S02.E04: Orange Sticker

[formerlyfreedom]

In the midst of an earthquake, Nora awakens to find Kevin missing and her hopes of safety in their new town dashed. The Murphys are left reeling after Evie’s disappearance. Kevin returns home, but without his memory of the night before or his cell phone, which would link him to the missing girls. Meanwhile, an old enemy makes her return in an unexpected way.

 

 

[Primetimer]

You can't talk about The Leftovers's Patti Problem without talking about its Kevin Problem. Is this a Pierce two-fer?

Read the story

[ToastnBacon]

Why is Patti speaking like a hick? She didn't used to talk like that.

Kevin doesn't seem too concerned with his palm print being on the car.

It looked like there were finger prints too, does Kevin think that the crime lab in Austin will blow it off?

It seems like the authorities would be eager to pin the girl's disappearance on a person, and not another departure.

Great low energy version of "You'd better shape up" from Grease.

[Tim Thomason]

It's true that Kevin should be more worried, although he's probably internalizing his worry and secretly hoping to get caught and "pay for his crimes" or whatever. Nora was right, and revealing his fugue state would've been a bad idea. Perhaps as bad as sleeping with handcuffs on.

 

But if what the show's suggesting is true (and it might not be), and there's been a second departure, then Kevin will probably be off the hook soon. If there has been another departure, and I presume it's a lot smaller than the 2% last time, then the news will spread quickly over the next couple days. Austin might be too busy to investigate thoroughly if they're suddenly hit by all these claims.

 

Of course, Kevin's fingerprints (as a police chief leaving aside his earlier booking) are certainly on record. And his behavior during the search and rescue were pretty typical of the usual "hang around the crime scene" that criminals partake in (disregarding the fact that he's been spotted talking to thin air in the middle of town). If a second departure doesn't become public knowledge quickly, then I'd expect Kevin to be detained and questioned about midway through the next day.

[patty1h]

What did Nora ask Kevin at the very end? After the handcuffs they laid down on the bed and she asked him a question - he answered "no". I couldn't make out what she said; I was watching online so I couldn't put on captions. Thanks in advance.

[Hava]

Why is Patti speaking like a hick? She didn't used to talk like that.

 

So I wasn't hallucinating!

 

When Patti told Kevin those details about her husband, that convinced me, for some reason, that she isn't real and is just Kevin's own subconscious. It seemed like that was something Laurie had told Kevin during their marriage. 

[represent]

 

When Patti told Kevin those details about her husband, that convinced me, for some reason, that she isn't real and is just Kevin's own subconscious. It seemed like that was something Laurie had told Kevin during their marriage.

But then why did the old man that the boy brings food to ask Kevin, "Who's your friend?" after Patti left? It made it seem like that old man could also see Patti. I'm confused. 

 

What did Nora ask Kevin at the very end? After the handcuffs they laid down on the bed and she asked him a question - he answered "no". I couldn't make out what she said; I was watching online so I couldn't put on captions. Thanks in advance.

 

I think she asked him if he believed that the girls would be found and he replied with a no.

Edited October 26, 2015 by represent

[Hava]

Oh, I thought that was because Kevin was talking to himself.

[represent]

 

Oh, I thought that was because Kevin was talking to himself.

Maybe, that's why I'm confused. I mean I don't know why that man is up there and he does talk to at least one human being that we know exist, the Murphy's son. But on the other hand he does look like he could have some "experience" talking to things that aren't really there. I did think that yeah, Kevin was talking to the air and that old man up there could relate to that and he didn't actually see Patti. But I'm not sure.

Edited October 26, 2015 by represent

[cpierce]

"Why is Patti speaking like a hick? She didn't used to talk like that."

Cuz that's what them thar Hollywoord types thinks uf us Texans... that we as all hicks and *snort* sheeat!

[NorthstarATL]

Ghost Patti is certainly making up for all that GR silence back when she was alive! I kept worrying about Lilly when Nora stuck her in a box and left the house, only to return and collapse, and later when Jill decided to go visit the Murphy boy next door while babysitting! I suppose after the departures you are either going to be hyper-vigilant or nonchalant, with little middle ground. I did like Nora's reaction, though, when she thought the event might have happened again, and the return of uncertainty surrounding the girls' disappearance. But, at the same time, she brought up the equally valid point that there were opportunists using the departures as a way of committing fraud. Someone who took the girls might well want people to believe they were a part of a second event, and not the victims of foul play. I don't believe that Patti is a reliable source, as she is undoubtedly a part of Kevin's twisted (especially considering the details his mind gives her!) brain.

  Even though Nora's handcuffs idea would probably not stave off a departure, I can agree with her approach where Justin Theroux is concerned.

[Save Yourself]

Nora did exactly what I kept wishing the people in Fear the Walking Dead would do (but never did). She actually tried to find out information! She was scared and freaked out so straight away tried to get some news off the TV or the net and then resorted to 911. So in other words she acted like an actual human being. So refreshing to see! Nora's great, more Nora please.

[Fisher King]

Okay, this episode won me back. I much prefer the chaos in Miracle to the continued pandemonium in Mapleton. I didn't even mind Patti's altered accent, plus she was interpreting Kevin's consciousness without adding her own personal attacks. Not as bad as usual anyway IMO.

 

I love Nora and Matt, and Jill is really quite awesome this season - so far.

 

Regina King was spectacular as usual and I'm glad she helped explain some of John's actions to Kevin.

 

I'm with others who are surprised Kevin hasn't already become a prime suspect in the girls' disappearance. I feel like that's coming soon enough though, along with the Miracle-ites soon trying to oust all the newcomers from Mapleton.

 

Look like John's son knows that the town can no longer claim the  exempt-from-The-Departure status.

[The Solution]

I can't believe I got Rick-rolled. It was making me insane because I couldn't finish the song in my head to figure out what it was until Patti finished it at the end of the ep.

[izabella]

I don't believe that Patti is a reliable source, as she is undoubtedly a part of Kevin's twisted (especially considering the details his mind gives her!) brain.

 

I don't see her as a reliable source, either.  I think she's Kevin's subconscious, and he's talking to himself.

 

Patti said the girls were driving along, carefree as you please, and then were taken.  But the car was parked, so that detail is wrong enough for it to not be true at all.

[freebie]

There was a lot to process, as usual, but the one thing I'm stuck on is the scene where Matt s leading a prayer group at the search site. They were giving thanks for being part of the 9,621, and it struck me how stuck the Miracle-ites are on that number, even someone like Matt, who obviously wasn't there on the Fourteenth. Which makes me wonder what, exactly, the population of Miracle is now. How often do newcomers like Kevin and Nora gain entry? Matt and Mary have only been there for a few months, right? So, counting both families together, that's six new people in a short period of time added to the population. Makes me wonder if they're trying to keep the number constant. Ugh. More questions. No answers. I feel like I'm watching "Lost."

[Armchair Critic]

I don't remember John explaining how he got shot to his wife, what happened would be the first thing I would ask my husband. But I guess she is used to him. I am liking this season better than last, but I ended up going to bed on kind of a down note after watching The Walking Dead and then this last night.

[txwatcher]

Patti is deliberately adopting a "Texas twang" to get on Kevin's nerves. But not all Texans possess said twang. Wether Patti is "real" or in Kevin's head, I do enjoy her comedic input. Love Nora more this season.

[ToastnBacon]

I can't believe I got Rick-rolled. It was making me insane because I couldn't finish the song in my head to figure out what it was until Patti finished it at the end of the ep.

I wonder if the usage of that song has the meaning of a hacker's Rick-Roll?

As in the writers saying to the audience, "I'm screwing with you!"

The old man on top of the post in town square could have easily meant, "Who is your imaginary friend?"

The use of the Pixies song, "Where is my mind" in three consecutive episodes is another thing to consider giving meaning to, or not.

To the poster who said they felt like they are watching Lost, I agree.

[DarkRaichu]

I don't remember John explaining how he got shot to his wife, what happened would be the first thing I would ask my husband. But I guess she is used to him. I am liking this season better than last, but I ended up going to bed on kind of a down note after watching The Walking Dead and then this last night.

She was also a nurse, I guess it should be fix / save life first ask questions later.  Plus Kevin was there to fill in the gaps.

 

It was interesting that Patti did not appear when John or his wife was around, yet Kevin was conversing with her while the man on the tower was watching.  As far as we could tell, Kevin was not aware of that man until he asked him a question.

I am thinking she was the manifestation of Kevin's latent superpower.  ie, he had power to see (immediate) future, Patti was just a way for his brain to process that information.

 

So where were the Sheriff and Mayor of Miracle??  Three missing girls should be a big deal in a town unaffected by the "event".  And what was John's position in the town's hierarchy?  That one Deputy seemed to talk to John like he was of a higher rank.

 

Yeah Nora = awesome

Edited October 26, 2015 by DarkRaichu

[represent]

 

She was also a nurse

I thought in the write up on the show they said she's a doctor who runs the town clinic? 

 

And what does John do? Is he a firefighter? I get the feeling that he such a high standing in that community. It was clearly him leading his fellow firefighters to burn down that guy's house. I even think the numbers that they were stating had to do with how severe the fire would be. Does anyone remember that? While they were putting on their uniforms at the firehouse, they were saying a three, four, five?  I thought was referring to like three alarm fire, etc.. as just how badly of a fire they were going to set.  But clearly he was leading the charge.

Edited October 26, 2015 by represent

[A Boston Gal]

Is it a silly question to wonder whether Kevin has put together the fact that John burned down the house with the fact that Kevin & Nora's original apartment burned down as well? Or are we way beyond buyers remorse for the $3 million home purchase?

[revbfc]

Is it a silly question to wonder whether Kevin has put together the fact that John burned down the house with the fact that Kevin & Nora's original apartment burned down as well? Or are we way beyond buyers remorse for the $3 million home purchase?

Forget it, A Boston Gal. It's Leftoverstown.

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

Who is the artist behind that awesome slowed down remake of the Grease song near the end of the episode?

[txhorns79]

Patti said the girls were driving along, carefree as you please, and then were taken.  But the car was parked, so that detail is wrong enough for it to not be true at all.

 

I think they could have been driving along, parked the car and they were taken.  I don't know if Patti's description has to literally be true for it to be taken as correct. 

[Ronin Jackson]

I'm not sure if Patti's info was reliable either... she was a little on point with the car, although it didn't end up being a bad thing that he got in the car (he may have saved one or two lives by getting in). The phone could be explained by his subconscious knowing where the phone was I suppose, but that too was pretty on point. Mostly I don't think I'd prefer Patti's info to be correct. It's a little too convenient for Kevin to have slept walked into a suicide attempt, all the water vanishes and the girls disappear at the same time... there has to be a connection between the three events. Not that Patti is denying this but she's giving no indication of a connection between Kevin's supposed suicide attempt and the girls disappearing. I did like Patti giving Kevin crap for not asking about the girls.

 

Also, what was with the scene with the girls running naked through the forest in the first episode? I'm not sure if I missed something but the scene seemed inserted in there without any context or explanation. Granted, this is HBO and gratuitous nudity is their thing, but the scene was more weird than titillating. Assuming they didn't just ask the three actresses to get naked to meet HBO's mandate, there is something going on there that probably has something to do with the disappearance. 

[shapeshifter]

Of course, Kevin's fingerprints (as a police chief leaving aside his earlier booking) are certainly on record. And his behavior during the search and rescue were pretty typical of the usual "hang around the crime scene" that criminals partake in (disregarding the fact that he's been spotted talking to thin air in the middle of town). If a second departure doesn't become public knowledge quickly, then I'd expect Kevin to be detained and questioned about midway through the next day.

Even though they discovered the palm print before Kevin arrived at the scene to "help," it was a pretty close time frame; I'm guessing the original cell phone ruse of having lost it while helping look for the girls would be just as good for explaining the print. Also, we were already shown how John stepped in to clear his new next neighbor for being there to search; now that Kevin saved John's life, prevented him from murdering, and kept it all secret, I imagine John would jump to explain Kevin's innocently placed print too. Kevin having told John he had been a cop would probably influence John's defense of Kevin--whether for good or for bad.

But then why did the old man that the boy brings food to ask Kevin, "Who's your friend?" after Patti left? It made it seem like that old man could also see Patti. I'm confused.

Going with an Occam's Razor reason (that the simplest explanation is the best): In a show about a supernatural event, the dude atop the armature likely sees dead and/or disappeared people. But if there turns out to be a natural, scientific reason for the event, then the simple explanation is more likely that the dude is just referring to Kevin's behavior (shouting at/talking to an imaginary person).

[Redcookie]

I think Patti had an eye job, facelift, in the afterlife.

[A Boston Gal]

I think Patti had an eye job, facelift, in the afterlife.

She certainly deserved it, considering all her hard work creating havoc in Mapleton ;).

 

Slightly OT: Ann Dowd seems to have lost some significant weight, especially since her turn on Masters of Sex as Bill's mother. As a fellow "older woman", I know one side effect of this can be the desire to tighten up not-so-elastic-anymore skin, pronto. Why should we have struggled so much with diet and excersize, only to look like crap?

Edited October 27, 2015 by A Boston Gal

[DarkRaichu]

I thought in the write up on the show they said she's a doctor who runs the town clinic? 

 

Ok, I must have missed that detail.

So the town is fine with a doctor with hearing aids?  Wouldn't those slow down her responses during an emergency?

Edited October 27, 2015 by DarkRaichu

[Cardie]

There's no indication that Erika's aid-assisted hearing isn't within a normal, functional range. It's no stranger than her being able to be a doctor while wearing very strong prescription glasses.

 

But then why did the old man that the boy brings food to ask Kevin, "Who's your friend?" after Patti left? It made it seem like that old man could also see Patti. I'm confused.

 

Patti's status is being kept ambiguous, so that either the man on the platform is used to seeing and hearing imaginary people. that she's a spirit he's attuned to, or that he's just going along with Kevin talking to no one. We already have Kevin's dad conversing with invisible people, so there is a trend developing of the world of the Leftovers being populated by apparitions of some sort. Of course, nothing Patti has said so far is inconsistent with her being part of Kevin's repressed consciousness, the repository of his memories of what happens when he's having his blackouts. Nothing is inconsistent with her being a ghostly witness to those events either.

 

Now we know why she left bags of feces on her ex-husband's doorstep.

[editorgrrl]

Who is the artist behind that awesome slowed down remake of the Grease song near the end of the episode?

Lo-Fang, and the song is "You're the One That I Want."

[DarkRaichu]

There's no indication that Erika's aid-assisted hearing isn't within a normal, functional range. It's no stranger than her being able to be a doctor while wearing very strong prescription glasses.

I guess. Is there any physical / disability guidelines for doctors a la ones for pilots?  I am just curious as never thought about it prior to my previous post.

 

 

 

Now we know why she left bags of feces on her ex-husband's doorstep.

Love letters to her ex? :D

Edited October 27, 2015 by DarkRaichu

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

Lo-Fang, and the song is "You're the One That I Want."

Thank you! :)

[preeya]

What did Nora ask Kevin at the very end? After the handcuffs they laid down on the bed and she asked him a question - he answered "no". I couldn't make out what she said; I was watching online so I couldn't put on captions. Thanks in advance

Nora: Are they ever going to find those girls?

Kevin: I don't think so.

[A Boston Gal]

It just occurred to me that Janel Maloney might actually have some lines this season.

[WearyTraveler]

It just occurred to me that Janel Maloney might actually have some lines this season.

 

That would be great for the actress, poor thing.  A whole season playing a catatonic state can't be easy.  I imagine all the takes she has to do without moving a muscle and I think that it must be very difficult.  It's also such a 180 turn from her probably most known role as Donna in The West Wing, that I sometimes forget it's the same actress.

[Rockfish]

Shut up, Patti--maybe Kevin's and Nora's relationship will morph into love. (I'm rooting for those two crazy kids, however dysfunctional their relationship may be.)

I am finding Patti fun, though.

[Blakeston]

I can't imagine the writers actually establishing that there was another departure. It doesn't seem like their style. I could see it being an unknowable possibility, though.

 

And what does John do? Is he a firefighter? I get the feeling that he such a high standing in that community. It was clearly him leading his fellow firefighters to burn down that guy's house. I even think the numbers that they were stating had to do with how severe the fire would be. Does anyone remember that? While they were putting on their uniforms at the firehouse, they were saying a three, four, five?  I thought was referring to like three alarm fire, etc.. as just how badly of a fire they were going to set.  But clearly he was leading the charge.

 

John's the fire chief. (His stint in prison for attempted murder doesn't seem to have prevented him from being in that position.) I definitely think the numbers the firefighters mentioned in the season premiere referred to the alarm level.

 

Also, what was with the scene with the girls running naked through the forest in the first episode? I'm not sure if I missed something but the scene seemed inserted in there without any context or explanation. Granted, this is HBO and gratuitous nudity is their thing, but the scene was more weird than titillating. Assuming they didn't just ask the three actresses to get naked to meet HBO's mandate, there is something going on there that probably has something to do with the disappearance. 

 

According to this interview with Reza Aslan, who's a writer for the show: "It’s just girls romping in the woods. There’s deliberate symbology there that’s supposed to have the same kind of metaphoric feel that you have from the opening scene: The idea of frolicking in the wilderness in an Eden-like place. It’s definitely there for a reason."

[RadiantAerynSun]

 

I definitely think the numbers the firefighters mentioned in the season premiere referred to the alarm level.

 

I thought perhaps rather than referring to alarm level (doesn't the # of alarms have something to do with the # of trucks/departments called in? not sure...) but the severity of their "threat" to the guy making false claims. ie maybe a 1 is a verbal warning, 2 more of a threat, etc all the way up to 5, burning down their house. Maybe the firefighters mostly just went around intimidating the charlatans, since I think the wife said this was the first time they had actually burned down a house...

[Blakeston]

I thought perhaps rather than referring to alarm level (doesn't the # of alarms have something to do with the # of trucks/departments called in? not sure...) but the severity of their "threat" to the guy making false claims. ie maybe a 1 is a verbal warning, 2 more of a threat, etc all the way up to 5, burning down their house. Maybe the firefighters mostly just went around intimidating the charlatans, since I think the wife said this was the first time they had actually burned down a house...

The alarm level is about how many resources are necessary to fight it.

The firefighters were already putting on their gear when they were throwing around suggestions like two, and when John said five, they were surprised. So I think the lower levels also signify fires.

My guess is that Regina King was lying or misinformed when she said it was the first time they'd burned down someone's house - or else she meant that it was the first time they'd set a fire that actually destroyed someone's house.

[represent]

 

The alarm level is about how many resources are necessary to fight it.

But isn't this determined by how bad the fire is?

 

Because it seemed like John and his buddies were pre-determining how bad of a fire they were about to set. So like you said, they would know how many resources they would need to put it out after setting it. The rest of his buddies were looking to him and rattling off those numbers like they were trying to how bad of a fire he wanted to set.

Edited October 30, 2015 by represent

[meep.meep]

I can't imagine the writers actually establishing that there was another departure. It doesn't seem like their style. I could see it being an unknowable possibility, though.

......

According to this interview with Reza Aslan, who's a writer for the show: "It’s just girls romping in the woods. There’s deliberate symbology there that’s supposed to have the same kind of metaphoric feel that you have from the opening scene: The idea of frolicking in the wilderness in an Eden-like place. It’s definitely there for a reason."

I don't think there has been another Departure - aka a mass disappearance for no known reason.  I think the girls disappeared in an event like what happened at the beginning of the first episode - an earthquake induced landslide that buried them suddenly.

 

An Eden-like place.  The town is named Jarden, like the French word for garden.  The main girl who is missing is named Evie. Not a big stretch.

[Desperately Random]

I thought perhaps rather than referring to alarm level (doesn't the # of alarms have something to do with the # of trucks/departments called in? not sure...) but the severity of their "threat" to the guy making false claims. ie maybe a 1 is a verbal warning, 2 more of a threat, etc all the way up to 5, burning down their house. Maybe the firefighters mostly just went around intimidating the charlatans, since I think the wife said this was the first time they had actually burned down a house...

 

 

But isn't this determined by how bad the fire is?

 

Because it seemed like John and his buddies were pre-determining how bad of a fire they were about to set. So like you said, they would know how many resources they would need to put it out after setting it. The rest of his buddies were looking to him and rattling off those numbers like they were trying to how bad of a fire he wanted to set.

I agree with both of the above posts. There was no fire as of yet so why would the firefighters be determining the alarm level of a non-existent fire? It seemed to me that the firefighters knew they were going to set some sort of fire as a warning and wanted to know how big (what level) it was going to be. That's why they were asking the level number, so they would know what they were in for and what equipment would be needed to start and then extinguish the fire. I am guessing that a level 5 is a rare occurrence and reserved for the worst offenders which is why they were surprised and a bit hesitant when they heard it was going to be a level 5.

Edited October 31, 2015 by Desperately Random

[thuganomics85]

Hmm, I'll wait and see for now, and I'm more then prepared to be proven wrong, but right now, I don't think this is going to end up being another rapture like "Patti" was claiming.  I just don't see the writers going down that path again.  I think something else happened to the girls.  It is possible that maybe Kevin did see something and he can't remember though, but who knows what that could be.  And if he wasn't actually trying to commit suicide, then what is the deal with the cinder-block?  Only other option I can think of is someone tried to kill him.

 

Still not sure where a lot of this is going, but I continue to enjoy this season a lot more this time around.  Still think moving to Miracle and the introduction of the Murphys have injected some sparks into this.  Regina King and Kevin Carroll are spot-on in these roles, and I find myself wanting to know more about Erika and John.  But the regulars are still just as great.  I continue to love Nora and how just the mere idea of another disappearance understandably freaks her out.  I continue to want to know what is going on with Kevin.  Actually enjoy Jill so far.  And I'm even curious to see what kind of role Matt is going to play in all of this.

 

Really enjoyed the music choices in this one. 

[shapeshifter]

An Eden-like place.  The town is named Jarden, like the French word for garden.  The main girl who is missing is named Evie. Not a big stretch.

Thanks for pointing these out. My excuse for not noticing is the spelling and pronunciation of Jarden, but I doubt it would've clicked for me even if it was Jardin, or even Dujardin.

[Joimiaroxeu]

Really enjoyed the music choices in this one.

Me too. First we get rickrolled and then there's the emo version of the song from Grease. It was like a one-two punch of surprises.

[Save Yourself]

I agree with both of the above posts. There was no fire as of yet so why would the firefighters be determining the alarm level of a non-existent fire? It seemed to me that the firefighters knew they were going to set some sort of fire as a warning and wanted to know how big (what level) it was going to be. That's why they were asking the level number, so they would know what they were in for and what equipment would be needed to start and then extinguish the fire. I am guessing that a level 5 is a rare occurrence and reserved for the worst offenders which is why they were surprised and a bit hesitant when they heard it was going to be a level 5.

 

Yes, that's absolutely what it is - I've put on here before that I think it's inspired by Farenheit 451 (tbh, totally ripped off from that book!). These firefighters are the very definition of 'busy work' - create the fire, put out the fire, repeat :)

 

I got the impression that was the first time they had called a level 5, I wonder if now that they have gone that far if they might even push it to burning at the stake?

[Milburn Stone]

Yes, that's absolutely what it is - I've put on here before that I think it's inspired by Farenheit 451 (tbh, totally ripped off from that book!). These firefighters are the very definition of 'busy work' - create the fire, put out the fire, repeat :)

I agree with you that for anyone who has read Bradbury's book the parallels were impossible not to see.

[Save Yourself]

I agree with you that for anyone who has read Bradbury's book the parallels were impossible not to see.

 

They'd have to acknowledge it on the show at some stage wouldn't they? You would assume that a lot of the characters would have read the book, it's a pretty common one to study at school. It would be odd if someone didn't point it out.