S02.E16: Wrath Of The Villains: Prisoners

[formerlyfreedom]

After Gordon is removed from protective custody, he begins to face new threats and dangers inside prison walls. In order to survive, he must rely on a new friend, as well as Bullock and other outside help. Meanwhile, Penguin grows closer to his father, while his step-mother and step-siblings move forward with their own plans for the family.

[Primetimer]

Even in jail, stay strong. All may seem lost, but you never know when a ridiculous plot contrivance will save you.

Read the story

[HoodlumSheep]

This was a fantastic episode.

Bless Harvey and his cow. He is the ultimate bestie. Harvey in that police guard uniform.. *fans self*

Poor Lee and the baby and Jim. I wasn't really expecting that.

Farewell, Pee Wee Herman! I enjoyed you while you graced us with your presence.

I liked the prison guard a lot. I hope he stays alive. Did we ever get his name? Someone on tumblr mentioned he could be Aaron Cash (or a character based on him).

I knew when that guard first mentioned a body bag that that was going to be how Jim was going to escape.

FALCONE!!! Oh, how I've missed you! He was one of my favorite characters in season 1. It was so good to see him.

Poor Puck. :'(

Overall this episode hit me with the feels.

Next episode looks fantastic as well.

Did I see that right? APRIL 11th? Do we really have to wait? Is this going to be like last year where we got an episode, then a week's break, then a new episode, a month break, etc? Because if so I am not pleased.

[Spartan Girl]

Harvey Bullock RULES.

So are we all sure that Lee really lost the baby? Or is this a cover story of some kind? I wouldn't put anything past the writers.

RIP Papa Pee Wee.

[MrsRafaelBarba]

Puck was a Dead Man Walking.

Nice seeing Falcone again.

Poor Oswald, hope Stepmommy and her spawn Get GOT!

Sorry show, not buying that mess with Lee.

[HoodlumSheep]

At first i didn't know what to believe about Puck. Was he an actual cinnamon roll or was he secretly a villain/future villain? Turns out he was just a cinnamon roll.

:'(

I really liked the ambience of this episode. It was like a splice between creepy and sad and it somehow worked really well.

[SoSueMe]

Great episode! Dammit show, introducing a lovable innocent and then killing him off right before my eyes!!! Wait, 2 lovable innocents, Puck and penguin daddy. Geez, way to grasp tragedy from the jaws of a happy ending. But it's Gotham! :)

[HoodlumSheep]

I am physically cringing at the thought that Gotham's episode schedule is going to play out exactly like last year. The constant week/month breaks for the final few episodes managed to kill the momentum and damage the ratings.

I seriously hope it doesn't happen again because they have a really good momentum going right now.

[Kathemy]

Sorry to say it but this was one damn weak episode. The Gordon plot lacked any kind of emotional punch. The Penguin plot was extremely well-acted but it couldn't have been any more predictable if they tried. At least next outing looks to be great.

 

Also, no, the schedule will be just fine. As far as I know it's just this week is skipping due to the NCAA championships.

Edited March 29, 2016 by Telepath

[SnoGirl]

They were watching Seven Brides for Seven Brothers right? Out of this entire episode, that cracked me up. What a movie to choose to be playing in the background.

I love Harvey. Loved seeing Falcone again, and the terrifying respect Harvey actually has for Falcone.

I fast-forwarded through the Penguin stuff. I wish they would just dedicate an episode to Gordon and Bruce. The villians are really starting to grate just a bit.

Every time I saw Gordon in prison garb, I keep thinking "No, Ryan Atwood, what happened???" I blame Peter Gallagher being on New Girl last week.

Edited March 29, 2016 by SnoGirl

[Lantern7]

Meh episode, given the wonderfulness blowing up over on Supergirl. Nice that we only got one episode of Gordon in the hoosegow, and now we can witness "Jim Gordon: Fugitive." On the other hand, Oswald's father bites it, and now he's lost both parents in the span of a few months. If his adopted family survives by season's end, I will be amazed.

 

Reading the recap . . . I think the inmates at Arkham wear the stripes. Puck should have been wearing a red shirt from the moment we met him.

 

Only thing missing was Ed eating doughnuts and getting laid.

[thuganomics85]

Great seeing Carmine Falcone again.  John Doman always knows how to make most of his screen time, and I always liked that while he is a villain, there is a more logical and even reasonable approach to his way of doing things, compared to the rest, so I can understand why people like Bullock and Jim work with him, because he at least some kind of code, even if it is twisted as hell.

 

Glad Bullock didn't just let sleeping dogs lie, and went to bat for Jim.  I figured something was up as soon as the friendly guard told Jim to be prepared for movie night, but it was enjoyable watching them pull it off.  Too bad Puck was too beaten up make it out alive.

 

So, Oswald's reunion with dad was short-lived, because Melinda Clarke and her creepy children are clearly just all about the money, and tried to poison Oswald, only for his dad to drink it instead.  Since the lawyers didn't draft the will yet, I wonder if they're getting the money.  Of course, there is a very good chance they might not even last long enough to enjoy it, because I have a feeling Hugo Strange's treatment is going to be pushed to the limit, if Oswald ever figures it out.

 

Nygma is still proud of himself, but that might change once he hears that Jim has escaped.

 

Leslie lost the baby?  Since it was only mentioned off-screen, we'll see if there is another twist, but that would be a big-ass thing for Bullock to lie about.

[Kathemy]

http://www.douxreviews.com/2016/03/gotham-prisoners_28.html

 

One word, "meh".

[Jediknight]

I liked the prison guard a lot. I hope he stays alive. Did we ever get his name? Someone on tumblr mentioned he could be Aaron Cash (or a character based on him).

My first thought was that he was a Cash stand-in or Cash's father.

 

Loved the return of Falcone.  That's something I've been waiting for, because it seemed like he cared about Gotham in his way, and didn't want to see it completely fall.

 

I'm glad they actually gave an explanation for Jim being in general population.  I was thinking if they're going to put a high profile criminal, who happened to be a detective who put a lot of the guys in prison, into general population without any explanation, then that might be the most unbelievable thing I've seen on the show.

 

I'm thinking once Gordon gets everything cleared up, and is back in good standing, he'll do something to honor Puck.

Edited March 29, 2016 by Jediknight

[immortalfrieza]

So, Oswald's reunion with dad was short-lived, because Melinda Clarke and her creepy children are clearly just all about the money, and tried to poison Oswald, only for his dad to drink it instead.  Since the lawyers didn't draft the will yet, I wonder if they're getting the money.  Of course, there is a very good chance they might not even last long enough to enjoy it, because I have a feeling Hugo Strange's treatment is going to be pushed to the limit, if Oswald ever figures it out.

Apparently intelligence skips a generation in Oswald's family, because Oswald's Dad would have to be a complete moron not to pick up on that his "family" all wants him dead, except, incidentally, for Oswald. The "family" might as well have had "I want to kill you and take all your money" displayed on their chests in bright flashing neon to make that more obvious than it was. I know nothing of the legality of inheritance but I'm guessing the "family" will try to off Oswald anyway since as Oswald's Dad's (I have no idea what his name is) next of kin by blood he's going to get in the way of them getting that fortune in some manner or another otherwise.

 

Leslie lost the baby?  Since it was only mentioned off-screen, we'll see if there is another twist, but that would be a big-ass thing for Bullock to lie about.

A big-ass thing to lie about that Harvey would have no actual reason to lie about that I can think of. Why would lying to Gordon that Lee lost the baby help him in any way? In fact, such a lie was more likely to do the opposite by completely demoralizing Jim if not drive him to suicide.

 

I'm thinking once Gordon gets everything cleared up, and is back in good standing, he'll do something to honor Puck.

Or, like with every other person to die in Gotham except the Waynes Gordon and everybody else will immediately and permanently forget Puck ever existed, which I find much more likely. Also, if this show were remotely like real life even when he proved his innocence he would still be considered liable for Puck's death and end up back in prison again.

[Biggie B]

They were watching Seven Brides for Seven Brothers right?

 

That's what I thought it was, although for a split second, I also thought it was "Oklahoma." But probably not.

 

I enjoyed this episode, even though it was screamingly obvious that Penguin's new-found happiness with his father wouldn't last. Pee Wee was great - I'm sorry to see him go. Poor Penguin - looks like he's going to regress right back to his pre-Arkham ways. I do wonder if he'll ever be implicated in Galivan's death. Perhaps he'll revert back to being a serious criminal and gladly take credit for it - "I'm so bad I even killed Galivan!! Catch me if you can!!" - which would of course help Jim.

 

I don't think Harvey had any ulterior motive in telling Jim that Lee lost the baby and moved away. Jim is his friend - Harvey would never be so cruel as to fabricate something so devastating to Jim.  Besides, isn't having the character Lee gone for a while a good way for the actress to take her maternity leave?

 

I also don't think we'll ever hear about Puck again. He served no purpose other than to motivate Jim to "choose life." Easy come, easy go. But wow, six years for stealing a car? That seemed excessive, poor kid.

[darkestboy]

I actually loved this one. Yup, it was cliché a plenty but it worked a lot though.

 

Gordon's storyline in the longest time actually held my attention and I was shocked that Leslie lost the baby offscreen.

 

Bullock working with Falcone to get Gordon out of Blackgate was interesting too. I liked that plot.

 

Oswald's family are freaking nuts. Not Elijah though, he was genuinely wonderful and then he died.

 

I'd rather have seen Charles try Plan B than Sasha though, 9/10

[MadyGirl1987]

Enjoyed this episode. Of course Papa Penguin wouldn't last, but sorry he is gone. Maybe flashbacks or hallucinations. We did see Gertrude a couple episodes ago.

 

I knew poor Puck would did the moment he said "I'm not dying in here." At least he died free?

 

And did anyone else notice they totally used a set from Daredevil season 2? The yard where Harvey visits Jim is the same one where 

The Punisher meets the Kingpin.

. I saw that "no excessive noise" painted on the wall and how it looked familiar. Pulled up the episode on Netflix and compared it. Sure enough it is the same. Look at the "no excessive noise" when positioned behind Gordon and how it compares in Daredevil. I just might have too much time on my hands to notice that...

[Dobian]

This is the second time Gordon has been forced into exile, the first time he was shuffled off to Arkham to be a security guard.  His career path to becoming the police commissioner is certainly a strange one, lol.  I wonder if Leslie really lost the baby, or just went to have it in hiding.  She must have gone off to have her baby in real life, wonder if she will be back next season or if they are just going to have Gordon go back to Crazy Babs.  I love Penguin's treacherous family and the scenes with his dad.  I will miss Paul Reubens.  I look forward to Penguin getting his groove back and dispatching his relatives after he figures out they murdered his dad.  This show has gotten really strong now, you can have an episode without Bruce or Alfred in it at all and it's great, or an episode that focuses on them and it's great.

Edited March 29, 2016 by Dobian

[Cruella]

How predictable and by the book is this show? I skipped bits and half-watched because it was obvious what was happening and nobody has any nuance, so. Evil evilled, good got banal uplifting speeches and explained plot in very simple sentences. The only surprising thing was Lesley's baby, and that felt just RANDOM. Penguin's father at least provided some intrigue, as it was interesting to see what exactly is up with his side of family (teh ebol step mom was as obvious as predictable), but for some reason his scenes felt so odd and their conversations would start so randomly, that I kept expecting them to turn out to be dreams. And in the end there was nothing interesting there anyway. And what was this bizarre nobody-cared drama with patsy faced kid?

[Gulftastic]

I know it was never going to happen, but I really wanted Penguin to be happy with his Pee Wee Herman Dad. I loved when he got fatherly forgiveness.

[Traveller519]

To me this episode gave glimpses of what Gotham can be. The fact that the show only had two real storylines worked so much better than when they try and cram things happening from every storyline into one episode. Plus the dichotomy of Jim in Jail, versus Penguin in his Strange induced mental prison, while seemingly happy on the outside worked well. My issue with the writing is that it's this two episode set up and "pay-off" <scare-quotes intended>.

 

The Victor Fries storyline was set up well, but then after two episodes its shelved for future reference, Penguin meets his father, and he's dead after an epsiode... for the show to be truly great, I would have loved for this episode to have not provided resolutions to either Penguin's or Jim's prison-stays. Give us a greater feeling of despair for Jim, let us see just how Happy Oswald is, while he gets the sense of the Step-Family's intentions.

 

For what its worth, I did somewhat sympathize with the step-family, at least the mother. As she says, she gave Elijah a sense of purpose in his life again. I don't think she was initially in it for the money. But getting the sense that this guy was going to come and claim the inheritance would put anyone's warning lights on.  Unfortunately, the whole family dealt with it in just about the worst way possible. 

[driedfruit]

Boring episode. Reformed Penguin bored me about as much as Gordon's prison stint. They should've planned this out better and had Gordon's prison nemesis be a familiar face. What the hell was the point of that adolescent? The only good parts were Harvey's scenes and Falcone's appearance. 

 

I'd much rather we got a whole episode of BatCat shenanigans, making trouble for Butch and Tabitha. 

Edited March 29, 2016 by driedfruit

[Kathemy]

The direction and pacing of this episode was very good. Too bad it was used to convey so tedious material. If, for example, "This Ball of Mud and Meanness" had been divided in screentime in a similar manner, that episode would've been even more fantastic. As it were, it was pearls before swine.

[Danielg342]

Man that ruled. Even if it was over the top and followed just about every cliche you could think of. What matters is that the execution was spot on.

 

I mean, I don't think it's the worst example of the acting saving the writing (Criminal Minds did it far more often, even its halcyon days), but it's pretty egregious since Gotham's writing tends to be pretty good. This episode, though, was one of the laziest written of the series' entire run, which was only saved because the actors put in such great performances.

 

It's especially true of the prison plot. It's not the first time jail has been shown to be an actual death sentence with a callous warden, a downtrodden targeted convict (Jim) and the warden working with a prisoner to kill said target. I even rolled my eyes at Jim's "death"- how much more of an example of "plot armour" can you get with that? We knew Jim was escaping, so why the cut to commercial right afterward? I will say I didn't see Puck dying and I wished he survived, but, at least for once the show used a male for the role of "inspirational death", so I'll let it go.

 

According to iMDB, the prison guard who helped Jim was a man by the name of Wilson Bishop, plated by Marc Damon Johnson. Aside from Bullock, he was the real highlight of the episode (more on that later), because he brought a lot of depth and energy to his role, which, like much of this episode, was written very poorly. I'm hoping we'll see him again in some capacity, because he was a real treat to watch.

 

Not a real treat to watch was Oswald's family drama. R.I.P. Elijah van Dahl, you went too soon, especially because Paul Reubens killed it as him. I'm not sure if the writer intended it, but Reubens seemed to give van Dahl an air of "godliness" to him, as Oswald confided his darkest sins to him and van Dahl assuredly and emphatically forgave him for it, as if van Dahl had that authority. I would have liked to have seen a few more episodes out of van Dahl, since there seemed to be a lot more depth and more avenues to explore in the Oswald-Elijah relationship (especially with van Dahl's revelation that his own father had dark thoughts meaning he likely had dark thoughts), but the writer seemed to whiff, just to create more drama and perhaps unhinge Oswald again. A pity, really- these writers don't seem to understand patience, do they?

 

I will say that Kayley Ronayne looked pretty hot portraying Sasha's attempted seduction of Oswald...darn, man. If that wasn't your (practical) sister and she wasn't clearly being manipulative, I'd be all over that.

 

(Of course, it's yet another example of the show believing female characters' only strengths are their sexuality, but Ronayne played it very well, so I'll give it a pass)

 

Other than that, I had high hopes for Melinda Clarke (Grace) but her and Justin Mark (Charles) were pretty one-note...I hope there's more to it than we've seen so far because I'd hate for this show to bring in a talent like Clarke and waste her like they've done.

 

The Bullock Meter

 

10- I had to save the most important part of the story for here because, finally, since "Spirit of the Goat", Harvey Bullock drove the episode. In fact, not only did he drive it, he commanded it and engaged at it full speed. Wow, was that ever a treat to watch. Again, the writing was pretty poor but there was Donal Logue, giving Harvey the life that only he can bring. I don't think you could have a greater example of what kind of a friend Bullock is to Jim and precisely what Jim means to him than this episode, because, boy did Logue kill it.

 

You could feel Bullock's genuine sadness when he had to break the news to Jim about Lee and the baby. You could feel Bullock's frustration when he didn't have a clue in figuring out who framed Jim (sure, Bullock likely would have figured it out because he's a keen observer but that's not on Logue but on the writer, and you could argue Bullock's emotions- another character trait of his- got the better of him). You could feel the deep amount of respect and camaraderie that Bullock has for Carmine Falcone, as Bullock fumbled his words doing his best not to upset the old mob boss (one aspect of where the writing was spot on was Falcone telling Bullock so subtly, "you know, it's rude to wear hats inside of a building").

 

Best of all, though, was Jim's rescue, because I felt Bullock's frustration with Jim for not just recognizing the gravity of the situation but getting moralistic at a moment when time was of the essence. I dug Bullock's impassioned plea with Jim that "gosh, guy, I went through all these lengths to save you and you know we don't have a lot of time so why the heck aren't you displaying any sense of urgency is beyond me!" That was classic Harvey, snarky but serious at the same time, displaying the "pit bull" attitude that makes me love Bullock so much.

 

It's one more reason to give Bullock his own show, because Donal Logue proved he could carry a show all by himself tonight.

 

Episode Grade- A-. This was a great episode, thoroughly fun from beginning to end with the right mix of emotion and urgency to keep me hooked. If it wasn't rolled in a pile of cliches, it could have been the episode of the series. If nothing else, it's a prime example of how great Bullock can be as a character and why he needs to be used far more often, because Donal Logue delivered big time here.

[Miss Dee]

I found Bullock pretty sexy tonight, actually.

[formerlyfreedom]

I found Bullock pretty sexy tonight, actually.

 

*tiny voice* Me, too!

[Danielg342]

Well, I kind of look like him right now...mostly due to laziness, but I guess there's hope for me yet! :P

[Perfect Xero]

I really enjoyed this one, and it was the first time that I've really been drawn in to a Gordon plot in a while. The last three episodes have just been hitting the atmosphere and acting out of the park, IMO. The plots/writing aren't always the best, but recently this show truly feels like I imagine living in Gotham City would feel.

 

While everyone is probably correct that Puck will never be mentioned again ... He said the reason he tried to step in and help Jim was a younger sister that Gordon saved from those kidnappers back in Season 1, is there a small chance that her name is Barbara and Jim and Lee eventually adopt her?

[Snookums]

The bad news is that Puck died along the way. Maybe there was a reason he was in that hospital bed and shouldn't have been dragged across town, huh?

 

 

Yes, and that reason was a BLOOD CLOT, as in "they say I have a clot." YOU DON'T MOVE SOMEBODY WITH A CLOT, BECAUSE THERE'S A GOOD CHANCE IT WILL BREAK UP AND CAUSE A DAMN ANEURYSM. The second I saw that kid I knew A) there was no way he should have stayed alive long enough to meet Jim Gordon and B) that situation would be rectified posthaste. He did die outside the prison walls, though, so Jim can mention him once to Lee once he finds her and then never, ever again.

 

As far as Lee losing the baby, I don't think she did, but I believe Harvey thinks so. There is no way, no way he would tell Jim something like that if he didn't think it was true. He would know damn well Jim would lose all hope if he did, not to mention being so cruel as to make even Ed or Fish recoil and say "what? What?" Obviously the whole "Lee went south" thing was to get Morena Barracin off the show for her maternity leave but within the story I'm assuming she was threatened in some way, so she left town and spread the word that the baby died to prevent any interest in coming after her by those who would like to cause Jim pain for various reasons.

 

So, is Ed just assuming that nobody else is going to care about tracking down Kristen? I mean, he's right, Lee's gone and Gordon didn't care in the first place, it was just Ed's paranoia, but still, on the off chance, he should have a plan. He can't frame every person in the place for murder.

 

I could not track The Family Penguin And Their Various Shenanigans. My husband and I were tossing ideas around the whole episode: was Elijah in the know about his family members, not P's dad at all, and just using him to expose them? But he could have kicked them out any time he wanted. And he certainly acted like he thought he was Oswald's dad the whole time. If the family was so anxious to keep Elijah alive, why switch out the meds? Because they frankly should have been as happy for Elijah to kick off as they would have been if Oswald had--as long as the will hadn't been changed that was a win/win situation, right? Oh well, at least we got to see Paul Reubens in a full-ruffle nightshirt.

 

I wish somebody would explain to evil wardens that if you want a prisoner offed, damn well do it yourself and make sure the body looks beat up. It's not like anybody is questioning anything that goes on in there so why bother getting in debt to prisoners for favors and stand around hissing loudly about your corrupt commissioner friends? JUST KILL THE GUY ALREADY. Gah, nobody seems to get things done on this show, except Harvey.

 

Now that Jim's going to be underground in Gotham I'm expecting a teamup with Bat and Cat. That should be fun!

[Snorfbat]

They were watching Seven Brides for Seven Brothers right? Out of this entire episode, that cracked me up. What a movie to choose to be playing in the background.

Yep, that was Seven Brides for Seven Brothers, or as I like to call it, Stockholm Syndrome: The Musical.

 

A truly bizarre choice for prison entertainment.

[jhlipton]

They were watching Seven Brides for Seven Brothers right? Out of this entire episode, that cracked me up. What a movie to choose to be playing in the background.

 

Yep, I spotted it right away.

 

Melinda Clarke and her creepy children are clearly just all about the money, and tried to poison Oswald, only for his dad to drink it instead. 

 

I don't see why they were upset about Daddy van Dahl biting it, save the Oswald, being a blood relative, might have a claim on an existing will.

[Snookums]

 

I don't see why they were upset about Daddy van Dahl biting it, save the Oswald, being a blood relative, might have a claim on an existing will.

 

Unless the house/furnishings are specifically to be handed to a family member per unbreakable bequest, I don't think Oswald has firsties rights automatically--I don't think even Gotham has entailment as part of its existing property/inheritance laws; plus, while rulings like that may apply to house and furnishings, they shouldn't to money/stocks/bonds/jewelry, etc. Also, Elijah specifically said he "wanted" Os to have it all and was changing his will in the morning.

 

That seeming to be the case, I really don't see the problem in one drinking the poison instead of the other (aside from the obvious CLEARLY MURDER HE'S FOAMING AT THE DAMN MOUTH issues.) In fact, Elijah biting it would be better--if Oswald collapsed next to a bottle of clearly acid-treated sherry, E would automatically conclude "poison" and have them all thrown out or arrested!

[Tony]

Worst episode of the season for me. Not interested in Gordon or Penguin's storylines.

 

Did they ever explain why the warden hated Gordon so much that he kept pushing for Gordon's offing?

[formerlyfreedom]

Did they ever explain why the warden hated Gordon so much that he kept pushing for Gordon's offing?

 

Didn't the warden say he was friends with former Commissioner Loeb?

[Perfect Xero]

Worst episode of the season for me. Not interested in Gordon or Penguin's storylines.

 

Did they ever explain why the warden hated Gordon so much that he kept pushing for Gordon's offing?

 

As was said, the Warden was friends with Loeb. Also, it wasn't said directly, but Gordon was convicted of killing a cop, which is the sort of thing that puts you on the prison guard shit list. The prisoners were a combination of doing what the Warden wants and the fact that Gordon is a (former) Cop.

[shelley1234]

As was said, the Warden was friends with Loeb. Also, it wasn't said directly, but Gordon was convicted of killing a cop, which is the sort of thing that puts you on the prison guard shit list. The prisoners were a combination of doing what the Warden wants and the fact that Gordon is a (former) Cop.

 

The warden is also clearly corrupt and I think he wanted the "goody two shoes" Gordon out of his prison, so that he doesn't decide to blow the whistle on the shenanigans going on there like he was once hell bent on cleaning up Gotham City.  

[VCRTracking]

They were watching Seven Brides for Seven Brothers right? Out of this entire episode, that cracked me up. What a movie to choose to be playing in the background.

 

Yep, that was Seven Brides for Seven Brothers, or as I like to call it, Stockholm Syndrome: The Musical.

A truly bizarre choice for prison entertainment.

 

 

Trivia: Julie Newmar the original Catwoman was one of the seven brides, "Dorcas".

 

Poor Oswald.

 

Harvey is an awesome friend.

 

I really hope Lee faked the miscarriage and her baby turns out to be Barbara as in Batgirl.

[Camera One]

It was predictable, but overall, pretty engaging.  They're still spinning their wheels on Jim Gordon's character development, though.  He needed a kid to tell him to choose life?  Poor guy who was this week's cannon fodder from the start.  The bleakness is not seeing where Gordon's character can go from here.  A few episodes, and he'll be back at the police station, brash as ever.

 

I assumed the Lee stuff was just to give the actress some time off, and they didn't want to give Jim a kid yet.

 

I liked see more of Harvey, though I'm not as keen to see Falcone again.  

 

I enjoyed the scenes with Penguin's father.  The actors really made it work.  It was frustrating no one got a clue about the evil wife's plans, though.  Hopefully, that will come in the next few weeks.

[blackwing]

I enjoyed this episode, although I thought it was very predictable.  Was the wife really trying to kill Oswald and not Elijah?  She knew that Elijah was planning on changing his will in the morning.  Either Oswald dies, and she keeps the money when Elijah dies.  Or Elijah dies before changing his will, and she keeps the money.  I thought her "ohs noes he wasn't supposed to drink it" was all an act.  Clearly she had been trying to kill her husband, she was withholding his heart medication.

 

I did find it funny that when the sister came back after failing to seduce Oswald, that the brother immediately stepped in with "shall I try".  

[John Potts]

Somewhat conflicted over this episode - it seemed somehow lacking. Given that it's a prequel series, it was pretty much inevitable that both Penguin and Gordon would make it out alive, so it rather lacked in tension. I did actually wonder if Penguin's tale was in fact a Strange induced hallucination and Penguin is in fact still in Arkham - though it's doubtful we wouldn't have had some hints that things aren't right with Oswald by now.
 

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thuganomics85  Melinda Clarke and her creepy children are clearly just all about the money, and tried to poison Oswald, only for his dad to drink it instead.

 

That's what you get for crossing Lady Heather! Mind you, dad clearly signed his own death warrant here - he was almost Too Dumb to Live by going, "I'm thinking about disinheriting you lot - I'll talk to my lawyer tomorrow. Oh my poor heart!" Though it was odd that she was so upset at PenguinDaddy dying - surely that's the optimal outcome for her (she even has a convenient patsy for her crime!).

 

Quote

 

darkestboy  I'd rather have seen Charles try Plan B than Sasha though

 

 

I liked that it was suggested - even James Bond has to consider seducing men now, if Skyfall is to be believed.
 

Quote

SnoGirl  They were watching Seven Brides for Seven Brothers right?
snorfbat  Yep, that was Seven Brides for Seven Brothers, or as I like to call it, Stockholm Syndrome: The Musical.

 

Well it IS based on the Rape of the Sabine women, so it could have been worse. Though unsurprising it's not performed much these days.