff up. Especially on the Fox News Channel, where an uninitiated viewer could easily think she/he had tuned in Comedy Central. It's "Chandra-Chandra-Chandra" with the occasional "Condit is just like Clinton" thrown in. Given our media's 24/7 obsession with the Gary Condit "scandal", you might assume that there is a real dearth of hard news to pursue.

In reality, there is indeed a news story percolating out there. The story bears remarkable and ironic similarities to the Condit/Levy story. Both involve Congressmen, rumors of infidelity, and the fate of a younger female subordinate. The details are so similar as to remind one of two alternate universes. The difference between the two stories? First, in the Klausutis case as not in the Levy case, there is a real body, very dead. Second, the Klausutis case involves a Republican.

The story had a brief flutter in the Northwest Florida press, which ran a few very short stories on Lori's death. With the exception of theNorthwest Florida Daily News, they were of the "Aw-what-a-shame/ nothing-to-see-here-move-along-now-folks" variety. But nationally, this mysterious death earned a mere one paragraph mention in The Washington Post's NATION IN BRIEF column:

"FORT WALTON BEACH, FL. - Lori Klausutis, a 28-year-old office worker for Rep. Joe Scarborough (R-Fl), was found dead in the congressman's district office. Police said preliminary findings from the medical examiner's office showed no foul play or any outward indication of suicide."

Unbelievably, that was it. The story was simply dropped. A young female employee of one of Florida's Congressmen had died unexpectedly in the Congressman's office. There were no witnesses to her death and the cause of death was not apparent. Klausutis' boss, Joe Scarborough had recently resigned from Congress prematurely and unexpectedly, amid rumors about his marital fidelity and soon after a divorce. He had also abruptly resigned as publisher of the Independent Florida Sun, claiming that resigning from Congress and as publisher was necessary to spend more time with his sons.

http://www.americanpolitics.com/20010808Klausutis.html

[more at link]

 

[Padma]

1 hour ago, statsgirl said:

Some of the media did try. Every day, after every speech, Daniel Dale would tweet out how many lies Trump told (usually 30+) and why they were lies.

The problem is that this election is Post Truth.  If Trump hit the emotional nerve, people blocked out whether  it was true or not.

 

No offense, and please don't take this personally!  I'm just re-reading George Orwell and have come to believe we must absolutely push back on this latest Trump spin on their lying.  I want to tell them (including the hateful liar Kellyanne Conway):  "There is no such thing as a post truth world. There really ARE still facts.  People really CAN know what they are.  When you're saying things that are UNTRUE you are either misinformed or LYING. If you are corrected and still say it again, then you are a LIAR."

There is no such thing as a "post truth" or "post factual" world. 2016 is no different from 2012 in terms of what is real and what is not. Maybe you have to work harder not to be taken in by lies and misinformation that is more easily spread. This "post fact" thing is just the latest bit of media complicity in making a pathological liar like Trump (and others with him like Pence and KAC) seem normal. But they are NOT normal. They are liars and con artists. They know EXACTLY what they are doing.

They must be called out for lying, and not allowed to pretend that it's "something about the world we live in now" with such aggravating and fake "innocence".

[Duke Silver]

I watched this live, and the anger from Malcolm Nance was righteous:

[Duke Silver]

Hey, Kellyanne Conway &/or Reince Priebus: I know your boy loves rallies.  The three of you (plus Steve Bannon), should go to the following coordinates, wave Old Glory and wait for what you've got coming to you:  39.0392° N, 125.7625° E

Do it.  Go there.  Now.

[Bossa Nova]

North Korea.

Wow.

Cool !

Edited December 14, 2016 by Bossa Nova

[candall]

5 hours ago, BuckeyeLou said:

AND: Condoleeza has a huge Oil Tanker named after her!  Hmmm...she has friends in the oil business.

Not just any friends, THE "friend."  Condoleeza Rice is on the Exxon payroll as a consultant.  She (and co-consultant Defense Secretary Bob Gates) recommended Tillerson for the SOS position and arranged for the introduction to DT, thus doing a REALLY good job of earning her Exxon paycheck.

 

Rachel Maddow did a shocking review-slash-expose' of Exxon's history of action that was adversarial to the interests of the US--adversarial to any interests except its own.  [See, Chad, where the US had negotiated an agreement that, in exchange for a pipeline, the money for the newfound oil deposits would have to be pumped straight into the (desperately) poverty-stricken economy for schools, infrastructure, etc.  But Tillerson/Exxon told the long-term dictator, "Never mind all that.  Here's billions of dollars, just for you.  Go have a new palace designed for yourself and build an army with lots of tanks--whatever you want."  The dictator liked that idea a lot!  He broke the agreement with the US and gave all the oil companies, except Exxon, 24 hours to get out of Chad.]

Maddow:  "[Exxon historically] competes with America.  In lots of places, Exxon is anti-American.  Exxon, under Rex Tillerson, has frequently, and repeatedly, and reliably, actively worked to oppose the interests of the United States of America, in countries large and small, even in countries where we are actively at war . . ."

(Wow, I've always maintained my own little Exxon boycott because of the Valdez, but there's PLENTY of reason to drive past the Exxon pump.)

**************************************

Maybe this is my imagination because I relate to Maddow and I'm feeling this way myself, but she sounded so depressed and discouraged when she was saying that in spite of ALL the evidence that Tillinger should not be confirmed, he probably would be found acceptable, because the Senate will want to appease DT.  "Partisanship over patriotism."  The Tillinger confirmation hearings will be a good litmus test; get ready.  [That's me, not RM.]

I have the thought that pretty soon, I'll be tuning into The Rachel Maddow Show and--as long as she's able--she'll report on all the new ways we are well and truly and irrevocably fucked.

[Jediknight]

1 hour ago, candall said:

Maybe this is my imagination because I relate to Maddow and I'm feeling this way myself, but she sounded so depressed and discouraged when she was saying that in spite of ALL the evidence that Tillinger should not be confirmed, he probably would be found acceptable, because the Senate will want to appease DT.  "Partisanship over patriotism."  The Tillinger confirmation hearings will be a good litmus test; get ready.  [That's me, not RM.]

I don't think he'll get confirmed.  I think at least Graham, McCain, and Rubio will cross over and vote against him.

[candall]

30 minutes ago, Jediknight said:

I don't think he'll get confirmed.  I think at least Graham, McCain, and Rubio will cross over and vote against him.

I hope you're right, but that's a slender braid from which to dangle the fate of the country.  I wouldn't even bother to lift my eyebrow at fresh video of Rubio trucking through the gilded lobby of TT.  McCain has declined multiple opportunities to defy DT when that opposition would have seemed automatic and so far, he has surprised and disappointed.

The FBI pre-confirmation investigative assessment of Tillinger should be about 147 pages of valid reasons why he's unsuitable, so we'll see whether there's a finally a place the line will be drawn, or whether the whole country is available for purchase.

[millennium]

I was surprised to see football great Jim Brown on CNN this morning singing Trump's praises, about how all Trump wants to do is help the black community.

And then Kanye West buddying up to him yesterday.

It's bizarre.   Even if you leave out the whole alt-right element of the campaign, they're still cozying up to a man who is determined to destroy the legacy of America's first African-American president.   

[Lunata]

8 hours ago, Duke Silver said:

I watched this live, and the anger from Malcolm Nance was righteous:

I've only seen Malcolm Nance recently since I'm watching MSNBC more than CNN. The first time I listened to him I was impressed by his knowledge and candor.

There's no doubt that the election was stolen. Russia has always been heavily involved with a brand of information warfare, known as "dezinformatsiya,". It has been used by the Russians since at least the Cold War. The disinformation campaigns are only one "active measure" tool used by Russian intelligence to "sow discord among," and within, allies perceived hostile to Russia. One component of the disinformation used in this election were Russia's troll factories that were paid to spread pro-Trump propaganda on social media. Hundreds of bloggers are paid to flood forums and social networks at home and abroad with anti-western and pro-Kremlin comments. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/apr/02/putin-kremlin-inside-russian-troll-house If you've ever commented, replied to or sent a tweet to Trump in his Twitter feed then you most likely have read comments or have been attacked by a high-school-age blogger somewhere in Russia. There's an abundance of digital hackers available for hire. So, there's that. The impact of bloggers supporting Trump, not that he didn't have plenty anyway, but these bloggers were just more hateful and coordinated. I must say that I'm not shocked since social media is globally available but I didn't have any idea of the scope and magnitude or the power it had.

President Obama, Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders and certainly Donald Trump were all aware what was happening. Of course Donald Trump wouldn't say anything about it because he was benefiting from it. This is an official press release from the Department Of Homeland Security and Office of the Director of National Intelligence on Election Security.

https://www.dhs.gov/news/2016/10/07/joint-statement-department-homeland-security-and-office-director-national

President Obama was sitting on information from 17 federal agencies that Russia was clearly behind the DNC hacking of emails from Hillary Clinton and John Podesta. But why would he not disclose this information sooner? He knew about the hacking for months prior to the election. Of course they knew there was hacking but as far as the hacking specifically coming from Russia was disputed. Trump pushed back on the premise that it was Russia, saying that Clinton and the United States had “no idea whether it is Russia, China or anybody else.” Well, they did know with 100% certainty. The mistake to withhold conclusive proof was due to the simple fact that President Obama and the DNC were sure that Trump couldn't possibly win. Nobody thought he would win. Whether there was direct tampering with voting machines in some states, or whether there was voter intimidation, or whether there were votes not counted, it's all a moot point now because Trump won. There's no doubt that the DNC was also hacked, they've admitted it. But it was only Hillary and John Podesta's emails that were the vehicle Trump used to create hatred for Hillary Clinton and move those people who had to plug their nose and choose a president to vote for Trump. It's pretty clear that Russia tilted the scales in Trump's favor and for very good reason as we're seeing from his cabinet choices.

By being overly confident in Hillary's win, by not forcing the issue about Russian interference, by not proving to the public that hackers were spreading lies, they let Russia and Trump get away with this and it's going to be a disaster for everyone. The Republicans will condemn 17 intelligence agencies and say they're all wrong, that the election wasn't fixed for Trump. I remember when Wikileaks just started to release Hillary Clinton's emails, Julian Assange was on Skype talking to some news agency and he looked into eye of the camera and calmly and coldly said "Hillary Clinton will never be president". He said it with such tangible surety that I got chills and knew at that minute that Trump was going to win, he was making certain of that.

Edited December 14, 2016 by Lunata

[KerleyQ]

11 hours ago, AntiBeeSpray said:

Yep and that's in part what's very frightening.

This is why I've finally landed on "yes, please, I'll take Pence."  I loathe Pence and every single policy position he holds.  But, I don't think he'll actively ignite a world war.  That's how low the bar is now, thanks to Orange Julius - just don't incite a world war.  

11 hours ago, Lunata said:

Oh that's just all part of the 'black hole' that Tony Schwartz said that Donald Trump is. The black hole that just can't be filled. Donald will probably have 'rallies' every week while he's President too. What can I say, the guy is a nut.

I wonder how long it will be before attendance at these victory rallies is mandatory, and we all have to call him Dear Leader.  I'll assume school will even be closed for the rallies.  It's not like Trump and the GOP want the population educated.  

11 hours ago, navelgazer said:

And ain't it a coinkydink that the same people -- the big old money fascists of the day who financed the German Nazi Party are the same people, the next generation on of course, set to benefit from Twitler.

About the book.   

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Is_a_Racket

The book.

https://archive.org/stream/WarIsARacket/WarIsARacket_djvu.txt

I am so stealing "Twitler."  

10 hours ago, statsgirl said:

Some of the media did try. Every day, after every speech, Daniel Dale would tweet out how many lies Trump told (usually 30+) and why they were lies.

The problem is that this election is Post Truth.  If Trump hit the emotional nerve, people blocked out whether  it was true or not.

The Russia issue just gets worse and worse.  I belong to a group that sponsored a Syrian family. Since they arrived they've been desperate to get their Aleppo relatives out but every time the UN wanted a cease fire to get civilians out, Russia vetoed it.  On Saturday, her sister and three small children were buried in the rubble of their home and died.

And today,  Rex Tillerson, holder of the Russian Friendship Medal, will be the new Secretary of State.  It's setting the fox to guard the hen house (Putin must be thrilled) but worse, the rest of the world is also paying the price.

This is what drives me insane.  I can handle people having differing political views.  I'm not arrogant enough to think that everyone should think exactly how I do.  That's fine.  But the complete refusal to differentiate fact from fiction makes me want to pull my hair out.  No matter how many times the truth is pointed out or the lie is corrected, they just keep carrying on with the lie. 

10 hours ago, izabella said:

That doesn't have to happen.  The Senate gets a chance to reject him during the Confirmation hearings.  The Senate can stop this from happening.  The Democrats are only outnumbered by a few, so if John McCain can get outraged enough to bring some other Republicans with him, they can stop Tillerson from being SOS. 

Of course, Trump will then manage to find someone else who is worse, somehow, so we're screwed either way.

I've read that there are at least 3 Republican Senators who are firmly in the "no" camp on Tillerson.  Rubio, Graham, and Paul seem to be pretty solid on going against him.  McCain... I'd like to think he'll stay firmly "no."  He tends to get wishy washy and follow the party line a lot, but once they trip his moral trigger on something, he'll stand up.  I think this Russia issue is hitting his moral trigger, so I don't think he'll just roll over to confirm Putin's BFF to the most significant cabinet position.  I don't think he'll want to roll over and let Putin take charge.  (Plus, he's at the end of his career.  He doesn't need to fear the "RINO" (or, to put it in the terms of the Trump cult, "cuck") label at this point.)  

9 hours ago, Padma said:

Based on what he's saying about his business, it's impossible to imagine Trump won't be in violation of the emolument's clause on Day One.

That is a REQUIREMENT of the Constitution, the highest law of the land. Why isn't it a bigger deal if Trump is breaking the law on the first day of his presidency (and every day afterwards until he truly divests (inc. the DC hotel) and has independent trustees watching over something like T-bills for him.

He will be breaking the law from day 1. How is this not a bigger deal?

This just confuses me to no end.  I know the GOP is partisan as fuck, but this is blatant, black and white stuff we're talking about here.  This isn't questionable.  They have no cover here to pretend it was a gray area or that the issue was never proved, especially with the D.C. hotel lease.  It's clear - no elected official can be a party to the lease.  As soon as he's sworn in, it's illegal.  The emolument clause is clear.  But the businesses he owns are being treated preferentially by other countries, even before he's sworn in.  Officials in other countries are scheduling events at his properties and staying in his properties when they come to the US, because, in their own words, it would be rude to stay with one of his competitors.  He's going to be financially enriched by foreign officials on a regular basis.  Not to mention that his hotels are basically going to become state run hotels once he takes office.  

Of course, the GOP has their eyes on the Supreme Court.  Trump could start murdering and eating babies right now, and they'd roll with it because they want that open spot.  They have no moral boundary that will stand in their way.  

8 hours ago, Duke Silver said:

^^^ Did you watch the Bernie Sanders town hall thingy in Wisconsin last night?  Responses from the Trump voters panel there make it pretty clear:  they don't care what Trump says or does, apparently.  They only care about what they make up in their own minds about what he's gonna do for them individually.  This conformed perfectly w/ my encounters w/ Trump supporters.

I've seen more than one interview this week with Trump voters who are like "oh, he's not really going to repeal Obamacare."  It's like whatever he said he'd do that they like, they're convinced he was being honest.  Anything he said he'd do that they don't like, they're convinced he was just exaggerating.  One woman I saw in these interviews works signing people up for the ACA, so it's literally why she has a job.  She said "oh, he won't repeal it.  He can't.  People have to have insurance."  Um, idiot?  Do you remember WHY we needed to implement the ACA?  Because people didn't have insurance, and the GOP was just fine with that state off affairs.  The only people who pushed for this kind of change were Democrats, most notably, Hillary and President Obama.  But this woman voted or the man who said he would take away the ACA, so not only will it be proven that, no, according to the GOP, people don't have to have insurance, but she'll lose her job.  How do people get to this level of stupid?   If a candidate says that it's on their agenda to get rid of something that is necessary to me (my source of income, my health care, food, water), I'm not going to roll the dice and vote for them, hoping they were lying about that.  I'm going to take them at their word.  

[Jediknight]

2 hours ago, candall said:

I hope you're right, but that's a slender braid from which to dangle the fate of the country.  I wouldn't even bother to lift my eyebrow at fresh video of Rubio trucking through the gilded lobby of TT.  McCain has declined multiple opportunities to defy DT when that opposition would have seemed automatic and so far, he has surprised and disappointed.

The FBI pre-confirmation investigative assessment of Tillinger should be about 147 pages of valid reasons why he's unsuitable, so we'll see whether there's a finally a place the line will be drawn, or whether the whole country is available for purchase.

Graham is a guarantee I'd say.  He's fought Trump the whole way, hell he's been leading the charge.  This is McCain's last run in all likelihood, so he doesn't have to worry about getting elected again, he's been fighting against Trump and his ties to Russia, it seems he's gotten his political balls back.  Rubio right away blasted Tillerson as a choice, so there's hope.

Another thing to consider is Trump's approval rating.  Trump will be going in with a horrible approval rating, some people who voted for Trump are starting to think it was a bad idea, and the CIA leak about Russia has hurt Trump even more.  Trump will always have his diehard supporters, but cracks are forming in his base, and the GOP may see a chance to strike against him.

As for the FBI, Reid is calling for an investigation into Comey to see if he colluded with Trump.  I'd say it's pretty safe to say that Comey did, Guilliani pretty much admitted it on Fox News.

[Pixel]

So, I keep reading that Michael Moore thinks it's likely that Trump won't even make it to inaugeration.  Normally, I wouldn't put much stock in speculation like that, but Moore has really been on top of all things Trump.  So, assuming this is actually possible - what does that look like?  Does it automatically go to Pence if something takes out the Donald prior to inaugeration? If he quits?  

And if (which I know this would never in a  million years happen) another election was held due to tampering, how would that even work?  Would they call back the pollsters and give everyone the day off to go out and vote again?

8 minutes ago, KerleyQ said:

I've seen more than one interview this week with Trump voters who are like "oh, he's not really going to repeal Obamacare."  It's like whatever he said he'd do that they like, they're convinced he was being honest.  Anything he said he'd do that they don't like, they're convinced he was just exaggerating.  One woman I saw in these interviews works signing people up for the ACA, so it's literally why she has a job.  She said "oh, he won't repeal it.  He can't.  People have to have insurance."  Um, idiot?  Do you remember WHY we needed to implement the ACA?  Because people didn't have insurance, and the GOP was just fine with that state off affairs.  The only people who pushed for this kind of change were Democrats, most notably, Hillary and President Obama.  But this woman voted or the man who said he would take away the ACA, so not only will it be proven that, no, according to the GOP, people don't have to have insurance, but she'll lose her job.  How do people get to this level of stupid?   If a candidate says that it's on their agenda to get rid of something that is necessary to me (my source of income, my health care, food, water), I'm not going to roll the dice and vote for them, hoping they were lying about that.  I'm going to take them at their word.  

Many Christians have plenty of practice doing just this - they cherry pick the parts of the Bible they like and pretend the other parts don't mean what they say or just don't exist.

[sistermagpie]

8 minutes ago, KerleyQ said:

But this woman voted or the man who said he would take away the ACA, so not only will it be proven that, no, according to the GOP, people don't have to have insurance, but she'll lose her job.  How do people get to this level of stupid?   If a candidate says that it's on their agenda to get rid of something that is necessary to me (my source of income, my health care, food, water), I'm not going to roll the dice and vote for them, hoping they were lying about that.  I'm going to take them at their word.  

There are some Trump voters who seem like they'd shoot themselves in the face if somebody told them that as a result a single child of an undocumented immigrant would go to bed hungry.

1 minute ago, Pixel said:

So, I keep reading that Michael Moore thinks it's likely that Trump won't even make it to inaugeration.  Normally, I wouldn't put much stock in speculation like that, but Moore has really been on top of all things Trump.  

What's funny about that is based on everything he's already done if we were still living in a reasonable period of history (not so long ago!) it would seem like a very natural thing to expect. The guy was already unqualified. Then he loses the popular vote by a large margin. Then he starts international incidents not helpful to the US. Then he starts blatantly using the presidency to make money for businesses that make for conflicts of interest he has no intention of dropping. Then he trashes the CIA and his surrogates announce plans to basically dismantle the intelligence community to replace it with sycophants.

I mean, surely the general reaction to this situation at most periods of history would be "Oh wait, this obviously can't happen." 

[Chicken Wing]

Quote

If a candidate says that it's on their agenda to get rid of something that is necessary to me (my source of income, my health care, food, water), I'm not going to roll the dice and vote for them, hoping they were lying about that.  I'm going to take them at their word.  

This. I do not get this mentality that so many voters seemed to have, of voting for someone based on the assumption that they won't do what they said. When did we get to that point of non-logic? (Probably around the same time that the standard of proof became acceptance of baseless facts until they are proven false.) Maybe I'm just weird with all my highfalutin thinking and using ma brain and whatnot, but typically we should be moved to vote for a candidate based on the assumption that they will do what they say, and if they win, hope that they actually follow through with X and Y. What kind of nonsense world makes people vote for someone on the assumption that they don't mean what they say, and if they win, hope that they don't actually follow through on X and Y? "I don't like the mean and distasteful things you say, I don't care for the positions you stand for and I disagree with what you claim you're going to do, so I'm going to vote for you on the basis that, maybe, just maybe, you don't actually mean any of it and won't actually do anything." Um. Yeah. So, if you disagree with what a person says, don't like what they stand for and do not wish to happen the things they say they will make happen, then, um, why the ever-loving fuck did you vote for them???