S08.E12: Always the Bitch, Never the Bride

[Castina]

I believe Bethenny went through what she went through.  I believe she felt very tired. weak and that it can come in waves.  I've experienced all this myself.   I know others that have experienced it.  

I just don't care.  I just don't find her a pleasant person, at all.  She's nasty as hell and was like that before this medical crisis.  It's hard to muster up any sympathy for a person like her.  So all I have to say about this and her "sharing" is ok, thanks, moving on now. 

The most interesting thing at the dog wedding was Ramona.

I don't know if I imagined it but did anyone else feel there was a very quick look of "WTF" from Bethenny when Carole mentioned she was inviting Sonja to the dog wedding?

Edited June 23, 2016 by Castina

[WireWrap]

2 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

Besides bleeding the other major announcement were Ramona's claims of having dated Tom seven times were dispelled.  Big difference between a single encounter and seven dates.  I thought Dorinda was insightful when she claimed Ramona does not care to see other people happy.

Ramona really is very unaware.  Her coaching Sonja to say, "I am sorry, forgive me," was telling.  It showed me there is exactly zero sincerity in Ramona's apologies.  It is really all about the other person forgiving not for the transgression.

I believe in yesterday's press release Bethenny said she wanted to remove shame from gynecological bleeding.  It is like humbling bragging, "I still  menstruate." (Very Brandi RHOBH and her "flow" statements. Since I have never seen as shameful, it may be embarrassing, inconvenient, destructive to furniture and clothing and linens, it does raise the issue the RH in general have done to one another about shaming the others.  There was something insincere about Bethenny trying to distance herself age wise from her problems and hysterectomy.  Bethenny's child bearing years are over.  She will be 46 years old in a few months.  http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/05/27/late.pregnancy.risks/  She, Ramona and even Luann need to stop trying to sell us they are ripe for childbearing.  Just because you have periods doesn't mean you are ovulating.  I really don't want the franchises to devolve into menopause discussions but at some point these women need to stop attaching their superiority to absence of menopause.  I welcome their discussions about non-age related infertility because that is something that is real and heartbreaking and of course overcoming it results in a child.  Adoption is also a very real option.

So this group of RH have had plenty of chances to take the highroad and choose not to.  Brandi and her "menopausal mamas", LVP announcing at the Reunion that Kyle peed herself when the ladies took the cameras and their night of drunken gymnastics, Meghan stress incontinence shaming Shannon for not being able to jog,  Tamra bringing the camera crew into her room to memorialize Vicki peeing on the bed.  It was totally in character Ramona bemoaning the fact she might have to return a bathing suit because of Bethenny's maladies.

Actually, I would find it refreshing if the older HWs, 45+, would address the issue of Menopause and how they are facing it. Instead it is used to shame other HWs or something to be avoided at all cost by those already in perimenopause or menopause itself.

[DelicateDee]

14 hours ago, Muffyn said:

Going to Home Goods when feeling that bad was silly.  Dorinda came off as very kind.  When she's not drunk and screaming, she seems really pleasant.  Hmm, maybe when Ramona was talking how great Sonja was when sober she really meant Dorinda.  Sonja is much more fun drunk. 

I hated the damn dog wedding.  So freaking boring. 

I got the sense that she wasn't feeling that bad when she first met Dorinda at Home Goods, and she did say that she has a scheduled appt. later.  I think she had a sudden episode that dictated that she get to the doctors stat.  Never having those kind of health issues, I'm surmising that it's not always extreme, hence you don't have to be bedridden 24/7.  I'm sure those who have dealt with this issue will clarify that.  Also, some people just won't acquiesce to an illness, till their forced to.  Different strokes and all that . . . 

[izabella]

3 hours ago, njbchlover said:

Forgive me if this has been answered already, but did Jules ever say WHY she was climbing in/out of a window when she injured her "coochie coo"??  WTF??  

Jules did not say.  However, in a lot of older homes there are some awkward balconies that you actually have to climb onto via a window.  My friends have a Chicago two-flat where there is a balcony built on top of the front porch, and the only way to access it is to climb through the window.  Yes, one day they might replace the windows with French doors, but it's not that important and it would mean changing the face of the house considerably to remove the classic, large windows there, so they don't mind the climb.

44 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

Besides bleeding the other major announcement were Ramona's claims of having dated Tom seven times were dispelled.  Big difference between a single encounter and seven dates.  I thought Dorinda was insightful when she claimed Ramona does not care to see other people happy.

Ramona really is very unaware.  Her coaching Sonja to say, "I am sorry, forgive me," was telling.  It showed me there is exactly zero sincerity in Ramona's apologies.  It is really all about the other person forgiving not for the transgression.
 

Yes, interesting how Ramona's lies and exaggerations are revealed now, long after they were trying to shame Luann for not seeking permission from Ramona to date this man.  So, either the shaming was fake, or Ramona is just an asshole.  I think the latter.

And we already know Ramona's apologies don't mean shit; she just says the words to placate people.  And, apparently, she has to practice and role play them to get them just right, which is how she knew how to train Sonja to do it.  Again, asshole.

Quote

 

I believe in yesterday's press release Bethenny said she wanted to remove shame from gynecological bleeding.  It is like humbling bragging, "I still  menstruate." (Very Brandi RHOBH and her "flow" statements. Since I have never seen as shameful, it may be embarrassing, inconvenient, destructive to furniture and clothing and linens, it does raise the issue the RH in general have done to one another about shaming the others.  There was something insincere about Bethenny trying to distance herself age wise from her problems and hysterectomy.  Bethenny's child bearing years are over.  She will be 46 years old in a few months.  http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/05/27/late.pregnancy.risks/ She, Ramona and even Luann need to stop trying to sell us they are ripe for childbearing.  Just because you have periods doesn't mean you are ovulating.  I really don't want the franchises to devolve into menopause discussions but at some point these women need to stop attaching their superiority to absence of menopause.  I welcome their discussions about non-age related infertility because that is something that is real and heartbreaking and of course overcoming it results in a child.  Adoption is also a very real option.

So this group of RH have had plenty of chances to take the highroad and choose not to.  Brandi and her "menopausal mamas", LVP announcing at the Reunion that Kyle peed herself when the ladies took the cameras and their night of drunken gymnastics, Meghan stress incontinence shaming Shannon for not being able to jog,  Tamra bringing the camera crew into her room to memorialize Vicki peeing on the bed.  It was totally in character Ramona bemoaning the fact she might have to return a bathing suit because of Bethenny's maladies.

 

Yes, yes, these women are all in menopause or much closer to it than to having babies (huge eye roll at ALL of them who bring that up) except for Jules.  These "girl's girls" sure do like to disparage menopause and the women who go through it (all women) as a natural part of life.  It's a way to shame them for being "OLD" and MY GOD, women who are OLD should be put out to pasture rather than openly discussing menopause because OMG, it's something to be embarrassed and ashamed of and should be hushed up. 

Yeah, guess what?  All that hiding of menopause means women often have no idea what their options are and why they should be beating their doctors' doors down to get the right hormone treatments, don't know that HRT can help prevent the #1 killer of women (heart disease), and what is worse?  DOCTORS also don't know.  You have to go to an endocrinologist, for pete's sake, to get any knowledgeable doctors.  Gynecologists should be all over this for their older patients, but I guess they only care about younger women.  There is also very little funding and research for menopause, unlike the wide wonderful world of Viagra and it's ilk.

So these women could raise a lot of awareness, but instead, they use menopause to shame others. 

Edited June 23, 2016 by izabella

[ElDosEquis]

15 hours ago, bravofan27 said:

I haven't seen the episode yet, but did enjoy the Luann special. She's cool, which I always knew. She's not like Bethanny where she makes it so you have to feel sorry for her or else you are a terrible person. Luann is just like, "This is my life. This part was hard. This part was good." 

That is probably the one thing makes her attractive as a person.

When you get past the pomposity that is 'the countess', she has an interesting past. I see now where she gets her brashness and FIDO attitude.

[izabella]

I really enjoyed Luann's special.  We've heard bits and pieces of her life story, but it's pretty amazing all things considered. 

The thing that really struck me was that Luann's giddy "in love" happiness (which we saw from the home videos, especially the one where the Count visits her family in their home), and the giddy "in love" happiness she's got going on now with new guy seem very similar.  I think Lu is someone who knows herself very well.

[StevieRocks]

7 minutes ago, ElDosEquis said:

That is probably the one thing makes her attractive as a person.

When you get past the pomposity that is 'the countess', she has an interesting past. I see now where she gets her brashness and FIDO attitude.

I really liked the special, too. It was very interesting; her life has been quite fabulous. For me, it also clarified why a lot of hags--Crazy Eyes, Nasty Bethenny--are pretty jealous of her, IMHO. This might sound stupid, but I thought it really humanized her a lot and made me despise Crazy Eyes and Bethenny even more for their vile pile on at Dorinda's. 

[NoWhammies]

Bethenny, I sympathize but bitch, please. I lost 50 percent of my blood from a fibroid hemorrhage about 18 months ago. I went to the ER one night. They said, "Nah - go home. We don't deal with women's issues."  (apparently I'd only lost about 30 percent by that point). The next day, I couldn't stand, I couldn't walk. Every time I tried to even sit up, I fainted. My husband carried me into the ER. Apparently 50 percent was a better number, because they gave me a transfusion and dealt with women's issues.

[Radar]

After this snoozer of an episode , and no big trip in the mix I don't have much hope for the rest of the season. I fear Beth's health issues are going to be the main focus and hi-jack the season like Yo's Lyme disease did on RHOBH.

[Umbelina]

9 hours ago, poeticlicensed said:

On WWHL Beth said that they all knew going in that Jules marriage was breaking up. Wtf? So this entire season of he gets home Iate. I make him eggs, we are redoing our house in the Hamptons was pure BS? 

I watched the Lu special and the second she said she was from Berlin CT and what her maiden name was i  yelled for Mr. Poetic. He was born and raised there and graduated from the same high school. he said he didn't know Lu cuz she is 10 years younger but he knows her older brothers and everyone knew the dads construction company. Too funny. 

Thanks for bringing that up!  Seriously, that was a significant revelation.  It puts a completely different spin on all of the early scenes with Jules and Michael.  Specifically, I'm thinking of the renovation tour in the Hamptons, and Jules' revelation that she has "every eating disorder there is" to Bethenny, because knowing this woman is sick and facing divorce, a huge stresser and rejection, as well as being so honest about her issues?  I dunno, it explains a lot. 

9 hours ago, poeticlicensed said:

Staging that wedding must have cost well in excess of the 10:k they raised. 

My thought as well.  It was wretched excess, and I don't give a damn if some stuff was donated, why not donate the money itself?  I was rewatching the Hunger Games series this week, and all I could think of is "These idiots would fit right in with the other Capitol people."  There is something wrong with our world, children going hungry, but expensive clothing for dogs is "cool?"  Ugh.

7 hours ago, Duke2801 said:

Gosh dangit Bethenny, I do not like you. You are mean, egotistical, and basically an asshole for the most part.  So STOP making me feel a modicum of sympathy for you, OK?  I've never dealt with endometriosis, but I can only imagine that it would be scary to be bleeding that severely, and then hear phrases like "living will." And yes, to somebody who has never had a hospital stay (like me), to hear that you have to be in the hospital for 3 days IS jarring and upsetting.  At least, I know I would feel that way.  

As for the hysterectomy/child-bearing thing, I mean... I can't hate on her for that either. I am sure if you had your kids young, it's hard to imagine starting over again in your 40s. But I DO have friends who are still having kids well into their 40s. One my besties just had her first last month at age 42.  Another woman I know got accidentally (seriously-not on purpose) pregnant at 46 and gave birth at 47. So it's become much more common nowadays, and not just with celebrities.

Bethenny did mention last season she'd like to have one more child. It was in her scene with Frederick when they were looking for places for her to live.  So it's not out of left field that she was upset by that.    

So, I shall continue to hate on the woman for a myriad of reasons, but her reaction to the endometriosis and the possible hysterectomy will not be two of them.

 

That's why I don't "love" or "hate" any of them.  Some annoy me more than others, but I can find things about each of them to like or dislike, or at least parts of their lives where I can sympathize or applaud or want to throw eggs.  They are complicated women, each with things to celebrate or dislike, and moment to moment?  That can change for me.  I think I'm just not an "all or nothing" person, it's the shades of grey that I like most.  I can dislike them in one situation, and laugh or cry with them in the next.  That's true of all of them for me.

2 hours ago, venezia54 said:

I feel horrible for Bethenny. I doubt she's exaggerating for the cameras, because everything she's going through rings true. People think that because fibroids are benign, they are no big deal. But they can be serious, and it's major surgery. I had fibroids that were so bad, they wrapped around other organs. When I walked into the ER distended like I was 8 months pregnant, my BP was so low, it was life-threatening. I was put on the oncology ward,  had to sign a living will and a DNR--and was rushed into surgery. Then there was the waiting to make sure the tissue wasn't malignant, which,thank god, it wasn't. My uterous was completely crowded with fibroids, they had wrapped around my ovaries, and they were affecting other organs,  so I had to have a total hysterectomy. I  had complications, so I was in the hospital for 12 days. I then had to go through a surgical menopause,  and it took  months to recover. Even when I recovered physically, it took a really long time to feel like myself again. I noticed Bethenny was really subdued on WWHL, which is how I was post-surgery. I wish her all the best in continuing her recovery. 

Her blog post was pretty enlightening, and I think it shows how anyone, regardless of how great their health insurance is, or how much money they have, can be confused and frightened once something scary/medical happens to them.  Someone might be the most competent, strongest person in the rest of their life, but scares like this, with all of the confusing decisions to be made, can bring them to their knees.  In my real life I've done cancer support for 16 years now, working closely with medical professionals, and the one thing I do know?  EVERYONE is unique, and everyone reacts differently.  Often options for treatment plans are confusing, or one doctor strongly advises one thing while another insists their way is correct.  It can be scary as hell, and frankly, doctors are only human, they make mistakes, they don't know everything.  That realization is hard for people who have been healthy most of their life to accept, it's another scary thing to deal with.  Dr. Welby MD doesn't exist in our world anymore, it's specialists and tests and confusing advice. 

On WWHL last night she said she was embarrassed about how emotional she got.  I don't think she should be, she's not alone in that.

[Alonzo Mosely FBI]

Once this "crisis" passes I absolutely dread the Red Queen, On the Rag, Aunt Flo humor that motormouth Bethenny will toss around. Watch what happens....

[Bronzedog]

I totally sympathize with Bethenny, but then I also don't hate her.  I assume she showed up for drinks with Luanne and Carole and then shopping with Dorinda is because it's her job and she was just trying to do it.  I think something happened when she was shopping that freaked her out because of the way she left.

[Straycat80]

I loved Ramona of all people giving Apology 101 lessons to Sonja, that was hysterical! 

Not a fan of Sonja's but she said she is trying and not drinking to please the other women, especially Bethenny (which I think is sad). And then before the Mexico trip gets cancelled Bethenny said she didn't want Sonja and Luann and their antics messing things up. What about Ramona? Do they not remember all her drunk ass behavior and turtle time? And B. Made it sound like she was paying for everything on this trip. Doesn't Bravo fund these trips? 

[Umbelina]

9 minutes ago, Bronzedog said:

I totally sympathize with Bethenny, but then I also don't hate her.  I assume she showed up for drinks with Luanne and Carole and then shopping with Dorinda is because it's her job and she was just trying to do it.  I think something happened when she was shopping that freaked her out because of the way she left.

Yeah, life goes on.  Even when you have something medically wrong with you, especially in the beginning when it hasn't quite sunk in yet, you go on with your life.  The IUD was removed, bleeding was expected, activity probably made it increase, but it wasn't as if her doctor told her "bed rest!"  She was living her life.  The shopping thing was an obvious Bravo designed sponsor set up, and Bethenny was scheduled to film that with Dorinda.  It's a quick little scene doing something she enjoys, shopping for home goods, so no biggie.  Until it was, the faintness and bleeding increased and her doctor appointment was already scheduled.  Thank heavens Dorinda offered to go with her, and frankly, Bethenny eventually accepting that showed just how scared/ill she was.  

[seasick]

18 hours ago, Baltimore Betty said:

There is a comedian named "Fat Jew.?"  It does sound anti semetic.
 

I remember on The Office when Michael asked Oscar if it bothered him when people called him a "Mexican".  He said "No Michael, I am Mexican.  I love this example because it showed thru Michael's question that people's prejudice and bigotry is their problem and in their head, and Oscar's pride of his ancestral nationality was was unshaken.  

It bothers me when people bend to these prejudiced attitudes and decide such terms have been so sullied as to change them.  I feel as though they are giving in to it--and often they change it yet again!  If people say that i'm 'tall" with a look of a bad smell on their face I'm not changing it to 'elegantly inched' or something.  "No Michael, I am tall".   

[lezlers]

2 hours ago, Boofish said:

So this "event" is getting dumber by the minute. There is an unfortunate Facebook challenge now. I was "nominated" and here is what it said "I'm bringing awareness to cancer. If nominated you have to post 5 selfies where you feel beautiful and then nominate 5 people" When I asked "how are you bringing awareness? who is not "aware" of cancer? which type of cancer? how does posting 5 selfies bring awareness to cancer?" I was promptly deleted and blocked. This is what this "dog charity wedding" is starting to remind me of *atomic eye roll*

I always refer to this as "slactivism."   Raising "awareness" for a cause using the least amount of effort, whilst still being able to show off your altruism to all of your friends (while not doing anything that actually helps the cause in any sort of meaningful way.) 

[HumblePi]

4 hours ago, njbchlover said:

Forgive me if this has been answered already, but did Jules ever say WHY she was climbing in/out of a window when she injured her "coochie coo"??  WTF??  

I feel like we're beating a dead horse and I don't I want to make this forum the 'Vagina Monologues' but others have wondered about this 'accident'. I mean, we all have a "coochie-coo" that we treasure with pride. We protect it feverishly every minute of the day. We primp it, preen it, clean it and treat it v-e-e-r-r-y gently. Usually we protect it like a treasure by wearing clothes that protect it against sharp objects that might cause trauma or worse yet....laceration. (arghhh!)

So, since Jules wasn't explicit with her explanation, other than she was climbing into a window (why?) and somehow either broke glass and cut her crotch through her jeans or whatever, OR she bruised it badly on the window frame by falling solidly on top of it as she was straddling it. Since I don't trust anyone and think they're all liars and cheaters, I have developed my own scenario as to how her vagina may have became so traumatized as to make Jules believe she might need vaginoplasty.  She and Michael were either having makeup sex or having some kind of kinky revenge sex and one of them had a sharp object in their hand and used it on Jules's vag. Okay, that's pretty overboard and disgusting but leaving us up to the wiles of our own imagination with this whole vagina thing has my mind spinning with scenarios.

Donald Trump has expertly put a mental image into the minds of his supporters with descriptions such as "Lying Ted", "Crooked Hillary", and "Little Marco".  Jules will forever be "Vagina Jules" in my mind.

[Knuckles]

4 hours ago, AuntiePam said:

  I've always been curious about dogs in NYC, especially in apartments where there's little or no green space. 

Pam,

Dogs in NYC live charmed lives, as long as they have caring owners. On the west side where I live, there are 3 big dog runs in Riverside Park, and off leash hours before 9am and after 9pm, when the park is filled with dogs and owners running along the river and thru the grass. And, the sidewalks in NY are remarkably clean, as the poop law is enforced, both by the cops,but mostly by peer pressure from other dog owners.

[Umbelina]

33 minutes ago, Straycat80 said:

I loved Ramona of all people giving Apology 101 lessons to Sonja, that was hysterical! 

Not a fan of Sonja's but she said she is trying and not drinking to please the other women, especially Bethenny (which I think is sad). And then before the Mexico trip gets cancelled Bethenny said she didn't want Sonja and Luann and their antics messing things up. What about Ramona? Do they not remember all her drunk ass behavior and turtle time? And B. Made it sound like she was paying for everything on this trip. Doesn't Bravo fund these trips? 

I wonder about that as well.

I know many think Bethenny does nothing but lie, but I'm not one of those people.  I think she's often quite honest, and often that is to her detriment.

Anyway, I may or may not be right about this, but watching her last night I thought this.  Bravo is paying for some/most of it, but Bethenny added in some extras that Bravo wouldn't chip in for, the caviar thing, possibly the helicopter trip, or other extras.  She may have negotiated with Beam or made sure to film some Skinny Girl stuff so she could write some of it off, but I did get the definite idea that she was heavily involved in the planning of the trip, and was contributing financially to that trip.  Bravo usually gets write-offs or huge discounts for showcasing the hotel as well.

[anonymiss]

6 hours ago, ZaldamoWilder said:

You know what?  Dammit, Jules made me love her.  I didn't wanna do it, I didn't wanna do it.   A windowsill cooch injury doesn't sound like a lot of fun but I giggled when she told the story.  Hematomato!  Lol!!  Girl's a hoot. I wonder if her sense of humor is Jewish or Asian.

LOL I've accepted and come to look forward to her next mention of being Asian. It's like she's doing it with a wink and a nod, embracing the inevitable drinking game montage to come for the Reunion. 

I can sympathize with Bethenny, especially since it's what my sister-in-law just went through, but not too much given what she's like on a normal day. This quickly remedied health issue doesn't excuse anything that came before and will undoubtedly come after.

I enjoyed Ramona's impression of Bethenny, but it's a good point that it's disgusting they've reached this level of subservience where they need to ensure they show proper penitence to Queen B.

Edited June 23, 2016 by anonymiss

[raiderred1]

2 hours ago, beaker73 said:

Mine does as well.  I wish him and you all the best.

I really hate to hear about all this cancer for y'all and your loved ones.  My thoughts are with you all.

[charmed1]

Quote

 

That's why I don't "love" or "hate" any of them.  Some annoy me more than others, but I can find things about each of them to like or dislike, or at least parts of their lives where I can sympathize or applaud or want to throw eggs.  They are complicated women, each with things to celebrate or dislike, and moment to moment?  That can change for me.  I think I'm just not an "all or nothing" person, it's the shades of grey that I like most.  I can dislike them in one situation, and laugh or cry with them in the next.  That's true of all of them for me.

^These are my thoughts, articulated much better than I attempted. These women are here for my entertainment. I don't love nor hate any of them. Expressing that I find Bethenny obnoxious or Ramona neurotic, Dorinda a drunkard, or being surprised by Bethenny's reaction to her medical woes does not equal "Hater." I'm not "team" anybody. My dislike/like/amusement/horror of these women is fluid amongst all the franchises. I can hate something Heather Dubrow says, but still like her outfit. I can say LVP walks like a duck, but still admire her business acumen. I don't know what it is about the RHONY forum that brings out so much, "If this was said about (insert other housewife name) then everyone would be in a tizzy, but because it's (insert poster's fave) then it's okay." But it really, really isn't that deep, because frankly, these people really aren't that deep. I like to come here and read the snark, but don't want to feel like I have to choose firm and unwavering allegiance to some empty headed HW just because. They all suck at some point in time, don't they? Even your favorite. Back to the OC. I need some bacon flavored Vicki vodka.

[raiderred1]

3 hours ago, WireWrap said:

Actually, I would find it refreshing if the older HWs, 45+, would address the issue of Menopause and how they are facing it. Instead it is used to shame other HWs or something to be avoided at all cost by those already in perimenopause or menopause itself.

I think that is a great idea as it always seems like a dark shroud of mystery, especially in the U.S of A. since going through my total hysterectomy I often wonder if women around me, say at the store, have been through it because I have found it scary and lonely to go through it without really knowing many women that have gone through it before me. I wonder if any of the HW's have had a hysterectomy.   My grandma had one in the 1950's and she died in 2000 at 91, so she is the only female in my family to go through this surgery. You honestly feel like you will be this, "not really me anymore person", for the rest of your life and the doctors are zero help. 

[WireWrap]

1 minute ago, raiderred1 said:

I think that is a great idea as it always seems like a dark shroud of mystery, especially in the U.S of A. since going through my total hysterectomy I often wonder if women around me, say at the store, have been through it because I have found it scary and lonely to go through it without really knowing many women that have gone through it before me. I wonder if any of the HW's have had a hysterectomy.   My grandma had one in the 1950's and she died in 2000 at 91, so she is the only female in my family to go through this surgery. You honestly feel like you will be this, "not really me anymore person", for the rest of your life and the doctors are zero help. 

Even for those of us that go through menopause normally, age, there isn't much conversation between women about it. There are so many treatments out there to help us go through the process and there is so much freedom after we come out the other side of it. Instead it is treated as if it is a death sentence/something to hide and/or avoid at all costs. I don't think there has been 1 HW that came right out and admitted to going through it on the show and there haven't been any discussions about it between any of them even though more are at the age of, at the very least, of perimenopause and some, Ramona, that have to be completely through to the other side of menopause. Instead it is used to age shame another HW.

I would think Bethenny, Carole, Luann and Sonja have at the very least, hit the perimenopause stage by this point in their lives but none of them will admit to it.

[raiderred1]

2 hours ago, izabella said:

 

Yes, yes, these women are all in menopause or much closer to it than to having babies (huge eye roll at ALL of them who bring that up) except for Jules.  These "girl's girls" sure do like to disparage menopause and the women who go through it (all women) as a natural part of life.  It's a way to shame them for being "OLD" and MY GOD, women who are OLD should be put out to pasture rather than openly discussing menopause because OMG, it's something to be embarrassed and ashamed of and should be hushed up. 

Yeah, guess what?  All that hiding of menopause means women often have no idea what their options are and why they should be beating their doctors' doors down to get the right hormone treatments, don't know that HRT can help prevent the #1 killer of women (heart disease), and what is worse?  DOCTORS also don't know.  You have to go to an endocrinologist, for pete's sake, to get any knowledgeable doctors.  Gynecologists should be all over this for their older patients, but I guess they only care about younger women.  There is also very little funding and research for menopause, unlike the wide wonderful world of Viagra and it's ilk.

So these women could raise a lot of awareness, but instead, they use menopause to shame others. 

IZABELLA, shout it from the rooftop, my friend!  You are absolutely right that the gynecologists have no clue about HRT.  I did end up going to an endocrinologist after my hysterectomy because one bio-identical gynecologist("expert"-HUGE EYE ROLL) almost caused me to commit suicide she had me on so much effing compounded crap and did not recognize the symptoms of HIGH estrogen!!!  Good god it is scary out there.  Since the Women's Health Initiative back in 2002 put a false scare into HRT most gynecologists these days are not schooled on HRT or still think it causes breast cancer.  The benefits way out weigh the risks for those of us that don't have a risk for female cancers in our genetics.  The damage that is done to our bodies once we reach menopause without HRT is ridiculous-heart disease risks, osteoporosis, dementia, Alzheimer's and not to mention the extreme drying, to the point of bleeding, in our vaginal walls!  I see all the pee pad advertisement and think how many of these women could be help with the right HRT. 

[NewDigs]

1 hour ago, Umbelina said:

I wonder about that as well.

I know many think Bethenny does nothing but lie, but I'm not one of those people.  I think she's often quite honest, and often that is to her detriment.

Anyway, I may or may not be right about this, but watching her last night I thought this.  Bravo is paying for some/most of it, but Bethenny added in some extras that Bravo wouldn't chip in for, the caviar thing, possibly the helicopter trip, or other extras.  She may have negotiated with Beam or made sure to film some Skinny Girl stuff so she could write some of it off, but I did get the definite idea that she was heavily involved in the planning of the trip, and was contributing financially to that trip.  Bravo usually gets write-offs or huge discounts for showcasing the hotel as well.

I don't think Bethy lies about everything but I do think she presents an exaggerated version of her truth. And I bet the caviar people discounted their roe and roe-girl for such significant product placement. I have a difficult time believing that B contributed large amounts for much of anything.

She's got hustle but it's so scattershot (and meanspirited) that I don't know how effective it is at the end of the day. I think there is such a thing as bad publicity.

So, if Bethy can't go to Mexico no one goes? 

[Umbelina]

2 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

Even for those of us that go through menopause normally, age, there isn't much conversation between women about it. There are so many treatments out there to help us go through the process and there is so much freedom after we come out the other side of it. Instead it is treated as if it is a death sentence/something to hide and/or avoid at all costs. I don't think there has been 1 HW that came right out and admitted to going through it on the show and there haven't been any discussions about it between any of them even though more are at the age of, at the very least, of perimenopause and some, Ramona, that have to be completely through to the other side of menopause. Instead it is used to age shame another HW.

I would think Bethenny, Carole, Luann and Sonja have at the very least, hit the perimenopause stage by this point in their lives but none of them will admit to it.

Well, we did have the pellets shot into someone's ass.

In my experience, women do talk about it, but maybe because I'm not even a tad embarrassed about sex, or sexual organs, or the natural progressions of life?

I have a feeling most of these women are avoiding it at all costs, getting hormones, using HGH, whatever it takes to avoid facing getting older.  RHBH did bring on Suzanne Somers didn't they?  She's open about it, if deluded and handing out fairly whacky medical advice right and left.  Of course her tales about it are mostly "how to avoid it!"  Sonja with her placenta facials, most of these women with their plastic surgery and various treatments all chasing the fountain of youth.  Hell, even the young ones are getting "preventative" botox now, as well as the fake boobs and liposuction.

I think it's sad.  I love seeing a real face, a real body out there, there are a few left, Helen Mirren comes to mind.  It's sad to me that to feel worthwhile so many women conform to porn images or chasing lost youth rather than embracing the stages of life.

4 minutes ago, NewDigs said:

I don't think Bethy lies about everything but I do think she presents an exaggerated version of her truth. And I bet the caviar people discounted their roe and roe-girl for such significant product placement. I have a difficult time believing that B contributed large amounts for much of anything.

She's got hustle but it's so scattershot (and meanspirited) that I don't know how effective it is at the end of the day. I think there is such a thing as bad publicity.

So, if Bethy can't go to Mexico no one goes? 

Of course she would negotiate it!  That's just smart, but still, her company or Bethenny herself may have done a lot of work to get those things worked out, and she could have easily thrown in some money of her own to make sure something she wanted did happen.

No idea about the trip!  We shall see!  That blog post indicated the doctors recommended several other things to try before surgery, so???

[Almost 3000]

21 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

Even for those of us that go through menopause normally, age, there isn't much conversation between women about it. There are so many treatments out there to help us go through the process and there is so much freedom after we come out the other side of it. Instead it is treated as if it is a death sentence/something to hide and/or avoid at all costs. I don't think there has been 1 HW that came right out and admitted to going through it on the show and there haven't been any discussions about it between any of them even though more are at the age of, at the very least, of perimenopause and some, Ramona, that have to be completely through to the other side of menopause. Instead it is used to age shame another HW.

I would think Bethenny, Carole, Luann and Sonja have at the very least, hit the perimenopause stage by this point in their lives but none of them will admit to it.

Well, Yolanda did say that she's good because she has a pellet in her ass. (I want one too)

[raiderred1]

2 minutes ago, Almost 3000 said:

Well, Yolanda did say that she's good because she has a pellet in her ass. (I want one too)

I always thought Yo was dealing with menopause and not really Lyme's disease.

[ElDosEquis]

Beffeny is like that moron that shows up to work when they are deathly ill and do nothing but sit there and bitch about being sick.

Shut up and go home. The world will continue to spin while you recover.

[Umbelina]

I hope this will be a Lyme free zone!  Please and Thank You God!

[Sai]

I enjoyed the Ramona and Sonja scene.  I love when they are together and getting along.  And in Ramona's defense about the cake, she did ask first if she was allowed to have a piece and after she cut her piece other people came up and started eating the cake also.

I usually don't like new housewives for some reason but I like Jules.  Good for her and her new drink and doing it on her own without her asshole husband.  Hope it's a success.  I looked it up and I'm gonna buy some myself.

As for Bethenny and her fibroids, my friend had them.  She had to have surgery and was in recovery for weeks.  Before her surgery she came to my house and she was very upset because she said she was bleeding tons and her boyfriend was at the bar like he didn't care.  She came over because she needed someone to talk to. OMG, she looked terrible and I was so worried for her.  She was so pale and her lips were the exact same color as her skin.  I never saw anyone with white lips before.  It was freakin scary!  Well, a few weeks later she had her surgery....and yes, her boyfriend took very good care of her during her recovery and stayed out of the bar, lol.    

[zoeysmom]

33 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

Well, we did have the pellets shot into someone's ass.

In my experience, women do talk about it, but maybe because I'm not even a tad embarrassed about sex, or sexual organs, or the natural progressions of life?

I have a feeling most of these women are avoiding it at all costs, getting hormones, using HGH, whatever it takes to avoid facing getting older.  RHBH did bring on Suzanne Somers didn't they?  She's open about it, if deluded and handing out fairly whacky medical advice right and left.  Of course her tales about it are mostly "how to avoid it!"  Sonja with her placenta facials, most of these women with their plastic surgery and various treatments all chasing the fountain of youth.  Hell, even the young ones are getting "preventative" botox now, as well as the fake boobs and liposuction.

I think it's sad.  I love seeing a real face, a real body out there, there are a few left, Helen Mirren comes to mind.  It's sad to me that to feel worthwhile so many women conform to porn images or chasing lost youth rather than embracing the stages of life.

Of course she would negotiate it!  That's just smart, but still, her company or Bethenny herself may have done a lot of work to get those things worked out, and she could have easily thrown in some money of her own to make sure something she wanted did happen.

No idea about the trip!  We shall see!  That blog post indicated the doctors recommended several other things to try before surgery, so???

Spoiler

here is a clue about the Mexico trip: 

Edited June 24, 2016 by zoeysmom

[WordsWordsWords]

I'm not particularly fond of Bethenny.. But in 1999, I hemorrhaged while in a hotel on a trip. Alone. I went to the nearest hospital the next morning and, after an examination, was told to drive myself home. 200 miles of interstate driving. All while being dizzy, nauseated, in severe pain, and weak. Luckily, my husband and a friend drove half-way to meet me. My friend drove my husband's car back, and my husband drove me home -- and straight to the hospital in my home town. I was in agony and bleeding heavily. I was diagnosed with fibroids, assured I didn't have cancer, and a hysterectomy was scheduled for a couple of days later. Surprise! Turned out I did, in fact, have cancer, all contained within the uterus. I cannot help feeling sympathy for Bethenny because what she's going through (at the time of this filming) is no joke.

Also any time you undergo surgery, there's more danger than we think about often. I had a friend who went in for a tonsillectomy, hemorrhaged, and died.

Other thoughts: Dorinda is a kind person when she's not drunk. I know a good number of nice-when-sober/horrid-when-drunk people. I'd love to go to Home Goods with her. I like shopping at that store anyway. Ramona is possibly the most clueless person I've seen lately. Really? Cutting chunks of wedding cake for herself? Even at a dog wedding. It was for charity, after all, so I feel confident they wanted to take photos and portion out the cake "traditionally." (I'm NOT a big fan of dog weddings. They kinda creep me out.) A Luanne-free (except for references) episode is never a bad thing. Jules doesn't annoy me much. She hasn't yet shown a lot of personality. Her husband, on the other hand, is a douche. He can't even resist taking shots at her when she's showing him something she's proud of. I'm not sure I'd drink her concoction, but he should shut up and smile.

[raiderred1]

6 minutes ago, WordsWordsWords said:

 

Other thoughts: Dorinda is a kind person when she's not drunk. I know a good number of nice-when-sober/horrid-when-drunk people. I'd love to go to Home Goods with her. I like shopping at that store anyway. 

I like Dorinda, too, if she isn't drinking.  I would guess, by watching, she makes a really good friend and I really like that in a person.

[WireWrap]

54 minutes ago, Almost 3000 said:

Well, Yolanda did say that she's good because she has a pellet in her ass. (I want one too)

Yes she did and she pretty much said that she didn't have to worry about going through menopause because of the "pallets" LOL Once again, a HW that refuses to admit she is going through it.

[UsernameFatigue]

I am curious as to the comments here that Ramona's claim to have dated Tom several times has been dispelled. It that because in this epi it was reported that one of Tom's ex girlfriends said he only dated Ramona once? So Tom has told both Luann and an ex this, but does that make it true? I am just as inclined to believe Ramona. And wasn't there an article last September in a NY paper that she was dating Tom? Would she make the papers regarding dating Tom based on one date? Also in the epi where Luann introduced Tom to some of the cast members I remember Luann and Dorinda saying rude things about Ramona. Tom looked very uncomfortable and actually rolled his eyes at one point over their remarks. It gave me the feeling even back then that Tom had dated Ramona for awhile and that Ramona was the one to break it off. I got a protective feeling towards Ramona from Tom during that scene.

[zoeysmom]

3 minutes ago, UsernameFatigue said:

I am curious as to the comments here that Ramona's claim to have dated Tom several times has been dispelled. It that because in this epi it was reported that one of Tom's ex girlfriends said he only dated Ramona once? So Tom has told both Luann and an ex this, but does that make it true? I am just as inclined to believe Ramona. And wasn't there an article last September in a NY paper that she was dating Tom? Would she make the papers regarding dating Tom based on one date? Also in the epi where Luann introduced Tom to some of the cast members I remember Luann and Dorinda saying rude things about Ramona. Tom looked very uncomfortable and actually rolled his eyes at one point over their remarks. It gave me the feeling even back then that Tom had dated Ramona for awhile and that Ramona was the one to break it off. I got a protective feeling towards Ramona from Tom during that scene.

Well Ramona went from a couple of times, to six times in her blog and seven times in the Berkshires. Here she says they went out a dozen times http://radaronline.com/celebrity-news/ramona-singer-blasts-luann-de-lesseps-relationship-built-on-lies/ and knows what was going on between he and Sonja. She is also claimed she was out on a date with Tom at the Mark Hotel when Luann swept him away and went home and "fvcked him".  Ramona lies and she hates Luann with a passion. There is probably a middle ground where Ramona may have run into Tom and she counted that as a date.  The most consistent thread is essentially that Ramona had no chemistry with him, Tom has said it was nothing between them.   Only Bethenny said Tom was smitten with Ramona.  If a guy is denying he is dating you, saying you are a one night stand, where is the dignity in proving him wrong?  Just move on.  Neither Sonja or Ramona are exactly looking out for Luann's best interests. 

I think Dorinda summed it up best-Ramona can't stand to see others happy. 

[UsernameFatigue]

I think the truth regarding how many times Tom and Ramona dated is somewhere inbetween Tom's one and Ramona's 6 or 7. However Ramona did not claim that she was on a date with Tom at the Mark Hotel and Luann swept him away and went home a "fvcked him" - at least not on the show. She did say in the Berkshires to Luann that a friend of Beth's saw them both at the Mark Hotel where they were with other people and Luann went over to Tom and told him that he had dated Ramona and that she was next.  And that they went home together. The interesting thing about that is that Luann said in an interview that she met Tom and the Mark Hotel (after the phone conversation when they were introduced by Dorinda they kept missing each other)  and that they were inseperable from that time on. So there is likely some truth to that story too.

[beesknees]

23 hours ago, Neurochick said:

Please, I had the same fucking surgery in 1999, I went though it.  I didn't act like a witch.  So what's her excuse?

Same here and my surgery was worse than Bethenny's.  They also asked me about a living will.  It is SOP (standard operating procedure) with many surgical procedures.  

[AuntiePam]

1 hour ago, Sai said:

And in Ramona's defense about the cake, she did ask first if she was allowed to have a piece and after she cut her piece other people came up and started eating the cake also.

 

Did she?  What I saw looked like she was asking the room -- a question directed at no one.  She cut a piece, then a woman came up to her, Ramona cut another hunk and the woman asked if she was a professional server.  Sarcastically, since Ramona was making a mess.  It was partly the fault of the host/hostess -- if the main event is over, then serve the damn cake. 

[Sai]

8 minutes ago, AuntiePam said:

Did she?  What I saw looked like she was asking the room -- a question directed at no one.  She cut a piece, then a woman came up to her, Ramona cut another hunk and the woman asked if she was a professional server.  Sarcastically, since Ramona was making a mess.  It was partly the fault of the host/hostess -- if the main event is over, then serve the damn cake. 

Yeah but if you look at the cake when the woman asked her if she was a professional server there was a big chunk taken out of the top of the cake, like several people had cut pieces off the top.  Ramona was cutting the bottom part of the cake and gave the lady who was talking to her a piece from the bottom where she was cutting.  And yes.....serve the damn cake!!  Lol.  It must have been towards the end of the event because Ramona said she wasn't gonna leave a wedding without a piece of cake.  I laughed when she said since they weren't going to Mexico and she wouldn't need her bathing suit anymore she was having cake.  Hahaha....

[njbchlover]

2 hours ago, zoeysmom said:

  Hide contents

here is a clue about the Mexico trip: 

This resort is nowhere near the Tequila region that Bethenny was planning on taking the women.  Tequila, Mexico (yes, there is such a place, LOL!) is on the west coast of Mexico, in Jalisco.

Generations Resort is in the Riviera Maya, close to Cancun, on the east coast.

I guess Bethenny was feeling well enough to make the four hour flight from NY to Cancun in February.  

Absolutely amazing resort, though!!!   :-)

Not to be catty (okay, well, yes, I'm being catty), compared to other times we've seen Bethenny in teeny-tiny bikinis, her stomach looks a little bloated here.  She still has a great figure for a super thin girl, but I've seen her tummy look more toned.

Edited June 24, 2016 by njbchlover

[Thumper]

Eh, that cake did not look that great.   ;)

[zoeysmom]

23 minutes ago, UsernameFatigue said:

I think the truth regarding how many times Tom and Ramona dated is somewhere inbetween Tom's one and Ramona's 6 or 7. However Ramona did not claim that she was on a date with Tom at the Mark Hotel and Luann swept him away and went home a "fvcked him" - at least not on the show. She did say in the Berkshires to Luann that a friend of Beth's saw them both at the Mark Hotel where they were with other people and Luann went over to Tom and told him that he had dated Ramona and that she was next.  And that they went home together. The interesting thing about that is that Luann said in an interview that she met Tom and the Mark Hotel (after the phone conversation when they were introduced by Dorinda they kept missing each other)  and that they were inseperable from that time on. So there is likely some truth to that story too.

There is just so much insanity in Ramona writing a blog and saying six times, watching the show where she gives the definitive seven times and then doing an interview and claiming 12 times.  You are right I reviewed the clip.  Like I said I think the swinging singles set run into each other.  Not necessarily as dates.  Ramona has never indicated how she first met Tom. This is the problem with Luann and Tom-they met, they clicked, end of story.  It is a replay of Luann and the Count in Switzerland. It had nothing to do with Ramona.  She had been out of the picture for months and it was a really small photo to begin with.  Yeah here is the clip Ramona is coasting on second hand information  http://www.bravotv.com/the-real-housewives-of-new-york-city/season-8/episode-9/videos/its-called-the-girl-code  It was Tom who gave the interview to Bravo-not Luann.

What is strange, is these women are painted as friends-why the hell are they fighting or trying to tear down someone's intended?  This show could be over in two years or one or many of them not re-cast-who wants to go down as being the so-called friend who was trying to screw up the romance?   Have some pride ladies.

Something tells me there is more to come in trying to screw things up between Tom and Luann because sane, secure people do those type of things to people they pretend are their friends.  Nothing screams appropriateness and class like gossiping and trying to break people up and ruin their happiness.   Ramona has always been feral towards Luann.  This isn't a good side of her, not that there is one, she comes off as her usual self-absorbed self.  Give Ramona about three years and it won't be about looking for someone to love, but Avery looking for an assisted living center.  She will be the mean old lady in the corner combing her extensions, admiring her fake boobs, stealing other residents clothes and shoes. 

[bravofan27]

I feel that maybe Bethanny cancelled the trip because she didn't want to deal with Carole and Luann. I think she felt pressure from Carole not to invite her, but knew it was way too mean girl, but didn't want to upset Carole. I think Carole needs to leave the show if she refuses to film with Luann. 

[Ms.Lulu]

11 hours ago, Rainny said:

I couldn't do it. No way I could be bleeding so badly that I ruin rugs, bedding and all that and then get dressed up and go out. I would be worrying the entire time about my clothing, the car seats, the restaurant seats, floor, etc. Especially not if I felt as weak and tired as she said she did. There is just no reason to put yourself through all of that. 

I believe her, I just wouldn't do it, I would have been in the emergency room, or at home resting until my Dr. appointment. 

I recently lived this, so I know Beth could too.  You adjust.  It was so bad for me that I wore pads inside adult diapers to keep from ruining clothes, bedding, furniture, car seats while my doctors tried to figure out what was going on.  I had other problems, the oncologist suspected ovarian cancer, in addition to fibroids.  My husband and I both cried when I was wheeled into surgery because I was as afraid of the surgery as the possible cancer.  And the surgery did almost kill me so I needed followup surgery!  Unfortunately, I joined the club of 500,000 American women that have hysterectomies each year.   

Edited June 24, 2016 by PDXlulu

[WireWrap]

7 minutes ago, bravofan27 said:

I feel that maybe Bethanny cancelled the trip because she didn't want to deal with Carole and Luann. I think she felt pressure from Carole not to invite her, but knew it was way too mean girl, but didn't want to upset Carole. I think Carole needs to leave the show if she refuses to film with Luann. 

The thing I am not understanding is that Bethenny said, in her TH, that she had intended on inviting Luann on the Mexico trip the night they met up but then decided against it afterwards. Why did she decide to invite her against Carole's wishes to begin with? Was she pressured by production about not freezing out 2 HWs or was it because she knew the trip was most likely to be canceled because of her fibroid problem or was she just saying that in her TH to make herself look less controlling?

[zoeysmom]

28 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

The thing I am not understanding is that Bethenny said, in her TH, that she had intended on inviting Luann on the Mexico trip the night they met up but then decided against it afterwards. Why did she decide to invite her against Carole's wishes to begin with? Was she pressured by production about not freezing out 2 HWs or was it because she knew the trip was most likely to be canceled because of her fibroid problem or was she just saying that in her TH to make herself look less controlling?

If you were Shed Media going to the expense of sending a crew down to Mexico and Bethenny's guidelines were responsible drinking and you had Jules, Dorinda, Ramona and Carole as your cast do you see a return on production dollars?  Jules is a non-entity whose entire storyline at this point is her eating disorder, which Carole and Bethenny have to bring up at every chance, sober Dorinda who has two people at odds with her man and Ramona not being able to go out.  Carole may think the viewers want esoteric, antiquated conversations but they don't.  What may be right for the booze company doesn't necessarily work for Shed Media and Bravo.  I can't think of anything more boring than listening to Bethenny pontificate on her vast knowledge of tequila.  I have been to tequila tastings it is not really made for TV.

Bethenny doesn't want a dud trip on her watch.

[MsDiva2007]

I too have had a hysterectomy for Fibroids. I was just 30 years old. When I had menstrual cycles the pain was horrible. It would come and go sometimes 20+ days a month. I had so much pain. I had my hysterectomy on New years eve when my son turned 5. That however was not an excuse to be evil to people and this being brought out is an excuse to not make her look like a mean old harpy. I had to work take care of a child and still managed to be kind and gracious to even my worse enemy. Bethenny is full of it!