S01.E04: The Pool

[PRgal]

14 hours ago, miracole said:

Kate should not have had on that bikini...because she's 8.  Who lets an 8 year-old parade around in a bikini?!

 

THIS, too!  I didn't buy my first bikini until I was at least twice that age!!!  And I only them a few times in my life.  I still live in one pieces or tankinis (I LOVE tankinis!)

[topanga]

9 hours ago, ribboninthesky1 said:

I'll agree to disagree.  To me, the point isn't whether the black kids that day were new to him (and I don't know whether the notebook was used for every NEW black person he met, or just every black person he interacted with) - it's that he seemed to know there would be black kids there, so that indicated to me that the family had been there before.  I'm also inferring that it wasn't Yvette's first time there, either, since she knew who Rebecca was. I watched that scene again - Yvette wasn't initially rude.  Rebecca came through, completely ignoring Yvette literally standing right there watching the kids, asking what Randall was doing there. Um...safely playing with some kids?  I don't think Rebecca was mean-spirited about it, but I got why Yvette was snarky with her.          

 

1 hour ago, Neurochick said:

Yvette and Rebecca's meetup at the pool, looked like two people who don't speak the same language trying to communicate.  

It seemed like a big miscommunication, as Neurochick said. Rebecca was panicky because she couldn't find Randall, but it probably sounded to DearYvette that Rebecca was horrified that Randall was playing there--with the black people. 

I grew up with several adopted black children and biracial children who only lived with their white parents, and even in high school, the kids (and their parents) were clueless about things like how to comb their hair, when to put on lotion, and why they probably shouldn't wash their hair every day. They learned these things only when they were exposed to other black kids--and black parents. 

 

On 10/19/2016 at 6:00 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I remember when I read Jacob Have I Loved, the main character's issue was similar to Kevin's

This remains one of my favorite books from childhood. In fact, I still read it from time to time. 

Learning more about Kevin's background story made me sympathize with his adult character. I still find him whiny and self-centered, but I understand him a little better.

All of the child actors are very talented. My only lament is that young Randall looks nothing like SKB. I suppose TPTB had to hire the best kids for the job, but little Kate still looks like Kate, and young Kevin still looks like Kevin. The child playing Randall has different hair, a different nose, and a different skin tone. It's not enough to take me out of the story, but I shake my head every once in while. I just hope the showrunners realize the two actors look nothing alike and picked the young boy because he was the best actor for the part. I hope I never hear that people "didn't notice" that young Randall and SKB look nothing alike. 

 

Quote

23 HOURS AGO, MTLCHICK SAID:

And because it cannot be said enough, Sterling is AMAZING.  I now must watch The People Vs OJ because his speech to William at the store floored me.  And then I laughed when he said "now try on the damn slim cut flat front chinos."

23 hours ago, ClareWalks said:

His delivery was perfect, and the fact that he got out that tongue-twister of a line was impressive in itself. I'd have required 10 takes just to not flub the pronunciation.

I know, right? Kudos to you, SKB. 

It reminds me of the episode where Beth asks Randall how long his drug addict bio dad was going to stay in their daughter's bedroom--or something like that. A line that definitely required practice and great enunciation. 

[ChromaKelly]

7 hours ago, Bama said:

Yeah, Yvette may have had good intentions but she was so snarky and aggressive and critical right off the bat that I was impressed that Rebecca was able to go back and speak to her.

Take the minefield of interracial adoption out for a second and imagine a perfect stranger coming right out and aggressively being critical of the way you care for your child.  As a mother, I would be all "Bitch?  Who asked you?  Back the fuck off!".  Now add in the racial aspect and I can't imagine how attacked and and defensive and insecure Rebecca must have felt.

When my oldest was a baby, he would NOT let a pair of socks stay on his feet, no matter how cold it was. We were at Target one day and this woman - total stranger - came up to me and chided me for "Letting that baby out of the house with bare feet" and berated me that he was going to catch and cold and a mother shouldn't do something like that.  I was stunned and speechless that she felt she had the right to even comment.  I barely mumbled something about his hatred of socks and walked away.  Later, I hated myself for not firing back at her about it being none of her business and for not knowing that you don't catch colds from being cold and telling her to basically fuck off.

Yvette could have handled Rebecca with a warm introduction and asking about how Randall came to be her child and offering to give her any advice - if she wanted it - about raising a black child.  Obviously since Rebecca came back to her to ask her questions, Rebecca was hungry for some guidance on such things but maybe she didn't know anyone to ask or thought people might think less of her for asking.

I know the writers were using Yvette's antagonism as a plot device to highlight the issues that can come with interracial adoption but man, her attitude flew all over me and had me feeling protective of Rebecca lol. Maybe that's what they intended.  But I wanted to smack her.

I find it interesting that so many people are feeling this way. Maybe because I am a white adoptive mother of a black child, I'm not seeing it. Almost every WAP mom has had a black woman come up and give hair care advice. Whether it's handing them the card of their braider, barber, a product recommendation, or even more direct and saying "his hair looks dry".  I am totally not trying to speak for black women here (and, black women in this thread, please let me know if I'm off-base), but there's more of a "village" approach. Randall is seen as one of theirs, even if he's being raised by white people. Therefore, it is absolutely Yvette's place to make sure he's being cared for properly. Every so often a WAP comes into the adoption group online and says how rude a black woman was to her about her child (usually it's hair related). Then they'll post a picture and yeah, the hair's a mess. Listen to her.
There are times when I feel incredibly insecure as a white mom raising a black boy. When he was standing on chairs at the barbershop, and I'm all white mom "seats are for sitting, please sit down sweetie" and then one of the barbers says firmly "sit down" and he sits. Yeah. Or when he goes out of the house in some crappy shirt with stains, crocs, and I realize his pants are inside out, and there's lint in his hair, and all the other black boys look all nice and put together.

*Maybe we should have a thread for the issues and themes of this show, like adoption, weight, race, etc.

 

[GodsBeloved]

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Therefore, it is absolutely Yvette's place to make sure he's being cared for properly. 

If this was Yvette's perspective, when she saw that Rebecca had no intention of introducing herself to the black folks she should have been the one making introductions. I don't get the feeling anyone has an issue with Yvette sharing information, just her condescending attitude. 

[Lady Calypso]

42 minutes ago, ChromaKelly said:

I find it interesting that so many people are feeling this way. Maybe because I am a white adoptive mother of a black child, I'm not seeing it. Almost every WAP mom has had a black woman come up and give hair care advice. Whether it's handing them the card of their braider, barber, a product recommendation, or even more direct and saying "his hair looks dry".  I am totally not trying to speak for black women here (and, black women in this thread, please let me know if I'm off-base), but there's more of a "village" approach. Randall is seen as one of theirs, even if he's being raised by white people. Therefore, it is absolutely Yvette's place to make sure he's being cared for properly. Every so often a WAP comes into the adoption group online and says how rude a black woman was to her about her child (usually it's hair related). Then they'll post a picture and yeah, the hair's a mess. Listen to her.
There are times when I feel incredibly insecure as a white mom raising a black boy. When he was standing on chairs at the barbershop, and I'm all white mom "seats are for sitting, please sit down sweetie" and then one of the barbers says firmly "sit down" and he sits. Yeah. Or when he goes out of the house in some crappy shirt with stains, crocs, and I realize his pants are inside out, and there's lint in his hair, and all the other black boys look all nice and put together.

*Maybe we should have a thread for the issues and themes of this show, like adoption, weight, race, etc.

 

For me, I don't think that the issue lies fully with her telling Rebecca about the barber. For me, it's Yvette's initial attitude before giving the advice. She was just so incredibly hostile toward Rebecca, with that almost pompous attitude toward Rebecca as a parent to Randall. Yvette was making assumptions about Rebecca before they even met. The fact that she acted this way to Rebecca and then felt like she had to interject with the advice just made her seem condescending. If she hadn't talked to Rebecca the way that she did, then I think Rebecca would have been less hostile back. Luckily, things worked out and Rebecca swallowed her own pride to talk to Yvette again, but it made Rebecca look like the better person. I assume Yvette/Rebecca got quite close so they got over their issues, but Yvette was definitely in the wrong. 

Although, personally, I also feel like other parents need to be careful when they're giving advice to other parents. If it's done in the right way, then it's fine. But it can't be done in a condescending "I know better than you and I'm judging you for your parenting skills" attitude. Luckily, Yvette's intentions were good and she was giving genuine advice to Rebecca, who was clueless. She wasn't blaming Rebecca for her not knowing about the haircut in that particular moment, so that's why I can say that I was fine with it. She could have continued to be condescending with the barber advice, but she didn't. I think that helped Rebecca to approach her later on in the episode. But it was just the timing and Yvette's initial attitude that made her seem worse than I assume she is. 

Edited October 20, 2016 by Lady Calypso

[mojito]

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Am I the only one who actually doesn't feel like Randall's dad did the wrong thing in giving him up?

Interesting that you should ask that question. If you'd asked me, I would've guessed that most people here thought that William had done the right thing, that he knew he was in no position to raise the boy.

Edited October 20, 2016 by mojito

[ChromaKelly]

1 hour ago, GodsBeloved said:

If this was Yvette's perspective, when she saw that Rebecca had no intention of introducing herself to the black folks she should have been the one making introductions. I don't get the feeling anyone has an issue with Yvette sharing information, just her condescending attitude. 

I see what you all are saying about how she came across. Yvette was making the point that they have noticed Rebecca and Randall, but the black families have been invisible to Rebecca. Randall noticed them (that's why he wanted to go to that particular pool).  But in however many times they have been to that pool, Rebecca never bothered. Granted, she's a mom of three children all the same age, and maybe Yvette doesn't realize that either.
Anyway, I feel like the onus is on the adoptive parent to seek out racial mirrors and build bridges. However, I also have the luxury of living in the time of Internet and Facebook groups and such, so it is easier to do these things and learn.

[Neurochick]

I think the encounter between Rebecca and Yvette, two people speaking a different language trying to communicate, paralleled with Randall watching his daughter in the school play.  See, Rebecca was just concerned because her son was where she could not see him; but Yvette might have heard, "I don't want my son playing over HERE, with YOU people." 

When Randall watched his daughter in the school play, he saw white people laughing, he assumed they were laughing because his black daughter was playing Snow White.  Was Randall correct in his assumption?  Was Yvette correct in hers?  It depends on who is watching.  I felt that Randall was projecting his feelings on the audience, maybe they were laughing as parents do, because the kids are cute, when he looked at his wife and his father, they too were laughing.  A few years ago I went to a performance of Madame Butterfly at the NY City Opera and the woman singing Suzuki was black, a fact that didn't seem to phase anybody in the audience. 

Just want to say how much I adore Sterling K. Brown; every time I see him I remember the first thing I saw him in, as Gordon in "Supernatural."

Edited October 20, 2016 by Neurochick

[ShadowFacts]

16 minutes ago, Neurochick said:

When Randall watched his daughter in the school play, he saw white people laughing, he assumed they were laughing because his black daughter was playing Snow White.  Was Randall correct in his assumption?  Was Yvette correct in hers?  It depends on who is watching.  I felt that Randall was projecting his feelings on the audience, maybe they were laughing as parents do, because the kids are cute, when he looked at his wife and his father, they too were laughing.  A few years ago I went to a performance of Madame Butterfly at the NY City Opera and the woman singing Suzuki was black, a fact that didn't seem to phase anybody in the audience. 

I felt really uncomfortable watching that, it's almost certain that some were laughing at, not with the black Snow White, and that wasn't Randall projecting.  Beth and William were perhaps not focused on that, they were smiling and laughing in adoration, the way parents and grandparents do.  Given what we saw at the pool, and Randall's being drawn to the black kids, it will be interesting to see how he and Beth handle the whole question of being in what looks like a pretty white enclave.  Randall alluded to it a little bit, saying to William that it's a great school and the parents like Beth are really involved, but I'll be interested to see more of what that looks like.

As to Rebecca and Yvette, they were both snappy, but each course-corrected in record time.  Would that we could all be so able to recognize our missteps and act to repair them. 

[ChromaKelly]

BTW I made a thread to discuss the social issues and themes of This Is Us. Might be a good place to delve deeper into these topics.

http://forums.previously.tv/topic/49415-this-is-our-social-issues-thread/#comment-2667581

[Artsda]

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See, Rebecca was just concerned because her son was where she could not see him; but Yvette might have heard, "I don't want my son playing over HERE, with YOU people." 

Rebecca outright told Yvette, that she was panicked because she didn't know where her son was and even politely introduced herself. Yvette then went on to be bitchy to her. Yvette knew that Rebecca was scared because she couldn't find her kid and it still didn't matter to her. 

[IntrovertGal]

I really loved this episode, they packed so much in it. This show is slowly turning into a must-watch show for me, the writing and acting are consistently strong. The scene when William calls Randall son for the first time made me tear up, those two actors are just killing it. SKB was phenomenal on American Crime Story and he is just as good on This Is Us. I'm happy that he finally gets the recognition he deserves. I felt so bad for Randall when people at the school play were laughing at his daughter for playing Snow White.

Glad that Milo got to shine a bit in this episode as well. I have always liked Milo as an actor, first on Gilmore Girls and then on Heroes. I guess I'm one of the few people here who loved the character of Jess on Gilmore Girls. ;)  That scene with Jack snuggling up with all three kids was so heartwarming and seeing Jack apologise to Kevin for not paying attention to him and giving his speech to Kate and telling her she was a princess, that was just great.

As someone who is interested in Kevin's storyline, I was also glad that we got some Kevin character development. No wonder he became an actor. I'm really curious to see how Kevin and Randall will interact as adults.

To be honest, I really disliked Toby in the first three episodes. He came across as overbearing and creepy to me. But I gotta admit that his speech to Kate in this episode rang true to me and that for once he did not creep me out, this time it was Kate with her stalking of Toby's ex. Toby had a point when he called it not sane.

[ZaldamoWilder]

2 hours ago, ChromaKelly said:

I see what you all are saying about how she came across. Yvette was making the point that they have noticed Rebecca and Randall, but the black families have been invisible to Rebecca. Randall noticed them (that's why he wanted to go to that particular pool).  But in however many times they have been to that pool, Rebecca never bothered. Granted, she's a mom of three children all the same age, and maybe Yvette doesn't realize that either.
Anyway, I feel like the onus is on the adoptive parent to seek out racial mirrors and build bridges. However, I also have the luxury of living in the time of Internet and Facebook groups and such, so it is easier to do these things and learn.

I don't even think she thinks it's that serious.   A mother of 3 eight year olds wouldn't consciously be thinking of Randall's blackness (until being confronted to) any more often than she's thinking of Kate's weight (until she sees her eat or in a bikini).   In fact, it doesn't look like she's going to a great deal of effort to remember that he's black at all and that may be the point.   Kevin's rant used the words *making sure Randall isn't too adopted*.   The family isn't focusing on the racial aspect of their children's differences.  Whether that's a good or bad thing or neither or both is an entirely separate discussion but in the meantime  I'm bothered by the idea that there is even an onus to Yvette for Rebecca's obligation to introduce herself.   She is not the damn Mayor of Uzeblackistahn, if she found it that deep, there wasn't anything preventing her from introducing HERself.  

1 hour ago, Neurochick said:

I think the encounter between Rebecca and Yvette, two people speaking a different language trying to communicate, paralleled with Randall watching his daughter in the school play.  See, Rebecca was just concerned because her son was where she could not see him; but Yvette might have heard, "I don't want my son playing over HERE, with YOU people." 

When Randall watched his daughter in the school play, he saw white people laughing, he assumed they were laughing because his black daughter was playing Snow White.  Was Randall correct in his assumption?  Was Yvette correct in hers?  It depends on who is watching.  I felt that Randall was projecting his feelings on the audience, maybe they were laughing as parents do, because the kids are cute, when he looked at his wife and his father, they too were laughing.  A few years ago I went to a performance of Madame Butterfly at the NY City Opera and the woman singing Suzuki was black, a fact that didn't seem to phase anybody in the audience. 

Just want to say how much I adore Sterling K. Brown; every time I see him I remember the first thing I saw him in, as Gordon in "Supernatural."

From what we saw, the only way she could've justifiably assumed this is if she already had her ass on her shoulders.   After screaming her son's name, moving swiftly on a wet surface and turning this way and that, Yvette could've stopped Rebecca's panic in its tracks, since we're talking about motherly obligations n' all.    She already knew Rebecca on sight and that she was Randall's mother but does nothing to gesture to this worry stricken woman that her baby's fine and in her care.   Every woman on this board mom or no, knows that the number one question to ask a baby who wanders over to you is:   honey where is your mommy?    Rebecca said he's not supposed to be over here, which given the context that Yvette literally saw unfold, could not possibly be interpreted as a racial slight, unless she was an asshole.   And just in case she was an asshole, Rebecca doubled back to clarify that "here" meant out of her line of vision, not "with ya'll".     As was mentioned upthread, I realize Yvette's initial protagonism is intentional and important to the plot, but it's also super shitty that she decided Rebecca's penance for not paying a debt she doesn't owe is the sanctimommy act.    

Edited October 20, 2016 by ZaldamoWilder
fingers faster than brain...switching to decaf

[Tiger]

My fucking affiliate interrupted the show five times.  Four NBC came back from commercial, and then the affiliate broke in with a local promo, twcie for their morning news team and twice, and ironically, thanking my market for making it the # 1 show in the market.  Then at end they literally cut off Rebeca mid-sentence, apparantly cut a scene with Kevin coming to Randall's house, the promos for next and the beginning of Chicago Fire, just for the meterologist to talk anout cooler weather this weekend.  

Anyway, Milo is fit as fuck.  I love that he isnt orange, roided, or have tattoos.  

I have to agree with Kate and Josie that what Kate was doing was research.  I was appalled that Kate had to ask Toby's permission to keep that folio.  And I dont believe thats the whole story of his divorce.  

Another unpopular opinion is that I found Randall very whiney.  People that see everything through the prisim of race are always projecting their issues onto others and taking some moral superior position when truly they are the ones being judgmental.  

I dont like the saintification of William.  The man was a drug addict who abandon him kid at a fire station.   Now he was a civil rights activist, he braids hair, he literally smells the roses . . . its way too much.

Rebecca should have smacked Yvette so hard that she landed at a fire station in Chicago in 2016.  She also should have said something to the parents of the little bitches who wrote that note. 

I wish they were showing us this bond between Kate & Kevin when were kids.  I also wish they were using kid actors that at least possibly resembled Hartley and Brown.   That said, the kid Kevin actor nailed the "Kevin is dead" line.

[QueBueno]

Never mind, y'all! 

Edited October 21, 2016 by QueBueno
'cause tons of people have mentioned Yvette.

[roughing it]

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The white audience laughing during Snow White was cringe worthy and sad. It seems only Randall picked up on that.

I got the impression that Randall was imagining the audience was laughing at his child, when they were really just enjoying the play.

[PRgal]

2 hours ago, Neurochick said:

I think the encounter between Rebecca and Yvette, two people speaking a different language trying to communicate, paralleled with Randall watching his daughter in the school play.  See, Rebecca was just concerned because her son was where she could not see him; but Yvette might have heard, "I don't want my son playing over HERE, with YOU people." 

When Randall watched his daughter in the school play, he saw white people laughing, he assumed they were laughing because his black daughter was playing Snow White.  Was Randall correct in his assumption?  Was Yvette correct in hers?  It depends on who is watching.  I felt that Randall was projecting his feelings on the audience, maybe they were laughing as parents do, because the kids are cute, when he looked at his wife and his father, they too were laughing.  A few years ago I went to a performance of Madame Butterfly at the NY City Opera and the woman singing Suzuki was black, a fact that didn't seem to phase anybody in the audience. 

Just want to say how much I adore Sterling K. Brown; every time I see him I remember the first thing I saw him in, as Gordon in "Supernatural."

I think people tend to suspend belief in opera - I've seen a black singer perform Butterfly (what I'd LOVE to see is a Caucasian Butterfly and an Asian Pinkerton).    

[BonnieD]

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When Randall watched his daughter in the school play, he saw white people laughing, he assumed they were laughing because his black daughter was playing Snow White.  Was Randall correct in his assumption?  Was Yvette correct in hers?  It depends on who is watching.  I felt that Randall was projecting his feelings on the audience, maybe they were laughing as parents do, because the kids are cute, when he looked at his wife and his father, they too were laughing.  

Glad to hear your perspective on that moment. I was really annoyed, thinking "what adults in this day and age would laugh about something like that? It's an unrealistic device put in to illustrate what Randall has to put up with." It makes more sense that it was just him projecting because, you're right, his wife and father were smiling and laughing too. That makes me feel entirely better about the scene, which was the one sour note for me in the whole show.

I dearly love this series, one of only a few I've added to my line up. It has all the best parts of Parenthood without the annoying parts, ie. Braverman domineering and self centered clannishness. Every character has something to offer in This Is Us. I don't find Kevin's story the weakest link but quite interesting. I can't wait to see him grow as a character because he has the farthest to go, and I really appreciated seeing the root of his need for attention.

That Toby sure is a polarizing character for fans, isn't he? I like him and think he had every right to finally snap at Kate about something. He's been trying so hard to be supportive but its always about her and her issues. She never stopped to wonder if he might have some of his own.

[topanga]

1 hour ago, roughing it said:

I got the impression that Randall was imagining the audience was laughing at his child, when they were really just enjoying the play.

I could feel Randall's discomfort at that moment. But then he saw that Beth and William were also chuckling- He was still a little uneasy, but perhaps it eased his mind that the audience thought it was cute and funny to watch this little black girl call herself "Snow White" and for the boy to call her "fair." And the kids were unaware that there was anything ironic or funny about it. As Randall said later, he loved that his daughter saw nothing strange about playing a character named "Snow White." 

[ShadowFacts]

37 minutes ago, BonnieD said:

Glad to hear your perspective on that moment. I was really annoyed, thinking "what adults in this day and age would laugh about something like that? It's an unrealistic device put in to illustrate what Randall has to put up with." It makes more sense that it was just him projecting because, you're right, his wife and father were smiling and laughing too. That makes me feel entirely better about the scene, which was the one sour note for me in the whole show.

There was no dialogue, so we're left to interpret what Randall thought and of course there's always more than one interpretation.  My own is that he was thinking along the lines of, what have I done?  Is this the right place for my little girls?  There would be no way for anyone to know why each individual was laughing, and even if asked, who would say other than that the kids were cute?  As to how many adults in this day and age would laugh about something like that?  I don't know how many, but I know there are some -- there was a Trump rally a stone's throw from our place, and from the t-shirts and what some of the supporters were saying for the news camera, they exist, yes, indeed they do.

[Randomosity]

On 10/19/2016 at 3:20 AM, pennben said:

He told Kate tonight that the divorce destroyed him and that is when he gained the weight (95 pounds, I think he said).  That turned on a light bulb for me.  He used to be married, successful, whatever, but also 100 pounds less than he is now. 

Not exactly. He's already been established to have been losing weight while Kate is not (ep 2?). So he wasn't 100 lbs less than now, he was 100 lbs less than whatever his highest weight was, which is not now. He may already have lost 75 of the 95. Losing another 20 still has him overweight. So while obviously a gain of 95 lbs is a big deal, we don't know for sure he wasn't already some degree of overweight before that large gain.

On 10/19/2016 at 1:19 PM, romantic idiot said:

About the episode, I learnt one interesting thing - that apparently black people need sunscreen. Because I'm brown and i don't need it all, except when up in mountains, and that too only on my nose. The folks here use sunscreen wear it to keep from getting darker, not because it's needed.  I like learning new stuff like this.

Public service announcement: Skin needs sunscreen. All skin colors. Skin cancer may get pale people more often, but it gets everyone. As does premature aging. You can get one without the other - different wavelengths of UV radiation cause visible burns vs aging vs damage that leads to cancer. Just because you're not visibly pink and peeling doesn't mean invisible damage hasn't been done. Additionally, UV goes through clouds! Just because less visible light gets through clouds doesn't mean that there's no UV - use sunscreen on cloudy days too.

And it's not just humans either - dog owners, you puppers' noses can get burned badly if they're outside often in the sun. Protect them too!

On 10/19/2016 at 1:21 PM, izabella said:

The one thing that rang false to me was the sunscreen stuff.  The 80's were not a time when sunscreen was popular.  In fact, there was very low SPF on sunscreen back then, in many cases it was marketing as sun tan oil to help you get a "deep, dark, savage tan!"  And a lot of people used baby oil AND those aluminum things to fry to a crisp.  Rebecca would not have been wearing a long sleeve shirt at the pool - she'd have been tanning, on purpose.

Born in '82, and we were suncreened up for beach days, sports games, swimming pool days, etc. We didn't reapply every few minutes like you're told to now, but we put it on at least once or twice. Once I hit my 20s, I upped my useage immensely. Always when outside, and even my daily moisturizer is SPF 35. Keeps wrinkles, age spots, and cancer at bay.

As for other things, I find it funny that so many people here loved young Kevin's line about 'what about Kevin, he's dead!'  I do like the sentiment, but it stuck out as awkward to me. The kid said 'meanwhile'. In my experience, 8-year olds are not often that articulate, especially when blurting out highly charged emotional words. So while the line could have been great, it didn't sit right with me because of wording.

I'm intrigued by the mention of another kid, and am now wondering if there's another sibling somewhere, or if they lost another baby, or if that divide is what led to a possible split between the parents.

[femmefan1946]

FWIW- My creative writing class is watching This Is Us as part of our study of how scenes and beats work. The prof referred to Toby as being a Manic Pixie Fat Guy, which is probably fair based on the first three episodes, although this one gave him more depth.

That he gained weight late in life makes sense since the actor appears to be an overweight mesomorph, while Kate is an endomorph. (Child Kevin is an ectomorph).

I was sorta glad that Yvette was bitchy to Kate. At least she is not starting out as the Magic Negro, which I worry that William may be turning into- not just a poet and a dreamer, but also a civil rights activist. Okay.

Any idea where Jack and Kate are getting enough money to raise triplets on?

[Tiger]

I thought it was interesting that Kevin told broadway brit that he didnt have family in Pittsburg when theyve established Rebecca as still living there.

If Jack is still alive, then I wonder if maybe Kevin, Kate, and Randall not having the same information; something like Kevin & Kate think Jack started drinking because Rebecca cheated on him, but Randall thinks Jack's drinking drove Rebecca away, and the truth is somewhere in between and a lot more complicated.

Edited October 20, 2016 by Tiger

[Aloeonatable]

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I guess I'm one of the few people here who loved the character of Jess on Gilmore Girls. ;) 

Table for two. IMO you don't have to "like" the character to appreciate and like the character and what he/she brings to the show. 

[topanga]

15 minutes ago, Tiger said:

I thought it was interesting that Kevin told broadway brit that he didnt have family in Pittsburg when theyve established Rebecca as still living there.

If Jack is still alive, then I wonder if maybe Kevin, Kate, and Randall not having the same information; something like Kevin & Kate think Jack started drinking because Rebecca cheated on him, but Randall thinks Jack's drinking drove Rebecca away, and the truth is somewhere in between and a lot more complicated.

Does she still live there? Pittsburgh to Northern Jersey is a six hour drive. She and Miguel arrived early in the morning. Would they really have driven all night just to stop by to say hello to Randall? And to go to lunch in Manhattan? 

If Rebecca does still live there, maybe that means she and Kevin are estranged. 

[Tiger]

2 hours ago, topanga said:

Does she still live there? Pittsburgh to Northern Jersey is a six hour drive. She and Miguel arrived early in the morning. Would they really have driven all night just to stop by to say hello to Randall? And to go to lunch in Manhattan? 

If Rebecca does still live there, maybe that means she and Kevin are estranged. 

Im pretty sure Randall told William "that [his] mother still lives in house [he] grew up in." 

[KaveDweller]

42 minutes ago, Tiger said:

Im pretty sure Randall told William "that [his] mother still lives in house [he] grew up in." 

I don't remember him saying that.  Wasn't that part of the line that was deleted from the pilot (according to posts in last week's thread)? Because if the line was deleted it may be because of timing, but it could also be that the show changed their minds about where Rebecca lived.

[ShadowFacts]

3 hours ago, topanga said:

Does she still live there? Pittsburgh to Northern Jersey is a six hour drive. She and Miguel arrived early in the morning. Would they really have driven all night just to stop by to say hello to Randall? And to go to lunch in Manhattan? 

If Rebecca does still live there, maybe that means she and Kevin are estranged. 

I am also confused as to William.  They all started out in Pittsburgh.  But Randall found him in Philadelphia, per the address in the email that he got from the investigator.  Yet, when they showed Rebecca going to see him while Jack took the babies to the doctor, his table and window looked a lot like the one we saw him sitting at in Philadelphia when Randall went to him.  I could be wrong about that, I'm not extremely good at catching details.  But I remember thinking, oh that looks similar to where he ended up in Philadelphia. 

[Squirrely]

5 hours ago, ShadowFacts said:

There was no dialogue, so we're left to interpret what Randall thought and of course there's always more than one interpretation.  My own is that he was thinking along the lines of, what have I done?  Is this the right place for my little girls?  There would be no way for anyone to know why each individual was laughing, and even if asked, who would say other than that the kids were cute?  As to how many adults in this day and age would laugh about something like that?  I don't know how many, but I know there are some -- there was a Trump rally a stone's throw from our place, and from the t-shirts and what some of the supporters were saying for the news camera, they exist, yes, indeed they do.

Re: the bolded, that's how I was reading it. When they were all walking in, it sounded like he was convincing himself instead of informing William. It felt like we were to wonder if Randall's kids could fill a notebook with marks.

 

I'm the same age as the Big 3 and my mom definitely slathered sunscreen on us for swimming. I can't recall her doing it at other times, but she may have. 

I really love this show! It's all I could do to read the thread and keep up so I could make it to the end and post. My only really issue thus far is that we're to believe Randall and Beth's home only has 3 bedrooms. Oh, and that a woman who was apparently EBF (exclusively breastfeeding) triplets ever has a minute without a newborn on her boob, and could leave for 4 hours. ;) 

Edited October 21, 2016 by Squirrely

[Arcadiasw]

7 hours ago, ZaldamoWilder said:

  Whether that's a good or bad thing or neither or both is an entirely separate discussion but in the meantime  I'm bothered by the idea that there is even an onus to Yvette for Rebecca's obligation to introduce herself.   She is not the damn Mayor of Uzeblackistahn, if she found it that deep, there wasn't anything preventing her from introducing HERself 

Agree completely and Lol on Uzeblackistahn. If we see Yvette again, I hope she's nicer and not so judgmental. 

[ZaldamoWilder]

14 minutes ago, Arcadiasw said:

Agree completely and Lol on Uzeblackistahn. If we see Yvette again, I hope she's nicer and not so judgmental. 

Lol.  trademark credit for that one actually belongs to a poster from our twop days whose screenname I don't remember.   I hope she giggled if she reads these threads.

[AdorkableSars]

Quote

Quote

Above all, I'm sort of stunned that 20 years ago (?!) Mandy Moore was singing "Candy."  She's knocking this out of the park right now. 

 

"Candy" is still one my jams to this day, gotta say!

This episode is the one that I have cried the most at. The scene with Jack and Kate at the pool where he gave her his shirt and told her she'd always be his princess just got me...I was a heavier child as well, and still struggle with my weight, and my dad is always so encouraging and supportive and sweet, and so I guess it was kind of like seeing my life on screen a bit. The whole family pool scene was really well done, I thought. The actors/actresses they got to play the young kids are great, and Milo and Mandy are phenomenal. 

Randall/Beth/William/the two adorable girls remains the storyline I'm probably the most invested in right now. All of the actors are just amazing (their scenes this week is where more of my tears came from). I really appreciate how ALL of the storylines have a perfect mix of comedy and drama though...well, I guess Adult Kevin's is still mostly comedic at this point, but it got me in the feels a bit seeing how cute he was with his nieces, and his reaction to William.

[possibilities]

On 10/18/2016 at 11:37 PM, memememe76 said:

That photo with the mother Rebecca befriended was kinda weird, as her child is missing in that photo. If I were Randall, it would be weird to hang a photo of your friend's mom and not the friend. 

I thought the same thing. Very strange.

I also thought it was a bit much to assume that the mean girls were embarrassed by Kate because she was "fat"-- they certainly didn't say so, that's just what her parents assumed. I thought maybe it was because her care bear bikini was "too babyish" for them-- like maybe they were trying to be cool, and thought care bears was for younger kids. Either way, I like young Kate a lot more than adult Kate. And I do appreciate that they don't show young Kate eating excessively.

I also thought the sudden decision to not face toward the pool after finding Randall, like once they found him they forgot about the other kids, was a bit much. I get the panic followed by relief when a missing kid is found, but still-- would they really let go of all vigilance at that point, or would they panic all over again because now they can't locate Kevin. Also, the lack of lifeguards notice Kevin "drowning" was more evidence that Kevin's dramatic bent was active. On the other hand, Randall grabbing and solving Kevin's rubik's cube while dissing Kevin's smarts showed that not all of the brotherly discord was coming from Kevin.

I enjoyed Jack's parenting, and the reference to him not drinking. Rebecca letting go of her defensiveness for Randall's sake was also good. And of course Beth and Randall can do no wrong. I can't get over the abandonment of William's cat, though.

[biakbiak]

12 minutes ago, possibilities said:

I thought the same thing. Very strange.

I also thought it was a bit much to assume that the mean girls were embarrassed by Kate because she was "fat"-- they certainly didn't say so, that's just what her parents assumed. I thought maybe it was because her care bear bikini was "too babyish" for them-- like maybe they were trying to be cool, and thought care bears was for younger kids. Either way, I like young Kate a lot more than adult Kate. And I do appreciate that they don't show young Kate eating excessively.

They drew a pig on the note that isn't subtle.

[miracole]

Quote

I dont like the saintification of William.  The man was a drug addict who abandon him kid at a fire station.   Now he was a civil rights activist, he braids hair, he literally smells the roses . . . its way too much.

From what they showed of William he was a good man who made some serious mistakes in his life.  But even as a drug addict whom abandoned his child, he apparently still wanted what was best for his child. After fighting a lot of his demons I don't have a problem with them showing that he's still a good man. 

I like that they showed Randall feeling a bit apprehensive at the play. Honestly he'll never know how many people were laughing and whispering at Snow white being black and how many were laughing and whispering because the kids were cute. Unfortunately, in real life there would no doubt be both of each in the audience. 

[kili]

Quote

 Also, the lack of lifeguards notice Kevin "drowning" was more evidence that Kevin's dramatic bent was active.

Children and adults do drown in pools with lifeguards. They don't always see everything. Parents need to keep an eye on kids like Kevin who can't swim. Even if they can swim, things can happen.

Quote

That photo with the mother Rebecca befriended was kinda weird, as her child is missing in that photo. If I were Randall, it would be weird to hang a photo of your friend's mom and not the friend. 

I'm probably jumping to conclusions, but my immediate thought was that the Yvette's child had died. The two families had become friends and when her child died, she kind of become an honorary godmother to Randall (and perhaps all the kids). It can go either way.

[romantic idiot]

9 hours ago, femmefan1946 said:

That he gained weight late in life makes sense since the actor appears to be an overweight mesomorph, while Kate is an endomorph. (Child Kevin is an ectomorph).

Huh?

[Schweedie]

9 hours ago, Randomosity said:

As for other things, I find it funny that so many people here loved young Kevin's line about 'what about Kevin, he's dead!'  I do like the sentiment, but it stuck out as awkward to me. The kid said 'meanwhile'. In my experience, 8-year olds are not often that articulate, especially when blurting out highly charged emotional words. So while the line could have been great, it didn't sit right with me because of wording.

That was actually the one thing that took me out of it a little bit - the 'meanwhile'. The rest of it, for me, was pitch perfect dramatical kid tantrum, but that word ruined it ever so slightly. Just go with 'but' or 'and'. (Which I know is a nitpick, but I'm a linguistics nerd who has studied language acquisition.)

I'm really enjoying this show and I thought this episode was the best one so far, and the flashback scenes are definitely my favourite ones. The kids are so freaking cute! (I keep thinking the kid who plays Randall looks a little bit like Dukie from the Wire in his earliest episodes, before he had a growth spurt.) I thought it was interesting when Rebecca asked "And what's up with Kevin lately?", because that implies that his attitude towards Randall is relatively new at this point.

And I wish we could see Jack in the present, if only so we can have Milo Ventimiglia and Sterling K Brown in the same scene. Never getting that would be such a waste.

[PRgal]

8 hours ago, kili said:

Children and adults do drown in pools with lifeguards. They don't always see everything. Parents need to keep an eye on kids like Kevin who can't swim. Even if they can swim, things can happen.

I'm probably jumping to conclusions, but my immediate thought was that the Yvette's child had died. The two families had become friends and when her child died, she kind of become an honorary godmother to Randall (and perhaps all the kids). It can go either way.

Or Yvette is Beth's mom.  I didn't get a good look.  Were there any girls in the group Randall was playing with (then again, to many boys that age, girls = GERMS!). 

[kili]

Quote

Or Yvette is Beth's mom.  

It's possible, but why wouldn't Beth be in the picture too? Wouldn't that make it even more bizarre? "Here is a picture of my family with my wife's mom who is consciously absent". Wouldn't he have a picture which included his wife at the same age? That's what I would do.

[luna1122]

Do we know Beth wasn't in the pic? We need a photo of the photo. All kinds of speculation around it!

[ShadowFacts]

31 minutes ago, kili said:

It's possible, but why wouldn't Beth be in the picture too? Wouldn't that make it even more bizarre? "Here is a picture of my family with my wife's mom who is consciously absent". Wouldn't he have a picture which included his wife at the same age? That's what I would do.

I think that Randall or Beth mentioned earlier on that they met when she was 19?  If I'm not mis-remembering, that would work against Yvette being her mother.

[luna1122]

I think they said they got married at 19. Been together 17 years. But they may have known each other all their lives. Or not.

[kili]

Quote

I think they said they got married at 19. Been together 17 years.

That's a little young for somebody who went to university to get married. Sure, it happens, but those are such busy years where people change a lot. As Kevin says "I'm sure there is a story there".

If Yvette is Beth's mother, it's a good thing they went to the pool that day.

[HeySandyStrange]

Don't quote me on this, but I could swear a few episodes ago Beth mentioned being with Randall since they were 19-indicating to me that's about when they met/started dating. I'm thinking they met in college and have been together ever since, but didn't get married right away.  Who knows, maybe Beth is adopted as well and they met at some group? I hope we get to see the Big 3's teenage and college years.

Still loving the show, and I'm finally getting into Kevin's storyline. I get that he was being a bit of a Hollywood douche at the audition, but British actress could get over herself as well. At the end of the day, they are people hired to repeat lines with some emoting thrown in, if they are good enough. Not trying to put down acting as a profession, but there was no need for the melodrama on her part imo.

[possibilities]

16 hours ago, biakbiak said:

They drew a pig on the note that isn't subtle.

I accept the artistic interpretation of the majority, which clearly declares it a pig. But my comment came from that fact that I thought it was a bear, as in her Care Bear bikini.

[ProudMary]

5 hours ago, luna1122 said:

Do we know Beth wasn't in the pic? We need a photo of the photo. All kinds of speculation around it!

Agreed!  This seems to be only a partial pic but it's a start.  The photo is from this ET article:
http://www.etonline.com/tv/200724_this_is_us_how_3_revelations_changed_everyone_s_lives_and_could_there_be_a_fourth_sibling/

[potatoradio]

Quote

Kate should not have had on that bikini...because she's 8.  Who lets an 8 year-old parade around in a bikini?!

*raises hand* Granted, this was many eons ago, but when I was eight, I wore my first bikini and so did one of my friends. Wearing a bikini at that age, to us, was about liking the print or color and just another fun thing to wear. It wasn't that different from wearing halter tops and shorts, which we also did. I didn't realize at age 8 that you were "supposed" to look a certain way to "be able to" wear a bikini. Ah, sweet innocence. It broke my heart when my niece, who was about 14 or 15 at the time, wore her first bikini and she was so anxious and nervous she kept taking her shirt off and on and almost didn't go in the water at first. And that was only on a private beach with family. The misogyny in this world...make it stop.

Oh...and how I used to wish it were true that sunburn "faded" into tan. Ha ha ha. I had that told to me so many times...oh, don't wear that geeky 15 SPF. Your second degree burn will TOTALLY FOR SURE fade to a gorgeous tan. Several tubes of Noxema and cans of Solarcaine later...

As much as I loved kid Kate and kid Kevin ("KEVEN IS DEAD". Bwahhh!), honestly, I'd be delighted with a pared down, concentrated Randall/Beth/adoptive parent/birth father show. I didn't know SKB was on "Army Wives" until someone posted that here and I like him much better on this show! I just find their storylines relevant, interesting, detailed and far more nuanced and well-written. 

I'm pretty much done with sad sack adult Kate. Jeebus, woman, put down your security blanket of "issues" and grow the heck up. You had a dad who was very sweet to you and honestly made you feel better when you were bullied, so you had at least one parent who was capable of helping you form some esteem. I'm sorry you had a totally hapless mom, but hey, really, your childhood could have been a lot worse...

Kevin - eh - some interesting material with West Coast/East Coast perspectives on artistic theatre life and some interesting material on being the forgotten child, but...a romcom set up? Blech.

I was glad to see the preview where Rebecca says she wasn't sure she wanted kids, because that gave me a little bit of motivation and made me temporarily stop turning the Dial of Doom down to the dislike intensely zone. As in: you are now entering Yogurt Bitch/Martyred Shrew territory, honey. Stop with the sighing and whining and acting all annoyed that your kids aren't perfect, self-sufficient angels with no problems. I had to remind myself that she lost a triplet and that maybe that was why she was lacking any emotional warmth or real vulnerability. I shouldn't need to do that, especially for a show so determined that I WILL CRY AND FEEL, D*MN IT.

I have more sympathy for the dad (can't remember his character name). He's very good at diffusing the emotional issues the kids are confronted with. He apologized to Kevin (which took some doing back in the days when parents ruled without question) and tried to help Kate see that the bullies were the problem, not her body. He's a bit of superdad cliche, but I can live with that. 

The show keeps me watching, despite my beefs. I keep thinking it'll be my last week, but I don't think I can say no to the Randall storyline. 

Edited October 21, 2016 by potatoradio

[luna1122]

50 minutes ago, ProudMary said:

Agreed!  This seems to be only a partial pic but it's a start.  The photo is from this ET article:
http://www.etonline.com/tv/200724_this_is_us_how_3_revelations_changed_everyone_s_lives_and_could_there_be_a_fourth_sibling/

oh, thanks proudmary! That's interesting. She's hugging Kevin, so yeah, looks like she become a real family friend, especially since this was displayed at Randall's house. None of her kids, if she has more than one. And some were speculating that she and Jack have an affair, but would Randall have this pic if so, even IF Jack and Yvette wound up married? Pretty creepy to display the pic of mom AND stepmom, unless everyone is just all fine with it. I don't know. Weirder things happen, I guess.

[scatteroflight]

Quote

That photo with the mother Rebecca befriended was kinda weird, as her child is missing in that photo. If I were Randall, it would be weird to hang a photo of your friend's mom and not the friend. 

I don't think there has to be any complicated reason. Sometimes kids stop being friends, for a million different reasons. In the meantime, it's entirely possible that Rebecca and Yvette's friendship grew as Yvette was helping Rebecca (and Jack) learn to parent Randall. It might be as simple as Yvette becoming a family friend.