S06.E08: No One

[Maximum Taco]

26 minutes ago, Minneapple said:

This is Cersei's fault. Lancel probably ran straight to the High Sparrow after her little "I choose violence" show of power. And with the news of the great big strong man guarding Cersei, well. That was the end of trial by combat.

Huh. I did not even think of that. That actually makes a lot of sense.

I still don't like the explanation they used though that it's "a scheme devised by corrupt rulers to avoid true judgement by the gods" I mean the High Sparrow himself would be the first one to say that men could be bought, even most septons (like the previous high septon.) He should've just said that it was brutish and barbaric, or something like "the gods wouldn't want others to suffer or die, only the ones being judged." I could at least buy that, because everything before this point it's been said that trial by combat is the way to let the gods decide.

Edited June 13, 2016 by Maximum Taco

[Happy Harpy]

"I am Arya Stark of Winterfell and I am going home" = made the episode for me. Come home, baby! And yes, I did love how she used the dark to gain advantage over the Waif. Maybe being able to fight in the dark will be useful during the Long Night, LOL. Seriously, Arya did improve leaps and bounds (yep) I don't think she was able to do parkour before, etc. I think she's also moved past her list, at least it doesn't seem to be the only thing she holds onto. I do want her to go through with her revenge but I have the feeling that it doesn't consume her anymore. She envisions a future beyond it...and exploring the West of Westeros is an end game I could see for her.

And Brienne was fucking fantastic. I love how she gained the Blackfish's respect. I just love her.

Jaime and Brienne are going to kill me, they have to stop with the heart eyes and longing glances. She's the little angel and Cersei the little devil on his shoulders. To Jaime's credit, he did take Riverrun as peacefully as possible and for once, one of his plans worked. I think that his whole conversation with Edmure was manipulation, and it's probably because I'm sick of the Cersei lurve but I wondered whether he was trying to convince himself. That said, I see now how the big fallout could happen. If Qyburn and Cersei want to use or even use wildfire (I agree it was the "rumor") whereas Jaime betrayed his original oath precisely in order to prevent such a thing he could finally, finally see her for what she is.

No body for the Blackfish? I do agree that his end could have been too similar to Barristan's (although they didn't show the Waif/Arya showdown either). But no body...you never know.

I also wonder whether Jaime waxing poetics about Cersei's motherly love could be proven wrong very soon. Tommen is a little shit way over his head, and for the first time I think that Cersei might sacrifice him at one point in order to get revenge. It would have been inconceivable for me so far, but if she thinks he's definitely lost to her...I truly don't know.

Oh, the bastards who sold Gendry to the Red Witch are back and still self-righteous. Nope, I didn't forget (no more than Shireen). Did love the Hound and the boots, though.

I did like the scene with Tyrion, Missandei and Grey Worm. A touch of humor and a touch of humanity (along with the Lady Crane/Arya scenes) go a long way on this show. Plus, Dany is back!

I feel that all the pawns are set up on the chessboard now and the last two are once more going to be epic.

Edited June 13, 2016 by Happy Harpy

[VCRTracking]

I liked last week's episode but agree with those who say the latest was disappointing and anticlimactic. Next week however looks to be EPIC.

[Hootis]

As someone who hasn't read the books, and so only has the show from which to judge the Arya character - I was really hoping she would die.

That actress must've played a maester with magic thread in a previous production. That was some miraculous healing magic on Arya Sue

The entire faceless storyline...well.  I expected to see a barn full of walkers burst open at the end.

[Misplaced]

The Waifinator!  

Also, Comedy Hour with the Hound!

[mrspidey]

5 hours ago, GrailKing said:

Who told Berric and Thorus about WW?

Thoros is a red priest. Who do you think?

[placate]

23 minutes ago, Hootis said:

As someone who hasn't read the books, and so only has the show from which to judge the Arya character - I was really hoping she would die

Since you didn't read the books but you're posting in the book readers thread, I'd like to tell you about how much more awesome Book!Arya is vs Arya can parkour and not sprain her ankles when jumping from heights and landing badly after getting gut decimated last episode. I'll spoiler this in case you posted in the wrong thread:

Spoiler

Arya is not just rendered blind after her time with the FM. She is also made deaf and then mute. It trains up her sensory skills. She is forced to sell shellfish as Cat of the Canal and learns about manipulating people through commerce and lots of whores.  She meets Sam and totally murder kills a deserter of the NW because he abandoned his duties.  She took a name off her list and killed Raff The Sweetling after she took up with a mummer group as Mercy, seduced him and then got stabby with him.  This is while book Arya is, and I think she's 12?

That said, I don't like terminator waif and stupid slapstick with a freaking cart thrown into the middle of a chase scene where the FM can suddenly try to kill people in public and for some reason miraculously wear a dude's face and lose their boobs.

[mrspidey]

6 hours ago, Hanahope said:

 

I don't really understand why Edmur cared that much for a baby he'd never seen. 

Family, Duty, Honor.

Those aren't just empty house words and "Family" isn't named first without reason. 

[patchwork]

Well that was dull, why have the last episodes been so dull? 

I want to believe that there's more to the Faceless Men cult like Arya's going to find it's not that easy to walk away, a Man knows he doesn't have to do anything because by killing the Waif Arya has made herself No-One. If there's no consequences then what's the point of the last two seasons? There's low key magic going on in the House of Black and White and I'd like to see that explored a bit more but no I think everything is as it appears- they trained Arya and are now happy to wave bye bye because assassins are just that nice. 

I agree that Brienne and Jaime are going to find themselves in a modified version of their book plot, maybe instead of Lady Stoneheart it's Berric that she drags him off to see and all of them end up going North. We'll still get the scene of Jaime burning Cersei's letter but it wont be because she had sex with other people but because he's been convinced of the White Walker threat and Brienne has talked him into doing the Right Thing. 

I don't mind that Lady Stoneheart doesn't seem to exist but I'm really upset that the pack of man eating wolves stalking the Riverlands hasn't been mentioned. 

[BooBear]

8 hours ago, Advance35 said:

I didn't like it.  Mainly because it centered on the stories I am the least interested in.   Dany and Mereen?  Yawn.   The only scene I liked was the one he had with Varys.   Good to see he is on his way back to Westeros.  I miss him being where the action is.

I do think this was the most poor episode of the season. I am irked like heck at Ayra's story line. I never thought there would be any supernatural explanation to her recovery but I did expect it to take up more than 5 minutes of the episode.  Plus I really didn't understand any of it. Sure she learned to fight in the dark but if she is going to make such bone headed moves as walking in town showing off silver and stopping for old strange neighbors... she won't last long.  As with others I had no idea what "you are finally no one." huh?  Did they name the episode and then try to write to it? No way she was healed after one night.

I don't understand Jamie. I don't expect him to fall in love with Brianne but I do think he respects and knows she is better than him. I just don't understand how he can go through what he has and then still be that enamored with Cerci. Not to mention the fact that he should know by now she cheated on him with Lancel. I was irked at that time Jamie spend so much time talking to Edmure Tully. Could have been taken care of with like 3 lines.  I don't morn the blackfish if your going to die... die for Sansa. What a waste there as well.  Speaking of waste -- pod and Bron were ok but took up too much time.

Ugh enough with the attempts at comedy with Gray Worm and Tyron and Mereen. What a waste of time.  At least glad Dany returned on her dragon.

I could not care less about Cerci. Other than laughing at her. 

ETA: I was also disappointed that Ayra didn't tell Lady Crane who she really was.

Edited June 13, 2016 by BooBear

[Spartan Girl]

I liked how Tyrion is getting Grey Worm and Missandandai to lighten up. I know Dany is probably going to be pissed at Tyrion's fuck up, but I hope we'll get a scene with the four of them drinking together post-battle.

[sunflower]

Quote

I just don't understand how he can go through what he has and then still be that enamored with Cerci.

That's the problem in a nutshell with Jaime's character arc.  Dude was a POW of the Starks, lost his hand, and bantered/fell in honor love? with Brienne.  The books clearly lay out his issues and he only fucks Cersei the last time the first time he sees her after Joffrey's death.  The show fucked up Jaime's timeline and, worst of all, softened Cersei to the point that she's not that bad, so that when Olenna even jokes about her being the worst person in the world it doesn't feel earned.  They gave some of Cersei's worst deeds to Joffrey (killing Robert's bastards) and emphasized her motherlove, but when you get in her POV in book 4, she seems like a crazy piece of shit, you wishes she was born a man.  The only way I feel sorry for Cersei is that it's unfair how women are treated in those days.  

Jaime makes sense through Season 3, in moments w/Brienne and Tyrion in S4, but that's about it.  Fuck Dorne.  

They also softened Tyrion, which also fucks ups Jaime a bit, but for another time.  

Edited June 13, 2016 by sunflower

[Conan Troutman]

"And now for our next caller, Cersei from King's Landing. She had a bad day and misses her son and her brother - or did she say her friend? Sorry, I forgot - and her wish is 'Burning down the House' by Tom Jones. There you go Cersei!"

Edited June 13, 2016 by Conan Troutman

[Haleth]

This episode was jam packed with action and blood.  Pretty high body count.  Did we visit everyone except Jon and Sansa?

Favorite line:  "I prefer chicken."  Ha!  I burst out laughing.  I'm so glad undead Beric and Thoros are still good guys.

Second favorite thing:  Cersei's face when Tommen outlawed trial by combat.  Robert Strong Gregor just lost his job.

I KNEW IT last week when everyone was looking for trickery when Arya was stabbed, I KNEW the writers were playing it straight and we'd have to hand wave that she not only survived her wound but would be able to leap and run.  No switched identities, just poor writing.  (And RIP, Lady Crane.)  Arya's arc in Braavos wasn't pointless,  (No pun intended.)  She got the training she needed to go back to Westeros and go all Stoneheart on her enemies.

Edited June 13, 2016 by Haleth

[Dewey Decimate]

Black Jack Randall waxing poetic about Jamie's jaw made me think there was gonna be another Jamie-related prison scene. Yikes! Wrong show.

While I'm not exactly rooting for Cersie (more the demise of the Sparrows), I loved Qyburn's look of proud-mommy smug as Frankengregor went hulk-smash. Short-lived, alas.

I could watch the Hound go slaughtery all day. Loved his petulance at only being allowed to hang his share of the baddies. Hope his tour with the BwoB is successful. "Lots of horrible shit gets done in the world for something larger than ourselves", indeed. On another note, I kind of want to go shoe shopping with him.

[sumiregusa]

7 hours ago, stagmania said:

It's amazing to me that there are only 15 episodes of this series left and we're still getting this kind of pointless filler. If it was cleverly written, it might be tolerable. But alas, no.

The Arya resolution was completely nonsensical, and I feel vindicated in my long held belief that the Faceless Man plot was little more than narrative wheel spinning to keep her busy until the right time came for her to re-enter the larger story. 

What a disappointing stretch of episodes. I hope the final two are good enough to leave a strong impression of the season overall.

"That was weak." - My dad after this episode, who loves this show more than anything.

Agreed, Father. Agreed.

[cambridgeguy]

I thought of this in previous weeks but with the Varys comment I was wondering why Edmure Tully, POW, is more clean shaven than 99% of the men on this show?  You don't give prisoners access to straight razor, after all.

That "give Peter Dinklage screentime" scene did establish that the Starks are still considered the enemy.  I do wonder how all of that will play out when Dany finally gets to Westeros.  None of the remaining Starks had anything to do with Robert's Rebellion.  They also mentioned the Martells so I wonder if Dorne will ever return to the storyline. Dany does have Martell ancestors and they're ready to fight the Lannisters anyway.

[stagmania]

5 hours ago, Brn2bwild said:

Has it been confirmed there are only 13 episodes left after this season?  I can't see how they possibly wrap everything up by then.

I don't think it's final yet, but yes, that's what the showrunners have proposed. They want 7 next season, and 6 for the last season.

2 hours ago, patchwork said:

Well that was dull, why have the last episodes been so dull? 

I think Sepinwall summed it up well in his review: he thought we were doing necessary table-setting for the last few weeks, but it turns out it was just stalling before we get to the presumably big moments in the final two episodes of the season. 

23 minutes ago, Haleth said:

I KNEW IT last week when everyone was looking for trickery when Arya was stabbed, I KNEW the writers were playing it straight and we'd have to hand wave that she not only survived her wound but would be able to leap and run.  No switched identities, just poor writing.  (And RIP, Lady Crane.)  Arya's arc in Braavos wasn't pointless,  (No pun intended.)  She got the training she needed to go back to Westeros and go all Stoneheart on her enemies.

I think in the books, it's true that Arya got necessary training before returning to Westeros. In the show, however, she hasn't learned a whole lot more than she already knew before she got to Braavos two whole seasons ago, and they never managed to make it seem plausible that she might really become a Faceless Man. And after all that time spent languishing in this plot, the ending was incoherent and all around badly written. I'm definitely marking this one down as a show fail. They can make it up to me with a Nymeria reunion. :) 

[Haleth]

7 hours ago, MadMouse said:

Wonder if we'll get a play of Brienne and Pod being hung with the Hound taking a certain lady's place? Just hope we get more Beric , Richard Dormer's take on the character is great. Probably my favorite smaller role on the show.

I had to stare at this for a while before understanding.  Oooooh!  Brienne and Pod being hanged!  Pod being hung is something completely different.

[Dev F]

10 hours ago, Anisky said:

Especially considering they are surrounded by Freys and helping the Freys in this battle. None of them would have a problem with their little nephew/cousin/etc being cold bloodedly murdered by the man sent there to help them? No? 

But that was the whole point of Jaime's gambit, wasn't it? To make Edmure believe that, unlike the Freys, he didn't care about any of those considerations, because all he wanted was to get back to Cersei? It was supposed to be a shockingly cold-blooded suggestion that only he would devise.

[Tikichick]

10 hours ago, Winnief said:

I think the idea was that by besting the Waif, she had 'proven' her badass FM credentials-the problem is she's NOT interested.

Good riddance to the Waif.  The Blackfish though I'll miss.

Did like Edmure's whole speech to Jaime and you can see Jaime struggling because deep down he KNOWS Edmure's right and that team Lannister sucks wastewater.  Seriously, don't try to pull the "they rebelled against their rightful king" card when you know better than anyone that the whole claim is a complete sham.  But I did LOVE his moments with Brienne. 

 

Of course this raises the question, when will Jaime finally open his eyes about Cersei?!?

 

So Brienne, Pod, the Hound, and Arya are all heading to Winterfell.  Thank the Old Gods and the New.  I mean no offense to Lena and the rest of the crew in KL, but right now I couldn't care LESS what happens in the Red Keep...the REAL action is up North.  Also happy that Dany's FINALLY back in Mereen so hopefully she'll soon be sailing West.

Were we told the Hound is headed for Winterfell?  I don't see much reason why he would, and that's not at all where I expect his story to lead.

[Tikichick]

10 hours ago, Anisky said:

So, what I'm getting from this season is that nobody is the slightest bit concerned that Walder Frey might be angry about his allies knowingly and cold-bloodedly killing his children and grandchildren. Ramsay at least we know is, well, Ramsay. Jaime's plan to launch a Frey toddler into a castle with a trebuchet is a bit more surprising.

EDIT: Especially considering they are surrounded by Freys and helping the Freys in this battle. None of them would have a problem with their little nephew/cousin/etc being cold bloodedly murdered by the man sent there to help them? No? 

Considering what happened at the Red Wedding when Catelyn held a knife to one of their throats in front of him, I think he basically thinks HE is the Freys and the rest are largely replaceable.

[Ottis]

So wait ... those 3 guys wiped out the peaceful village last week? I know the villagers were into nonviolence, but still. And if there were more than those four guys, wouldn't the Hound want revenge on *all* of them? He's not done.

Agree with all on Arya. She gained miraculous healing skills and apparently some assassin skills though her win was anything but definitive. So I guess she is trained up now for something else, sort of?

Uh, Dany? Can you have the dragon hang around a bit while we are under attack?

This season, without much book to guide it, has been much more conventional TV. The last couple of episodes better be epic and contain some surprises.

[Tikichick]

10 hours ago, Black Knight said:

Well, I did think something would go wrong with the trial by combat, because Cersei was way too confident about it and we all know things don't work out as planned in the GoT universe...but, again, this is something where a deviation from the books hurts. In the books, Loras isn't caught up in all this, he's off somewhere mortally wounded, so to have Tommen eliminate the trial by combat concept, if it happens that way in the books, works out fine. Margaery's the one caught up in it, and all her own choices for a champion suck (since, as Cersei explained to her, she's not allowed to choose her brother Garlan), so not getting to go the trial by combat route doesn't really make a difference to her. But on the TV show, Loras does stand accused, and why would Margaery allow the canceling of his own trial by combat? He doesn't have any chance with a trial by septons given the evidence against him and that Margaery can't lie for him again.

So it's a lot like the Dorne plot deviation, which, while on the whole I wasn't sad to see the way the TV show went with it because I've always had the feeling the books' Dorne plot would end up not amounting to much actual impact, having the Lannisters being more concerned about giving Riverrun back to the whiny Freys who lost the castle as opposed to attacking Dorne really makes no sense. Myrcella was the king's own sister, and Dorne is in rebellion. Realistically, the Lannisters would be telling the Freys to take care of their own damn problems because the Lannister army is needed elsewhere. This is the family that went to war because Catelyn took Tyrion prisoner. Ellaria murdered Myrcella.

All the preview showed is the Battle of Winterfell, but I wonder if it's going to be intercut with the Battle of Meereen. That juxtaposition would be interesting since fire is going to be key to the Meereen scenes (thanks to the dragons) while Winterfell is all snow and ice.

I thought Margaery wasn't charged any longer since she has confessed, and therefore doesn't face the prospect of a trial?

I think there will be the contrasting fire and ice battles, but I see it coming a little differently.

[Constantinople]

11 hours ago, Hanahope said:

I don't really understand why Edmur cared that much for a baby he'd never seen. And what does he think is going to happen to his army when the Freys and Lannisters take over?

 

4 hours ago, mrspidey said:

Family, Duty, Honor.

Those aren't just empty house words and "Family" isn't named first without reason. 

The key word being Family, not some random person, who may not even exist, that a LannIstER (sic) claims is your family.

Jaime said he would do anything to end the siege, so why wouldn't he lie about Edmure having a son?  It's not as if Jaime scores particularly well on Politfact, and the Freys are even worse.  Even if they showed him a baby, what's the proof that it's Edmure's?

[Tikichick]

10 hours ago, trif said:

Jaqen's comment about Arya finally being No One also caught me off guard. But I think maybe the logic was supposed to be that if the Many Faced God "allowed" Arya to best his true devotee The Waif, then there is a reason and Jaqen should not interfere with the MFG's will or at least the death 'balance'. Sort of a lesser version of the reasoning we heard this same episode about why Dondarrion thinks The Hound can be redeemed (and why the BWB itself is meant to fight for light instead of getting caught up in the lords' wars).

I'm not sure, though. One of my hesitations is that I never got the sense before that the Many Faced God was a particularly interventionist god, even in the eyes of his true believers. For having spent two seasons with them, we know pretty little about the actual deity.

 

10 hours ago, kieyra said:

I haven't hated the Arya plot (but can agree it's been going on a bit too long). Prefer to see someone get really hardened over, yes, years than become an insta-badass, such as on a CW show. 

But ...

Jaqen's smile and nod to Arya at the end didn't sit well with me. He didn't seem like he was fucking around before, or that their training had this "wink-nudge" aspect to it, like "I'm going to invest all this time and training into you, but I'm secretly cheering on your eventual rebellion!"

And the Waif wasn't quite right either. She used I/me pronouns, and she clearly had ego invested in killing Arya. How is that faceless/selfless? Or are we perhaps meant to believe Jaqen set the whole thing up including the death of the Waif, who did in fact suck at assassination?

I think the Arya story is still a serious misdirect.  I wonder if Arya isn't indeed No One after all and the statement she is Arya Stark, Lady of Winterfell is exactly what Jaqen was waiting to hear.

[Maximum Taco]

5 hours ago, mrspidey said:

Family, Duty, Honor.

Those aren't just empty house words and "Family" isn't named first without reason. 

And yet he has no problem with slapping his uncle in irons and handing him over to the Kingslayer.

And I'm not saying he has to choose his child or his uncle, because as we all know in the books he saves both.

[Fishslap]

11 hours ago, placate said:

I get why they'd have Drogon destroy the ships off-screen, cgi and budget and all, but how dare they kill Blackfish off-screen!

Personally I have stopped expecting adherence to the books the show claims to be based on. And of all the warped caricatures available on this decomposing TV show you can't get worse than Super-Brienne; the magical woman who has no weaknesses of any kind, quite unlike Brienne in the books. I'm still waiting for her to have half her face bitten off before she and Pod are hanged, so naturally I wasn't expecting much when it came to offing Blackfish. Why not have him run over by a lorry while we're at it? Never mind that they have no cars, who cares about plot !?!

Oh well, I'm sure that was just an accident when the author wrote all those things in the books. Let's just up and make Brienne like the Invincible Hulk why not! I DEMAND GREEN PAINT FOR BRIENNE!

 

sigh...

Edited June 13, 2016 by Fishslap

[sunnyface]

This was one of my favorite episodes of the entire run.  Jon/Sansa/Bran, Theon/Ramsey. and Dany's 'grand' speeches were not missed. The Arya/Lady Crane scene was gold. Jaime avoided spilling blood - so some growth there and his interactions with Brienne make me think that Jaime will probably end up dead soon. Pod/Bron and the Hound were keeping things rolling.  Cercei stares are awesome!  The Varys/Tyrion scene was too short.  Could have done without the Arya/waif's chase scenes but for a television show - there was enough stuff flying around to keep one entertained. This episode had the feel of the first season for this viewer.

[Ambrosefolly]

11 minutes ago, Constantinople said:

 

The key word being Family, not some random person, who may not even exist, that a LannIstER (sic) claims is your family.

Jaime said he would do anything to end the siege, so why wouldn't he lie about Edmure having a son?  It's not as if Jaime scores particularly well on Politfact, and the Freys are even worse.  Even if they showed him a baby, what's the proof that it's Edmure's?

It seems that Edmure had been informed of the kid, probably being mocked by Walder himself. I don't even know if Jaime knows for sure, his info is probably second hand like Edmure's. 

[mac123x]

2 hours ago, Haleth said:

I KNEW IT last week when everyone was looking for trickery when Arya was stabbed, I KNEW the writers were playing it straight and we'd have to hand wave that she not only survived her wound but would be able to leap and run.  No switched identities, just poor writing.

And so easy to fix!  Last week, Arya could have realized at the last moment that the old lady was actually the Waif.  She ducks, the Waif cuts her right arm (since Arya is a leftie), then she jumps in the canal.  Same exact outcome, same trip to Lady Crane to get patched up, but a much more believable action sequence this week. 

 

The only thing lost is one week between last episode and this one where people might speculate "oh noes, is Arya going to die?" which no one (npi) actually thought would happen.

[WatchrTina]

6 hours ago, Happy Harpy said:

Oh, the bastards who sold Gendry to the Red Witch are back and still self-righteous. Nope, I didn't forget

Did they "sell" him to her or did she convince them that the Red God wanted her to take him to Stannis?  I genuinely don't recall.

[AAEBoiler]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I though Cersei had asked Qyburn to dig up stuff about the High Sparrow.

[GrailKing]

5 hours ago, mrspidey said:

Thoros is a red priest. Who do you think?

Outside of a serendipitous chance by a heartfelt prayer, he hasn't shown any looking into the flames episode I can remember.

Not unless he and Melisandre had some talk when they gave her Gendry.

So people who don't read the books or are casual watchers would scratch their heads.

[Maximum Taco]

14 minutes ago, WatchrTina said:

Did they "sell" him to her or did she convince them that the Red God wanted her to take him to Stannis?  I genuinely don't recall.

Kind of both. She tells them the Lord of Light needs him and also gives them two bags of gold.

When Arya asks why they are doing this, Beric says the Lord has need of him, Arya accuses them of doing it just for the gold, and Thoros says it's both. 

One of the more annoying show changes. The book's brotherhood has a lot more honour then the show's. I doubt they'd ever sell one of their own. But then again the book's brotherhood isn't as dedicated to the Lord of Light as the show's, they are much more about defending the smallfolk.

Edited June 13, 2016 by Maximum Taco

[Tikichick]

3 minutes ago, AAEBoiler said:

Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I though Cersei had asked Qyburn to dig up stuff about the High Sparrow.

I think she did.  However the rumor that she shared with him and asked him to investigate was likely about something else entirely.

[GrailKing]

57 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

Were we told the Hound is headed for Winterfell?  I don't see much reason why he would, and that's not at all where I expect his story to lead.

Well considering that his story with Sansa isn't finished yet or for that matter Arya it could be the way the writers reintro him to their story lines.

He protected both girls, he knows of LF betrayl, Brienne may also be there and they all could be there for

 

Brans dream of a giant full of black blood.

Edited June 13, 2016 by GrailKing

[benteen]

9 hours ago, KaleyFirefly said:

The best and saddest part of the Tyrion scene was when Tyrion said he was going to have his own vineyard one day and only invite his closest friends to drink the wine, and then he did a very slight pause, as if wondering if he even has any true friends. 

Agreed.  I liked that moment for a lot of reasons.  One of the main characters dropping his guard and thinking about his future.  Tyrion really seemed tired and beaten down by everything that had happened to him at this point.  It was the saving grace of Drunk Meereen, Take 2.

[paigow]

52 minutes ago, Ottis said:

So wait ... those 3 guys wiped out the peaceful village last week? I know the villagers were into nonviolence, but still. And if there were more than those four guys, wouldn't the Hound want revenge on *all* of them? He's not done.

The Hound killed 4 guys..then found 3 more waiting to hang = 7 killers.

[Hanahope]

I'm surprised that the show is going to wrap up in only 13 episodes after this season.  Seems like this season is half new material, half book material not shown before.  So the next 15 episodes are really going to encompass all the material contained in 2 (or 3) more books?  I guess a whole lot is being compressed or eliminated.

I'm wondering a bit how Arya knew that the Waif couldn't fight as well in the dark.  Why wouldn't she think that every FM intern got such training?

Agreed that Tyrion is getting very little to do and his efforts haven't been that successful.  Also, no word about the other two dragons?

[Tikichick]

1 minute ago, GrailKing said:

Well considering that his story with Sansa isn't finished yet or for that matter Arya it could be the way the writers reintro him to their story lines.

He protected both girls, he knows of LF betrayl, Brienne may also be there and they all could be there for

  Reveal hidden contents

Brans dream of a giant full of black blood.

Not sure they have the time to reunite him with either of the Stark girls on screen.

As far as the spoiler piece, there is a character on screen who fits that idea perfectly -- and fits perfectly with the other spoilers regarding the character from whom that suggestion comes from.

[GrailKing]

2 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

Not sure they have the time to reunite him with either of the Stark girls on screen.

As far as the spoiler piece, there is a character on screen who fits that idea perfectly -- and fits perfectly with the other spoilers regarding the character from whom that suggestion comes from.

If your talking

LF, I'm well aware, it's one I believe in for the books; but they more or less gave Cersei the part of GOHH and she told LF what he had to do, and if or when he fails she could send the Mountain. It's either the GOHH or Bran's vision which one will they use.

Both are open at this point.

[Tikichick]

Just now, GrailKing said:

If your talking

  Reveal hidden contents

LF, I'm well aware, it's one I believe in for the books; but they more or less gave Cersei the part of GOHH and she told LF what he had to do, and if or when he fails she could send the Mountain. It's either the GOHH or Bran's vision which one will they use.

 

Both are open at this point.

Nope, I'm talking specifically the one you mentioned in your first spoiler in the post I quoted.  There is speculation re: that character and a speculated major upcoming plot development, even speculation that person may ultimately be behind that plot development.  Dovetails nicely with what that person "said" in your spoiler.

[Misplaced]

8 hours ago, Chris24601 said:

People keep saying this, but I'm really starting to think that Martin's twist is going to be that Jaime's redemption quest fails. At this point I'm not even sure that Cersei killing Tommen would be enough to turn him from Cersei's side as long as they got to be together.

Call me cynical, but I've always thought this.  It would be just like A Song of Unbelievably Depressing Nihilistic Ice and Fire to give Jaime a chance at redemption, have him travel down that road a fair way and in the end throw it all away for the same old mistakes.  Because grimdark!  And subversion of tropes and yadda yadda.

So to my cynically ticking brain, Jaime's redemptive arc in Show!Song happened in Seasons 2 and 3, with Brienne and losing his hand.  So he already got redeemed, and he already threw it away.  I can be annoyed that the show isn't using NCW better (because I do think he's a good actor), but I haven't been annoyed that his redemptive arc was "thrown out."  But that's just me! 

[Fishslap]

7 hours ago, Maximum Taco said:

Huh. I did not even think of that. That actually makes a lot of sense.

I still don't like the explanation they used though that it's "a scheme devised by corrupt rulers to avoid true judgement by the gods" I mean the High Sparrow himself would be the first one to say that men could be bought, even most septons (like the previous high septon.) He should've just said that it was brutish and barbaric, or something like "the gods wouldn't want others to suffer or die, only the ones being judged." I could at least buy that, because everything before this point it's been said that trial by combat is the way to let the gods decide.

Corrupt people like Pycelle, Cercei and Tywin Lannister have been saying that, which was the point Tommen made. It's bad enough that we have to suffer with Zombie Greg now if people can't counter Cercei's cheating by banning trial by combat.

[Gertrude]

18 minutes ago, Hanahope said:

So the next 15 episodes are really going to encompass all the material contained in 2 (or 3) more books?  I guess a whole lot is being compressed or eliminated.

Well, that's what you get when you eliminate anything interesting about Dorne and kill the actual players, compress the Iron Islands into absurdity, decide that unCat is not something you want to do and delete a Targ heir. We have no idea about how much else they are deciding to skip/compress. They are only interested in hitting the big cinematic moments and are foregoing any actual story telling. They got their Red Wedding, they are happy, even if we may not be.

 

4 minutes ago, Misplaced said:

Call me cynical, but I've always thought this.  It would be just like A Song of Unbelievably Depressing Nihilistic Ice and Fire to give Jaime a chance at redemption, have him travel down that road a fair way and in the end throw it all away for the same old mistakes.  Because grimdark!  And subversion of tropes and yadda yadda.

So to my cynically ticking brain, Jaime's redemptive arc in Show!Song happened in Seasons 2 and 3, with Brienne and losing his hand.  So he already got redeemed, and he already threw it away.  I can be annoyed that the show isn't using NCW better (because I do think he's a good actor), but I haven't been annoyed that his redemptive arc was "thrown out."  But that's just me! 

If Jaime does eventually fall back into his old ways, then I want to see why. I want to see him actually trying and giving a shit about it and then fail. He had a brief glimpse at redemption but it was never more than skin deep. the season 3 arc for Jaime matches the book, but doesn't match anything else about show Jaime. I am not upset that they threw it away, I am upset that they never really committed to it and thus are robbing that character of what makes him interesting. And no, puppy dog looks at Brienne and a sad wave doesn't count.

[Tikichick]

Just now, Gertrude said:

Well, that's what you get when you eliminate anything interesting about Dorne and kill the actual players, compress the Iron Islands into absurdity, decide that unCat is not something you want to do and delete a Targ heir. We have no idea about how much else they are deciding to skip/compress. They are only interested in hitting the big cinematic moments and are foregoing any actual story telling. They got their Red Wedding, they are happy, even if we may not be.

 

If Jaime does eventually fall back into his old ways, then I want to see why. I want to see him actually trying and giving a shit about it and then fail. He had a brief glimpse at redemption but it was never more than skin deep. the season 3 arc for Jaime matches the book, but doesn't match anything else about show Jaime. I am not upset that they threw it away, I am upset that they never really committed to it and thus are robbing that character of what makes him interesting. And no, puppy dog looks at Brienne and a sad wave doesn't count.

I suspect we are headed for the story of the kingslayer who betrayed his oaths by killing his king to prevent him from burning his people alive to become one of a series of ironic twists as a result of several of his major decisions, likely ending in the obviously ironic climax.

[Hootis]

6 hours ago, placate said:

Since you didn't read the books but you're posting in the book readers thread, I'd like to tell you about how much more awesome Book!Arya is vs Arya can parkour and not sprain her ankles when jumping from heights and landing badly after getting gut decimated last episode. I'll spoiler this in case you posted in the wrong thread:

Nope, I meant to post here; I'm fishing for information as to why people still support the show Arya after this wasted story line.  I had to assume she's much better in the books.  Honestly, I think it's the actress (Maisie) who puts me to sleep - she reminds me of Paige in the Americans with her two facial expressions.  Worried Face and Stone Face.  Thanks for filling me in.

[GrailKing]

30 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

Nope, I'm talking specifically the one you mentioned in your first spoiler in the post I quoted.  There is speculation re: that character and a speculated major upcoming plot development, even speculation that person may ultimately be behind that plot development.  Dovetails nicely with what that person "said" in your spoiler.

Gosh, I just woke up and have 3 pages open LOL, my 66 YO brain needs a pointer to remember LOL.

I remember I said

Bran and Mel

[Gertrude]

Well, the House of Black and White is more mysterious and less combative for her. The rules and their beliefs make much more sense. The face magic is well done and not as easy as just putting on a mask. You see her actually learning things and putting them to use. She doesn't have as many chapters as she does screen time, which I think helps. We also get to see what she's thinking, and this helps all characters. A lot of what the book does well is hard to translate to the screen.

This is meant to be her 'off camera' time as she levels up and we only see glimpses of what she's up to while other storylines take center stage. They were reluctant to do this to a major character and fan-favorite. They've done it to Bran and we only see glimpses of what is happening with him, and I think it works better. It makes what we do see interesting and leaves us wanting more. (well, at least once he gets to the Three-eyed Crow. I wasn't a huge fan of his chapters traveling North)

Edited June 13, 2016 by Gertrude