S03.E03: Always Bet Black

[Tara Ariano]

Quote

A high-profile murder case is presented to the class by Annalise that even the Keating 5 finds morally questionable. Meanwhile, an unlikely sources leads to a startling discovery by Laurel.

[Eneya]

That sure would be something reprehensible.

[Lady Calypso]

So, we get some Nate/Annalise romantic scenes. He makes her a smoothie in the morning. They work cases together while in bed. 

It looks like each main student will get their own case to lead. 

I do love Bonnie/Annalise's relationship. She hides her junk food for her. They really do support each other, which is nice.

Laurel's dad is a piece of work. I can see why their relationship is complicated. With him wire-tapping her phone calls and him using her for his own gain, it's no wonder she wants nothing to do with him. But it is very interesting, and I wouldn't be opposed to seeing a little more later down the road. Interesting that she also didn't tell Annalise or Bonnie that she did sign the property transfer in exchange for Frank's location. 

Poor Meggie. She sees Wes/Laurel and finally confronts him about it. 

I liked seeing Connor, Asher, Michaela and Oliver having fun, even if it didn't end well with Connor and Oliver. You know, for everyone putting the blame on Connor and assuming he's the screw-up in the relationship, it's actually Oliver. He's the one that's not acting like the adult here. Connor's been relatively ok. It really feels like Connor has some undealt issues because he assumes he's always in the wrong. It's really sad. 

So, it's not Oliver or Bonnie. Thank goodness it's not Bonnie. But someone else was in that house and they're alive. I honestly feel like it could be Connor, but who knows. There's not many hints yet. 

[SimoneS]

Ugh, this Laurel continuing to pine over Frank is ruining this show for me.

Is a main cast member really supposed to die? Or is this a tease with a peripheral character dying? Regardless, too bad it isn't Connie, I am not a fan.

[love2lovebadtv]

5 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

So, we get some Nate/Annalise romantic scenes. He makes her a smoothie in the morning. They work cases together while in bed. It's cute but I'm still not sure of his purpose. Maybe just to give her some balance and stand in doorways with a wet,  naked chest. 

It looks like each main student will get their own case to lead. That's a better approach to the show and other makes more sense than the previous premise. I would like to see other students qork on cases,  too.  And have the k5 struggle to interact with them. 

I do love Bonnie/Annalise's relationship. She hides her junk food for her. They really do support each other, which is nice. I like it better when they get along . They both need a good female friend. 

Laurel's dad is a piece of work. I can see why their relationship is complicated. With him wire-tapping her phone calls and him using her for his own gain, it's no wonder she wants nothing to do with him. But it is very interesting, and I wouldn't be opposed to seeing a little more later down the road. Interesting that she also didn't tell Annalise or Bonnie that she did sign the property transfer in exchange for Frank's location. Definitely an interesting sub-plot here.  Until I heard the voice I wasn't sure that was really Frank. 

Poor Meggie. She sees Wes/Laurel and finally confronts him about it. I want Meggy to stick around for normalcy . Not shipping wes/laurel. 

I liked seeing Connor, Asher, Michaela and Oliver having fun, even if it didn't end well with Connor and Oliver. You know, for everyone putting the blame on Connor and assuming he's the screw-up in the relationship, it's actually Oliver. He's the one that's not acting like the adult here. Connor's been relatively ok. It really feels like Connor has some undealt issues because he assumes he's always in the wrong. It's really sad. Oliver definitely needs to grow up. This is real life. And I'm not sure why he was saying someone like Connor wouldn't date him.  They're both handsome guys . 

So, it's not Oliver or Bonnie. Thank goodness it's not Bonnie. But someone else was in that house and they're alive. I honestly feel like it could be Connor, but who knows. There's not many hints yet. Are there two bodies ? That's what it sounded like to me . There's one under the sheet and another they just found . 

[wanderingstar]

It was so cathartic when Annalise slapped that perv client. He had some gall bitching about serving 3 years. He should count his blessings and shut the entire fuck up.

I still haven't seen anything that dissuades me from thinking Wes is the one on the gurney.

Disappointed not to see Jose Zuniga reprise the role of Laurel's dad, but I like Esai Morales, so I enjoyed those scenes. I was confused about what Laurel signed, though. And why did she lie to Annalise about finding Frank's location.

I know Frank is in hiding, but I wish we got more of him in this episode.

I don't know what to make of Meggie. Is she as nice as she presents, or is she working some long con on Wes?

Edited October 7, 2016 by Gillian Rosh

[TVHappy9463]

My guess for under the sheet is Femke Jensen's character and in the basement is Nate. 

Last week Annalise said something about Femke's character looking into Wes' father's murder. Nate is in the basement because he rushed into the burning house to save Annalise.  

The fire was set by Annalise to cover something up.  And Frank will end up being Annaliese's client. 

[secnarf]

My interpretation was that Laurel hid Frank's location from AK because Frank told Laurel that AK tried to kill him. Laurel doesn't want AK to use the information that she "sold her soul" for to kill Frank, and/or Laurel doesn't want to contribute to Frank' death. Her lie was very close to the truth but not quite convincing enough, IMO. I don't think AK is buying it.

Also regarding a comment above - I definitely think there are two "bodies" - one dead and one with a pulse.

I am really not liking Oliver that much anymore, but I did think his gaping at Nate was pretty cute/funny.

This was a pretty decent COTW, but I feel like the blackmailing lawyer storyline was just dropped. That lawyer would know that the client actually killed the girl, Janie. I don't see how this solved the blackmail problem. And I had enough of blackmailing lawyers last season, I really don't want this to recur in future episodes.

I can't trust Meggy. I don't think we've been given any indication that she's anything but what she says she is, but the nature of this show just makes me unable to trust her. I also can't trust anything Annalise says - that whole thing with Bonnie, I don't buy for a second that AK didn't want Bonnie to be alone. Her reaction to the body - I'm convinced that it's all (or at least, mostly) a show. It's kind of sad.

[Dee]

Annalise outing herself as a Coliver shipper cracked me up.

[KaveDweller]

16 minutes ago, secnarf said:

My interpretation was that Laurel hid Frank's location from AK because Frank told Laurel that AK tried to kill him. Laurel doesn't want AK to use the information that she "sold her soul" for to kill Frank, and/or Laurel doesn't want to contribute to Frank' death. Her lie was very close to the truth but not quite convincing enough, IMO. I don't think AK is buying it.

She could have just not signed that thing for her father and then she really wouldn't know when Frank was. Then maybe Annalise would have bought it.

[dgpolo]

Oliver gaping at Nate really cracked me up.

[bantering]

49 minutes ago, Gillian Rosh said:

 .

I don't know what to make of Meggie. Is she as nice as she presents, or is she working some long con on Wes?

She better be working a long con because I have no idea why anybody would want to deal with him mooning after Laurel.

[secnarf]

25 minutes ago, KaveDweller said:

She could have just not signed that thing for her father and then she really wouldn't know when Frank was. Then maybe Annalise would have bought it.

But then Laurel won't be able to go find him herself (inadvertently leading AK straight to him, most likely). 

[Artsda]

What did Laurel sign? Does she even know? It will so come back to haunt her. I liked that she didn't give up Franks location.

Wes mooning over Laurel I could do without. I miss their friendship.

Why is Michaela angry her gay ex has a new beard? She dodged that bullet.

I liked the Atlantic City road trip, they should do more new locations.

Quote

Are there two bodies ? That's what it sounded like to me . There's one under the sheet and another they just found . 

 

Yes they just found some else, who is still alive. 

[LaJefaza]

10 minutes ago, secnarf said:

But then Laurel won't be able to go find him herself (inadvertently leading AK straight to him, most likely). 

That's exactly what's going to happen. AK and Bonnie are easily 10 times smarter than Laurel and she played herself right into their hands. I think they've been conning her from the start, knowing fully well that she WOULD take her dumb ass straight to Frank. She didn't fool either of them.

For dramatic effect, Wes, (provided he's not the one under the sheet) is going to be one of the LAST characters they'll disclose as being safe in the countdown to the big reveal. I think the final two will be Wes and Michaela, the two Annalise seems to care the most about. 

[possibilities]

I don't think Connor thought he was wrong. I thought he was taking the fall so he wouldn't have to tell Oliver about defending him to the racist guy. He doesn't want to hurt Oliver by throwing the racism in his face, and he also doesn't know if Oliver would believe him; it's just easier to not get into it and spare them both that conversation, so he went for the simplistic story that he was jealous.

[VCRTracking]

They recast Laurel's dad with the brother from La Bamba! "RIIIIIITCHIIIIIEEEE!"

Edited October 7, 2016 by VCRTracking

[Dee]

I love that Karla Souza advocated against making her father the head of a cartel.

Her commitment to subverting stereotypes is quite admirable.

[twoods]

Now there is another body? So maybe the first body was someone that everyone is covering the murder of, and the second is someone that inadvertently dies. Damn it show! I like all the characters so I don't want any of them to get killed off. 

That perv was a piece of work. Next week is going to make my blood boil.

I don't trust Wes's girlfriend. And med students don't practice all the time on their friends or significant others so stop it show! We get that she's a medical student- you don't have to remind us every two seconds.

[Racj82]

I I'll go down swinging that my believe is its nate on the gurney. I saw a dark chocolate brown arm on the gurney while the camera swung around the back of Anneliese. Are least, I think I saw that.

[J.D.]

I was wrong when I guessed the body would be Bonnie.  One down, three to go.  My other guesses are still Nate, Eve and Annalise's mom.  I cannot accept that it might be one of the Keating 5  .... so I'mma stay in denial over that.  :)

As soon as Annalise slapped that perv, I knew it was going to have its own storyline.  That was so out of character for Annalise (not to mention unprofessional). The minute she hit him, I thought "assault."  Then the previews gave us a tease.

I love Oliver but even I think his character is doing some wackadoodle things.  The whole breaking up with Connor makes no sense and now what's up with the cell phone?  I just want him and Connor to get back together.  I miss Coliver.  :(

[secnarf]

5 hours ago, Racj82 said:

I I'll go down swinging that my believe is its nate on the gurney. I saw a dark chocolate brown arm on the gurney while the camera swung around the back of Anneliese. Are least, I think I saw that.

They hadn't decided who the body actually was until right before the 9th episode, when it is revealed. There's no point looking for clues like that. The body was a dummy during filming. 

It may very well be Nate, but you won't find any glimpses of his body under the sheet, and no amount of slowing down, rewatching, estimating the size of the body, etc will give you useful information. 

[Primetimer]

She's in Miami, so she skips the dumb story with the ugly murderer.

View the full article

[Aleks]

11 hours ago, Dee said:

Annalise outing herself as a Coliver shipper cracked me up.

Hilarious! This totally made my day!!!

And: I seriously start shipping Masher. It's somehow ironic-funny-distracting. Love their scenes and also loved the dynamic of the whole Atlantic City trip-disaster. A bit more of that, please!

[Neurochick]

6 hours ago, nosleepforme said:

I think it's just that her life is not what she wanted it to be. She wanted to have it all - great career and also this romantic fairy tale. But her life has pretty much turned upside down, so she's jealous of her gay ex's new girlfriend, because on the surface she is living the life that Michaela wanted and it doesn't matter whether Aiden is gay or not.

I kind of felt for Mechaela then.  She had her life all planned out and now it's gone 180 degrees from what she wanted. 

But the truth is, she could have just stuck with the plan and married Aiden, but did not want to.

That's the thing about social media, people show off, want you to see just how fabulous their lives are; but I sometimes wonder, if you're living a fabulous life, who has time to take pictures of it?

[Happytobehere]

Well, Bonnie is also off the table in "The Who's Under the Sheet Mystery," as well as in the newly launched "Who's the Second Body that can't be Identified Mystery." Strangely, I'm glad that she is not the casualty of the season.

New game, new thoughts, one of the people, either the dead one or the badly burned one is either Lauren Velez or Meggie, who clearly cant be trusted because she is running Wes's drivers license.  Who does that? Someone who is a little too interested in the life and times of Annalise Keating and company, that's who.

I am more convinced than ever that either Nate or Connor will be revealed to be the dearly departed.  A strong case can be made for either of them based on the developments of their characters this season.  Nate is around way too much, why is he always there? Damnit get a job! However, the more I see of Nate and his insistence on being there, the more I feel like love isn't driving his actions, but rather, it's a case it "keep your friends close and your enemies closer." I'm trusting him less and less with each episode.  Connor is getting the good guy edit, which is often writer speak for, we want you to miss this character when he is gone.

 Defendant of the week was pure garbage, if there is any justice in this world, he will get his just deserts while in jail.  

The Slap by Annalise and the takedown of the bitchy lawyer were the best moments of the show.

What is Laurel's deal with Frank? I don't believe she loves him, so what's up? Is her father right about her only being interested in men who are unavailable.

I'm starting to re-evaluate Michaela and Asher as a couple.  I forgot about how damaged she was shown to be in season one.  The engagement of the former boyfriend and her reaction showed hat she was still living in a bad head space.  I think Asher r ally cares for her, despite the way the relationship began.  They might actually be good for one another, so I'll step back for the time being and see where the show goes with this pairing.

Edited October 7, 2016 by Happytobehere

[DearEvette]

I loved Connor's telling Michaela "Our ex has gotten engaged." Ha!  and snort!

The Atlantic City scenes were fun.  Honestly, if you had asked me who the unlikeliest couple was on the show I'd have said Asher and Michaela but, darn it Asher is winning me over.  He is such an idiot, but I can't be mad at him.  He is besotted with Michaela and he is being a good friend to Connor and Oliver.  He's such a damn puppy. 

Speaking of Michaela, this was a great ep for her.  She has grown since season 1.  I loved her take down of the pawn shop guy and how she was really on top of all the precedents in the case.  And her coat was fab.

Nice to see Milauna Jackson as the newest DA to tangle with Analise.  I've liked her since she was the badass CIA chick on Strike Back.  Looks like she'll be sticking around for a few more episodes.  Although DAs don't fare to well in this universe, it is like the Defense Against the Dark Arts job with Analise and her crew being the Dark Arts. So the poor dear will probably be admonished,demoted, fired  or dead by the time this all ends.

[Racj82]

4 hours ago, secnarf said:

They hadn't decided who the body actually was until right before the 9th episode, when it is revealed. There's no point looking for clues like that. The body was a dummy during filming. 

It may very well be Nate, but you won't find any glimpses of his body under the sheet, and no amount of slowing down, rewatching, estimating the size of the body, etc will give you useful information. 

Damn, let me have my theory people.

Just joking. I don't follow shows beyond when they air and what I see. I don't need spoilers or knowledge of behind the scenes. Stuff. Just watching a tv show. Nste is also the person with a raised presence this season which is also a bad sign for characters on tv shows like this.

[helenamonster]

11 hours ago, twoods said:

I don't trust Wes's girlfriend. And med students don't practice all the time on their friends or significant others so stop it show! We get that she's a medical student- you don't have to remind us every two seconds.

My stepsister is in PA school and she actually does practice on anyone in the family who will sit still long enough. I realize she's the exception to the rule, though.

I liked getting some backstory on Laurel this episode, and I love any storyline that lets Karla Souza speak Spanish. Her dad is kind of awful but he does have a point...she could do much better than Frank (I do not mean Wes) and should stop wasting her time trying to find him, at least outside of helping Annalise and Bonnie. But, nope, she's gonna find him on her own now, I assume, and that makes me even more worried that she's the one #UnderTheSheet. Annalise and Bonnie are not going to be happy when they find out Laurel hid this information from them, and the fact that we now know Bonnie survives the fire and appears to be 100% complicit in whatever happened there makes this even more likely, imo.

Speaking of the fire, there's a second body! They said at the end of the episode that they still had a pulse, but in the promo Bonnie is calling it "a body" and saying that the police can't identify it, which leads me to believe the second person is also dead. I'm gonna guess that this person is a newly-introduced and/or minor character like Meggy, the president, or that new annoying guy, Drake, and that while the #UnderTheSheet body was an intentional murder that Annalise, Bonnie, and perhaps others are responsible for, the second body was someone who was in the wrong place at the wrong time.

I liked that this episode addressed the issue of racism within the gay community. My best friend is a gay man (white, for what it's worth) and he talks about how frustrating it is to see such open racism on gay dating apps (just like Connor said, a lot of "masc for masc" and "no blacks, no Asians"). I wouldn't really know about this issue if it wasn't for my friend, and I think it was cool of this show to give it a little bit of a spotlight. It's not something mainstream media ever really gets in-depth with.

I was confused...what was the thing that Laurel signed? I figured it had something to do with her father's financials (he said her brother couldn't sign it because he was having money problems in Venezuela) but I wasn't clear on the specifics and how it might (or will) come back to bite her later. I also didn't realize that the women we met in the Christmas episode from season one, was Laurel's stepmother, not her mother, who her father apparently left after she suffered some mental health problems. Oh, and he wouldn't pay her ransom when she was kidnapped at sixteen! Well, that definitely explains her stoicism in the face of all the shit she's faced since going to Middleton, but I hope they dig deeper into this. Maybe it can be the big flashback plot of the second half of the season?

[J.D.]

58 minutes ago, Happytobehere said:

The Slap by Annalise and the takedown of the bitchy lawyer were the best moments of the show.

That slap was real, btw.  Pete Nowalk mentioned that on Twitter.  I don't know who's "under the sheet," but Nowalk said it's a pivotal character on the show and fellow cast mates said they cried when they found out who.  So, even though Meggy, or someone equal to her in importance for this storyline, may be one of the bodies, the body in the ambulance is someone pivotal to the entire show.

 

52 minutes ago, DearEvette said:

I loved Connor's telling Michaela "Our ex has gotten engaged." Ha!  and snort!

Loved it!  That cracked me up as well.

 

12 minutes ago, helenamonster said:

I liked that this episode addressed the issue of racism within the gay community. My best friend is a gay man (white, for what it's worth) and he talks about how frustrating it is to see such open racism on gay dating apps (just like Connor said, a lot of "masc for masc" and "no blacks, no Asians"). I wouldn't really know about this issue if it wasn't for my friend, and I think it was cool of this show to give it a little bit of a spotlight. It's not something mainstream media ever really gets in-depth with.

This conversation kind of bothered me.  Although I never used Grindr or "Humper," the HTGAWM equivalent -- LOL -- still, Connor's comment kinda irritated me.   True, the guy he was talking to came off kind of like a jerk.  But still, people have their own personal likes and dislikes.  Love is love and you're attracted to what you're attracted to.  It's not racism if you're not attracted to certain ethnicities.  It's personal preference.  And it's not like the guy Connor mouthed off was searching on "Humper" for a new friend to go clubbing with or interviewing prospective employees.  He was talking about a relationship.  You can't force attraction.  It just is.  

Okay, I'll stop now because I feel a lecture coming on.  LOL  :D

[helenamonster]

2 minutes ago, J.D. said:

This conversation kind of bothered me.  Although I never used Grindr or "Humper," the HTGAWM equivalent -- LOL -- still, Connor's comment kinda irritated me.   True, the guy he was talking to came off kind of like a jerk.  But still, people have their own personal likes and dislikes.  Love is love and you're attracted to what you're attracted to.  It's not racism if you're not attracted to certain ethnicities.  It's personal preference.  And it's not like the guy Connor mouthed off was searching on "Humper" for a new friend to go clubbing with or interviewing prospective employees.  He was talking about a relationship.  You can't force attraction.  It just is.  

Okay, I'll stop now because I feel a lecture coming on.  LOL  :D

No lecture from me! Everyone's entitled to their feelings. Perhaps it was a clumsy way to introduce the issue, I can agree on that. But I don't think it makes the problem any less real (again, I have no personal experience with this, it's all secondhand from my friend).

[Milaxx]

Other than the slap heard round the world I wasn't that impressed with this show this week. Things I liked: Esai Morales as Laurel's dad. The impression that he's involved in something other than a drug cartel. Bonnie pushing Annalise to do something to put Janie's mother out of pain. Asher & Michaela coming clean although inadvertently to Bonnie about their relationship. Seeing Oliver practically drooling over Nate's glistening pecs. Things I dislike: recasting Laurel's dad even though I adore Esai Morales. The Connor/Oliver argument in AC. I was willing to go the Stanford thing even though it was a jerk move, but now Oliver is just being a jerk. Annalise continually waking up looking like a soap star in full makeup and wig. Meggy & Wes are just boring. 

As much as I enjoyed it, Annalise slapping that guy in chambers was a bad move. She of all people should be aware of whether or not a room ha cameras in it or not. Especially since DA made it known that everyone in their office hates her. I also think it's becoming fairly obvious that the new President/Dean has something against Annalise. This brings me to my guesses for who's the dead body. My guess is it's Lauren Velez's character. Unless there is an announcement that one of the K5 actors is leaving to pursue a movie career, I don't see them leaving. I think the President will become a liability like DA Sinclair was last season and she will be the one to go. I'm not sure whether she gets killed and Annalise burns or has the house set on fire by someone in order to cover it up. As for the body still breathing, I'd vote for Connor. He seems to be the one suffering from guilt the most due to their misdeeds. I could see him trying to save the person who does die and failing. It might  also pave the way for a Connor/Oliver reunion once Oliver knows all the secrets and has fully been indoctrinated as on of the K5

38 minutes ago, J.D. said:

That slap was real, btw.  Pete Nowalk mentioned that on Twitter.  I don't know who's "under the sheet," but Nowalk said it's a pivotal character on the show and fellow cast mates said they cried when they found out who.  So, even though Meggy, or someone equal to her in importance for this storyline, may be one of the bodies, the body in the ambulance is someone pivotal to the entire show.

Taking this with a grain of salt, if it is one of the core characters, I'd vote Frank.

[juliet73]

I'm down to Eve or Annalise's mom under the sheet.  I think Nate is the one they found in the house.  Even though he has a pulse,  I don't think he's going to make it.  Thinking of Nate...he was quite "oiled up" for just hanging out at home. 

I liked the COTW. 

I really don't like the Michaela/Asher hook up. And Wes and Meggie are boring. She seems "too perfect".  Between Rebecca and Meggie, Wes really went from one extreme to another.  

[stuckin60s]

loved Oliver drooling over Nate!!!.  Wonderful spot where Conner made sure Oliver didn't know the drunk in AC was talking bad about him and coming for Conner.  I want Frank back!!   

[Milaxx]

I just think it's a little sad that the reason Connor covers so much from Oliver goes back to how they became a couple. If it wasn't for running to him as a refuge after burning Sam's body, they likely wouldn't have gotten together as a couple.  Despite all he has done it appears that part of Connor still sees Oliver as that innocent guy in need of protecting. I think in a way Oliver senses this and is rebelling against it. Sadly that's what killed their relationship. In a very odd way, it probably would be better if Connor stopped trying to protect Oliver..

[tennisgurl]

Man, even I felt that slap. And, as good as that slap felt, it was a terrible call on Annalise's part, and it seemed out of character. She has been a lawyer for years, she has to have represented worse people than that asshole. I guess its because it feels more personal because of everything that happened, but still. I dont want to see that guy anymore. 

16 hours ago, Dee said:

Annalise outing herself as a Coliver shipper cracked me up.

I know right? Everyone is just so invested in their relationship, its great. And as much as I have always loved Coliver, I would kind of be alright with Connor getting a new boyfriend. Its depressing how everyone seems to immediately assume that Connor did something wrong, when its Oliver that has been in the wrong since he screwed Connor out of Stanford. Not that Connor has always been innocent, but he has been a great boyfriend since the last breakup, and he deserves better. What even worse is that Connor seems to really believe that all his Oliver problems really ARE his fault, even when its clear that Oliver has a ton of unresolved issues to deal with that are hurting their relationship. 

 

22 minutes ago, Milaxx said:

Despite all he has done it appears that part of Connor still sees Oliver as that innocent guy in need of protecting.

I totally agree. I think Connor sees himself as a bad guy, who hurt poor innocent Oliver, when its clear that the story is more complicated than that. I think he has really low self esteem, and that, combining with his reaction to the abuse victim from last week, makes me wonder if he was in an unhealthy relationship in the past or something. 

I loved seeing Laurels dad, and I thought their scenes together were great. I am really glad they resisted the urg to make him some kind of cartel guy. Its like when your watching Law and Order and you can tell what kind of story its going to be the second you hear someones name of see their ethnicity. Its annoying. Laurels dad might be a jerk, but he was on the money about Frank. He is not worth it! 

[bantering]

I think it's a little dumb for Oliver to tell Connor to act like a grown-up when he's the one who hacked Stanford to make sure Connor didn't see the acceptance. That's not exactly mature. 

Everyone, except for Analise (and Nate?), is working my last nerve this season. I do think the actress who plays Michaela is good at playing angst though. She seems super-stressed. I feel like maybe that's how Wes should be reacting. It's like his dad getting shot was just another day at the office for him. I can't tell if Wes is just a bad actor or if he's supposed to be in some comatose state from all the shock. If it's the latter, I don't think he'd be interested in having sex with the medical student though.

Edited October 7, 2016 by bantering

[Milaxx]

20 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

Everyone is just so invested in their relationship, its great. And as much as I have always loved Coliver, I would kind of be alright with Connor getting a new boyfriend. Its depressing how everyone seems to immediately assume that Connor did something wrong, when its Oliver that has been in the wrong since he screwed Connor out of Stanford. Not that Connor has always been innocent, but he has been a great boyfriend since the last breakup, and he deserves better. What even worse is that Connor seems to really believe that all his Oliver problems really ARE his fault, even when its clear that Oliver has a ton of unresolved issues to deal with that are hurting their relationship. 

 

47 minutes ago, Milaxx said:

Despite all he has done it appears that part of Connor still sees Oliver as that innocent guy in need of protecting.

I totally agree. I think Connor sees himself as a bad guy, who hurt poor innocent Oliver, when its clear that the story is more complicated than that. I think he has really low self esteem, and that, combining with his reaction to the abuse victim from last week, makes me wonder if he was in an unhealthy relationship in the past or something. 

I loved seeing Laurels dad, and I thought their scenes together were great. I am really glad they resisted the urg to make him some kind of cartel guy. Its like when your watching Law and Order and you can tell what kind of story its going to be the second you hear someones name of see their ethnicity. Its annoying. Laurels dad might be a jerk, but he was on the money about Frank. He is not worth it! 

I'm not sure if Connor has low self esteem or if it's part of the PTSD he has from the whole Sam debacle. It appears that for many years Connor lived the carefree play boy life style. Covering up Sam's murder and what they have done since then appears to be weighing heavily on him and for whatever reason he sees Oliver as a beacon. 

I read that it was Karla Sousa's idea for the kidnapping storyline and she also encouraged Novak to stray away from the cartel story. Back in season 1 it appeared that they were going for drug kingpin for her dad. I'm glad they dropped that since they plan to flesh out her story this season.

[J.D.]

I just had another theory.  I'm thinking that body number two was on purpose and body number one was an accident -- or vice versa.  There's SO many scenarios that could work here, but to give you an idea where I'm going with this, let me make up an example. 

Hypothetically:  Frank was the intended target.  Frank's at the house for whatever reason.... maybe Annalise fakes peace with him.... we don't know what would get him to go to Annalise's because there's still several shows leading up to the fire that we haven't yet seen.  Anyway, something happens where they think Frank is dead (shooting, stabbing, drink laced with drugs..????)   I'm leaning toward the drink since it's the easiest to cover up.  Annalise and Bonnie alone can't move Frank's body, so they cover up his drug-induced 'death' with the fire. 

Annalise leaves so that she can come home to her house engulfed in flames.  She feigns shock, wants to know who's in the ambulance -- fully expecting it to be Frank!  Surprise, surprise -- it's Nate.  Nobody knew he was asleep in the basement.  Nobody expected him to be there.  Annalise is devastated!!!   "Oh no, not Nate!  He wasn't part of the plan!!!"   <-- My embellished dialog.

I've been leaning toward this theory since watching the show the other night because Bonnie looked a little surprised to learn there's a second body.  It was as if she was expecting there to be one (Frank) because she was in on whatever happened.

Of course, you could swap out my two victims here with any number of other people in similar scenarios.  The key point I'm theorizing is that body number two was the intended victim -- who lives -- and body number one in the ambulance was someone nobody expected to be in the house, but rather a casualty of the circumstances:  Nate?  Eve?

Hmmm.........

[Milaxx]

I could also see the dead body being Eve since Famke is signed to a new tv show. 

[Glade]

I loved it when Analise asked Bonnie if she was also going to tell the police where Rebecca's body is.  Rebecca also had a mother somewhere, and she may even have been a survivor of child sexual abuse, we'll never know. 

[Lady Calypso]

2 hours ago, helenamonster said:

I was confused...what was the thing that Laurel signed? I figured it had something to do with her father's financials (he said her brother couldn't sign it because he was having money problems in Venezuela) but I wasn't clear on the specifics and how it might (or will) come back to bite her later.

It was some kind of property transfer. I don't understand the full logistics, but her father was signing over I guess one of his houses (in West Palm Beach?) to her for financial reasons. My best guess is that he's in some kind of financial trouble and needs to lay low, so signing over one of his properties to Laurel will help that matter. 

41 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

I totally agree. I think Connor sees himself as a bad guy, who hurt poor innocent Oliver, when its clear that the story is more complicated than that. I think he has really low self esteem, and that, combining with his reaction to the abuse victim from last week, makes me wonder if he was in an unhealthy relationship in the past or something. 

I think he does too. The fact that he lets Oliver yell at him and assume that he's trying to sabotage him flirting with another guy, plus him taking all the blame in the car just made me feel bad for Connor that he feels that way. Connor has been very meek and quiet this season, I've found. He's more submissive and just lets things happen, so I guess it must be from the PTSD of all the events that have happened. I wouldn't be surprised if we found out that Connor sustained some sort of emotional abuse in the past. 

I'm still going with Nate being the first body. As for the second body, who knows? 

[possibilities]

39 minutes ago, bantering said:

It's like his dad getting shot was just another day at the office for him. I can't tell if Wes is just a bad actor or if he's supposed to be in some comatose state from all the shock. If it's the latter, I don't think he'd be interested in having sex with the medical student though.

I dunno... sex can be an excellent distraction/anaesthetic if you're trying to be OK when you're not OK. I can buy that he's trying to pretend nothing is wrong, but I don't know if that's what is really the show's agenda, either. He might also be playing a long game of some sort, though I have no idea what it would be. It really is a bit disturbing how blase Wes seems to be, though. If he's a sociopath after all, though, that would work. But he also shows signs of not being one. So I'm perplexed, which is surely exactly what the show intends. They like to keep us in that place of WTF at every moment.

25 minutes ago, Milaxx said:

 I think Connor sees himself as a bad guy, who hurt poor innocent Oliver, when its clear that the story is more complicated than that. I think he has really low self esteem, and that, combining with his reaction to the abuse victim from last week, makes me wonder if he was in an unhealthy relationship in the past or something. 

I think Connor feels guilty about the burning/dismemberment and cover-up after Sam's murder. I think it's genuine that he wants to protect Oliver from being an accessory-- it's not like telling Oliver would make Oliver's life better in any foreseeable way, and it could make it worse in quite a few different ways. It's also self-protective to not tell him, because you really never know how someone will react when you reveal that you covered up someone's death by cutting their body up, burning it, or otherwise going along with the layers and layers of gore that were involved in the whole mess. Moreover, if Connor tells Oliver, who knows what Annalise, or any of her associates, would do to Connor AND Oliver. He knows they will murder and cover up to save themselves, so he really can't tell Oliver without taking a very serious risk not only for himself/the K4/Annalise and for Oliver. He's basically damned no matter what he does. And as a result, he's depressed. It actually seems to me like a pretty rational response.

I agree that Oliver senses the distance caused by the secret, and is rebelling against it. But I don't think Connor has any good options, and he knows that, which is why he's basically given up. I don't think any past trauma is necessary to explain it. It's possible, of course, that there IS past trauma, but I am hoping the show sticks with him as having been from a happy and supportive family, and not particularly messed up before Sam's death.

I think Connor's reaction to last week's case was another sign of his decency, and that he's still got a moral compass and some courage, and is sometimes willing to do something at least slightly personally risky instead of always putting his own ass-covering and personal convenience first. He empathizes, not necessarily because he has the same trauma, but because he has his own (which we already know about, i.e. the Sam fiasco). Same thing this week when he confronted the racist creep who was dissing Oliver-- he gives a shit, so even though he could ignore the problem, or stay out of it, he speaks up rather than just cashing in on his privilege for his own pleasure and convenience. He leverages the empathy, for a greater purpose. And it may even help him some, to feel like even if he can't do anything about the Sam thing, he can at least channel his conscience into confronting other wrongs.

I can't figure out who would be in the basement and not be able to get out, unless they were already dead (which is contradicted by them having a pulse) or were put there and restrained in some way (locked in, drugged, tied up, whatever)-- which seems to me to say that the 2nd body might have been the real target, and the first was the mistake.  Or both could be deliberate. Why not, right? Get your murders in bulk for a discount!

I don't know why anyone would sleep in the basement, voluntarily. I no longer have any guesses. I think all the theories being floated are equally plausible, and equally implausible-- which is part of what's making it so fun, I guess.

[J.D.]

28 minutes ago, nosleepforme said:

I don't want to lecture (besides it would get off topic way too quickly), but I just want to say this:

Having a preference is totally fine, I have preferences too in what kind of men I am attracted too, but in my opinion it is not okay to dismiss an ENTIRE GROUP of people  and sell it as a preference. It is STILL racism, because you put a large group of people with different backgrounds, different personalities, different looks into one tiny little box and reject all of them based on one tiny little label that can never accurately represent a person. 

Especially the "no Asian" thing that is so prevalent on gay dating apps slumps Chinese men, Korean mean, Japanese men and so on, a really large and diverse group of people,  into one SINGLE category.

Besides, one will never be attracted to all white people either, so if one would want to be really thorough with their preferences, one would have to list all traits and characteristics  that one is not into. I do also believe that since one can not be attracted to everyone of a certain group of people, one can not not be attracted to everyone in a certain group of people either. 

And in the end,  you are not dating an ethnicity, you're dating a person. An individual for their own unique charm, quirks, flaws and looks.

So it always bothers me when I read in dating profiles "no whatever", because I think it's disrespectful, rude and mean (and I say that as a white dude). If you receive a message from someone that you are not into, just politely decline, but don't rudely dismiss a diverse group of people.

 

Well, this turned into a lecture. I am sorry. I just tried to explain as eloquently as possible why this is a problem and why I liked that the show addressed it in the episode.

I wouldn't know anything about dating apps, so I have no idea what goes on over there but if I were to do that type of thing, to me, it seems kinder to not waste a person's time.  If you already know what you're not attracted to, why not state that?  Otherwise, that very type of person could respond to your profile only to make you have to let them down.

I'm white.   I have no attraction to regular 'ole white guys like myself, and so IF I was going to use a dating app, I would state that upfront.  Doesn't mean we can't be awesome friends.  It just means I'm attracted to something else.  My BF is Greek.  Admittedly, his middle eastern, ethnic features are what I first noticed about him.  That, and his adorable uniform  (he was my mailman when we first met).  :D  My daughter's mother is Italian/Black.  Her olive skin and beautiful features is what first attracted me to her.  

I'm not shallow and I'm not racist.  I don't exclude white people in every aspect of my life.  (So tempted to say, "Some of my best friends are white.")  :D  Anyway, it just means I'm physically attracted to what I'm physically attracted to.  I've never had to use a dating app, but if I ever did, I'd be honest with people from the start so as not to waste their time.

[Kira53]

12 hours ago, J.D. said:

I was wrong when I guessed the body would be Bonnie.  One down, three to go.  My other guesses are still 

I love Oliver but even I think his character is doing some wackadoodle things.  The whole breaking up with Connor makes no sense and now what's up with the cell phone?  I just want him and Connor to get back together.  I miss Coliver.  :(

Someone got to Oliver and forced him to break up with Conner.  Annalise is my first suspect.  What's her motive?  They haven't decided that yet.  They do make it up as they go along.

I just decided that Annalise would be worried that Conner would talk about the murder if he went to Stanford.  Annalise might believe that breaking up Conner and Oliver would reduce the possibility that with time Conner would confess to Oliver.  The fact that he confessed to a client confirms her worries that he is still a high risk of confessing to the murder and risking the rest of the Keating 5 and Annalise herself.

Edited October 7, 2016 by Kira53

[RedheadZombie]

I was happy to see Esai Morales.  I don't understand Laurel's relationship with her father.  She seems to act like he's a monster, but then she's teasing him and feeds him a bite of the treat he brought her.

So, so happy to see Bonnie's alive.  She hardly had any lines this season, then they set it up to look like she's profoundly depressed and ready to commit suicide.  At least she's alive at the end of the season, apparently.

1 hour ago, TVHappy9463 said:

My guess for under the sheet is Femke Jensen's character and in the basement is Nate. 

Last week Annalise said something about Femke's character looking into Wes' father's murder. Nate is in the basement because he rushed into the burning house to save Annalise.  

The fire was set by Annalise to cover something up.  And Frank will end up being Annaliese's client. 

I'll buy your top line.  If Famke isn't going to be a semi-regular, may as well kill the character off.  I know everyone loves Nate, and I think he's pleasant enough.  But when you get past his body, he's kind of boring.  And I don't see Annalise maintaining a healthy relationship.  It's not her thing, and would make it difficult for her to bitch so much.

If not those two, I offer Oliver (weak actor, and now bad character), Michaela (never liked her, don't like her with Asher), and possibly Meggy.  I wouldn't have expected Annalise to react so strongly to Meggy's death, but if Anna started the fire (have no idea), I think she would have a strong reaction to killing a good person who wasn't involved in all this mess.  And if Annalise set the house on fire to cover up the person's death, she would be prepared to howl and scream.  I just don't know.  I bought her reaction at first, but who knows.

[teenj12]

• I didn't really like the COTW, but I LOVED Annalise slapping the shit out of that guy. How dare he complain about three years? That is a slap on the wrist compared to what he could of gotten. Honestly, the fact that he had the audacity to wine after he KILLED people. I was so glad Annalise handed him his ass, but to bad it's about to come back and bite her's.
• Can I just say that I love Connor/Asher? And I lol'd when Asher said something along the lines of "I'll have sex with you" in exchange for him not showing Michaela the pictures. It's interesting that her ex-fiance found a new beard. It's hard to be that deep in the closet, I know.
• I liked the writers addressing racism in the gay community. Totally wasn't expecting it, but HTGAWM has never shied away from tackling plenty of social issues. I still don't think the Connor-Oliver split makes sense, but we'll see where they go with it.
• As for the Flash-Forwards, so far Annalise, Bonnie, and Oliver are all confirmed alive, but we still don't have the slightest clue about who the bodies could be, or even how this all happened in the first place. My personal guess is that the students killed someone again (maybe Frank?) in Annalise's house, and Annalise burned the house down (or ordered the students to) in order to try and cover it up. Someone else got caught up in it all and that's who the second body is.

[Feline Queen]

How convenient that Michaela had her engagement ring to pawn. 

Annalise would have to be Mad Hatter bonkers to burn her own house to the ground and sacrifice everything in it.  Even if she didn't care about any of the furnishings, it's also her place of business and all her case files would be there.  

[Lady Calypso]

1 hour ago, teenj12 said:

• I liked the writers addressing racism in the gay community. Totally wasn't expecting it, but HTGAWM has never shied away from tackling plenty of social issues. I still don't think the Connor-Oliver split makes sense, but we'll see where they go with it.

Me too. They were definitely trying to make a very pivotal point about this, which I enjoyed. I don't know if they quite hit the mark, seeing as the guy never said he was racist and Connor only guessed at what his profile would have said, so there's a possibility that he was wrong, but the point was there and I think it got near its mark. 

I just am thinking about this second body and how in the promo for next week, they say that they can't identify who it is, so I guess the body's burnt in some way. My initial thought is that it could be Connor because it would tie up Connor/Oliver's very out there break-up and them getting back together could be due to Connor almost dying. It would make sense as to why Oliver rushed over to Annalise's house in a frenzy (if he knew/suspected that Connor was there), because I can't see Oliver going to Annalise's house for Annalise. 

I'm thinking that if Wes isn't one of the bodies that maybe Meggie is. She's either going to be Annalise's stalker or she's going to be a victim. I also hope that Annalise's boss isn't one of the bodies. I like her. 

[love2lovebadtv]

6 hours ago, helenamonster said:

My stepsister is in PA school and she actually does practice on anyone in the family who will sit still long enough. I realize she's the exception to the rule, though.

I liked getting some backstory on Laurel this episode, and I love any storyline that lets Karla Souza speak Spanish. Her dad is kind of awful but he does have a point...she could do much better than Frank (I do not mean Wes) and should stop wasting her time trying to find him, at least outside of helping Annalise and Bonnie. But, nope, she's gonna find him on her own now, I assume, and that makes me even more worried that she's the one #UnderTheSheet. Annalise and Bonnie are not going to be happy when they find out Laurel hid this information from them, and the fact that we now know Bonnie survives the fire and appears to be 100% complicit in whatever happened there makes this even more likely, imo.

Speaking of the fire, there's a second body! They said at the end of the episode that they still had a pulse, but in the promo Bonnie is calling it "a body" and saying that the police can't identify it, which leads me to believe the second person is also dead. I'm gonna guess that this person is a newly-introduced and/or minor character like Meggy, the president, or that new annoying guy, Drake, and that while the #UnderTheSheet body was an intentional murder that Annalise, Bonnie, and perhaps others are responsible for, the second body was someone who was in the wrong place at the wrong time.

I liked that this episode addressed the issue of racism within the gay community. My best friend is a gay man (white, for what it's worth) and he talks about how frustrating it is to see such open racism on gay dating apps (just like Connor said, a lot of "masc for masc" and "no blacks, no Asians"). I wouldn't really know about this issue if it wasn't for my friend, and I think it was cool of this show to give it a little bit of a spotlight. It's not something mainstream media ever really gets in-depth with.

I was confused...what was the thing that Laurel signed? I figured it had something to do with her father's financials (he said her brother couldn't sign it because he was having money problems in Venezuela) but I wasn't clear on the specifics and how it might (or will) come back to bite her later. I also didn't realize that the women we met in the Christmas episode from season one, was Laurel's stepmother, not her mother, who her father apparently left after she suffered some mental health problems. Oh, and he wouldn't pay her ransom when she was kidnapped at sixteen! Well, that definitely explains her stoicism in the face of all the shit she's faced since going to Middleton, but I hope they dig deeper into this. Maybe it can be the big flashback plot of the second half of the season?

I dunno. The guy was a Jerk and I'm not up in the dating lingo. But I don't feel like the episode addressed racismnin the gay community. If he was a heterosexual black guy who was only interested in black women, I doubt people who have an issue with that or call it racism.

 

If anything I think Michaela makes inappropriate comments to Asher about his being white but people seem ok with it. She clearly has an issue being Asher but seems to also not want to be with someone outside her race. But I digress. 

I wasn't crazy about laurel at first but I've come to like the actress. And I think her character is interesting. I like that she doesn't get easily frazzled. Also think her dad is right about her having daddy issues. I found it interesting to see her interact with her dad. And I'd love to see more interact with people who knew the K 5 before law school. Remember how interesting it was when Annalise went home? I'd like to see more of that with other characters.