Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

[Defrauder]

Well I guess we know who got and burned the credit card statements at home.

[SometimesBites]

I wonder if there's any chance that Anna hasn't really heard about this yet. Like, how much internet/TV/newspaper access does she have? I imagine she knows SOMETHING is going on, but maybe she has only received a very filtered and inaccurate version. I also imagine that JB and M are in total shock; I am a jaded old broad and even I find the Ashley Madison concept pretty gross. If I found out my son had signed up, I would be reeling.

I am thinking that this has to be true. If it weren't, they surely would have responded publicly right away.

I'll wager the odds that Anna hasn't heard about this are about even with the odds that Donald Trump has shaved off his comb-over.

[kokapetl]

OK, looks like the OKC profile is gone now, and they found the man in the catfished pictures:

http://www.modelmayhem.com/1374459

That okcupid profile disappearing. What an astonishing coincidence! Like the astonishing series of coincidences I expect we'll be expected to believe in the coming days. Edited August 20, 2015 by Kokapetl

[Guest]

I see it opposite.

I think Michelle and Jim Bob are gonna drop him.  He is dragging them down. They are gonna claim he wasn't really saved and wasn't truly a Christian. Josh is gonna get sent to some sex addiction rehab place. Or something else only those two loons can think up.

But I think they are going to dump him like a hot potato. There is a lot of money at stake. Jim Bob likes his money! He likes being a star more than he likes Josh. Josh is so gone. 

 

I think they'll dump him, make statements about how it is sad that Satan ensnared one of their children, and they are praying for him.  He may be placed under "church discipline" meaning they avoid him.  

 

I feel sorry for Anna and those children. Even if the kids have no idea what is happening, their world is being rocked for the second time in just a few months.

[kokapetl]

Well I guess we know who got and burned the credit card statements at home.

Once the copies of the bills sent to the card holder are destroyed by the card holder, I'm sure there's just NO WAY they could be reprinted!

[Marigold]

I am reading from Duggar fans that he was set up.

 

I'm not tech saavy.  How do you set someone up with credit cards like that? Doesn't the bill go to his house? I'm just lost on how this is a set up. 

 

I really REALLY hope Anna is calmly looking through his credit card statements....

[SometimesBites]

Josh-   "Fix it Jesus"

Jesus- "Even I can't fix this"

"Fix it yourself, Gordito."

[kokapetl]

I think they'll dump him, make statements about how it is sad that Satan ensnared one of their children, and they are praying for him. He may be placed under "church discipline" meaning they avoid him.

I feel sorry for Anna and those children. Even if the kids have no idea what is happening, their world is being rocked for the second time in just a few months.

I think what Josh has secretly been up to is shocking news to them all. He made those who forgave him for what he did (his sisters), and trusted him to be a decent guy (his wife) and supported him (his parents) look like fools.

[Defrauder]

Once the copies of the bills sent to the card holder are destroyed by the card holder, I'm sure there's just NO WAY they could be reprinted!

Anna could probably call the company and have them send her a copy.  Or she can get a lawyer to do it for her. Once it's in the system it's there.  If it's a debit card the bank will have a record of the monthly transactions that she can access easily.

[Oldernowiser]

If he made payments online and why wouldn't he, rather than having statements mailed to the house where his wife is home all day, there's a record of it. As this whole thing proves, the Internet is forever.

Allegedly.

[Defrauder]

I don't trust JB and Michelle enough to give them any credit for being in the dark on this.  They weren't in the dark before.  I think they knew.  They probably hoped it wouldn't come out of course.  Maybe they prayed about it.  All it takes is that Fox interview rewind to convince me that they more than likely knew or at least suspected Josh's extra marital activities.

[kokapetl]

I am reading from Duggar fans that he was set up.

I'm not tech saavy. How do you set someone up with credit cards like that? Doesn't the bill go to his house? I'm just lost on how this is a set up.

I really REALLY hope Anna is calmly looking through his credit card statements....

identify theft does happen, but the thieves usually have the victim's address (and therefore mail) changed so the victim doesn't know. This doesn't seem to have happened. A super devoted "liberal conspirator" who somehow managed to intercept his mail would also need to cause the Ashley Madison hack. Incredibly and extremely unlikely.

[STFUFrank]

I am reading from Duggar fans that he was set up.

I'm not tech saavy. How do you set someone up with credit cards like that? Doesn't the bill go to his house? I'm just lost on how this is a set up.

I really REALLY hope Anna is calmly looking through his credit card statements....

As much as people dislike them for their views I can't see anyone being THAT dedicated to set up an account starting 2-3 years ago and another a year ago. But whatever floats their boats.

[Joe Jitsu913]

Why two accounts? I have two theories. 1)Anna learned about the first account. There is a gap between the two accounts, so he worked hard to be a faithful husband during that time. Eventually his craving for vagina (the boy likes to go to ChowTown!) caught up to him and he made the second account incase Anna ever logged into the first one to check up on him. 2)The second account was made because he realized he was dangerously dumb using his first name in his ID (JOSH_THE_MAN).

Maybe a combination of the two ideas expressed above.

I hear they have great tuna fish sandwiches in Chow Town.

[Defrauder]

If he made payments online and why wouldn't he, rather than having statements mailed to the house where his wife is home all day, there's a record of it. As this whole thing proves, the Internet is forever.

Allegedly.

Yes but even when you buy something online it reads on the statements sent to your address.  If he was using his home address the statements would have been sent there.  If I buy something online from a store using my debit card it comes out of my checking account and the monthly statement gets sent to my address with all of my transactions for the month.

[Gbb]

Anna could probably call the company and have them send her a copy.  Or she can get a lawyer to do it for her. Once it's in the system it's there.  If it's a debit card the bank will have a record of the monthly transactions that she can access easily.

 

She can only request a copy if her name is on the card, and I'd be surprised if that's the case.

 

I am reading from Duggar fans that he was set up.

 

I'm not tech saavy.  How do you set someone up with credit cards like that? Doesn't the bill go to his house? I'm just lost on how this is a set up. 

 

The credit card is in his name and seems to be attached to Josh's actual home address, so it couldn't have been a set up by someone creating an Ashley Madison account in his name. The only way he could have been set up is if one of the hackers chose to add his info to the data dump before it was made public, and even they'd have had to have access to his home address and credit card number, so it's very unlikely.

[Lemur]

I am reading from Duggar fans that he was set up.

 

I'm not tech saavy.  How do you set someone up with credit cards like that? Doesn't the bill go to his house? I'm just lost on how this is a set up. 

 

I really REALLY hope Anna is calmly looking through his credit card statements....

 

1.  He could do paperless billing for his AM account, and most likely did.

 

2.  Most "adult-oriented entertainment" never shows up under it's own name.  It would show up on a credit card or bank statement as an acronym or under a totally unrelated name, usually the holding company that owns the business or a third party card processor. (Strip clubs, for instance, tend to bill as car services.)

 

And I don't think this guy was set up at all.  Consider the timing.  The account gets cancelled just after InTouch releases the police report.  The PR team probably asked him if there was anything else out there that would look bad and told him to cancel the account.  Also, there have long been rumors that Josh was really into internet porn in his youth.    And let's be honest, if you're going to Catfish someone, why the hell would you pretend to be Josh Duggar?  I mean, I get that it would get you attention, but I would think in this case, it wouldn't be the kind you'd want.

[kokapetl]

Anna could probably call the company and have them send her a copy. Or she can get a lawyer to do it for her. Once it's in the system it's there. If it's a debit card the bank will have a record of the monthly transactions that she can access easily.

If he made payments online and why wouldn't he, rather than having statements mailed to the house where his wife is home all day, there's a record of it. As this whole thing proves, the Internet is forever.

Allegedly.

Anything he received from the bank is merely a customized printout of data that remains intact at the bank. A copy of the customized printout he received probably remains intact at the bank. Edited August 20, 2015 by Kokapetl

[Lemur]

identify theft does happen, but the thieves usually have the victim's address (and therefore mail) changed so the victim doesn't know. This doesn't seem to have happened. A super devoted "liberal conspirator" who somehow managed to intercept his mail would also need to cause the Ashley Madison hack. Incredibly and extremely unlikely.

 

So, if this is wandering too far off topic, if this hypothetical liberal conspirator was going to do that, why would they do it to Josh Duggar and not, say Mike Huckabee, Rand Paul, or Chris Christie?  But yes, highly unlikely.

[Cherrio]

I also doubt Josh found what he was looking for. The place is apparently 95% male and I wonder what the ratio of prostitutes to gold diggers, let alone women genuinely looking for an affair is.

His one guaranteed hook up might of turned out to be his mom so he turned it down.

[kokapetl]

So, if this is wandering too far off topic, if this hypothetical liberal conspirator was going to do that, why would they do it to Josh Duggar and not, say Mike Huckabee, Rand Paul, or Chris Christie? But yes, highly unlikely.

I guess it could be argued Josh's stupidity and arrogance made him low hanging fruit. I do think tabloids wouldn't have touched him if he had real connections and power. But I also think his stupidity and arrogance account for him signing up for an Ashley Madison account.

His one guaranteed hook up might of turned out to be his mom so he turned it down.

I wonder how Amy find herself hookups. Edited August 20, 2015 by Kokapetl

[Oldernowiser]

So, if this is wandering too far off topic, if this hypothetical liberal conspirator was going to do that, why would they do it to Josh Duggar and not, say Mike Huckabee, Rand Paul, or Chris Christie?  But yes, highly unlikely.

Excellent point. Other than here, Josh Duggar is extremely small potatoes. If someone is going to that much trouble over several years, they'd aim higher. Any one of several presidential candidates, for example.

And that person would have to know the site was going to be hacked or have the ability to add Duggar's data to the dump.

Too much trouble for the target, IMO.

[cheatincheetos]

What are the odds on him having an account on ChristianMingle or FarmersOnly?

I think he'd avoid CM. Religious folk would be more likely to watch the show and recognize him.

It also says he is "strictly monogamous". 

Maybe he misunderstood the question and agreed that he was "strictly monotonous".

I'd be a little surprised if a woman who hooked up with Josh via AM comes out with a story.

 

Mostly because I totally believe he signed up - twice - and paid up, with all intentions of getting sex, but didn't actually hook up with anyone via AM. The online news stories indicate that AM was ripping off its customers - huge male to female ratio of members, alleged creation of tons of fake female profiles, etc.

Sounds about right. There are tons of blogs and youtube videos with the same complaint about OKC and POF, the skewed ratios of men to women, the lower response rate from women (because they have too many messages to answer) and the suspicions that the site is using fake profiles to mess with them and keep them from cancelling. I'm just amazed that they managed to get so many people to sign up. I'd think most cheaters would just try a sly way to use the mainstream sites to find what they want.

[sr7698]

The whole what will JB/Michelle do about Josh and did they/didn't they know discussion is fascinating.  JB/Michelle are in a tough spot with Josh.  He was their "golden child" and now is a 27 year old father of 4 young children with a GED and (as far as we know) no way to support himself and his family.  If they don't help him out, I would be deathly afraid of Josh and Anna saying "F**k it, let's write a tell-all book, go on talk shows" and expose all the dirty laundry about the Duggars as a way to make some money.  On the other hand, continuing to be connected to Josh "hurts the brand."

[cheatincheetos]

If you google "random guy", that pic he stole is one of the first results.

Catfish are always so lazy. Always a 'model' and always one of the first pics in a search result.

[Julia]

So far, it's possible. None of us have seen Josh Duggar's credit card statement, and we only have the evidence of a database which could have been tampered with that those are real transactions to a card in his control. Someone with access to his account could confirm it in minutes. For the rest of us, we'll have to wait until the transactional data becomes available.

[truthtalk2014]

Once the copies of the bills sent to the card holder are destroyed by the card holder, I'm sure there's just NO WAY they could be reprinted!

I'm sure Josh set it up to not get paper bills in the mail.  I don't get any statements in the mail.  I view them all online.  With most of mine you can print statements from a few years back.  So, I don't think Anna would have ever had a chance to see the statements.  And you know Josh pays all the bills because he's so smart and a man.

 

Josh in the near future.

 

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view2/4016849/jimmy-swaggart-crying-o.gif

Edited August 20, 2015 by truthtalk2014

[cheatincheetos]

http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Passcode/2015/0820/The-troubling-ripple-effect-of-the-Ashley-Madison-data-dump

 

"The trove included information that can be tied to "a handful of congressmen" and executives from Fortune 500 companies, said Mr. Hansen, who has analyzed the leaked information."

 

Hang in there Joshy, maybe you'll have company soon with some of your old "family values" Congressbuddies!

[camom]

Even if a credit card statement came to the house saying that he charged to "Ashley Madison," Anna wouldn't have had a clue what that was.  He could tell her he'd bought some clothes and she wouldn't know the difference.  (I know I'd never heard of Ashley Madison until they were hacked.)

[Ljohnson1987]

Guess Smugs thought the J in that JOY thing they follow meant "Josh First"

[Wishing Well]

I actually work for a bank so I can confirm, paper statements are generated ONLY per customer choice, otherwise it's all available on online banking. If Anna uses OLB but did not have her name on that particular card as an owner, she wouldn't have ever had indication that the card existed, and it's against compliance and punishable by lawsuit for the bank to ever let Anna even know of its existence.

Granted, the bank also keeps all statements at fingertips access for 7 years and anything longer than that can still be requested. What you do at your bank never goes away, we pulled up a 30 year old statement the other day for someone doing estate planning. All Anna has to do is to get a lawyer who can subpoena his accounts and legal HAS to force them over.

[NextIteration]

Adding that IF the second account was billed to his business account - for certain Anna wouldn't have access to any of that.

[Cherrio]

Even if a credit card statement came to the house saying that he charged to "Ashley Madison," Anna wouldn't have had a clue what that was.  He could tell her he'd bought some clothes and she wouldn't know the difference.  (I know I'd never heard of Ashley Madison until they were hacked.)

Ashley Madison does sound like a Fundie clothing store. 

[Ljohnson1987]

I cannot imagine how Anna must be feeling with all of this coming out. She has a brand new baby, and three other young kids to take care of.  I don’t know how she doesn’t have the knowledge or strength to leave Josh. What is it doing for her, to stay with him? Thanks, Gothard. You’re a real prince. Anna needs to get some advice from her siblings that have left, and never looked back. I hope she puts her kids before Smugs.

[Missy Vixen]

Pornhub, redtube.  Probably just the vanilla categories.

I'm waiting for the porn addiction to come out. Seriously.

[kokapetl]

I actually work for a bank so I can confirm, paper statements are generated ONLY per customer choice, otherwise it's all available on online banking. If Anna uses OLB but did not have her name on that particular card as an owner, she wouldn't have ever had indication that the card existed, and it's against compliance and punishable by lawsuit for the bank to ever let Anna even know of its existence.

Granted, the bank also keeps all statements at fingertips access for 7 years and anything longer than that can still be requested. What you do at your bank never goes away, we pulled up a 30 year old statement the other day for someone doing estate planning. All Anna has to do is to get a lawyer who can subpoena his accounts and legal HAS to force them over.

But is this like Swiss banking? I'd assume that in America a wife can get access to her husbands records via the courts. Am I wrong to assume this? (I'm not American).

[Ljohnson1987]

Also, thank you to the mods for putting up with whatever is to come from this mess.

[kokapetl]

Ashley Madison does sound like a Fundie clothing store.

Lydia Madison. Dainty Mary-Kate & Ashley Jewell. Edited August 20, 2015 by Kokapetl

[BatmanBeatles]

I cannot imagine how Anna must be feeling with all of this coming out. She has a brand new baby, and three other young kids to take care of.  I don’t know how she doesn’t have the knowledge or strength to leave Josh. What is it doing for her, to stay with him? Thanks, Gothard. You’re a real prince. Anna needs to get some advice from her siblings that have left, and never looked back. I hope she puts her kids before Smugs.

I can only imagine that at this point she's in denial.

[Ljohnson1987]

So, Smugs spent a grand on sex sites, but only gave $500  to the man who helped build the TTH who is battling cancer? I guess we know where his priorities are.

[Fabricationary]

So, I don't think Anna would have ever had a chance to see the statements.  And you know Josh pays all the bills because he's so smart and a man.

 

Yeah, Josh probably bought Anna some Bic for Her pens to use for notebook doodling.   Not for any serious, financial, or official writing.   

Edited August 20, 2015 by Fabricationary

[galax-arena]

Also, thank you to the mods for putting up with whatever is to come from this mess.

The mods were probably breathing a sigh of relief that all the craziness from the molestation scandal had died down, and then this happened. Josh is so inconsiderate.

[Ljohnson1987]

Yes.  Here's a statement from Josh. I'll pray for Anna. Pray that she leaves his sorry ass.

 

https://www.duggarfamily.com/michelles-blog?ID=651536de-8b7d-4525-afb0-3f525bc390e1

[sometimesy]

Has there been a statement? I can just imagine JB messing this one up, or arguing with the PR peeps about what to say. It must be hell working with JB. (Although he should stay right out of this one.

 

Well, there is my answer. haha Thank you Ljohnson1987!

Edited August 20, 2015 by sometimesy

[Ilovemylabs]

I agree that she'll have to get tough, completely. But toughness is usually something we have to grow into as we go through hell. With 4 tiny children including a nursing newborn, and a life under severe publc scrutiny, this all has to be a little slice of hell, heartbreaking and scary. As stringently as I disagree with her world view, and as stupidly ignorant, arrogant, and sappy as I've always found Anna, I feel for the hurt and utter disallusionment she's grappling with today. Breach of trust is a deep wound.

Anna will stick it out just like Hillary Clinton and Anthony Weiner's wife.

[sometimesy]

He did a Hugh Grant. I think it was the right move.

[JoanArc]

 

I'm waiting for the porn addiction to come out. Seriously.

This is why I raised a stink when that story that Josh watched porn at a candidate's headquarters came out. It's escalation, and see where it led?

[Fabricationary]

Yes.  Here's a statement from Josh. I'll pray for Anna. Pray that she leaves his sorry ass.

 

https://www.duggarfamily.com/michelles-blog?ID=651536de-8b7d-4525-afb0-3f525bc390e1

 

Wait wait wait....paying $1K for two separate Ashley Madison accounts held for over two years, plus an OKcupid profile, all of which solicit sex from women, and possibly having the extramarital affairs and/or sexual encounters sought through these profiles, is now reduced to "viewing pornography over the internet"?

[Cherrio]

Also, thank you to the mods for putting up with whatever is to come from this mess.

The mods are in a richly appointed room, saying out loud......Every time I think I am out, they pull me back in.      

[JennyMominFL]

Statements From Jim Bob and Michelle Duggar and Josh Duggar
August 20, 2015
Statement from Jim Bob and Michelle Duggar:

Please see the statement below from our son Josh regarding recent media stories about him. When we learned of this late last night our hearts were broken. As we continue to place our trust in God we ask for your prayers for Josh, Anna, our grandchildren and our entire family.

Statement from Josh Duggar:

I have been the biggest hypocrite ever. While espousing faith and family values, I have secretly over the last several years been viewing pornography on the internet and this became a secret addiction and I became unfaithful to my wife.

I am so ashamed of the double life that I have been living and am grieved for the hurt, pain and disgrace my sin has caused my wife and family, and most of all Jesus and all those who profess faith in Him.

I brought hurt and a reproach to my family, close friends and the fans of our show with my actions that happened when I was 14-15 years old, and now I have re-broken their trust.

The last few years, while publicly stating I was fighting against immorality in our country, I was hiding my own personal failings.

As I am learning the hard way, we have the freedom to choose to our actions, but we do not get to choose our consequences. I deeply regret all hurt I have caused so many by being such a bad example.

I humbly ask for your forgiveness. Please pray for my precious wife Anna and our family during this time.

Josh Duggar

 

http://duggarfamily.com/michelles-blog?ID=651536de-8b7d-4525-afb0-3f525bc390e1

Edited August 20, 2015 by JennyMominFL