S02.E07: True Love Never

[Tara Ariano]

Lucious explores the possibility of partnering with Jago as he maps out a plan to turn Empire into a global music monolith; at the same time, Andre struggles to find a balance between his newfound values and demanding career. Elsewhere, Hakeem molds Laura into a star; and Cookie pushes to get Lyon Dynasty involved in a major televised charity concert.

[SimoneS]

Ha, Cookie took Jamal back from Lucious and he knows it. I look forward to Cookie taking out Laz.

 

Lucious is so full of drama. I would feel more about his turmoil if he wasn't busy trying to destroy or harm everyone around him. His protege is going to kill him when she finds out that he killed her father.

 

Does this mean that Andre is finally chilling out because his angst is a little much.

 

I am glad to see Tianna again, but I cannot bring myself to care about Hakeem's ingenue.

Edited November 12, 2015 by SimoneS

[wanderingstar]

Damn if that "Boom Boom Boom" song isn't growing on me.

 

Mirage a Trois took a Dreamgirlsish turn this ep. Interesting. Hakeem and Laura's kiss was cute.

 

Loved how happy Cookie and Jamal were to be working together again.

 

Porsha was everything ("YASSS! My boss is a PIMP!")

 

I wouldn't want to be Laz when Cookie finds out about who he really is.

 

Next week looks GOOD!

Edited November 12, 2015 by Gillian Rosh

[dirtypop90]

Thought this was boring. why on earth would they devote so much time to hakeem and this new singer (who's name I always forget) She is just so bland. It was nice to see Tiana though, but I was upset she was used in this way. Why would a current popular star be interested in teaching some other girl how to be a star who could be placed in direct competition with her? Also, Still confused why she was made a series regular when they barely use her.

 

I would like to know what's going on with Boo Boo Kitty.

 

I really have no words about cookie and lucious's current s/ls other than I'm not feeling them.

Edited November 12, 2015 by dirtypop90

[mtlchick]

"what are you doing all walk of shame and what not?" It's hard to laugh when you have a cold.

 

The show had a slightly better pace than recent episodes but still pretty hectic.  Some stories should take a back seat for a while but I'm not sure which ones.  Sad for the lack of Becky, but happy for the dose of Porsha and her actual skunk hair

 

At least "Boom boom boom boom" is progressing along.  It's strangely addictive.

 

I'm very excited for next week...hopefully a few things come to a head and can be over with.

[phoenics]

Still love Adam Rodriguez and I am grateful to the show for giving me so many hawt scenes with them. That made my night. Laz is hot. FIRE.

I wonder if Lucious' mom killed herself... I feel badly for young Lucious - that must have been awful... that's just... awful.

Lucious' response to his entire childhood and young adult life is to just rail at anything that isn't what he thinks should be "normal" and lash out at those who aren't. Much of what he projects out at his sons is just his own self hatred.

The Hakeem vs Frieda thing is stupid. No matter what, Hakeem is a Lyon - Frieda will probably be dead or off the show by the end of the season.

That menage a trois scene with Lucious and the emerald city girl and whatsherface was confusing and seemed OOC for Lucious Lyon. Share? WTF? And what is whatsherface up to? Whoever she was on the phone with - I think this is about stealing Empire's entire music catalog. She's up to no good, probably in hock to some sheisters and promised to get it for all the money she put into Empire. Lucious is in trouble. And worse, Andre is going to be right about that streaming company - you can't just merge like that without a proper vetting. Lucious is supposed to be smarter than that.

I have a feeling that at the end, the only thing standing will be Lyon Dynasty and Lucious will have to band together with them in order to take Empire back from whatsherface and some corporate raiders. I think this is going to mirror what happened to most black owned labels. Lucious is about to lose everything.

[Syndicate]

This show is just mindless drivel!  Still nothing but a musical variety show for the most part with people not doing much of anything of substance.  Nothing about it seems to leave me with wanting to know what happens next.  And Boo Boo Kitty must be over and done with at this point.

Edited November 12, 2015 by Syndicate

[wanderingstar]

Forgot to add - that's two weeks in a row we've had Andre mention Empire's share price. Foreshadowing?

 

I'm still loving the Cookie/Hakeem team-up this season. 

[tennisgurl]

I cannot explain the appeal of Boom Boom Boom Boom, but...it has appeal. Its just intense in a way I don't totally get. 

[SimoneS]

That menage a trois scene with Lucious and the emerald city girl and whatsherface was confusing and seemed OOC for Lucious Lyon. Share? WTF? And what is whatsherface up to? Whoever she was on the phone with - I think this is about stealing Empire's entire music catalog. She's up to no good, probably in hock to some sheisters and promised to get it for all the money she put into Empire. Lucious is in trouble. And worse, Andre is going to be right about that streaming company - you can't just merge like that without a proper vetting. Lucious is supposed to be smarter than that.

I have a feeling that at the end, the only thing standing will be Lyon Dynasty and Lucious will have to band together with them in order to take Empire back from whatsherface and some corporate raiders. I think this is going to mirror what happened to most black owned labels. Lucious is about to lose everything.

 

You might be right. Lucious has made so many enemies that it would not surprise me if they team up to take him down.

[CofCinci]

I cannot explain the appeal of Boom Boom Boom Boom, but...it has appeal. Its just intense in a way I don't totally get.

It's like "Drip Drop." The first time I heard it, I thought it was an abortion. Now I hum it.

[appledumpling]

Too much sex this episode and like Syndicate mentioned up thread, no substance.  I'm hanging in there though, because I like the characters; however the storyline leaves a lot to be desired.  I find myself wanting this season to hurry up and be over with as opposed to last season when I didn't want it to end.

[Amethyst]

The promos confused me, because I thought the big showdown between Jamal and Lucious was happening this week.

 

Speaking of which, the scene between Cookie and Jamal was the best.  I love it when they're getting along.

 

Officially over Andre constantly freaking out, and the Lucious flashbacks.  The flashbacks are sad, but it looks like they're leading up to a grand conclusion (the mother's suicide, or Lucious shooting her in self-defense, etc) and I wish they would get to it already.

 

Is Rhonda actually pregnant?  I know you can be active during pregnancy, but gravedigging and heavy Stairmaster climbing just looks really suspicious...

 

I think Cookie is right; Laura isn't meant to be a lead.  At least not for a girl group.  She has the talent, but not the bite, and her innocent nature is probably what Hakeem really likes about her.  Her attitude towards the other singer was funny, but I don't think it's a permanent fixture for her personality.  And I wouldn't be surprised if she wasn't digging the Pussycat Dolls vibe from the group.

[thuganomics85]

The thankfully aborted threesome with Lucious, Mimi, and the other woman was just so damn strange.  One of those moments where I couldn't believe I was seeing it. Not sure why, really.  Maybe because it involved an Oscar winner?

 

Eh, don't care all that much about Laura, but I'm really loving Hakeem now, so I actually enjoyed him stepping up and help lighting a fire in her.  I think he has been showing that there is more to him then being an arrogant punk, and actually does have the smarts.  I liked that Cookie seemed to enjoy him not backing down.  And I liked that is suspicious of Laz, even if a lot of it might just be jealously over how much power he has.  But I can only imagine what Cookie's reaction will be once she realize what Laz has been doing.

 

The stuff with Jamal and Cookie was great.  Lucious better watch out, because Cookie really is the biggest influence in Jamal's songs, and knows how to make them successful in ways Lucious can't.

 

Andre resists falling back into old habits, and resorts to just bribery instead.  Classic Empire!  Kind of impressed that they got the same actress to play the deputy mayor (pretty sure it was the same one), since we haven't seen her since their first, err, "encounter."

 

Where did Anika go?  Then again, this is the first time in a while we've seen Tiana, so I do think the show is falling into the trap of not being able to use all their regulars.

 

Fuck it, I totally love the ridiculous "Boom, Bang" song.  And I still hold a somewhat unpopular opinion, by really enjoying it when Lucious sings.  I certainly don't think Terrence Howard is the best vocalist; not even close; but he just brings a raw energy to all of his songs that I really love.  I can see why Lucious was a success back in his heyday.

[Actionmage]

Clarence Williams III?! Yes! And he's still lookin' good.

 

I was initially glad that Andre found his faith, but I was concerned that he threw himself in so hard. His pastor seemed cool, but after tonight? I am wondering just what the man knows about Andre and his past. If the pastor is good, then Andre's second default- blackmail- may blow up in his face.  I am wondering if their conversation was potentially recorded as they were in an actual recording room.  Yeah, the show needs to be consistent with Rhonda's baby bump too.

 

It was so funny how Jamal and Cookie's actions were so very "illicit affair"!  Cookie not sure Jamal was going to show up. Getting giggly drunk and going to the studio- a "forbidden place" for Jamal now- and Cookie sneaking him out behind Hakeem's back! Like the preview from last week showed, Lucious knows who helped Jamal get his head around that single. Jamal was lucky that there was a room full of people.

 

Oh, and Lucious deserves all the unhappinesses. Unable to be happy for any of his sons is just the tip, no matter how understanding of his background I become. There have been many decisions made last and this season that were as spiteful and petty as anything he claims anyone else has done to him. I will admit that the drunk defense of Mimi to her phone felt honest and heartfelt, at least in that moment. Unless Lu was never drunk and was playing Mimi like the supervillain TPTB seem to be painting him as this season to date.

 

Watch your ass, Laz. Cookie don't play.

[Artsda]

I love the Boom Boom song and the actress who sings it. She better kick Hakeem next week.

 

This episode did feel like filler to me though.  

[GreekGeek]

I found it odd that Cookie and Laz spent days (?) of sex together, and she never once saw or questioned him about the tattoo on his back. I was sure that when he got up to "buy a newspaper," and his back was to her, she would look at his back and her expression of bliss would change to horror. Or did he give her some baloney story off screen?

 

I have to wonder about Andre's minister. Having sex to get what you want is sinful, but blackmail to accomplish the same thing is A-OK? Still, I'm glad Andre is finding some happiness through his faith. I wish the show would pick up the plotline from last week, where he seemed to want to impose a morals clause on the artists.

 

I confess I can't tell the difference between good rap and bad rap, so I am finding it hard to tell if Freda is genuinely talented or Lucious is kidding himself. Still, Clarence Williams III's character seemed pleased with her, so we're meant to take that as a sign that she is the former. One motif I'm finding amusing: Someone is singing away and Lucious or Cookie interrupts and says, "You're not bringing it" and then the person starts over singing pretty much the same way, and they say, "Now that's what I'm talking about."

 

Did Lucious's mom kill herself in front of Lucious? Yikes! But I thought it was weird that he just sat there and watched.

 

Looking forward to the Hakeem/Freda showdown next week, as well as his fight with Laz.

[wanderingstar]

I am blanking on the name of the streaming company Lucious wanted to merge with, but when that guy said he wanted exclusive rights to the Lucious Lyon catalog, I just thought "how very Tidal!"

[Dee]

Another fantastic episode.

 

Other than Lucious terrible rapping/singing, Terrence Howard should never be allowed to spit rhymes ever again, Empire has really solidified its reputation as a well written blockbuster television hit.

[Badsamaritan]

I think Laz is gonna be the thing to bring the Lyons brothers back together in a big way. Yeah they all have their issues with Cookie, but I'm pretty sure they will fuck Laz up collectively for hurting her.

I don't think Cookie saw the tat on the guys shaking her down, so even if she did see it on Laz, there's no reason for her to think it means anything. Hakeem is the only one who saw it and could put it together.

I like the spec that Lucius, in his arrogance, will lose Empire. He really is better creatively with Cookie. She woulda told him from jump what the Boom, Boom, Boom, Boom song needed. I'm starting to dig it too.

I hope Keem wipes the floor with Freda. She's trouble with a capital T.

[Neurochick]

Cookie never saw the tattoos on the guys who kidnapped Hakeem, Hakeem was the one who saw the tattoos.  

 

And I like that "Boom, Boom, Boom" song.

 

And I also really don't need for everything on TV to have substance.  If I want substance, I'll watch PBS.

[Dee]

Empire has a lot of substance. Much more than Lee's precious Dallas and Dynasty.

What anchors Empire most, however, is its unabashed embrace of its soap roots.

[Whitley Trillbert]

I feel like this show has hit the sophomore slump. I don't get it...especially if they have the same writers from last season.

[Dee]

Empire hasn't hit a sophomore slump, far from it actually, it has just refused to keep the characters static which has made for a much richer show with an infinitely deeper mythology IMO.

[Empress1]

Is Rhonda actually pregnant?  I know you can be active during pregnancy, but gravedigging and heavy Stairmaster climbing just looks really suspicious...

 

There was a woman in my spinning class who spun basically until she gave birth; she just kept moving the seat back to accommodate her growing belly. She had a baby a few months ago and is back in class. Twitter is insisting Rhonda's not pregnant, but I think she is.

 

I was not here for that threesome scene, at all, and Lucious and Mimi kissing had me recoiling. Maybe it's because Terence Howard has always creeped me out, but that was not sexy to me AT ALL. (Also Lucious/Terence Howard can't rap.)

 

Cookie and Laz are sexy - Adam Rodriguez is FINE - but I kind of can't wait until she kicks his ass when she finds out who he is.

 

Hakeem: "You're sitting in my negotiating chair" had me rolling. He was dead serious, too. You better get out of his chair! I really liked Hakeem this ep - "Why you looking all walk of shame and whatnot?"

 

I like that the show has grasped that Porsha is best used in small doses. "Yaaaaaas! My boss is a PIMP!" was a great line.

 

Really looking forward to the rap battle next week. Freda seems like she has more talent but Hakeem has more swag.

[Neurochick]

What I like about this show is that the characters aren't the same as they were last season; in real life people don't stay the same.  They change and not always for the better.  Lucious is different now that he knows he's not dying.  Cookie's different, she has to go her own way, not try to get Empire and she's let go of Lucious, which is why I feel Anika isn't important this season.  Cookie knows she's attractive and doesn't need Lucious to define her.

[Milz]

Laz is dead man walking. Still wondering how he managed to avoid Cookie seeing his back after being naked with her for 3 days.....

 

I liked how Lucious channelled Ravi Shankar on Boom Boom Boom.

[darkestboy]

I didn't enjoy this one. It had some moments but ultimately I found my mind wandering a bit with it.

 

I just want Cookie to wise up to Laz and take him out. She's right about Laura though even if Hakeem doesn't see it.

 

The scenes with Cookie and Jamal were great though.

 

Andre will crack once again, you can just see it coming, can't you?

 

Lucious and Mimi - I don't want a three way with them. The Lucious plot with the streaming company and Freda all had hit and miss qualities to them this week, 7/10

[Primetimer]

From the ring to the range to the bedroom, the Lyons are getting ready to blow.

Read the story

[Empress1]

Laz is dead man walking. Still wondering how he managed to avoid Cookie seeing his back after being naked with her for 3 days.....

Cookie didn't see Hakeem's captors' tats (brands?), only Hakeem did. So she has seen it, but she doesn't know it has any significance. And Hakeem hasn't seen Laz's back.

Edited November 12, 2015 by Empress1

[PepperMonkey]

God help me, I love this show.

 

I agree with appled, though, way too much sex and I am no prude. Adam Rodriguez IS fine, but he doesn't deserve Cookie. What has he done to deserve her? Nothing. I hope for HER, it's just sex and she's not falling for him or something.

 

I can't bring myself to care about Hakeem's girl, either. LOVE Hakeem, though and I loved Jamaal this epi because he really lights up when he's with his mom.

 

Was proud of Dre for not sleeping with the deputy mayor. Charles Malik Whitfield is going to be a majorly negative influence on him, though, and I love it. I adore CMW. It was also awesome to see Clarence Williams III but I was missing William Fichtner. Would love to see CWIII and Fichtner in some scenes together.

 

Welp, I'm off to fangirl cause I just realized that's what I sound like and while I'm at it, I shall try to get Boom Boom Boom out of my head, probably to no avail.

[bichonblitz]

Cookie and Jamal getting drunk on the "best champagne" in the bar. Great scene. Jamal's smile melts me. 

Boom Boom Boom Bang Bang Bang... can't get enough of that! 

What's Marisa Tomei up to? 

[lovinbob]

That's not really Quincy Jones, is it?

 

Update: Just read that it is Clarence Williams III, which is what I suspected (though I didn't know his name).

Edited November 12, 2015 by lovinbob

[CofCinci]

What's Mimi's long con with Lucious? She wasn't interested in the 3-way and most likely faked whatever phone call that was. I don't want to see those two make out again. Is he going to lose Empire to her and then end up over at Lyon Dynasty?

Too bad Laz will most likely die. Wish he wasn't a "bad guy" and could stay on the show a little longer.

The wig consultants should have given Cookie the (fake) hair of someone who has been in bed banging for 3 days.

The Cookie's Cookout animation on a screen in the background was adorable.

Kelly Rowland is great as Lucious' ill mother. Hope she gets some credit though I think her role has gone unnoticed by most because Empire is in the sophomore slump.

Is Rhonda still pregnant?

[JenE4]

I really like how they start an episode with a song just eh, and then Cookie or Lucious or the singer or some producer guest star of the week tweaks it throughout the episode so that by the end of the show I actually like the song.** For instance, when Cookie was texting Jamal and said to flip it around or something that I had no idea what it meant and it went all terrible singing here to AMAZING SINGING yeah-yeah-yeah! And then the same thing with "Boom Boom Boom, Bang Bang Bang." It was really lame at the beginning of the episode and then Lucious channeled his inner wounded child and it was all kick-ass sing-rapping and trigger pulls and revolver revolutions. And I was all Hell, yeah, this song is awesome! But, I have to laugh in agreement what someone said above (sorry, I can't quickly find it again scrolling up) how someone will sing badly and then get a pep talk, sing it the same way, and then get a "Now THAT's what I'm talking about!" That was totally the case with Frieda. She did do her parts the same throughout, and Lucious was all psyched when she sounded exactly the same. LOL. I think because the other rappers also incorporate various tones and speeds and emphasis and make their rhymes sing-songy, and Frienda is just IRapMonotonelyAtThisSameRapidPaceAtAllTimes. Good thing she had Lucious to add some pep and emotion to Boom, Boom, Boom, Bang, Bang, Bang. Yet, I'm sure even though she's terrible, she's going to win the rap battle and so Hakeem will go back to Empire and then Jamal will go to Lyon Dynasty because he works best with Cookie...and because Lucious is pissed that he got that living room concert bump.

 

**Edited to add an exception: That Bottomless Mimosas song was just terrible. Then again, the coaching there simply surrounded bumping one girl over the other out of the way with no musical improvement, "I Will Survive en Espanol" aside. Then again, I hate every song that group does.

Edited November 12, 2015 by JenE4

[angelita100]

This was my favourite episode of the year so far.  I miss Jamal and Cookie's scenes together so this was great. Love Keem and his I like his love interest.  Can't wait for Cookie to find out what Laz is up to.  And the Boom boom song... LOVE  IT.  Terrence may not be a true rapper but whatever, he brings something to it that is convincing to a know nothing like me.

[wanderingstar]

I like the Mirage a Trois songs "Do It" and "Runnin"

*hangs head*

[Grace19]

I love their songs too. this episode is okay. It occurred to me this episode that the writers never focus on Hakeem and Cookie producing his songs. they just show him rap some songs, but we hardly ever get to see him and his mother working on it and I'm starting to think its deliberate. every episode now, Jamal gets to sing at least 3 songs and we see him working on it, we also see Freda being produced by Luscious, why not show us cookie and Hakeem too. it will help us get to see them as good at what they do. seems like cookie is only shown to be a good producer when she is producing Jamal, like they have to show Jamal as the greatest artist on the show, so we don't get to see others work on their songs.

As much as I love Hakeem's girl group, I miss seeing him perform with Tiana, she is a regular now, so they should use her. I will hate it if they make Hakeem loose to Freda, she is a good rapper, but I can't buy her as a better rapper, artist and performer than Hakeem, who have better stage presence.

[Grace19]

Moving on to other things, I think Cookie should tell Hakeem, she's working with his brother, Hakeem loves his brother and will understand. but if he catches them sneaking around, he might take it the wrong way. He's always believed that his mother loves Jamal more, and its not above Luscious to use this to lure him away from his mother. I hope this doesn't cause any problem between them.

On a shallow note, Tiana is gorgeous.

[tomatoflyer]

I'm frustrated by how boring the show has become. No one seems to have much personality or spark anymore. Empire still hasn't stabilized in the ratings, and I'm wondering just how low it will go. The show had a certain spirit, and I feel like it's gone.

[Dee]

.

Edited November 13, 2015 by Dee

[RCharter]

**Edited to add an exception: That Bottomless Mimosas song was just terrible. Then again, the coaching there simply surrounded bumping one girl over the other out of the way with no musical improvement, "I Will Survive en Espanol" aside. Then again, I hate every song that group does.

"Bottomless Mimosas" followed up by the hit "Brunch Till They Run Outta Crab Legs"

What's Mimi's long con with Lucious? She wasn't interested in the 3-way and most likely faked whatever phone call that was. I don't want to see those two make out again. Is he going to lose Empire to her and then end up over at Lyon Dynasty?

Too bad Laz will most likely die. Wish he wasn't a "bad guy" and could stay on the show a little longer.

The wig consultants should have given Cookie the (fake) hair of someone who has been in bed banging for 3 days.

 

Depending on the method of attachment in real life it might just have fallen off after 3 days of good lovin'

 

Can Laz die after being in my bed for three days straight?  Hot dog Adam Rodriguez is a beautiful man!

 

I was totally weirded out by that entire Mimi/Lucious scene.  I was so scared for that call-girl, the two of them looked crazy as hell and the minute they were out of the room April should have stolen their wallets and made a run for it.

 

Welp, I'm off to fangirl cause I just realized that's what I sound like and while I'm at it, I shall try to get Boom Boom Boom out of my head, probably to no avail.

The only way to combat an earworm is to send in an even bigger earworm to destroy it.

 

May I suggest Mambo No. 5?

[sereion1]

I hope Cookie knows what's she doing by placing that bet with Luscious; Hakeem will never forgive her. I'm not feeling Freda; her voice is nails to a chalkboard.

Edited November 13, 2015 by sereion1

[Easyspreestep]

I hope Cookie know what's she doing by placing that bet with Luscious; Hakeem will never forgive her. I'm not feeling Freda; her voice is nails to a chalkboard.

The minute Cookie placed the bet I knew Hakeem would win the battle.  No need to even watch the show.  

[SashaSwank]

I have a feeling Laz is undercover police.

[njudah]

"boom boom boom boom?" "drip drop drippity drop?" these are indeed deep lyrics lol

[Joimiaroxeu]

I just want Cookie to wise up to Laz and take him out.

Apparently she's gonna wear him out before she takes him out. I ain't mad at her.

 

Can Laz die after being in my bed for three days straight?  Hot dog Adam Rodriguez is a beautiful man!

He truly is. I like the idea of him being an undercover cop because I'll hate to see him go otherwise when Cookie or one of the other Lyons kills him. But I guess if he's a cop Cookie will still be done with him. Sigh.

 

Up until this episode I thought the season was rather weak. Now it feels more like season one again to me.

[Vixenstud]

Boom Boom Boom, like Drip-Drop is soooo addictive....I find myself repeating Boom Boom Boom Boom, Bang Bang Bang Bang whenever I walk into a room or doing nothing. 

 

And maybe I was particularly horny this eppy, but UO I was totally turned on with the Lu/Mimi/side piece scene....from Lu and Mimi's kiss to the way Lucious pushed the girl's thigh aside and looked like he was about to go deep sea fishing, Mr. Vixenstud almost got DA HAMMER! put on him!  Then Lucious had to see that damned gun tatt and the moment was ruined.

 

But when he, Freda and his gun did the other version of Boom Boom Boom?  Mmm-mmm!

Now, I don't find TH attractive at all...the man looks like Roosevelt the corner pimp with pretty eyes!  However, he was upping the sexay this episode.

[wanderingstar]

One thing I missed on my initial watch was Andre saying "Bill de Blasio would love that" when he showed Deputy Mayor Alvarez the video he blackmailed her with. Damn that was funny.

[kassa]

The one thing that doesn't make sense about the tattoos is that Hakeem would have mentioned them to both parents -- you know, as evidence about who the guys who were otherwise hooded and masked were.  So they could figure out who they were and go after them (or deal with them as the case may be).

 

But somehow they knew who they were and how to deal with them (not sure how they just figured that out, unless the ransom was signed explicitly).  At any rate, you'd think it would come up in conversation.  Or maybe Hakeem just blanked everything out.